View Full Version : How to avoid Adderall tolerance (yes, it can be done).


tambourine-man
09-05-11, 01:00 AM
I've been getting a lot of pms from people wanting to know how to avoid tolerance to Adderall. So here it is, yet again, but short and sweet, without all the mumbo jumbo...

I've been taking Adderall (or Vyvanse) for a little over a year and have noticed little, if any, tolerance. I have found two methods to be effective...

Chelated magnesium: Yes guys, it works. Take magnesium (chelated!!!) at bedtime. That's it. I'm not going to explain why this works. Google it.

DXM: This can be found in Robitussin or Delsym. This may not be the healthiest method, though whether or not it is genuinely unhealthy is debatable. I personally take half a cap of Delsym in the evenings. Why not just take magnesium? Well, I typically do. However, I have noticed that DXM not only prevents tolerance for me, but reduces it as well. I have to be very careful, because a few days of steady dosing will take my tolerance right down to zero, and the meds can become too strong. So I take a children's dose every now and again, just for good measure.

I hope this helps assuage some of your fears, though I would like to add that the best way to avoid tolerance is not to over-analyze the effects of the medicine and definitely to not chase the high.

evansss
09-07-11, 07:57 PM
If I already find that frequent days off are keeping habituation to a minimun do you recommend these methods anyway? I take at least 1-2 days off a week and up to 2-3.

Xande86
09-07-11, 08:23 PM
If I already find that frequent days off are keeping habituation to a minimun do you recommend these methods anyway? I take at least 1-2 days off a week and up to 2-3.

Well, taking 200mg or 300mg of chelated magnesium wouldn't hurt.

lol it's a nice sleep aid too.

Macavity224
09-07-11, 08:35 PM
Tambourine, have you ever been on Dex out of curiosity? I just switched from Adderall to that, and I'm thinking this method will work for both, considering they're both amphetamines...

BalanceisKey
09-08-11, 04:28 PM
Is there a brand you recomend?

I've been getting a lot of pms from people wanting to know how to avoid tolerance to Adderall. So here it is, yet again, but short and sweet, without all the mumbo jumbo...

I've been taking Adderall (or Vyvanse) for a little over a year and have noticed little, if any, tolerance. I have found two methods to be effective...

Chelated magnesium: Yes guys, it works. Take magnesium (chelated!!!) at bedtime. That's it. I'm not going to explain why this works. Google it.

DXM: This can be found in Robitussin or Delsym. This may not be the healthiest method, though whether or not it is genuinely unhealthy is debatable. I personally take half a cap of Delsym in the evenings. Why not just take magnesium? Well, I typically do. However, I have noticed that DXM not only prevents tolerance for me, but reduces it as well. I have to be very careful, because a few days of steady dosing will take my tolerance right down to zero, and the meds can become too strong. So I take a children's dose every now and again, just for good measure.

I hope this helps assuage some of your fears, though I would like to add that the best way to avoid tolerance is not to over-analyze the effects of the medicine and definitely to not chase the high.

tambourine-man
09-08-11, 09:13 PM
Yes, it will work for Dex as well. Absolutely. I take Solarray magnesium chelate.

Also, for DXM, I go with Delsym, because it is a polysterex (extended release) solution. A dose taken before bedtime seems to diminish any perceived tolerance by morning.

I do, however, experience doses lasting a shorter duration as I grow tolerant. The intensity, however, has not diminished in the least.

Macavity224
09-09-11, 07:40 AM
Yes, it will work for Dex as well. Absolutely. I take Solarray magnesium chelate.

Also, for DXM, I go with Delsym, because it is a polysterex (extended release) solution. A dose taken before bedtime seems to diminish any perceived tolerance by morning.

I do, however, experience doses lasting a shorter duration as I grow tolerant. The intensity, however, has not diminished in the least.

One more question about Magnesium...currently I take a calcium/magnesium supplement every morning...vegan diet, so I don't really get calcium from much other places. I know that calcium and magnesium do some weird things with each other if one dose is higher than the other though...for example, if I took a separate calcium and a seperate magnesium supplement that weren't formulated/dosed to "work together." I only ask because I don't want to go out, buy magnesium supps, and start taking them only to realize that they're not absorbing because of some weird interaction with the calcium.

tambourine-man
09-09-11, 10:58 AM
Um, I really don't know. I get a done of calcium because I drink milk nonstop.

kolaborator
09-09-11, 12:33 PM
One more question about Magnesium...currently I take a calcium/magnesium supplement every morning...vegan diet, so I don't really get calcium from much other places. I know that calcium and magnesium do some weird things with each other if one dose is higher than the other though...for example, if I took a separate calcium and a seperate magnesium supplement that weren't formulated/dosed to "work together." I only ask because I don't want to go out, buy magnesium supps, and start taking them only to realize that they're not absorbing because of some weird interaction with the calcium.

Yes, calcium and magnesium compete with each other for absorption so it is not recommended to take both at the same time. When the supplements combine the two, they only take into account the smallest dose of both minerals your body needs for proper function. To decrease amphetamine tolerance, it is best to take magnesium at night and calcium during the day.

Also, one should be very careful with DXM. While one can take DXM at low doses to decrease tolerance, one should NEVER take it at the same time as adderall due to the adverse effects on the cardiovascular and circulatory systems. Both meds significantly raise blood pressure, and for people with already elevated blood pressure this can be seriously dangerous.

One can take DXM in the evening after adderall wears off, or on off days. Taking it in the morning, before adderall, is not usually advised, due to the unpredictable potentiation of the amphetamine.

Memantine, just like DXM, is an NMDA receptor antagonist. Whether it is as effective as DXM for tolerance is a topic of much debate, but it is certainly a much safer alternative.

tambourine-man
09-09-11, 01:00 PM
Yes, this is very true. Adderall plus DXM equals a mess.

Possum
09-09-11, 05:44 PM
I have some questions. It's often hard to find things in my teensy little town. I looked for Delsym DXM and only found DM Max containing dextromethorphan HBr 10mg. Is this the same as DXM?

And I could not find chelated magnesium anywhere, although the pharmacist said she could order some for me. If I remember correctedly chelated minerals are easier to absorb, right? So for now I bought magnesium softgels, 400mg which are supposed to be "micronized" 50x smaller than regular magnesium. Will this work as well as the chelated stuff or should I just go ahead and special order it?

Thanks for your answers!

Xande86
09-09-11, 06:20 PM
I have some questions. It's often hard to find things in my teensy little town. I looked for Delsym DXM and only found DM Max containing dextromethorphan HBr 10mg. Is this the same as DXM?

And I could not find chelated magnesium anywhere, although the pharmacist said she could order some for me. If I remember correctedly chelated minerals are easier to absorb, right? So for now I bought magnesium softgels, 400mg which are supposed to be "micronized" 50x smaller than regular magnesium. Will this work as well as the chelated stuff or should I just go ahead and special order it?

Thanks for your answers!

I couldn't find magnesium in stores either, except for low quality magnesium oxide. I ordered online.

relax21
09-09-11, 10:02 PM
I have some questions. It's often hard to find things in my teensy little town. I looked for Delsym DXM and only found DM Max containing dextromethorphan HBr 10mg. Is this the same as DXM?

Yes, DM and DXM are both abbreviations for dextromethorphan. DM is the more appropriate abbreviation.

pedalpounder
09-09-11, 11:02 PM
Dextromethorphan is evil. Seriously, that stuff cannot be good for you. I can't believe it's over the counter honestly.

tambourine-man
09-10-11, 12:57 AM
Dextromethorphan is evil. Seriously, that stuff cannot be good for you. I can't believe it's over the counter honestly.

Were you once, or have you known, a recreational DXM user? I really don't see where that comment would come from.

Yes, DXM is a dissociative anesthetic, like PCP, Ketamine, and Nitrous Oxide, and, when taken in significant doses, it can profoundly alter consciousness. This effect can be sought in an irresponsible way.

But to say any particular drug is evil is a bit silly. I've seen methamphetamine devastate entire communities, but it, and Adderall, are still terrific meds when used appropriately.

kiosk
09-10-11, 10:40 AM
by accident I found that low dose seroquel at night-time helps my tolerance issues....has to be <50mg and it takes a couple days to get used to it...first few days makes u a bit lethargic during AM.....
but as a dopamine antagonist it helps desensitize the DA receptors giving them a break from the constant flood of from adderall...

this may or may not work for everyone...but i tried all know magnesium forms and it didnt do squat for me....and DXM made me feel like crap

tambourine-man
09-10-11, 10:58 AM
by accident I found that low dose seroquel at night-time helps my tolerance issues....has to be <50mg and it takes a couple days to get used to it...first few days makes u a bit lethargic during AM.....
but as a dopamine antagonist it helps desensitize the DA receptors giving them a break from the constant flood of from adderall...

this may or may not work for everyone...but i tried all know magnesium forms and it didnt do squat for me....and DXM made me feel like crap

YES! Sooooo true! I've discovered this myself. I actually think the two should be prescribed more together more often, as Seroquel helps you to sleep, and does aid in reducing tolerance (at 25 to 50mg).

Macavity224
09-10-11, 11:01 AM
YES! Sooooo true! I've discovered this myself. I actually think the two should be prescribed more together more often, as Seroquel helps you to sleep, and does aid in reducing tolerance (at 25 to 50mg).

But wouldn't a dopamine suppressant and an amphetamine work against each other? For example, wouldn't the Seroquel still be exerting its effects by the next morning when you took the Adderall? Or would 25-50mg be too low a dose to still be doing anything a couple hours later?

BalanceisKey
09-10-11, 02:51 PM
been using dxm for 2 days while i wait for my magnesium chelate in the mail and daaaamn. The first day i noticed no change and was disapointed but today i reallyyy feel the difference

tambourine-man
09-10-11, 06:50 PM
been using dxm for 2 days while i wait for my magnesium chelate in the mail and daaaamn. The first day i noticed no change and was disapointed but today i reallyyy feel the difference

Yeah, careful with it. They say it can't reverse your tolerance, but I swear I've dropped it down to nothing before using DXM.

tambourine-man
09-10-11, 06:51 PM
But wouldn't a dopamine suppressant and an amphetamine work against each other? For example, wouldn't the Seroquel still be exerting its effects by the next morning when you took the Adderall? Or would 25-50mg be too low a dose to still be doing anything a couple hours later?

It seems, in such a small dose, it does the job and leaves my system by the next day.

BalanceisKey
09-11-11, 12:25 AM
p.s. - you got me with that justin beiber link

Macavity224
09-11-11, 07:19 AM
So are there any sort of negative health effects that can come from daily consumption of DXM? I'm not talking about robo-trip boses, just a teaspoon a day, like you said.

tambourine-man
09-11-11, 11:34 AM
So are there any sort of negative health effects that can come from daily consumption of DXM? I'm not talking about robo-trip boses, just a teaspoon a day, like you said.

I don't imagine it is "good" for you. However, I wouldn't think it would be terrible either. I don't use it daily though.

BalanceisKey
09-13-11, 12:07 AM
So are there any sort of negative health effects that can come from daily consumption of DXM? I'm not talking about robo-trip boses, just a teaspoon a day, like you said.

i actually feel pretty good when i wake up now since starting dxm. I use to feel ****ty till i took my first dose of adderal. So idk if its healthy or not but i feel healthier

Walter White
02-21-12, 09:32 PM
I'm just curious, would this method work for tolerance to any drug or is it specific to amphetamines?

Fraser_0762
02-21-12, 09:45 PM
I'm just curious, would this method work for tolerance to any drug or is it specific to amphetamines?

I'd like to know this to.

Would it work with Methylphenidate as well?

spunkysmum
02-21-12, 09:50 PM
I've been getting a lot of pms from people wanting to know how to avoid tolerance to Adderall.

You know, I've always suspected that men get PMS!

Fraser_0762
02-21-12, 10:10 PM
If this really works, why isn't there more information on here and other sites about it? (i'm not doubting you that it does work) but surely there should be more notice about this? It's very very important that more and more people know this. Stimulant tolerance is probably the biggest issue for most people who take them. Preventing/reversing it would be a godsend.

Imagine only having to ever take 5/10mgs of Adderall or something each day and feeling just as great/motivated as you did the day before.

spunkysmum
02-21-12, 10:14 PM
Imagine only having to ever take 5/10mgs of Adderall or something each day and feeling just as great/motivated as you did the day before.

Especially if you're like me and you're down to trying to get by on a half-pill a day to stretch them out until you can afford a refill.

Fraser_0762
02-21-12, 10:15 PM
Especially if you're like me and you're down to trying to get by on a half-pill a day to stretch them out until you can afford a refill.

Why don't you give this method a go yourself then?! :)

holepunch
02-22-12, 02:11 AM
I'm a little confused how DXM could reduce tolerance induced by amphetamines. DXM is primarily a serotonin reuptake inhibitor and NMDA receptor antagonist. It has little interaction with dopamine, which is NT implicated in amphetamine's mechanism of action.

Even though serotonin reuptake inhibition could cause a cascade which may affect dopamine levels, I think the only thing that DXM may do is indirectly increase the levels of dopamine available so when you take an amphetamine drug, more dopamine is released vs. if DXM wasn't administered. This could give you the false perception that you are avoiding tolerance, when in fact, you are just feeling the effects of more dopamine stimulating receptor sites.

I could be wrong but i'm just thinking out loud.

Alexandra

Massari
02-22-12, 10:34 AM
I've been getting a lot of pms from people wanting to know how to avoid tolerance to Adderall. So here it is, yet again, but short and sweet, without all the mumbo jumbo...

I've been taking Adderall (or Vyvanse) for a little over a year and have noticed little, if any, tolerance. I have found two methods to be effective...

Chelated magnesium: Yes guys, it works. Take magnesium (chelated!!!) at bedtime. That's it. I'm not going to explain why this works. Google it.

DXM: This can be found in Robitussin or Delsym. This may not be the healthiest method, though whether or not it is genuinely unhealthy is debatable. I personally take half a cap of Delsym in the evenings. Why not just take magnesium? Well, I typically do. However, I have noticed that DXM not only prevents tolerance for me, but reduces it as well. I have to be very careful, because a few days of steady dosing will take my tolerance right down to zero, and the meds can become too strong. So I take a children's dose every now and again, just for good measure.

I hope this helps assuage some of your fears, though I would like to add that the best way to avoid tolerance is not to over-analyze the effects of the medicine and definitely to not chase the high.

Good information!

Massari
02-22-12, 10:51 AM
I'm a little confused how DXM could reduce tolerance induced by amphetamines. DXM is primarily a serotonin reuptake inhibitor and NMDA receptor antagonist. It has little interaction with dopamine, which is NT implicated in amphetamine's mechanism of action

That is a wrong assumption on the function of the antagonist with respect to it's interaction with dopamine. What we say is, DXM prevents tolerance. It's like:

Medical doctors prevent sickness and disease in a human being. And you argue: "If doctors prevent sickness and disease in a human being, how come you find more sick people in the hospital, where there are doctors, than at home, where there's no doctors!"

kiosk
02-22-12, 06:30 PM
I'm a little confused how DXM could reduce tolerance induced by amphetamines. DXM is primarily a serotonin reuptake inhibitor and NMDA receptor antagonist. It has little interaction with dopamine, which is NT implicated in amphetamine's mechanism of action.

here you go...

Amphetamine tolerance is caused by excess Ca++ influx through the NMDA receptor gated calcium channels on the outer membranes of the dopamine cells bodies in the ventral tegental area, one of two areas in the brain with concentrations of dopamine producing neurons.

taking an appropriate NMDA (partial) antagonist will prevent the development of a tolerance for the effects of an amphetamine or amphetamine-like stimulant. Also, by preventing excess Ca++ influx into the neuron, an NMDA antagonist will prevent associated brain alterations and damage (excitotoxicity)

Modulation of dopamine D2 receptor expression by an NMDA receptor antagonist in rat brain
(http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10096038)
The role of excitatory amino acids in behavioral sensitization to psychomotor stimulants. (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9560846)

btw...u are pretty hot looking!! that alone addresses my tolerance!!! :D

Urgezz
02-23-12, 02:00 AM
I'm a little confused how DXM could reduce tolerance induced by amphetamines. DXM is primarily a serotonin reuptake inhibitor and NMDA receptor antagonist. It has little interaction with dopamine, which is NT implicated in amphetamine's mechanism of action.

Even though serotonin reuptake inhibition could cause a cascade which may affect dopamine levels, I think the only thing that DXM may do is indirectly increase the levels of dopamine available so when you take an amphetamine drug, more dopamine is released vs. if DXM wasn't administered. This could give you the false perception that you are avoiding tolerance, when in fact, you are just feeling the effects of more dopamine stimulating receptor sites.

I could be wrong but i'm just thinking out loud.

Alexandra

as someone above pointed out, it has more to do with the NMDA antagonism which essentially flushes and gates receptor channels so to speak. of course, DXM is not the BEST NMDA antag for this purpose, it is just the easiest to obtain :p that being said, it's not a miracle fix, and certainly does not *reverse* tolerance in any substantial way.

IME, the DXM effect is pronounced the first few nights, but tapers off to subtlety quickly. honestly i stopped because i have enough pills and supplements to take on a daily basis! also, a lot of people here speak of the process of titrating up to find your optimal therapeutic dose, if you're lucky enough to have discovered this you shouldn't really need the DXM.

SWIMER
02-25-12, 06:58 PM
Does Adderall feel more potent than dexamphetamine?
Is this a stupid question ? :))

CrashBandicoot
01-18-13, 07:34 AM
bump for more info

perfectchronic
01-28-13, 05:56 PM
I've been getting a lot of pms from people wanting to know how to avoid tolerance to Adderall. So here it is, yet again, but short and sweet, without all the mumbo jumbo...

I've been taking Adderall (or Vyvanse) for a little over a year and have noticed little, if any, tolerance. I have found two methods to be effective...

Chelated magnesium: Yes guys, it works. Take magnesium (chelated!!!) at bedtime. That's it. I'm not going to explain why this works. Google it.

DXM: This can be found in Robitussin or Delsym. This may not be the healthiest method, though whether or not it is genuinely unhealthy is debatable. I personally take half a cap of Delsym in the evenings. Why not just take magnesium? Well, I typically do. However, I have noticed that DXM not only prevents tolerance for me, but reduces it as well. I have to be very careful, because a few days of steady dosing will take my tolerance right down to zero, and the meds can become too strong. So I take a children's dose every now and again, just for good measure.

I hope this helps assuage some of your fears, though I would like to add that the best way to avoid tolerance is not to over-analyze the effects of the medicine and definitely to not chase the high.

Why don't you just take some Milk Thistle? It detoxifies your liver, and make sure to stay off of your medication for a couple of days, while it's taking effect.

G.Debord
07-09-15, 06:49 PM
Just wondering, are the pioneers of this method (therapeutic amphetamine and DM) still with us and has this proved a successful and sustainable combination over the long term?

thanks, and I hope you are all still with us ; )

PS: Has anyone run this by a physician and monitored organ function etc?

Protazoid
07-09-15, 09:20 PM
Does Adderall feel more potent than dexamphetamine?
Is this a stupid question ? :))

Some people prefer the added bit of PNS stimulation that the L-iso provides in addition to the more cerebral CNS stimulation the D-iso provides.

There are also studies that show amphetamine react differently based on the concentration of the isomers than what would be expected from the superposition of their relative concentrations.

Drug holidays work well for tolerance.

phospho
07-09-15, 11:39 PM
wow, what a great thread... if the OP sees this post, thank you for sharing :thankyou:

LetoII
07-11-15, 02:06 PM
I just switched to adderall from ritalin. There is a major difference that makes adderall preferable (less sweat for me), and the wearing off is actually not bad. Ultimately, when they work, both work exactly how I need them to. Although I like taking a drug holiday (going a day or so not taking any meds), it isn't always possible due to my intense workload with law school (I need to be the best, which means, I'm always studying).

So tolerance is a HUGE issue for me. Couldn't I just switch every so often between the meds to reduce tolerance? I like the magnesium idea and I want to check with my doctor to ensure it won't interact with other medications I'm on.

bobC
07-11-15, 08:14 PM
After ~7 years on dexedrine I started having some tolerance issues. I found swapping to ritalin (focalin XR) worked!

I was on Focalin XR (40mg/day) for two years. It is a great medication for ADD, but not as energizing as dexedrine especially in the evening. I recently swapped back to dexedrine 30mg/day and its working quite well.

bobC

sarahsweets
07-17-15, 04:24 AM
. Although I like taking a drug holiday (going a day or so not taking any meds), it isn't always possible due to my intense workload with law school
I'm curious, why do you take med holidays and what do they do for you?



So tolerance is a HUGE issue for me. Couldn't I just switch every so often between the meds to reduce tolerance?

Well IMO tolerance can be overrated. Yes it happens, but its more likely a result of not feeling the meds tricking you into thinking you have developed a tolerance.

daveddd
07-17-15, 06:09 AM
I'm curious, why do you take med holidays and what do they do for you?





Well IMO tolerance can be overrated. Yes it happens, but its more likely a result of not feeling the meds tricking you into thinking you have developed a tolerance.

an everyday thing

how do you know so well how other peoples minds work?

sarahsweets
07-17-15, 07:01 AM
I dont want to misunderstand you but was this a real question, a snark, or what?

an everyday thing

how do you know so well how other peoples minds work?

daveddd
07-17-15, 12:17 PM
I dont want to misunderstand you but was this a real question, a snark, or what?

a real question, you post this quite often

I'm asking how or why you're assuming that its likely that anyone experiencing tolerance is not able to actually tell if they've lost therapeutic benefit?

i could tell, my sister could, i trust at least some of the posters here know themselves and their symptoms

a lot of people may continue experiencing the benefit, good for you if you are, nobody doubts you

also though a lot of people lose benefits of meds, its just the way things go

Stevuke79
07-17-15, 04:02 PM
Well IMO tolerance can be overrated. Yes it happens, but its more likely a result of not feeling the meds tricking you into thinking you have developed a tolerance.
I'm asking how or why you're assuming that its likely that anyone experiencing tolerance is not able to actually tell if they've lost therapeutic benefit?

i could tell, my sister could, i trust at least some of the posters here know themselves and their symptoms

i don't think Sarah was claiming to know what is in someone elses mind. I tend to agree with her that when many people feel they are experiencing tolerance, they are simply no longer experiencing the buzz.

I don't care to hunt for them now but I've cited the studies elsewhere in this forum that Dopamine reuptake is a highly tolerance resistant pathway. That means that while it is possible to develop such tolerance, it is statistically VERY RARE. On the other hand, dopamine availability (related to euphoria) builds tolerance very very quickly.

So when someone claims to have built tolerance, suggesting they may simply be missing the euphoria (which is how I understand Sarah's post) is a valid suggestion. While it may not be so for any particular person,.. for most people it will be correct.

Secondly. the OP and LetoII both cite magnesium. Magnesium acts to specifically prevent the body from reducing dopamine availability to accommodate the reuptake inhibitor.

In other words, it prevents tolerance specifically to the euphoria of adderall. (It does NOT effect tolerance to the reuptake pathway, which is it's primary and intended effect). So if Magnesium helps you get the desired effect, then by definition your desired effect is to get high.


So in this context, Sarah's suggestion is spot on.

("spot on" vis a vis the OP. Not Leto II. I suspect Leto was asking an innocent question... but the OP seems like a tweaker.)

daveddd
07-17-15, 04:16 PM
i don't think Sarah was claiming to know what is in someone elses mind. I tend to agree with her that when many people feel they are experiencing tolerance, they are simply no longer experiencing the buzz.

I don't care to hunt for them now but I've cited the studies elsewhere in this forum that Dopamine reuptake is a highly tolerance resistant pathway. That means that while it is possible to develop such tolerance, it is statistically VERY RARE. On the other hand, dopamine availability (related to euphoria) builds tolerance very very quickly.

So when someone claims to have built tolerance, suggesting they may simply be missing the euphoria (which is how I understand Sarah's post) is a valid suggestion. While it may not be so for any particular person,.. for most people it will be correct.

Secondly. the OP and LetoII both cite magnesium. Magnesium acts to specifically prevent the body from reducing dopamine availability to accommodate the reuptake inhibitor.

In other words, it prevents tolerance specifically to the euphoria of adderall. (It does NOT effect tolerance to the reuptake pathway, which is it's primary and intended effect). So if Magnesium helps you get the desired effect, then by definition your desired effect is to get high.


So in this context, Sarah's suggestion is spot on.

("spot on" vis a vis the OP. Not Leto II. I suspect Leto was asking an innocent question... but the OP seems like a tweaker.)

i guess if the dopamine pathways say so it must be true


seeing that post nearly every day, can make one feel like a drug seeker, its frustrating

Stevuke79
07-17-15, 04:25 PM
Dude, I'm sorry. Asking about aderall tolerance doesn't make you a drug seeker and I didn't mean to imply that and I apologize.

Thinking you have developed tolerance doesn't make you a drug seeker (even if you hvae developed tolerance. In fact, .. you probably have.. but to dopamine availability,.. not reuptake.)

If however you go on a hunt for NMDA inhibitor and other ways too make adderall function more like cocaine.. that would be drug seeking behavior.

I think Sarah was responding more to the OP than to Leto.. or at least taking Leto in the context of the OP. And frankly,.. we get A LOT of tweakers on this forum.. and it's helpful to newbies if we call them out.

daveddd
07-17-15, 04:32 PM
Dude, I'm sorry. Asking about aderall tolerance doesn't make you a drug seeker and I didn't mean to imply that and I apologize.

Thinking you have developed tolerance doesn't make you a drug seeker (even if you hvae developed tolerance. In fact, .. you probably have.. but to dopamine availability,.. not reuptake.)

If however you go on a hunt for NMDA inhibitor and other ways too make adderall function more like cocaine.. that would be drug seeking behavior.

I think Sarah was responding more to the OP than to Leto.. or at least taking Leto in the context of the OP. And frankly,.. we get A LOT of tweakers on this forum.. and it's helpful to newbies if we call them out.

ok thats fine, i just see it very often too. those of us who have developed tolerance, its annoying

i have the more classic ADHD of hyper and overstimulated, so it was never about euphoria , just calming, and it worked well at first

i think i did a binge search once, and the longest following of patients i found was 6 months

according to rating scales i think a tad under 70% maintained clinical efficiency

thats a majority. but 30% certainly isn't rare

im not overly concerned about my brain chemicals, just my symptoms

Stevuke79
07-17-15, 04:38 PM
I know bro.
And the way we respond to most of this is context based. Long term clinical efficiency might even have more to do with symptoms than the neuroadaptivity itself .. so you really are right when you talk about the long term effectiveness of adderall in treating adhd. (in addition to which, .. I think the euphoria DOES help treat many types of adhd.. so while it's not clinically healthy,.. lot's of people do have reduced effectiveness when they adapt to that first pathway.)

And then someone else talks about magnesium.. and we say something else to them .. and while it's not what we mean, it sounds like we're simply talking about effectiveness.

(which would pyss me off too in your shoes.)

daveddd
07-17-15, 04:42 PM
I know bro.
And the way we respond to most of this is context based. Long term clinical efficiency might even have more to do with symptoms than the neuroadaptivity itself .. so you really are right when you talk about the long term effectiveness of adderall in treating adhd. (in addition to which, .. I think the euphoria DOES help treat many types of adhd.. so while it's not clinically healthy,.. lot's of people do have reduced effectiveness when they adapt to that first pathway.)

And then someone else talks about magnesium.. and we say something else to them .. and while it's not what we mean, it sounds like we're simply talking about effectiveness.

(which would pyss me off too in your shoes.)

i get it, I've seen the tweakers too

when i see the tolerance thing everyday (its not only in this context by the way) it builds and sometimes i get a bit prickish about it

my bad

daveddd
07-17-15, 04:49 PM
i mean i just don't get

the first time i popped my addys i was able to scrub my entire house with a toothbrush, cut every blade of grass in my lawn to the exact same level with scissors, study for 36 hours straight , met 63 new friends, all stuff normal people do

then bam, none of that

if thats not tolerance i don't know what is

sarahsweets
07-18-15, 04:57 AM
i guess if the dopamine pathways say so it must be true


seeing that post nearly every day, can make one feel like a drug seeker, its frustrating

Frankly, seeing you post, everytime I express my opinion on this, in some snarky way gets old and I am starting to wonder why you have to take shots at me. I have never once said anyone is a drug seeker. I have never said tolerance never happens. I think way back I may have thought that at some point but my opinion has morphed into the current one. I share this info when it comes up because while not all people are looking to experience the physical pleasures of the meds, when people do talk about what to take to potentiate, improve, avoid tolerance, decrease tolerance or increase the feeling of meds, I feel like I have the right to share my OPINION about what may be going on. I have never claimed to be an expert or know everything. All I have is the experience of being on stimulants for over 10 years, so I figure maybe I know something useful to share. I had to come to terms with understanding the difference between the early stages of physical euphoria and the intended benefits as well. I am an alcoholic, it was in my nature years ago to start poking around for what would make a good thing even better.
The good thing is, I have never abused my meds, and once I read about the dopamine stuff, I realized that there is a factual difference between physical effectiveness as in what you feel, and actual effectiveness as in what you should expect.
IME people who think that there is some underlying message or intent, need to take a look at what makes them think that they know what my intent was.
If I came out and said
"dude, stop trying to get high gosh dang drug seeker!" Maybe then I can see why you always jump into this with me, but thats not the case.
If you feel like you are being made to feel like a drug seeker than thats on you and not me.

daveddd
07-19-15, 11:43 AM
your right

its probably a result of having excellent symptom control from stimulants at one point , to good control... to zero control

what i logically consider tolerance

seeing that everytime someone mentions that they have had this experience and hearing it likely because you don't "feel" the drug or sometimes "feel the euphoria" is frustrating to me for my own reasons

so i guese stating that someone who thinks that there medication isn't working anymore is likely incorrect and just assumes that because that can't feel the drug or euphoria made me feel like they are seeking the feeling or euphoria as opposed to symptom control

and in some cases that may be right, in others not so much, i let myself feel grouped in with the former


sorry

Little Missy
07-19-15, 01:01 PM
I like to have rotating Rx of Dex and Adderall.

LetoII
07-28-15, 12:52 PM
Whoe… sorry, I’m prepping for finals and don’t always check the forums.
Let me clarify some of what I meant:

1. My psychiatrist told me to only take the Adderall (and when I was on it, Ritalin) when I needed to, not on days when I didn’t need it. For me, those days are running errands, if I’m taking a day off from tasks. It’s just a day when I know I don’t need to be able to focus on any one thing, and I can give my body a day without drugs. When I actually have to function in a normal way, whether I’m studying, or doing stuff around the house, I take my meds.

2. My concern with tolerance is more concern with dependency. I’m fearful that tolerance will lead to dependency. This may be ill-founded, but I think whether I’m actually building a tolerance is probably something that should be determined by my physician. Oh, by the way, my current dosage doesn’t give me a buzz in I think what is connoted by the term. It calms me down a lot, it helps me focus, and I can tune out distractions or thoughts that randomly pop in my head in quick succession. It just mitigates the symptoms of my ADD. Like I said, let’s leave this to my psychiatrist’s determination.

3. My question was about tolerance in general. I’m not trying to get high. I’m just concerned with long-term usage of any drug. This is not limited to my ADD meds.

4. I appreciate that this forum gets a lot of tweakers. And I appreciate I’m an anonymous person on the internet. I’m not taking offense. There’s a lot of people that abuse these drugs and makes us all guilty by association, unfortunately.

thomass
07-28-15, 01:31 PM
I don't understand how people can get addicted to stims, but then again I don't really understand how people can be addicted to alcohol. I take stims because I need to, not because I want to. I'd love it if I didn't have to take any medications.