View Full Version : I love her unconditionally, she wants me to change.


shtonkalot
09-23-11, 08:51 AM
First post, looking for some people that may have been in my boat.

I'm a 31 year old guy that has fallen hard for a 27 year old lady.
I was diagnosed with ADHD at age 21. I have tried stimulant medication, self medicating with pot and rehabilitation in the past to deal with issues fitting into society.
I have 2 children from a previous relationship, this is what has driven me to stay in society instead of simply dropping out and being a bum or whatever. I have low self esteem in a sense but also know that I am fine with things including myself just being what they are.
I have gotten by recently through support from extended family that provide me housing and by selling illegal things for cash to earn money to survive.

I've been doing OK, mostly avoiding any loving relationships for years and taking a back seat in my kids upbringing so as not to upset their lives with my instability.

This has recently changed. I have known a Lady for over a year now that I have been attracted to but never entertained the possibility of a relationship with.
About 3 months ago she made it clear to me that she was interested in me. I tried to hold off as I was scared for what may happen and did so for a few weeks until I caved and went out on a date before quickly getting serious with her.

She is wonderful in most respects, a real catch in just about anyone's eyes. She is beautiful, intelligent, helpful and kind to others, has a high paying job, loves to cook and is great at it, fun and funny . She loves my children and she is great with them. She inspires me to be more stable and thoughtful of the future when she is around. I have an easier time doing day to day tasks I would often ignore or be distracted from without her there.
She says she loves me and I believe I love her dearly.
We have started to plan for a future together and we have decided that she is to move in to my house in the coming months.

However... (can't all be rosey fun times)
She makes it clear that she isn't happy with some aspects of my life. Many of these I'm not happy with either, most of those I've changed for the better of myself and our relationship and am glad to have done so.
Cigarettes and pot have gone, never had I found it so easy to stop them. Stopped my illicit trade and am trying to get some government assistance for money and doing some legal work as well. This has been a little difficult as I have not yet got constant income but I can see it working ok.
Cleaned up my house and have started cooking for myself and kids (don't have kids fulltime) rather than eating crap. This is a little difficult but I'm managing and she seems to notice and be happy for it.

But when she pushed me to spill my difficult personal life philosophy and she didn't agree she started saying she couldn't be with me if I we didn't agree on some basic beliefs. This has since changed since she spoke to other friends of ours and her family.
Know today she has gone to her psychologist and told her about me and all she has talked about since she got out was what her psych thinks about me as an adult ADHD sufferer (I've never met the psychologist) and how I will have to take medication to get through study and hold a job.

I broke down when she told me this and explained I just don't think it matters what I do that it will never be enough for her.
Her reply was to tell me she doesn't want to be the adult in the relationship and I told her again I think I cannot be what she wants, I'm just me and I love her no matter what but she doesn't seem to want me unless I change into something else.

This is where we have left it.

I feel horrible, I just want her and am willing to do just about anything to keep her. I feel like I've changed so much about my life already and she can definitely see that I've made big changes.

I've taken various stimulant medication before though and I find it fuels my already large anxiety problems to an unbearable level. I don't want to keep changing things about myself just because she asks when I'm sure they will become an issue between us as a couple.

Stimulant meds are something I'm glad to not be taking anymore. I do have difficulty studying and working a real job but the improvement they give in those areas isn't worth the anxiety I find they induce. I can see me getting angry and aggressive after a hard days study or work, it has been the case in the past.

So that's a big chunk of stuff to read for you ADHD dudes out there but I'm hoping it's interestingly familiar to someone that may have some suggestions for me.

I'm at the point where I'm considering walking away but only so I stop messing her around. I don't think she really wants what she's asking for and it doesn't seem to matter too much what I do she keeps asking for more changes.

I'd be happy with her if she didn't work, put on 100kgs and was stoned all day. I just want her as that what's makes me happy. It doesn't seem to work the other way around.
This seems like a good shot for a happy family life for me and my kids. But I can't keep going on when she seems so unsatisfied with what I'm offering at any point.

If you read all this I'm super impressed already, any advice is a bonus.

RedHairedWitch
09-23-11, 12:36 PM
Treating a disability is like treating an addiction, she can't force you to do it. That is setting you up for failure. It's a choice you have to make for yourself and she supports you.

Can you get her to read anything here? here are some threads that I suggest you read together, or send to her.

http://www.addforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98803

http://www.addforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=109577


http://www.addforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73780


http://www.addforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=86622&highlight=vent

RedHairedWitch
09-23-11, 01:13 PM
One more:

http://www.addforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105879

sarek
09-23-11, 03:41 PM
Do you know what hers and your own personality types are (Meyer-Briggs)? Every type has their own idiosyncrasies and there are potential compatibility issues that can be better understood when you know a little about psychological profiles.

shtonkalot
09-23-11, 08:27 PM
Thanks guys. I have a bit of reading to do!

I've only had a brief glance over the topics you linked RHW, Thanks a million for coming through with some good looking info. I will read through it and talk to my lady about it.

To be honest I think I had jumped the gun a little (what a surprise) with her wanting me treated. I think she is really just scared that problems will come up in the future and that this is a solution from a professional. The words she spoke came from both fear and love, frightned enough to say it now and make it important sounding but motivated by love and care for us to be able to have each other.

sarek, I have not been Meyer-Briggs tested and I'm not yet sure if she has. I tried to find an online self test but there are a few different ones and some of the questions seem to ambiguous to answer with just the options provided. Can you advise a good test or a way to get tested?

I'm looking to go see my psychiatrist again (has been over a year) and also further medical expertise if advisable.

Thank you both so much for the help.

anonymouslyadd
09-25-11, 12:46 PM
However... (can't all be rosey fun times)
She makes it clear that she isn't happy with some aspects of my life. Many of these I'm not happy with either, most of those I've changed for the better of myself and our relationship and am glad to have done so.
Cigarettes and pot have gone, never had I found it so easy to stop them. Stopped my illicit trade and am trying to get some government assistance for money and doing some legal work as well. This has been a little difficult as I have not yet got constant income but I can see it working ok.
Cleaned up my house and have started cooking for myself and kids (don't have kids fulltime) rather than eating crap. This is a little difficult but I'm managing and she seems to notice and be happy for it.

But when she pushed me to spill my difficult personal life philosophy and she didn't agree she started saying she couldn't be with me if I we didn't agree on some basic beliefs. This has since changed since she spoke to other friends of ours and her family.

Our needs for a lover or lifemate are greater than an NT. Don't be in a relationship with someone who tries to change you. Don't be in a relationship with someone who doesn't accept you for the person you are. You already know the areas of your life that need work. You don't need to hear about it from your partner.

What I ^^^^^^listed is incredibly hard to adhere to, and it seems like you really have affection for this lady. I can't imagine something like this working out for you in a good way though. We need understanding people to be in a relationship with. Bottom line. She doesn't seem like she is one of those people.:(

RedHairedWitch
09-25-11, 01:58 PM
There are some books for the partner of ADHDers out there. Gina Perra wrote a good one.

Kirby Albee
09-25-11, 06:29 PM
She might be really good for you, though, if you really did want to make a project of yourself. Sometimes people get tired of themselves and want to be different. I have.

Crazygirl79
09-25-11, 06:55 PM
One word of advice..

Reassess your relationship! You are who you are regardless of what you do to try and "change" things....if she doesn't take you for who you are she aint worth your time, love, effort or energy, think about it do you really want to be with someone who wants you to "change" ??

I agree with Anon's post...

Selena

anonymouslyadd
09-25-11, 08:09 PM
There are some books for the partner of ADHDers out there. Gina Perra wrote a good one.

Do you really think the OP's woman will change? I guess the question is: what are the chances of someone experiencing a paradigm shift on account of learning about ADD. I've seen one person have lan epiphany on here and possibly someone else really getting the ADD brain through knowledge.

I am really hopeful, but sometimes I think it's best to accept people for who they are and move on. I think there's less frustration in the long run and less disappointment.

ADHDTigger
09-25-11, 08:50 PM
It isn't about change.

Gina's book is a helpful tool for the partner of a person with ADHD. While validating the partner's experience, it clarifies what is intrinsic to ADHD while presenting ideas to reduce the frustration.

I leave drawers and cabinets open. Drove hubby nuts. He learned to tell me- no judgement, only information- when he saw me do this and to just close the silly thing if I wasn't there to tell.

Gina talks about taking a picture of the loaded dishwasher for her ADHD husband so that he would have a "map" of how to do it.

I'm still thinking about the OP. What I know to be true is this- if you go into a relationship or marriage thinking you will change the other or that you will change for them, you are setting yourself up. I knew I would never change hubby. He knew that he would not change me.

That said, there were things that we agreed to TRY to do differently, recognizing that this was an effort.

anonymouslyadd
09-25-11, 09:36 PM
Tigger, take a look at the words the OP used to describe this person.


she pushed me to spill my difficult personal life philosophy and she didn't agree she started saying she couldn't be with me if I we didn't agree on some basic beliefs.

This is someone who is not good for an ADDer. I don't think we do well with pushy people. This is someone who is inherently a certain way. It's a part of her personality. It's the type that wants to fix us.


Know today she has gone to her psychologist and told her about me and all she has talked about since she got out was what her psych thinks about me as an adult ADHD sufferer (I've never met the psychologist) and how I will have to take medication to get through study and hold a job.

This person sounds like my ex-wife. My ex told me about the transaction between her and her therapist and how bad I was. This isn't someone I feel is willing to learn (change) how to cope with the ADD brain. Plus, she's putting the focus all on him.


She makes it clear that she isn't happy with some aspects of my life.

I'm saying that we need people in our lives that are very understanding. This doesn't seem like she would be that type of person let alone buying a book by Gina Pera.

peripatetic
09-25-11, 10:10 PM
greetings,

straight out i'll admit i didn't read your whole post. but i did skim most of it:o enough that i'm compelled to post and mostly because of this portion:

But when she pushed me to spill my difficult personal life philosophy and she didn't agree she started saying she couldn't be with me if I we didn't agree on some basic beliefs. This has since changed since she spoke to other friends of ours and her family.
Know today she has gone to her psychologist and told her about me and all she has talked about since she got out was what her psych thinks about me as an adult ADHD sufferer (I've never met the psychologist) and how I will have to take medication to get through study and hold a job.

I broke down when she told me this and explained I just don't think it matters what I do that it will never be enough for her.
Her reply was to tell me she doesn't want to be the adult in the relationship and I told her again I think I cannot be what she wants, I'm just me and I love her no matter what but she doesn't seem to want me unless I change into something else.

This is where we have left it.

a number of things leap out at me upon reading this (and this part i did read...more than once...carefully).

1. she pushed you to outline your perspective (the pushiness is something i see as...less than ideal) and then deemed it incommensurate with hers. i agree with her that you should have some common ground, but...her first response was that she couldn't see your perspective, essentially. that's a problem.

2. she adjusted her position on #1 after talking to others. not after talking to YOU...but after consulting with others. i see that as a red flag.

3. she's talking to her psychiatrist about you and your adhd...um...it's great that she's getting more information, but what's not great is that she's telling you what her practitioner said as if that's the bottom line. in other words, she's not talking to YOU about your adhd, she's talking to someone else. and then she's deciding how you should treat the disorder YOU have based on the opinion of someone who, yes, is in the medical field, but hasn'nt even met you much less has treated you.

4. she doesn't want to be the "adult" in the relationship. well, i doubt you want to be the "child", so it seems prima facie like that's not so bad. but hold on a minute...why would someone say that? who says that about a romantic relationship? i'll tell you who: someone who perceives the other as at least inclined to NOT be an adult. she's drawing conclusions that are really not boding well for a healthy relationship.

5. when you told her you loved her unconditionally...and feared you'd never be good enough...she didn't protest that point. she let it stand with you basically getting tacit confirmation taht at that moment, she couldn't say othehrwise.

look, you're going to fall for her or not...emotions are what they are and not usually susceptible to reason. but try to keep in mind the pattern of her approach to you and her criteria for relationships.

personally, i'd say i'm overall a pretty accepting person. i would not say that i've accepted someone unconditionally even. i think i just have different conditions...or perhaps i have fewer. mental illness/disability is a non issue (i'm not a traitor to my own kind;)), but there are things i couldn't accept and chief among them is that i couldn't accept someone who thought i needed to change to earn acceptance, who valued the opinions of others about me more than my thoughts and who identified ways for me to "fix" me so i'd be acceptable instead of supporting me and wanting to be with me as i am. the fact is, you may or may not change in ways that would make you more accepting of you. that you would begin a relationship based on the condition that you do seems like it sets you up for a tough road ahead. if nothing else, to let someone think that you're willing to change however they want....that they're needs and wants trump yours...you're essentially allowing her perspective to be the default one. i think it could set you up for not only feeling inadequate, but also for feeling like your needs/desires don't matter as much as hers.

i encourage lots of caution. people who demand you conform to their needs and don't ask what changes they should make to conform to yours...that's not a good idea, in my opinion.

RedHairedWitch
09-25-11, 11:49 PM
Do you really think the OP's woman will change? I guess the question is: what are the chances of someone experiencing a paradigm shift on account of learning about ADD. I've seen one person have lan epiphany on here and possibly someone else really getting the ADD brain through knowledge.

I am really hopeful, but sometimes I think it's best to accept people for who they are and move on. I think there's less frustration in the long run and less disappointment.


I think they/she should be allowed to make an informed decision.

anonymouslyadd
09-25-11, 11:59 PM
I think they/she should be allowed to make an informed decision.

I agree.

Kirby Albee
09-26-11, 12:39 AM
Hey, O.P., I'd give some weight to what Peripatetic says.

Crazygirl79
09-26-11, 12:44 AM
I agree with Peri too...personally I wouldn't tolerate half of what the OP's partner is doing.

Selena

shtonkalot
09-26-11, 08:25 PM
Wow, can't believe how much help and support you strangers are offering me. I feel I need to try get out my message as best I can and I'm not convinced I've been honest and accurate enough so far.

I'll respond to Peripatetic's points first as I see there are some points others agree with.

1. she pushed you to outline your perspective (the pushiness is something i see as...less than ideal) and then deemed it incommensurate with hers.... I should perhaps have stated the facts a bit better here. I didn't lie but there was definitely stress about the difference that I made her aware of and told her I'd have a hard time talking about before I felt pressure to spill my beliefs. I do believe she was trying to understand me and that is why she came across as pushy. My beliefs are hard for a lot of people to understand and I did a poor job of explaining them. I do feel like I made the mistake of communicating something important to me in an inefficient manner.
2. she adjusted her position on #1 after talking to others. not after talking to YOU...but after consulting with others. i see that as a red flag.Again I think others were able to more softly introduce my ideas to her in a way she found easier to understand and accept as different. I won't lie I was really doing a poor job just holding together trying to be honest with her, it was ineffective at best from my side.
3. she's talking to her psychiatrist about you and your adhd...um...it's great that she's getting more information, but what's not great is that she's telling you what her practitioner said as if that's the bottom line. in other words, she's not talking to YOU about your adhd, she's talking to someone else. and then she's deciding how you should treat the disorder YOU have based on the opinion of someone who, yes, is in the medical field, but hasn'nt even met you much less has treated you.I'd like her to take my word on my problems but there is the problem I have that my explanations don't match her view as well as the textbook ones. Most of the time my explanations don't match my own view as well as the professionals. Coming here and getting more perspectives on ADHD is teaching me a lot.[/quote]
4. she doesn't want to be the "adult" in the relationship. well, i doubt you want to be the "child"... ...she's drawing conclusions that are really not boding well for a healthy relationship.Here I agree, to be honest I think she acts just as childish in other ways as I do. I don't think she is choosing her words well when she says that though, I can recognise it as I often catch myself doing it. The real problem she has is understanding adult ADHD not me acting like a child. It seems easy to believe that it is a difficult thing to differentiate for others not familiar with ADHD. I'm not trying to excuse it but I do understand it.
5. when you told her you loved her unconditionally...and feared you'd never be good enough...she didn't protest that point. she let it stand with you basically getting tacit confirmation taht at that moment, she couldn't say othehrwise.I'm not sure about the accuracy of that. My mind is a little hazy on how it all went word for word but I do believe it ended with her telling me she loved me, I haven't been able to describe that part of the exchange accurately here and think I painted it from my view a little heavily.

She has told me that she doesn't want me to change since this discussion I was talking about, she has expressed concern that she is expecting changes I can't make and she doesn't feel right about it.
I do believe she is trying hard to understand and it is something that is difficult to understand.

She seems willing to stick through the confusion for the happiness too, and she does recognise the happiness.
i encourage lots of caution. people who demand you conform to their needs and don't ask what changes they should make to conform to yours...that's not a good idea, in my opinion.After making this post we have reassessed and decided to not move so fast. We aren't changing much but we are not having a date when she will move in any more. Rather we are letting that come when the time is ready.
She suffers anxiety and depression, so do I along with the scatterbrain ADHD issues. We are both fearful of what is to come.

As I believe she is willing to understand I look forward to sharing the discussions on here and getting her further info to help her do so.

Anyone got the name of the Gina Perra book?

BaberahamLincoln
10-01-11, 08:29 PM
This thread is incredible for me. I've been trying to make a relationship with a guy work that does not communicate his needs, desires, or positions on things.. at all. He also assumes a LOT about what I'm feeling and what my stance is on a LOT. It's as if I'm not even a part of the relationship at all, which has left me completely perplexed. I wonder if any of that pertains to your situation shtonkalot? Did she ever ask you to change anything or are you assuming you'd need to for her? That might be me projecting what I'm facing right now.2. she adjusted her position on #1 after talking to others. not after talking to YOU...but after consulting with others. i see that as a red flag.Excellent point. If you're explaining things and opening up to her, and after that she's having to go get validation outside of you two in order to adjust her position, that is a red flag in my opinion as well.3. she's talking to her psychiatrist about you and your adhd...um...it's great that she's getting more information, but what's not great is that she's telling you what her practitioner said as if that's the bottom line. in other words, she's not talking to YOU about your adhd, she's talking to someone else. and then she's deciding how you should treat the disorder YOU have based on the opinion of someone who, yes, is in the medical field, but hasn'nt even met you much less has treated you.Again, I agree with peripatetic. If she's not trying to talk to you about your adhd, and going to someone else, ... I don't know, I'm failing to see how it's even a relationship between the two of you. It sounds like a horrible situation if you've talked with her, even a little bit about your adhd and ? other issues?.

In my situation, he won't open up about a thing! I mean, really.. I'm having to read between lines and try to figure out who this person is.. and it's something that I've wanted to do because, from what I know about him, I'm just in love with. I've talked to my shrink about my situation because he won't discuss any of it with me. What I can't figure out is where he got the idea that I want him to change! But I'm getting sidetracked here, sorry.4. she doesn't want to be the "adult" in the relationship. well, i doubt you want to be the "child", so it seems prima facie like that's not so bad. but hold on a minute...why would someone say that? who says that about a romantic relationship? i'll tell you who: someone who perceives the other as at least inclined to NOT be an adult. she's drawing conclusions that are really not boding well for a healthy relationship.:eek: She said she doesn't want to be the "adult" in the relationship? *barf* Why would someone say that? Who does say that about a romantic relationship? Peripatetic is spot on stating someone who's drawing those kinds of conclusions isn't conducive to anything healthy.5. when you told her you loved her unconditionally...and feared you'd never be good enough...she didn't protest that point. she let it stand with you basically getting tacit confirmation taht at that moment, she couldn't say othehrwise.That is so sad. :( This is exactly what I've experienced in my situation. I'm sorry she left you hanging like that. It can be really devastating to put yourself out there, so vulnerable, and having someone just ... not say anything. I know exactly how this feels.[...] but try to keep in mind the pattern of her approach to you and her criteria for relationships.Wise philosophy. Something I can use for sure.personally, i'd say i'm overall a pretty accepting person. i would not say that i've accepted someone unconditionally even. i think i just have different conditions...or perhaps i have fewer. mental illness/disability is a non issue (i'm not a traitor to my own kind;)), but there are things i couldn't accept and chief among them is that i couldn't accept someone who thought i needed to change to earn acceptance, who valued the opinions of others about me more than my thoughts and who identified ways for me to "fix" me so i'd be acceptable instead of supporting me and wanting to be with me as i am. the fact is, you may or may not change in ways that would make you more accepting of you. that you would begin a relationship based on the condition that you do seems like it sets you up for a tough road ahead. if nothing else, to let someone think that you're willing to change however they want....that they're needs and wants trump yours...you're essentially allowing her perspective to be the default one. i think it could set you up for not only feeling inadequate, but also for feeling like your needs/desires don't matter as much as hers.

i encourage lots of caution. people who demand you conform to their needs and don't ask what changes they should make to conform to yours...that's not a good idea, in my opinion.I don't have anything to add to these final two paragraphs, but I thought they should be reiterated.

shtonkalot, you said in your last post that maybe you haven't communicated things to her? Why do you feel that that is? It sounds like she wants to know, although I agree she shouldn't be pushy. I'm sure I've come off pushy when, from my perspective, it was that I really didn't understand anything that was going on in my man's head. It wasn't meant maliciously whatsoever, it was out of significant confusion and a severe lack of communication. *shrug* She may be more accepting than you think..? At least that's my hope. But if you love her so much, why not take the risk and open up to her?

It sounds like a rough situation for sure. Good luck shtonkalot!!

peripatetic
10-01-11, 10:32 PM
i'm glad tko'd posted and could share her experience, at least a little, because i will admit that i've not forged ahead with a romantic relationship with folks who sound (from my limited knowledge of couurse) like those in your lives. so i think it's not only good to hear that you're not alone in giving it a go, but to hear the difficulties as well as the fact that perhaps it is possible to struggle through and maintain the relationship.

i fully respect that you want to clarify and that you see you might've painted with a bit of a heavy stroke in outlining your situation. i'm not the best at getting my point across on the first go and can certainly understand the need. i will say that i also understand a certain urge to "defend" your person. not saying that's what you're doing, and i will say that even if you were, that's not necessarily a bad thing or necessarily an entirely bad thing. the fact is it takes two people to make a relationship and two people to fight within it. acknowledging your role is crucial. and i see you do acknowledge hers as well...also crucial. the question is, does *she* acknowledge it/see your perspective? that's where i see the concern. well,and in one other place.


I should perhaps have stated the facts a bit better here. I didn't lie but there was definitely stress about the difference that I made her aware of and told her I'd have a hard time talking about before I felt pressure to spill my beliefs. I do believe she was trying to understand me and that is why she came across as pushy. My beliefs are hard for a lot of people to understand and I did a poor job of explaining them. I do feel like I made the mistake of communicating something important to me in an inefficient manner.


ok, i do get that and i can see how the phrasing had me thinking along different lines. i saw her as being really overbearing. with your clarification, i can see more that she's working to get to konw you. i can also see that her "pushiness" might just be forthrightness or even just lack of a certain sort of grace that i also lack. i'm very much guilty of just asking whatever question occurs to me...and then the stunned silent squirming tells me that the question is thought too personal, etc. i don't push, but i have often asked without thinking about the other's comfort and overall assuming that if the person doesn't want to answer any question, s/he just won't.


Again I think others were able to more softly introduce my ideas to her in a way she found easier to understand and accept as different. I won't lie I was really doing a poor job just holding together trying to be honest with her, it was ineffective at best from my side.


not knowing what your perspective is, i'll just take your word for it as i can very much conceive of ideas that might need to be presented ... well, to use your terminiology, more softly. i think i get what you mean and i was thinking she was more checking with others to gauge your acceptability and that'snot what you meant.


I'd like her to take my word on my problems but there is the problem I have that my explanations don't match her view as well as the textbook ones. Most of the time my explanations don't match my own view as well as the professionals. Coming here and getting more perspectives on ADHD is teaching me a lot.


ok, now this i still see as really seriously problematic. textbooks aren't a substitute for listening to a person's experience and i do have much more personal history with this...on both sides.

a textbook, the DSM, what one person's experience with their adhd loved one, even the experiences of otehrs with adhd...none of them, all of them combined cannot ...should not override the experience of the person in front of you. textbooks speak in generalities and try to cover as much territory as possible. they don't account for the individual's circumstances and life history. the combination of symptoms and the severity in which each presents and how much of a role that plays in your life is specific to *you*. what treatment will offer relief and in what way and what side effects are suffered and what you're willing to put up with and what you're not...those are also specific to *you*.

like i said, this is where i do havemore personal experience. when i joined this forum i knew pretty much nothing about bipolar. over the course of being here i've developed very close friendships with three people with bipolar...and their experiences are very very very different. yes, there are common themes in some areas, but there are drastic differences as well. one of those people was the light of my life, in short. and i both wanted to know as much as i could about what he was experiencing and he wanted me to know. so i talkedto him,of course, and i also started reading up, talking to others about bipolar, and i shared that with him. his reaction was a lot like mine about adhd and your person: talk to me about my experience and don't conclude you that what others tell you about theirs or what books say tell you about *ME*.

the bottom line here is that there's knowing about bipolar and knowing a person with bipolar. same for adhd. you might know a lot about what others say about adhd, including texts and experts, but that doesn't mean you know me. or you. getting that point across is important. your experience is important. it's great, like i said in my first post, that she wants to learn more, but you are the "expert" on you and other info should be secondary.


I'm not sure about the accuracy of that. My mind is a little hazy on how it all went word for word but I do believe it ended with her telling me she loved me, I haven't been able to describe that part of the exchange accurately here and think I painted it from my view a little heavily.


i'm so glad i was wrong on this point and she did validate you and her care for you:)


She has told me that she doesn't want me to change since this discussion I was talking about, she has expressed concern that she is expecting changes I can't make and she doesn't feel right about it.
I do believe she is trying hard to understand and it is something that is difficult to understand.


it is and i'm glad she's trying to understand and assume you're trying to understand you. i just think it's important for both of you to realize that both of you need to understand each other and both need to work at the relationship. in your initial post i got the sense that she felt the work rested entirely on your shoulders and only you would be adjusting yourself. i think people evolve and both need to be willing to adjust to meet each others needs.


As I believe she is willing to understand I look forward to sharing the discussions on here and getting her further info to help her do so.


glad to hear it. she could always join herself :)

BaberahamLincoln
10-02-11, 12:21 AM
[...] acknowledging your role is crucial. and i see you do acknowledge hers as well...also crucial. the question is, does *she* acknowledge it/see your perspective? that's where i see the concern. well,and in one other place.Another great point. Acknowledging perspectives on both sides is, as peripatetic so astutely put it: crucial.

In my case, I don't have the privilege of even beginning to step into his shoes, because he is completely closed off to me. The lack of communication is unlike any relationship I've ever had.. and I'm starting to realize that in my case, I don't really have one. I have no idea who this person actually is, nor do I have a clue what kind of issue(s) he might be dealing with other than "ADD," and as we all know, that is a spectrum disorder. Everyone seems to experience different symptoms.. or maybe not different symptoms, but their manifestation can vary widely. I wish he'd talk to me about his ADD. As far as if he has other comorbid conditions? I've never really been told anything.ok, i do get that and i can see how the phrasing had me thinking along different lines. i saw her as being really overbearing. with your clarification, i can see more that she's working to get to konw you. i can also see that her "pushiness" might just be forthrightness or even just lack of a certain sort of grace that i also lack. i'm very much guilty of just asking whatever question occurs to me...and then the stunned silent squirming tells me that the question is thought too personal, etc. i don't push, but i have often asked without thinking about the other's comfort and overall assuming that if the person doesn't want to answer any question, s/he just won't. It's possible she's doing this, and if she is, you really should let her know.. as in.. tell her. Clear communication is VITAL to any kind of relationship at all.

My case feels unique. He drops hints, and then if I ask about them, he feels like I'm being pushy. In the past he'd just get ANGRY, and I'd apologize, and we'd go back to how things have been: completely dysfunctional and without trust. *sigh* This thread is so cathartic! I'm not trying to hijack, I can just relate SO well. For me and this guy, I'm really at the end of my rope. I've opened up to him and tried to be patient, but I feel like we're not in a relationship with each other because of all of his assumptions.. I don't even know where he gets these things from.

I'm not trying to dishearten you, shtonkalot. There may be hope for your situation. But there's nothing solid for me to work with in mine. :-/i think i get what you mean and i was thinking she was more checking with others to gauge your acceptability and that'snot what you meant.Oh, that's good. In my case, my "partner" IS doing that. I'm glad she's not doing that to you, though.ok, now this i still see as really seriously problematic. textbooks aren't a substitute for listening to a person's experience and i do have much more personal history with this...on both sides.

a textbook, the DSM, what one person's experience with their adhd loved one, even the experiences of otehrs with adhd...none of them, all of them combined cannot ...should not override the experience of the person in front of you. textbooks speak in generalities and try to cover as much territory as possible. they don't account for the individual's circumstances and life history. the combination of symptoms and the severity in which each presents and how much of a role that plays in your life is specific to *you*. what treatment will offer relief and in what way and what side effects are suffered and what you're willing to put up with and what you're not...those are also specific to *you*.

like i said, this is where i do havemore personal experience. when i joined this forum i knew pretty much nothing about bipolar. over the course of being here i've developed very close friendships with three people with bipolar...and their experiences are very very very different. yes, there are common themes in some areas, but there are drastic differences as well. one of those people was the light of my life, in short. and i both wanted to know as much as i could about what he was experiencing and he wanted me to know. so i talkedto him,of course, and i also started reading up, talking to others about bipolar, and i shared that with him. his reaction was a lot like mine about adhd and your person: talk to me about my experience and don't conclude you that what others tell you about theirs or what books say tell you about *ME*.

the bottom line here is that there's knowing about bipolar and knowing a person with bipolar. same for adhd. you might know a lot about what others say about adhd, including texts and experts, but that doesn't mean you know me. or you. getting that point across is important. your experience is important. it's great, like i said in my first post, that she wants to learn more, but you are the "expert" on you and other info should be secondary.Ahh.. I can actually breathe easier because of your words here, peripatetic. Thank you. I have a brother who has bipolar disorder and so I've experienced that with him, but as you say, and rightly so, it varies dramatically from person to person. I don't even know what my guy is dealing with at all, other than ADD like I mentioned. So, I can't even turn to a book to read about it. But what good would a book do me when I *want* to get to know *him*? It wouldn't.i'm so glad i was wrong on this point and she did validate you and her care for you:)I'm glad to hear this too, shtonkalot. Validation is so important, and caring about where the person is coming from is just.. well I think it's absolutely essential! In my case, ... well I was going to say I don't get any validation, but the fact is, I literally don't. I have no idea where he's coming from or who he thinks I am.. I have no idea who he is, and he refuses to communicate it with me. *shrug* It's been months and still.. he just refuses.it is and i'm glad she's trying to understand and assume you're trying to understand you. i just think it's important for both of you to realize that both of you need to understand each other and both need to work at the relationship. in your initial post i got the sense that she felt the work rested entirely on your shoulders and only you would be adjusting yourself. i think people evolve and both need to be willing to adjust to meet each others needs.(Emphasis added.)

Beautifully said. It's funny, I feel like I'm so similar to the OP it's.. just uncanny. The work feels like it's rested, almost entirely on my shoulders, and he also does not want to understand where I'm coming from on anything. He thinks he's got it all answered in his head... again, in my case, it's this overriding feeling that *I* am not in the relationship. It's a relationship between himself and his thoughts and assumptions. I've started to give up. I've been trying to connect with him for months and I know very little more than I did when we first met. :( So sad.As I believe she is willing to understand I look forward to sharing the discussions on here and getting her further info to help her do so.That's a great idea, but getting her info isn't really what I think peripatetic was getting at. Definitely *talk* with her. Communication is essential.

Good luck to you, and thank you again for your wise posts peripatetic. They've given me a lot to think about with regards to my relationship. I hope shtonkalot's partner isn't as disinterested in where he's coming from as my guy is with me.

ginniebean
10-02-11, 01:12 PM
Wow, can't believe how much help and support you strangers are offering me. I feel I need to try get out my message as best I can and I'm not convinced I've been honest and accurate enough so far.

We all have ADHD so.. welcome to the family.


She has told me that she doesn't want me to change since this discussion I was talking about, she has expressed concern that she is expecting changes I can't make and she doesn't feel right about it.
I do believe she is trying hard to understand and it is something that is difficult to understand.

She's right, making too many changes all at once is a recipe for failure. ADHD defies common sense, it's an output disorder, a disorder of performance. People understand input disorders like mental retardation, they cannot understand a disorder where commands to get things done die in the brain before they can be exectuted.

There is a LOT of hope. There is a lot of help. With respect for each other, patience and time you can have a better life and a good life together. The number 1 determinant of a happy relationship is acceptance. This is true for all relationships. It becomes MORE so when a person has a disability.

In order for acceptance to happen a lot of information needs to be learned so you'll need patience with her too.

There are red flags, we all understand your desire to make this relationship work and I'm sure she truly is a lovely person. But do not allow yourself to be emotionally abused by ignorance. This is your biggest risk and you do have to face it, pretending it away makes you complicit.






Anyone got the name of the Gina Perra book?

Is it Me you or ADHD

BaberahamLincoln
10-02-11, 06:57 PM
I just got a copy of Is It You, Me, or ADD in my possession and have only read the forward by Dr. Barkley, but I'm eager to get into it and learn what I can recognize within myself to work on and work with in my relationships. Thanks to whoever recommended this!

BaberahamLincoln
10-02-11, 11:08 PM
What I'm having trouble with, is that he thinks I've been inconsistent. Which, I have been.. because of the curve balls, and then lies trying to cover them up.. I'm not sure what I should have done? He won't communicate with me, he doesn't keep his word on promises he makes to me, and I don't know who he is..

The fact that I've stuck around this long doesn't say anything to him except that I'm doing it because maybe I'm lonely or afraid to be alone or something. That's bull****. I've stuck around because of my feelings for him. Not because I couldn't go get someone else.

I'm VERY willing to accept the things I've been responsible for, but he hasn't said one word about taking responsibility for his actions. Actually, he has. He's said he'd do it all again, and that he doesn't feel sorry.

It's like he expects me to read his mind, know what he's dealing with, who he is, without him telling me anything.. but then I have to react perfectly even when I DON'T know what the hell is going on and why things are happening the way they are. I really am just at a loss as far as what he wants.. except to test me repeatedly.. with no end in sight.. and without any information to go on to understand. I'm NOT perfect.. and I have NO idea where he's coming from, but I'm willing to work on it.. ..it goes both ways.

I love him. I want to fight for him. I want to work through this with him, but he gives me nothing to go on. He blames me for things he does, and expects me to just take it. Alienating me from our friends.. I have NO ONE to talk to about this.. no one to give me some insight or validation or correction or anything.

I'm so tired. I can say I've really tried, but I've been given very little to work with here, and on top of that, deceit, and blame for my reactions to the deceit. I'm sorry I didn't react how he wanted me to but I honestly, sincerely don't know what I should have done. How can you have a relationship with that going on? I can't. Maybe there's a woman out there that can!

The advice here is for both parties to be accepting and open, and willing to be accountable for their actions. I can offer this! I WANT to meet his needs.. but he won't tell them to me. *sigh* I'm so exhausted from this. It's just so many "teasts" he called them.. and I can't win! You know, at a certain point it seems pretty clear that he doesn't want me to win. He wants to push and push and push so that I'll walk away and he'll be the one that was rejected.

I was so upset last night because of this.. I have been accepting. I haven't asked him to change at all.. with the exception of asking him to tell me the truth that he's made blatantly obvious. ='( How it appears to me is that he expects PERFECTION from me, while he can do whatever he wants to.. and I shouldn't question *a*ny*thing*.. even when he dangles it right in front of my face.

I feel I've been pushed to my limits, and beyond. I hope things work out for you though, shtonkalot (http://www.addforums.com/forums/member.php?u=57025). I'm sorry to have hijacked your thread here. It was just strikingly similar to what I'm dealing with.

BaberahamLincoln
10-05-11, 01:40 AM
I just got a copy of Is It You, Me, or ADD in my possession and have only read the forward by Dr. Barkley, but I'm eager to get into it and learn what I can recognize within myself to work on and work with in my relationships. Thanks to whoever recommended this!

Just wanted to update that I'm really gaining a lot of insight into myself and others that I've met with ADHD from this book. It feels like I'm just beginning to understand how significant of an impairment this is, in and of itself, and I'm determined to improve what I can bring to the table in my future friendships and relationships. I highly recommend it (from what I've read so far).

shtonkalot
10-20-11, 11:59 PM
I just wanted to come back and thanks to you all for the support and advice.
I have called it quits yesterday after another emotional day.

anonymouslyadd
10-21-11, 12:52 AM
I just wanted to come back and thanks to you all for the support and advice.
I have called it quits yesterday after another emotional day.

I'm glad you came here. I'm sorry for what's happened.:(