I've been reading alot about add/hd and also allergies and food sensitivities. I'm at a crossroad now with our son. He seems to have some of both.

We moved back to Canada from California and no longer have the resources to choose our child's doctor. He's almost five and shows small improvements with diet but I'm seeing a pediatrician soon to discuss allergies and his history of add/hd-like behavior.

I'm wondering how to approach the subject with a new doctor? I don't want my child placed on medication at such a young age without the proper testing and diagnostics. I've heard horror stories about children in my area who were placed on large and inappropriate doses. What should we expect prior to being told medication is what he needs? What kinds of testing should be required?

The child psychiatrist in California said he wouldn't diagnose our son as ADD/HD until at least 7 or 8 and suggested he had a regulatory disorder and may outgrow this behavior. It's better but not gone and the outbursts are very disruptive. He had such problems in preschool that I'm concerned about his starting kindergarten in the fall.

Suggestions?

Kimf,

You might want to research some articles & websites on ADD, and find a doctor who specializes in ADD. It sounds like your previous doctor may have been more "old school" or perhaps very conservative.

Let me know if you need some assistance finding some resources on-line.

I'm sure some of our other members also have some recommendations as well.

Originally posted by kimf
I've been reading alot about add/hd and also allergies and food sensitivities. I'm at a crossroad now with our son. He seems to have some of both.

He's almost five and shows small improvements with diet

but I'm seeing a pediatrician soon to discuss allergies and his history of add/hd-like behavior.

I don't want my child placed on medication at such a young age without the proper testing and diagnostics.

I've heard horror stories about children in my area who were placed on large and inappropriate doses.

What should we expect prior to being told medication is what he needs? What kinds of testing should be required?

The child psychiatrist in California said he wouldn't diagnose our son as ADD/HD until at least 7 or 8 and suggested he had a regulatory disorder and may outgrow this behavior.

It's better but not gone and the outbursts are very disruptive. He had such problems in preschool that I'm concerned about his starting kindergarten in the fall.

Suggestions?

Wow! You are RIGHT ON!

do you know how much you already know? Seriously!

Diet has an impact, doesn't fix the problem.

He seems young for drugs/ he probably is.

He seems like he'll be at risk fo less than optimal participation in Kindergarten / you are probably right.

seek a second opinion if you like.

Expect to have to be involved with school to help the teacher both understand your son's needs an dthink up ways to deal with the needs of a classroom and the needs of your child.

there are many good books to help you recognize what you see, and understand wht things can help.

So far nothing "fixes" ADHD. So set your expectations appropriately.

chin up. Such people as your son can make important and valuable contributions to society and still be ADHD.

disclaimer: take what you like and leave the rest. If it sounds like medical advice check it out with a doctor you pay so if it goes wrong you have someone legally responsible to sue, that won't be me. :)

Thanks for the response. He started kindergarten and of course began having issues within the first week. Unfortunately he can be aggressive when things aren't going well so that compunds the issues. Last week was better and the teacher even called to tell us so.

I'm in New Brunswick Canada ... do you know it takes up to six months to get a referral to a pediatrician here ... so we still haven't been able to see anyone.

Any suggestions for helping our child's teacher would be appreciated. On the positive he is taking the "time outs" well. We've tried to explain they aren't punishment but a time to quiet his body ... seems to be okay with him.

One thing that confuses me ... to children with ADD/HD attend to long activities? My son is able to play board and card games, make puzzles, work at school "activities" like math and letter writing. He can do these activities for a long while without any issues. He will turn off the TV so it doesn't distract him. Are these good signs?

From your description, Kim, it sounds like your child is able to do things that many ADD children are not - Namely, to concentrate on time-intensive tasks in school, and even {gasp} shut the TV off to concentrate better.

There certainly are tips for the teacher (http://www.edutechsbs.com/adhd/00037.htm) as well as the DSM IV definition of ADHD (http://www.edutechsbs.com/adhd/00002.htm) available online, but perhaps it would be helpful if you could describe the symptoms your child is exhibiting? Then we could guide you to some appropriate materials to read. Though I am not a medical professional, at first glance, it doesnt sound like your son has the "classic" ADHD signs.

Originally posted by kimf

One thing that confuses me ... to children with ADD/HD attend to long activities?

My son is able to play board and card games, make puzzles, work at school "activities" like math and letter writing. He can do these activities for a long while without any issues.

He will turn off the TV so it doesn't distract him. Are these good signs?

Yes they do attend to long activities. It is called hyperfocus.

Things that are inherently reinforcing, things that he "likes" will sometimes get almost addition like or compulsive amounts of time and attention.

That he knows how to EXTERNALLY limit his distrctability is GREAT!

Go get in line for that diagnosis! :)

That's my vote :) :))

You'll see different interpretations for the same things. That's why it is important to go to a professional who is paid to know and do, and why you have to come here and ask questions and get very convincing opposite opinions, sometimes, and then make up your own mind.

Good Luck and keep coming back!

Its true, its all about perception and interpretation.

What I "read" in Kim's post was:

* "...he can be aggressive when things aren't going well..."

* "My son is able to...work at school "activities" like math and letter writing...He can do these activities for a long while without any issues"

* "He will turn off the TV so it doesn't distract him"

IMHO, this is not an issue of hyperfocusing on enjoyable tasks. However, that being said...I dothink that these are excellent signs of a child who has adopted a good work ethic, can focus on work, knows how to concentrate and knows how and when to eliminate distractions. I think that's excellent!

The aggression is something to investigate, to find out why your son is becoming aggressive. Your son may be frustrated/agressive for any number of reasons that are not related to ADD. I hesistate to speculate any further in this post.

I too, therefore, recommend having your son evaluated by a professional.

Thanks everyone! I am "in line" to visit a pediatrician ... who I'm sure will then send us to another "specialist".

His symptoms ...
- he gets hyper when over stimulated and can't seem to get himself calmed down.
- There was a time when it would take hours for him to fall asleep and he would be restless all night. We removed some foods/chemicals from his diet and that issue was resolved. He now gets 11 hours a night.
- he's "very" intense emotionally
- he's extremely impulsive - This is the main problem that is difficult to manage and for others to cope with. It appears aggressive and it is certainly physical but I don't believe the intent is to hurt ... he just doesn't seem to think before he pushes or pokes or trips others. If there was a medication for impulse control, I think he'd be a candidate :-)
- He loses things and seems forgetful. I have no idea what he does at school unless his teacher calls (and then it's not usually a good report)

I don't think he gets hyperfocussed but then I'm not sure what that "looks like". He certainly enjoys things that make him think. He loves to play games and do art work but will stop when it's time to change activities. He can start and complete tasks. We've been trying to teach him good habits anticipating the school years so hopefully this will continue.

In the mean time we are keeping an open dialog with his teacher/school and hope we can keep him happy.

Thanks for your ideas and support. I have to say it's been confusing but I think we'll figure things out - I hope!

-Kim

Get a diagnosis, just don't start with an expectation that ONE THING will "fix" the problem.

There isn't, fundamentally, ONE PROBLEM. There is a condition that causes several problems. It may take one or more solutions per problem. Be patient.

Good luck.

kimf,
My understanding is that only about 5% of true ADHD kids have actual food allergies(see US Surgeon General's Report).That number has been consistently qouted for some time now.Also, diets like Feingold's were found to be helpful for true food allergies but not ADHD.My feeling is that it doesnt hurt anyone to watch what you eat, just dont look to diet as a clinical treatment for ADHD.

Here's a good book by an ADHD expert who is a Feingold disciple; John Taylor: Helping Your ADD Child..by John Taylor.Check it out.Good luck.

Thanks. I agree that the food restrictions does not solve the underlying problems but some foods do aggravate the situation. I can pretty much time it depending upon what he eats. He's not on the Feingold diet BUT if he drinks apple juice he doesn't just get hyper but gets several physical reactions as well. By removing the dyes and artificial chemicals that are in most foods, he's been sleeping through the night. This child didn't sleep through the night until he was almost four years old.

I don't believe these are true allergies but certainly they are sensitivities (we had him tested) and as someone who has both I know they can impact my mood, attention level and general well being.

Thanks for the wise words and the suggested reading. As I said earlier, I am working on getting a clinical diagnosis but in the meantime both diet and behavioral suggestions seem to be working - there were no real issues this past summer.

We've been to several specialists and no one has really said he has XYZ. It's always been suggestions and possibilities because he was so young. Now that he's in school I hope we'll get a concrete answer.

Thanks!

-K

So young, sometimes the thing to do is stand back and watch carefully, and wait to see what develops and what stays the same.

You have time.

Yes ... is it okay to do that? He's improved a great deal in the past year but school was a bit of a hiccup. I don't want him going down a path of poor self esteem. We are working VERY closely with his teacher right now. Today he came home with a "good day" card and was thrilled! As was I :-)

Read all the books by Sam Goldstein you can get your hands on. Your current focus and Sam's will support one another, i think.

http://www.samgoldstein.com/

http://www.raisingresilientkids.com/

Thanks. One person I have yet to read!

-K

Are there by any chance any cdc centers in your area? Child development Clinics are a good place to start for an evaluation, my daughter had her first evaluation done at a local cdc here. It took one full day and was intense in areas of physical and mental evaluations. It is just a starting point though, because sometimes these children exhibit things that the cdc doesnt get to see in their 1 day evaluation. Which prompts for an inpatient evaluation most of the time consisiting of a very structured enviroment which would cause any child to break ill or not! This would give you a better idea of exactly whats going on. As far as medications, my daughter is on several and I dont know that I agree with drugs and little ones, especially the drugs that havent even been studied by the FDA for use in children! I am currently seeking more natural medication alternatives for my daughter. I wish you luck with your son, It can be very hard! Keep your head up!

KimF,
Have you read Brain Allergies by Phillpot? Lots of good info.
Also, have you had your son tested for pyroluria? Have you heard of it? It was discovered in 1952 by researchers who presented their findings to the APA (American Psychiatric Assoc) but they falsified the report in order to continue receiving grant money from the drug companies. It's the "Watergate" of the mental health arena.
Pyroluria is a naturally-produced poison caused by an adrenal gland that is not working properly. Researchers found that this gland will not function properly unless it gets enough B-6 and zinc. The symptoms of pyroluria range from mild such as a little anxiety to full-blown schizophrenia, if left untreated. The longer it is left untreated, the harder it is to cure.
There are several sites that explain pyroluria such as dr.kaslow and doctoryourself.
If I were you, I'd call a local lab (do you have LabCorp?) and ask if they have a urine test for "pyrroles" or "pyroluria." If so, it's pretty easy to just take them a urine sample. They will ship it to another testing facility like the Bio-Center in Wichita, Kansas overnight air. Total cost is usually $72.00 but you need to have a lab order from your doc first.
One more thing, scattered white spots on your son's fingernails are a red flag for pyroluria. Also, if he has had frequent ear infections you should suspect a milk allergy. And there is a HUGE correlation between a milk allergy and pyroluria.
If you'd like more info, please let me know. I've written a book on this subject but it hasn't been published yet.
NWLinda

I have done some digging on pyroluria, and am having some difficulty finding reliable information (from websites other than nutritional & supplement websites). Do you have any medical research, not sponsored by a nutritional or supplement company that describes pyroluria, how it develops and its impact, etc.?

Do you have the minutes of the APA meeting as well? How do you know the report was falsified? This is all quite interesting to me.

Hey, I reread the initial post. he is five? Let him have some outbursts.

Be kind and loving, and hold your ground as an adult, which is to say, don't let his actions FORCE you to do anything. Always hold the open option.

You might make simple rules for him to follow, but don't trap your self with the same. < smile >