View Full Version : And it may take even longer to persuade doctors to think like ecologists.

05-20-13, 05:06 AM
studies-of-human-microbiome-yield-new-insights (

A switch from a love of diversity in expensive trinkets to a love of diversity in the microbial diversity within the human body.

New medicine.

Ahhh but how ( ??

When it comes to our inner ecosystem, our kick-it-and-see western diet and lifestyle experiment may not only be removing some important members all together (think wide spread use of antibiotics, for example), but reducing our gut microbiomes ability to defend itself (and us) against opportunistic pathogens (some domestic, some foreign) and reducing its overall metabolic output (more on this in a minute).Diversity of natural foods - diversity of microbial communities nurtured.

The scientists reared mice that lacked any microbiome. In their guts and lungs, the germ-free mice developed abnormally high levels of immune cells called invariant natural killer T cells. Normally, these cells trigger a swift response from the immune system against viruses and other pathogens. In Dr. Blumberg’s microbe-free mice, however, they caused harmful inflammation. As adults, the mice were more likely to suffer from asthma and inflammatory bowel disease. Inflammation underlies Western disease - diversity of real foods (organic) as the only mechanism of developing internal microbial divresity.

Eat monoculture develop internal microbiomic monoculture - succumb to inflammatory disease.

The vegetable is your friend.

05-20-13, 05:12 AM
Nobody with any biomedical knowledge would ever try and generate microbiomic diversity through any means other than diet/lifestyle.

All Western diseases result from an interaction of poor lifestyle (predominantly stress from having to earn money) in interaction with diet.

This represents key (only UNMANAGEABLE) mental level stressor in interaction with key (only UNMANAGEABLE) physical level stressor.

Immorality x Microbial monoculture enrichment.

We need morality (mind) and microbial diversity.

Both (of these) factors unsurprisingly !! lead to stress.

From above: "developed abnormally high levels of immune cells called invariant natural killer T cells."

From previously ( : "cortisol resulted in a significant decrease of NK cell activity" - chronic stress wipes out NK cell population.

So - we've a bizarre situation in which we're profoundly deranging NK cell activity - through diet and immorality (forcing people to need money to survive) (the only physical and mental level stressors which are unmanageable (for the body) - and lead to disease)

- and we're becoming diseased.


Solution - a sustainable zero energy house and a diverse sustainable fresh organic vegan diet to all by co-operative working; microbiomic diversity ensured - optimal immune system operation - freedom from disease.


05-20-13, 05:41 AM
From the perspective of an ecologist, and more specifically a microbial ecologists, diversity is something you want in an ecosystem. Greater diversity is associated with resilience, or the microbiomes ability to deal with such things as opportunistic pathogens or perturbations from diet. Define optimal physiology not correct pathophysiology.

Awareness of bacterial, fungal and viral diversity required within body completely outclasses any man-made artificial intervention in curing disease.

Outcome variable.

All we can do is allow people an unmanageable stress-free life by removing the need for money to survive, and availing diversity of real food to all people.

05-20-13, 05:47 AM
Switching from a low-fat, plant polysaccharide-rich diet to a high-fat, high-sugar "Western" diet shifted the structure of the microbiota within a single day, changed the representation of metabolic pathways in the microbiome, and altered microbiome gene expression. Reciprocal transplants involving various combinations of donor and recipient diets revealed that colonization history influences the initial structure of the microbial community but that these effects can be rapidly altered by diet. Humanized mice fed the Western diet have increased adiposity; this trait is transmissible via microbiota transplantation.

05-20-13, 05:50 AM
No drug will ever result in internal microbial diversity.

All (Western class) disease may be cured by diet/lifestyle (environmental) intervention.

Human genetics (that people are born to develop Western disease) is ABSOLUTE c***.

Not pre-determined - human beings are dying because food corporations - in order to maximise profit$ are pouring cheap and addictive non-foods (starch, sugar, trans-fat, processed vegetable oil, MSG, artificial sweeteners) into people - which is resulting in disease.

At its root (of all of the disease which the pharmaceutical corporation courts) - lies the profit-motive.
Remove the profit motive and nobody 'll be there to alter the profile of foods available to you - to precipitate disease.

Remove money - remove non-foods.

05-20-13, 06:36 AM
The sole question I have is:
organic/diverse/fresh vegan ketogenic versus organic/diverse/fresh vegan non-ketogenic ?

The answer - I think - is low amounts of organic/diverse/fresh vegan food whereby ketosis is maintained by virtue of total calorific intake.

'Ketosis' may be retained by staying in dietary intake just a notch above starvation.

See Mount Athos - 10 mins organic/diverse/fresh vegan eating daily.

What stops people from eating so little ?
Eating as stress-relief.

So duh!! ELIMINATE the unmanageable stress !! and people will revert to natural patterns of eating.

Exactly - discard money.

05-20-13, 06:49 AM
To test this hypothesis, the current author (under the mentorship of Drs. Ethan Sims and Edward Horton at the University of Vermont) undertook a study of subjects given a very low calorie ketogenic diet for 6 weeks in a metabolic research ward [13 (].
That these subjects'peak aerobic power did not decline despite 6 weeks of a carbohydrate-free, severely hypocaloric diet implies that the protein and mineral contents of the diet were adequate to preserve functional tissue. As can be noted, endurance time to exhaustion was reduced after one week of the ketogenic diet, but it was significantly increased over the baseline value by the 6-week time point.

Sole question - near starvation diet for life ?

Yes - I think so.

05-20-13, 06:54 AM
Eating's a pastime only to those in need of self-medication from stress.

So ubiquitous is the stress from money/societal hierarchy/a dominant societal message of consume/consumerism as much as possible
- that people can't even intuit their own level of stress.

One needs a period without it - to recognize its presence.

There is no respite from that type of societal stress in the culture we live in - and so people have 'normalised' to a viciously criminal societal environment.

And have proceeded to eat themselves (ourselves) to death.

05-20-13, 06:56 AM
Kill money -> Eliminate inequality ->
Equality as root to alleviation of suffering.

05-20-13, 07:37 AM
As can be noted, endurance time to exhaustion was reduced after one week of the ketogenic diet, but it was significantly increased over the baseline value by the 6-week time point.
Low carbohydrate diets seem to reduce the fecal concentration of SCFA in the short term. Some adaptation seems to occur, judging by the differences between the study periods (4 weeks vs. 8 weeks).

Looks like we've 2 fundamental metabolisms ... (1) growth and (2) maintenance.

And the secret to healthy ageing - is to know when growth is over and maintenance begins.

Problem - the maintenance profile of food intake (gut microbiome fibre metabolism) requires loss of material world attachment (blood glucose elevation as dopaminergic reward strategy) and moral societal infrastructure (absence of unmanageable stress)
- however - that said - switch from growth type to maintenance type of food intake profile - and you've the basis to healthy ageing.

05-20-13, 07:41 AM
From exogenous carb/protein (Insulin/IGF-1 axes) to endogenous fat (SCFA) production.
Naturally - you will struggle to acquire diabesity if you're eating a low calorie fibre (inulin) based diet for your internal microbiomic farmers to turn into nutritious SCFAs.

Blanched Dubois
05-20-13, 09:16 AM
With all due respect, I've been attempting to follow your threads as I'm also investigating what the human genome 'needs' for optimal functioning for quality of a healthy life without meds based on diet, exercise and flooding cells and organs, entire system with approved fluids that would not impair homeostasis from occurring.

I find the one size fits all theory you're submitting missing important variables and I've tested this 'theory' of yours here with a system and it didn't work, completely.

I was already in 'good' physical health ie; body was diseased but no heart disease or illness' other than 'severe spinal stenosis of C2-C7, bone spurs, serious compression issues ( painful, stiff, limited in function ) arthritis both osteo and rheumatoid in varying part of body ( lower back, shoulder, knee and feet/ankles, and Chronic tickborne disease with various virus' -Lyme Disease from No. California Lyme Tick bite, Epsteins Barr, CFS, Fibromyalgia etc etc.

The 'system' did include a diet very specific in what it allowed based on the premise that certain foods are poison to the system, cause high acidity and kept the body and cells from being healed by homeostasis by never allowing said body to reach homeostasis.

I followed said system to the 'T'. It did, within first 2 weeks allow me to stop taking .5mg of percacet for breakthrough pain and 10mg of methadone for treatment of pain so severe I could not walk without a cane, and relieve severe neck and back pain, stiffness, limited range of motion, it did give increased energy, cure inflammation, remove pain in joints, made bones protruding from RA/spinal injurty look less inflamed visibly changed appearance of swollen spine and foot bones ( i am a woman past menopause early from partial hysterectomy in 2005 ) it also healed gums disease, cured a 30 yr cigarette addiction, had me sleeping on my back for the first time in my life, improved skin and hair and eyes by 'the look of it' -IE; while it seemed to 'cure' body fast of these ailments and stopped a 30 yr nightmare by the knowledge given that these were flashbacks to pre verbal infant child abuse starting in the crib at about 6 months of age ( and validated by years of physical abuse I did suffer at the hands of my mother - who suffers from undiagnosed, untreated, NPD/BPD/possible Bi-Polar or ADHD - casebook Narcissist without a doubt based on family dynamic ) the 'dreams' never happened again after being given this 'reading' of the state of my body so it did, in some way, help heal chronic long term PTSD heretofore undiagnosed, untreated and serious enough to cause my life severe limitations I did adapt to, improvise to and overcome to 'appear' 'normal' and succeed in my business - but again did not hit on the serious bowel issue I was told was 'nothing' and given antibiotics to 'cure' - I was blown off by everyone including my Dr's and the system developer herself who called me some spiritually foo-foo names when I suggested she was 'wrong' in her estimation of 'me' and my 'issue' of seriously misread symptoms presenting.

She tried to reimburse me the money I spent on the system for myself and my son. She also insisted that I never speak directly to her again and since I decided to send her money back and insist that I wanted to continue and believed in the system due to the rather miraculous way I had no pain or discomfort other than sweating profusely to relieve myself of pain meds I was on for 4 years and the other successes' i'd measured - she agreed to work with me via email. I struggled with the question of her system and her treatment of me worthy of 'completing' and doing the maintenance required to reap benefit of body now able to heal in a state of complete and non undermined homeostasis by diet alone and taking the quart of water with 3 half droppers of formula water and nothing else but diet to keep healing body of all disease.

I did have to spend a week in the hospital and previously ingest 2 separate doses of the 'strongest antibiotic' at 10 day intervals while the System developer, Dr's and ER's did nothing but blow me off as 'in menopause' or 'suffering from a sinus infection' and 'crazy'. Also during this time I noted heightened ADHD - hyperactivity worse than ever. Still, no scans of body were ordered and I had 'forgotten' to demand these tests by trusting the 'authority' of Dr's and ER Dr's as I had so much success in every other way from system. Ie; I was under the illusion that I was simply fighting an infection. I did NOT note why my stomach did distend at varying times ( RED FLAG i missed as did physicians at ER and Primary Care Ofc) after eating my small amount I eat at meals. I prefer to graze during the day on fruit for breakfast, water, on an empty stomach, protein from fish, mainly and dark leafy green veggies, certain root veggies, more water, and protein, complex carbo's with certain nuts, beans etc, very light dinner and no eating past 5pm. Water or herb tea with the only sweetner allowed called Organic Succinot. That sugar, system's designer/sales woman/ medical 'medium' deemed the ONLY form of sugar allowed on system due to how the body breaks it down etc. and that it would not interfere with cleanse part of system ( first 4-6 weeks ) - the pivotal symptom presenting was missed by me who had never had experience with what a distended tummy would mean with no bowel discomfort - no pain - just the swollen lymph nodes and the belief that the system was working even though I had no respect for the employment of system developers 'marketing plan and execution of said plan'.

Hence, while I agree with the premise of the system it failed due to a few important factors that I experienced using myself as the lab rat. 1. The system did not 'ease' you into the radical change from one diet to another. ( i did that myself and with the one Dr I had that did treat me as a whole unit aka person aka unified field of energy) for 6 months prior. I had already begun weaning from full dose of methadone and percacet to lowest possible dose while remaining comfortable and able to do basic functions permanently disabled but caring for my disabled son and home, bills, etc 2. It was possibly responsible for causing a probably dis-eased bowel system to go from malfunctioning to 'normal' functioning and therefore caused a bowel 'problem'. In my case, it caused the small intestine to become blocked or perforated and went undetected due to, I imagine ( i have no answer to 'why' I ended up needed a bowel resection - will find out with new GI and a colonoscopy) going from non optimal or diseased functioning for so many years to optimal functioning and created a 'shock' of sorts which created a 'problem' I was told 'could happen to anyone' and 'was most likely caused by the bowel snagging on scar tissue' - and this was all supposition. Have not gotten to GI since. Going this month for that 'answer' GI specialist thinks he can provide by 'looking at the bowel' through scope.
3. One diet does not fit all. The diet on the system included all veggies, root veggies, ie; no meat, no cows milk, no gluten etc etc vastly different than the 'balanced diet' I had previously followed. ( I am 5'2 about 105lbs - thin frame muscularly and genetically though good muscle to fat mass - not a lot of fat as I had cut sugar and refined white foods out of my diet previously for at least a year and exercise was limited to walking rapidly for cardio and long enough to up heartbeat and burn calories, build more muscle, and pilates type exercise to provide lean muscle mass and optimal flexibility) and 'bouncing' on a mini trampoline, and a hour of sun daily.

There are many people I have spoken to ( healers, those who are studying affect of drugs ( poisons to the body?) vs Food and water intake upon the cells of the body and a 'formula of energetically imprinted energies' when added to a quart of water a day in graduating increments over 4-6 weeks vs water by itself one of few 'allowed' fluids to intake on system to get body to release all poisons and flood allegedly severely dehydrated cells the nourishment necessary to bringing the body into a state of homeostasis AFTER the poisons were excreted via sweat glands and through epidural system. This system did not take into consideration the argument of blood types diets as viable. System developer was the only one she deemed 'capable' of regulating the various symptoms I presented and offered treatment of said symptoms to 'cure' the infection. Before the bowel fully blocked or whatever happened to it that caused it to create pain worse than childbirth while my eyes rolled into the back of my head at 4 something in the morning ( when I presume the bowel is attempting to process leftover unneeded aspects of ingested foods in body from the day before ?) and knock me out - I was told to 'avoid the hospitals as they'd just pump me full of chemicals because she believes ALL meds are poison to the body that is healthy. I was also told to 'not eat so much' - all leading me to question system developer as 'so stuck in her spiritual significance aka I'm right and the entire world is wrong assumption - her system works for everyone and only 'once before this happened' and other nonsense she told me when I insisted she was 'wrong' as I was not eating too much, following the diet precisely as directed and on NO meds for anything by the time I died for 3 minutes before the EMT's got there to revive me and get me to the ER for emergency surgery to save my life.

For instance, the GAP diet is recommended for anyone diagnosed with sensory disorders, ADHD/Aspberger's/Broad Spectrum Disorder assuming your theory and the above theory are in fact true in theory and practice.

After I was hospitalized for a week and lost a part of my small colon ( where B12 is stored) and while in patient during that week I was given no specifics as to how much colon was taken prior to resection- Surgeon who performed emergency surgery refused to talk with me sending his 'associate surgeons' ( the underlings ) because I was not advocated as a single disabled woman with no family or friends or 3rd party-legal/medical adovacy in place at my side before or during ER surgery to save my life, complicated by 4 months of disintegration of said bowel system, sepsis/necrosis and (history of taking pain meds which is prejudiced in society ) - no one cared to order catscan or mri to see why symptoms were presenting. Lymph nodes were the only red flag to them and not enough to give a crap about me or my son or our life which is lived with no family or friends due to our 'illness' as 'unacceptable'. Absolutely prejudiced by opinion and neglected, harassed - utterly attacked by some who could and should have 'helped' but chose not to because they didn't trust me or know me.

So, after 4 months gangrene/necrosis set in due to misdiagnosis/malpractice of Primary care Physician who was not interested in ordering a Cat Scan to 'see' what was going on to cause severe perspiration, lymph nodes inflamed, seriously fluctuating and rapid heart beat ( from 151 bpm to 200 when asleep randomly in the sleep state ) severe fluctuations in body temperature from extremely cold extremities to heat flashes and more perspiration to cold and back again, extreme fatigue, weight loss ....i got nothing but disdain, laughed at, and told I was menopausal / crazy.

Now I'm following a balanced diet I feel is 'right' and taking control of my physicians care of my boy and self by forcing them to look at entire medical files with history and genetics - family history before I'll allow them to blow me out their offices.

Submitted ( i'm not a scholar or scientist, obviously) with respect.

Lastly, it is my contention that this is why we have diseased societies - it's based on the treatment of human beings as parts by 'specialists' who don't take the time necessary to educate themselves as to what could really be at cause for severe cases like mine as well as the way in which culture ( who is NOT your friend ) is lived today with no real care for a 'tribal' unit and how that might impact one's well being and how that does affect the health or disease of the body as a unified field made up of body/mind/emotions/spirit et al.

“Humanity is at a crossroads, we can only go one way, as one can’t go in two directions at the same time. We do not know what we need to do as a human species, there is only one place to go and that is into the light, as one tribe”.

Click here to listen to Prayer from Flordemayo (approx. 20 minutes)

The Hogan is a meeting or gathering place that serves as the Altar and Teaching space for Flordemayo’s intimate group-teachings. It is located in the heart of New Mexico approximately 1 hour from Albuquerque. The Hogan is also serving as seed temple until the plans are fulfilled for an underground, temperature and humidity controlled, seed temple that will serve as the Sacred Seed Temple that fulfills the vision that Flordemayo had to preserve, bless and share sacred seeds for generations to come.

* Genetic modifications vs unaltered seed for healthy 'food'

05-20-13, 01:26 PM
The 'system' did include a diet very specific in what it allowed based on the premise that certain foods are poison to the system, cause high acidity and kept the body and cells from being healed by homeostasis by never allowing said body to reach homeostasis.

Excellent stuff - the paper I was about to present - before seeing your post.

paper 1
( modern Western-type diet is deficient in fruits and vegetables and contains excessive animal products, generating the accumulation of non-metabolizable anions and a lifespan state of overlooked metabolic acidosis, whose magnitude increases progressively with aging due to the physiological decline in kidney function. In response to this state of diet-derived metabolic acidosis, the kidney implements compensating mechanisms aimed to restore the acid-base balance, such as the removal of the non-metabolizable anions, the conservation of citrate, and the enhancement of kidney ammoniagenesis and urinary excretion of ammonium ions. These adaptive processes lower the urine pH and induce an extensive change in urine composition, including hypocitraturia, hypercalciuria, and nitrogen and phosphate wasting. Low urine pH predisposes to uric acid stone formation. Hypocitraturia and hypercalciuria are risk factors for calcium stone disease. Even a very mild degree of metabolic acidosis induces skeletal muscle resistance to the insulin action and dietary acid load may be an important variable in predicting the metabolic abnormalities and the cardiovascular risk of the general population, the overweight and obese persons, and other patient populations including diabetes and chronic kidney failure. High dietary acid load is more likely to result in diabetes and systemic hypertension and may increase the cardiovascular risk. Results of recent observational studies confirm an association between insulin resistance and metabolic acidosis markers, including low serum bicarbonate, high serum anion gap, hypocitraturia, and low urine pH.
paper 2 (
Metabolic alkalosis:The cause of the patient's metabolic alkalosis eventually was linked to surreptitious ingestion of baking soda.And back to stress (ie why doesn't stress hormone naturally correct pH variation):
"cortisol leads to increased renal excretion of hydrogen ions, which are acidic, therefore leading to an alkalosis"

Why aren't we stress hormone sensitive ?


In neuro / endocrinology - increasing the levels of a neurotransmitter or hormone results - through negative feedback in the system becoming 'resistant' to the neurotransmitter or hormone.

Because of the stress (which nobody can see because it's ubiquitous) of living in an immoral societal infrastructure of only money - we're directly leading to cortisol insensitivity.
Cortisol insensitivity (because of cortisol's anti-inflammatory role) - results in the floodgates being opened to inflammation.

Inflammation is a commonality to the disorders/diseases of Western living.

05-20-13, 01:32 PM
Stress hormone alkalizes.
Chronic stress screws up our bodily pH buffering system - resulting in a set-point skewed towards acidosis.

Not based on science - unlike the post above ... however ... this page sums it all up:
"Usually we think of whole food as the source of alkalizing elements required for pH fitness. However, even with the best alkaline diet cannot prevent the inevitable drop in body pH during physical, emotional or mental stress ..."

That site suggests exercise - personal experience though is that the lactic acid makes things worse.
A perfect alkalizing diet isn't enough.

Sodium bicarb ingestion is useful - but not a useful strategy in the long term.
Plenty of papers suggesting that exercise induced acidity (lactic acid) is offset by sodium bicarb ingestion prior to exercise.

In the long term we have to eliminate unmanageable stress - by eliminating money/law - the 2 factors which prevent human equality (equality of man).

As of mind (emergence of mind, emergence of modern man) - anything we do which doesn't lead towards equality - is stressful.

05-20-13, 01:42 PM
A sign of the incredible idiocy of man - that morality (the prime directive of mind) - where mind is the species' highest emergent property - can somehow be overlooked when considering human disease.

Highest emergent property's prime directive = morality

And so when we engage in immoral behaviour (anything to do with money) - we become stressed.

Stress translates into overcranking cortisol production (cortisol insensitivity resulting).

And then the floodgates are opened to metabolic acidosis and inflammation.

And soon after and way prematurely -> we're dead.

05-20-13, 02:20 PM
That site suggests exercise - personal experience though is that the lactic acid makes things worse.

However - under metabolic acidosis - by exercising - breathing harder - we blow off CO2 and thereby alkalize the body.

What's the problem ?

Extreme anaerobic acidifies ?
Challenging aerobic alkalizes ?

Definitely true that acidification occurs with exercise.
Definitely true that heavy breathing alkalizes.

Nothing's ever easy.

05-20-13, 02:24 PM
Exercise moderately. Contrary to popular belief, intense or excess exercise will actually cause excess acid buildup in the body. Alkalizing exercise is pain-free, aerobic and moderate, rather than excess or intense.


05-20-13, 02:33 PM
Looks like everybody and their dog knows ... ... ...
Ideally, your body should be slightly alkaline, but most people's bodies are excessively acidic due to [1] high stress levels, [2] a diet high in meat, sugar consumption and other acid-forming habits.
Game over.

We're (Western world disorders) sick (primarily) because of a
[1] mental stress (world with money) x [2] physical stress (poor diet (acidifying))

05-21-13, 06:06 AM
The acidity theory of atherosclerosis does not unde
restimate the importance of other key factors
for atherosclerosis like ageing, improper diet, env
ironmental pollution, lifestyle, physical
inactivity, tobacco smoking and genetic predisposit
ion. However, most of these risk factors
might result in altered autonomic nervous system, s
ympathetic bias, increased lactic acid and
acidic environment thus propitiating atherogenesis.
Our proposal may extend to any respiratory
or metabolic disturbances resulting in acidosis.

wikiP/bicarb buffering system Any disturbance of the system will be compensated by a shift in the chemical equilibrium according to Le Chatelier's principle. For example, if one attempted to acidify the blood by dumping in an excess of hydrogen ions (acidemia), some of those hydrogen ions will associate with bicarbonate, forming carbonic acid, resulting in a smaller net increase of acidity than otherwise. This buffering system becomes an even more powerful regulator of acidity when it is coupled with the body's capacity for respiratory compensation, in which breathing is altered to modify the amount of CO2 in circulation. In the above example, increased ventilation would increase the loss of CO2 to the atmosphere, driving the equilibria above to the left. The process could continue until the excess acid is all exhaled.But but but:
The rate of secretion of hydrogen ions (H+, protons) is affected by several factors, including luminal pH, systemic pCO2, mineralocorticoids, and the potential difference across the collecting duct ... ....
Stress (mental from living an immoral life in a world with money)

Hydrocortisone ( (cortisol) 1 1 8Suggests that cortisol has 1=glucocorticoid, 1=mineralocorticoid activity.
That is - that cortisol has both glucococorticoid and mineralocorticoid activities.
... active secretion of protons via proton ATPases-*-

So - what's going on ?
Acid-Base homeostasis is screwed up by the chronic stress induced by living within an immoral societal infrastructure where money is required to survive - and where money results in inequality - where the primie human directive of our highest emergent property (mind) - is towards equality.

Can we correct this problem with diet or exercise ?
Not really - breathing mechanism, diet, exercise can be used to help modify pH in either direction (well accepted) ... ... but if you've a constant stressor going on in the background.

It's a bit like having a massage whilst you're on the deck of the Titanic and heading directly for an iceberg - in plain view - the effects of exercise/diet/meditation - can't serve to correct the acid-base imbalance from glucocorticoid/mineralocorticoid derangement from chronic mental stress.

'd be the conclusion.

I've tried every form of 'healthy' intervention - none work - forcing an individual to do something immoral to the state of their mind - results in stress.

And - I don't know whether we'd want it any other way - for if we were able to circumvent the problem - we would never realise a novel societal infrastructure in which equality was enshrined - would be stuck on in 'stupid' world - where people 'd spend their limited lives chasing money (money is a hard drug worse (more addictive/damaging) than heroin) ... ... in a drugged out haze in which immorality (getting that nexgt hit - the pay rise etc) win out over morality (generating a better world) - in the battle for an individual's time.

This idea, of course, explains why the love/desire of money is the root of all evil.

We're looking at a mechanism by which a non-chemical agent (money) activates and stimulates damaging dependence - in exactly the same way that the terrible hard drugs (heroin etc) do.

So addictive - that guess what happens when one suggests we remove heroin (money) from the heroin-addict (people who live for money) ... ...
exactly what you'd expect. MqviZBtknBboDf4hOokqQ iU6TEhTgsgaB2-Kph2-

Heroin and Money - both the same from a strictly neurochemical perspective.

05-21-13, 06:12 AM
That's all there is to it then -

We're an aerobic reaction.
We need to ensure a certain internal environment to support mitochondrial function.
That internal environment is predominantly defined by glucocorticoid and mineralocorticoid.
These hormones are essential for functioning of human metabolism.

Then along came a mind - whcih was hitched onto the predecessor mechanism of stress correction (cortisol) - and all hell broke loose - as chronic stress (leading to cortisol insensitivity/metabolic acidosis) - resulted in a slow disintegration of the human organism to the diseases of Western living.

Morality (to live a moral life) is the * solution.

* only

All other factors leading to pH imbalance are corrected by allowing the individual to operate to the letter of morality - you're now free to exercise, you're now free from stress and therefore free from the motivation to drink alcohol/smoke cigarettes , you're now free not to ever worry about losing your job [you don't need one], you're now free from worry about whether your kids will make it in dumbo world (where only money matters) [because academic achievement [Uni certificates for money] is no longer a conditionality on survival] ... ...[B]
... ... so - we'll observe cortisol sensitivity restored - a lifestyle which becomes man (unmanageable stress-less) and you'll live a life which'll be pain-free until point of death.

And that's about as good as it can get - with the only additional point to be made - of that (as described above) as societal infrastructure which supports - with mind (acquisition of wisdom)/pair-bonding (formation of actual pair-bond cf prairie vole)-> detachment from material desires - which results in the internal experiential perspective or arrival at a place which may be considered bliss.

When you no longer want anything (this is how you tell whether you're detached from material desires) - because (and without anything other than the sun, veggies and some form of sufficient shelter - which is owned communally ie isn't yours) - you have all that you need.

Freedom from material desires occurs when you no longer want anything physical, nor want power ie the paradigms of money and law (legal system) lose complete control over you - because you want neither of what either can provide.

05-21-13, 06:28 AM
So - fair societal infrastructure + education for understanding context (ie the evolutionary mechanism) + pair-bonding results in the ideal journey from point of conception (t - 9 months) back from birth to death.

We're required to start at point of conception - because of (and as described by Peripheral) - the adverse effects of maternal stress on developing embryo.

Presumably - even further back - the effects of stress on germ cell development 'd probably reveal increased mutation rate under stress ... also ...

05-21-13, 06:32 AM
And there's the idea ... ...

You’ve heard of insulin resistance, leptin resistance, and possibly even thyroid resistance. But have you heard of “cortisol resistance”? Recent research suggests that resistance of cells and tissues to the actions of cortisol – rather than high cortisol levels in the blood – may be the primary factor in the stress-disease connection.

05-21-13, 06:35 AM

Chronic stress, glucocorticoid receptor resistance, inflammation, and disease risk

After covarying the control variables, those with recent exposure to a long-term threatening stressful experience demonstrated GlucoCorticoid ResistanceHow do you treat resistance syndromes - by taking away high levels of hormone etc and allowing sensitivity to re-instate.

05-21-13, 07:02 AM
Our society won't allow the meaning of life to man - because detachment from material desires is not supported by a societal infrastructure which does not permit survival without material world attachment (the motivation to earn money).

So - our societal infrastructure is the cause of all diseases of Western living - if you're not stressed (and dying - see paper above) in this current societal infrastructure - then you're a psychopath - and are just loving all of the pain which inequality in wealth brings.

Personal experience - cortisol resistance manifests itself in wandering inflammatory disease - which shifts from dental to hand and feet, to joint - to asthmatic inflammatory pain - and I'm pretty sure that lethargy, interference with thought, memory loss etc (ie central and mental effects) directly result from cortisol insensitivity.

05-21-13, 07:08 AM
Because inflammation plays an important role in the onset and progression of a wide range of diseases, this model may have broad implications for understanding the role of stress in health. We're designed to be social/moral creatures.
Equality as root to alleviation of suffering.

05-25-13, 07:19 AM
Define optimal physiology not correct pathophysiology.

Awareness of bacterial, fungal and viral diversity required within body completely outclasses any man-made artificial intervention in curing disease.

Outcome variable.

All we can do is allow people an unmanageable stress-free life by removing the need for money to survive, and availing diversity of real food to all people.

Forcing me to eat an all vegan diet is no less stressful than FORCING me to earn money to survive - There is a common thread between a monetary driven society and your proposition that is by asserting FORCE.

My metabolism does not work the same as many "westerns" - taken from link reference in this post (

Capacity for Moderate Exercise in Obese Subjects after Adaptation to a Hypocaloric, Ketogenic Diet (

To study the capacity for moderate endurance exercise and change in metabolic fuel utilization during adaptation to a ketogenic diet, six moderately obese, untrained subjects were fed a eucaloric, balanced diet (base line) for 2 wk, followed by 6 wk of a protein-supplemented fast (PSF), which provided 1.2 g of protein/kg ideal body wt, supplemented with minerals and vitamins. The mean weight loss was 10.6 kg

I am NOT nor do I tend to be obese! Before menopause I tended to be under weight according to charts and stuff - I do not eat when stressed nor do I eat when board - I eat when I am calmly alert and I only eat until I am no longer hungry.

I like fruits and vegetables I naturally prefer fish over other meats but I do need some form of animal protein in my diet -I can not digest legumes {beans and such} I can NOT use them as a protein substitute I just unpleasantly found out beans and such are kin to wheat,rye, barley which I shouldn't be digesting those either apparently.

Now for some thing totally different

Paleo Diet Food List (


~live link above removed due to guidelines but article some good points for those interested enough to copy and paste into browser ~

Humans are predators we are supposed to eat like predators not like cattle - Constant eating isn't good for any thing but stock yard animals -

I guess what struck me was the list of things to avoid are all the things I can't eat seeing as I am having to entertain a Celiac diet due to autoimmune disorders which are caused by not only by stress but eating crap I wasn't designed to eat -

While I tend toward considering it mostly BS I have noticed my symptoms getting worse when I lost control of my own diet and began eating stuff I never did - because some one else cooked it.

I ran into some one on a paleo diet and looked that up and although it eliminates two of my favorite foods yogurt and cheese every thing else on the list of "don't eat" I naturally avoided the first 39 years of my life - Sense modifying my diet by removing the obvious culprits bread and pasta I have already began to feel better.

Now my BIG question here is

Would you like me to force you to eat meat?

Then by all means please do NOT suggest I be force to go vegan!!!!

I have many vegan friends I support their choice and their dedication but the reason we are friends is because they accept their choice as their own while allowing me the freedom to make my own choices even when in the face of diversity - To be friends we all accept responsibility for our choices while allowing others the right to do the same.

As you can see their are equally good arguments for going to a mostly meat diet . . .. The stress and money thing well I agree there but until a collective plan is formulated to actually do some thing no reason to get my knickers in a knot - When actual practical plans replace talk well I may or may not still be around . . . Until then I am left to survive best I can with what has been given. I consider any desire to force my will upon others verboten.

Bottom line I want to spend my time left on Earth appreciating what life I do have as opposed to wasting what I have wanting for some thing I have not.

05-26-13, 05:26 AM
Not forcing ... :-) ... I'm still not sure what the answer is ... ... though things are about to become quite considerably simple soon ... ... why ?


05-26-13, 06:53 AM
Human disease - the cats are responsible:
"MiAOwwwww! ("

So - if people want - I guess animal product can be eaten - though there's no biological reason why we should - though plenty of reasons why we shouldn't.

05-26-13, 07:19 AM
I can not digest legumes {beans and such}

Just had an allergic reaction to vegan protein powder - containing pea protein isolate - so next stop!! - rice powder isolate or just plain protein intake from green leaves.

The problem with animal products - they're just very inefficient to produce - aren't really compatible with happy animals - and can't be rolled out to 10 billion people.

Just on a practical level - are animal products an option for the planet ?

05-26-13, 07:37 AM
From a paleo link ... ...

Reactivity versus

What Are Lectins?
Lectins are proteins found in animals (including you) and plants – they’re everywhere, especially in grains, legumes (especially soy), nuts and seeds. Observing a very obvious reaction versus nuts (first), seeds second - legumes third ... ... which could make life difficult as a ketogenic vegan.

Down to green veg and cold pressed vegetable oil ... ... which could be enough - pesky protein levels required - don't know the answer.

Certainly - if key to eliminate Insulin / IGF-1 fluctuations - a world of zero carb / low protein 'd be advised ?

The ketogenic diet is a high-fat, adequate-protein, low-carbohydrate diet
What does adequate mean ?