Hello all, My ten year old son has ADD, he has previously been on Ritalin, which worked, but gave him stomachaches... We tried Metadate, which didn't do anything, but give ME a headache trying to get him to take it in the mornings. We went back to the Dr. on Friday, (this was a sub dr. his regular dr. was out on medical leave) and she gave us Concerta to try. She gave us 18mg. once a day, and then a prescription for 5mg. of Ritalin, prn in the afternoons, after we left the dr.s office, I was reading through the information on Concerta and saw it is supposed to last 12 hours. Since it seems to me, that the concerta will last through homework time, I didn't get the Ritalin filled. My question is, I see some of you who post here actually take the concerta yourselves, does it seem to last the entire 12 hours? Or do you feel it is wearing off?

Another question I have is, and I know this may be hard to answer, but I am trying so hard to understand what my son is going through, I get so frustrated, when I am trying to help him with homework, and it takes him SO LONG to do a simple page, that shouldn't take 3 minutes to do, can those of you who actually take the medicine try to describe the difference you feel when you are on it vs. when you aren't? It is so hard to comprehend what it feels like when you don't go through it yourself, and a 10 year old can't really describe how he feels so well.

I forgot to add, my son doesn't have the hyperactive part of the condition, only the trouble focusing... I also wanted to ask, the dr.s have told me I can give him the medication only when he has school, I am wondering if it may be more effective if I do give it to him 7 days a week, is there a difference that anyone is aware of? as far as the medication being in his system? I noticed several posts regarding when you first start on the meds, so I am wondering if that means I should give it to him everyday, to keep it in his system, if it would mess him up to only have it on the days he has school.


Thanks in advance for any feedback you can give me about this. I know this is alot of questions, and appreciate the time anyone takes to answer them.

Everybody's different. Concerta seemed to last about 10 hours for me. Maybe a tad longer some days. The theory is that the body builds up an acute tolerance to methylphenidate (and maybe amphetamine, too) which is why the Concerta tablet leads to increasing concentrations of methylphenidate peaking at hours 4-8, and then falling off, because during hours 0-4, the body is building up acute tolerance to the drug. Now, this is theory, not necessarily proven, but some people feel this to be true. I personally don't think I develop much in the way of acute tolerance, so for me I notice Concerta becoming quite effective at hours 4-8. Also, theoretically, all your tolerance to the drug is lost over the next 12 hours that you don't have the drug in your system, i.e. evening & while you're sleeping, so this is why it works again with renewed vigor the next day. Some people however seem to develop chronic tolerance to the drug, that is, over months/years of use, they require dosage increases every so often. To ward off this possibility, you might want to consider a drug holiday once per week (Saturdays are great to sleep in, then (medicated) make Sunday a school-functional day for homework, study, and whatnot) or when school isn't in session, i.e. holidays and whatnot.

Regarding what it feels like to have ADD, primarily inattentive. I can start reading something, and if I'm not passionate about it, I'll start getting lots of random thoughts in my head about other things, about my life, about people I know, about tangential topics, and I'll carry on thinking about them and maybe a while later realize crap I just lost 15 minutes and I have to be to work in 5 minutes, so I gotta go now kbye. LOL. It's a problem with "staying on task" especially with things that one does not strictly enjoy. The medication helps me with that tremendously, in theory by raising dopamine levels so that one feels a baseline "satisfaction" even from boring work that wouldn't otherwise raise dopamine levels and produce a sense of contentment.

Thank you for your response, Chadwick... I think giving him a break on Saturdays, and then starting again on Sundays sounds like a good idea...

We have asked him before why he doesn't do his work... he replied, "Im thinking", my husband asked him, "what are you thinking about?" My son replied, "What you will say if I don't do my work." I know he thinks ALOT... I guess it does make sense that his thoughts jump from subject to subject...

It just gets SO frustrating! I hope and pray this medication helps him concentrate and focus... and he can work to his full potential...

You sound like a very loving father. Just tell him you love him, and want him to be happy in life, and will do anything in your power to make that possible. Sometimes, hearing that from my own father inspired me to excel.

Lol, I am actually his mom... I wish his father was tolerant of all this... he fights me on the medications, and thinks I should just be stricter with him...



I tried to use a "car" analagy I read somewhere about comparing needing meds to a car needing break fluid... that the medicine will help his brain slow down, but I don't know if it really got through to him.

LOL I'm sorry. My ADD mind just refused to read your nickname. ;) I somehow thought your nickname was tommy or something. I do that a lot with words that don't immediately leap out as being defined in English. Oh well it all holds true, the concern you show for your son is wonderful. If he's a sensitive child then a little heart to heart might be in order.

That's ok, sometimes I do feel like Im his mom and dad...

I tried to use a "car" analagy I read somewhere about comparing needing meds to a car needing break fluid... that the medicine will help his brain slow down, but I don't know if it really got through to him.
I don't like that analogy at all LOL. The last thing I would have tolerated at that age is someone giving me a pill to slow my brain down. Instead, phrase it thusly: the medication will help you with school. It'll make it easier for you, and less stressful. You'll enjoy it more.

That is a better idea... thanks for that. I try to make him feel as normal as possible, and I can only imagine how frustrated he must be, when all the other kids are doing their work, and he can't... and is contantly getting singled out so I am trying to help him see that with the meds he won't have that problem, he will be able to do his work...

Oh, another question, if you don't mind :)

I noticed alot of weightloss, lack of appetite symptoms associated with the Concerta.. The dr. we saw friday commented on his weight, that he was slightly underweight. and had lost a pound since January, now, seeing the symptoms of lack of appetite, I am concerned he will lose more weight. He told the dr. his "favorite hobby" was eating. This child eats all the time... so I am assuming it is genetics that he is so skinny, I am certainly not starving him, I am wondering if that is something you found was an issue taking concerta...

And thanks again for your responses, it helps tremendously to have someone's input, someone who has been where my son is now.

Part of it may be genetic. You have the power to get more calories into him. Fat is a very energy-rich material, 9 calories per gram, whereas the same weight in carbohydrates only supplies 4 calories. I don't mean stuff him with fat, but at his age, fat isn't so bad. The body uses it for construction and energy expenditure, not arterial deposition. If you're concerned about fat, then get one of those newfangled trans-fat free, omega-3 supplemented spreadable butters or whatever that are proven to lower cholesterol. Not that cholesterol is an altogether bad thing per se. It's the body's repair mechanism. A high cholesterol level means the body is repairing itself. By the way, omega 3 from flax seed oil may be a waste, apparently the omega 3 in it is little used by the body, it's best to give him fish oil omega 3 which has natural EPA & DHA in it. But I digress, this has nothing to do with ADD.

Make sure he gets enough protein too! I would recommend supplementing 100mg or so of magnesium citrate per day and a multivitamin w/ mineral as well, especially both of those in the evening with something a bit acidic like orange juice to aid in the absorption of the magnesium. Not in the AM since acidic urine means the Concerta will be less effective.

Thanks Chadwick, I did start both my children on a multivitamin last month... My daughter takes it fine..my son complains of the taste the entire time...(and then 10 minutes later FINALLY puts it into his mouth...

He hasn't been on meds for almost a month now, b/c I recently found out he needed glasses, and wanted to try(with his teacher's blessing) to see if maybe the fact that he couldn't actually see without getting headaches, and having to work so hard to focus the actual words would help, then while he wasnt on the meds is when I put him on the multivitamin. Giving that to him at night would help, so I only have to fight over ONE pill in the mornings. And I will up his protein.. I am reading around for diet habits, to help him out...

I don't like that analogy at all LOL. The last thing I would have tolerated at that age is someone giving me a pill to slow my brain down. Instead, phrase it thusly: the medication will help you with school. It'll make it easier for you, and less stressful. You'll enjoy it more.
I like the analogy of an ADD's brain being like a busy intersection, where the street lights are broken, and the traffic is trying to move in all directions at once. The net flow of traffic is really slow, (ie. your thoughts can't get where they are trying to go!). However, a stimulant puts a traffic cop in the centre of the intersection, so that the cars (thoughts) can finally get to where they are headed, one car (thought) at a time...

This makes perfect sense to me, because sometimes I can totally picture my thoughts as cars crashing and not making it through the intersection. And also, many of the legitimate cars are getting held up and blocked by bigger trucks or flashier sports cars. Maybe some people are trying drive to work, or someplace else important, and they have to get out and start walking...

I read this in the book, "Scattered Minds: A New Look at the Origins and Healing of Attention Deficit Disorder", by Gavor Mate M.D. It's an awesome book! I would definitely recommending having a look at it, (by the way, it's rather long, so skimming it might be a better idea for most of us).

The loss of appitite is pretty common with any stimulant, but it should get back up there when his body gets more used to the medication..

Concerta only lasted me about 5-6 hours, same with adderall xr. Its just how he metabolizes the substance. Just try to observe when his normal behaviour returns again. When I was on concerta, I was taking it twice a day.

Apeman, thanks, lol, that actually made sense to me and I will look at that book...

Daven, wow, 5-6 hours... then if that was the case, we would need something later in the day, actually to get him through the whole day at school. I keep in close contact with his teacher, and she is going to let me know asap how things are going and if he is or isn't making it through the day... he is a skinny kid who eats all the time, so he has a fairly high metabolism, he started yesterday on it...he didn't complain of any headaches/stomachaches etc... and ate well last night. I didn't tell him what any of the side affects were, or even that there were any, so I would know if he were to have any, then they would be true side affects. He also did his homework fairly easily and quickly for me... so only time will tell... :) thanks for the responses!!

Another question I have is, and I know this may be hard to answer, but I am trying so hard to understand what my son is going through, I get so frustrated, when I am trying to help him with homework, and it takes him SO LONG to do a simple page, that shouldn't take 3 minutes to do, can those of you who actually take the medicine try to describe the difference you feel when you are on it vs. when you aren't?


I am gathering you your self don't have ADD. If not then you know how to proritize things, you know what to do when. Say you are washing dishes and look out the window and notice the flowers need watering. Most non-ADD people finish up the dishes, then go water the flowers. Should some thing happen say your husband comes in and tells you about his day you will still remember to water the flowers. You will also be able to determine HOW long it will take you to water flowers before you begin, plus the fact your brain is able to determine if they need watering now or can wait till tomorrow.

An ADDer may stop washing the dishes go water flowers (fearing forgetfullness and dead flowers) While watering the flowers husband comes up and starts talking about his day, which will remind the ADD brain of some thing else, like a shopping list. Off we go often in mid conversation with husband, to make a shopping list, never mind the long lost dishes still sitting in the sink!!! We may or may not have thought to turn the WATER OFF!! There is no ability to proirtize activities, the idea hits and off we go. This is often refered to is lack of impulse control.



Most non-ADDers have a fairly good idea of how long a given routine task will take. To MOST ADDers time is a fliud concept. Things we find interesting can take hours without even noticing it. Things we hate or find boring may take five minutes but that five minutes to an ADDer feels like a month, our brains concieve of time in relationship to the activity as opposed to the actual passing of time. Maybe why he doesn't do a homework assignment that would take five minutes because his brain may "indicate" otherwise. As an adult and a past home work procrastinator my self that is how it worked for me.

Another thing non-ADDers tend to be able to do that I couldn't before treating my ADD was "make" myself do some thing I hated or found boaring. Oh I would try but my brain seemed to "wander off" on it's own and usually managed to take my body with it!!!. I also lacked balance. I was either very interested or not interested at all, there were few in betweens!!

Not being on medications I have four and five thoughts in my brain at one time, all vieying for attention. Trying to mannage these five ideas is like trying to land five air-planes one one landing strip at the same time. When I was growing up my room often looked like I landed five air planes in it!!!

Taking my medication doesn't stop me from being able to have four or five thoughts at once, what it does do is it allows my brain to proritize the thoughts and "land the planes" one at a time. Taking medications to my brain is kind of like putting some one in the control tower of my brain. It in no way slows down my thinking unless I tell it to. Right now I am writting this letter but I am deciding on how to approach a task at work. The task at work is in the back ground of my thoughts, this letter is in the forground. I am having two opposing thoughts but they aren't competing with eachother.My brain is proritizing them in order. Letter now work in ten minutes.


I can still multi-task at will and am only limited by my external senses. I have also learned how to "learn from my my mis-takes". I can look back on a situation I found unpleasent, feel the emotions but not be over whelmed by them, then I can hold the thought long enough to "process it logically." My emotins do not carry me away so to speak.

I no longer "feel" my medications like I did when I first started them. When I first started taking stimulents I "felt funny" not bad just different. My appetite was also decreased for about a month. I drank nutritional supplents to maintain my nutrition, and caloric needs. After a month my appetite returned to normal and I no longer needed the supplements.

Well speeking of balance I know I must stop here as I still need to do one more thing before I go back to work. I am on my medications and so I am aware of the passage of time and the necessity to go back to work if I want to have $$$$.

Wow, Tammy, thank you, that truly put things in prospective for me. The whole "time" issue really hits home, b/c he is always trying to put what homework he brought home off till later(which then makes things an all night battle) I try to get through to him, "if you do it now, ten minutes and you are done, you don't have to think about it again." I've pretty much given up on that approach, b/c it doesn't work AT ALL!!

I have always been pretty forgetful, and scattered most of my life, but it never affected my schooling, I never let it, and I guess that is what makes it so hard for me with him, is I was, well, I guess conditioned to do the tasks I disliked the most first, and then they were over and done with, but that is something beyond his ability.

I can completely see your analagy of doing dishes, lol... I can just stand there and do the dishes, but that doesnt mean I will remember the flowers when I am done... now, if I am cleaning, and I haveto leave the room I am in to put something up, I will easily get sidetracked in the room I entered, and start doing things in there.... I have recently started if I am cleaning, and need to put something in a room I haven't gotten to yet, I will simply toss the item near the door of the room, b/c I know if I go in, I will start cleaning in there, lol and there the item will stay until I get there.... so I guess I can see more than I realized how his brain works.
I have always been quite happily scatterbrained, and just learned, or taught myself, to compensate for it....

Anyway, thanks again for your well thought out reply, it meant alot to me...We are taking things one day at a time around here.

is I was, well, I guess conditioned to do the tasks I disliked the most first, and then they were over and done with, but that is something beyond his ability.

I am able to do this now that I am an adult. I did learn to do this with FOOD when I was younger. I would eat the thing I dis-liked the most (or liked the least) first then move leaving my favorite part of the meal for last. Don't know why it took ten yeras for me to learn to relate this to other things like chores and such :confused:

I felt school to be restraining. Kind of felt like being tied up. When I got out of school the last thing I wanted to do was more school. I am the hyper variety of ADHD, therefore I literally sat on all those wiggles all day!! When I was young it wasn't but a three block walk from end of school and home not near enough time lapse to wiggle out all those wiggles!!!! Trying to remember how mom handled it!!!

I was allowed to play for an hour or so, because I remember doing my home work at the kitchen table while my mom cooked supper. I got out at 2:30-3:30 she started cooking about 5:00pm. Cooking was going on but mom also helped to keep me focused as they did not prescribe medications "back then". If I took to long argueing about home work then I couldn't watch TV, or play with my friend until home work was done!!! There was like a reason I wanted to have the school work done by the time supper was ready. If I was like a total brat I couldn't play with friends the next day, but there was a reward or some thing if I got all my work done with out the hassles and the reward was pretty immediate. Like after supper I could do some thing I really liked. If work not done it was back to work no reward!! I just can't remember what the reward after supper was as there were no vedios, cable, ect in those days. What ever it was it motivated me to get the work done with out the battle!!!!! However mom let me play for an hour or so after school because I needed a break from the restrictions of class room. I absolutely could not go from school to more school at home with out a break in between!!! ;)

I did learn to do this with FOOD when I was younger. I would eat the thing I dis-liked the most (or liked the least) first then move leaving my favorite part of the meal for last.
That is exactly what I have always done... somehow I was able to do it with schoolwork too. I would force myself to do subjects I couldn't stand first(math/algebra) so I could 'savor' the subjects I loved(english/history). I honestly didn't have a choice when I was my sons age, my dad didn't allow for lower grades than b's, and the consequenses for making lower were extreme compared to todays standards. From the time I started school, until the day he died when I was in 8th grade, I made below a B one time. And spent the next six weeks in my room doing writeoffs every night after homework, that was after getting a belt the day I brought the report card home. That was all it took. Not saying that was right or wrong, but it sure worked... also not saying I am going to put my son through that, I will try to find another way.

I just got the book "The ADD Answer" by Dr. Frank Lawlis. It, so far, has been interesting, and I would like to try some of the alternatives.If there is a way to assist him without meds, then I am going to find it, I owe my son that....

If there is a way to assist him without meds, then I am going to find it, I owe my son that....

When I was older, fifth, sixth, definatly by Jr. High I was grounded if I brought home a grade below "C". I would be grounded from the day I got the report card (days added to next report card period for lost report cards that had low grades, and weren't brought home) to the next report card with a passing grade.

I as a fellow ADDer who's only well liked subject until Jr. High was P.E., PLEASE try the medication approach before resorting to the belt approach. I do not know your child as you do but too much corpral punishment (or too severe) may have the opposite effect on an ADD child than the one you are looking for. I am not opposed to a good ole fashion fanny dusting as long as it is appropiate, used in times when reasoning isn't an option (otherwise not accepted)

I am going to use spanking... I dont believe it will accomplish anything since this is not something he is doing deliberately, I was using that as an example of what my parents did... He just brought his report card home, 2 F's. He has NEVER had an F before on his report card. One of the subjects was reading. He also brought home his papers he had done.... one stack was all reading..every single one of them was a 100. So he failed in a subject he makes straight A's in because of not doing all his work. I have grounded him. I told him, and his teacher, that he is grounded to his room this week, no tv, no game boy, no x box... if, IF on Friday he can bring a note home stating he has completed all his work for the week, then he gets ungrounded. And he has to do that every friday. if he doesn't complete his work, he is grounded for another week. I am keeping him on the meds, if they help, then all the better, I am going to be looking into other alternatives but I won't hurt him by going that route...

When I was diagnosed with ADHD (combined type) at about age 9 or so, I was treated very successfully with Ritalin for about one month, then my mother just had an instinctual anti-drug reaction and took me off the medication. Of course, I was too young to know anything at all about it and assumed she had good reason for doing so beyond gut instinct. I was untreated for an entire decade after that, and did well (VERY well in fact, 4.0 student, honor societies, presidential awards, etc.) until university, when my intelligence and coping mechanisms became ineffective for that environment, and I actually had to pick up studying. And studying simply wasn't going to happen, oh no . . . ;) Can't sit still that long unless I'm *very* passionate about it. Not without meds, that is. Intelligence can mask symptoms sometimes. But with medication, it's like you're unleashing your full potential. It's really quite wonderful, and I'm eminently thankful I found a great psychiatrist and that my parents are supportive. I in NO WAY feel ill-will towards my mother for taking me off Ritalin when I was a child.

Concerta only lasted me about 5-6 hours, same with adderall xr.
I really don't see how Concerta could possibly last that short, the OROS delivery mechanism shouldn't depend upon ph of the stomach or intestines, it's just water-dependent (I think) . . . hmmm, very interesting. Could you possibly build up acute tolerance to the drug's effect more readily than most? This is why Concerta was designed the way it was though -- double the concentration between 4-8 hours (in most people). Maybe you need to triple the concentration to achieve similar effect at the 5 hour mark. That doesn't sound like a pleasant experience though. :)

IF on Friday he can bring a note home stating he has completed all his work for the week, then he gets ungrounded. And he has to do that every friday.


If I remember right I had to do a weekly "notebook" thing with one of my daughters teachers. I believe it was Michelle who had to bring me a note book home from the teacher with a numerical scale. This was done for behavior but I can see where this idea would work for home work as well. If she forgot the notebook she was grounded until said note book was produced. Id she got good scores she got extra "mommie time" with just her and I. Sounds like you are on top of it!!!! :)

I really don't see how Concerta could possibly last that short, the OROS delivery mechanism shouldn't depend upon ph of the stomach or intestines, it's just water-dependent (I think) . . . hmmm, very interesting. Could you possibly build up acute tolerance to the drug's effect more readily than most? This is why Concerta was designed the way it was though -- double the concentration between 4-8 hours (in most people). Maybe you need to triple the concentration to achieve similar effect at the 5 hour mark. That doesn't sound like a pleasant experience though. :)
Actually when I started taking Concerta the pharmacist told me that for most people it lasted more like 6 - 8 hours, not 12. It starts falling off at six for me and is gone, gone, gone by 8. He also said it had to do with how fast people's stomach's empty. I take it twice a day and it works great for me that way.

Scattered

As far as resisting meds so hard for you son, I encourage you to watch not only his grades but his affect. My hyperactivity started turning inward around sixth grade which probably made it a lot easier to be around me, but a lot harder for me to live in my own skin. Grades aren't the only issues. After elementary my grades went up and up, until I pulled 4.0 in two masters programs,but I lived with chronic anxiety and occasional depression. The biggest help the meds have done for me is release that huge knot of anxiety. Unfortunately a lot of kids as they get older will self medicate with drugs, cigarettes, booze or whatever to escape those feelings -- studies actually show that kids on medication who are ADD are less likely to use drugs than ADDer's who aren't. I know it's not an easy decision (I've got an ADD'er myself who is 7 years old), and I've decided if I start to see signs of her fighting internal wars like I did or feeling like a failure, I will give her the option of medication.

Good luck to you -- It's real clear how much you care about your child.

Scattered

Thanks to everyone... I know it has been a while...


My son is currently taking Adderall now(guess I gotta switch forums, lol) He wasn't doing very well on Concerta, the teacher said he was still off task, etc. So we switched him to the Adderall. And he is doing well now...

So thanks to everyone, I do love my son, and want what's best for him!