View Full Version : Sun


SB_UK
09-19-14, 08:22 AM
"that between November and April, he simply hated the Manchester climate and spent the cold, damp mornings and dark winter nights pining for a place where the sun did not spend all day hidden behind forbidding grey clouds."

I can't stand the UK November - April.
My wife can't stand it.

Most people I know can't stand it either.

-*-

Can people be happy in a cold damp dark climate ?

Everything's better in the sun.

stef
09-19-14, 08:28 AM
My British friend doesn't seem terribly affected by this same weather we have here in France but she is insane for sun when we have it...
I grew up in very cold, yet very bright, winters and the darkness here in winter overwhelms me.

Yesterday, I was trying to imagine just how awful it gets (because I noticed it's visibly darker now in the evening), and I can't even picture it yet because the weather is lovely right now.

SB_UK
09-19-14, 08:29 AM
What does it feel like ?

Like we slow down in the absence of light/UV and need pick-me-ups like caffeine/sugar to energise.

SB_UK
09-19-14, 08:31 AM
My British friend doesn't seem terribly affected by this same weather we have here in France but she is insane for sun when we have it...
I grew up in very cold, yet very bright, winters and the darkness here in winter overwhelms me.

Yesterday, I was trying to imagine just how awful it gets (because I noticed it's visibly darker now in the evening), and I can't even picture it yet because the weather is lovely right now.

There's some connection between darkness and pain, I think ... ...

darkness
slowing down
depression
pain

SB_UK
09-19-14, 08:42 AM
One of those patterns we see are eg in Italy -

industrial north (cold)
community/family - centric south (sun drenched)

I just wonder whether the 'work ethic' is more about an addiction to supply the body with something it just does not naturally obtain in environments without sunshine.

I've found that myself and wife are happy in the sun - but darkness and cold drives us into gloom.

Are ADDers (as we see in the animal kingdom) destined to follow a migration pattern - from north to southern hemisphere based aroundthe sun ?

Migration patterns are common in nature- why not ADDer ?

-*-

In the UK - we pretty much non-stop talk about nothing else other than the weather.

What if ADDer ties our parasitism to the sun to an even deeper level ?

Thing is - about materialism is that people are tied to their stuff.
I have no tie to anything I own - making the loss of the materialistic tendency as potentially being in keeping with a migration profile in the ADDer.

ie you can only really travel with whatever's in your pockets -
- bearing a material bent wouldn't work if nature's providing us with a tendency towards migration.

SB_UK
09-19-14, 08:50 AM
Imagine if the end of Summer lead into the start of Summer.

That thought is about the nicest I can remember having.

At the moment we've a lovely end of Summer which can't be enjoyed because of what we surely know is about to follow.

We all know that global depopulation is due to descend over the next few years
- perhaps when there's less of us - we'll be able to find ourselves all 2 places in the sun - and oscillate between them.

Of course none of that is possible whilst we have the ridiculous notion of country and barring entry of people from one place into another
- but 'country' as an entity is only there for an elite to benefit from its existence.

SB_UK
09-19-14, 09:05 AM
It's just that - the sun supplies our favourite health-promoting food, is required for us to go outside and exercise, makes us feel happy, is a natural appetite suppressant, has the potential of supplying all of our electrical needs

- the question I ask is whether or not a simple state of mind (wisdom) in the sun is sufficient for happiness.

It's interesting that we moved out and away from the sun in the first place - migrating out from the sun into the coldest of places.

Presumably we were looking for something.

Confusing the promised land (without) with the promised land (within).
Looking for freedom.

But when we realise that wisdom takes us to the promised land within - aren't we ready to return to the sun ? - to play out the rest of our life in as close to our ideal environment ie in the sun in silence.

-*-

But what about all of the things that human beings have done over the last 5000 years ?
Wasn't there something useful in all of that.

Maybe something or other - but the major theme in human history was simply how to reach the promised land
- and to realise that the promised land was a state of mind which arises through deep udnerstanding/wisdom/mind of morality ... ...

Then there's just silence and life awaiting death and re-absorption back into the fundamental substrate (sea of honey) which pervades what we call reality and elsewhere ... ... and which is hidden from our senses.

Flory
09-19-14, 09:19 AM
I like the winter here if it's properly cold but we get miserable half ***** mild winters increasingly :( depressing

Flory
09-19-14, 09:23 AM
My least favourite time is late summer through early autumn. My favourite time is probably March through early July

SB_UK
09-19-14, 09:33 AM
Maybe it's the darkness and then the cold ... ...

last person I asked said that they're fine in Winter as long as it's bright.

Flory
09-19-14, 09:35 AM
A crisp sunny day in midwinter can be so beautiful especially if there's a frost.

stef
09-19-14, 09:41 AM
A crisp sunny day in midwinter can be so beautiful especially if there's a frost.

YES. Winter can be beautiful!

It's not the cold (although ok, -20C is insanely cold and yes I went out in that last winter when I was in the states), it's the lack of light. One year I just stopped counting after 10 straight days of clouds in February. I mean not even a ray of sunlight.

Little Missy
09-19-14, 09:43 AM
I like the sun, who doesn't? But I think totally dark and thick cloudy days have an entirely different feel to them. I love it.

Flory
09-19-14, 09:46 AM
It's the moisture in the air that makes the cold and indeed heat here miserable when I was in Toronto -19 I still felt (bundled up of course) fine to walk around, get groceries etc etc

The darkness can be oppressive we have the weird dst thing here do you do that in America ? Twice a year out clocks change

SB_UK
09-19-14, 09:55 AM
I like the sun, who doesn't?


Do adders like the sun more ?

Maybe the drive to find reward in a bottle is because we don't obtain the required level of UV exposure

- it has only been relatively recently that human beings have set up a social structure which prevents sun exposure (9 - 5pm) when it's out

- and Americans only get a couple of weeks holiday a year, right ?

SB_UK
09-19-14, 09:56 AM
What does it feel like ?

Like we slow down in the absence of light/UV and need pick-me-ups like caffeine/sugar to energise.


<- That's what a stimulant (our medication) does.

SB_UK
09-19-14, 10:03 AM
You could convince me that the adder disorder relates to far sub-optimal levels of uv exposure.

But what about all of the news stories showing a dramatic rise in skin cancer from uv exposure ?

It's not the sun.

It's diet (carbs) / lack of exercise / distress and eating too much
- and not the sun which're to blame.

We evolved as ketosis immersed persistence hunters under the sun - there's no way we're suddenly going to become sun reactive

- it's our metabolic state which is cancer promoting
- not the sun.

Fuzzy12
09-19-14, 10:05 AM
I love the sun and sunshine but I hate heat. Anything warmer than 27 C drives me a bit batty.

I also love cold but very sunny winter days. Sun shining on snow is beautiful.

I don't mind the darkness in winter so much but I hate rain. Especially cold, windy rain that hurts your face. :mad:

SB_UK
09-19-14, 10:17 AM
What if all that ADHD is is sub-optimal light exposure.

As described above we s--l--o--w down.

We need to speed up and so 'speed' up.

Just lack of appropriate light exposure because we're meant to either study or work when the sun's out.

And as money becomes too tight to mention - we can't even go on holiday into the sun - but even if we did - really bad idea for extremely pale to immerse in intense sunshine.

As ever - the 'rules' of human society are our downfall.

There's nothing wrong with us - is everything wrong with the society we support.

SB_UK
09-19-14, 10:18 AM
Fair enough

- it's looking like it's light, absence of moisture and not extremes of temperature but as long as it's light and crisp - temperatures on either side of zero.

SB_UK
09-19-14, 10:32 AM
Sounds like we're destined to be desert nomads.

Wait a minute !!

If an urge to explore rises in us innately, perhaps its foundation lies within our genome. In fact there is a mutation that pops up frequently in such discussions: a variant of a gene called DRD4, which helps control dopamine, a chemical brain messenger important in learning and reward. Researchers have repeatedly tied the variant, known as DRD4-7R and carried by roughly 20 percent of all humans, to curiosity and restlessness. Dozens of human studies have found that 7R makes people more likely to take risks; explore new places, ideas, foods, relationships, drugs, or sexual opportunities; and generally embrace movement, change, and adventure. Studies in animals simulating 7R’s actions suggest it increases their taste for both movement and novelty. (Not incidentally, it is also closely associated with ADHD.)
Most provocatively, several studies tie 7R to human migration. The first large genetic study to do so, led by Chuansheng Chen of the University of California, Irvine in 1999, found 7R more common in present-day migratory cultures than in settled ones. A larger, more statistically rigorous 2011 study supported this, finding that 7R, along with another variant named 2R, tends to be found more frequently than you would expect by chance in populations whose ancestors migrated longer distances after they moved out of Africa. Neither study necessarily means that the 7R form of the gene actually made those ancestors especially restless; you’d have to have been around back then to test that premise with certainty. But both studies support the idea that a nomadic lifestyle selects for the 7R variant.


http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2013/01/125-restless-genes/dobbs-text

SB_UK
09-19-14, 10:33 AM
Persistently moving.
Light exposure.
No problem with temperature as long as we're moving.
No materialistic reward system.

There's a definite pattern arising here.

SB_UK
09-19-14, 10:41 AM
UV-induced beta-endorphin production causes addiction-like symptoms
http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2014-06/mgh-ubp061214.php
We've already covered this idea.

So lack of sun exposure results in needing to get our opiate hit elsewhere.

Fat/Carbs (as evidenced by naltrexone) result in activation of the opioid system.

Carbs stimulate.

-*-

So - the sun can activate both sides ie stimulant / narcotic of human functioning ... ... and in the absence of appropriate sun exposure - finding other sources of stimulants and narcotics we go ?

SB_UK
09-19-14, 10:44 AM
But why did we ever leave the sun in the first place ?

The need to complete the mind (tree of knowledge of good and evil) - which provides the key to return back to the garden of eden.

ie we had a job to do, which we needed to complete before allowing ourselves to be happy in the sun (and silence).

'cept there's no way back (societal structure considerations) on account of a lawyer, banker, politician and policeman whose job it is to keep you out.

Unmanagable
09-19-14, 01:45 PM
I prefer warmth, either with sun or overcast, as long as it's warm. Cold, damp, darkness makes me physically ache. My favorite times of year are spring, summer (except for the soupy humidity), and fall. I hibernate during the winter as much as possible. I hate having to wear a whole f'n load of laundry to stay warm.

imnotkuku
09-19-14, 02:47 PM
When I lived in Oregon, I HATED it. It rained 9 months out of the year, was gloomy and the winters were COLD. I grew up in Southern California. I'm a beach baby and LOVED IT! Then I moved to GA. Summers are humid and there's thunderstorms. I don't mind rain and clouds in the summer because it still feels bright outside, I guess because it's warm. Winters have always been mild here...another HUGE plus because I absolutely despise being cold. Then last year...we had 12" of snow...IN THE SOUTH!!! It was miserable, I was miserable...we were stuck in our cars the first day it snowed, on the road, for hours..some it was overnight (anyone here of the Atlanta Snowmagedon of 2013?). I am so much happier in the spring/summer/early fall but, as mentioned...I can't enjoy the fall because I know winter is looming and it makes me want to move back to AZ where you never see white sh** on the ground LOL

SB_UK
09-19-14, 02:59 PM
dry
light
warm

We can live in perpetually dry, light and warm as long as we use solar power to desalinate sea water.

just sun

would it get boring ?
no.

SB_UK
09-19-14, 03:08 PM
I prefer warmth, either with sun or overcast, as long as it's warm. Cold, damp, darkness makes me physically ache. My favorite times of year are spring, summer (except for the soupy humidity), and fall. I hibernate during the winter as much as possible. I hate having to wear a whole f'n load of laundry to stay warm.

Apparently many people put on weight going into Winter - maybe it's a seasonal hibernation evolutionary fat deposition thing ...


I can fast without too much effort in April through August but it's suddenly become so much harder.

SB_UK
09-20-14, 03:22 AM
darkness
slowing down
depression
pain

Cold, damp, darkness makes me physically ache.

Aches and pains ?

As the darkness takes ahold it feels like we're struggling to kickstart ourself into operation.

-*-

Can anybody be happy in the dark/damp (ie UK) when we've the light and dry as an alternative - often less than a day's drive away.

Why do we do it to ourselves ?

YOU MUST WORK.
YOU MUST NOT LEAVE YOUR DESIGNATED COUNTRY.
YOU MUST TRAVEL TO FIND WORK.
YOU MUST HAVE A SPECIALITY.
YOU MUST TELL PEOPLE HOW GOOD YOUR SPECIALITY IS.
YOU MUST STRIVE TO EXTEND THE SCOPE FOR YOUR SPECIALITY SO YOU HAVE JOB SECURITY.
YOU MUST GENERATE CHILDREN AND MAKE THEM DO ALL OF THE ABOVE.

- even though the very vast majority of it is a complete waste of time.

Anybody feel like going back to sleep until people see that all we need is sustainability (silence in the sun).

Waking up in the gloom, wet, dark to go in and do something pointless at work.

November - April.

"that between November and April, he simply hated the Manchester climate and spent the cold, damp mornings and dark winter nights pining for a place where the sun did not spend all day hidden behind forbidding grey clouds."
ps copied from a DT article on a little chappy who earns 300,000.00 a week

Although the pointlessness is less of a drag when the sun's out -

this life is more than just a read through

When it's gone it's gone.

SB_UK
09-20-14, 03:39 AM
What do we need to have a positive mental attitude ?

Sun.
Doing something which brings personal reward (autonomy, mastery, purpose)
Working collaboratively and not competitively (though see 'purpose').
Feeding our gut bacteria (generate our neurotransmitters - a biggy) (though see 'mastery' ie optimization of physiology).
Community with all things (plants and animals included) (though see 'purpose').
Moving (ie feeling comfortable in the body) (though see 'mastery' of one's own physiology).
Learning something you want to know (though see 'autonomy').
Personal quality (though see 'mastery' eg in an instrument).
Art (a computer game, listening to music).
Generating something lasting of worth (though see 'purpose').

There're more - just a few listed.

BUT YOU CAN'T HAVE ANY OF THE ABOVE IN A MONETARY/LEGAL BASED ECONOMY.

You just have to stay in your unfit for purpose shelter and do what you're told until you die - trying to make out that a University degree and a decent pension are somehow compensation for a thoroughly pointless life.

-*-

Wisdom (as precursor to living in silence in the sun) - a sustainable existence
as what it's all about.

And instead we generate noise in the damp.

ruby.149.42
09-21-14, 12:37 AM
I lived in the UK for 12 years and the first 3 or 4 years I had no issue with the climate whatsoever and was just joyously happy that the summers weren't as ******* hot as my native Australia. Part of this (not all), maybe our ADHD sensitivity: I HATE Australian summers, the heat and humidity drive me crackers and I do a series of heel-clicks when I feel the first bite for winter chill. We're just coming out the other end and feeling the first bits of heat makes me dread the oncoming summer. But I always seemed to be so much more sensitive to temperature than those around me anywhere.

I think that what ultimately started driving me bonkers about the UK winters was the lack of sunshine and that during those long cold months you never saw (visually) anything pleasant. I lived in West London where you literally never get a view - its just flat, flat, road after road and no pretty vistas to look out at. In Spring / summer, this is all transformed with baskets of flowers stuck to every pub and blooms and blossoms everywhere. That would always make my heart sing.

What was interesting was coming back to Australia for Xmas and leaving here early January where everyone is still in party mode and then arriving back in Blighty and the second you get off the plane, you notice that everyone is walking around with grey skin, hunched shoulders, looking miserable, knowing they've maxed out their credit cards on Xmas/NYE and now have 4 months of misery to wade through.

So yeah, sun is in it but there's lots of factors - light - view - mood of everyone around you. Chuck me in a ski resort and I am a very happy but very cold girl.