View Full Version : We need more conversation about diet and exercise


Jshect
11-19-14, 03:01 PM
I think it is a shame there is so little conversation going on in the health and nutrition area. Many scientists and doctors are coming out and talking and researching many of our problems (ADHD, diabetes, heart disease, cancer, alzheimers etc.) and how our diet may be directly responsible or at least have an influence on these problems. Please people start researching diet instead of just listening to your psychiatrist, who makes his/her living selling pharmaceutical drugs. I'm not saying medications are not important, but so is your diet.

Jshect
11-19-14, 03:10 PM
I will do some more research and start introducing specific individual topics. I'm not reading that nine page thread. I personally know someone whose ADHD symptoms completely disappeared when they removed artificial dyes from their diet. I am not implying everyone's adhd will disappeas, but a few might notice reduction in their symptoms. it's worth a try. I also understand changing ones diet is very, very difficult (at least for me it is). It's a lot easier to just take a pill everyday. If the pills work, yes take them, but for me they have only sort of worked, and the more I read about nutrition the more I realize much of what we have learned was wrong. Saturated fats and cholesterol are not the enemies they were made out to be. High glycemic carbs are the real enemy. So these decades of being told low fat, high carb diets are heart healthy was BS :( I will do some research and start a couple of new specific threads. One will food dyes, possibly other food chemicals, another gluten and other high glycemic carbs.

Jshect
11-19-14, 03:16 PM
Or maybe I'll go through that nine page thread and start specific threads on some of the important individual points. The goal is, by having many different specific threads, it will be more organized and easier to follow.

Jshect
11-19-14, 03:22 PM
Oh wow, I just read the first thread about only seeing stickies, ***I went to the bottom and chose to see all user threads***. GREAT, there's already been a lot of discussion. LETS KEEP THE DIET AND NUTRITION DISCUSSIONS GOING. Nobody's comment in 30 days. New research is constantly being done.

Jshect
11-19-14, 03:25 PM
[QUOTE=Nobody's comment in 30 days. New research is constantly being done.[/QUOTE]

Wrong again, someone commented 2 days ago. Moderators, why would this section be automatically set to only show threads that have been responded to ONE DAY AGO?????? The default should be to show all threads, or at least a year or something. Please change that.:confused:

BellaVita
11-19-14, 06:09 PM
It's also important to get blood work done and see if you have any vitamin deficiencies.

I have to get B12 shots because the pill form doesn't absorb well for me, and let me tell you - they make a world of difference for me.

Brain fog clears, more energy, noticeable reduction in anxiety/depression, and also my vision gets clearer!

I haven't been able to get one for a while, and I'm suffering :(

peripatetic
11-19-14, 06:17 PM
Wrong again, someone commented 2 days ago. Moderators, why would this section be automatically set to only show threads that have been responded to ONE DAY AGO?????? The default should be to show all threads, or at least a year or something. Please change that.:confused:


Moderator note:

Feel free to follow the advice I give in this sticky : www.addforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=163364

I will forward your request, better made in site suggestions, to admin, but this has been suggested and isn't something we can do without a forum update. Which isn't in sight right now. My advice to change your own settings still applies. And you're welcome to start more discussion if you want to see more. People are certainly interested as you saw yourself.

Now back to the thread topic. Any further comments on this moderator note may be addressed to me via private message.

Jshect
11-19-14, 07:13 PM
It's also important to get blood work done and see if you have any vitamin deficiencies.

I have to get B12 shots because the pill form doesn't absorb well for me, and let me tell you - they make a world of difference for me.

Brain fog clears, more energy, noticeable reduction in anxiety/depression, and also my vision gets clearer!

I haven't been able to get one for a while, and I'm suffering :(

I tried several different B12 pills and had bad reactions. Did you have bad reactions when you took the pills? Do you think the shot would not cause me a bad reaction? I am deficient in B12.

Corina86
11-20-14, 10:39 AM
I have bad reactions to all B vitamins. I get hungry and agitated. Then again, I don't think I have a deficiency.

I have a pretty healthy diet due to stomach and gut issues. I also exercise a lot, mainly because I like it.

The problem seems to be that Concerta is making me slightly less hungry and it's possibly increasing my metabolism even more, so I've been losing some weight, even though I've been eating almost all the time. This is a problem for me, since I'm borderline underweight. For this reason, I cut down on my exercising. I still walk daily though.

If you want to discuss weight loss or particular diets, there are lots of threads on these issues. There was also a thread on exercising, but there haven't been any posts in it lately.

Stevuke79
11-20-14, 10:46 AM
It's an important conversation to have.

But I think you're mistaken that it gets overlooked. I'd be surprised if anyone has been to a licensed psychologist who hasn't discussed diet and exercise. I'm pretty sure that's a basic part of the ADHD discussion. I don't think that most of us could even get good results from the medications themselves without being mindful of diet and exercise. (My meds don't do anything when I don't eat or sleep properly.)

daveddd
11-20-14, 10:48 AM
It's an important conversation to have.

But I think you're mistaken that it gets overlooked. I'd be surprised if anyone has been to a licensed psychologist who hasn't discussed diet and exercise. I'm pretty sure that's a basic part of the ADHD discussion. I don't think that most of us could even get good results from the medications themselves without being mindful of diet and exercise. (My meds don't do anything when I don't eat or sleep properly.)

funny enough , I've never had a p-doc of any kind mention diet or exercise

a passing question on general physical health here and there

Stevuke79
11-20-14, 11:24 AM
funny enough , I've never had a p-doc of any kind mention diet or exercise

a passing question on general physical health here and there

Oh,... Oops :doh::doh:

I guess it's easy to make my mistake and think that what I've seen is pretty standard and not just my personal anecdote. (I also got the impression my pdoc thought it was "the rule",... so really it's his fault! Yay for blaming someone else!!)

So now that you say that, and related to the thread topic, I thought I under stood that even with medication, you still need diet, sleep and exercise to make any progress. So it might be interesting for this thread if anyone has had the opposite experience. Has anyone just done medication and you're fine?

daveddd
11-20-14, 11:28 AM
Oh,... Oops :doh::doh:

I guess it's easy to make my mistake and think that what I've seen is pretty standard and not just my personal anecdote. (I also got the impression my pdoc thought it was "the rule",... so really it's his fault! Yay for blaming someone else!!)

So now that you say that, and related to the thread topic, I thought I under stood that even with medication, you still need diet, sleep and exercise to make any progress. So it might be interesting for this thread if anyone has had the opposite experience. Has anyone just done medication and you're fine?

you would think its the rule (common sense would dictate that)

but I've been to probably 15ish different head docs, none of them ever mentioned anything specific about nutrition or asked about food sensitivities or anything close

daveddd
11-20-14, 01:08 PM
Oh,... Oops :doh::doh:

I guess it's easy to make my mistake and think that what I've seen is pretty standard and not just my personal anecdote. (I also got the impression my pdoc thought it was "the rule",... so really it's his fault! Yay for blaming someone else!!)

So now that you say that, and related to the thread topic, I thought I under stood that even with medication, you still need diet, sleep and exercise to make any progress. So it might be interesting for this thread if anyone has had the opposite experience. Has anyone just done medication and you're fine?

i wonder if i went to a nutritionalist?? with certain issues if they would inquire about mental health?

namazu
11-20-14, 01:34 PM
you would think its the rule (common sense would dictate that)

but I've been to probably 15ish different head docs, none of them ever mentioned anything specific about nutrition or asked about food sensitivities or anything close

Wow, that's quite a losing streak! :eek: :(

My current pdoc & psychologist (at the same ADHD-focused practice), and my last pdoc, are/were big on the holistic approaches (i.e., meds + exercise + sleep habits + diet + environment + behavioral strategies).



My psychologist just came back from the CHADD conference last week, and today shared some of her notes with me.

She said that in terms of non-med strategies, the ones with evidence of some efficacy are ADHD-focused CBT, walking meditation, omega fatty acids (fish / nuts), and exercise (even in 5-10 minute bursts, with some bonus for intensity but don't overdo it). Apparently sitting on an exercise ball or wobbly stool instead of a desk chair also engages the cerebellum and somehow that boosts the prefrontal cortex...I should try to get the details of why it boosts instead of distracts...

She said that although people with ADHD are more prone to allergies / sensitivities (unclear mechanisms), there's no general ADHD-busting benefit for most people in eating a restricted diet (gluten-free, avoiding sugar, etc.). Obviously, you shouldn't eat total junk, either, and if you or your kid does have a known/suspected sensitivity, then it makes sense to avoid the triggering foods.

Stevuke79
11-20-14, 01:36 PM
i wonder if i went to a nutritionalist?? with certain issues if they would inquire about mental health?

It's a good question.

Just a guess, but a psychologist has more of a "top-down" approach - he starts with challenges you are having, and tries to identify a disorder so he can find his way to a solution.

I think a nutritionist is more "bottom-up" (either could be top-down or bottom up, but the point is they're inversed). He starts with a solution, diet, to improve your life and your challenges, and digs down from there to different problems that can be address with diet. So it will probably always be addressed, but maybe in a different way and often not directly.

daveddd
11-20-14, 01:54 PM
Wow, that's quite a losing streak! :eek: :(

My current pdoc & psychologist (at the same ADHD-focused practice), and my last pdoc, are/were big on the holistic approaches (i.e., meds + exercise + sleep habits + diet + environment + behavioral strategies).



My psychologist just came back from the CHADD conference last week, and today shared some of her notes with me.

She said that in terms of non-med strategies, the ones with evidence of some efficacy are ADHD-focused CBT, walking meditation, omega fatty acids (fish / nuts), and exercise (even in 5-10 minute bursts, with some bonus for intensity but don't overdo it). Apparently sitting on an exercise ball or wobbly stool instead of a desk chair also engages the cerebellum and somehow that boosts the prefrontal cortex...I should try to get the details of why it boosts instead of distracts...

She said that although people with ADHD are more prone to allergies / sensitivities (unclear mechanisms), there's no general ADHD-busting benefit for most people in eating a restricted diet (gluten-free, avoiding sugar, etc.). Obviously, you shouldn't eat total junk, either, and if you or your kid does have a known/suspected sensitivity, then it makes sense to avoid the triggering foods.

yea, maybe i have signs or signifiers that point to an F'ed up head or they would od mentioned it

namazu
11-20-14, 02:05 PM
yea, maybe i have signs or signifiers that point to an F'ed up head or they would od mentioned it
?!

Nah, I think you must just have encountered clinicians who aren't looking at the big picture (or are selectively ignoring parts of it).

I know my head is ****ed up, but that seems all the more reason to use whatever tools / approaches are available.

daveddd
11-20-14, 02:16 PM
?!

Nah, I think you must just have encountered clinicians who aren't looking at the big picture (or are selectively ignoring parts of it).

I know my head is ****ed up, but that seems all the more reason to use whatever tools / approaches are available.

could be

just seems weird with the amount of doctors and institutions none ever thought to look to nutritional problems for my issues

if thats the standard practice

namazu
11-20-14, 02:29 PM
could be

just seems weird with the amount of doctors and institutions none ever thought to look to nutritional problems for my issues

if thats the standard practice
I don't know if "looking to nutritional problems" to explain symptoms is standard practice, if there's no other evidence to indicate an allergy or sensitivity or deficiency. So in that sense, I don't think that you're alone. It does seem weird that no one ever asked you about allergies or sensitivities, though. :scratch:

Still, if you've explored a lot of other causes and treatments with limited success, it seems like ruling in/out nutritional issues would be something to consider.

My new pdoc (actually a neurologist; old pdoc retired a few months ago) sent me to get tested for Vitamin D and B levels. Vitamin D was "low normal" -- and there's a lot of debate about what the optimal levels even are. Vitamin B12 was way low, which was news to me (I don't think I'd ever been tested for B12 levels before). Now I'm taking B12 supplements. I can't say the sublingual supplements have made a noticeable difference (at least, not yet) on my ADHD symptoms or other symptoms, but since B12 deficiencies can cause long-term nerve damage, anemia, and other problems, I'm glad the neurologist thought to check it.

So I'd agree that docs are often spotty in terms of investigating nutritional issues if there's not other evidence that a deficiency or allergy or sensitivity is present.

But incorporating healthy eating and exercise into an overall treatment plan should be standard, even if you're not addressing specific dietary issues.

Mishka
11-20-14, 02:32 PM
Over the past 20 years I've seen 3 different pd (all either specialized in or had a lot of experience with ADHD). They've all at least mentioned importance of regular sleep habits, eating and exercising, but none have made specific suggestions about diet. I've never asked either though.
I've found all those things do affect how well my meds work.

daveddd
11-20-14, 02:33 PM
yea, then id have to say my intake papers probably all asked about allergies and stuff

i just always marked no to everything , because I'm really not sure, as a kid i don't think i had any allergies

i get a lot of exercise

i think my mom has mild anemia though

daveddd
11-20-14, 02:38 PM
i just remember to, my grandma was a huge supplement freak

she always used to tell me i needed b12 because of my behavior

she gave me drops, i don't know if i remember a difference, of course I'm pretty sure i probably didn't follow threw to long

Stevuke79
11-20-14, 02:52 PM
I also think there is a difference between saying that diet, nutrition and exercise, and the lack thereof can CAUSE or PREVENT ADHD and saying that these can be effective parts of TREATING it.

I assumed the OP meant the latter.

Unmanagable
11-20-14, 03:08 PM
I've never had a doc discuss any details regarding the importance of nutrition, movement, and good sleep hygiene, other than the check marks on the initial paperwork, as dave mentioned.

I've seen several GP docs, two psychiatrists, and other various specialists. I've found most don't wish to discuss it and will shut down if I bring it up, or comment that it isn't their area of expertise and cut me off.

Seeking out a registered dietitian is one of the best things I ever did for myself. Luckily, I crossed paths with someone reputable and genuine who was willing to barter, or I may not have ever gone down that path. Life changing is the only way to describe it.

My sis has diabetes and high blood pressure in addition to her other struggles and the only nutritional advice offered to her is to drink diet drinks and use artificial sweeteners, which both are incredibly toxic in other ways. Unfortunately, my sis and many other peeps don't feel a need to look any deeper. It's infuriating to me that it isn't given more attention all across the board in the professional arenas and that more educational support isn't made available.

Way too many people I know tend to get really defensive when I try to discuss it, saying, "Well if all that s*** were true, I think my doc would have mentioned it by now." .....or......"The fda wouldn't let them put stuff in our food if it wasn't safe." (not thinking of the rapidly increasing number of "small amounts of toxicity" that keeps adding up in our food and water supplies) Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr..............

Jshect
11-22-14, 02:18 PM
Yes, I don't think I've ever had any psychiatrists mention diet and exercise. They go through medical school (which I think big pharma has corrupted somehow, with $$ or something) and they are taught disease -> medication period. My whole point is people on here with genuine ADHD may be able to reduce their symptoms through elimination diets, evening out their blood sugar and exercise. My other point is there are probably people on here who are 100% positive they have ADHD but don't, and just have similar symptoms because of gluten sensitivity, or dairy allergens, bad gut flora, or reactions to food dyes and other toxic chemicals which the corrupt FDA thinks are safe. You will never know until you put in the work and try different elimination diets, reduce added sugars, and eat more vegetables. It's really easy to take a pill everyday, it's MUCH, MUCH harder to actually have to learn how to cook and resist ubiquitous junk food. Apparently people are claiming to have miraculous results with this GAPS diet, which is on another thread.
Human beings are easily able to fool themselves. I was convinced because of my brain fog that I had some type of schizoaffective disorder in the past because my brain fog symptoms matched some of the schizoaffective symptoms. I don't have that, but I fooled myself. I've tried all types of schizophrenia medications that the Pdocs were all to eager to prescribe with ZERO results.