I think what I share with Asperger's is even more difficult than the ADHD. Is that possible?

I like this web resource....

http://www.udel.edu/bkirby/asperger/as_thru_years.html

ASPERGER SYNDROME
Stephen Bauer, M.D., M.P.H.

Click Here for Dr. Bauer's Bio

Introduction Epidemiology Definition Clinical Features
Through the Lifespan Thoughts for Management in School

Yeah, it's possible. I am 'Aspergers like' according to my psych. I have the difficulties but not the character. I have meltdowns, rages, take things literally, non-dominant hemisphere dysfunction, flapping (under stress) and I can relate quite easily to the writings of autistic people.

I love conflict, paradox, disagreement, contrast, and conceptual elegance, similarity, identity, eqivalence, equality.

Ain't it great to be high functioning?

I think we have a real service to perfrom. Revealing what it is that we are actually reveals what others are too.

I'm still looking for a place that can load me down in my strenghts... I feel under utilized. I want to be used for my strenghts, a lot.

I did really well on "block design" in the psychometric tests recently. That explained a lot to me.

Becoming a Borg, by free will, would be a perfect setting for me... strong and defective at the same time. Share strenghts, shielded from personal weaknesses.

I'm good at memorising numbers. I know all my numbers and I remember phone numbers and car rego numbers and anything to do with numbers.

I think I'm more ADD than AS coz I'm so wierd (in the hyperactive/silly way) but I am still a lot of AS.

Well, I hope you both feel welecome here.

My wife and are in the LONG PROCESS of getting our 5 year old son diaganose with AS. From everything we have read, coupled with our observations of our son, we are 90% or more sure that this where he is, or at the least he is somewhere on the Autism Spectrum.

Anyway, I am not sure how his life will be as he grows into adolescence and adulthood. His environment is very known to us right now since my wife homeschools our kids. I was wondering if the 2 of you, or anyone else on this board with Aspergers, has any advice for me as a parent that you think would be helpful for my son, in respect to raising him. We have been reading a lot, but I don't walk in his shoes.
Or maybe, what were some things that your parents did that you hated or drove you crazy, maybe being exactly the opposite of what they should have done:) I want to understand my son and love and take care of him the way he needs me to. Sometimes I know that I butt heads with him and I really want to be the best parent I can be for him, as he is uniquely made.

I teach my autistic son the ways of the world - basically - I explain everything to him. I help him learn self care so that when he is older he can live independantly is he wants. I explain to him how other people feel and what people think and how his actions are seen.

Hi Jimmmaaa,
I wish you and your wife all the best with helping your son. I'm afraid I can't offer much in the way of help as I've only recently discovered what AS is. But your son is off to a very good start, due to the fact that his parents have recognised the problem and are doing all they can to help.
But you were interested in knowing what parents did that we hated, drove us crazy and were the exact opposite of what they should have done. In the case of my parents it was continual nagging, ie: Look at me when I talk to you! Didn't you hear me?! Get your hands out of your pockets! Stand up straight! Don't just stand there, say something! Stop day dreaming and do something! and again, Look at me when I talk to you!, And so it went on and on. The effect this had was to only make me more and more self-conscious and fearful, until the point where I was perpetually afraid of doing something wrong, and most of the time I would get it wrong due to misinterpreting what I was being told or just general clumsiness.
Now I'm sure that if my parents had been aware that there was a problem, and if I was aware that there was a problem the situation would have been entirely different. But back in the 70's when I was growing up there really wasn't much info available for these sort of disorders. When I was a child I was simply thought of as 'shy and quiet, bit of day dreamer' and as an adult i've had difficulties with depression and anxiety due to not being able to cope with my 'shy' nature. But I was always made to feel that I could change my behaviour, to 'get over' my apparent shyness. I remember my mum saying things like "don't be afraid to talk to them, they won't bight your head off". So why after 30 years have I not been able to stop being shy and start talking to people? Because I have AS. If I had known this when I as 5, things would be different now. Of course AS isn't as simple as shyness alone, as you know there are many factors which contribute to the syndrome, but it seems this is how it's perceived by non-AS people who aren't even aware of the syndrome.
I'm sorry, I didn't mean to bore you with a 'hard-done-by-childhood' story. These days I am more happy & relaxed, and with a little knowledge of my condition, I am able to look to my past and now things make sense - there is an answer and reason to the way I am, I no longer have to feel guilty or ashamed to be 'different'.
And I guess it does briefly illustrate how the wrong start to child's life with AS can lead to, or even snowball, the effects of AS in adult life - and it is much harder when you've got to stand on your own two feet and be a responsible adult.
The best advice I can give is to listen, be (very) patient, and make sure you understand what your son is communicating to you. Because his methods mightn't be as direct as talking, it may be visual or behavioural. And make sure your son understands what your are communicating to him - be very clear and detailed with any instructions, even ask him to repeat what you have told him, but above all just remain calm and patient. Kids with AS are very sensitive, and will easily become upset and give up trying. Of course they can't be wrapped in cottonwool all the time, but that's a case for discerning, parental wisdom.
Take care of yourselves,
regards,
Dwight

I'm currently trying to get my daughter tested for AS for nothing seems to help her. She has been diagnosed ADD, OCD, but she never really fit the descriptions. All I do know, is that she prefers being by herself and doing things alone. She has no friends and she talks in a baby voice most of the time, she hates talking about her day or how she feels, She also is completely focused on Pokemon, has been for at least 7 years with no signs of letting up. She draws them, researches them, buys the cards and the games, she has taped each episode at least three or four times. He doesn't care about her appearance. She also reacts oddly to situations, such as birthdays, holidays, wither its fun or not. But she's highly creative, and she doesn't need to be entertained.. oh she's almost 16. Any insight in AS would be appreciated.

Thanks Dwight for your very well thought out repsonse to my questions. I find it very difficult at times to understand my son. I find myself reacting to his behavior and I know I need to stop, take a deep breath and slow down to listen. If I did my heels in and he just gets more upset and runs away, like what is happening at the moment. My son will get upset and stuck on something and I have a hard time staying calm without getting emotionally hooked into the situation, which ALWAYS makes it worse. In general it is hard for me not to get hooked into an emotionally charge situation.

Well Thank you Dwight for giving me some advice as someone who DOES walk in the same type of shoes as my son. I really do want to understand him and take care of him the way he needs. It is very hard.

Thanks again,
James

James: I was thinking of you this weekend...and was thinking that isn't it GREAT that your son, with all of his difficulties, was born to parents who are married and love each other and are together and want to care for him in the best way possible??? I think the fact that you care about him and want to give him as much care as possible and want to DO everything possible is EVERYTHING....Can you imagine what it would be like if he were born to crappy parents who fought all the time and hated each other....and had a crappy marriage???and who weren't committed to staying together no matter what??? I don't know.....perhaps God gave you and your wife this kid for a reason.....God knew you and your wife could handle it....??? God knew you and your wife's marriage was SO strong and SO filled with love and commitment that it could withstand raising this type of child.....And knew this kid would be uncondtitionally loved no matter what despite his difficulties and despite the troubles he brought to the family??? And it certainly sounds like he is.....Any truth in this????:)

Yes...There is Joan...Thanks Joan for the great words...But it doesn't make it any easier. It hit me kind of hard last night. I just broke down about it all and I am kind of teary right now as I write this.

I know that Jack is a gift to us and God gave him to us because He will give us the strength to be the best for Jack. I also know that God will teach us a lot about HIS love for us through Jack. I know we are learning about unconditional love as you said.

Here is a song that sums up our thoughts very well about Jack:

Fingerprints Of God
Written by Steven Curtis Chapman
©1999 Sparrow Song / Peach Hill Songs / BMI / Admin. by EMI Christian Music Publishing
For Emily
Psalm 139: 14, 15 / Php. 1:6
I can see the tears filling Your eyes
And I know where they're coming from
They're coming from a heart that's broken in two
By what you don't see
The person in the mirror
Doesn't look like the magazine
Oh, but when I look at you it's clear to me that...


I can see the fingerprints of God
When I look at you
I can see the fingerprints of God
And I know it's true
You're a masterpiece
That all creation quietly applauds
And you're covered with the fingerprints of God


Never has there been and never again
Will there be another you
Fashioned by God's hand
And perfectly planned
To be just who you are
And what He's been creating
Since the first beat of your heart
Is a living breathing priceless work of art and...


Just look at you
You're a wonder in the making
Oh, and God's not through, no
In fact, He's just getting started and ...

Here are the Bible verses listed at the top:

Psalm 139:14, 15
I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
your works are wonderful,
I know that full well.
My frame was not hidden from you
when I was made in the secret place.
When I was woven together in the depths of the earth,

Philippians 1:6
being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.

I guess it sometimes is easy to know in my head that we are going through hard things with Jack, but to let the emotions come out is a different story. There are so many unkowns for me....I have hopes and dreams for my kids and I don't know what will still be the same and different in what those hope and dreams will for Jack. And do not mean I am giving up on having dreams for him...I guess it is a lot to deal with....Maybe I forgot to mention that Jack has an appointment at the MIND Institute on October 29th, 2 days after my birthday. Up to this point, it has been all this Medial-Insurance-Bureucratic-Red-Tape-Hoop-Jumping mess. Really it is hard to believe, sort of like I feel something is going to fall through and our health insurance is not going to really cover this.

I was reading some of that book, The Explosive Child, and talking to my wife last night and I just broke down and cried over it all. Well I am rambling on about this, but it is possibly one of the hardest things I have ever dealt with. I know we will be sustained through it all, but it is hard and scary and very emotional for me.

Thanks so much again Joan, for all the great things you said and about me and my wife.

No other people's words do not make it easier....That is true....Even other people who are going through the same experiences as you....THEIR words do not make things easier.......I know with all the unknowns, it must be hard and scarey......VERY hard and scarey with all the unknowns....This is probably the hardest thing you will ever go through in your life....which is why I guess a day at a time is the only way to go....

I am sorry you are sad.....I do love your poem, Fingerprints of God....

An appointment with the Mind Institute just two days after your birthday??? Hmmmm. Is that a birthday present to you from God? Now why would God take away the insurance benefits for that appointment which took you so long to get. I just bet it WILL be covered....

And it's important to let the feelings come....(is it hard for men to do that?)......not to let them build up.....it's good you and your wife can share feelings that deeply....Jack is lucky to have you and your wife as parents....:)

I did not say all those things about you and your wife....YOU did....I just paraphrased them back from what I read in all of your posts:)

Well, it was kind of you to remind me of what I said, Joan.

Actually, The Fingerprints of God is a song by a singer named Steven Curtis Chapman. My wife has a binder full of all the information relating to Jack with that song on the front, along with a picture of Jack. It makes me a little teary thinking about it.

For me, I can express my feeling, but sometimes they hit me all at once, almost seems like it is out of the blue, but it is not. Usually something triggers them. Well I guess there is a lot going on. On Thursday and Today my wife had to take my son for testing. She homeschools our kids, but it is through a Charter School program. So our kids are officially student of the State of CA, but my wife teaches them. We get some money each somester for books and so forth. Along with that, the Charter School district also has a Special Education Dept. So a lot has gone on the past few days, and it is hitting me.

Know what James? Let me clarify. I wasn't reminding you of what you said. I've been continually always reading your posts here and now telliing you in my own words what I've interpreted you as having said.....sort of drawing my own conclusions about you and your wife....that would be more accurate of what I was doing....so does that make more sense???

Well I can understand feelings coming on all at once....getting triggered like when you look at his scrapbook.......so cry away on your wife's shoulder...hey it's very healing.....:)

P.S. James I want to let you know I'm right there with you all the way....routing for you and your wife and Jack....

In fact, to send good karma, I will read a little bit of Explosive Child everytime I visit Borders.....I have read the first chapter and a half already....and the book seems to always be right where I leave it.....in the parenting section....:)

James, I would just like to say my thoughts are with you. I have a young son too (he's 4), and although we have not yet faced the kind of challenge you describe, I can relate to much of what you say, maybe just as a father, or as an ADD father. I don't think my son has Aspergers (he's more ADD-like, if anything), but he can go into an extreme shyness (for example), which always wrongfoots me because I would want to be as supportive and sympathetic as possible but it makes me uncomfortable and I don't always deal with it very well. If it was someone else's child I think I'd cope much better, but paradoxically I love my own boy too much to stay cool. Luckily I think he knows how much I love him, but I think he has an inkling already that his father is a bit 'flawed'. My opinion or feeling about whether this is a good or bad thing (for him) keeps changing.

I'd be only too happy to continue to share with you regarding the challenges of being a father etc. I think the desire to be a good or better father was (indirectly) one of the things that made me want to join the forums.

Hi Jonathan,

Thanks for the kind words. Parenting is one of the most challenging things in life--No difficult problem is harder at work. But with that said there is also a lot of joy that comes from being a parent.

I think it is even more difficult to be a good dad today. But we are both doing great. I wish my father had put in even a little bit of the effort I have put in, but that can't be changed now.

Well Jonathan, I hope you have a great day and weekend.

Dear James,

all children are challenging, so to have a child who struggles extra-hard to find any place at all in the world, without knowing exactly what that struggle is like for him, must be frustrating beyond words...

I have no particular advice for you & your family but I want you to know how important this work is--this brave work that you address every day, trying to be your son's ally in understanding himself and meeting his needs, and in creating connections to the outside world and the people who love him--what you are doing could help your son form lifelong friendships, or avoid addiction, or find a partner for life, or save his marriage, or love his children, or...

The ways in which you try to understand and reach your son WILL matter--even if you do not succeed, even if all you do is try and try and never stop trying. He will see and feel your deep love through your belief in his ability to find/create a fulfilling life, your support as he takes part in a world he may find difficult, and the safe haven of your family when he needs respite.

On hard days, please be gentle to yourselves--give yourselves some grace and kindness--remember to refill your own tank...

and then try again--it really does matter.

all my best,

M

Hi MzsMail,

The timing of your words is very encouraging. Thanks so much,
I really appreciate your encouraging words.

Hi again James,

Thanks - I am having a very nice weekend! An uncle of mine is here whom I don't see very often - the dear brother of my (inexpressibly dear) mother who died 12 years ago.

I agree with MzsMail's sentiments: just wanted to emphasize where she says that trying to reach him 'WILL matter--even if you don't succeed', that this mattering, having an effect, is a kind of success anyway. A very real amount of frustration certainly awaits you, but I think it's quite valid to take the view that in a very important sense if you love your son and remain committed to trying to help him and be there for him, you can't fail - even if you have to learn to change some of the specific goals you may have set as you go along. I also agree with her exhortation to be gentle on yourselves - even for your son's sake: when you are worrying about a problem which you feel is disturbing your children, they may actually be more unsettled by your worrying or accompanying state of agitation than they are by the problem you are worrying about. (I don't mean by this that you should be pretending everything is fine when you don't feel it is, or pretend you are not worrying when you are - just that you should take as holistic a view as possible...)

What you said about you and your father applies to me and mine too. Sad, I know my father loves me in his way, and is very pleased with his grandson (my 4-year-old Aaron), who reminds him of me as a little boy, but he can't even hold up his end of a telephone conversation with him.

Hope you have a nice weekend too!

Nice wonderful supportive stuff here, huh James....??? Aren't these people unbelieveable????????????? (Jonathan and Mzsmail).....(she said opening the second pack of kleenexes).................

James, i am an adult (46 yr male) who self diagnosed ADHD about twenty years ago watching a TV special, that ended with the tag line, that most ADHD kids out grow it in middle school or High school. I knew that was completely wrong, and that i was not going to individually teach MD's anything by my protestations to the contrary. (early 1980's) i was diagnosied via marital therapy in the late 1990's)
Recently i have become aware of the LD and Aspergers components of my experience. I've given it a great deal of thought.

Some of what is done in correctly headed schools is right, but no thought is given to "How in the world will this person find Adult settings with these supports?" The first issues IS to find out what works and how. but being an adult is in most our our futures, and living THEN also is a need. I grew up without the help, I became an adult without the help. I am now realizing how much below my potential I have been forced to operate.
I can even say what I need. But so far I cannot get it.
I once saw a presentation by a man with severe dyslexia. He would get help with the library catalogue and finding books on the shelves and skimming the forward before taking the book home, by claiming to have forgotten his glasses. He always got the help he needed. When he said he was dyslexic, he got put off, not helped, or people tried to teach him to read, on the spot, like he had never thought of that.
The point isn't that society doesn't provide what even your AS son needs, though it may not provide it with that label.Good luck now and in your shared future.
Re-evaluate what is important, and when. understand failure is no ones goal. If you are frustrated because you don't see what the matter is, understand, seeing what the matter is and having that not help is just as tough. Assume the existance of a REAL problem. It is there. Then go gently. With yourself as well as him. Remember, his future is for His dreams, not his parents. Prepare him, as best you can, for following his own guidance, not yours.
i hope that helps.
ADHD, LD, AS - David

Thanks Wheel. Good input.

Diagnosed Aspergers Sysndrom with my other disorders. Gift really. U should see my IQ scores and me on a PC. Better and less intrusive than AD/HD. Imagine what i feel like when i am being torn apart inside. I want 2 have all the attention and be the life of the party and then at the same time i just want 2 be on my own away from everyone. That is hard.

Conflict is what keeps us from stagnating BigDaddy! It isn't easy, but there is the opportunity in every conflict for the emergence of unspeakable beauty. Look for it in disasters near you!

Jimmmaa

Advice to parents of Aspergers kids: Get advice from people other than me; become an expert yourself (yes it is a ton of work.)

Things that could have been done better or that back fired when done to me. Wow. I have to tell you, I do some of the same things to my son and daughter. But i have some clues to offer.

If it jams, look up. It comes from sailing, but it is short hand for some really good advice, I think.

When a problem becomes noticed, "don't just do something, sit there!" Our bias for action, or immediate action, is not always appropriate.

If the solution were ready at hand, it would already be used. so look farther away, even look up. On a sail boat, the one place you can't get to, and therefore don't want to consider having a problem, is up the mast. Its too high to reach, and the boats are too small to be able to climb the mast. But HOPELESS as that inclines us to be, there are an amazing number of times when looking up, and SEEING the problem OUT OF REACH gives us what we need to be able to magically handle the situation pretty well anyway!

So continue to look farther away in local problems. Take TIME. Be there not DO THERE. We're called "human beings" not "human doings." consider how you can HELP without words, without "taking over." Offer to be his tool, rather than being the artisan using him as a tool on himself.

Kahil Gibran says of teachers that they bring students (you bring your children) not into the temple of your own understanding, but to the threshold of their own. So true.

In the story of Job, in the old testimate, job's friends were most "helpful" while they sat with him, before they opened their mouths. Their errors, once they spoke were many. but in sharing his plight with their time and attention but with out their two cents... that was their greatest and most valuable gift of freindship, IMHO.

So the firs thing to do is slow down. Drop the result. Explore the process with him. Getting results is for when you KNOW what works FOR HIM and HE knows it and He has practiced it enough FOR HIM to be able to perform it. the standard required is much less what you know, and much more what he needs, when he needs it, how he needs it, to work it out for what and where he is. You cannot make him "ready."

There is a book called "Scattered" that i think will speak to some of your concerns and impulses.

Good luck!

Hi David,

Thanks for your great words. You always have some very thought out responses. I like the sailing insight: If it jams, Look up. There is a tendency to want to rush and fix things, do things, but sometimes just understanding and being there is what is needed.

I will have to reread your post again because there was so much good info and insight in it

Thanks again.

I know this is probably none of my business but I really think its a very bad idea to home-school AS children. They NEED to be able to interact with other people there own age and they need to learn by their mistakes how to interact "normally". They cannot do this at home with you explaining every detail all of the time. It is just not a realistic environment. I know that a lot of people will post remarks about this comment like 'society should be more accepting of everyone's differences' and AS people should be 'appreciated for what they are'. The fact of the matter is, however, that they won't and it is the minority who will have to change. However morally opposed you are to conformity, being able to at least put on the performance is going to be a necessity when your children need to get a job.

Diagnosed Aspergers Sysndrom with my other disorders. Gift really. U should see my IQ scores and me on a PC. Better and less intrusive than AD/HD. Imagine what i feel like when i am being torn apart inside. I want 2 have all the attention and be the life of the party and then at the same time i just want 2 be on my own away from everyone. That is hard.diagnosed 2½ years ago with adhd, add and asperger syndrome, i know *exactly* what you mean: i *want* to be around people and for short periods of time i'm actually able to do just *fine* (socially), but then all of a sudden i get this "nooo! let me *out*!!!" feeling, and then i have to leave/flee, to be by myself...
:(

My 11-year old son has been diagnosed with AS for a few years now and he and I both are affected by ADD. Reading this post all the way back from the beginning was heart-wrenching to say the least.

The awareness in the world of AS grows dramatically each year...it was only officially added to the DSM quite recently. I will say that having this diagnosis created a window to improve things so much for my son. Since this condition is in the autistic spectrum of developmental disorders, all kinds of excellent support has been provided by our schools due to the AS diagnosis.

I have also come to view my son as a genuine blessing from God. He has helped me see things I was unable to see until his unique perspective brought them to light for me. He has also helped me re-establish priorities and become truly grateful for the blessing of life.

Carry on all you Asperger's kindred spirits out there!

Ed