View Full Version : Can Strattera work for me?


Robin.B.P
06-06-15, 10:43 AM
Here it goes... I am 45 years old and have lived a hard life with Adhd that made me hit the wall 2,5 years ago. I saw it was coming well before that, but my Adhd kept pushing me til i hit bottom.

After that i started and tried a lot of meds for depression that dindt seem right for me, all ssri/snri worked for a while, but as some of you maby know is that they depletes dopamin. So i got more depressed over time before i got diagnosed with Adhd and depression. By that time i felt like dopamin had left my brain and felt really wierd. So i started Ritalin, but it made my anxiety a lot worse.

So after a while i started Vyvanse that killed my anxiety, but after that i got really depressed on it. The reason, drop in serotonin...

And here the truble starts, the only Ad i can take is Cymbalta because its an Snri, all other Ssri makes me drowsy, tierd and lost with no motivation. The problem i have is that with Cymbalta 60 mg will make me crash bad on Vyvanse since it will not last as long when i take Cymbalta or any other med when i get to high on serotonin.

I am so tierd to see there is no light in my life, but only troubles and dark places.

So the clue is that, when i take an Snri i need dopamin. When i take Vyvanse i need serotonin and it will make my life really bad.

So i was wondring if i only took Strattera i would not drop in dopamin or serotonin. But will it help for Sa. and a bit on depression, and will it help me to focus and for motivation?

I hope there is some nice peolpe in here that can help a guy from Norway to get back his life, for me it seems that its all about Nri since that is what helps me with Cymbalta.

sarahsweets
06-06-15, 10:55 AM
Well strattera was origionally supposes to be for depression so its in the same general area as SNRI's and SSRI's. Taking both cymblata and straterra could be redundant.

Robin.B.P
06-06-15, 12:02 PM
I know Sara, Strattera does not increase serotonin nor dopamin so i was thinking of dropping both Cymbalta and Vyvanse since it would not interfere with those receptors.

And since Cymbalta is an Snri it decreases dopamin, and i know first hand how thats working out.

So if Strattera would work on motivation and focus, it could be the med. for me. If it can help on anxiety to that has been a part of my life it would be great.

I hate every med. that work on serotoni, they give me anxiety all of them and make my depression worse over time because of loosing dopamin that is a part of Adhd. So if Strattera could work for me i be glad to live with less dopamin if i didnt get depressed.

Headroom
06-09-15, 06:31 PM
Bupropion would be more of your type of medication because it releases both adrenaline (focus) and, to a lesser degree, dopamine (drive). Strattera works along the same lines, but the balance is shifted more towards adrenaline. Strattera was initially tried, but rejected as an antidepressant, where bupropion has succeeded for this purpose. It is only after it failed as antidepressant that Strattera was approved as an ADHD medication. Just the opposite of this is the clinical history of bupropion whose ADHD off-label use has emerged after it had been already successfully used as antidepressant. Neither of these drugs does much for serotonin, which is, perhaps, a good thing for somebody with ADHD or someone whose depression is due to ADHD.

If we ignore an iffy bliss which can be obtained by moderating GABA, opiodic and a few other types of receptors whose value is more pronounced for recreational rather than medical utilization, we are stuck with adrenalin, dopamine and serotonin.
Adrenalin is a tough gamble because it has direct negative cardiovascular effects, namely narrowing arteries and raising blood pressure. It also directly raises anxiety, and while this may be beneficial for someone who lacks motivation to a point of stupor, it will bring more problems than help to an average target patient.

:) From the standpoint of ruling classes of any society dopamine is something that a worker bee should not mess with. It is a toy for those who are at the helm - to fly like an eagle and to ?@^&@ like a bunny. Aside from sociopolitical reasons, high dopamine is responsible for addictive and over-the-board behavor and when combined with alcohol makes an already unstable person even more reactive and aggressive. Nether that, nor mania associated with its high levels is something that someone would like to be sued for, and the history of dopamine drug abuse is not something that could be overlooked.

Enter serotonin. If one is careful to eliminate a possibility of serotonin syndrome, from a standpoint of a bean counter raising serotonin is a much safer ground in regard to legal responsibility. Yes it kills the sex drive and makes you fat, but so what? If it works you get a kind of opiate-lite bliss without the opiate addiction. Actually addiction is there and you become a lifer, but this is typically not advertised before a prescription is written out. Serotonin causes quick down-regulation, meaning that you get less of an uptick from a dosage as the time goes by. That's why recreational MDMA (XTC) users speak of the drug losing its magic after the initial honeymoon period. The magic is from serotonin. Adrenalin and dopamine still get boosted, but their contribution to the bliss is of a cruder nature. If one overdoes it by a large factor, there is such a thing as dopamine toxicity (different, but akin to serotonin down-regulation). When it comes down to receptors, there are more types of serotonin receptors than either dopamine or adrenalin receptors. That makes it easier to switch a patient to another SSRI, when an SSRI stops to work due to serotonin down-regulation. All of these are the reasons why SSRIs have dominated this field since they were invented.

I am writing this to answer a question raised in this thread and to share my knowledge hoping that it will be helpful to others. To establish some background, at some point of my life I started having derealisation symptoms. Everything suddenly looked like I was looking at the world through the steel wool or as if somebody was waving his hands with their fingers spread apart in front of my eyes. No depth perception, visual noise and flashes everywhere as if a disco mirror ball was throwing specs of light at everything I looked at. I couldn't see the grain on a building or a tree trunk, the warmth of the sunset on a red brick. Sounds came from far away as if I was deep under water. I had high IQ, but had problem organizing things. So derealisation, ADD and depression was thrown at me, but never confirmed. I did not feel depressed, but I did have some ADD symptoms. So I was treated by a barrage of drugs none of which helped. Ritalin never worked for me and somebody later switched me to Pemoline. A bupropion was added and that combination and suddently I almost the the life as I used to see it before the onset of my condition. What's more, I had a great demanding job and was at the top of my performance. This was awesome until circumstances changed, I lost my insurance and decided that I could not afford the medications. So again I went on getting by without anything prescriptional. In a retrospect those have not been productive years.

Enter Strattera. After years of not taking anything I decided to try a new drug. At that point I happened to be depressed due to a failed relationship. To deal with it I tried some new supplements and then, after catching up on reading, I bought some Strattera on the web without prescription. I also made an appointment to see a shrink. By the time I got to see the doctor Strattera has already alleviated my depression and the shrink was more than happy to prescribe to me such a mild drug. I had no negative side-effects whatsoever. Mild it seemed to be and having taken it for six months, I decided that it didn't do anything and stopped taking it. It was then that I realized that it wasn't just a mild antidepressant for a broken heart, but actually worked a great deal for focus. I had a highly technical job and professional things which were easy up until that point became hard. My doctor decided to put me on something else which didn't work. So again I said goodbye and got by on supplements for a couple of years until I decided to see a different doctor. By that time due to my prior usage of Somatomax and Modafinil, I was no longer capable of experiencing deep sleep. Pemoline was no longer available, so my new doctor put me again on bupropion, which worked, but by itself wasn't good enough. He tried augmenting it with a whole bunch of amphetamines, but they worked no better than Ritalin. Then he tried Strattera. It seemed to work initially, but outright falling asleep became even more difficult. Before that when I took Strattera the first time I worked up my dosage to 80mg a day without any problems. This time it was different. There were other unpleasant side-effect, but I could cope with them. When I hit 40mg this time, I experienced heart palpitations and tachycardia so strong that I thought I was heaving a heart attack. The first time it happened it was after the dinner. And then it went on and on. My girlfriend could feel sudden heart palpitation as I was lying next to her. Both my blood-pressure and heart rate were suddenly high. Yet, I was an athlete in a very good shape. I did some research and it turned out that other people on Strattera were having the same kind of problems. I had to give up Strattera and it took me another six months before the symptoms disappeared. I continued to take bupropion and at some point was able to procure Pemoline. This is what I am using now and this combination works for me even better than it worked years before. Now I am finally at a point when I can explain why I wrote all of this and, perhaps, answer the question brought up in this thread.

1) For ADHD and similar conditions one should avoid messing with serotonin. It is a way to go only for severe clinical depression, not for a depression brought on by lack of personal performance due to other factors.

2) For inattentive ADHD andrenalin should be up-regulated, but this should be done carefully. I got my cardiovascular problems because both bupropion and Strattera boost adrenaline, and I took both of them at the same time the second time I was put on Strattera.

3) For hyperactivity one can go the dopamine road with Ritalin or amphetamines. They will come one down while temporarily contributing to one's sex life. However, the increase and the drop in dopamine that they produce are very rapid and harsh. As a result these drugs will eventually cause dopamine receptor down-regulation and ruin sex, which will cause depression.

4) For myself and for people in the same category Pemoline is the ideal complement for bupropion. Pemoline is not a dopamine releaser, but a dopamine transporter. There is no other drug has the same function. Dopamine releasers flood the system with dopamine and my brain does not cope well with with sharp increase of the signal. Nothing good comes out from an unavoidable rapid crash either.

5) It is possible that Strattera could work with Pemoline as well.

6) One should not discount Modafinil and racetams, but should remember that Modafinil shares dopamine releaser characteristics.

7) Better medications will arrive, meanwhile it's up to us.

Robin.B.P
06-10-15, 10:46 AM
Thank you so much for your story an insight. Like i have said so many times before, i have tried almost everything.
All ssri when i increase dossage make me so tierd and sleepy that i get useless for everything.
The only med that dont do that is Cymbalta because of its action on Norepinephrine, but like in the past it will kill of my dopamin.

If Strattera work on motivation and focus it could be the med for me since it will not touch serotonin or dopamin, but i dont see how i should get off Vyvanse since i get a bad withdrawl day to if i take i breake.

But also when i was on Remron with Vyvanse i had no comedown, like Vyvanse worked 24/7. On that combo i had great focus but was still depressed since Remeron has done nothing there for my depression.
Right now i am so lost, i am on 2x30 mg Cymbalta and 30 mg Vyvanse and i have zero focus and concentration. Have tried all the way up to 60 mg and it didnt do anything for that.
So from my stand point i have some options left, try Strattera alone. Or try Cymbalta, Vyvanse with Remeron. Or try Adderall Xr with Cymbalta and hope my focus will improve.
And also, how will Strattera work on anxiety? Vyvanse kills mine much better than any ssri/snri. But like you said the comedown from stims is horrific, it drains the head for dopamin til a point i get so tierd i have to go to bed if i skip a dose.

But i also see many here claim that Strattera makes them tierd with no focus so i am a bit affraid to try it out. But in the end, i belive it could help me get ridd off Cymbalta and Vyvanse if it works on me ...

Headroom
06-10-15, 05:14 PM
It would so easy to prescribe medication if its effect on a particular individual was known in advance. :)
But we are not there yet, so you'll just have to try it on yourself, UNLESS you'll find somebody else's previous medical experience which closely parallels yours, which would be a great luck! Or, you'll just absorb the facts and at some point of trial and error road through a list of available medication something will click and a memory of what you have read long time ago will help you make a better decision.
But speaking of focus and motivation, have you tried modafinil type drugs?

Robin.B.P
06-11-15, 08:24 AM
I havnet tried modafini, and i am not shure my new doc will let me. Its a big problem here where i live to get the same doc every time, so for now i have had about 15 diffrent. And its hard to start over again to explain whats going on with me since i have both depression and Adhd.

Any way with Vyvanse after 4 months i feel it does wery little for me, its like i get more than enough dopamin and i am able to sitt still. But like i have said it does notting for focus and concentration, and it makes me just dull. I just dont want to see anyone like i have it right now. Its hard to be at work and not be abel to concentrate when i need to.
Will see my new doc next week and i hope i can get here to understand whats going on in my head.