View Full Version : Coincidences do not 'logically' not exist, the concept simple doesn't exist


Gilthranon
08-20-15, 05:00 PM
After some drinks, come to think of it, if every single action, affected by a long line of cause-action-reaction-consequences interfering at some point in its timeline, in our world of endless multitudes of endless interferences among external factors (C-A-R-C) is the result of another action influenced by collision with another factor, coincidence simply doesn't exist.

Everything is the cause of result of everything, playing onto each other, influencing each other, crossing each other. It's a relentless circle.


Example - a cause-action relation is no more than the simple movement as a result of any source at all. Organic, subatomic, flatlander, material, alive, hyper dimensional, quantum mechanic or other. This action, inevitably triggers an endless course of actions, which, again inevitably, will eventually come into collision with a different cause-action relation with its own background. Hence the result is a result of a result, resulting into yet results (which will again only result to result into results etc.) - that is my result !!!

Little Missy
08-20-15, 05:05 PM
No serendipitous synchronicity?

Gilthranon
08-20-15, 05:30 PM
I think everything is the result of factors influencing each other. So, I don't think so.

Gilthranon
08-20-15, 05:42 PM
No serendipitous synchronicity?
Wait no my judgement was too fast, yeah that's a definitely an unexpected interesting point of view, can you elaborate what exactly you have in mind ?

Little Missy
08-20-15, 06:40 PM
Wait no my judgement was too fast, yeah that's a definitely an unexpected interesting point of view, can you elaborate what exactly you have in mind ?

hmmmmm, well it is just so broad that it can happen anywhere and any time for any thing. Surely you have experienced this at some time.

Kind of like instant karma, only different.

sarek
08-24-15, 02:34 AM
Ultimate predictability exists to a major extent but is limited by two major factors, one fundamental, and one practical.

- The fundamental factor comes into play whenever quantum effects interface with the macroscopic world. This only happens in certain circumstances. Usually, quantum effects are "smoothed out" when you scale the system up, but that doesnt always happen.

- The practical factor is the non-calculability of the whole complex of cause and effect. While this is not fundamental, it will still preclude our ability to know the future.

Pilgrim
08-24-15, 04:24 AM
Ultimate predictability exists to a major extent but is limited by two major factors, one fundamental, and one practical.

- The fundamental factor comes into play whenever quantum effects interface with the macroscopic world. This only happens in certain circumstances. Usually, quantum effects are "smoothed out" when you scale the system up, but that doesnt always happen.

- The practical factor is the non-calculability of the whole complex of cause and effect. While this is not fundamental, it will still preclude our ability to know the future.

I get it I think. One is almost mathematical.
The second one is cause and effect.

KarmanMonkey
08-28-15, 12:04 PM
While it's true that every event has a set of causes, I feel it's a bit of a leap to say that there's no coincidence. I think part of it comes down to the meaning of the word.

Coincidence says to me that there are two items that are closely related in nature, but have little to no causal relationship.

For example, if the radio has an ad for a store as I'm driving by it, I consider it a coincidence, because there is no apparent connection of factors that would cause those two things to happen at the same time.

I think you'd like the field of chaos theory. It's the field of mathematics where the concept of the butterfly effect came from. It basically steps away from direct cause and effect, and instead looks for patterns; the concept being that every event has immesurable consequence, and each event has a nearly infinite number of contributing forces and influences, but that the sum of these infinite forces can result in a relatively stable system.

SB_UK
08-29-15, 02:08 AM
Emergence - something new and completely unprecedented comes along.

Totally scuppers predictability.

Generally the completely unprecedented is beyond the frame of reason of the pre-emergent species.

Could a monkey imagine life with words.

Couldn't imagine.
Couldn't imagine words.

Emergence is a natural/divine (whichever you like) ultimate Christmas present.

As you had no idea you wanted it and couldn't see how unimaginably much so that you'd enjoy it.

SB_UK
08-29-15, 02:40 AM
post-edit

Emergence - something new and completely unprecedented comes along.

Totally scuppers predictability.

Generally the completely unprecedented is beyond the frame of reason of the pre-emergent species.

Could a monkey imagine life with words.

Couldn't imagine.
Couldn't imagine words.

Emergence is a natural/divine (whichever you like) ultimate Christmas present.

As you had no idea you wanted it and couldn't see how unimaginably much so that you'd enjoy it.

It represents the integral of what was before (ie the sum from 0 to infinity) - both magical terms.
Zero and Infinity.

Then look at Kunga Dorji's avatar.

http://www.featurepics.com/FI/Thumb300/20110314/Zen-Circle-1820196.jpg

Note - insight into what infinity and zero mean in a 'real' world without them - they relate to the emergence and dissipation of real into (ie the real duality) into a third arena (hence Trinity) which is of a single dimension - what we'd call time.
Time = precursor dimension (a standing wave compressed into 1 dimension - so all we see is pulsatility) with space as 2 dimensions = the 2 waves in a standing wave.
This represent the fundamental (reality) of Planck time, Planck length standing wave matrix - from which emergence builds reality.

y = 2x
integral y = x^2

Substitute

circumference = 2 x pi x r
area = pi x r ^2

^
|
Exctly the same

Noting

E=hf
E=mc^2

-*-

Evolution works by chaining integrals.

What holds the integral together as one - generally called an abstraction layer - is the 'social impulse' which can be considered resonant synchrony with a fundamental substance (or God if you prefer).

Why does evolution proceed ?
Because that what it does.

Is there a pattern ?
Yes - see above - sequential integrals - the left is 'selfish' the right is 'social' - taking from the world of dualism.
The centre - is balance.

Also taking from a Buddhist symbol.

-*-

Can we know the future.

No - we can only have strong suspicions - at close to the point of emergence - of what is to follow - because we need to have our reality extended by following emergent property before we're able to get close to intuiting the following emergent event.

What's the general pattern ?

Well - it's similar to 50's black and white TV set to one of those all singing all dancing 4k UHD TVs.

-*-

Increasing our resolution over reality.

http://s7.postimg.org/9cgg9bt7v/zig.png

Yes.

At its core - lies pure darkness.

From which emerges light.

Noting.

E=hf
E=mc^2

Relationship between h and c.
The Planck length is the scale at which classical ideas about gravity and space-time cease to be valid, and quantum effects dominate. This is the ‘quantum of length’, the smallest measurement of length with any meaning.

And roughly equal to 1.6 x 10-35 m or about 10-20 times the size of a proton.

The Planck time is the time it would take a photon travelling at the speed of light to across a distance equal to the Planck length. This is the ‘quantum of time’, the smallest measurement of time that has any meaning, and is equal to 10-43 seconds. No smaller division of time has any meaning. With in the framework of the laws of physics as we understand them today, we can say only that the universe came into existence when it already had an age of 10-43 seconds.

So simply

time - 1 d
space - 2 d
gravity - social impulse ie resonance with underlying fundamental substrate - simple language - holds everything together.

Point of social impulse - previous abstraction layer has nowhere to go - must see emergence of 'something' new.

Why ?

Because that's what a fundamentally creative creator does.

-- Also --
Solves what is quantum ?
As this is the field which exists pre-emergence of the first real

What is gravity ?
First real 'social' impulse

Also what is zero and infinity in a 'real' world ?
The emergence of 'real' from 1d which exposes itslef to us only as a pulse (time).

The standing wave has a pulsatility.

Reality is simply orthogonally - perpendicularly arrayed standing waves.

With evolution - reality (phenomenological) changes.

SB_UK
08-29-15, 02:42 AM
What is quantum ?

It's a Lorenz butterfly shaped from time forming via 23/24 interations into a left and a rigth wing - the duality of 2 space dimensions - which are eversions of one another.

TelepathBoy
08-29-15, 05:24 AM
"Coincidence" is merely a word used to describe the personal / emotional significance that us humans ascribe to seemingly unlikely and personalized C-A-R-C cycles. As an objective concept, "coincidence" is meaningless. It does not exist independently of us, who define it and experience it in the first place.

Therefore, I think that there might be another way to view your C-A-R-C model. "Coincidence" is defined by us and as such exists as a subjective concept that has no existence independent of us. Therefore, the concept of "coincidence" resides within our minds as an idea, as a "thought". Are thoughts not always the first C of the cycle as it pertains to human action? Thought is the C that necessarily precedes the A; A cannot occur without the C. We ascribe personal and emotional significance to all of these Cs, no matter how minor; that is the nature of thought. Therefore, all of these C-A-R-C cycles that are set into motion by human hands are necessarily laden with thought, and therefore, personally emotional significance as well. Endless multitudes of endless interactions among these thought-laden C-A-R-C wheels collide and carom around the world and around the universe. Many of them returning and behaving predictably and as we expect, and many of them disintegrating and / or recombining into unrecognizable forms upon the endless sea of cycles. But, with 6 or 7 billion of us, each and every one of us setting millions of these C-A-R-C cycles into motion every single day, the laws of probability dictate that at least a handful of these cycles will return to us in recognizable, emotionally significant, seemingly (and probabalistically) unlikely, personally and emotionally significant ways.

Coincidence as a subjective experience therefore originates and culminates in thought - the cause which propels action forward and comes to rest again as consequence - the first and last C of the infinite cycle, both the cause and the consequence, and once again the cause, and both at the same time, perpetually and eternally in motion.

If you're interested in the idea of synchronicity, much has been written on the topic. It's interesting stuff.