View Full Version : Strange and random


Sarah36
01-05-16, 08:25 PM
Ok I have a random topic and wonder if I actually speak it hear I can move on. It seems very simple bit when I was of kindergarten age, I remember a checkup at doctors office when I had to get a shot. I saw the shot in her hand, asked if it would and she said yes...I figured it wouldnt truly hurt but when she injected me it surprised me with a horrible sting. I immediatly closed my eyes and cried. I remember a sense of betrayal and got real quiet as she looked at me with a pouted lower lip. I have never forgotten this experience and nearly refused to vaccinate my son. I know its rediculous but making babies and kids get shots that we know ahead of time will hurt makes me a bit angry.

My question is...does anyone else here with ADD obsess over simple things like this? I understand the importance of vaccinating, but want a painless way of immunizing. I have actually gotten angry over this. Having said that...Im not a good person to discuss needless infant procedures with lol.

Delphine
01-05-16, 09:58 PM
I ruminated for ages about vaccination. Thought about it from every angle. Dreaded putting my two through it. For me, it felt like the first betrayal..... (the parent walking the kid into a horrible experience, just because it was societal's 'norm').

I can't tell you how much anxiety this all meant for me back then.

But what decided my position (I went for vaccination... eventually) was my own family history.

Many of my mother's/ grandmother's children died of these conditions. In their day, things were different.

At the end of the day, when you do not vaccinate, you are relying on those that do to hold back the tide of these terrible possible factors. Eventually... after MUCH ruminating and soul searching.....I didn't want to be amongst those who relied on others to vaccinate theirs, so I didn't have to vaccinate mine. (Which is why I eventually decided to be amongst the numbers who vaccinated!)

But... do we obsess over 'simple' things like this? Oh God, YES...... did I obsess? Did I stay awake and wonder..? Did I ponder over whether mine were "just two" in the great ocean of potentially unvaccinated babies?

Did my want my two beloveds to be the ones to be excepted? (Yes, btw)... Did I want to not think about any of it?

In the end, I'm not sure if I made the right decision so I'm not saying what anyone else should do. (I did decide to have them vaccinated. YOU decide for yourself. I have no strong opinion on this either way.)

One died anyway. I will never get over that, although I try, every day. And I love everyones kids who are now the same age as he might be (35)!

But regarding obsessing about 'whether or not' about vaccinations... tough call for any parent because yours could be the 'one-in-a-billion' that draws the short straw!!!!!!

We want the best for our kids. That is primary.

We also want to do our bit to take our environmental/ tribal responsibility seriously.

Tough call. Especially when these days, they give these jabs in huge cocktails.

(30 years ago, the vaccinations were one-by-one...... closer to the way it would happen in ordinary everyday life. And still cause for rumination!!!!!)

So I have no answer for you. Maybe I ranted. Sorry if so. But regarding your question.... "did I obsess over simple things like this?".... YES.... hugely...

Socaljaxs
01-06-16, 02:47 AM
I don't have children of my own. However, I truly don't understand the reason why people would choose not to vaccinate their children? Just watching and talking to my sister with her two kids (age 2 and 10 months old)and knowing that she can at times feel helpless to injuries and sickness of her children, and that sense of vulnerability that comes with being a mother.

I can't understand why, if you can offer a way for even a little more safety of your own child's health, not to mention the children around the children. I'm not sure why people are so against it.

Shots can hurt. That's for sure. However, I think there are several creative ways to make the experience less traumatic for the child. My sister took her kids to get shots she went with her husband and both kids. Knowing the oldest boy was getting a shot and the baby which she really is too young to truly understand. My sister and her husband(my sister's husband is Terrified, like faint causing terrified himself of blood, needles and anything, medically related). Went and got flu shots while my nephew got a certain vaccine. So my sister went first, than my brother in law then son but knowing mommy and daddy got it and was fine made it less scary for him, he had tears yes, but he wanted to show his sister he was very brave and it would be ok for his little sister.

Point is you can make a terrifying experience like shots less freighting for children. Sometimes creativeness makes it easier. And you get a sucker once you're done lol

dvdnvwls
01-06-16, 02:59 AM
Vaccinations are certainly not anywhere near a needless procedure, and it is not a "tough call" in any sense. Some states in the US are apparently blocking children from going to school until they have their vaccinations up to date, and I hope soon they all do that. Vaccines are essential for survival - if not your child's own survival, then someone else's in your community. But I hear you on wanting to find a better way, something that doesn't hurt.

Socaljaxs
01-06-16, 03:17 AM
Vaccinations are certainly not anywhere near a needless procedure, and it is not a "tough call" in any sense. Some states in the US are apparently blocking children from going to school until they have their vaccinations up to date, and I hope soon they all do that. Vaccines are essential for survival - if not your child's own survival, then someone else's in your community. But I hear you on wanting to find a better way, something that doesn't hurt.

But that's the thing. For a lot of people it is a tough call! OP stated right there that she feels she is betraying her child by doing it. For a mother to want to protect the child it hurts them to know they are forcing pain into them. Even if temporary.... I don't understand the why people don't. Interested to know the reasons for anti vaccines, but I do see people all over social media that are anti vaccination. So, there is a debate and a feeling of to do or not to do for people

Fuzzy12
01-06-16, 04:36 AM
Do vaccinate. You'd be betraying your child if you didn't. As adults we need to be able to see that the long term benefits greatly outweigh the short term unpleasantNess. The whole point of having a parent is that they don't think like children and can sensibly weigh up points and make long term decisions.

Delphine :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug:

To answer your question though: yes, I do tend to obsess about all kinds of things :)

Socaljaxs
01-06-16, 04:53 AM
So I started google searching why people are anti vaccine. Very interesting. Apparently, they (anti vaccine groups, make claims such as vaccines cause child to become autistic, die, epilepsy, and they have extreme side that believe fad cdc and Ada and all doctors are only for big pharma companies and the Children suffer because of this.. You ever get bored. Interesting conspiracy theories

dvdnvwls
01-06-16, 05:25 PM
That was my point. When something is "a tough call" (so called) only because of wild conspiracy theories that have long ago been proven false, then really it isn't a tough call at all. Anyone who makes even the tiniest effort to actually look at the facts, decides to have their children vaccinated.

Socaljaxs
01-07-16, 04:42 AM
That was my point. When something is "a tough call" (so called) only because of wild conspiracy theories that have long ago been proven false, then really it isn't a tough call at all. Anyone who makes even the tiniest effort to actually look at the facts, decides to have their children vaccinated.

Yes I'm those instances I agree sadly there are people that believe everything written on the Internet or on Wikipedia is true and a proven fact ..

Sadly that's just one group of people. There are others that believe medications of a child and for themselves included vaccines causes more health issues than prevents them.

I have a friend like this. She got strep throat and refused to get antibodics because the swears her immune system is weakened by medicine and that natural methods will make her healthier, since her body is forced to fight it with out any medication help

Unmanagable
01-07-16, 09:19 AM
I've been severely sickened by multiple vaccinations I've received in the past, repeatedly, most especially and most recently, the flu shot, and were I to give birth to a child, I would be one of the folks who would be looked down upon by you guys and not vaccinate, unless I was forced against my will. I would likely be open to a few of them, but certainly not ALL of them.

Being automatically considered comparable to the scum of the earth by others because I'm highly concerned about what "they" say is safe and effective, especially after experiencing anything but safety and effectiveness after allowing them to poke me once I was old enough to speak up for myself, gets old after a while. But not old enough for me to once again blindly and willingly accept them injecting foreign stuff that breaks down my immune system into my body.

I have many friends who choose not to, as well, and they've lived to ripe enough old age and in good health, thus far, and their kids that they've chosen not to vaccinate for every damn thing under the sun are healthier and more active than most, and they don't deal with as many allergies and picking up colds and flu bugs as frequently as others. Those living examples, in addition to my own experience, is all the proof I need to remain convinced that there's a lot more to the vaccine scene than we'll ever know for sure, as long as there's money to be made from them, especially.

I feel that on either side of the coin, if you've already made up your mind without being willing to look any further and deeper beyond what someone on the internet says, by reading factual and legitimate information from all sides, by looking into the ingredients and the effects they can have long term, and including the information shared by those who have experienced difficulties, and pay close attention the huge number of vaccinations now required vs. what may actually be necessary, you are doing yourself and your child a disservice.

It's a slippery slope to be on, especially if you aren't in agreement with the masses.

sarahsweets
01-07-16, 02:35 PM
I've been severely sickened by multiple vaccinations I've received in the past, repeatedly, most especially and most recently, the flu shot, and were I to give birth to a child, I would be one of the folks who would be looked down upon by you guys and not vaccinate, unless I was forced against my will. I would likely be open to a few of them, but certainly not ALL of them.
I dont like when anyone feels ostracized. It doesnt help anyone's point good or bad.

Being automatically considered comparable to the scum of the earth by others because I'm highly concerned about what "they" say is safe and effective
I hear this a lot. If we dont have vaccines, what other ideas do you have to control these diseases? And when you say "they" say its safe, what motivation do you think they have for promoting them?

I have many friends who choose not to, as well, and they've lived to ripe enough old age and in good health, thus far, and their kids that they've chosen not to vaccinate for every damn thing under the sun are healthier and more active than most, and they don't deal with as many allergies and picking up colds and flu bugs as frequently as others. They are very lucky.
Those living examples, in addition to my own experience, is all the proof I need to remain convinced that there's a lot more to the vaccine scene than we'll ever know for sure, as long as there's money to be made from them, especially.
I hear this a lot too. There is not as much money to be made off the vaccine market as you would think. They are made so cheaply that I cant see what company or officials would push them on people for money. I guess I just want to understand what you think the motivation is aside from money.

I feel that on either side of the coin, if you've already made up your mind without being willing to look any further and deeper beyond what someone on the internet says, by reading factual and legitimate information from all sides, by looking into the ingredients and the effects they can have long term, and including the information shared by those who have experienced difficulties, and pay close attention the huge number of vaccinations now required vs. what may actually be necessary, you are doing yourself and your child a disservice.
One vaccine that I think in hindsight may not have been necessary was the chicken pox one. i dont know if Im just ignorant but I had chicken pox and Im only 40 so it wasnt too long ago, and myself and all the school friends I had were ok. Maybe there is more too it.


I agree that research of all sides on the part of the parents is a must. I initially rejected the push for the hpv vaccines because I wasnt sure I understood all there was to know about them. I actually paid for some info from pub med to get my own info and came to the conclusion that preventing cervical cancer for my girls was worth it since it runs in our family. My son was 18 and he asked if he could be vaccinated for hpv. That was all on him. He read about the dangers of hpv for men and decided he wanted to get one. My son and oldest daughter are all done with the vaccine schedule for hpv and no one has had any single reaction or issue. My youngest got her first shot in the series a few months ago and shes ok so far. We all get the flu shot. Except my husband decided he didnt want to. I dont get it because he works at a university and the last time we all got the flu shot and he didnt, he got the flu. During the swine flu epidemic a few years back I did not funnel my kids into the school for that eerie school suggested vaccine clinic. My son caught the swine flu and was hospitalized before we left for disney world. I quickly chose to vaccinate the girls after that.
I am willing to listen to what people have to say because I just dont understand it but I am not in the business of condemning anyone for how they have experienced their life.

Tmoney
01-07-16, 04:49 PM
So the question is do we obsess over little things like this and not necessarily vaccination or whether we agree or not agree with your opinion.

For me the answer is Yes, absolutely I obsess over things like this. I won't call them little because to you and me and people like us it really isn't little regardless of what anyone else thinks.

However, it's only my opinion and I am not a professional or expert, but my obsession, to me, is caused more by my anxiety than my AD(H)D.

I have these obsessions about so many things I can make lists! What I have learned in my 46 years of diagnoses is to learn to handle them and live with them so they don't negatively effect my daily life. It's not easy and it takes time, patience and faith, but it is definitely doable!

I am not like other people, things that are in everyday life that people accept bother me and occupy my mind. I have to work at letting them go and focusing on the positive things instead.

I like making jokes of them and laughing about them. Yes inside they may be serious to me at first, but the key to letting go for me is turning it into something funny. There is a comedian who is a genius at this and he stars on my favorite sitcom. Jerry Seinfeld.

Seinfeld is my therapy. He takes things from everyday life like Doctors visits and renting a car or air travel and he makes fun of the annoying parts of them and for me it is medicine to my illness.

I wish good things for you

Delphine
01-07-16, 06:42 PM
Hands up here how many people ever had their own little baby in their hands that they had to present for the jab.

You see..... it's one thing to have an opinion on the matter.

It's quite another thing to have a tiny being in your hands that you are completely responsible for (even though you wonder how capable you are for making such decisions for another person.... especially a teensy newborn).

So... imagine that now your instinct is to protect this little being. Imagine that you doubt your own ability to look after yourself, let alone an innocent newbie.

Imagine you have read and read, and obsessed and obsessed about all the parameters... imagine how much you will maybe have informed yourself of both sides of the argument before making a decision ( and bear in mind that decisions, in themselves, are too often a challenge for you because you can see all sides of the argument!!)

Imagine that even if we are talking about minuscule probable 'damage' from vaccinations, then the mind of an ADHD person who has teensy, innocent baby in arms will automatically go 'flight, fight or freeze'.
(We're talking ADHD person with beloved babe in arms here...... we're not talking global armchair opinion of what-one-should-do-while-not-in-high.alert-mode....)

If I never had a baby, I would definitely say vaccinate, yes definitely... for the sake of our whole society.

When I was holding my own teensy babes in arms, I wobbled. But yes... I thought about it and vaccinated, for the good of all. (And because of long past family history of babies dying of all sorts.)

But I understand the dilemma. And I wouldn't want to deflect anyone else from their own instinct. BEFORE I held my own beloved babes in my arms at the doctors office, I would've had a black and white opinion about it.

Parental instinct is very powerful. And in the absence of knowing for sure, there is always that roll of the dice.

And that is your parental decision.... even if you cannot absolutely definitely say for sure.... that is why it is a 'tough call' - Nothing is easy here. xxx

Unmanagable
01-07-16, 11:12 PM
I hear this a lot too. There is not as much money to be made off the vaccine market as you would think. They are made so cheaply that I cant see what company or officials would push them on people for money. I guess I just want to understand what you think the motivation is aside from money.

Perhaps there is money to be made as a result of them being made so cheaply, just like the so called food is made quite cheaply, the supplements we're being sold and told are legit (not) are made quite cheaply, the generics are made quite cheaply, etc.......I see patterns.....and I've felt the results of connecting each of those dots within my own personal experiences and from observing others.

That's all I've got. My instincts have served me well in my decision making processes, most especially as of late, but I'm only human, too, so my potential to f*** up ranks right up there.

I can never accurately narrow down what anyone else's motives and intent are, it would just be speculation. Some things can also be a lot bigger than one reason could accurately cover. Who truly knows? And if they did, who would really believe them? lol

I just follow my gut and work really hard at trying to nurture it from all the damage it has sustained. I used to get sick as hell from the required shots I had to take for 13 years at my job. My body says no, and I'm tuned into it now more than ever.

Little Missy
01-08-16, 10:21 AM
I had whooping cough when I was 2 years old.

My parents were so frantic, my mum said my dad was ready to do a tracheotomy on me at home. :eek:

Mumps were a real drag. Only had one chicken pox mark so who knows if I ever really even had them.

I remember crying hysterically, throwing up and having to lay under a desk at the doctor's office panting so I wouldn't faint when my daughter had her innoculations.

SO glad that is over.

Until shingles set in.:eyebrow:

sarahsweets
01-11-16, 05:27 AM
I had whooping cough when I was 2 years old.

My parents were so frantic, my mum said my dad was ready to do a tracheotomy on me at home. :eek:

Mumps were a real drag. Only had one chicken pox mark so who knows if I ever really even had them.

I remember crying hysterically, throwing up and having to lay under a desk at the doctor's office panting so I wouldn't faint when my daughter had her innoculations.

SO glad that is over.

Until shingles set in.:eyebrow:

I bet you are bummed that you missed out on measles. ;)

Little Missy
01-11-16, 08:08 AM
I bet you are bummed that you missed out on measles. ;)

Yeah, never had those. :)

dvdnvwls
01-11-16, 04:26 PM
Imagine you have read and read, and obsessed and obsessed about all the parameters... imagine how much you will maybe have informed yourself of both sides of the argument before making a decision ( and bear in mind that decisions, in themselves, are too often a challenge for you because you can see all sides of the argument!!)
The trouble is, what we are talking about is not an "argument" with "sides". This is a simple case of reason vs superstition.

Delphine
01-11-16, 05:00 PM
True! Absolutely true..... But imagine.... if you'd obsessed and obsessed (because that was me).

As I've stated many times, when I was done obsessing :)..... my brain picked what was eventually obvious to me. (Deciding to vaccinate, for the good of all).

But, I thought we were talking about obsessing. Jeepers.... when it comes to obsessing, this is one of the subjects that really got me going.

(Obsessors, such as me, see all sides of the argument and can infinitely keep themselves going like the energiser bunny!!!!) xx

dvdnvwls
01-11-16, 07:17 PM
True! Absolutely true..... But imagine.... if you'd obsessed and obsessed (because that was me).

As I've stated many times, when I was done obsessing :)..... my brain picked what was eventually obvious to me. (Deciding to vaccinate, for the good of all).

But, I thought we were talking about obsessing. Jeepers.... when it comes to obsessing, this is one of the subjects that really got me going.

(Obsessors, such as me, see all sides of the argument and can infinitely keep themselves going like the energiser bunny!!!!) xx
I know... and if there is a legitimate dispute between potentially valid points of view, this ability to continue seeing all sides can be good or helpful or useful.

Example: There are people who claim to cure autism by making the child drink laundry bleach. It's another situation where one "side" of the "argument" is not valid, not even potentially (actually, of course, making a child drink bleach is harmful and stupid). Again, there is clearly not a valid argument going on there; feeding kids bleach is simply wrong, and everyone who hasn't been sucked in by the superstitious hype knows that. The anti-vaccine crowd is engaging in exactly the same kind of superstitious hype. Even being willing to call these types of discussions an "argument" with "sides" is giving far too much credit to the fear-and-hype-mongers.

dvdnvwls
01-11-16, 07:35 PM
I just remembered something that's kind of on topic here.

I've seen a smart and nasty bully (school age) who discovered that his target was anxious and tended to obsess, and so he decided to tell her distressing things (which were all false) just to hurt her.

That kind of bullying is exactly what the anti-vaccine fear mongers are doing.

ToneTone
01-11-16, 10:04 PM
I guess I have obsessions of various kinds, but I kinda talk or journal my way through them using techniques of cognitive behavior therapy.

A couple of points:

1. Pain does not always equal suffering ... and children can and do recover from the pain of a shot ... the problem is someone should have been there to hold your hand during the shot and to comfort and hug you afterwards ... and to congratulate you on taking a big step that could save your live and the lives of many others ...

2. The pain you endured for that moment of the shot is one millionth or one billionth of the amount of pain your parents or siblings would have experienced had you caught one of these horrible conditions and died of it or even experienced prolonged suffering as a result of it.

The issue I think is that you needed more support and nurture as you were preparing for the shot, during the shot and after the shot. I'm no fan of shots, but I've given blood because I saw doing so as meaningful. No one told you or helped you see and feel--really feel-- how meaningful the shot was ...

I do want to emphasize that a moment of pain is not prolonged suffering. Humans and children can be very resilient. There's something about the fact that you know the pain is coming that can spook some people. That's what makes it scary.

But anyone with a broken ankle will be in longer agony than anyone who takes a shot ... But in this case the lack of nurture left an emotional pain ..

Go to any old cemetery and you can see all the children that died as a result of diseases and flu and conditions that these vaccines now prevent. Vaccines really are one of humanity's and medicine's greatest achievements in the past 75 years or so ... And as I understand how they work, they simply trick the body into thinking that it is facing the condition, and the body's natural defenses strengthen. So that when a real exposure occurs, the body can fight off the condition because it has already built up some immune protection.

Good luck.

Tone

excelsior
01-14-16, 02:22 PM
I think they use different injection solutions, and with thinner needles, vaccinations aren't painful like they USED to be...