View Full Version : Happy Pink Shirt Day!


KarmanMonkey
02-24-16, 11:09 AM
http://pinkshirtday.ca/

Today in Canada people (especially men) are encouraged to wear pink as a sign of solidarity to eliminate bullying.

I'd like to open a discussion here about bullying, specifically how to reduce/eliminate it.

Wouldn't it be amazing to grow up in a world without bullies?

Personally I feel that the term 'bullying' diminishes what it is and furthers the idea that it's a normal part of childhood, and the "boys will be boys" attitudes... I think rather than calling it bullying, we need to call it what it is:

Assault
Abuse
Harassment
Discrimination

I'm sure there are other words. Until we take the issue seriously and show everyone the real and permenant damage that is done, real change will be impossible.

Thoughts?

Lunacie
02-24-16, 01:25 PM
Let's say there's some guy strutting around a college campus with a knife, randomly sticking some other guy that looks distracted or weak.

Instead of bringing in the police, the admins tell these guys to stand up to the "bully" and defend themselves.

The emotional wounds of being bullied are just as real and can take even longer to heal than the stab wounds do.

KarmanMonkey
02-24-16, 02:07 PM
I have always loathed the "blame the victim" mentality that so often gets attached to bullying.

Fuzzy12
02-24-16, 02:12 PM
Let's say there's some guy strutting around a college campus with a knife, randomly sticking some other guy that looks distracted or weak.

Instead of bringing in the police, the admins tell these guys to stand up to the "bully" and defend themselves.

The emotional wounds of being bullied are just as real and can take even longer to heal than the stab wounds do.

Wow..seriously??? Is that how most admins react???? Is that how any admins react?????

Standing up to a bully with a knife??? That is insane. Poor, poor kids. The workplace is an oasis of peace compared to that.

Lunacie
02-24-16, 02:27 PM
Wow..seriously??? Is that how most admins react???? Is that how any admins react?????

Standing up to a bully with a knife??? That is insane. Poor, poor kids. The workplace is an oasis of peace compared to that.

No.

I was saying that the admins respond differently to a knife or gun as a weapon than they do when the weapon is words or demeaning actions.

And that is a very real shame and problem.

We don't want another Columbine or whatever tragedy you can point out, but everyday the tragedy of bullying continues with authority turning a blind eye ...

and yes, blaming the victim for not standing up to the bully.

Fuzzy12
02-24-16, 02:30 PM
Oh...ok. And yeah, I agree. Bullying should be taken seriously. I still find every work place that I've worked in more pleasant and socially less stressful than school. It's so sad that kids have to deal with this. I'm sure it causes lots of long term damage.

KarmanMonkey
02-24-16, 05:10 PM
So how do we change it? How do we create a culture where behaving like a bully no longer carries rewards? How do we stop bullying that we see? What's the best way for someone who's bullied to respond?

Little Missy
02-24-16, 05:12 PM
So how do we change it? How do we create a culture where behaving like a bully no longer carries rewards? How do we stop bullying that we see? What's the best way for someone who's bullied to respond?

My dad used to pay the neighbor kids to beat them up.

midnightstar
02-24-16, 05:20 PM
I think the only way to teach bullies that it's not acceptable to bully is to segregate them away from everyone else and let them bully each other.

For example one school I was at I had a whole gang of bullies come after me and all the school did was say oh dear what a shame and tut at the bullies, they didn't get detention or have the police speaking to them or anything. There were two ringleaders, the others were "hangers-on". I remember I got physically attacked by one of the ringleaders one time and the school didn't give a crap.

Little Missy
02-24-16, 05:25 PM
I think the only way to teach bullies that it's not acceptable to bully is to segregate them away from everyone else and let them bully each other.

For example one school I was at I had a whole gang of bullies come after me and all the school did was say oh dear what a shame and tut at the bullies, they didn't get detention or have the police speaking to them or anything. There were two ringleaders, the others were "hangers-on". I remember I got physically attacked by one of the ringleaders one time and the school didn't give a crap.

Too bad you didn't live in my olde neighbourhood way back when. My dad took care of all the kids. :)

Lunacie
02-24-16, 06:09 PM
So how do we change it? How do we create a culture where behaving like a bully no longer carries rewards? How do we stop bullying that we see? What's the best way for someone who's bullied to respond?

I think there needs to be an understanding of the long-term effects of having been bullied.

There needs to be an understanding that words and actions can be just as harmful as weapons.

It needs to be taken seriously as an assault, and prosecuted.

But there needs to be more community service and less imprisonment.

BellaVita
02-24-16, 09:35 PM
I once read an article about the "benefits of bullying" or something like that, like how getting bullied can help you grow and increase social skills and encourage people to work together and it was SO full of crap...

I agree bullying can cause so much harm.

KentUnknown
02-24-16, 09:40 PM
Canada. What a great place.

aeon
02-25-16, 12:43 AM
What's the best way for someone who's bullied to respond?

Based on my own experience, after trying everything else and not having any of it work, strong violence achieved results and stopped the bullying for good.

I donít like saying that, but thatís my truth.

---

For months, almost a year, a kid in my school would prank call my house at odd hours of the morning, e.g., 3:00am, most nights of the week.

This angered my parents, and eventually I started being punished for that kidís behavior...the usual stuff...being beaten, denied food, and so on.

I asked the kid to stop...nothing. I asked his older brother...nothing. I asked at school...nothing. I asked the police...nothing. I asked the phone company...nothing.

One day (after almost a year) I reached my point of no return.

I knocked him down and then used the cast on my (broken-but-healing) left arm to beat him with.

I will spare you the details save to say that his injuries were grievous, he did not get up on his own, and he required surgery.

He never bullied me again, and for that matter, everyone else who bullied me stopped doing so as well.

Profound violence got results that worked when nothing else did.

I donít feel good about saying that, but it was true for me.

Also, by choosing violence once, it stopped a repeating pattern of violence in my home...the pattern related to that kidís pattern of behavior, that is.

Thatís one of two times I have been violent in my life.

The other time was in stopping a rape.


Namaste,
Ian

dvdnvwls
02-25-16, 12:52 AM
Thanks Ian.

It is sometimes said "Don't stoop to the bully's level". Far too often, that is horrible advice. Unfortunately, in general, bullies do not have another ("higher") level at which they are capable of being engaged. Of course, it is hoped that they will develop that "higher" level at some point; but "at some point" is irrelevant to the present.

BellaVita
02-25-16, 01:42 AM
I'm so thankful I wasn't bullied much in school, my brother got bullied and called names lots though and that really hurt to watch....he was on prednisone to treat his Crohn's and it made him gain weight, so lots of people called him "fat" and other nasty things.. :( (I was more "invisible"/girl who didn't talk much more than anything.)

One time though(middle school), a guy called me the b-word, and I then took all of my strength and courage and slapped him across the face. He didn't call me any names after that.

Lunacie
02-25-16, 10:10 AM
Based on my own experience, after trying everything else and not having any of it work, strong violence achieved results and stopped the bullying for good.

I donít like saying that, but thatís my truth.

---



Thatís one of two times I have been violent in my life.

The other time was in stopping a rape.


Namaste,
Ian

When I was a kid I don't think I could have won in a fist fight.

My little sister could beat me up, and she was 5 years younger.

All she had to do was knock my glasses off and then I couldn't aim properly.
---
Bravo to you for stopping a rape. I don't know how I would do that, but I would certainly try.

aeon
02-25-16, 09:10 PM
Bravo to you for stopping a rape. I don't know how I would do that, but I would certainly try.

Thank you. I used a piece of rebar combined with a stealthy approach so as to have a chance to strike both men. I was able to, and this allowed the young woman to run away. Neither of the men ever saw me.

Taking action, and violent action at that, when triggered and seeing red, is a terrible, terrible thing.


Namaste,
Ian

Lunacie
02-25-16, 09:25 PM
Thank you. I used a piece of rebar combined with a stealthy approach so as to have a chance to strike both men. I was able to, and this allowed the young woman to run away. Neither of the men ever saw me.

Taking action, and violent action at that, when triggered and seeing red, is a terrible, terrible thing.


Namaste,
Ian

No doubt both you and the young woman had some PTSD from that. :grouphug:

aeon
02-25-16, 09:39 PM
No doubt both you and the young woman had some PTSD from that. :grouphug:

Her, I am sure...and I feel sad when I think about that.

Me, not so much from the external experience, but absolutely from my internal experience of the things I felt, which were very, very dark.


Blessťd Be,
Ian

KarmanMonkey
02-26-16, 09:44 AM
Often (though hardly always) a bully learns the behaviour from others... That's how they learn to react to situations, to deal with any issue that comes their way. So you're right; they don't know how to communicate on a higher level.

Bullies can be taught about their behaviour, but it can't be the person being bullied to do it using a "higher" level of communication.

My experience was the same; I was bullied for years in the "blame the victim" era, where I kept being told I just needed to stop reacting and they'd stop targetting me. What utter BS that was! All my stopping reacting did was to convey my silent consent for the treatment they were giving me. It also caused me to retreat farther and farther into myself and wind myself so tight with emotion that I considered suicide.

The day I finally had enough and decked one of my bullies was the last day I was bullied.

Unmanagable
02-26-16, 10:11 AM
I was bullied by kids in school because of my weight. I hated school because of it. All of my struggles were looked at as me simply being a hard headed and rebellious child, so I was forever being told to "straighten up and fly right", and all the other nauseating and demeaning cliches that built up a massive wall of shame and rejection.

Then when I hit 13, I experienced sexual abuse, and again in my later teens. I feel being bullied all those earlier years made me fearful of speaking out because I felt I'd get blamed for that, too, and never told anyone. I held it ALL in for decades, until just recently, actually, and the abusive cycle continued up into my early 30's.

I finally found some of my self-worth that had been buried so long, with the help of some very generous and kind souls who taught me how to love myself again and how to ask for and accept meaningful help.

I responded violently on many occasions during those years, depending on the occasion. My life was on the line in more incidents than I'd like to remember, and I was quick to jump to the aid of another, regardless of the consequences.

The first violent response was in high school when a girl who liked to pick on others just to get a rise out of them came up to me accusing me of looking at her boyfriend in the cafeteria.

I ignored her and kept walking away from her, until she shoved me. Then I grabbed her up by her hair (it was down to her waist), wrapped it around my wrist, and flung her over my back somehow. She never said another word. Ran into her a couple years ago and she had really short hair, and she's a hair stylist. I had to chuckle a little.

The bully mentality I encountered in the workplace, a state owned facility, was off the hook, too. Most especially when I spoke up about ethical wrongdoing, with concrete proof in hand and a very determined spirit. They get vicious and squash souls and stuff, but no one ever believes the victim. That was why I had to resign. Power speaks and hushes all others.

They sent me to my four free sessions of counseling provided by the insurance plan, "To get our key employee back in the game, because there's clearly something not right, and we want to support you in all the ways we can."

Had I snapped instead of resigning, they would have said, "She was seeking mental health services, we don't know what was wrong." Think about that next time you see a headline of someone "going postal", etc. Headlines are made to sell media, stories rarely get accurately reflected, especially in tragedy.

Many days, it feels like society as a whole is one big bully to me. Grateful to be able to still hold onto some hope amongst the BS. Grateful for those who bring the uncomfortable things into the light.

dvdnvwls
02-26-16, 03:03 PM
So, further to my comment above about the bad old advice "don't stoop to the bully's level"...

Since then, there have been several examples that (in a twisted sort of way) actually end up proving the truth of that old misinformation. I know this is extreme use of anecdotal reports, but I find it interesting. In each of the cases where the bullying was ended satisfactorily, what the victim (or helper of the victim) did was indeed exactly that - not stooping to the bully's level. What all the successful ones did was temporarily stoop below the bully's level ("below" in the strategic sense only - for example, sneak attack from behind with a weapon is strategically a pretty nasty move), take definitive action at that level, and then resume being themselves. The ones who only stooped just as low as the bully was, and those who kept to "the high road", had less success in changing the circumstances.