I've read a few things on the web which say that ADHD could actually be Narcissistic Personality Disorder - but nothing I've read really explains why. It seems to me that ADHD and NPD are so totally different. I'd be grateful if anyone could explain the theory behind this or provide a link which explains the connections etc.

Actually they are opposites. The NPD person does not have self and requires very strong cultural understandings to pull the full view of self from people around him/her. There is a very strong tendency towards role patterning and status seeking. People are status objects and sources of adoration.

The people that the Narcissist brings into their lives are only there as "supply". The narcissist will do anything to keep them in their life. If they remove their adoration from the narcissist, he/she will often turn violent.

The narcissist often does not have original ideas. They will grab onto the ideas of their supply and make them their own. ADD people constantly create new ideas.

ADD people are often the targets of the narcissist!



How would they be confused?

1. ADD is confused with every known type of "cultural" disorder. This is due to the nature of it *not being a disorder* in and of itself, but a cognitive type that has many challenges. (my view)

2. Most ADD people need context in order to understand their place in the world. (Most people know their place) Constant feedback is required for this. It often mimics mild narcissism. (Women often get the histrionic label)

3. Because we have lives of trying to fit in, there is sometimes and appearance that we are showoffs, or selfish. We just do not understand the rules. The narcissist does and uses them to get "supply".

How are ADD and NPD vastly different?

1. The narcissist has no self so he/she needs other people to tell them who they are. ADD people are filled with self, we need people to tell us "where we are"



2. The narcissist plays a very dishonest game to get supply. Targets are found, then the narcissist clings to them. The narcissist will be full of compliments that are not heartfelt. ADD people are usually too honest or are bad liars. We often give heartfelt compliments and statements that are considered rude (The narcissist is almost never rude)

3. The narcissist is hollow with a "glittery, shiny outside" ADDers are often unpolished with a "glittery, shiny, inside"

4. The narcissist is a creature of culture. The ADD person is often on the outside of culture.

I think it is the view that people who have full selves are somehow arrogant, therefore NPD...NPD has no self. Self, in the end is what is created in the mirror of other people's faces.



Serious Warning!

ADD attracts NPD!

ADD people often have many many run-ins with this type of person. The NPD type is very attracted to ADD. Lack of self sees full of self and runs for it. ADD is easily pulled in by this type. They seem shiny... They learn how to shine for you. We are an incredible source of supply and adoration.

Warning signs:
1. They play the victim constantly. Everyone is out to get them.
2. You get very hyperfocused on them...trying to find the person in the glitter
3. People you would not normally find interesting are fascinating...this is due the ability on the part of the narcissist to lure people in based on their "needs".
4. The narcissist will turn a very self sufficient ADD person into a love devoted slave.
5. They will get viciously angry (many times violent) when you withdraw...
6. The narcissist usually has a theme of self image that does not match deeds at all (earth mother who does not care about recycling, a caring father... who spends no time with his children... a very smart man who has no ideas of his own....look for these strong oppositions!
7. They tend to know many facts (in order to look smart) but can not tie them together


Finally, if you are in a relationship with a narcissist, run! They will suck you dry.

Here is the link to my model that shows where NPD lies on the continuum as predicted in my model.


http://www.contextualmind.org/wiki/index.php/IRCM

<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p> </o:p>There’s the obvious point that both ADHD and NPD sufferers can often seem self absorbed but I think that’s probably the only similarity. I was actually told by an analyst that I had Narcissistic Personality Disorder. He went on to say that ADHD didn’t exist and as far as I remember put it all down to children rebelling against their mothers who they loved/hated. I think most therapists don’t like the idea that “mind problems" may have a neurological basis.

Chain, I can't get the link to your website to work

Yep... I am trying to fix it. I have a problem in my wiki :)

If you want to read more about narcissism I also suggest visiting Dr. Sam Vaknin's site on Narcissism. He is himself a diagnosed narcissist and you will see the tendencies he describes about the NPD reflected in his own website.

I have personally had a run in with both a male and a female narcissist and I can smell them coming. They are not like people with ADD, and not anything like my best friend with ADHD or my cousin with ADD who are incredibly sweet and thoughtful people.

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq1.html

Chain,

That is a very clear and cogent explanation

Thank you so much

Thanks Chain. Your post is so comforting to read. Right before my diagnosis of ADHD, I truely thought I was narcissistic. It was very disturbing. Then my psychiatrist diagnosed me as ADHD. I started reading up on ADHD and everything about my life started to make sense. From childhood to the present.

I like the section about being honest. I can not lie. If I do, which is almost never, I feel so guilty I have to come clean.

Thanks Chain. Your post is so comforting to read. Right before my diagnosis of ADHD, I truely thought I was narcissistic. It was very disturbing. Then my psychiatrist diagnosed me as ADHD. I started reading up on ADHD and everything about my life started to make sense. From childhood to the present.

I like the section about being honest. I can not lie. If I do, which is almost never, I feel so guilty I have to come clean.
I had the same exact experience! This is a problem with DSM and psychology. They describe behaviors out of context. The context of AD/HD is vast! It is more vast than many people who are not AD/HD. So that little list of "symptoms" that cues a doctor into AD/HD does not lead them to the full understanding.

As AD/HD people...we have a tendancy to read everything we can... we are "self builders" because "self" is not given to us by the culture...We constantly look for flaws that need to be mended and psychology texts are sooo attractive, but they can be poison. Yes we do show behaviors that seem narcissistic but they are very soft in comparison. I have not met an ADDer yet who was not a compassionate soul... even the very angry ones end up caring... There are some people that, because the DSM is so vague, are not what I call IRCM but are diagnosed as ADD.

Some of them are narcissistic or sociopathic... they are distracted not because they are building context of their environment but because they are searching for supply or prey. These are quite rare... but always be on the lookout :)