View Full Version : I think found the mysterious simple Vyvanse booster & missing link to inconsiseffecti


QuasarMind
06-12-16, 01:00 PM
Hi,

I am not ready for a official report and recommendation as I have not thoroughly tested this theory, but by accident I think I maybe found a way to make Vyvanse more consistent and effective on a daily basis. I have discovered and thoroughly tested that food eaten within 3-3.5 hours of taking Vyvanse will have a massive reduction in Vyvanse effectiveness and duration. I finally exercised more discipline by not eating morning food and set my first of two alarms to take Vyvanse with approx 6-8 oz of water and have had much better results but still felt the 70mg (300lb body weight) wasn't strong enough. Well, a little over a week ago I got a bottle of Rolaids Advanced for less than $4 at Walmart. Now I heard here PPI's, in particular Prilosec can reduce Vyvanse effects for a unknown reason even though in theory an antiacid should help. Well, while I honestly bought the Vyvanse for stomach discomfort, I started taking 2-3 with my Vyvanse and another 2, 2-hours hours later and didn't think much of it. In the middle of the week I noticed my Vyvanse had been working very well and it continued to work perfectly until today, when I took no Rolaids. Now, today it is 3 hours into my Vyvanse but for the prior week I noticed the first effect at 1.5 hours and full effect just a little past 3 hours. I can tell today is going to be a "mucky" somewhat brain-dead day compared to the past week and I got plenty of sleep last night.

Now this is definitely far from "evaluated" but I wanted others to try it with me. I did some research and calcium carbonate is listed to have a "moderate" interaction with Vyvanse as it supposedly increases absorption and effect.

Now I would point out I have been taking more daily than the label recommends, but it says 2-3 at a time no more than 7 daily. They taste quite good and they improve stomach comfort, so I take them throughout the day, but my "morning" method seems to be within manufacturer recommendation. To avoid moderator trouble and advise common sense, I suggest asking your doctor for the maximum safe window of dosing and intervals. Upon doing my own research, I would advise against anyone exceeding the 7 tab per 24hr Rolaids/calcium carbonate intake with out requesting doctor's permission and blood/kidney tests thereafter sustained intake. From my interpretation of reading about 10 articles, I gather that potential toxicity is from daily buildup and not peak concentrations, say from morning doses only but that is what I call amateurish medicine.

I am going to spend the next two weeks testing my new potential discovery but I ask that others do this with me.

As for my "food theory", I have found it, at least with myself to be certain fact. Virtually and food intake within the first 3 hours if taking Vyvanse severely decreases effectiveness and duration. Very thoroughly tested on myself but I have found a few people in the history of this forum to reach the same result while others swear food helps Vyvanse but I personally suspect they haven't properly tested both methods. Keep in mind, food may effect your results also.

It is very plausible that the Rolaids Advanced when taking Vyvanse with morning fasting will alleviate stomach discomfort for those having trouble using the 3-hour food abstinence after taking Vyvanse to increase effectiveness.

Rolaids Advanced also has simethicone which I presume has no effect on the Vyvanse, but for the sake of being consistent with the expirmenting I request of others, I ask you also use Rolaids Advanced just like me. If I recall correctly, Rolaids Advanced casts $3.84 for 60 tabs at Walmart. It was not generic, but the price was roughly the same as the generics without simethicone. The Rolaids Advanced color makes them look like they will taste like crap but I found them to be quite tasty and honestly more habit forming than amphetamine medicines.

Roundmouth
06-12-16, 02:10 PM
I can't find that specific pill over here. But there are quite a few different ones containing calcium carbonate and magnesium in different forms.

I've also heard that sodium bicarbonate creates a friendly environment for stimulants.

Taking the Vyvanse after eating, would that be as bad as taking it right before?

QuasarMind
06-12-16, 02:53 PM
Taking the Vyvanse after eating, would that be as bad as taking it right before?

Definitely the same. I did some research a while back and food from the average meal takes about 4 hours to half-way dissipate in the stomach it's self. I haven't done as much testing as I generally take Vyvanse in the morning but I found the threshold to be around 5 hours before being safe to take Vyvanse after food

C15H25N3O
06-12-16, 05:12 PM
I have the best effectiveness nearly not feeling but recognizing it very weak and subtle on only 35mg when I eat 1-2h before sleeping and having absolutely no food but drinking on its effectivness which last minimum 13 hours or until I eat healty. My weight decreased 11 kg in 2 months. I had a blood screening but no call and advice from my physician to eat multiple meals like before. I have full energy on Vyvanse and feel greater from day to day. Vyvanse is a eat intake reducing bootcamp punishing me with loss of effectiveness and side effects like sleepiness for eating with no need while it is working.

It depends on the activity and the kind of food (lean/rich) we eat how fast it leaves the stomach. A pure toast or some sweeties or a banana spend fast energy faster absorbed than 4 hours from the gut but killing my effectiveness after 1-2 hours. Comparing our experiment results i now dare to bet it is making a thin film on the intestinal gut (that could also have an effect on the guts flora kinds of bacteria) which is not removed by drinking water but eating removes most of the film from the guts skin which reduces absorbtion/metabolizing (why I become sleepy) and moves the LDX further on in the gut building another film (why the effectiveness come back for me after 2 hours but not 100%). The film seems not to be removed from the guts skin by water. I also would bet I have to increase my 35mg to 40mg after to less sleep or binging after its main effectiveness or drinking too much water while the intake if the guts flooding meets the food from last night.

You have been on Adderall which is kicking in. Does Vyvanse also kick in or do you just feel it or do you only recognize it very subtle?

I have a subtile but perfect effect after 1 hour improving all symptoms and I can feel it without food at its 3-4h peak instead of lunch which is a short period of overdosage in the meaning of a subtle effect before and after. Than it becomes subtle again.

I remember reading anytime that too much calcium can cause kidney stones. I had one 20 years ago. This pain hurt like hell Take care and stay safe with you experiments on calcium carbonate. I think its better not to experiment with basic/acid pH supplementing but food reduction because Vyvanse is also prescribed in binge eating.

Starting with Vyvanse I had severe sleepiness and twice real ugly sensitive crap as side effects after 8 hours forcing me to lay down why I bought a pack of pH-test stripes for some bucks and my urine was always basic for 6-8 hours and became acidic after that rapidly while I experienced the effectiveness coming back after 10 hours later with an strong impact and bang than DEX kicking in. My urine was not basic after 10 hours. Another 1-2 hours later i felt a crashing withdraw which I dont have anymore but I feel natural tired from the day and from eating and the one meal by night makes me tired enough to sleep. So I dont need any sleeping pills.

I continued drinking each liter of water with 300mg HQ Magnesium since my prescription of Ritalin.

I am finished with experimenting for while – until i hit an athletic weight – and might have to rise the dose combined with more eating.

spunky84
06-25-16, 12:58 AM
I remember reading anytime that too much calcium can cause kidney stones. I had one 20 years ago. This pain hurt like hell Take care and stay safe with you experiments on calcium carbonate. I think its better not to experiment with basic/acid pH supplementing but food reduction because Vyvanse is also prescribed in binge eating.



Yes, please do be careful! If you're going to, please at least see your doctor for regular monitoring. Too much calcium carbonate can cause an electrolyte imbalance (hypercalcemia and hypophosphatemia) as well as a change in blood pH levels that are very dangerous.

I think it does sound interesting how calcium carbonate is increasing the effects of Vyvanse, but please consider doing this under the supervision of your doctor if you're going to continue onward.

C15H25N3O
06-25-16, 07:47 AM
Why should anyone ask the physician for supervision to use an uncontrollable and obviously unhealthy chemical dysbalance to increase effectiveness of a controlled medication? Sorry, almost this idea is ADHD. It is not yet abuse but it looks like there is another not satisfying dysbalance either caused by a too low dosage of medication or by an upcoming wish for a stronger impact. You better talk to your physician for an individual dosage adjustment leaving the standard of 10mg steps.

The more sleep before medication and the less food but drinking while medication brings out the best subtle and longest lasting effectiveness of Vyvanse.

What is at least unsatisfying you guys with Vyvanse?

What is the effect you miss from Vyvanse?

I recognize a "not so good" effect on making decisions.

spunky84
06-25-16, 06:13 PM
Why should anyone ask the physician for supervision to use an uncontrollable and obviously unhealthy chemical dysbalance to increase effectiveness of a controlled medication?

If someone is going to do anything that is dangerous, if you're going to do it regardless, it's still worth getting labs done. Those that suffer from bulimia are at great risk for an electrolyte imbalances. The majority don't go for routine blood work as they aren't in a place, usually, to get help or anything, but there are those who are especially at high risk that do go for routine blood work.

I had suffered hypokalemia. My symptoms were severe (one of the scariest moments of my life especially considering I couldn't use my phone to call 911 because I couldn't use my hands/fingers, nor would I have been able to talk because my lips had gone numb and could barely move them to speak). I eventually learned to replace my electrolytes and watch for symptoms, but even just watching for symptoms or replacing electrolytes doesn't mean much in the long run. I may not have symptoms, but even just being slightly below normal could have me in cardiac arrest without warning.

There are people that suffer from bulimia that do get routine blood work done to watch their electrolytes. Obviously the best thing to do would to be recover and not engage in the disorder, but not everyone is at that point (and even in recovery, there could still be issues as many can't just quit cold turkey and start by reducing the number of times until they eventually quit all together).


I'm sure there are other ways around the issue with Vyvanse - talking to your doctor would be absolutely the best thing to do. However, there are people that are going to take large amounts short term (or long term) or even normal amounts long term regardless of the potential consequences. They should still at least be aware of the risks. I'm sure my doctor wouldn't be happy if I did this, but if I did, I'm not sure I'd be willing to do this without having routine blood work to make sure my electrolyte levels are stable.

Calcium isn't just for bones and teeth. It plays a vital role in nerves, muscle contraction (including the heart), and blood clotting.

Calcium and phosphate are inverse of each other. If calcium goes up, phosphate goes down. From what I understand, with the over consumption of calcium carbonate, even if resulting in hypercalemia, it doesn't mean you'll end up with hypophosphatemia, but why take that chance? Hypophosphatemia also affects the heart and can cause respiratory depression. There are also serious consequences to alterations in blood pH that are outside the normal range. People die from electrolyte imbalances. People die from acidosis and alkalosis.

Yes, it'd be better to discuss with a doctor a better way to manage whether it be a dose change or med change, but if someone is going to do something regardless, they should at least be made aware of the potential risks and consider being monitored by their physician. Not everyone is aware of what could happen.

The OP may decide to continue with the calcium carbonate and decide not to have his lab values monitored. That's his prerogative, but maybe he isn't aware of the potential complications. In the event that he is aware or whether he cares or not, this topic could be read by many, members or not. Many may try it. They deserve to know the risks. Even if they know the risks, it may not occur to everyone to get your labs monitored. So I don't think it's out of line to suggest doing so under a doctor's supervision if someone absolutely insists on doing it.

Lunacie
06-25-16, 06:33 PM
I would think that Rolaids would increase the effect of the Vyvanse at first, but it would wear off sooner than without the Rolaids.

I agree that if you're chasing the feeling (the euphoria) you're looking for the wrong kind of effect.

C15H25N3O
06-25-16, 07:24 PM
Reviews from 2015 and 2016 indicated that TAAR1-selective agonists have significant therapeutic potential as a treatment for psychostimulant addictions;
however, as of February 2016, the only compounds which are known to function as TAAR1-selective agonists are experimental drugs.
Amphetamine addiction is largely mediated through increased activation of dopamine receptors and co-localized NMDA receptors in the nucleus accumbens;
magnesium ions inhibit NMDA receptors by blocking the receptor calcium channel.
One review suggested that, based upon animal testing, pathological (addiction-inducing) psychostimulant use significantly reduces the level of intracellular magnesium throughout the brain.
Supplemental magnesium treatment has been shown to reduce amphetamine self-administration (i.e., doses given to oneself) in humans,
but it is not an effective monotherapy for amphetamine addiction.

I am used to adding magnesium and I dont have any difference if I take it or not.
I am taking magnesium for over 15 years as I found out I need it. When i was prescribed to ritalin i needed daily magnesium.

I never abused amphetamines.

Just wondering if something is not correct in my neurochemics or if addiction changes minerals functions

... or my magnesium intake indeed reduces any amphetamine self-administration

The ADHD Fan
06-30-16, 10:41 PM
I think adding magnesium to boost medication effectiveness is somewhat of a crapshoot. I know some people swear by it while others see no positive effects. One of the main reasons is that magnesium is one of the most diversely-used minerals in the body (along with iron and zinc) and is part of so many different pathways.

One interesting bonus of magnesium is that it may help clean up some of the free radicals and other damaging agents that are sometimes higher in people with ADHD either due to ADHD itself or the stimulant medications. There definitely is some type of interaction, and stimulants have been shown to change the magnesium/calcium balance in the blood (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7761553).

It's also interesting that boosting magnesium intake may help offset some other conditions that are seen in the ADHD population more than the general population, such as Tourette's (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11863398).

Magnesium can also offset some of the negative effects of too much sugar (high fructose corn syrup) in the diet, especially in males. I know with some of the students I worked with, this was always a concern!

If any of you decide to give magnesium a shot, it might be a good idea to pair it with vitamin B6 (http://www.jle.com/fr/revues/mrh/e-docs/improvement_of_neurobehavioral_disorders_in_childr en_supplemented_with_magnesium_vitamin_b6_268529/article.phtml).

In the end, I think it all really comes down to chemical pathways in the body and whether your particular situation involves a magnesium deficiency or something completely different. I am interested in this mineral though, and would have to read more up on the subject!

~*anastacia*~
07-03-16, 09:44 AM
Hi all, I'm new to this forum so hopefully my first post works as planned:

I was diagnosed with ADHD inattentive/impulsive in Feb of this year at the age of 32 (female). I was prescribed Concerta over a 4 month period starting at 36mg, increased to 72mg for 2 months, then a final month at 108mg until I was switched over to Vyvanse last week due to being overstimulated some days and no effects others.

I have noticed with both meds a level of "crashing" when it wears off, more evident with Concerta, and some irritability, again most with Concerta. When I noticed the effects of Concerta, I started researching as much as possible to lessen the crash when the med wears off, also any info on how to regulate the medication better in my system via foods and supplements. I have a health science background, so was able to research adequately.

I have somewhat tailored a schedule through trial and error that seems to buffer the side effects, and enhance the med effects on days when needed. As one poster mentioned, and which I agree completely, is that each individual is different in physiology and we will require adjustments based on needs. The schedule is as follows:

Upon waking
1 tsp sea salt mixed with water (premade night before)
1 tsp baking soda mixed with water
30 minutes later Vyvanse dose @ 50mg

I have found eating protein and fats (fish oils) for breakfast seems to be the best method to assist the medication to work optimally for neurotransmitter function. I usually cannot stomach solid foods in the AM, so have a protein shake instead. With this I take zinc, B5, and iron supplements as these are known to be low in people with ADHD.

Meds usually wear off around 2pm, or taper down (same with Concerta). There are days when I need more focus later in the day because of studying or my night job so I have added in acetyl l carnitine for more energy or alpha gpc for concentration (depending on the need for the evening). Time is dependent on schedule or how I feel. Sometimes these are added during the day, if needed. I also use a supplement with ginko and bakopa for exam time for memory retention. No ill effects with any, though ACLAR seems to amp up body temp and irritability slightly.

In the early evening, when the "crash" is beginning, I will have green tea for the l-theanine to relax me but provide some caffeine. I also try to have a big dinner of meat/fats/veg because I find I don't have an appetite during the day or am turned off by certain foods based on smell. I will end some nights with an epsom salts bath, and always try to be in a cozy environment (i.e. bed with book). I also take magnesium citrate before bed to help with sleeping.

I drink about 1L of mineral water during the day, on top of uber amounts of more water because I get dehydrated quickly if I don't stay on top of it. I also try to eat foods that will stabilize my blood sugar and prevent inflammation in the GI, as I have IBS. The days I eat gluten or refined sugar I find my head fuzz, as I put it, that I experience the following day highly counteracts the effects of the medication. I have also noticed caffeine causes increased irritability or puts me in zombie mode shortly after drinking it.

So far this schedule seems to work pretty accurately. Aside from adding in exercise here and there, and limiting the amount of stress I expose myself too, I have been able to manage better. I will most likely have to start a two dose per day regime later down the road I'm sure, but this system works in between doc appts. Hopefully my research is helpful :)