View Full Version : Overwhelmed with guilt.


Greyhound1
01-19-17, 01:53 AM
***Trigger Warning***
This thread is about the killing of animals. Please be aware this is a sensitive topic. Post to follow soon after this warning.

Greyhound1
01-19-17, 02:37 AM
I am sorry to bring up this subject and it brings me great pain. I have to write about this because hopefully, I can move past it.

Here's the problem. Recently, we moved back into our old home which we had been renting out for the past 8 years. The house took a beating with tenants and poor property management. We have been working on it for the last 3 mos. and also spent too much money. We are working to get it ready to put up for sale soon.

The problem is we recently discovered that not all the tenants had moved out. We heard scratching sounds in our walls at night. It was freaking me out and keeping me up all night. The first night it was in the living room. The next night was in the kitchen and then 2 nights in a row, I heard it in the bedroom walls.

I knew it had to be a mouse. Reluctantly, I set 4 mouse traps in the basement. The next morning all the traps were sprung and had 2 dead mice. Yuk! I also have OCD and the germ aspect of mice in my bedroom walls freaks me out.

Last night I set the traps again and got 2 more. I just set them again tonight and dreading the results in the morning.

I am struggling because I really hate killing animals. I feel guilty as hell because those mice are just being mice and I totally feel justified at the same time. I can't share a house with mice and I don't see them buying it. I hate having to do what I feel, I have to do.

I just can't stop thinking about the poor mice I've killed and feeling guilty even though the rational part of my mind says kill em all. I keep seeing the images of the dead mice in the traps.

I have also checked and repaired any possible points of entry into the house and basement that I can find. It just really sucks having to do this but I am glad to get that off my chest.

I am an animal lover and I really hope this didn't upset or offend anyone.

Fuzzy12
01-19-17, 02:58 AM
Will write more later but first::grouphug:

psychopathetic
01-19-17, 03:10 AM
((((((((((((((Hounds))))))))))))))

What a tough situation. I couldn't be comfortable living with wild mice either though.

My parents have had to deal with mice in their place. I don't think it would've been so bad had it not been for the fact that my parent's couldn't use any of the bottom cupboards to store food or dishes/pots and pans. But the mice would chew through boxes and bags and poop and pee on all the dishes...and that's not only really gross, but with all the germs and diseases they can potentially carry...it was quite dangerous as well.

My dad didn't enjoy having to get rid of them. He didn't like using mouse traps...in fact he invested in some pricey traps that just caught the mice without killing them so he could let them go. Only that didn't work cause the mice would be back within a week.

So it was traps for him. And that has worked pretty well...my parent's haven't had mice this whole winter now. We'll see if they'll be back this summer though?

I think it's sweet of you to care so much about this. It shows you've got a big heart.

But IMHO, I think it's okay to do what you need to do to get rid of the mice. Not just so you can sell the house, but to keep who ever moves in safe as well.
It'd be different if mice didn't bite or contaminate food and dishes...if they didn't pose a significant threat to people's well beings...unfortunately they do though, and when it comes to things like this...I think people's lives need to take top priority.

Sorry for the long reply. Not even sure if I'm making sense.

(((((((Hounds)))))))

Hope the thoughts don't linger for too long.
Do you have any friends or family you can ask to dispose of any more mice caught in traps in the future?

Fuzzy12
01-19-17, 03:24 AM
Hound I can so relate. I hate this moral question. For me it's usually insects. I'm terrified of them (for no good reason), can't live with them but u feel so guilty about killing them too. Whenever possible hubby just dhows them out into the garden alive but sometimes it's not possible.

My biggest horrors were always cockroaches. I kept thinking that I can't kill something just because I perceive it as ugly and disgusting but just couldn't live with any of them in the house. They are harmless really. I try to justify myself by telling myself that they carry diseases. But that's not why I kill them (or get them killed rather). I.kill them purely because they are ugly and freak me out.

We had a wasp nest this summer and we had to get it fumigated. Thats 1000s of living beings killed. They were flying into our bedroom every night and buzzing around fuzzling. we had a heat wave but had to keep the windows shut. They still found their way into our bedroom. I don't think I've ever hated anything as much as those wasps. I didn't even feel that bad about killing them though I did feel a bit bad about not feeling bad. Like I've become callous or something.

We get a lot of wasps just from the trees behind our house and there's nothing I can so about that. I'm already dreading this summer and wish they would all just die out. The entire species. ...though I know how selfish and cruel that kind of thinking is.

Sorry I'm babbling. I don't know how to solve this moral dilemma. We could point to nature and say that most animals kill for their own benefit but that alone doesn't make it a good reason of course. So yeah, I really just don't know. But you are not alone.

psychopathetic
01-19-17, 03:26 AM
lol this reminded me of when I was a kid and I found my uncle's dumb (actually he was a pretty dang smart dog tbh) dog digging a hole in some snow. I went to check to see what he found, and he had dug up a bunch of field mice. I was SO angry because one of the mice was dead and I hit the dog really hard. I got in some big trouble for it, and I got in even bigger trouble when my grandma found out that I'd taken a bunch of her nicest wash clothes (I wasn't aware there was anything special about them!) to wrap up the mice in hopes that they'd be warm and survive.
I checked on them the next morning and they'd all passed away :*(.
lol I'm still angry with the stupid dog.

Omg, lol I so did not mean to tell this story in an attempt to make you feel guilty or anything. I don't mean it that way...it's just something you made me remember that I felt like sharing for goodness only knows what reason >.<'.

psychopathetic
01-19-17, 03:32 AM
My biggest horrors were always cockroaches.

/sigh :( :(

I miss my 2 cockroach friends. They only ended up living for about 1 1/2 years for me, but they were seriously a couple of the coolest pets I've ever had. Roaches creeped me the heck out too before I got a few to keep as pets...then they slowly became cuter and cuter in my eyes haha. The roaches I had weren't a species that could infest (especially in my state's climate), didn't carry any harmful diseases or mites, and didn't bite...so they really didn't scare me in away and I truly enjoyed holding them and petting them on their backs :lol:.

Freaking adorable little things they were! lol I miss them :*(. They both passed away within a week of each other just 4 or so months ago. I miss spoiling the heck out of them with new fruits and veggies.

Fuzzy12
01-19-17, 03:36 AM
I'm sorry psycho. I didn't know they'd passed away. I was always impressed with how fond you were of them though I could only dkim your stories about them. Just reading scout them os freaky enough. I regularly have nightmares about coco roaches.

And yes I totally know it's unreasonable.

Greyhound1
01-19-17, 06:02 AM
Thanks Fuzzy and Psycho for your replies. They help!

I was hoping to get some sleep after my last post. I logged off and was getting ready for bed about 2:00am. I was heading from the bathroom to the bedroom and heard one of the damn traps go off.:doh:

It's now 5:00am and I can't get them out of my head. I keep imagining what I am going to find when I go down there.

Sorry to hear about your pets psycho:grouphug:

Fuzzy12
01-19-17, 08:12 AM
Could someone else deal with them like psycho suggested? When hubby is home he's in charge of insect evictions because I just can't deal with them.

Unmanagable
01-19-17, 09:19 AM
They may chew up the electrical wires and start a fire, may chew up other valuable items/foodstuffs, may have diseases that get left behind in their excrement, etc. and create a disaster. Just like mosquitoes and ticks that can spread disease, or poisonous spiders that can end a life. You need to protect your home and family from potential disaster/disease.

With that being said, I feel your pain more than you may realize as your overwhelming feelings of guilt and sadness are the exact same thing I feel each and every time I see (read about) a dinner plate with meat or animal products/smell fast food as I drive by/see cows in the field as I drive by/etc.

I still haven't been able to shake off or reel in the overwhelming emotional responses of knowing all the purposeful deaths that occur for what I've come to learn to be very unnecessary. Hell, I still have to pull over to gather my emotions when I see road kill that's a pure accident. I'd have to get someone else to take care of it, for sure.

BouCoupDinkyDau
01-19-17, 10:12 AM
You might try a cat. They're great mousers, and you can rest easy that a natural hunter is providing for their own food, contributing to a positive circle of life.

Hope this is helpful.

Greyhound1
01-19-17, 10:42 AM
Could someone else deal with them like psycho suggested? When hubby is home he's in charge of insect evictions because I just can't deal with them.
Unfortunately, there isn't. I would feel even worse if my wife had to handle it which she doesn't want to. I just have to get through this and protect our home and ourselves.

midnightstar
01-19-17, 11:02 AM
Aww Great Hound :grouphug:

Unfortunately, as Unmanagable said, killing the mice is unavoidable - the way to think of this is is it better for the mice to be the only ones to die in traps or is it better for them to chew wires and die anyway and cause a house fire or something and potentially cause human deaths :grouphug:

Greyhound1
01-19-17, 11:04 AM
They may chew up the electrical wires and start a fire, may chew up other valuable items/foodstuffs, may have diseases that get left behind in their excrement, etc. and create a disaster. Just like mosquitoes and ticks that can spread disease, or poisonous spiders that can end a life. You need to protect your home and family from potential disaster/disease.

With that being said, I feel your pain more than you may realize as your overwhelming feelings of guilt and sadness are the exact same thing I feel each and every time I see (read about) a dinner plate with meat or animal products/smell fast food as I drive by/see cows in the field as I drive by/etc.

I still haven't been able to shake off or reel in the overwhelming emotional responses of knowing all the purposeful deaths that occur for what I've come to learn to be very unnecessary. Hell, I still have to pull over to gather my emotions when I see road kill that's a pure accident. I'd have to get someone else to take care of it, for sure.

I totally get what you are saying! We had a deer that got hit by a car a month ago and died in our yard. Actually, it was even worse because it was still alive when police arrived and they had to shoot it. I am crying now just remembering that image.

I went inside to avoid witnessing them putting it down. The worst part was getting up the next day and seeing the carcass still laying there. I had really hoped they would use all the meat to benefit at least someone or something. I know that's not their job but the amount of waste was just painful.

Greyhound1
01-19-17, 11:21 AM
You might try a cat. They're great mousers, and you can rest easy that a natural hunter is providing for their own food, contributing to a positive circle of life.

Hope this is helpful.

I have a cat already that I rescued from a shelter. Unfortunately, previous owners had him totally declawed and he is a senior cat now.

He may be able to catch some mice but our basement isn't finished out. It is dirty, damp and would also allow him access into crawl space areas. He already has a very sensitive stomach and throws up anytime he eats anything besides his cat food including tuna.

I love him too much to subject him to that plus the thought of him possibly throwing up mice on our bed.:doh:

Greyhound1
01-19-17, 11:23 AM
Aww Great Hound :grouphug:

Unfortunately, as Unmanagable said, killing the mice is unavoidable - the way to think of this is is it better for the mice to be the only ones to die in traps or is it better for them to chew wires and die anyway and cause a house fire or something and potentially cause human deaths :grouphug:

I totally agree with you both and realize it's a necessity. It just really sucks.

Greyhound1
01-19-17, 11:32 AM
I do feel better knowing something has benefited from my killing spree. I have been taking the dead ones outside and placing them next to some woods and so far they have all disappeared within 24 hours.:yes:

sarahsweets
01-19-17, 11:40 AM
I go through stages of guilt. We have always had a field mice problem- we live across from woods and fields. I used to think it was relative to the kitchen not being clean enough but that was not the case. We had a great mouser cat who even w/o front claws was a master mouse catcher. Most times she played with it to death- sometimes she cornered one. The dead ones were tossed and if she had a live one, i would get it outside. Now that she's gone we use mouse traps. I had an exterminator at my house years ago and asked her what she charged to get rid of mice and she said 1.00$ and told me she recommends traps over anything else.

Hubby sets the traps and if I hear one go off I can not be near to hear or see its suffering. I dont have an issue once their dead but I dont like to see any animal suffer.

Greyhound1
01-19-17, 11:51 AM
Now is the moment of truth. I got zero sleep last night but I am finally ready to face my fears and go check the traps today. I am certain at least one trap went off. Listened all night and only heard the one. Hopefully, it was the last one living here.

midnightstar
01-19-17, 11:53 AM
:grouphug: Great Hound :grouphug:

aeon
01-19-17, 01:50 PM
For some reason, I can emotionally disconnect when the to-be-killed are classified as vermin and/or disease vectors and are living in human living spaces.

That said, a few years ago I hit a woodchuck with my car late at night. I stopped to check, and it was still alive, but grievously wounded, and would not survive.

I thought about it for a second and decided that it would be better to end its pain and suffering, and so in some kind of emotional panic I ran over it again and again until I knew for sure it was dead. Then I drove the last mile home crying and wailing and feeling like...I was...bad.

I still think about that woodchuck from time to time and I will instantly get watery lids, just like I have right now writing this.

But vermin...kill, kill, kill. I love watching ratting videos on YouTube where the terriers are in a frenzy and their muzzles are crimson.

Usually the creatures I would seek to destroy reproduce in numbers or go into estrus constantly, so I know their population will hardly be affected.

I simply cannot have those creatures in my living space. It is a risk to health and well-being.

I try to catch and release when I am able.

And all spiders and ladybugs are welcome to share my space.

:grouphug: Greyhound1


:doh:
Ian

psychopathetic
01-19-17, 02:14 PM
Now is the moment of truth. I got zero sleep last night but I am finally ready to face my fears and go check the traps today. I am certain at least one trap went off. Listened all night and only heard the one. Hopefully, it was the last one living here.

:(

(((Hounds)))

Greyhound1
01-19-17, 03:12 PM
I am glad to report my killing may soon be over, I hope. Checked the traps today and only the one I heard last night went off. One more victim but the good news is none of the other 3 traps were touched. They all still have peanut butter intact.:yes:

peripatetic
01-19-17, 05:16 PM
hey there,

i saw you mentioned your OCD and how it's driving you nuts to have the images pop into your head.

i can relate. not to the mouse thing, but to having graphic intrusive images. they're so ******* awful. i'm sorry you're enduring this now.

much love to you,
-peri xx

Johnny Slick
01-19-17, 05:24 PM
I have a cat already that I rescued from a shelter. Unfortunately, previous owners had him totally declawed and he is a senior cat now.

He may be able to catch some mice but our basement isn't finished out. It is dirty, damp and would also allow him access into crawl space areas. He already has a very sensitive stomach and throws up anytime he eats anything besides his cat food including tuna.

I love him too much to subject him to that plus the thought of him possibly throwing up mice on our bed.:doh:FWIW I don't think that cats are actually all that good at catching mice, especially if you feed them well, which, given the way you're feeling empathetic about the mice, I'm sure that you do. I'm pretty sure that we decided to keep them around us way back in the day because they're cute more than anything else.

acdc01
01-19-17, 07:23 PM
Sounds like you already killed nearly all the mice so this probably isn't a good idea anymore but why can't you just hire someone else to do the killing. I imagine you'd still feel bad but it's like buying a steak from the market versus having to kill the cow yourself - you won't feel it as much.

I don't remember rodent control costing that much even if you have already spend a lot fixing up the home.

Little Missy
01-19-17, 07:42 PM
They are just SO cute. Little whiskers and little feetsies with leetle claws.

Hantavirus isn't so cute though. :eek:

psychopathetic
01-19-17, 07:50 PM
Hantavirus isn't so cute though. :eek:

I dunno...

If you look closely, you can make out a cute'ish (a mother could only love) face. What, with the small and large making eyes, and the nose beneath made out of part of the rest of the large...and the goofy grin made of the medium? :lol:

http://maharashtratimes.indiatimes.com/thumb/msid-54904662,width-400,resizemode-4/maharashtra/mumbai-news/search-for-hanta-virus/-/hanta.jpg

Greyhound1
01-19-17, 07:59 PM
Sounds like you already killed nearly all the mice so this probably isn't a good idea anymore but why can't you just hire someone else to do the killing. I imagine you'd still feel bad but it's like buying a steak from the market versus having to kill the cow yourself - you won't feel it as much.

I don't remember rodent control costing that much even if you have already spend a lot fixing up the home.

I spoke with a friend on mine who is a professional in pest control today. He informed me that mouse traps are the best way to go. I would have to pay an exterminator to come out and check and set traps each day.

He also informed me that my mouse problem is most likely not gone.:( He explained that a mouse will only travel 10 to 20 linear feet in search of food. He strongly suggested we get about 12 more traps and spread them out as much as we can since we could have more within just 25 feet from the original traps.:doh:

Fuzzy12
01-19-17, 08:52 PM
I'm sorry that really sucks. :(

BellaVita
01-19-17, 10:08 PM
:grouphug:

You have such a sensitive heart.

That's a really good thing.

I am similar, our house ( when I was younger) had some mice, so one of my parents set out traps. I saw the dead mice stuck to the sticky mouse traps. It made me so sad. I really didn't want the mice to be killed.

I'm sorry you had to kill the mice.

acdc01
01-20-17, 05:11 AM
That sucks about the mice. Have you spoken to your realtor already about what improvements need to be done?

I kind of wonder if you've killed enough mice already. I think that When the house inspector looks at your home, there will be mice droppings all over the place (unless you clean it up too) and he will point that out to the buyers and they will think there are mice regardless of whether he sees a mouse. So the buyers will want to hire their own professional after they buy he place. As long as the mice aren't so bad they make scratching sounds still, I wouldn't think it mattered unless you cleaned out the droppings too. I could be wrong. My property report showed droppings but there were rats not just mice before we bought it and hired pest control.

Greyhound1
01-20-17, 09:58 AM
That sucks about the mice. Have you spoken to your realtor already about what improvements need to be done?

I kind of wonder if you've killed enough mice already. I think that When the house inspector looks at your home, there will be mice droppings all over the place (unless you clean it up too) and he will point that out to the buyers and they will think there are mice regardless of whether he sees a mouse. So the buyers will want to hire their own professional after they buy he place. As long as the mice aren't so bad they make scratching sounds still, I wouldn't think it mattered unless you cleaned out the droppings too. I could be wrong. My property report showed droppings but there were rats not just mice before we bought it and hired pest control.

We have discussed improvements with our agent and have been following them to a T.

We had no idea we had mice until last week. We have never heard or seen any droppings or evidence prior to then. It happened to coincide with our first snowfall and really cold temps. of the season. I hope and guess they came in just prior to the extreme cold snap.

So far, we haven't heard anymore scratching and none of the traps went off last night.:yes: I am going to place a dozen more down there tonight and find out if we got em all.


Thank goodness it has been confined to the basement and crawl space. Once the mice are gone for sure, we will inspect or clean every inch we can prior to any potential buyers or inspectors coming by. Thanks for your advice.

Greyhound1
01-21-17, 12:03 PM
Things are getting much better. Set out 16 traps last night all over the place and none of them were touched!

I feel so much better about the mouse situation here.:) Hopefully, my days as an executioner are now over!

psychopathetic
01-21-17, 12:13 PM
Set out 16 traps last night all over the place

:eek:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/TVAhhVrpkwM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

:lol:

Greyhound1
01-21-17, 12:38 PM
:eek:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/TVAhhVrpkwM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

:lol:

:lol: That looks like my basement.:lol:

Little Nut
01-21-17, 03:52 PM
FWIW my ex told stories of a cat she had that loved to bring her a nifty present that she could play with too. After being outside the cat would bring in from time to time...you guessed it a live mouse. It would drop it at my ex's feet, she would panic and she claimed her cat would react with shock because she let it get away and the cat had to catch it again to bring it back to my ex.....

Greyhound1
01-21-17, 07:48 PM
Gawd, I hate setting those mouse traps! I have had several go off while in my hand. I am so paranoid about one catching my hand or fingers.

It probably took me over and hour just to set the traps. I hate those things!

BellaVita
01-21-17, 08:07 PM
Gawd, I hate setting those mouse traps! I have had several go off while in my hand. I am so paranoid about one catching my hand or fingers.

It probably took me over and hour just to set the traps. I hate those things!

Yikes. :eek:

psychopathetic
01-28-17, 11:05 AM
How's this situation been over this past week Hounds?

Greyhound1
01-28-17, 06:36 PM
How's this situation been over this past week Hounds?

It's gotten much better. I've had 16 traps setup for over a week and not a single one has gone off.:yes:

Thanks for asking.:)

Greyhound1
01-28-17, 08:26 PM
I did have to kill some mildew today to get ready to paint. I am back to my killing ways.

However, I have no sympathy for mildew and I enjoy seeing it disappear. :) I guess, I am just prejudice to mildew, fungus and germs.

Killing something that has a face or branches is much more troubling to me.

Laserbeak
01-29-17, 03:07 AM
I had a mouse problem once, but my cats took care of it. So no guilt on my part, it was their fault! (lol).

Actually I understand how you feel. I had to feed crickets to my lizard, I loved the lizard, but then she died and in a certain way, I was kind of relieved, since I no longer had to buy live animals to feed to her. I've decided not to buy another chameleon.

midnightstar
01-29-17, 10:27 AM
Great Hound - Tigger says if she was nearer to you she'd hunt all the mice for you :grouphug:

And Tigger *is* a good mouser :)

Greyhound1
01-29-17, 11:54 AM
Great Hound - Tigger says if she was nearer to you she'd hunt all the mice for you :grouphug:

And Tigger *is* a good mouser :)
Thanks Star.

Seems like we have the mouse problem under control. How is Tigger at killing mildew?:lol:

midnightstar
01-29-17, 12:12 PM
Thanks Star.

Seems like we have the mouse problem under control. How is Tigger at killing mildew?:lol:

Not sure but she's good at catching leaves and feathers and bringing them inside to show me her latest catch :lol:

Little Missy
01-29-17, 12:36 PM
At you paint rolling Kilz on it?

aeon
01-29-17, 08:43 PM
At you paint rolling Kilz on it?

For sure, Kilz FTMFW! :yes:


Cheers,
Ian

Little Missy
01-29-17, 10:28 PM
KILZ, baby, KILZ. Its the only way.

sarahsweets
01-30-17, 05:16 AM
You wouldnt feel so guilty if you had Hantavirus-
https://www.cdc.gov/hantavirus/
And they had detected it quite recently.

Greyhound1
01-30-17, 11:30 PM
At you paint rolling Kilz on it?

It's easier to just spray bleach and water. I like the easy way.:yes:

Actually, kilz shouldn't go over living mildew. It will feed on the coating and grow underneath. However, It can go over any stains left after killing the mildew.
Kilz does make a kitchen and bath primer which is mildew "resistant" when applied to clean surfaces. It won't work over mildew but just inhibit future growth.

Zinnser makes a water based primer that can and it really works.
http://www.rustoleum.com/product-catalog/consumer-brands/zinsser/primer-sealers/mold-killing-primer/


Sorry, I've been in the coatings industry for 25 years and fell off the deep end.:doh: