View Full Version : Is there a way to objectively measure neurotoxicity from Adderall?


Bakasura
02-08-17, 05:26 PM
I was wondering - does anyone know if there is a way to objectively measure (whether through brain scans or something of that sort) neurotoxicity and the extent of such from adderall usage? Specifically looking for if there is a way to measure that is less subjective than pure anecdotal "feelings".

I wont go into detail much now as to my personal situation - but the short of it is that I have been on adderall for 19 years (everyday) and am now feeling large negative effects in terms of memory, cognitive abilities, ect... I have been doing a lot of research and would like to try a few different things, such as adding Namenda, lessening the adderall, ect.... - but I have no way to objectively measure the specific negative cognitive impact that has been done and the potential positive repair which these changes may do. Any help, insight, or advice - would be beyond appreciated.

Little Missy
02-08-17, 07:36 PM
Good luck, they've been trying to measure Fukushima for 5 years.

Lunacie
02-08-17, 08:01 PM
Have you ruled out changes in your environment that could account for the
changes you're noticing? More stress? An illness? Sleep issues? Change in diet?

fredonian
02-15-17, 03:59 PM
The most measurable form of neural degeneration that occurs is not from toxicity but mild shrinkage of the brain that occurs from prolonged and repeatative abnormal sleep patterns with users frequently pushing their limits. It can largely be reversed and regained in an appreciable degree but not 100%.

fredonian
02-15-17, 04:13 PM
Engaging into aerobic activity (I did it on a Nordic Track) for twenty or thirty minutes resolved the very issues you mention of almost overnight with me.Adderall constricts the blood vessels and prolonged periods of without exercise repeat the symptoms. Make sure it's not your blood pressure or diabetes. Overall just be smart about it but I think you would be amazed with what just walking itself would deliver. When I say walking...At least 2000 steps at a fast pace.

sarahsweets
02-16-17, 05:52 AM
I just went to Home Depot and bought myself a toxicity-o-meter and slapped it on to get my reading. ;)

Postulate
02-16-17, 08:36 PM
What you're asking is, can gasoline ruin your car's engine? Well, if you accelerate above 7,500 rpm in neutral for an hour, your car might catch fire. Otherwise, gasoline will not ruin your car and you begin to realize why that was a very silly question.

If you IV 250mg of Adderall, you will freeze in your seat and your jaw will clench so hard your teeth will break in your mouth and some dopamine D2 receptors might come off their supporting structure. But this is not due to neurotoxicity, but due to hyper-activity of the system, similarly to how a hyper-activity of a car's engine can cause fire, D2 hyper-activity can destroy D2 receptors.

Neurotoxicity is if you come in contact with dimethyl-mercury and the thing eats you alive to the bone for a 7 month period until you can no longer talk or swallow and you die in pain.

applejuice
02-20-17, 08:42 PM
One way to measure stimulant neurotoxicity is measuring receptor binding sites and neurotransmitter amounts (like they do in rats) - however that's not something you could do.

I think this opinion is not widely accepted on this forum, but after 19 years of Adderall use I think neurotoxicity will develop. Studies also support this (this one, for instance: http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content/315/1/91.short)

There's no way to prove your symptoms are caused by Adderall neurotoxicity - but I would personally think it has.

A lot of neurotoxicity (mostly dopamine depletion) recovers quickly after ceasing use of amphetamines, as the brain produces new neurotransmitters.

I'd talk with your psychiatrist about this, and maybe see if he agrees to lower the dose, or switch to a methylphenidate (Ritalin, Concerta and others). Since methylphenidate is a reuptake inhibitor instead of a releasing agent, it isn't as neurotoxic.

Amphetamine neurotoxicity has been shown to be caused by oxidative stress. Antioxidants can help with this, but it isn't as helpful when neurotoxicity has already occured.

I see you mentioned Namenda (memantine), which is an NDMA antagonist, that can cause dopamine receptor upregulation, increasing sensitivity to stimulants. I'd personally recommend to try magnesium (also an NMDA antagonist) first, as its a supplement, not a drug.

Best of luck! Many people on other forums have had great improvements in their symptoms after long term Adderall use.

Also, I'm not your doctor, talk to your psychiatrist for medical advice.

sarahsweets
02-21-17, 05:41 AM
One way to measure stimulant neurotoxicity is measuring receptor binding sites and neurotransmitter amounts (like they do in rats) - however that's not something you could do.

I think this opinion is not widely accepted on this forum, but after 19 years of Adderall use I think neurotoxicity will develop. Studies also support this (this one, for instance: http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content/315/1/91.short)

There's no way to prove your symptoms are caused by Adderall neurotoxicity - but I would personally think it has.

A lot of neurotoxicity (mostly dopamine depletion) recovers quickly after ceasing use of amphetamines, as the brain produces new neurotransmitters.

I'd talk with your psychiatrist about this, and maybe see if he agrees to lower the dose, or switch to a methylphenidate (Ritalin, Concerta and others). Since methylphenidate is a reuptake inhibitor instead of a releasing agent, it isn't as neurotoxic.

Amphetamine neurotoxicity has been shown to be caused by oxidative stress. Antioxidants can help with this, but it isn't as helpful when neurotoxicity has already occured.

I see you mentioned Namenda (memantine), which is an NDMA antagonist, that can cause dopamine receptor upregulation, increasing sensitivity to stimulants. I'd personally recommend to try magnesium (also an NMDA antagonist) first, as its a supplement, not a drug.

Best of luck! Many people on other forums have had great improvements in their symptoms after long term Adderall use.

Also, I'm not your doctor, talk to your psychiatrist for medical advice.

Amphetamines have been around for 70 years. I am not saying animal research doesnt have its place but in this instance I think studies of humans are better.

aeon
02-21-17, 10:55 AM
Methamphetamine has been shown to cause neurotoxicity, even at clinical doses, but the same cannot be said of amphetamine at clinical doses.


Cheers,
Ian