View Full Version : Switching to Desoxyn from Vyvanse -- looking for dosing experience


chronological
03-25-17, 01:41 PM
I've developed tolerance to 140mg Vyvanse (i'm obese -- BMI of 46 -- hence the dose being over 70mg) and so my doc is having me try out Desoxyn. He's a psychiatrist specializing in ADHD and I've been working with him for a couple of years now, so he knows me and is happy to let me drive the titration. He's told me to just keep pushing the dose up until I hit therapeutic effect, but I'll only take it so far before double checking with him. What I'd like some help with is, how far should that be.

So far, here's what I know/believe:


The FDA guidelines say that the "usual effective dose is 20 to 25 In a meeting daily", however I am assured by my doc that such FDA guidelines are not gospel; e.g. the FDA limit for Vyvanse is 70mg, but as I say I had to go up to 140mg to get that working.
Just as with the Vyvanse, it is likely I'll have to exceed that normal daily limit for Desoxyn because of my weight. My doc is not only allowing for that, he expects it. He's told me to take it up fast to 25mg or so, and then titrate up from there
I've already taken the Desoxyn up to 35mg with no significant effect yet
However, in terms of equivalences, I found an online calculator that puts 140mg Vyvanse as equivalent to only 15mg Desoxyn (those being equivalent to 30mg Adderall IR).

So I'll probably keep moving up, 5 or 10mg a day, until I hit 50mg, but I'm a bit nervous about just keeping on above that point. My doc did say just keep going, but I'd like to double check with him at some point, if I see it needing to inch up towards 100mg.

So, does anyone either have direct experience (in the context of working with a doc rather than self-experimentation), or can point me at some good literature? As usual, a basic Google search throws up only the standard "20 to 25mg" kinda thing, and that's no use to me.

Thanks for any help. But could I make a plea that any such help be restricted either to direct, doctor-guided experience (your own or that of someone you know), or it's from reliable literature; e.g. pubmed or the like. Like anyone else, I can rummage through the general detritus that is The Internet, so I don't need hearsay or gut feel opinion. I'm asking on this forum because many people here, as fellow sufferers, do know what they're talking about.

thanks!

dvdnvwls
03-25-17, 02:29 PM
Skip the equivalence charts. Skip the speculations and calculations. Effectiveness and minimal side effects is the only chart worth looking at. It takes patience, but it's worth it.

Start with a dose that is known to be too low, and stick with it for a full week. Take notes on how it affects your work (not how it affects your feelings, unless it makes you feel worse instead of better). When the week is up, move up one single step in the manufacturer's available dosages, and do the same. And so on.

chronological
03-25-17, 02:59 PM
Skip the equivalence charts. Skip the speculations and calculations. Effectiveness and minimal side effects is the only chart worth looking at. It takes patience, but it's worth it.

Start with a dose that is known to be too low, and stick with it for a full week. Take notes on how it affects your work (not how it affects your feelings, unless it makes you feel worse instead of better). When the week is up, move up one single step in the manufacturer's available dosages, and do the same. And so on.

Thanks. I agree that the only thing that really matters is if it's working and not breaking something else. The equivalences were just to let me calibrate where I was with reference to Vyvanse and Adderall, my response to both of which I understand pretty well. And I am right in the middle of that titration you recommend (although I, and my doc, would disagree with you on the full week thing ;) ). I've been through titration protocols in the past for Ritalin, Adderall, as well as Vyvanse, so my doc and I have that side of things under good control.

Really all I'm looking for is some kind of supra-25mg dosing point at which to take pause. As it stands, I think I'll take it up to 50mg (assuming I don't hit therapeutic effect before then), and at that point I'll phone him and ask if I should keep going (which based on my most recent meeting with him, he'll almost certainly say I should).

But if anyone here has been on Desoxyn 50mg+ a day, I'd love to hear about it.

c

dvdnvwls
03-25-17, 03:19 PM
Don't try to calibrate. It can't be done accurately because your reactions are not the same as others' reactions. Don't try to get an idea of others' effective dosages - it's different for them anyway. Be patient, it's worth it.

dvdnvwls
03-25-17, 04:44 PM
Make sure you stay on each dose for at least a full week, and make sure you don't skip any steps. For example, if the manufacturer offers a 5 and a 10 and a 15, don't skip the 10 just because the 5 was far too weak. Don't make that kind of assumptions.

chronological
03-25-17, 08:10 PM
Make sure you stay on each dose for at least a full week, and make sure you don't skip any steps. For example, if the manufacturer offers a 5 and a 10 and a 15, don't skip the 10 just because the 5 was far too weak. Don't make that kind of assumptions.

Thanks, but as I've already said my titration protocol is being done under my psychiatrist's supervision and according to his instructions (which have also been made clear to and agreed upon by my primary physician). Following your advice would mean I'd have to disregard two doctors instructions which, with respect, I'm not about to do.

Also my question is really quite precise and I'm not looking for opinions on the value of equivalence calibration, nor on my titration schedule. I mentioned those things merely as background.

What I *am* looking for are comments from anyone who has either direct doctor-backed experience of, or can point to medscape-grade references to, Desoxyn dosage for ADHD at above 50mg per day.

Can anyone help with that?