View Full Version : Anyone Notice The Size Difference in Teva's Generic IR


wonderboy
08-09-17, 06:23 PM
I know that Teva has changed its formula, but has anyone noticed a profound difference in the size of the actual pills themselves? They seem profoundly smaller to me as well as less potent and efficacious

BlackWarrior
08-10-17, 01:45 AM
They are less effective for sure. I noticed the coloration is off too. I'm not sure about the size of the pill though...

Snoopy10
08-11-17, 09:29 AM
I noticed the color change as well, like they are faded a bit. Are they less effective? I hadn't noticed. But aren't I kind of stuck with that brand of generic because of my pharmacy?

CharlesH
08-12-17, 01:42 AM
I'm just curious - how do you know that the formula has changed (besides aesthetics and personal experience)? Is it something that's announced in the news, or is it more like anecdotal knowledge that pharmacists and doctors share with patients?

Little Missy
08-12-17, 06:27 AM
I'm just curious - how do you know that the formula has changed (besides aesthetics and personal experience)? Is it something that's announced in the news, or is it more like anecdotal knowledge that pharmacists and doctors share with patients?

I believe the NDC # changes if the formulation changes.

JustAHedgehog
08-15-17, 06:41 PM
I put the tablet in my mouth and tasted the sweetness. After rating it it became soft and chrome apart and I noticed it was actually effective unlike the ones I swallowed it. Weird...

Amberg330
08-15-17, 07:25 PM
I just was diagnosed with ADHD and given 20 'mg of adderall and I got teva, so I am really interested if I got the name brand or another generic it would be more effective? I have nothing to compare it to. So i would love everyone's thoughts on his too :(

wonderboy
08-16-17, 01:05 AM
Impax's subsidiary Global pharmaceuticals is a rather new generic for Adderall IR and XR

Apparently global handles all of Impax pharmaceuticals' generics division

I have never tried them, but, I don't know what to do! All the alternatives have received very poor reviews.

But I digress… Here is the real reason for my post:


1.


For eight years I have always taken Teva IR generic, because out of all manufactures I have tried, It seemed be the most potent and efficacious.

CorePharma was horrible between the years of 2009 and 2012, then improved, but now (of course) it is discontinued
although apparently is available in some outlets.

Teva changed the formula in 2013 - The latest change I could find

When I state they changed their formula, I mean that they applied,with the FDA,for a new ANDA to produce and promote a drug. (d- amphetamine salts) The only reason for this would be a -change- to something


2.

I called Teva and conducted some basic research concerning (as to when) the last time Teva submitted an application to the FDA, or changed their formula (i.e. a new ANDA)

My research, both by calling Teva personally, and, researching this on the FDA site, indicated they changed it in 2007 and 2013 respectively.

No recent changes can be found,or at least I did not find them.

Interestingly, according to the FDA, -Barr pharmaceuticals- submitted a ANDA to the FDA for mixed amphetamine salts IR in 2013. This... I cannot explain. Perhaps someone else can. As they were acquired by Teva.

I could not find any recent Teva formula changes, so I can't explain reports with respect to a drop in efficacy / potency

The only advise that I can give is:

Whatever you do, do not except the manufacturer:

_________
Mallincrokdt
_________

Out of every possible generic you can name, this really is, horrific, and I mean -horrific-

Even though I may regret this advice, I think I would stick with Teva.

---- Rationale of my thinking:---

__________________________________________________ ____

Even though the reviews recently have been deleterious for Teva, they aren't as bad- as many of the other new manufactures of this drug.

There is actually some mild vitriol towards some generic companies
These reviews are rampant and (invariably) profoundly negative - for the most part of course.


I hope this helps in any way..

wonderboy
08-16-17, 01:17 AM
I'm just curious - how do you know that the formula has changed (besides aesthetics and personal experience)? Is it something that's announced in the news, or is it more like anecdotal knowledge that pharmacists and doctors share with patients?


You know because the firm submitted to the FDA a new ANDA for the drug

See my new post below

sarahsweets
08-16-17, 03:54 AM
Impax's subsidiary Global pharmaceuticals is a rather new generic for Adderall IR and XR

Apparently global handles all of Impax pharmaceuticals' generics division

I have never tried them, but, I don't know what to do! All the alternatives have received very poor reviews.

As far as I know, Global is one of the generics authorized by SHIRE to make its xr. It has been for awhile. IMPAX is the new kid on the block. Did they aquire Global recently?

wonderboy
08-17-17, 06:28 PM
Yes. If you go to Impax's website, when searching for their generic products, you will be taken to global pharmaceuticals.

So, I assume that is global that manufactures generic Adderall. I am not sure if they manufacture both XR and IR

JustAHedgehog
08-18-17, 10:33 PM
Yeah, it does seem smaller. I wonder also if the company has gotten sloppy and been letting more of the Levo entionomer than allowed. I'm sure if this is the case they could easily eat away with it. Although I do not know exactly how they extract different entionomers (my guess is HPLC)?

wonderboy
08-20-17, 06:46 PM
Two profoundly concerning issues with respect to generic companies receiving approval for their product


1) What is even more interesting (and, in my opinion, both unacceptable and unethical) is the "testing process" which a generic company completes in order to complete the application (an ANDA) to the FDA, for ultimate approval. Here is what I mean:

1) The generic company --alone-- performs all the tests to ensure it is commensurate with the Brand

This information is -------confidential------, the results are not available to the public.

One only can speculate what the:

A. Internal Validity

B. External Validity

2) Once these companies begin producing their drug, most of the time
(in factories located in third world countries,) we must hope they actually produce what they state to the FDA they will. The FDA does not have the resources to check on all plants around the world.

If you visit the FDA site, in the search area, type "warning letters"- These letters are where the FDA has indeed inspected a plant, and found standards to be profoundly sub-par.




It simply makes one worry...and rightly so.....

sarahsweets
08-23-17, 04:48 AM
Two profoundly concerning issues with respect to generic companies receiving approval for their product


1) What is even more interesting (and, in my opinion, both unacceptable and unethical) is the "testing process" which a generic company completes in order to complete the application (an ANDA) to the FDA, for ultimate approval. Here is what I mean:

1) The generic company --alone-- performs all the tests to ensure it is commensurate with the Brand
Really? I was always under the impression that in order for any company generic or brand to get a patent to make a medication, they had to have some sort of independent testing and review?

JustAHedgehog
08-23-17, 06:31 AM
Entionomers are tricky little things to identify. They have all the same physical characteristics but due to being nonsuper impossible images of one another can have different physiological effects.

Little Missy
08-23-17, 09:10 AM
If I saw one, its been a couple of years, I'd notice if there was a difference or not. I used to take Teva exclusively for 6 ish or more years. They always tasted like a sweettart.

wonderboy
08-25-17, 05:31 PM
Really? I was always under the impression that in order for any company generic or brand to get a patent to make a medication, they had to have some sort of independent testing and review?


Even if they are required to have a third party in the testing process, which I do not believe is required. the testing data, in terms of the ultimate results:

__________________________________________________ ___________
bioequivalence / bioavailability and other --VITAL variables-- they implemented
__________________________________________________ ___________


And the "internal validity" - and "external validity" of their "tests" including all other variables......and, most importantly, the actual results are -not- made public.


Moreover, one would have to be a tad bit poignantly naive to believe that if a third party did overlook the tests, that they are... completely.... "value free" :)


I simply find this really concerning.....

sarahsweets
08-26-17, 03:57 AM
Even if they are required to have a third party in the testing process, which I do not believe is required. the testing data, in terms of the ultimate results:

__________________________________________________ ___________
bioequivalence / bioavailability and other --VITAL variables-- they implemented
__________________________________________________ ___________


And the "internal validity" - and "external validity" of their "tests" including all other variables......and, most importantly, the actual results are -not- made public.


Moreover, one would have to be a tad bit poignantly naive to believe that if a third party did overlook the tests, that they are... completely.... "value free" :)


I simply find this really concerning.....

It is concerning but not enough for me to not take my adderall ;)

JustAHedgehog
08-27-17, 02:41 PM
Anyone else split the tablet in half before taking both halves? I feel like this helps absorption and it works like it should. Otherwise it feels weak

CharlesH
08-29-17, 01:56 AM
Anyone else split the tablet in half before taking both halves? I feel like this helps absorption and it works like it should. Otherwise it feels weak

If it works for you, then I guess just keep doing it. If you're asking for my opinion, I'm pretty sure that the tablets readily dissolve within seconds, so I don't see how breaking it in half would accomplish anything. Simple test - place the tablet on your tongue. If it dissolves within seconds, then splitting the tablet is probably useless.

CharlesH
08-29-17, 02:04 AM
Even if they are required to have a third party in the testing process, which I do not believe is required. the testing data, in terms of the ultimate results:

__________________________________________________ ___________
bioequivalence / bioavailability and other --VITAL variables-- they implemented
__________________________________________________ ___________


And the "internal validity" - and "external validity" of their "tests" including all other variables......and, most importantly, the actual results are -not- made public.


Moreover, one would have to be a tad bit poignantly naive to believe that if a third party did overlook the tests, that they are... completely.... "value free" :)


I simply find this really concerning.....

Going off of what sarahsweets said, do have experiences in which certain generics underperform?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but generics must contain virtually the exact amount of active chemical, especially since the active chemical is amphetamine, which is tightly controlled in the USA. Assuming that the FDA rigorously tests this, then for IR medication, I don't see how a generic company could screw up the inactive ingredients so badly that the active chemical becomes unable to be absorbed into the bloodstream.

Now, XR type medications are a different matter since different companies might use different methods of releasing the active chemical over time.

CharlesH
08-29-17, 02:18 AM
Entionomers are tricky little things to identify. They have all the same physical characteristics but due to being nonsuper impossible images of one another can have different physiological effects.

Are you trying to imply that it would be difficult to independently test the ratio of enantiomers? I have college intro level knowledge of general and organic chemistry, and that just doesn't seem right to me. If there are any chemistry experts out there who know better than I do, then please chime in!

Also it seems implausible to me that the DEA, which tightly controls the production process of controlled substances, would allow such a conspiracy to go on. There probably aren't that many commercially viable ways to mass synthesize Adderall, so the DEA could monitor the starting raw materials and all expected the byproducts along the way. If you're so concerned, then perhaps you could write directly to the DEA.

sarahsweets
08-29-17, 04:59 AM
Also it seems implausible to me that the DEA, which tightly controls the production process of controlled substances, would allow such a conspiracy to go on. There probably aren't that many commercially viable ways to mass synthesize Adderall, so the DEA could monitor the starting raw materials and all expected the byproducts along the way. If you're so concerned, then perhaps you could write directly to the DEA.

The thing that hangs me up about this is motive. What is the motive behind generic meds and not testing them properly or having them not work as well as their brand counterparts? Wouldnt it make sense to have them work the same or better? The more people taking a certain manufacturer the more money is made right? So why would sub par standards be useful? It makes sense that it could be a cost cutting measure but how much money is saved at the expense of patients? Do they really save so much that its worth getting a bad rep over efficacy?
And are they making so much money off them that its worth having them work poorly? And are they doing so well at making crappy generics that there is no way the FDA would care?