I've chosen to graduate early instead of staying an extra semester here, as I'll have all 120 hours I need to graduate by next winter because of credits I already had. I had to agree to that to get funding for summer school, reason being they're taking the money they'd ordinarily have given me for Spring '07 and applying it to my tuition this summer. I want to be out of here, too.

But people keep asking me what I want to do after I graduate, and I always have to make up an answer along the lines of: 'well, I may do law school or grad school, or I may just work until I know what I want to do'. A large part of me wants to do grad school outside of the United States, but such an undertaking would mean a lot of planning and my grades would have to be much better than they are now. I currently have a 2.34 GPA (set to change after this month), but I was undiagnosed for the first three and a half semesters of college and never got treated for depression until the third semester. I think I can make a 3.0 or close to it, but that would take a lot to do. Do I even have a shot at applying for grad schools outside of the US? Where would I start? I started looking at UK postgraduate programmes, and their descriptions were intimidating (to say the least). I would ideally like to study international politics, history, or something tangentially related.

Has anyone here ever been in my situation? Any suggestions?

Hi there,

I'm kind of in the same boat. I went undiagnosed my first 2 1/2 years of college, and once I began treatment my grades went from like a 2.4 to a 3.7. I'm pleased, but there are still a lot of F's, incompletes and withdrawn courses on my transcript.

I'd like to pursue a graduate degree as well and I am kind of worried about my transcript. I talked to a few academic counselors at my college, and they have suggested that I get some real-life work experience or an internship, volunteer position, etc in the field I want to pursue. Take the GRE's and accompany any graduate school application with a letter from your psychiatrist explaining your diagnoses and treatment, and write an extra letter yourself explaining your situation.

Anyhoo, I hope this helps a bit.
Cara

Hey There,

Take a look at my post "Any hope for grad school?" I am pretty much going through *exactly* what you are going through...

I was undiagnosed for 5 years of undergrad, and I have an impressive 2.65 GPA...I am starting to study for the GRE and it would be a dream come true if I actually get accepted anywhere. From what I understand, if you get in touch with your Student Disabilities Office on campus, they can write you letters of advocacy...

You should also find out about this thing called a 504 Accommodation Plan and emphasize that BY LAW you are entitled to one as an ADD individual, but you went through three and a half years WITHOUT ONE.

--Onemoreyear

PS. Just like Fiddlegirl said, it's REALLY important that you get an internship or something along those lines...

Hey if you can go to graduate school now, my suggestion would be to do it. I graduate with a BSE but never went to graduate school. I mainly didn't go to graduate school because with family to take care, and working fulltime it was going to be very hard to do it.
Check into your college ability to help students with add/adhd. Noone is guaranteed a 504 plan. Also, look into your rights under the American with Disabilities Act of 91.
Take care
Johna

Really? No way! I totally thought you were entitled. My godmother is an ADD specialist who said it is required by law, but maybe that's only for children...? Please do inform, I was banking on that!

Thanks for the replies.

It looks like a very overdue trip to the career center is in order. I am afraid of appearing as clueless as I feel, and I always think that my options for an internship of any kind are nonexistent because of my grades and the fact that I don't know any faculty well enough to get a good recommendation. Those profs I have had more than once, I've either done poorly in their classes or started out well and then crashed and burned because I insisted on staying in school when I really should have been hospitalized. I may have had a chance with my history prof from last semester, but I flaked on the last major assignment of the semester even after he gave me chance after chance to turn it in, so I got a C+ in that class.

I was in the exact same boat when I graduated with my B.S. I was diagnosed the summer before my senior year in college. I entered that year with a 2.5 and graduated with a 2.7 (I got a 3.6 both semesters). It's so hard to get your GPA back up, it' so easy to bring it down.

When I graduated, I really wanted to go to grad school, but I knew with my GPA it would be hard to get it. I didn't want to waste time, money and emotions on applications if I didn't think I could get in.

I entered the work force. I knew that if I had a few years working, grad schools would be more likely to accept me, because it would mean I had really thought about what I wanted to go for in grad school. Plus, I didn't know if I wanted Speech Language Pathology or something different. By going into the work force, I would get more experience to help me figure out what I really wanted.

I just started grad school - 4 years later! I am going for Applied Behavior Analysis. I am so excited and I love my program! It was definitely worth the wait. The program accepted me because of my work experience and I know I want to be a Board Certified Behavior Analyst.

I suggest you:
(1) take more classes and get your GPA up (take classes in the areas you're interested in going to grad school for)
(2) wait to go to grad school for a few years, until you decide what you really want
(3) take the GRE now (it would be much easier now than in a few years after you're forgotten lots of stuff)
(4) look into what grad schools you could get into with your current GPA, in the US and international (you never know - the programs I was looking to were really strict, but maybe international politics and/or history won't be as strict)
I know nothing about international schools, maybe they're more willing to take a lower GPA, but the US schools more likely will not (from my experience)

Good luck! Remember, what I've written are suggestions based on my experience.

Here is a great site that pertains to section 504 and post secondary:

http://www.pacer.org/pride/504.htm

Also, a school cannot discriminate against disabilities, which is why they shouldn't/can't ask about disabilities. But, that doesn't mean they can't decline a person based on their GPA.

This site is about rights of college students, it's a good one too:
http://www.protectionandadvocacy-sc.org/ADA-504-College%20Students.htm

What I got from them was that we have rights. But, we don't get the same treatment we got (or would have gotten) in grade school, junior high, and senior high.

We have the right to not be discriminated against, because of being ADD (but I don't think that covers GPA). We have the right for accomodations to help us be on equal ground with "normal" people.

If I have mis-interpreted this, let me know! This is definitely an interesting subject!

Hm, yeah, I see what you mean there..

I guess I didn't mean that we should say to a graduate school, "you have to forgive this because I'm disabled..."


It would be something along the lines of ...."as an individual with a Learning Disability, I am afforded certain accomodations under the Americans with Disabilities Act of 1990 since my school is a publically funded university. For 5 years of undergraduate work, my condition was undiagnosed and for that reason, I was not able to complete my undergraduate work under such accomodations. I therefore did not have a fair chance in competing with other students in my classes, which is reflected in my GPA.

Notice that, following my diagnosis and the commencement of a medication/educational therapy program, I got an internship which resulted in a publication. Note that my GRE scores are higher than **% of undergraduates pursuing graduate education. Also observe that after the implementation of a 504 accommodation plan, my grade point average changed from a 2.65 to a 3.75. This demonstrates that, while my potential is sky-high, I was prevented from performing in my fullest due to an unknown disability. Once the disability was treated, my potential was realized."

That's something I might write in the personal statement on a grad school application...???

I was just re-reading my post, and I sounded a bit negative. If you want to try to go to grad school - then go for it. You'll never know if you could get in now unless you try.

As for onemoreyear's post above - it can't hurt to write that. I just know, that even though I wrote a statement very similar to that - I didn't get in. They told me it was because of my GPA.

If you really want grad school now, sin nombre - go for it. But, it just could be worth your wait - especially since it seems you're not too sure what you want to go to grad school for.

That really sucks to hear that...I'm so sorry...maybe my plan won't work...

It just seems SO unfair to me that our GPA can be held against us when we have a disability that prevents us from working at the level of the students we are competing with...I don't understand how any grad school can just use the GPA if they know this fact. It's completely unfair.

It does suck, onemoreyear. I wish the admission people, professors in the program could see our hearts and see how unbelievably hard we work, see our determination. It's so unfortunate that they only look at numbers, because they're missing out on some amazing people.

But, you'll never know if your plan will work or won't work unless you try.

I'm one of those people who says it like it is, positives and negatives. I want people to be aware of what could happen.

That's what happened to me, it doesn't mean it will happen to you. The program (and had applied to 2 years ago and was rejected) I'm in is strict and they very much limit the amount of people in it.

If you really want to go to grad school now, onemoreyear and sin nombre, go for it.

Look at the program you're wanting to get into, talk to the professors and the admission people, make sure they know who you are. When you're applying for a program - go over and beyond what they're asking for. Make sure your recommendations (from people) are stellar, include a former teacher/prof who will back you up. Get your doc to write something up about your progress since meds.
Put your heart and soul into a cover letter - telling the admission committee why you will be an amazing student for them to have in their program.

onemoreyear and sin nombre - you have to reach for things you want. If it doesn't happen right now, take a bit of time (find work in the career field you're want to go to grad school for) and try again. If it's something you want, you need to keep at it.

Best wishes!

Thank you so much for your encouragement livinginchaos...I really do appreciate it.

*Incidentally* I was just reading through the tests they used to diagnose my ADD...

It reports that I have a Full-Scale IQ of 141 according to the WAIS-III. That corresponds to intellectual functioning in the 99.7th percentile. What ticks me off is that my GPA is a 2.65...grad schools that choose to admit students based primarily on GPA are not only missing out on some creative, innovative, and inspired individuals...They are missing out on INTELLIGENT individuals.

By choosing GPA as a filtering factor, educational institutions are shooting themselves in the foot. GPA/class performance/exam grades cater to the MAJORITY. Well, guess what...? There are geniuses sitting on the outskirts of the majority...that's what makes them geniuses! That means that conventional evaluation methods like homework and finals do NOT identify individuals who don't conform to that structure.

It's insane! Albert Einstein flunked out of college!

I had at least 5 professors ask me "how did you EVER get in this class?" "I think you should be honest with yourself--you're not going to work out as a scientist.." "This just isn't your thing--some people aren't able to grasp this material." They have NO IDEA what they are talking about...I was BORN to grasp this stuff--I just don't grasp it at YOUR LEVEL.

I'm sorry for this way this posting sounds, I just know how I've suffered for the last 4 years because I began to actually BELIEVE what these "professors" were telling me about myself...

To everyone with ADD.....Don't EVER let someone tell you that you "weren't built" for something! Don't EVER let someone demean you! We have the right to pursue our dreams, we have the right to deviate from the norm, and we have the right to speak in our OWN ADD language...

My dream post-undergrad program would combine medicine and the social sciences, or something to that effect.

And onemoreyear, I hear you. My WAIS-III full-scale score was 126, but my Verbal subscore was 145. At the time the test was given, I was dealing with some other major emotional problems, so I don't know if that's really my optimum score or not. I've always had huge gaps in verbal and performance areas; the split in verbal and performance was 45 points when I was given the WISC-III in second or third grade. I used to think that I was absolutely terrible at math, because that's the impression I always got from standardized test scores (granted, they were above average, but only slightly and didn't approach my verbal area scores) and years of school. But looking back at my school records showed that the huge gap didn't appear until I switched to an entirely different school system that was more boring and that didn't put me in a gifted program until a year later. And the WAIS indicated that I'm actually quite good at math, at least the arithmetic part of it. I retook general chemistry (first-year chem for science majors) here and got a B in the first half of it, the part that I failed just two years ago. I also got a B in the lab. I decided to press my luck and take the second half of it, which I have never taken before, and I'm doing alright in it. And lab is going well, too. That is mostly why I am not entirely sure which way I want to go. But I have decided that if I wish to go to med school, then I will take the rest of the requisite courses next summer and after I graduate.

There are too many things that I've held off on, skipped entirely, or was psyched into failing simply because of listening to others' impressions of my ability (or lack thereof). I have internalized others' negative assumptions and views, but I won't do it any longer. This lesson has cost me a lot ($975/credit hour, lol), but it's invaluable.

onemoreyear -

you don't have to apologize for your post. I distinctly remember feeling that way when I graduated with my bachelor's and when I was trying to get into grad school the first time around.

The way schools admit people (especially grad school) sucks. I understand it's an easy way. They only have to glance at scores. They can accept or decline within a short time period and not have to read a ton about you or know who you are.

I think that should matter most - who are you and are you determined to make grad school work because you want it.

I really think that's why if you decide to apply to grad school, you should go above and beyond what they ask. Make them get to know who you are and what you want. You never know what can happen, sometimes they make exceptions!!

I was in a program last year - accepted with .5 GPA under their qualifications for admission, but they admitted me conditionally. It was a horrible program, so I quit. But, that' s a possibility.

Another possibility - GRE or MAT scores.

onemoreyear, sin nombre and anyone else considering grad school -
take your GRE or MAT ASAP!! Don't wait like I did (4 years). Take it while you have the info fresh in your head.

It's great that you two are letting others' negativities enter one ear and go straight out the other. Don't give it a thought! Especially professors - they don't know you, so their opinion doesn't matter! :D

Best wishes to you both - keep striving for what you want - even if you end up taking a short detour (like I did)!

Hmmm... Completely read through this thread and many things in my mind had been discussed. However, there one more thing that I am still confused:

Should I mention my ADD in my statement of purpose?[/i]

It might be able to explain my GPA increases in the last two semesters (from B- to B+), but would the admission just think I've been giving myself excuses?

Why not?! I did - you want people to understand that the increase in your GPA isn't because you were sluffing off with school work, but because of a genuine issue. You probably also will want to write about how your are helping your ADD; what are you doing to help yourself.

I don't think it's giving excuses, unless you really were sluffing off the semesters before the last 2.

Good luck!!