Here's a question for the guys:

How many of you work out on a regular basis? How many of you are workout fanatics? How many of you dream of working out, but can't seem to break the chain of excuses?

Actually one of the most significant changes for me since the ADD dx is that I work out constantly now. I even hooked up with a personal trainer to get me on a proper program, that has been a great investment. Not only is he a great trainer he has become a good friend. I think the effects of wroking out are as equally beneficial for me as the meds.

Hrmm...I need to get motivated again. I do enjoy working out, but would love to be challenged, like with a trainer or workout partner. Too bad the median age of my neighborhood is 91!

I started working out for about a full year and dropped like 30 pounds. I did it compulsively, like 1-2 times a day including running, weights, aerobics etc. I did it all. Then I stopped and barely have worked out since, with only occasional, sporadic weeks where I will and then lose motivation. Right now I'm going about every day

Just started riding my bike again. Been doing about a mile every morning, to get the blood pumping :)

I used to work out a long time ago on a regular basis but can't seem to get myself into the groove of doing it again unless I have an upcoming event, which is stupid because working out only a month prior to a race doesn't do much for you.
I am big into Jet Ski racing (Endurance) and I got the crap kicked out of me at the first race.. I keep asking myself if I could have prevented it if I had been in good shape.
It was an offshore event and the surf was insane. I can handle (and love to fly) big surf in sets but this was like a washing machine.. Hitting from all sides.. I ended up coming off my ski in mid-air at about 45mph and pan caked into my ski when we hit the face of another wave. My knee is all swollen up now, though it didn't happen until about 1 1/2 weeks after the wreck. Bottom line is this, if I was stronger across the board, would I have been able to fight coming off the ski better? Probably..
At the end of last season I was in pretty good shape.. During the off-season I didn't do much else but slap keys on the computer, and at night have a drink of Bacardi & Coke to relax.. Not good.
I think one of the biggest problems for me is I get so focused into something (usually computer/site related) and can't pull myself away to go work out..
This really is something that I need to address because my "dream" is to be world champion in my class this year at the Championships (which happen to be in Texas this year for the first time - my backyard). I dominated the super course (endurance) races last year but didn't make it to the championships due to finances.. This year I would break my own heart to be in the position to be there and not be able to compete because I have refused to get on a program.

I know this is long winded but I know a lot of people with AD/HD that love to work out but also go through phases.. My father, at 60 turned into a health nut after coming down with adult diabetes. He will go for 6 months running almost 10 miles a day, laying out in the sun, pumping weights.... and then quit! Only to start it up again 6-12 months later..
Have there been any studies done on this?

I only run when chased, jump when my wife yells, and lift when I'm picking up my fork...


But.. I'm thinking about getting back into paintball... Shooting people legally can feel so rewarding at times..

Am now up to 4 miles a day :)

I love paintball.. Good workout too when it's 100+ outside and your are running for cover.

I'm going to go for a mile today.. walking, limping, running.. whatever. :)

despite me being a girl i cant seem to get motivated to work out, but i would like to. heh some say im a tomgirl!

I go through phases. I get all gung-ho about working out and getting fit and healthy, and I stick with it for a week or two, then it just sort of... fizzles out.

THANK YOU, AD/HD!! *sigh*

I'm hoping that after I get on my correct meds, I'll be able to stick with it more. I like the feeling of being fit and actually being able to wear NICE looking clothes ;)

-- Tom

PS: Big, I cannot for the life of me "vote" here. It always says my session is invalid. I checked my cookies and it says that it's not rejecting them, so I'm confused. I am behind a corporate firewall (Microsoft) but it's giving me grief. Any ideas?

MSFT most likely is filtering content at the firewall as well. Not sure why you can't vote, but if you PM me your vote, I'll manually add it for you. :) Sorry, that's the best I can do.

I suffered a cardiac arrest about 16 months ago.

During cardiac rehabilitation, I started weight training.

Like most things that I “get into”, I went gang-busters. For about six months.

Then, predictably, my interest evaporated.

I worked up some good arms and calf muscles. See results below.

Remember, I’m 53. (I was 52 when I had the cardiac arrest [and two heart attacks])

OK, to be totally accurate, the cardiac arrest was on January 23, 2002. The pics below were taken in August, 2002. My birthday is April 3rd, 1950. The cardiac rehab and subsequent weight training didn’t start until around February or March.

You do the math. Phew!

Click Here For Calf Pic (http://www.epic-isti.com/images/calf2.gif)

Click Here For Arm Pic (http://www.epic-isti.com/images/arm2.gif)

MadMike, dude, you are totally ripped! YOUR HUGE!!!!

Can you offer me an excercise that would target specifically my biceps? Forceps are okay, just want to concentrate on bulking up my upper arms. Pecs could use some work too, but for now, I want to just focus on the biceps. What do you suggest? Freeweights, machine, supplements? Give me a specific workout that you use. Is it as simple as just doing pull-ups/chin-ups?

Well about 10 years ago I did Lau Gar kung fu for a few years at the same time in my life I was on permanent 6-2 morning shift in a physical job and when I got home from work I trained for an hour or so at home, then I got a groin strain and stopped training altogether and since then haven't exercised at all :(

But over the years I wanted to start back training but didn't have the confidence, I did find it hard with the martial arts cos my mind would get really confused when learning new sets (Kata) which I'm sure is related to ADD.

Anyway, I ordered a Total Gym XLi last week so am looking forward to getting that, cos I really loved exercising, so now I can do it at home and lose the weight I need to.

I have a such a hard time getting started working out. I was doing this eating plan/workout plan with my wife, Body for Life.
You basically eat 6 smaller meals a day, 3 of those meals being protein shakes or weight loss shakes. The idea behind it is to reduce your carbs and increase your protein while at the same time building up your muscle mass. 3 days of weights and 3 days of cardio, alternating. We did it from November until about April and I was not very faithful at the weights or cardio but pretty good with the eating. I started the thing at 255 or so and the lowest I go was 246. Now I tip the scales consistently at 250 to 252. The funny thing is I know that my body reacts well to exercise.

In 1992 to 1193 I worked as a bagboy at Lucky(now Albertson's) and when I started I probably weight about 215. I was running my but off chasing cart out in the parking lot....sometimes as stress or anger relief. I also always ran to get a price check. I was down to 185 in no time at all, just from the cart collecting during work.

I even got all motivated by finding a picture of myself from when I got married(185lbs) and scanned it inot my computer and it is currently my desktop background on my computer. I started running for a few days and have not done much in a couple months.

Any suggestions for motivation? Also, any suggestions for what to do without joining a gym? I know it is important to be healthy. I am 35 right now and have a family with 3 active young kids. I want to be around for them for the long term. I started the year with a goal to lose 50 lbs and so far I have not lost anything. I don't want to abandon that goal, but need some suggestions on how to achieve it.

Though I run myself to the "bone", I can work out like this every day.. ;)

www.pwcracer.com/videos/teamsportracing/

Click on the TSR-R5-ProAmNovice link.. ;)

I'm the little (non-white) ski.. #151

(It's a big file.. DSL/Cable needed)

David, you should bicycle instead of running, the circles are therapeutic for your knee.

I have trouble getting to gym and finding time to exercise. Doh! Would probably help if I could get off the computer... You all could help by making your posts more boring and inane. Thanks for your support. :p

Hey Force, I like your signature.... It reminds me of one of my favorite verses in the Bible:
Proverbs 24:16
for though a righteous man falls seven times, he rises again,

I have a poem about this, if you are interested.

You must be young Jimmy- if I'd stayed down after falling down only 7 times, I'd still be down... but thanks. Yeah, I love that one too, I got it off a "no fear" shirt. Funny, but I keep looking for the verse numbers when I look at it too...

This is a pretty fascinating topic for me, especially since I've had difficulty getting into a regular program to work out. I see a flabby man when I look in the mirror although people consider me thin. I'm 5'11" and 170#. I'm not sure what that works out to be. All I know is that my belly protrudes more than I like.

I cite several reasons for not following through with a program.

1) They say to make time to work out, but any extra time I can find I devote to writing. I sold a short story to an anthology this spring and have just finished the first draft of one for which I have high hopes. I'm also in the middle of the second draft of a novel I've written. If I have nothing else to say about myself, I know that I'm an exceptional writer and with the proper dedication to the craft I know I will be successful at it.

2) I can't seem to put down the cigarettes.

3) I have a voice inside my head telling me I'll never have the body I want.

So how do I make time to work out? I walk my dog every morning when I first get up, not for too long but a decent and brisk twenty-minute saunter. It's helped to bring my weight down from a high of 185.

If it's okay to limit myself, I really just want to tighten up my abs, not build any bulk.

Hi FtLaud: For your height, your weight is just about perfect....(to calculate ideal body weight, take 106 pounds for the first 5 feet and then 6 pounds for every inch thereafter). You should weigh 172. So you're just about right......If you can't cut out the cigarettes, can you cut down? Congrats on all that writing success....something to be proud of....and the fact that you've gone from 185 to your ideal body weight is also a good thing.......Can you cut back the writing time JUST a wee bit and devote a little bit of that time to a work out? Perhaps twice per week? Perhaps while you're working out, you could be meditating about what you will be writing about when you return home....You CAN have the body you want....:)

P.S Fort Lauderdale is where I want to live someday!! or at least Broward or Palm Beach....

I wish I could ...
I used to run with my wife when we were dating.
then we got married, she got fibromygia, and a member ship to a womens only gym.
My path to exercise just slammed in my face. (the door) oh well.

I feel so great when I work out, but I don't. There have been some times when I worked out regularly, religiously. I have to be able to have a regular time to do it, and it's too hard to take the time now, it seems. I found that it helped me feel more like I was in my body, not just my head. I even built up my upper body, when I used to lift regularly. I need a life manager.

i just ordered a crossbow wieght training system and plan to get started as soon as i have it assembled.my doctor says that working out will release some chemical in the brain to help with the depression so i will know it 6 weeks.

Hi all..
At 44 I have done so many different things in regards to fitness. The pattern however seems to remain that I go whole hog... stress or injure myself within a year and or lose interest. I have yet to find a way to maintain a cardio program. I'm 5' 10" at 175 pounds so it's not like I'm way out of whack with my weight but my fitness is lame.

I'm actually a bit fearful of the latest influenza strain making the rounds and hoping my heart is up for the test if I catch the bug.

Like so many others I too feel a huge rise in a sense of well being when I do get some extended periods of fitness, but just can't seem to sustain it.

A partner seems like a great idea.. now where is that wife.. ;^)

Cheers! Ian.

I ride my bike to work 3-5 times a week. It is 7 miles each way. I have always ran or rode a bike. I have ridden from Seattle to Portland several times. I do much better mentally if I exercise. My Doc say it is my way of self medicating. Even my wife notices a difference when I am exercising. I do go through about a 2 month period each year where I just cant seem to ride.

Four out of the last five days.. for twenty minutes.. oh.. it's going to be a long haul..
I've got enough wood to keep me busy though.. five cords... bucked up into 18" lengths, split and stacked. We'll see how it goes..

I am hoping if I have something practical I can sustain it.. more will be revealed..
Cheers! Ian.

javascript:smilie(';)')

I hope you guys dont mind me posting here, if you do let me know i will drag my butt back to the girl side of the fence and try real hard to muster some enthusiasm for housework or friendship issues.

I think weight training is possibly the second best activity there is. I leave my dumbells just inside the bedroom door so i make sure i lift some weights each night.
Mostly i like to free lift and have worked out quite a routine over the last 10 years or so.
Before i even realised my oddities were ADHD based i knew that weight lifting helped me function better from day to day.

First off you work yourself till you got no energy or anger left then hot shower and fall into bed so exhausted even your thoughts dont have the energy to run through your mind and keep you awake.

Has worked for me for years.

Public exercise is somthing i loath with a passion though. I just cant stand all those people measuring themselves against everyone else. Not to mention all that wasted money.

capri we don't have a square inch to spare for anything more in the house.. heh If I could I'd have a few weights around.. but not until the kids move out at this point..hhe I too have enjoyed weight training.

I like to think my wood pile will keep up with Paul's novel but I think has has the jump on me.. lol
Cheers! Ian.

Well, I got my run up to just over ten miles before I left the ship two months ago. That was high-end, run off the anger, distance though. Normally I would hit the treadmill for an hour to an hour and a half and toward the last month or so I was there I would weight train for the same amount of time every other day. Lost 26lbs the first two months just running. I am sure the adderall helped, just as I am sure the fact that I tend to forget to eat when I am on an underway schedule helped a bit too, (BTW, you can't get away with missing too many meals running that much 6 days a week, you get very weak very fast. It was a good reminder to EAT!).

Anyway, after all that I got down to 197lbs which for me is very light. I get home on LIMDU and I'm expecting the wife to be impressed as I have not looked like this since high school. She says to me, "You're too skinny! It's not attractive at all Dan. You need to put some weight back on." Sicillians! Not happy unless they are feeding you fat! ;-) Anyway, 192 is what the book says my ideal weight should be, but Doc says with my frame 225 is more accurate. So, yes I am running light right now. The idea being to cut down to lean and then lower my run distance, up my calories a little bit and let the weight training take it's course and bring me back up to my normal body weight, only lean as in highschool again.

My normal run is 7-8 miles, when I am not busting butt to get over a 2 month hiatus, and I don't do it because I'm a health nut, though I enjoy the benefits. I do it, because it is as good, or better for my ability to function as the adderall is, and it's a cumulative benefit. In other words, the meds add to my function, this does too. Together I get more than either gives me alone.

Also, quite frankly, I am angry. All the time angry at all the crap out there. I am a heart on the sleeve kind of guy and I can't just ignore all the hate, and discontent in the world. It makes me angry. The exercise helps keep me from blowing another gasket. I have enough nuerological problems without adding psych problems too. ;-)

Way to go E-boy! I have not ridden my bike in sometime. I am planning to start riding tommorrow. I used to run a ton. I ran a few marathons. I know it was one of the few times I could really stop and think. Hope thing are okay for you!

Never had my run that High Jim, probably never will either. Big torso, short arms and legs make for a less than efficient running machine. I do enjoy getting the angst out of my system though and, who knows, on a particularly bad day I might just manage a marathon. :-)

I am glad to see some guys making some headway on this. I got some good news this week. My doctor had threatened to put me on medication for lowering my cholesterol this past fall. I got the recent tests back and had made at least a 20% improvement in my blood profile!

My doc was impressed but not nearly as much as I am.. eheh Some element to be grateful for.

Now.. it's back to the wood pile and another twenty minute stint of splitting.

Cheers! Ian.

Cheers Ian!!!!!!! Way to go! keep up the good work!
Jim

Thanks for the nod Jim. Like E-boy I get some of the rage out of my system with a bit of intense exercise.

I used to run a lot but that's beyond me just now.
Hats off to you E-boy I know the intensity of running is what I'm after.
Cheers all. Ian.

Thanks guys. Your efforts have inspired me to at leat start up again. Today I rode my bike 7 miles to work and I will ride back home tonight. I hope this is the start of something. I am planning to do a annual 33 mile bike ride on the 29th. I will keep you posted. Keep up the good work!
Jim

I am going back into the gym again tonight... I find on the rough days a little reward helps. For expample, this particular gym sports a sauna. :-) It must be the swedish and indian blood, but sauna = sweathouse to the indian in me, and same thing for the swede. Now if they just had a cold pool outside the gym even the Irish guy lurking around in there would be happy. 'Course, I'd probably have a heart attack using it! The object with a cold pool is to sit in the 160 degree heat of the sweat house until you can't stand it anymore and then jump into the, just above freezing to 60 degree or so, cold pool. I could pull it off in high school because that was pretty much any kind of out door swimming in Idaho (most of the running water is coming off of glaciers, or is some other kind of rocky mountain snowmelt and winter snow up there isn't gone until mid-june so it's COLD). Nowadays, I'd probably just go into immediate cardiac arrest or something. Damn, getting soft in my old age. ;-)

I prefer road work to the treadmill to be honest, but I am still somewhat climate shocked from going from the Arabian Gulf to an East coast winter. Granted Va has nothing on Idaho, but it over a hundred degrees colder on some days than what I was used to overseas. So, I am slowly reaclimatizing myself. Besides, on a treadmill I can zone out and not have to worry about getting hit by a car.

I could never do the treadmill thing. It was to boring for me. I think you are doing the right thing. You have a huge climate change to deal with. I agree you will be safer. There are idiot drivers everywhere. I always liked the whirl pool.
Jim

gosh you guys are ambitious.. heh

Right now for me it is all talk. I have only done one day. It is a start though.

Talk is good.. at least for me. It seems like public commitments help me some.

So here we go with just that.. five days a week.. no less than twenty consecutive minutes a day.

I'm aiming for progress so I'll accept lesser times if my lame old (feeling) lungs at least get opened up a bit.

I'm not going to be fussy about exactly what I'm doing.. if it's shoveling snow or filling the porch with wood.. it'll count.

I'm not going to keep any records other than the days I get the job done checked onto the calendar. I just want to enjoy the time for what it is.

Another stipulation for me will be that it has to be outside. A fast paced walk to the river.. giving the dog a run for her money wrestling.. I'm going to try and remain open to a wide variety of activities.

Tonight I played with the dog hard enough to get the blood pumping and it was fun. I'm beginning to think more about fun.. heh I'm not very good at it. Practise will no doubt improve things. < g > .. you guys can see me smiling as I write this yes? heh

Now.. if I can make a nice little graph like Paul made for his novel progress... hmmm well we'll see.

Cheers boys. Ian

Way to go Ian! Making it fun with anything we do is the key for us. I love to ride otherwise I would not do it. I will go for 4 days a week to start out with. I know I won't make any graphs but I will keep track. I did ride in again today. That is 2 in a row.
Jim

Ian,

Keep in mind I made most of my progress on a ship at sea. At first I started small. Worked up to a half hour a day five days a week. Then I started noticing all the darn marines in the gym making me look bad. If there's anything I can't stand it's a smug jarhead! ;-) Besides, half the reason I was doing it was temper control and I was going through the wringer on the ship because they wrote me up for a psych symptom and called it misconduct even though medical was aware of it and dealing with it and said it was most assuredly not misconduct or even a big deal (it was a really minor issue, but one of the master chiefs in my department didn't want any head cases on HIS ship fit for duty or not and he made it a point to ignore medical which is, incidentally, illegal as hell. Point is I had a lot to be angry about. Between all that running and being angry, even the marines were starting to give me the "what's his problem?!" look. I guess I may have snarled a few times. Go figure. I mean they bark, who are they to talk?

Lastly, even working 16 hour days on a deployment there is simply too much time to have on ones hands. No one there I want to socialize with, I've read darn near the whole library, and even on an aircraft carrier you run out of places to go you haven't already been. So, it was a matter of staying occupied or going stir crazy. I filled my time up with training other people on their warfare quals, maintainance, repairs, and the gym.

Jim and E-boy et all
Yes fun helps. I'm not what anyone would refer to as "light" so any practise with "fun" is worth doing.

I may not get to the graph either but it's a nice thought.. might hit on Paul to send me a template. < vbg >

Two in a row is great. String them up Jim!

E-boy your comments about rage are uncomfortably familiar. I now internalise most of mine which is just as bad or worse for me than when I vented it on others. A self destructive fool.. yes sir..

There was once a time where I sat za-zen morning and evening and managed to run quite a bit too. Those were the most peaceful times internally for me. That type of discipline seems a ways off to say the least.

I have cycled plenty too but not since the mid eighties. I once did a 110 mile day. When I was cycling I was covering about 30 miles three times a week. Eventually I ran myself into the ground and had to stop. I have done the same with running. I've run marathon distances and trained for many months only to over do one aspect or another and sabotage the goal and or my ability to sustain the effort.

I got quite practised in yoga too.. now I just want my wood pile finished and the strength to help with a few construction projects to contribute to the family needs.

Jarheads is such a descriptive term.. hehe

Moderation in all things is an attractive goal for me. Starting small is essential but if it's too small I forget about it.. if it's too big I avoid it.. what a juvenile.. wish I had a big bit of "grownup" to chew these days.

I must say it's good to have company. Thanks guys.

Eeyore

I hope this image isn't too big. I modified the calendar page from my yahoo account.

If this is too slow to load for some I would welcome the feedback.

Although this is not day one of this venture it feels like it..
Cheers! Ian.

Another day.. another weeks wood split..

Does anyone know if I will be able to simply modify (edit) the image above instead of posting multiple images when I need to update it?

If not, I'll post it elsewhere and just post a link to the updated image I think.

Cheers! Ian.

LOL.

When I fist saw the calander, I thought you were scheduling to have A.D.D. every day. lol

oh.. but I am.. hahha

Ya I guess I should lose the add button... rofl

Looks like we have 90 minutes to edit the posts so I'll have to wait until tomorrow to post the next generation calendar.. ;^) I laughed too.. still laughing.. heh

Cheers! Ian.

Ian,
I do not know that much about computers so I can not help with the calander. It sounds like you have done a lot of different things. I ran a few marathons myself in my younger days. I have done quite a few long rides to. You guys are helping to get me going. I took Sat off, but rode 20 mile yesterday. Today I rode into work again. I am feeling a little better. I am like you I need to do more than a little workout, but if I overdo it I won't want to keep it up. I think I am the small guy here. I am 5'8" so that helps me in the running area. Oh well I got sidetracked. Keep up the good work.
Jim

That's ok Jim, I know more about computers than is good for me.. < g >

I have done many different things and none have been sustainable. My deepest desire would be to establish enough of a routine with this activity to have it blend into a lifestyle change for the better.

I'm glad to hear you find this thread of thought motivating. I do too.

How long did it take you to do your twenty mile route? What was your cadence? I almost miss the bike! Gravel roads have made horses more appropriate. Last year I rode very little. Maybe this year I can ramp it up once the weather warms up some. I have harness to drive her in the winter but I don't need anymore wood so it's a bit pointless.

Taking pleasure for pleasures sake is a struggle.

I'm 5'10" and have lost about 20 pounds since the summer to leave me at 170 which is still marginally heavy still. Muscle tone might help some... ehhe

Your side track looks like coaching to me.. personal touches help keep it real for me. Thanks.

This thread seems like it belongs on it's own in "Peer Coaching" or somewhere at least under it's own heading. Does anyone else feel the need? I don't want to move if this convo gets lost in the shuffle.

Cheers! Ian.

Ian,
I am up for the move to peer coaching, but I do not mind it here. You are doing a good job. You weigh a little less than I do right now. I need to get down to 160. I am 177 right now. It took me about 75 minutes. My candence was problaby 90 to 110 strokes a minute. I averaged 16.7 mile an hour. I do have a road bike. As I get into better shape I will get faster.
Jim

Jim
I guess there is no need to move this thread then.. it was just a thought.

I cut back on my potatoes, rice, bread and pasta and lost twenty pounds without even noticing. I didn't get all extreme about it but I did cut back. Now I prefer to eat less carbos while doubling up on the low fat protein.

I used to aim my gearing at 60 revs per minute when I cycled. I'd die a fast death at your rates.. lol

==insert huge distraction factor==
I still have my old road bike but the rubber is all rotten and it would take some time to bring it back into shape but it might be fun to do some of that again.

It was so mild today.. moisture was making the farm smells sharp in the clean air. The smell of thawing horse buns is a favourite right of passage on the road to spring. It was just below the freezing mark today with no wind speak of so splitting was comfortable in less clothing. The bluejays were scolding me the dog was hounding me for a wrestle.. work was cruising..kids came home happy..

The rage in the cage.. the vicious tongue.. the self loathing muted by the deer walking bye, both of us having made it through another killing season.

Take care. Ian.

"I'm from the government. I'm here to help." ~ E-boy

:-)

GOD I LOVE THAT QUOTE! HA HA HA HA HA HA! Sorry, an old supervisor of mine used to say it in the most sarcastic manner possible and I have long since taken it to heart.

E-boy do you keep a folder full of signatures? I'll trade you.. ;^) I take no responsability for the offensive nature of some of mine though.. < g >

Great picture. I was wiped out today so I did not ride. I do end up losing about 10 lbs once I get into shape. I might ride tonight after work. It depends how I am feeling. My legs are latic acid city today.
Jim

I'm not working hard enough at this to need a day off.. and with any luck that's just where I'll stay! heh

I love the images on the web. I never tire of the variety... thanks.

Jim do you warm up and stretch and all that stuff? Lactic acid is no fun. How do you gauge how hard to work?

Cheers! Ian.

Chaotic,

I keep 'em in my head.


"A Smith and Wesson beats four Aces"~ Murphy

You have a head?.. cool.. ;^)

I have a tough time remembering lunch..

Cheers! Ian.

So much for hardly working. I took my pulse after I was done my twenty minutes today and found I was working to almost 80 percent of max.

If I remember correctly ones maximum heart rate is calculated as 220 minus your age. I was 77 percent of that. I think you have to be above 60% to have any positive effect.

Whatever the case I expect part of my suprise comes in not knowing how little work it takes to get my heart rate up. I suppose the Dexedrine is playing a part in that as well but I'm too green to know by how much.

I've got to stop splitting for a while and do some stacking. I don't get the same satisfaction from stacking it up neatly as I do watching the pile grow...

Another day in paradise. I have made excellent headway at work this week although all I've done today is cook. Company this afternoon for coffee and wide ranging discussions in the forcast.

Cheers! Ian.

Hey Ian,
Sorry it took a while to get back to you. I took today off too. I felt better but I needed to give my wife a ride to work today. Your calculation is right. I notice my pulse is higher with Adderall XR.
I have used a heart monitor, but I just go by how I feel. I am for some reason able to push myself quite hard. Sometimes to hard. Hope the company was good.
Jim

Jim and or anyone else.. if you disappear for a few days I won't hold it against you.. really.. < g >

The company was good. They didn't stay long enough though. If I'm working hard enough I have a much better tolerance for people. This is a good thing!

I didn't take today off but maybe should have, as my motivation wasn't at it's best. I didn't realise I was working as hard as I was. I don't think you are suppose to train above 80% more than once a week or so if I remember correctly.

I do feel much better this week with the consistant output though. I notice my sinuses clearing out a bit of goo in the process. It's nice to dream of running again. I expect there is enough manual labour around here to keep me busy for the forseeable future though. That's not all bad.

I'd like to be of more use to those immediately around me. Cleaning up the garden weeds and getting some construction type projects done would be a big hit around here. It's good to dream isn't it? Unfortunately it seems as if dreaming is all it is. On second thought I think my dreams are best if I just focus on tomorrow's efforts..

In six weeks I'd like to show some significant improvements.

Cheers! Ian.

Ian,
I do not read to many books about working out. I just kind of do what feels hard. I did get back on the bike again today. I rode to work. It felt better today. I rode a little faster. I am still feeling really winded after riding up hills, but that will get better. Sounds like your doing a great job. I think will both have show a lot of improvement in 6 weeks. Oh to answer a question you had earlier. I do not strecth before after I ride. I probaby should but have not done it.
Jim

Actually the latest research says not to stretch cold muscles. Warm up with calesthenics, or a lighter version of the exercise of choice for a few minutes, then stretch. Stretching cold can produce tearing and soft tissue injuries, or so I'm told. The fact that I stretched cold throughout highschool athletics and never got injured must have been pure fluke. I coulda won the lottery!

Want to hear something funny? I have 2 degrees in Exercise Physiology (well almost) and am going to school for Physical therapy. My world revolves around exercise. I can quote just about any research study out there. I really know my stuff. My 8 or so jobs int he last 4 years have been in the exercise field.

I work out exactly 0 times per month. I just can't stay focused.


BTW, if anyone has any questions about working out, I will gladly answer them.

88ssp and crew.

Thanks for the offer. If I run into trouble I'll let you know.. :D

Jim I used to read a lot until I figured out that life is more about the "doing" than the "knowing". Now I resort to the information to ensure that I'm not so far distracted that I'll miss the tried and true recipes..

E-boy the warm muscle thing always made sense to me.. thanks. I spent a couple of year practising yoga and through that learnt to stretch patiently.

It's a bit like cooking for me. Once I used to avoid cookbooks but was missing the fundamentals. Once I could make a white sauce without much trouble I was able to improvise more. It's like that with exercise and me. If I'm not reminded of the fundamentals I loose my way and in no time I'm doing something that isn't sustainable. I'm not anxious to loose my way on this supportive thread. I feel the strength of your presence growing every time I post. I am already feeling the benefits and have great faith that this type of commitment when carefully chosen could be a very effective tool for me. I like the feeling very much.. thank you all who contribute here and elsewhere. It helps.

I sympathise with 88ssp. I know how that feels to be very knowlegable but not able to put much of it to work. My whole existence right now is centring around how it is I can engage more with the world around me. I have a plethora of resources and very little practise in putting much of it to work.

The exercise is the first step for me in making a public commitment to do something good for myself that I know will have many positive rewards. I'm hoping that this will help lead me to a life more involved in "doing" rather than only "knowing". This is what I want.

I think I've said here before that even if I never learnt another thing, I don't likely have life enough left to act on what I already know. Life is in the doing. It's a skill I have to practise in order to develop...

I'm tremendously dissatisfied with how far away my deepest dreams are. I'm sick of it and have come to the point where little else matters besides making some steps toward a more satisfying life style. I'm the king of distractability... but of course here on the forums I'm just one more person struggling to make some headway.

Here is another mark on the calendar thinking about bikes.. and spring and watching my wood pile grow.. and my smile broaden.

Cheers! Ian.

Another one done. I am tired tonight. I can't tell whether I'm getting my daughter's cold or whether the body is just removing some of the cobwebs it has accumulated.

I did some consistant cardio exercise before allergy season one year and it paid huge dividends by reducing my allergy symptoms to neglegable levels. I hope I can reap the same rewards this year.

More will be revealed I'm sure.
Cheers! Ian.

"Talking about music is like dancing about architecture".
http://home.pacifier.com/~ascott/they/tamildaa.htm
:rolleyes:

After yesterdays relaxed day off today was a strong showing..
Cheers! Ian.

:rolleyes:

Way to go Ian,
I am working my way back into shape. I did do my 33 mile ride yesterday. It is a very hilly ride around an Island here close to where I live. I was pleased with how I rode. I did better than I thought. I took today off. I will start up tomorrow.
Keep up the good work.
Jim

Thirty three miles.... That should pay some dividends.. Are you clipped into your peddles? What kind of bike are your riding? What style of rim? How much psi. are you running? I have fond memories of my old road bike.

Well done Jim. My twenty minutes looks pretty pale in comparison but that's not going to hold me back. At this rate I'll be well positioned for an active and productive spring and summer. I just need to do a little bit and keep at it.. the rest will come.

I meet again with my coach tomorrow. I'm looking forward to telling her about the progress.

Cheers and thanks.
Ian of the endless wood pile.

Ian,
Thanks. It is a Fuji Team road bike. It is very nice. I have speed play clipless peddles. I run at 120psi and have ritchey rims. The ironic thing is that The whole 2nd half of the ride I could not get clipped in. I came close to becoming a sopprano if you know what I mean. I am sure your coach will be impressed. Like you said this is your base to do more once the weather gets better.
Jim

drool....

I know I am very lucky. It makes riding fun

Got some semi-good news last night. Been concerned over what adderall has been doing to my blood pressure. Noticed at the gym right off the bat during warm up that I was already over 70% of my target heart rate.... ADDERALL. It went much higher while I was working out proper and I did that for most of an hour before it was sauna time (My favorite part). So, for most of an hour I was at 80-90% of my maximum heart rate. That was a little spooky especially with the blood pressure stuff going on lately but I felt fine, so I just did my thing. They have a blood pressure machine on premises so I went ahead and sat through a test about 15 minutes after my workout. My heart rate was still around 136 beats a minute, but my blood pressure was remarkably low.

Anyway, I was out of the routine of running for a good many weeks in transition from ship to shore so I am thinking my heartrate will go back down to reasonable, have to bust my butt to make my target rate, levels within a few weeks. One hopes anyway.

Getting my little twenty minute hit in during the early hours of the day seems to be better all round. I'd like to get it in before breakfast but that seems out of reach right now.

My whole day is changed because of it. I'm calmer over all and this leads to a better chance of catching social cues. I'm still quite cranky. Once the bank account has recovered a bit and stabilised and the fruits of my labours generally start to show up I'm quite sure that I'll lighten up in the glow of consistant progress.

As the clouds part I'm quite frightened when I glance backward. Nothing to do but walk forward.. no running yet..

E-boy I don't know what the blood pressure should be doing in regards to exercise and the drugs I'm on. I should look into that... yup. It seems as if my ability to bring my heart rate down is crippled some. I expect I'll taper off this Dex train and use as needed instead of the 10mg slow release in the morning and another 5mg standard release in the afternoon.

I'll start monitoring my heart rate just as I become conscious in the morning to see if I can learn when to ramp up the intensity of the exercise and when to back off for a day or so. This has always been a terrific indicator for me. If I'm working too hard my base rate is up. If I'm ready for more work it will drop.

My elbows are beginning to show signs of stress. I know it's a six week project to adapt some of the tougher tissue like ligaments and tendons. I'm a long way from there. I'm off to look into some ways of helping them out. :(

Cheers! Ian.

Well, I'm glad it's not just me. The upside is that I find it very easy to jump into sustained activity, providing I am reasonably hydrated (This is trickier than it sounds, see downside). The downside, is it is somewhat worrisome and I have to drink water like it is going out of style.

I am going to bring this up to Doc's attention again tomorrow. Supposedly he has a really good ADD audio tape he wanted me and my wife to listen to, I am supposed to remind him of too. I have remembered that for a month. I only have about 24 more hours to remember it and I am sure I'll find a way to forget now. ;-)

I am no longer really pushing myself. Just glad the ball seems to be rolling well again. I was having real difficulty re-establishing the "habit" of dragging myself out. Now I have to re-establish the weights. I think I'll hold off on that until after the Physical readiness test for the Navy though.

I am also trying to rope my trash talking soon to be fourteen year old into a 5K run with me. They have several fun runs scheduled this spring. He's an active kid and I think he could probably outpace his old man easily enough if he gave himself a little credit. Besides, there's no shame in walking if it comes to that. We are only going for fun and I'll not leave him behind. It's up to him though. I am not going to make him go. I am going to though. It's kind of a reward/motivation for the whole lifestyle change thing.

What I need to do most is quit smoking. Not today though. After that, the next most important thing is dragging my butt to the Navy college office and getting my classes started. Somewhere down the list around item 500,000 or so is the very wistful wish for a trout stream and a cold sixpack (of pepsi with two beers hidden in the back ;-) ). SIGH!

Getting started for me is tough. Once I'm rolling I'm ok but I still need to have reminders frequently. I have a terrible memory. I write almost everything down. I try to practise remembering but it's tiresome and not very rewarding. There is a game under my bed that I'd like to get into making time to play with the kids. I'll drag it out tonight and have a look at it.

I drink a lot of water too but I use my urine as an indicator of how much I'm needing. I hope your increased water consumption isn't indicative of something too far out of whack. I never used to drink much but found it helped my spring allergy a lot if I could stay hydrated.

Things are definitely moving along. It has been months now without a break through to indicate my efforts are along the right path but I think things are turning around now finally. My posting rate here is sure up.. ehh

24 hours is an eternity... lol

I'm trying really hard not to be pushing myself but even this small commitment of exercise is taxing my system. I don't sleep much so that is likely the culprit. I must say though that today the twenty minutes was over before I was ready to quit which is new. I'm not moving as much flem either which is encouraging. I hail from the "people of the weak lung".

Do you enjoy weight training? I did it for a while but I'm the body type that would make a bad soup. I lean to "scrawny" when I'm fit. I could never put on any bulk lifting weights and that's why I was doing it. Clarence Bass was my hero.. lol

I like the sounds you are making in regards to running with your son. Everything you have said there sounds right on the money. The wild card of course is his to play and that's a long way from a guarantee. I'm sure that if you can continue in that attitude, he'll reap the benefits somewhere down the line as he remembers your healthy approach to him and the running. Passing it forward to the grand kids maybe.. what a warm thought that is. That really is letting the "buck stop here". I'll have to find something like that to offer my eldest. She's 16 and could use something positive from her Papa... maybe driving skills... hmmm. Thanks E.

I finally managed to quit smoking a few years ago. I don't know exactly when. I made a conscious effort not to mark the date. I'd quit so many times before that the only thing that mattered was that I didn't have a smoke in my gob that minute! I suppose it's still like that except I'm repulsed by smoke now.

Sounds as if you have lots on your plate. Classes beginning..and a hell of a list! ehhhe I have a small river going through the bottom third of our 155 acre property. It has a dozen or so species up from the Red River, that struggle with the agricultural run off. I almost never take the time to fish. Maybe once I learn to sit still for a few minutes in the morning for meditation a light will come on and I'll begin to crave a fish fry.

Cheers! Ian of the walleye dreams.

coke and beer to follow.. :p Photo of my first two trout on a fly rod.

Hey guys,
Good job. i too have noticed my pulse rate and blood pressure are higher since I started the Adderall. I rode into work today. The weather sucked. I was cold and wet. I never really got warm. I did not try to push it just try to make it. The 5k sounds like fun E-boy. Your son may end up likeing the running. I was lucky that I never smoked. Keep it up you guys. Nice fish Ian

I took my pulse in bed this morning but something must have been whacked as it was at 80/min. I hope that's not an honest representation of my fitness! I remember the days it sat at 45/min... groan....

Another day.. and stronger yet... one small step at a time.. I'm running out of wood to split so it'll be back to chainsaw work soon and that's never nearly as much fun. I expect it will yield the same results though.

Rain can be a killer. I lived on the west coast of Canada just north of you Jim for many years. I need my ultraviolet... so I'm on the prairie for good now, I hope.

Cheers! Ian.

Yeah my resting pulse is higher now. I like the rain, but it is a colder rain. Did you live in or around Vancouver? I like chain saws, but I do not get to use them that much.
Jim

I lived in the lower mainland in Coquitlam just up the valley from Vancouver for much of my childhood.

Truth be told, I don't mind the saw that much. It is intense enough to hold my attention.. heh
Cheers! Ian.

I agree with the saw. I have ridden my bike a few times from seattle to vancouver. Anyway it is one of my favorite cities
Jim

I'm not interested in Vancouver at all anymore. I still remember before the days of "heat inversion" where the summers were spectacular.

After the Hong Kong invasion I have no interest in being there at all. I have some family on the island and spend some time in Victoria now and again but Vancouver I avoid. It's like any other metropolis port city only worse because I remember when..

Now Vancouver has an aggressive edge to it that I am not attracted to. Victoria on the other hand is right down my alley... too bad I'd need to make a small fortune to live there! Everything in Victoria is only ten minutes away and you can catch trout reliably within a fifteen minute drive of downtown. The trout pic I posted was just that kind of drive.

However I've chosen the country life where land is cheap and the neighbours few... ehhe Every time we go on a car trip somewhere and camp, it's a bit of a joke in the family that camping at home is much wilder than anywhere we have camped to date.. save maybe Glacier National Park in B.C.
http://www.bcadventure.com/adventure/wilderness/parks/glacier.htm

Cheers! Ian.

I envy you Canadians. I miss Idaho sooo much! There isn't a trout stream within four hundred miles of me here. Supposedly there are Pike in the resevoir a few miles up the road, but I've yet to hook one, and even the catfish and b*** I do hook are teeny and disappointing and don't even fight much. Catfish are not much for catch and release either because they are so placid that if you don't jerk the line to set the hook at every little twinge of the rod, they swallow the whole rig. Then it's cut the line, or kill 'em. Needless to say, I cut the line. Gets expensive so I just don't fish much anymore, besides catching the occasional snapping turtle can be a bit too much of an adventure even for me. Small ones are kind of cool, but the bigger ones... Well, they are just plain tempermental and I always feel obligated to free them, and well, I like my fingers. Nope, I miss trout and steelhead. I saw a Mepps black fury lure in the bait shop the other day on base. Rotten lure for these parts. Too small for most of the fish here. Great trout lure though. High contrast, black and yellow spinner. They eat 'em up! Always caught my limit with one of those.

I spoke to my oldest boy about that 5K tonight. He said he like to go, if he can bring his friend Robert. It's a military sponsored event and family only. Fortunately Robert's dad is Army, so he gets to play too! YAY! This also means if they decide they would rather screw off and walk I am free to try to give a good account of myself. :-). I am not taking it too seriously. I have enough time to get into decent shape training, but not enough to really get into competetive shape with my short legs. If I really push it I might be able to maintain an 8 or 9 mile an hour pace. I used to be able to out do that pretty easily, but... Well, 18 I'm not. Nor am I anywhere near as lean as I used to be.

Ian, you asked if I enjoyed weight training. I do, when I am fully back into the routine. It is quite painful getting there though. I don't main sore muscles either. For some reason, it takes more out of me than running ever did. I find that a good full workout on the weights circuit makes me quite sick to my stomach. It usually takes several weeks to get that out of my system. Running has never done this to me. My weight tends to remain stable, and then slowly climb as my body adapts to the workload. VERY SLOWLY. If I stop, I lose about five pounds a week on the adderall. That's while I am running, at the present rate of course. My plan is to Bring my run up to 8 miles a day with maybe a weekly ten mile run and possibly breaking up the daily grind with some shorter duration interval training for speed. When I get my weight down under two hundred again I will begin weight training in earnest again, low weight high reps in an effort to get as lean as possible. Then I will bring my calorie intake up a little, the weight progressively up, and my run distance down, until I am running no more than a half an hour five days a week.

That should put me where I want to be. I still need to quite smoking. :-( The very thought makes me sad... Of course, the idea of dying makes me even more sad. The world needs me! Maybe...

I'll bet you ate those fish didn't you! Rub it in why don't you!

E-boy et all.
If there are lurkers.. please join us whenever.

If you are ever up into south western Saskatchewan, there is a park there that is my favourite place on the planet so far. Roughing it is best so bring a tent and find a quiet spot in the west end of this place and tie a few flies before breakfast.
http://www.se.gov.sk.ca/saskparks/parks/park.asp?park=Cypress%20Hills

There are areas that are quite developed but the west end isn't. Throughout the surrounding areas you will find joy.

There is a Ducks Unlimited project seven or eight miles from here that was brimming with pike until last winter. We were short of snow and it froze the shallow body of water to the point that the fish couldn't make it through the winter. The shores were rank with tens of thousands of pike in the spring. We had a bad winter kill that year in our river too. The Ducks Unlimited site yielded firm white fleshed clean tasting pike so I hope it recovers soon.

My brother introduced me to a technique to fillet jack (pike) boneless. I'll tell you right now that everyone thought that was just the ticket! The day we were out had us eating kilo after kilo of absolutely boneless tasty jack fillets.. what a treat. Reminded me a bit of salmon in it's texture.

Sheesh! You guys are going to have me motivated to fish too... my brother's will be wondering what the hell is going on. ehhe Feels great to be alive just now.

The run with your son sounds like a great first step. Again, your tone sounds right on! It would be nice to see some instant gratification but I expect that the results will be positive regardless of the time frame.

Cheers! Ian.

Ian,

Wow, That was one positive post! Great to see that! It was especially nice to see positive feedback on my attempts at establishing some kind of link with my sons. When they were younger we were much closer. I am sort of naturally on the same wavelength as small children. So was my father though he would be loathe to admit it. My stepsons, of course, did not inherit ADD, and my youngest, who through no fault of his own ;-) happens to share my genetic heritage, did not share in the ADHD aspects of it. So, while he and I are eye to eye on everything from cartoons to games to... well everything, it won't last long. My two older sons have some interests that dove tail with mine, but not many. They both love math on the acedemic side. I could do without it, electronics tech or not. Neither of them cares for science. I live for the stuff. They get good grades, but neither reads for recreation, which I try to sell them on every chance I get to their great dismay. They do like soccer, but they prefer hockey. I can't skate to save my life. I have more or less given up on video games, though I am really not sure why. I was quite good at them, I just sort of, pushed them away for some reason. Maybe so I wouldn't compete with the kids for time on the game console.

It seems these days that the older boys see me as primarily a guy to ask homework questions of, ask about the occasional odd factoid (they know I have a propensity for trivia), the guy who takes them to the mall, and the all purpose electronic/bike/whatever else is broken repair man.

With the little guy interfacing is easy. With the older ones it is a challenge that often involves attempting to involve myself in activities I have no interest, skill, or knowledge of. Wanting to establish a rapport with my sons, gives me the interest, but these experiments usually fail as teenage boys are easily embarrassed by father's who stink at *fill in activity here* in front of their friends. Add to this that the easy fun with the five year old in front of them brings accusations of favoritism faster than I can even say the word favoritism and with a blended family that's a big deal.

So, I was very happy when Christopher agreed to go. This mean's it's even odds my 12 year old Brian will go as well. They didn't have much patience for fishing, so maybe this more energy intensive activity will be a bigger success.

Sounds great E-boy. It sounds like you raelly work at trying to understand your kids and not just put up with them. That is a rareity. I am sorry I am not much of a fisherman so I cannot discuss it with much authority. I think the running plan is very good. e-boy did you run at that pace while you were smoking or was that before you started. That is a nice pace. I am hoping to ride a couple of 100 mile rides this summer.
take care both of you

Well, for three and a half miles that pace is probably more wishful thinking than reality. 7 miles an hour to 8 tops. I could crank 10 for a good solid two miles when I was in my early 20's without too much heartache, but I really don't know what my top end is now as I'm not in that kind of shape anymore. I doubt it's that fast. Now I can hold that 7 as a smoker. :-) In fact the post run smoke is a great motivator. ;-)

Another notch in the handle..

Piles?! That's gotta be painful! You got preparation H for them? I'll bet it hurts real bad when you gotta use the little boys room! You got one of them inflatable doughnut seats to sit on? ;-)

Seriously, I know what you meant. You know, walking and hiking or, for that matter, just what you are doing are all just fine forms of exercise. The Surgeon general here says the key thing to start with is remaining active. From there, the starting point, providing you have a doctors screening and permission (depending on age health, blood pressure, heart disease/conditon ect...), is to start with mainting a target heart rate of at least 120 beats a minute for 20 minutes at least three times a week. If that is uncomfortable they say to cut it to ten and work up to twenty. Then over the course of a few months to work up to doing it five days a week. When you have been doing that for a month or two (keep in mind this is a long haul develop a healthy life style, don't scare the american public and try to keep them from getting fat, which they are are at a frighteningly fast rate) to increase the time you maintain that heart rate to half an hour. Now after you have done that for a couple of weeks you are ready to calculate your maximum heart rate for your age, look for your target heart rate and then maintain that for half an hour three times a week. Do this for about a month and then go up to four or five time a week. If weight loss is your goal you want to increase the time to 45 minutes 5 to 6 times a week because your body will not stop using blood sugar and glycogen stored in the muscle tissue as it's primary energy source (it does burn fat too during this time, but only barely) until about 30 minutes has passed. The ideal fat burning target heart rate is fifty to sixty percent of maximum. Personally, I usually end up holding 60 to 70 % because after not training for two months and being on the adderall it is really hard for me to keep my heart rate below those rates... ;-) I am hoping it drops back down soon, because it makes me look really out of shape. Typically any weight loss over about 2.5 lbs a week is water weight. Normal metabolic processes cannot produce or metabolize tissue any faster than that. So, these diets that claim faster results are full of crap. In our case as ADDers, we often have metabolic disturbances, so what feels right to you is probably right. In addition to that, I find that Adderall tends to double that 2.5 lb a week rate and it also increases water loss.

One of the biggest single factors in health and fitness besides staying active is simply eating intelligently. Avoid major calorie deficits. You should never burn off more than 500 calories more than you take in. This means you should neither starve yourself, or overwork yourself. The end result is the same to your body. It goes into starvation mode and drops your metabolism cutting your energy usage and conserving fat. You end up lethargic, with little exercise benefit and no fat loss. Your body will instead canibalize muscle tissue to produce energy. Also, obviously, don't eat crap. Smoking is bad, and I am a very stupid but very stress free smoker. Soft drinks and coffee are bad. I drink very little soda, but they can pry my hot coffee from my cold dead fingers. However, drinking extra water can offset any bad effects from these beverages. Proper dental care, of all things believe it or not, is crucial to cardiovascular health. The same microbes that cause cavities and gum disease can get into your circulator system through your infected gums (I'm talking about non-flossers here not people with advanced gum disease) and cause coronary artery disease. Biopsies of plaques in arteries consitently test positive for these bugs. Wierd huh? There's hope from a really simple source though. Firstly, there's already a vaccine for Carries (the bug in question) in human trials in europe. In the first test the subjects took the vaccine orally and simply brushed with a tooth brush but no paste for six months and were tested for bacteria in their mouths. None were found whatsoever. The other bit of hope is a plant sugar called xylitol used in gum you can buy in the store here in the states. Carries bacteria cannot digest it. What's more, when carries is exposed to xylitol on a regular basis, it loses it's ability to digest refined sugar too. It is no longer able to digest sugar and produce acid at all. This was discovered in denmark. Where the incidence of cavities and tooth decay in adults has dropped some 80% since. Of course, xylitol does nothing to protect you from gum disease, though the vaccine would if it ever gets approved.

****, the rambler strikes again!!!!! You know what Ian? I read to much!

I'm a reader too.

Are you a primarily non-fiction reader?

I really enjoyed your comments on the bacteria. I'll be following up on that. I'm a flosser too but have enough years of abuse behind me to leave my gums a bit low and the soft base of my teeth more vulnerable.

I've had a lot of dental work done over the past few years after many years of neglect. I now have teeth which I can bit with and have some confidence.

The diet and cardiovascular information I was mostly familiar with. You have stated the facts clearly. If there are admins lurking this is worthy of a "sticky". So many people still don't "get it" about why so many "diets" fail to change anything in the long term. You have made this point very well and it's worth keeping in mind.

I'm not likely getting enough sleep to take advantage of the exercise I'm doing. I sure feel strongly that the Dexedrine is not helping either. I'm tempted to begin tapering off the medication train and see how it goes. I was able to address many of my adhd symptoms prior to last summer sustainably without meds using my coach and it may be time to return to that approach. I'll discuss it with my Dr. on the 24th and the psychiatrist on the 18th.

My eating habits are better than they have been in the past. I'm not so prone to binging. Since last summer I have cut back on starches like rice, spuds, pasta and bread. I've begun to cook quite a bit now again after a half dozen years of not cooking. One of the things I've enjoyed baking recently is course breads. yum... Hopefully this week-end I'll get a chance to buy some ingredients to make some hard loves of grain for some European style pumpernickel.

Cheers! Ian on a donut, saving his pile for next year.. heh

Ian,

I was just listening to a really good audio tape my doc gave me from a lecture to the american psychiatric congress regarding the State of the science on ADHD as of 2003. The comment that was made about stimulant meds and sleep was that when the dosage was fine tuned, the stimulant had no negative impact on sleep and, in point of fact, actually eliminated or greatly moderated the sleep pattern disturbances associated with many cases of ADHD. Are you by chance taking the extened release version of dexedrine? That was addressed by this study too. They producers don't like to acknowledge it, but extended release dexidrine doesn't work. It's no different, clinically then regular dexidrine in lab tests. Nor does the first extended release ritalin, although later versions of extended release ritalin worked well, and adderall XR works very well also. The key thing though is varying the dose to get it tuned to the individual.

Very informative guys!! I need to watch my eating habits. I like bad food. If I did not exercise I would have a weight problem. I did ride into work again and will ride home tonight. I have slept good with Adderall XR. I have had other distractions from sleep as you guys know. :D
Jim

I am taking 10mg of extended release dex in the morning and then 5mg of whatever you call the other Dexedrine after lunch. I don't think it has any effect on my sleep. I'm just a bad sleeper on any account. I was taking dimenhydrinate for a few years before my pharmacist told me me it would be interfering with my R.E.M sleep.

I quit the travel tabs and my Dr. suggested lorazepam in 1mg doses for the same effect and it seems to work well. I find it hard to admit I take all this medication. I'm not very comfortable with it. Without the chemistry assist I don't usually get more than about 4 or 5 hours sleep a night at best.

It's my internal demons/torture that keep me from sleeping.... maybe too much preparation H.. ya never know.. ehh

Is there a transcript available for the tape you got E-boy? I wouldn't mind having a look/listen to it. Sounds current and timely.

You must have some good rain gear to keep your mileage up like this Jim. Or isn't it as rainy as I think it might be where you are? I like bad food too, but mostly I just like to eat too much of whatever I eat. It keeps me tired and ensures I don't have the wherewithall to do any more than the minimum. It's sick and I do it in so many different ways.

I play guitar poorly too and this seems to be just one more way I avoid playing the hand I'm dealt. I'm frustrated today no doubt. Just not getting the traction I need. I have a million ways to avoid meeting my potential in the areas that I am strong. Grrrr. I'll try and focus on the things I did get done instead of the dark side. :rolleyes:

E-boy you sound like a bit of a mechanic. Did you see the little low temperature differential Stirling engine I built? It runs on the heat of my hand at about 145 rpm and much faster on a mug of hot water... or over ice.. whichever you choose. I built it ostensibly for my wifes science lab at school. But we all know about boys and toys... lol My Dad is a mechanical type andI had a bet with him last week that I couldn't drill a Robertson driver bit. He hasn't figured out how to "anneal" yet.. ..heh I win! I love machines. But then I love almost anything that has humans extending themselves. Your collective running pace for starters.. oh my.. ... I thinkIcanIthinkIcan..

Jim the guitar is like your bike in that I'm lucky. www.perryguitars.com Daryl and I met in the fall of 1987 and became friends appreciating each others extremes. Mine is a steel string. I suppose it's true what Daryl says about most people buying guitars with their eyes but I'm not one of them. His have quite a voice.

Ian of the much left undone.
Peace.

It always feels better once I write.. thanks for hearing me out.

Ian you sound like a very good a fixer upper. I do not know much about guitars, but I can relate to your passion. It does rain a fair amount, but it is more drisal. I just have tights and a bike rain jacket. It is inexpensive. I get wet but i sweat a lot so I get wet no matter what. Also my wife did get me a thing that you put your wet shoes on overnight and it dries them off. Hope your day gets better.
Jim

Ian, I like machines, but I'm more of a tinkerer than a mechanic. Electronics is my field.

You know Ian, over 75% of adult ADDers have sleep issues and while it is counter intuitive as hell, the present wisdom is to treat the ADD 24 hours a day. Which is to say to continue stimulant dosing at night. A well tuned dose doesn't "stimulate" an ADDer at all, and it does directly address the sleep issues because they are directly related to the ADD. Almost 100% of cases when treated this way report normal sleep patterns after treatment. No kidding. I only just learned this today and I am going to ask my doc if I can dose a couple of hours before bed come Monday. :-)

Anyway, as soon as the wife gets home my butt is going to the gym. She is mad at me again anyway. I asked her to listen to this audio tape my doc gave me of one of the nations ADHD experts speaking before the American psychiatric congress regarding the present state of research on ADHD and on his own experience with his patients. This is where I got all of that new info I mentioned above. She was less than enthusiastic, and when I commented she didn't have to listen if she didn't want to she blew up at me. It went down hill from there.

Sorry to hear that wedgie boy :D Just kidding!! I hope you have a great work out. I can relate to the wife being mad as you know :D

Hey crew.
One more kick at the can today.

E-boy the tape sounds like it's wonderful. Do you have any links that might be appropriate? Is it marked "April 24th 2003"? I see a pdf file at: http://www.nimh.nih.gov/research/Roundtable2003message.pdf

Interesting about the stimulants at night. I'll give that a whirl tonight and see what happens. I'll loose the Ativan of course.

I notice a difference between the two forms of Dexedrine E-boy. The 5mg after lunch kicks in rapidly and is sometimes unpleasant if I'm over tired or feeling weak in some way. I sometimes get a bit of a panicky feeling with it but never on the 10mg slow release stuff but obviously the science isn't there to back that up. I know we are all different and that I have not taken the time to eliminate some obvious possible factors in this observation, but life is short.. and I'm not that interested in the details of it really. I want to be off the meds altogether but I'd best just hang tough until I'm stronger and on better footing.

I've never been able to follow things electrical or electronic. I'm fascinated with the computer and it's works but I'm really not that skilled. I just don't have the disciplined math brain to make a living at it. Linux is a political and social commitment rather than a technical appreciation.
http://www.firstmonday.dk/issues/issue3_3/raymond/#d1

Jim I seem to forget that if it's raining it can't be all that cold! ehhe Especially if you are riding at a good pace. Oh how soon I forget.. ;^) The shoe drier must be just the ticket!

A fixerupper I am, yes.

I'm so grateful to have a partner that is sympathetic. I'll try to keep my mouth shut about it.. you guys seem to have your hands full with the other thang.. strength to you both. I got a peach. Found her in the classifieds.. but that's a story for another day..

Well Ian, My wife really is a peach too. She had just been through a lot before she met me, and I was the knight in shining armor before the promotion sort of overwhelmed me, and circumstances soon after that pushed anxiety issues, that I had always assumed were normal, so far beyond normal they simply could not be rationalized away. Had I known I would suddenly find myself so out of control of my own life, I never would have dragged her into things. She refers to the "ME" prior to all this stuff manifesting itself so spectacularly as "The old Dan" and often pines for his return. I really can't blame her for this. I have aggravated long standing issues of hers that she was completely above board with me about. No, she is not completely fair all the time, and she has done and said insensitive things, but she has no real concept of what ADD is, so I can hardly blame her for doing what everyone else in the general public does and listening to the Media and many of the mainstream doctors and psychologists who are inexplicably still in the dark ages on ADD, if they even acknowledge it's existence. I know I have not always been fair, or even nice. Hell, put me on a bad med mix, combine that with the ADD symptomology like speech editing issues, and sensitivity/defensiveness and I could be an out and out bastidge. So, I give her credit. I still hold out for a better day though.

Electronics are no different from machines. The math required is unbelievably simple. Computers, you see, are stupid. Just very fast. ;-)

E-boy between you and Jim I am left with my jaw on the floor. You both give me plenty of reason to pause and think before I "go off".

Thanks for the insight.

I have done a double shift today as it just felt right. I worked twenty minutes in the morning and now I'm just in from another 36 minute flurry. This now ends the wood I had bucked up into stove lengths and begins the next round with the chain saw. I'll take tomorrow off and pick it up again on Monday, all things being equal.

It's still cold enough to make the work bearable. It won't be once the bugs come out so I'm trying to get it well underway for next fall. I have plenty enough split for the next heating season to begin but it would be great to be a full year ahead... but then there is the summer kitchen to finish... ah.. dreams.. :rolleyes:

It's kind of nice to see the arms popping veins that no nurse would have trouble tapping.

It looks like yesterdays blues were temporary which I'll take as a good sign.

Off to the shop to see if that's still functioning as well. ;)
Cheers.. Ian of the juvenile calendars

I live by calendars! Of course, I suppose I'm sort of juvenile. I've got energy at all the wrong times, for all the wrong things. I've a tendency to wear my heart on my sleeve and my speech tends to reflect exactly what I am feeling. I think it is too my credit that inspite of the fact that if it crosses my mind it comes out of my mouth I generally manage not to say horrid things (the major exception being antagonistic meds making me angrier than I thought I was capable of being. Even the docs that caught it were impressed that I had been on them a year and a half and was never violent with anyone (not even a hint of it). This as an impulse control problem ridden ADDer! Do you think we've got a guy here with a real gentle streak or what? I was, as I said, a world class reactive jerk and even I was horrified by some of the things that came out of my mouth). With the exception of the one chemically induced incident of bastidgeness I'm an overly sensitive very defensive boob when I'm upset and I say some spectacularly ridiculous things, but they fall under the realm of just that, RIDICULOUS.

Believe me, if I was too horrible my wife,Robin, who is a victim's rights advocate for domestic violence would have been long gone. She was victimized by her ex-husband verbally, emotionally, psychologically, and physically for ten years before she finally got away from his sorry ***. At the beginning of our time together I could not even wake her up without her jumping three feet in the air and I had to be very careful how I pitched my voice when speaking to her because if I even sounded like I might be upset she would flinch. You had to make noise when entering a room she was in so she knew you were there. Even when I could tell she did not agree with me she would not say so or raise her voice when angry because she was afraid. She was afraid of men in general.

Believe it or not, I took it as a hell of a compliment the first time she ever yelled at me. That's when I knew for sure she felt safe around me. Completely safe. You see, she may not entirely forgive me my foibles, and she may not find me the most reliable man in the world, but she knows beyond a shadow of a doubt that I would sooner cut my own arms off than hurt her or those kids. After a while she decided I was probably just a wuss in a big giant body. I'm kind of non-conflict oriented in my general philosophy, you see. There just aren't that many things in life worth potentially coming to blows over as far as I'm concerned. The safety of my family and defense of my person are about it. I would also go to the aid of a person who obviously needed it, of course. Anyway, the wife used to put me on the spot wanting me give people a good talking to she thought needed it all the time and I would talk to them but I'd do it my way, which apparently wasn't the aggressive intimidating "Go straight to blazes" talk she wanted to hear. So, she decided I was this big wuss in wolf's clothing... :-)

One day, when my in-laws were staying with us (FOR THREE MONTHS!!! ARRRRRGH!!!!!!!!!!!!! I love 'em but that's a really LONG TIME!) One of the neighbors decided to have a little altercation with a young man he caught in the house with his daughter when he came home from work. Only he decided to have it in my yard. They were getting pretty loud and scary, and my mother in law has a very bad heart. She was popping nitro like it was going out of style. Me? I was actually oblivious to all this at first because I was focussed on the computer. My wife shook me out of it and asked me to put a stop to it before her mother had another heart attack. So out I went. I remember asking nicely the first two times. I remember I wasn't nice the third time and I was loud enough that the whole neighborhood heard me and lots of lights went on, and I may have used a bad word or two.... I don't actually remember the rest. I guess between untreated anxiety and the ADHD I spun up a little higher than normal... The teenager was the smart one. He left. The dad wanted to "Discuss it with me". My wife got to watch me physically remove him from my property. **** I wish I remembered that part more than vaguely! I didn't hurt the guy, but I must have scared the crap out of him because he had been harrassing my mother-in-law and wife on a daily basis prior to this incident and he didn't come near my home for three months after it, and then it was to apologize to me.

When I walked in the door, it was dead quiet. My mother in law was making tea, my wife was staring at me like she had no idea who I was, and my father in law said, "I don't know who the hell you are, but what did you do with Dan?" After that my wife no longer pushes me to "stick up for her". I think it may have been about seeing if I was capable of protecting her. It saddens me she feels so unsafe in this world. It saddens me even more she made me promise not to do anything to her ex... :-( He's given me a few excuses and I had to be all civilized and let the police handle it. GRRRRR.

See, she has her share of problems. I try really hard not to dump mine on her. Realistically there is no way to avoid that, of course. Man, I'm a dope. I didn't know this would happen when I married her though, or I'd have never put her through it. I have also told her I would not blame her if she decided to leave, nor would I play any games with the finances or any of the usual crap you see these days. She's still here. Maybe, I'm doing something right. Probably by accident knowing me. ;-)

I am not the gentle type. I likely fall squarely into the "abuser" category. I have a sharp tongue and a quick temper. Like many with ADHD I have a hard time with perspective when it comes to priorities. All my priorities look of equal importance to me and time just kind of happens all at once. This often leads to frustration. All the viscousness has moderated tremendously but it's not gone and the tolerance for any of it around here has diminished to near zero and I don't blame anyone but myself for that.

Last night I made another booboo with my middle daughter and scared her by being angry. I'm almost completely impotent when it comes to being a parent except for the negative impact. I still have some positive impact as a father but as a parent I'm dead in the water. I just don't know how to nurture those I'm close to.

I can school a young green horse to be kid proof, I can teach a dog nearly thirty words before it's a year old. I can grow almost anything with life in it.. but I am not good with my family... or myself as far as that goes. It's a sad day when I see the reality of being a fifth wheel at home for the most part. It is like being a stranger in my own house.

Your ability to culture a safe place for you wife is remarkable. What a great story. It made me smile thinking of your attention to detail and the satisfaction of knowing that her yelling at you was only proof that things are better for her now. Well done.

I was supposed to go out to my father in-law's today with the family but couldn't face it. Between the incident with my daughter and my trial with evening doses of Dexedrine I didn't turn out the light until after five this morning. I'm profoundly sad throughout. What a roller coaster I'm on these days.

I think I will begin to look at taking measures to leave. Or at least to have that option available if my wife and I thinks it's for the best. I don't like people for the most part and can hardly make friends with myself so maybe it's over due. In the mean time I'll stick to my guns about productivity and contributions to the household and keep plugging away at what I "can" do and try not to focus too intently on that which eludes me.

I heard your comments about the medications and dialing them in. I'll follow up on this with the professionals in my life.

Cheers! Ian.

This was Brenda.. a dear friend of mine.

Well boys it looks like at times we all have our relationship issues. I really like your stories E-boy. That is great that your wife can yell at you now. I do yell back at my wife, but no matter what I do it does not seem to work. I am like e-boy in a sence that I do not do conflict. I think my is so much so it is an isssue. I have never had abuse issues with my parents so I do not know why I am so mild mannered. I am very competitive and when in games I have lost my temper.

Ian do not sell yourself short you may be doing much better than you think. I know I thought I was going to be fired from my job and asked only to find they have no clue what I was talking about.
Well back to the physical fitness part. I did not ride this weekend. As you know I am great at wiping out on my bike. Maybe I did not tell you. I have broken both shoulders wiping out. About a month ago I got caught in a road crack and the bike went down hard. I was okay, but the derailer hanger bent a little bit. It caused the chain to skip gears and the chain to rub on the spokes when I was in low gear. I advoided low gear. That gave me a good workout. I took the bike in sat to get fixed. It should be ready today. I got a new helmet. Take care guys,
Jim

Ian,

These days, I am very like you in that I have had no patience at all. My wife is always angry with me, and her being able to yell now, while it is a good thing, has worn out it's charm in a big way.

My normal self is the gentle soul. I spend too much of the time overwhelmed these days though and that is from the fighting. Overwhelmed Dan is no patience Dan. No patience Dan is the guy who finds it to be near impossible to be good natured about the boys incessant arguing. The Dan who the five year old gets mad at for getting after him for being antsy (Five year olds ARE ansty). The Dan who gets into arguments with a 12 year old over household decisions the 12 year old has no say in (I catch myself and say "Why am I arguing with a 12 year old?"). I can be quite Cranky Ian. Though not the down right nasty Guy I was on that bad med mix (Wellbutrin and lexapro don't mix well). When I am not overwhelmed, on the other hand, Patience is something I have in spades. Easy going is the name of the game. I once had an angry gentleman punch me full in the face and didn't lose my temper ( I looked him in the eye and asked what his problem was. Turns out he'd been drinking This was in a bar, I'd just arrived in, so go figure. My reaction wasn't quite what he'd expected. He sort of changed colors and left in a hurry. ;-) Lucky for me he wasn't much of a puncher.). My wife used to say I had the patience of God. Heh. Guess I'd be the devil now...

Don't get me wrong, I'm not as bad as all that. I'm just very reactive. I think I'd fall under the category of not much fun, at my worst.

Hi crew.
It looks like I'll be comfortable with a half hour now. That equals twelve logs. :D

I don't think I'm selling myself short at all Jim. I talked to PU (wife) last night after they all got home and the kids cleared out. Although she was sad to hear of my observations, she did not deny any of it. It was a calm discussion. She was sad.

For a week now I've had a clarity about my position and options that I have not had before. A selfish posture of sorts that leaves me quite focused. I'm not at all feeling like I'm headed off in unreasonable directions on impulse. I'm steady in my actions around the home through the internal roller coaster. This is unique for me.

Over the last month or more, I've taken up a lot more house hold duties and have begun to once again enjoy the kitchen. Work is comming along nicely and the cash flow is on a steady rise. PU has been quite exhausted over that same period and she's very appreciative about the extra efforts I'm making. I'm not doing it explicitly for her where once I would have as part of the "honeymoon" E-boy has spoken so well of elsewhere, but it's nice to be "part of" in what ever way I can be.

I told her about making it possible to leave if necessary and she isn't interested in that but I made the point that if it was ever deemed appropriate it would be much easier to do if I was in a position to actually make it happen myself. It's not that there isn't a bunch of things going well, it's just that my history has left things in such a position that even some of the small transgressions are not tolerated. I certainly feel like I'm losing my kids emotionally if in fact I ever had them. So really it's just a question of keeping the damage to a minimum.

I feel like if I can stay the course with the exercise that all will be well in the end. I have to hang on to something in order to feel like there is at least a rudder in the water. Whether the direction is true I can't tell but one thing is for sure. Without trying to head out on a path there is little chance of getting to making the dreams reality.

I got a lot of things done yesterday while the family was out. I got the new controller unit installed in the range hood and fixed the mini vac.. Mr. fixerupper.. Cleaned up some in the yard as the snow melts and set the repeating trap up in the basement for the spring rush if mice into the root cellar. I also took the time to partition and format a new hard drive so I can finally migrate from this old Redhat system and onto something new like Gentoo and Knoppix. I broke up the 80 gig drive (WD800JB) into twenty partitions for three separate operating systems.. ehhh oh how I love machines..

Gentoo I have built up before but finally found the drive was beginning to fail and causing the operating system to fail each time I got it within liveable configurations. The Gentoo is built entirely from source code against your specific hardware if you really want to play... and I do. It'll mean at least a month worth of downloads and compiling time but hey.. this machine is a hobby not a profession.

Cheers! Ian.

You guys sound so pratical and seem to see what is going on in your lives. It is something I hope to get to soon. I see what is going on around me and know that if I was advising me that I would tell myself that I am not going about it the right way. In a lot of situations I have taken the easiest road and not the high road all the time. Hopefully that will be the case. Good luck and good thoughts to both of you.
Jim

Dan is it ok to refer to you as Dan instead of "E-boy"?

I don't see others referring to your first name and I don't see you posting it in your signature but I'd look forward to talking to Dan..it's easier to type.. heh

I really appreciate the reality check on your patience. I'm not as hot as I made it sound I guess. I have made a lot of headway regarding my impulsive nature, but am still subject to :

HALT or
H = hungry
A = angry
L = lonely
T = tired

One of the things playing a large role in my frustration is the business of not commanding much respect from the kids. If PU isn't behind the idea, it has no teeth and I'm ignored for the most part. Not a good feeling. This is not beyond my understanding. I see how this has happened and this week-end I finally saw that my mistake was in expecting it to be different when nothing has changed on my part.

I don't know how I will or whether I can make inroads in this but I will stick to what I know and try to keep things moving ahead in hopes that things may change for the better. I do get very frustrated when I see that the girls are manipulating events with the knowledge that although I may be correct, without PU's sanction they won't have to submit to anything I might ask. My wife can't mediate all things and shouldn't have to but maybe this is a way for us to team up more intimately again in the parenting. I've quit asking much from the girls. I think this point is worth digging into a bit more with PU and I will.

This forum as a back board to sound out ideas is a very good thing for me. Thanks for hearing me out once again.

Cheers! Ian.

Originally posted by E-boy
Ian,

These days, I am very like you in that I have had no patience at all. My wife is always angry with me, and her being able to yell now, while it is a good thing, has worn out it's charm in a big way.

My normal self is the gentle soul. I spend too much of the time overwhelmed these days though and that is from the fighting. Overwhelmed Dan is no patience Dan. No patience Dan is the guy who finds it to be near impossible to be good natured about the boys incessant arguing. The Dan who the five year old gets mad at for getting after him for being antsy (Five year olds ARE ansty). The Dan who gets into arguments with a 12 year old over household decisions the 12 year old has no say in (I catch myself and say "Why am I arguing with a 12 year old?"). I can be quite Cranky Ian. Though not the down right nasty Guy I was on that bad med mix (Wellbutrin and lexapro don't mix well). When I am not overwhelmed, on the other hand, Patience is something I have in spades. Easy going is the name of

the game. I once had an angry gentleman punch me full in the face and didn't lose my temper ( I looked him in the eye and asked what his problem was. Turns out he'd been drinking This was in a bar, I'd just arrived in, so go figure. My reaction wasn't quite what he'd expected. He sort of changed colors and left in a hurry. ;-) Lucky for me he wasn't much of a puncher.). My wife used to say I had the patience of God. Heh. Guess I'd be the devil now...

Don't get me wrong, I'm not as bad as all that. I'm just very reactive. I think I'd fall under the category of not much fun, at my worst.

Ian
That sounds like a good idea to me!

Wow.. I'll have to print this out and staple it to my forehead so I can never forget that I've been called practical!!! Whooooohoooot!

Just kidding of course although it is true that "practical" is not my strong suit.

I do feel like I can see more clearly just now. I don't know why either although I do hope it lasts. It happened last week-end. Saturday afternoon to be specific. A shift... go figure. All these years and now I feel somehow empowered to look after my own interests. Not to the exclusion of others, just the contrary, but to include myself in the care I take with so many things. Really odd.. I like it very much but the feeling is new and frankly odd.

Thank-you Jim for putting me in the same paragraph with E-boy.. he's got a great rational mind that leads the way.

Until last week-end I felt exactly like you described in your post. It is not a pleasant feeling. Strength to you.

Cheers! Ian.

Originally posted by biking guy
You guys sound so pratical and seem to see what is going on in your lives. It is something I hope to get to soon. I see what is going on around me and know that if I was advising me that I would tell myself that I am not going about it the right way. In a lot of situations I have taken the easiest road and not the high road all the time. Hopefully that will be the case. Good luck and good thoughts to both of you.
Jim

Thanks Ian,
I know I will get there I am still in a situation where as I grow I am forced to justify it and am still looking out for oncoming traffic that sometimes comes way to fasy. Hope I made that clear. You each inspire me in my own way to become a better person.
Thanks,
Jim

Me a great rationale mind?....... Have you been drinking Ian? By the way, Dan is fine.

I have the same issue with my children you do, for the record. It gets to the point where rather than ask me to do something for or with them they will ask their mother. After several go rounds with this I finally told both her and them that I am a person, not Mom's pet and I speak English so if they want something from me they have to ask me. If I say no, asking Mom if I'll do it doesn't trump me, it virtually garranties the answer is no and probably no the next time too. If you want to reason with me and you make good points my mind can be changed. If Mom comes to me independently, and makes good points, or makes the thundercloud face, my mind can be changed (or made up depending on the whys and hows). I am not an unreasonable man. For her part, my wife has the nasy habbit of complaining to the children about my shortcomings rather than just to me. I could see complaining to a close friend or confidante, or even to her counselor, or mother, but complaining to the children undermines my position in a big way and then she turns around and wonders why I have difficulties with them when she is not here. I tell her, "well it might have something to do with what you've been telling them about me" which she tries to deny. When I point out our middle son quoted one of her favorite gripes and rather than just send him out to the salt mines for life as I thought appropriate at the time, he was still in his room. Then she gets mad and asks me what I expect because everyone is angry with me. I tell her I expect her not to sabotage any attempt I make at doing better. Needless to say, it doesn't get substantially better after that. Sounds like you and PU at least are on the same page.

Indeed PU and I are for the most part on the same page. She's not beyond embracing change. The pendulum has swung back and forth during our 18 year tenure. I feel a change coming on. I expect her to see the wisdom of the merits of a united front to help alleviate some of my frustration with the girls. I'm excited about the prospects of what that might bring if I'm able to play my cards at all well.

You two are in a very tough spot in comparison. Funny that it is me who is coming to peace about leaving or at least doing without or something or something.

Jim if you feel inspired it's likely the fault of your willingness to remain open and searching. You offer up what you can, I draw strength from that too. Thanks to you bud. This whole thread is an inspiration for me. David's creating the board another... Andrew, Paul and Tara's wisdom too, along with all the regulars who tread before me, showing us the way. Dan's another story.. ;P~~~~~~ eheh (jk)

gratefully yours. Ian.


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Thanks Ian,
I am ready to learn new things and to come out from the problems in my life. I think I am open to leaving if that will make us both happier. I would not want to do that without saying I tried my hardest make it work. Yes and I agree with you on the others. Dan, I beleive you will be a very good pyschologist.
Jim

And try we do.. and laugh some too.. heh

Now what is that signature all about.. "Shoot low"?
Ian

I love to laugh. It is supposed to be a joke. My brother always used to say that. I enjoyed it. I have a dry sense of humor, but I do have one. Also I love slapstick. Did you ever see the pink panther movies with peter sellers. They are very funny

Yes Peter Sellers is a hoot.. I'll bet the kids could stand an introduction.. hmmm

Dan is another story? Is it a scary one?! I love scary stories! Oooh! Tell me, tell me, tell me the scary Dan story! Is Dan a monster?! Is he scary?!

Sorry... What's all this about leaving Ian? Also, I am sorry about you being up all night on the dexidrine. There was the bit about "Fine tuning" the dosage first. You should be able to take a nap on it. You know Ian, too much stimulant can cause irritability and contribute to mood issues. Or you may well have co-morbid conditions you are unaware of. A full 50% of ADDers do. And a good many of those conditions are mood disorders HINT HINT. My point is Ian, before you go throwing in any towels, and before you accept the judgments passed on you your whole life, you may want to consider these items. Of course, I may be making a giant *rhymes with Bass* out of myself here. You may well have looked into this stuff already. Or you may have done what I initially did, which is to assume the docs would have looked for this stuff automatically. Don't count on it. Even some of the "specialists" seem woefully uniformed these days. The most recent studies are published though. You can arm yourself with information and find doctors who are familiar with it.

Don't mean to preach Ian. You are older and wiser than I. You may not believe that, but I do. I just hate to say anyone give in on the basis of percieved reality when, we, especially we here at the forum, know that what's percieved to be true, even by us, isn't necessarily the truth. The truth shall set you free Ian. Or make the guy with the negatives a little money on the side ;-) as the case may be. My point is, you have a neurological syndrome, that tends to have co-morbid conditions (you may not have been checked for), tends to be poorly medication managed, and the often undiagnosed co-morbid conditions tend not to be medicated at all. This syndrome deeply affects the very parts of your brain that regulate emotional responses, impulse control, and all sorts of other things. I just don't want you to look at this as necessarily this huge unsolvable character flaw. You'd be suprised what the tiniest little changes in the strangest places can do.

A very well written, and well thought out response, E-Boy! :)

I only know the first few paragraphs of the Dan story.. and it's a joyous one so far... at least for me and not scary in the least.. well.. hmmm it's scary how much I like the dood... lol but this seems to be scaring me regarding some others too... ehheh

Re leaving: PU had made a comment the other night after I scared our middle daughter "Boo" about how she thought that "it" would never change. I have no doubt that although "it" whatever "it" is has had some major changes to it's overall makeup over the last three years. Something snapped last week-end and I gained a bit of clarity hitherto unknown to this scatter brain about myself and how I feel and what I need. Although I'm serious about making preparations to be able to leave it's more about calling PU's bluff and saying and feeling that if what I'm doing and have done is not good enough for her then I'm ok with that and I'll be out of here. I feel that this brings to a head the need for some perspective on just what the realities are here. She's a workaholic and looks like a bag of dirt most days. She's having a tough time keeping her eyes open after about 8:30 in the evening. She's got glaucoma on the rise.. recently diagnosed with pre-diabetes.. can't sleep.. All the while Ian is lightening up and contributing more and more financially and being so much more active in getting garbage can's emptied, meals thought up and prepared, repairs to this that and the other thing. And best of all happier.

PU's still rational for the most part but the focus is beginning to shift. I've got good colour in my face and my body is loving the increase in activity. I just think it's best to put things in perspective. If it was determined that my leaving would lend our girls a leg up or somehow help them to flourish with more vigour having me out of the house then why not leave? However I think what will happen will be that the pendulum will shift once again here, and the current realities will come more into focus and not the entrenched views that were developed over the past year as I crashed and burned.

The girls are already showing signs of looking at me in a different light. If I left, I'm quite certain that things around home would not be better off at all. I expect that it would be much worse in fact. I think everyone knows this but the kids have been riding a wave of "Mum control" with limited to no input from Papa and that now is coming to a close... PU seems not to recognise it but I think the girls are at least thinking about the smell of change in the wind.

If it turns out that I was the "stick in the spokes" then I'm better off away from them and they can blossom to their hightest potential. I'm not going to drop out of sight. I just won't be "live in". Or at least that's what I'm proposing. Nobody else here is approving of this plan but me and I'm not pushing it, I'm just tossing it out as a wise option if I'm as destructive billed or not able to change in ways that PU deems appropriate. I feel it is important to make the point that PU is entirely spent and that the girls are using her lapses to take advantage of some behaviour I don't think should be sanctioned under the "good parenting" flag. Like throwing out silver ware in the garbage because it's easier than having to deal with the lunch kit you have left for a week at room temperature.... repeatedly.. enough times that people notice how much is missing when they set the table for dinner. The dog showed up with a couple of spoons and I figured out where it was all going. The burning barrel!

There are a number of things like this that aren't helping. Things go missing, messages don't get relayed. Tonight after work, PU apparently drove two hours out of her way to pick up kids from drama only to find they had not gone to rehearsal. PU had asked specifically of both older girls that they contact her at work if there was a change in plans as I was gone until late tonight. This is an ongoing slack that PU picks up and I only appear to be interfering with when I try and address this type of thing. There is a long list of others that no doubt are exaggerated by the close proximity of our living arrangements.. and other circumstances but it's a huge extra load....hold on to your hats now.. We are raising three kids in a house that measures 265 sq. ft. Imagine.. heh Privacy is something others give you in this house not something you can take. This situation has it's benefits but it is intense on all fronts.

Dan, I'm not giving up on anything. In fact I have never felt so committed. But the primary commitment is to me just now. I believe this will be good for all concerned. I am gaining some much needed self esteem and confidence. The other players will be forced to deal the changes inherent in that confidence. If I'm not respected it's likely because I'm not respectable in their eyes. If that's ever got to change then I'd best look after respecting myself in as many ways as I can find to do so.

E-boy your comments are so very welcomed. I was off to the big city today to make the first significant bit of cash flow in months, early this morning. I had three major calls complete for noon and spent 45 minutes with my favourite luthier talking about wives, eggs and kids lutes and guitars.. Then I covered lots of ground killing off long outstanding chores all over the city for another three hours then hid away in a mall to avoid the rush hour and did some shopping. PU can't buy the same shampoo twice... so today I looked after that need in me for a shampoo I like.. ehh bought a poo load of cheapest of cheap stainless flatware too.. let them throw it out! I bought glasses I'd like to drink out of.. oh I had a ball. I grabbed an internet cafe $2 twenty minute terminal and read your post.. I was overwhelmed with warmth. What good care you take with people. I felt like it would be pretty hard to fall down too hard with you guys on my team. Thank-you for that. I don't remember ever feeling such solid support as I'm receiving from you people. Thank-you rings thin but I do thank-you. It feels great. I have hope.. real hope that this is the start of something great.

You mentioned the other day about "fine tuning" and I did not miss it.. I'm just a slow perk on some things. I've been watching my behaviour more closely and I think you are right. I read this post of diesel's with interest.

diesel's comments on tailoring give me a big clue about how I might approach this meds business.
http://www.addforums.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1495

The benchmark of being able to nap while on the meds I hadn't heard. I've also got an appointment to talk to a psychiatrist about Welbutrin on the 18th. Is this a good idea or is the group wisdom that I might want a longer more tailored trial with Dexedrine just now? I am not in a rush... just want some results and the Dex has some drawbacks. I'm more anxious on it. I can't stop picking at my nails.. Anxiety is something I'm not looking for more of. I generate plenty on my own! ehhe By the sounds of it most of my complaints may very well be dose related.

Dan the fact that I chose to experiment with what I thought was a small dose of Dexedrine before bed was entirely my own curiosity at the wheel of responsability. It was a Saturday night and I had nothing much planned for Sunday and a lazy day would not have been unwelcome. As it turned out it was a pretty good day all round.. no regrets and it ain't your fault.. at all! Thanks for the tip.. please don't throttle back on my account.. < g >

The first round with Ritalin had a dangerous rebound. Didn't like it at all. The Dex is not obviously inducing a rebound but I'm missed things before.. yup!

Does anyone have any experience with grass? Marijuana?

I need to look at a defintion of co-morbid. Although I've heard the term I couldn't define it for anyone. I have not looked into much. I was at the bottom of the barrel in the middle of October still quite sober through Christmas and just now find some life coming back into my bones.. The coach is back in place, the forums are acting as daily coach.. the cash flow is way up... the food is fabulous! and I feel changes occurring that may well shake the foundation. Now is the time to be considering these terms yes. Thank-you for the nod.

I'm not throwing in any towels.. I'm not leaving any time soon and doubt that I ever will.. it's only a means to an end. If PU is suggesting "it's" (read -- my shortcomings) always going to be unacceptable then the choices are few. I think I have gained some insight and she has lost some perspective. She's maybe not aware of the changes yet. This will change shortly. Everyone seems a little more alert these days. For instance the dog and chickens got fed and watered before I got home.. signs of life... or maybe just scared... I don't care really.. it felt good not to have to go to the barn at midnight. I'll be sure to say my thank-yous.

ok.. beddies..
Cheers! Ian.

hmm .. I've made a faux pas again.. I thought I'd seen a private forum for all things co-morbid but I understand it was in my imagination..

Please drop me a note someone on links I should see regarding co-morbid and adult adhd.

I'm sorry for the length of the post above.. the cup spilleth over blah blah blah.. < g >

Cheers! Ian.

Ian,
I understand where you are coming from. I need to do the same thing with my wife. I did not see clearly why you thought you needed to go. I have known for sometime this is what I need to do but have only on a few occasions actually followed through. If my wife feels I am a detriment to her happiness than I will be happy to move on. Great to see your new found confidence and clarity.
Well back to the workout issue. I have not exercised since Friday. My bike is in the shop. I hope to get it tomorrow. Well take care guys

I wonder how she'd feel if you started destroying her things? I get this lecture from the wife sometimes. Only with me, It's because I'm about as graceful as a drunken waterbuffalo indoors. Accident prone, in other words. I have knocked over this and that, spilled wine, coffee, or soda on this or that, dropped chinese food on this or that, the list goes on and on. When we had been dating for some time, I bought her a new living room set, and I made sure I had everything scotch guarded. ;-) Get me on a soccer field and I can be the very picture of grace, but in confined spaces... Well, let's just say, I need some time and space to move my booty with style and grace. ;-).

Ace, may have been on to something with this earlier when she said you had to watch the gift thing. Your wife is lashing out at things she knows you value. What to do about that, I don't know. That is something you have to evaluate on your end. I might refuse to accept any further gifts from her. "What's the point, if you are going to hold it over my head or destroy it later anyway?"

Hey Dan! Sorry I have missed you the last few times. I am in the same boat. I am lectured over and over for things I am a clutz about. I am listening to everything you are saying. How are things on your end?
Jim

Hey crew.. I feel you guys with me all day.. it's a good feeling. I am grateful for your patience. I'm gathering strength from this in big pails.. mucho gracias.

No I don't speak any Spanish I just like the way those words feel in my mouth.. :rolleyes:

Jim it's not so much that I'm needing to go away. It's more like I've become willing to do so. It's a fine line I'm sure but it's true enough. I really don't have any intention of leaving but I am becoming ready and willing to go away. In this way I hope to become healthier both inside and outside the home in the ways my relationships function. It's a long story but I'll make this version short in light of last nights transgressions.. heh

When we married we chose a new last name. For anyone familiar with John Steinbeck's "East of Eden" the word is the central thesis of that story. As I understand it the word means "thou mayest" and that's what we have based our marriage on. So "out" has always been an option in theory. PU has had less trouble with the concept than I have but now something has changed in me to enable me to see that willingness as an asset to the bigger picture. It feels like a bit of "growing up" really. Just a lot less of "two halves trying to make a whole" and a lot more of two wholes choosing the relationship, each from a position of strength.. well.. that's the theory but regardless of the theory, I'm filled with the sense that this is an important thing for me to attain. Whether I stay or go is not nearly as important as having a real choice about it practically. Most of this evolution has been an emotional one. I now have the mindset in place to want to be standing on my own.. emotionally and physically.

This is not something I have to do with/to/for/against my wife. It's something I have to do with me. I hope that's a better look at where I'm at with this. I'm not a fan of bailing out on relationships but death isn't the worst thing that can happen for me.

I got to bed at about 4:00am this morning and today after 3:00pm I was anxious that I leave enough daylight after work and chores to get my time in and get that heart pumping.. ehhe man it strikes me as funny that the need to put the little gold star on the calendar is enough to get me out there when I'm as knackered as I was today. So I got my 20 minutes in and found myself quite strong. I was surprised to find myself comming out of it actually feeling better and livelier. Oh.. baby.. bring it on.. I'm so sick of being sick.. I want to feel good.. a lot.. so I'm paying the piper.. one little investment at a time.

I am getting pretty callous about protecting my time to work out. I love the feeling. I'm finally willing to defend myself even if it's not approved of by someone else. This is progress in my books. I've fantasised about being free to contradict others for the sake of my well being ever since I can remember and now I can begin to gain some experience with it. IthinkIcanIthinkIcan...

You are eating a lot of pain Jim. I guess we all know what that tastes like. I hope you get to taste something else once in a while. I'll bet you'll welcome the bike home! When is it supposed to be finished up and ready to go?

Dan your question "I wonder how she'd feel if you started destroying her things?" reminds me of my base line check for sexism in advertising. I hate the "dumb **** male" commercials where the guy can't figure out how to take a teaspoon of cough syrup by himself and the like. I love to reverse the roles in my imagination to check how that same thing might fly if the genders were reversed. It's often quite funny to consider.

I think Dan's right on about the gift giving thing. I was raised on bribery and coercion and I'm not easy to hook up on those terms anymore. Breaking cycles is the toughest darn thing out there but it's my ticket out of some of these strange loops I get stuck in.

Cheers all. Ian.

Ian,

I think I understand what you mean now about what you have been saying about being ready to leave. You are talking about independence. Full independence. It makes sense really.

Once again we are on the same page. I've sort of been doing the same thing. I've no intention of leaving my wife and children, anymore than you do, but I've also no intention of allowing myself to be in anyway dependent due to my "issues". I found myself that way for a while. The wife would rail, and cajole, when the timing suited her (in front of witnesses), but due to a combination of circumstances we were down to one car, and I had had my license (due to an error by the DMV) suspended, and then when that was fixed it expired. She lost her ATM card, carried the only check book (this is common practice in military families as the service member is not home to compare notes for the balancing of the books), she borrowed my ATM card and promptly lost it right around the time hers arrived in the mail. So, I would ask for the fee money to renew my license and a fight would erupt every time. So, I just quit asking. Periodically thereafter she would bring it up in front of friends or family and go on at length over my long term lolly gagging in getting this important task done. So, I'd ask again, more fighting... Anyway, eventually it got done due to extroadinary circumstances. To this day she insists I lolly gagged even though I got my head bit off every time I brought it up, and when I point that up, I get told I had horrible timing... Maybe I did, I don't know. All I know is having my car is much better than car pooling. It's not a great car, but it get's good mileage and most of the high failure rate parts have been replaced and the heater works. New tires too. Any car that's reliable that can be bought and paid for without financing, is a good deal as far as I'm concerned. On Navy pay no less!

I'm pretty much covered now. In the event that the wife wants me out, and I hope it never comes to that, I just get a separation agreement from the magistrates office, present it to the barracks admin weenies on base and get myself a room. They'll charge me something for it, but it won't be too bad. Ships are even simpler. You live right there on the ship. The accomodations aren't posh, but it's not bad and there are even some good things to be said for it.

Worked out at lunch time today. Hydration helps a lot it seems. Been dehydrated so much of the time lately that I forget how much impact it has on energy levels and stuff. I am still no where near as fast as I was two months ago (it has to be the adderall making me de-train so quickly), but I still felt like a deer compared to yesterday. :-) Ran for a full hour too. My average speed wasn't so hot. Started out slow for the warm up then just ramped up to 8 miles an hour which felt suprisingly comfortable and maintained that for a few minutes, and then slowed it down gradually until I had completed my first mile and a half in a passing time for my age group for the Physical Readiness Test (I figure if I push myself hard through at least that first part every time, I should get some speed gains). Then I held it at 7 miles an hour until the 15 minute mark, dropped down to 6.5 until the 20 minute mark. Dropped to 6 even until the 25 minute mark, and held 5.5 until the 35 minute mark. I did five minutes of five miles an hour at a five degree incline, went back to one degree and back up to 5.5 and slowly climbed the speed and the slope back up to 7.5 and five degrees, which I reached at two minutes before the forty five minute mark and held for two minutes. Then I was pretty **** pooped. I cooled down by running the remaining fifteen minutes at progressively slower speeds. 0 degree slope 7 miles an hour for a minute, then 6.5 for two minutes, 6 for five, 5.5 for three, and 5 for four minutes. The machine kicks you into cool down for five minutes after that. My heart rate was still well above target after that five so I reset the machine started a walking pace and set it for ten minutes. I managed in 15 minutes total to get my heart rate down to 134... It stayed up there a good while too. It should start coming down soon with the exercise. It was high at first on the ship too. By the time I had my daily runs in the 7 or 8 mile range I had to really work to hit my target heart rate and maintain it even on the adderall. So, heres to hoping it comes back to that soon. It's not that it hurts, or is hard right now. It actually feels pretty darn good. It's just strange is all, and you do get the occasional odd look when your heart rate is in big red numbers right there for the passerby to see and whistle at. I've been covering it with a towel.

I got out before breakfast to get my twenty minutes in. I didn't have any meds in my system either and I felt better off. My late nights caught up to me today though. I was tired.. still am. I did not get the boost I was expecting from an early jump on the exercise. There is always tomorrow. < g >

I'm going to have to learn about tweaking this stuff I'm taking. Any suggestions would be welcome.

I think we are on the same page now too in regards to the power to stay or leave. Thanks for hanging in there.

Some of the behaviour you two describe in your partners is nightmarish. Loopy? I suppose though that if I could look closely enough I'd see my share of fruitloop moments in my own conduct. But I don't need to go there do I? eheh

I appreciate the detail in your body's responce to the work load. I'm not sure it's wise for me to be keeping that close tabs on my own at this point but yours lends some perspective at any rate. Gracias.

Have you talked to a doctor about your extra need for water intake yet?

Cheers! Ian.

Yeah, It has a lot to do with the combination of meds I am on. The adderall, of course, doesn't help much, but the topamax is a really big culprit in that it substantially increases water loss through sweat, respiration, ect. I take that for my anxiety and as a mood stableizer, it's off lable use. Normally it's proscribed as an anti-convulsant. Doc's main comment was to watch for hyperventilation (Metabolic acidosis is a nasty side effect that can make you dead with this stuff, fortunately quite rare), and drink lots of water unless I enjoy kidney stones. Gotta love his sense of humor. I asked how much, he said double my intake. Something I was pretty much already doing anyway, on the pharmacists say, so, and in fairness to Doc I think he said this before too. I forget a lot. Mind you this is for the combo not because of the stimulants. For you, just make sure you get at least a good eight glasses of water a day and you're set. Eight ounce glasses, don't drown yourself. ;-)

As for tapering your dosing on the stims... The best bet might be to just talk to your doctor about tailoring the dosage. You might even consider a switch to another med. Depending on what is available. Adderal is quite effective for me, and the Navy likes it because it's the cheapest thing they got. ;-) Usually different meds come in different dosage sizes even in extended release form. For example I can go ten, 20, or 30 milligram capsules on the adderall. I am sure there are probably even variants on that. Dexidrine probably has the same kinds of variations. Try asking your provider for three capsules of one third size your present dose, and try cutting your dose by one third (take two capsules in the morning) and see how you feel. If it isn't flying go ahead and take the third. Just some ideas.

Stimulant meds are relatively safe to work with if you do so with your doc's advice. They've been using the same two main molecules since the 1930's as the active ingredients in every stimulant based treatment product out there for ADD right now. They're safer than tylenol. Anyway, if you cut your dose slowly, you should be able to get to the point where you can take a nap and still get symptom relief. Keep in mind, one thing, the part of the molecule that does the work in treating the ADHD, is not the part that makes it a stimulant. There are a whole butt ton of other compounds in this same family that are also stimulants that just don't do a thing for ADHD. No, one of the other complexes on this molecule seems to mimic a nuerotransmitter. So, maintain the dose long enough to make sure you aren't suffering from just plain tiredness before you decide you need more "juice". Rest, eat, have some water, whatever, then do something you know requires concentration and see how you do. If you do lousy then maybe you weren't on too high a dose of dexidrine. Or maybe you just cut it by too much. Or maybe, you have co-morbid conditions like rapid cycling bi-polar that get in the way of the stimulant working properly.

If that last part sounded involved Ian, it's because the very best solution, particularly to the co-morbid question, is to find a good specialist, up to speed with the studies done in the late 90's and only recently published, have them do a full screening and see what they find. This can be a time consuming process, but worth the effort if it results in more effective treatment.

Oh, Doc, thinks my heart rate will calm down as I continue my workouts. Particularly as I don't feel especially tired when it's that high. I'm pooped by the end of the day though. Ten thirty P.M. and I can barely keep my eyes open. Had a good workout today though and tomorrow is Friday! YAY!!!! Not sure what I have to look forward to, but I'll think of something! :-) Take care Ian. Get some rest.

Hey guys I am back for today and possibly tomorrow and then I will be on vacation . Then the following week my wife is going to spend a couple days alone on a trip of her own. That will be a nice break for both of us.

I understand what you guy are saying about being ready to leave, but not planning to. I can say that I am honestly not there quite yet. I still am in the mode that I try to accomodate my wife some. I am working on me and think I am making strides. I am ready to go if that is what needs to happen. I do not feel I am dependent on my wife to survive, but unfortnatley I am still dependent on her to gauge what kind of person I am and if I am good or bad. That is something I am working on to control how I feel about myself without response from others. That make sense?

No bike yet. I will get it tomorrow. The things I am getting I do not consider gifts. It is stuff I want.

Good job on the workouts to both of you. I am looking forward to when I share what I am doing with you guys. It will probably next week.
Jim

Well, I would choose a different wording. I have no intention of voluntarily going anywhere unless my wife asks me to. I rather like the company I have. The point is not being dependent. Anymore than my wife would want to be dependent. In fact, she wouldn't tolerate it, so I think she can understand that much. In my case the car situation getting taken care of pretty much re-balanced the scales. My independence has been restored, insofar as being able to move about freely to do the things I need to do, without imposing on everyone in the free world. Long story, we won't go there again.

Hey, I'm at 21.63 miles for the week, not including today! I'm hoping to throw at least another five in today. It's not like on the ship when I was cranking out 7 or 8 miles a day. I had been quite confident I would bounce back much faster. I am not sure why this hasn't happened. Maybe because I am not pushing as hard because I am not as angry as I was. Anyway the Navy physical readiness test is in May, and the 5K is coming up in April. My weight is dropping quite rapidly, but when you discount water weight (the stuff that comes back by the next day with a good healthy amount of drinking water), it is a more sensible, but still pretty fast 3.5 to 5 lbs a week. The adderall is doing that. Normally your body won't metabolise tissue faster than about 2 to 2.5 lbs in a week. Anyway, my nutrition's good so my running times which go from 45 minutes to an hour should be leaning me up some. That's the plan anyway. Calesthinics, will soon give way to light full circuit weight training, and as my body weight comes down the weights will increase in amount and reps. Finally, when my weight hits about 180 or so, I will taper off the runs until I am doing about four miles a day, and go high weight low reps on the full circuit weights, and put on as much muscle as I can. Then I will continue the running as is and weight train until I max out on strength for my weight, at which point I will try to bring the reps up to three sets of eight, the run up to five or six miles three times a week, and just maintain it. This will probably put my body weight at somewhere between, 225, and 240 which is right where it wants to be, and my body composition at somewhere between 5 and 12% body fat, which might be a tad low, but I can always eat a few potatoe chips. :-)

Will I ever actually get to my goal? Maybe? Not as far off as it sounds, Like I said that's about my normal weight anyway and as I have to meet Navy fitness standards anyway I'm probably between 14 and 18 % body fat now. As to whether I make it using that route, or I get quite that muscular, is anyone's guess... I'm having fun though, so who cares?

Another one before breakfast!
I got some help this morning.. :D Manon (eleven) came out with me before breakfast and moved the process along doubling the speed. We did about 30 logs in a half hour. Manon was pumped to be helping. It took me completely by surprise but what a nice surprise.

Manon has a mild streak of oppositional definite disorder. I expect she's adhd as well.

I found that she had been "whittling" with my hoof knife in the barn the other day and had left it in the barn loft on the floor. I suggested she should always be careful to put the dangerous things back where she found them. In the city on Tuesday I bought her a knife of her own. She hasn't stopped using and coddling it since. I think it was a hit.. and likely accounts for the hand with the wood. I'll take it whatever way it comes. ;)

Dan I think I followed your comments on the meds. I appreciate the effort. That helps me a lot. I got a pill splitter today and had a chat with my pharmacist. I'll halve what I'm taking now and see how that goes for starters. I'll toss the whole question past the psychiatrist on the 18th.

Jim I hope you get a well needed break on vacation . Sounds like good news all round for you . When you get back you bike will be waiting and so will I.. me for an update.. ;^) Take care and we'll see you next week.

Dan, I'm glad to hear the car care has moved the scales.. story is not necessary.
Why wouldn't you run outdoors? I love seeing those types of numbers for hours you have invested.. Nicely done
I want the before pictures taken right now! This should be fun!!! What a huge transformation. Is the process helping your outlook any? Ship side the exercise didn't seem to help much with the anger but do other things change when you do this type of build up?

Having fun... hmm man I can always use the practise on that one. I'm having fun with my efforts too. I'm not even feeling too chagrined standing next to you too and your physical prowess either which is new for me. I don't seem to care much anymore what I'm doing in relation to others.. I feel so powerful just now it's spooky. Not hyper just quite focused and calmly confident.
This too shall pass..
Cheers! Ian.

Ian,

Every time I walk into the gym there is always someone (a good many someoone's actually) who can do more, and this sometimes makes me feel more than a little uncomfortable.

Finally I just decided that I do this for me, not for them, or for the sake of any hypothetical audience and I measure my performance against my past performances and compete with myself. It works.

Ian, you are doing all the right stuff. You have every right to be proud of the progress you have been making. My only advice would be to avoid placing myself and Jim on pedestools. Your main limiting factor from my understanding has been medical circumstance. That being the case, you should be doubly proud of your efforts rather than self effacing.

Dan I know... yup yup yup.. and for the most part I've avoided the pitfalls you mentioned. I agree with every point you made.

Today I noticed a marked rise in how much I could do in the time allotted. I am going to increase the time to a half hour a day. Once I can sustain that I'll introduce another session.

I reduced the meds to day by half and took the time to figure out when might be to hit the second dose. I took 5mg of Dex (long) at 8:00am and took a booster at 4:30pm of 2.5mg Dex (short)

So far I'm guessing this is going to show a better level of success. The anxiety is way down and the consentration seems to be up. I felt better today than I have for a while. I'll sit with the dose like this for a week or two and see what's up after that time. Thanks again for piping up.

Cheers! Ian.

No worries about piping up. Piping down has always been my problem. I can never seem to keep my yapper shut when it most needs to be. Some how those moments seem to equate to me as the same as all the times as a kid when I wished I could speak, but wasn't afforded the chance. So now, to a greater or lesser degree, If I feel wronged (and I can be quite defensive) or I think someone else has been, I have a tendency to say something. Usually something quite modest at first, at least if it's on someone else's behalf, but it doesn't take too long for me to ramp up if I really feel things are being done in an underhanded way. The down side of this is that people close to me these days often find it difficult to talk to me about things they ought to be able to. I don't take criticism as well as I should. Oh, on my good days I am fine but if I'm overwhelmed (which is pretty much all the time these days due to stress) I get defensive, impatient, and am generally less than receptive. A communication technique virtually assured to communicate absolutely nothing, except maybe that I carry a lot of distrust for other people from the past that has nothing to do with persons in the present... And I wonder why she blows up at me sometimes.... Heh, I can be very blind to something right in front of me. I mean this is something I am well aware of, and yet I still didn't even see it happening.

I have got to get out of this line of work, or find a better way to cope. Demotion back to what I was doing before, while it will certainly fix the problem is not an option. My family has gotten bigger since then, a pay cut is the last thing I need and, quite frankly, I earned that promotion. I am a **** good tech. I'm just not so hot with politics, or some of the other job description changes that went with the promotion. No, adapting somehow is what I need to do, and do well. Well enough I have some brain juice left at the end of a work day. In the mean time I have to get the home situation resolved to everyone's satisfaction. ADHD is only a peripheral issue here. Oh, the symptoms are all big players, but the real problem is communication and while the ADD may have had a lot to do with screwing that up the ADD is mine and the responsibility rests with me. So, what to do about fixing it....? More gym time for sure.... It helps me think, it calms me down, it relieves the bursting dam feeling behind my eyes. Then I think I will concentrate on using those things attached to the side of my head... Ears I think they're called. Yes those things. I'll try to use them more and the mouth less. When I start feeling defensive I'll just repeat over and over to myself, "She's not them. She's not them. She's not them." Who's them? Take your pick. Old teachers, my father, my mom, a doctor or two, neighbors, relatives, all sorts of folks who thought they knew exactly what I needed to fix my ills. None of them had much good to say most of the time, except mom, of course, she would just lose patience.

Will this fix things? Is it all my fault? Oh, I doubt I'm the root of all evil... I mean, I had nothing to do with the Kennedy asassination... REALLY! Point is, while I have been very hurt by some of my wife's behaviors I haven't been being very fair to her. Oh, it wasn't intentional unfairness. Just typical Dan communication troubles.

I feel very lucky that she has put up with all she has from me, especially in light of these realizations. I feel sort of ridiculous about some of the whining I have done about her here too... How I must have made her feel, shutting her out like I did... OUCH! Yeah, I think I can understand her blowing up.

Mother Theresa she's not, but then neither am I and she's a lot closer than I am in more than just gender.

Still, we have discussed all of this. I have an opportunity to make some changes that show she does, in fact, matter very deeply to me. I haven't worked this hard for this long, and tried very hard to be brutally honest with myself (with some obvious hiccups) to let a little long overdue constructive criticism like this go to waste.

The only thing I can see this changing is the dynamic at home for the better. I suspect many of the things I wanted from her, may come of their own accord, for simply having listened without the involuntary stroll down memory lane.

Manon joined me a again for the last bit. Promotion through attraction.. hmmm I must be getting better.

I'm one of those who tends to lead with my mouth as well. I talked to some professional coaches in a conference call Tara had posted a link for. It was Thusday night and I noticed I was so slow and deliberate in my questions. I used to go off so fast many people would just shake their heads and walk away having grasped nary a thread of what I had been saying.

If I'm on the ball I force myself to walk slower than I normally would as well. Ramping up is something I've learnt to be cautious of. I can't think of a single instance where it has helped anything for me to be cranked up. Happy, angry or just stupid, I'm not the right guy to handle the ramp in too steep a mode.

"Overwhelmed" is a state that seems to be addressed quite well with lots of physical exercise. I finally saw a resting pulse below 60 last night. Sheesh! I was muscle sore yesterday. Not so much so that it would prevent a healthy half hour today but my body is feeling the work that's for sure. I'm just flying through the workload now. It would be interesting to see the increase charted. I was fantasising about having a body to go along with the healthy heart after imagining you and your talk of weight gain. But first things first and there is a whale of a lot of work around here that could use a strong and healthy Ian with enough stamina to keep at it.

I hadn't articulated it before but I used to take the position that I was essentially the root of all evil. I'm not saying this to be extreme but I was constantly taking responsibility for things that weren't wholly mine. I hope I can continue to keep a grip on my current state of affairs which seems to be more balanced in this regard.

Your partner sounds human like the rest of us.. < g > I think that much of the healing and progress that goes on around here has little to do with ADHD and more to do with fundamentals like communication. Currently I'm trying to re-establish some credibility over issues regarding my authority by practising issuing consequences instead of getting angry with defiant kids. What doesn't follow in this short note is a long dissertation on old dogs and new tricks. Suffice it to say I'm struggling. < vbg >

I'm not sure this is coherent.. might have to have a nap this afternoon, my legs are weary.

Cheers! Ian. :bowl:

At least as coherent as I am Ian. :-) Don't forget to take rests on those work out days! It's very easy to over do it and out pace your body's ability to bounce back. Take a day or two every so often to take stock. That might be a good time to write down where you are at.

Resting heart rate coming down is a very good sign. Means your cardiopulmunary system is getting more efficient at rest. Your particular choice of work out, more than likely means you are also putting on some muscle which will, in turn, increase your basal metabolic rate by increasing the amount of actively metabolically active tissue. In short you'll burn more fuel simply by being awake and about. A difference of as little as three additional pounds of lean muscle mass can add 32,000 calories to your annual burn. That's a ten lb net loss by years end by actually gaining some weight! HA! This is why weights are important, though often overlooked. They are also done incorrectly most of the time. Ideally, unless you are body building, which most of us aren't you should find a weight that is a difficult resistance for you at 8 - 12 repetitions in perfect form (even if you have to do it slow to do it right), and stick with it until it becomes comfortable and then go up some weight until you are happy with where you are at. This is will increase strength and muscular endurance under heavy loads. It also promotes good bone density as evidenced by my skull. ;-) People have a tendency to want to lift too much, too fast and they want to bounce, arch, and do all kinds of contortions just to get the weight up. Not only is this a good way to get hurt, but it avoids using the very muscles you are supposed to be exercising. What's the point if you're gonna cheat right? Besides, who are you competing with anyway? There are always a million people in the gym who look ten times better than me and lift more too. I just ignore them, do my workout and then sneak out and let the air out of their tires... No, scratch that last, I'm only kidding about that part. I just work on me and I haven't been on the wieghts in about two months. Just running for now.

As for you Ian, you sound like you are already in remarkably good shape. A resting heart rate in the range you just mentioned is in the very low average range so you can consider yourself quite fit compared to most. Especially considering you are taking stimulant medications.

I guess my comment to everyone is this....if the pros need coaches and trainers, and they are disciplined (in our perception) enough to work out, then why wouldn't the ordinary folks need trainers? If super athletic people need trainers to push them harder, then certainly ordinary or less than ordinary athletic/non-athletic people would at minimum need a trainer to push them harder. Otherwise, we would be outperforming the pros in terms of personal discipline.....

I think if somone wants to work out and stay consistent, they should be prepared to pay out the dinero occassionally, as a booster, to keep on working out. My mentor has a trainer for 9-12 weeks, then takes over for herself for several months, then pays the trainer for 9-12 weeks, so she can stay consistent. When you are disciplind and can do it on your own, drop the trainer for a few months, but be ready mentally and budget wise, to start using the trainer the minute you drop off in ability to push yourself hard enough.

Thats my OP! - from someone who does not work out! I need to take my own advice, but I am currently investing in household rearrnagement services, which will be followed by coaching, which wil then be followed by personal trainer, and then if necessary be followed by dietician. Thats my plan folks!!!

Sincerely, yours,
The modulator!

Jon

Dan I have seen my heart rate in the low forties but at 44 I should enjoy my sub sixty and shudup.. you are right.. ehh If you notice on my calendars I am taking the odd day off as it feels right. I'll likely take a break tomorrow
The dose reduction is making the workouts feel better too.. it's all good. :D


Jon in this part of Canada we have many of these resources provided by our standard health care services. With the resources I have before me I'm sure I'll be able to keep myself busy for some time to come. I saw my dietitian twice last year and learnt a bundle. Mostly about insoluble fibre but that's another pile altogether.. ;P~~

The very act of not following a strict rule set for my workouts provides me with an opportunity to practise the skills of listening to my body. I don't have many of these observation skills naturally but at this point in my overall development I appear to be be able to hear my body's messages reasonably well. I'm taking this time to enjoy a patient unstructured observation of me. Calm time if you will.

A greater self awareness both physically and emotionally is a pleasure and a welcome change. No doctor or trainer can better know what I am feeling better than me. When my conjecture rises such that I feel the need for input, I do go looking for professional help but mostly I just want to ease into the routine and have that routine
evolve into a somewhat organic response to my efforts.

I do the same with guitar. Access to a good teacher can spin me off for years.

I've said it before here and I'll mention it again. I'm not nearly as interested in the compiling of information as I am in experiencing the action or of the "doing" elements of things. I am such a hound for information and have a library full of resources that I have milked over the years but precious little has been accomplished in comparison to the knowledge base. I do recognise a credibility gap though as I always appear less experience to people than I am generally.

I've followed Clarance Bass and practised body building in some detail.. (1983/4) I've practised Zen, yoga, raced motor cycles..bicycling and the list is endless but all of these things last only a short time and all end in injury or distraction of one kind or another. Afterward I'm left with a sense of failure and befuddlement wondering what it is exactly that I need to do in order to be happy and to be of service to those around me.

When I was running regularly I was monitoring my blood profile while trying to manipulate a performance boost with my food intake.. I've done so many of these types of excessive "knowing" endeavours. I have grown to distrust them all.

I don't want to be the best. I don't want to have the most. I want to relax into my own skin with the knowledge and self assuredness that I'm loving the people I need to and caring for myself in that same loving manner. Should be easy peasy.. heh

When I work out I'm not busy thinking about my heart rate. I'm laughing with the dog or listening to Manon rave on about the knife I bought her. I want to watch the seasons change and the newly arrived birds from the south.

Much of what plagues me still is that I am often "missing" in the moments that I'm living in. Enter Mr. distactable. So I am practising slowing myself down enough to live at the pace of the life around me not my expectations of it. I am enjoying the some of the fruits of this effort at last.

I have gone to extra ordinary lengths to avoid looking at the essential nature of myself. By working out in a fashion that is patient and relatively unambitious I am afforded windows of insight that are pointers toward those essential elements.

You seem to do things in groups. I don't try to do this type of searching in groups any more. I will do it one one one with certain people but for the most part I am too distractable to benefit from many of those types of situations. I most hunger for a relationship with myself that is clued into the world around me in such a way as to be most useful to myself and others.

You see Jon I'm not after the training.. I'm after the gold ring.. < g >

A healthy balanced lifestyle is a building block I have been neglecting.

I don't pay for anything I don't have to. I am a huge fan of the open source software movement and all things Linux. I'm not using any proprietary software. For a peek into the latest cheap thrill you could d/l and burn a bootable copy of the latest "Knoppix" live cd and set your computer to boot to the cdrom. It'll boot up to an "all the bells and whistles" operating system that runs entirely in RAM. There is nothing to install and once you reboot without the cd, nothing will have changed and all will be mindless.. I mean winduhs again. eheh Please bear with my lame humour. It's a fine example of a paradime shift in our culture that is not often appreciated.. yet. An introduction to this type of discussion is available in Eric Raymond's "The Cathedral and the Bazaar"
You can download it at the URL below. It's not that long.
http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/

I drive a car that has a half million kilometres on it and besides the rotten body the drive train is showing some wear on the valve guides but it's not like it needs oil added between changes or anything. Being the machine lover I am, I'm in awe of Toyota's prowess. My truck is a 1969 GMC half ton that I get offers on regularly now. The wiring harness wouldn't fool a clown!

Pierrette and I read the United Nations report years ago called "Our Common Future" and have chosen to do our part to reduce, reuse and recycle. Much of our Society seems to have missed the point about "reduction" being the single most effective way to address so many of the worlds woes. We don't recycle much but we have reduced by the truck load. Given that I'm not blue pure prefect, it used to outrage some people to find that we had three computers in the house but we still had to go outside to pee.. it was fun to make jokes in the face of such wrath by saying something naive like... "You don't actually deliver that crap inside at your house do you.. it's filthy you know!". Or catching the up and comers with "you like to eat outside and crap inside.. we like it the other way around here.. " Rest assured we now have plumbing like the rest of the civilised world.

I'm bucking/splitting wood to work out. When it warms up some, I'll do construction work on the girls new digs and work in the garden. If there is time, I'll get to put some miles on the mare. There was a time when blood profiles and charts and records and journals were part of my approach but it didn't save me from myself.... ever.

I'm a numb skull when it comes right down to it and I just don't "get it" if it ain't really simple. I don't want a "pro" level experience, I think the "pros" are missing the point.

Although many would benefit greatly from a personal trainer it would be counter productive for me. I bet you get fitter than I do though... lol

Cheers! Jon.. thanks for the comments.

what is essential is invisible to the eye
antoine de saint-exupery

Eh, It seems we are both hooked up by the government then. The Navy has come a long way since I joined in the end of the 80's. I have full access to personal trainers now. Physical therapists too. We even just recently started putting shrinks on ships which is why yours truly is still in the Navy and wasn't discharged out of hand when my anxiety disorders reared their ugly heads. We also have dieticians and all manner of other health care and preventative medicine available to us. Of course, this is all well and good... Personally, I would have preferred they addressed the horrible pay and housing conditions myself. We still have 70% of military families qualifying for foodstamps. No, not made up, I'm a financial counselor I know the numbers very well. This is after the raises everyone made so much of by the way. Cool eh? Glad I didn't join the Navy to get rich. I'd be so crushed! I don't mind working another job. I only get mad when they talk about how much they appreciate us and do so little to fix the issue, and out and out lie to the press to cover it up ( they told the Navy times I make the equivalent of 47,000 dollars a year on the outside. I don't even clear 30,000 with sea pay and hazardous duty pay! They claim my medical and life insurance are worth 17,000 extra dollars a year, but I could get better coverage for far less money. So, I say give me the extra 17 grand and send me on my way fibbers! Sorry, but that was just wrong.) Anyway, second jobs are good. Keeps me out of trouble. :-)

ok ok time out! Who is the picture of? That must be clear before going one word further!

Jon

Itschaotic, can I call you Itchy for a nickname? I appreciate your deep contemplation on the topic, and I might gain some insight from it...very interesting and humbling, a different way to look at the work out paradigm. I have no idea how it will play out for me in real life, but I appreciate the thoughts..

Jon
PS ~~ Who is the girl?

A day off... wow.. and I bit in like a real day off. I hope I can resume work at a reasonable pace tomorrow. What a weird day. With enough work physically and a reduction on stims, I was a mellow dude today and how odd is that! < g >

Resting during the day time was down under 70 beats/min this afternoon.. and even on the Dexedrine this afternoon I'm quite sure I would have slept if the book hadn't been so good. I changed the time I take the doses too and that's balancing out much better. The new times of the doses seem to be right on too.

Dan or anyone.. do you know how long a Dexedrine dose regime needs before one can safely say it is to be "proofed" so to speak? How long should I stay at this dose to make sure I'm fully adapted to the change?

The navy is beyond my comprehension. Just thinking about what my life might look like in the military is mind boggling. I'm not even sure I could even submit to a boss at all any more. I've been on my own now since 1986 and I don't think there is any turning back now. One of the drawbacks though is the financial security that even a modest income in the navy would provide. Life without a safety net.. poetry without revisions.. things that make me go.. hmmmm I have some regrets now as I age about the short sightedness of my vision regarding finances but I've done the best with what I had and it's onward and upward now. Spilt milk be gone!!!! and sour grapes to the vinegar barrel.. ehh

I read for about two hours this afternoon and finished the last third of a book I've been milking along for a month or more. If I can get to bed tonight at a decent time I might have a crack at that ever elusive "refreshed" feeling in the morning but I think I've eatten too much for that to be a reality. I tend to burn a little rich on the fuel mixture.. If I want that stomach to flatten out I'll have to stop overloading the capacity.. duh!

Jon your a gracious modulator.. < g > I forgot to correct the image size when I posted that big image of Sharon Stone with the Linux mascot emblazoned on her shoulder. I'm conscious that the people who pay for the band width of this sites activities continue to offer us the privilege of posting images so I apologise for leaving that image larger than I intended. I don't want to abuse it and loose the option of posting images. I suppose this would be a good time to get off my butt and make a financial contribution to the efforts here.. yup. That's a stunning dress...

I re-read that long rambling epistle I wrote from last night and wondered if you would be able to forgive me that indulgence. Your post back here is gratefully received. I'm only a few months into a recovery from a bleak bottoming out last fall where I nearly didn't make it back. Near death experience has a reputation for focusing one's priorities and I'm down to the brass tacks. I am not certain at all that I have the strength to face that degree of darkness again and thus my "deep contemplation".

Jon you can call me what you like.. I'll respond to almost anything. My name is Ian of course but I've been known as "peein' Ian" and a whole host of unmentionables... so feel free to make it up as you go along and then stick with what's comfortable for you. Your patience, tolerance and open mind leave me at ease. Thanks

Cheers! Ian.

Ian,

If you go around apologizing for the length of your posts, then how am I supposed to feel? I am not sure I can ever avoid a good ramble or rant... I will be relegated to the terminally rude section of the forum, my posts judged too long to be worthwhile to read... SIGH! Of course, this is probably already true, so I can hardly start griping about it now can I?

When it comes to cold hard cash, I am not a particularly greedy man. Oh, I've coveted my share of shiny trinkets and chrome plated, overly horse powered doo-dads, but material things tend to very quickly lose their luster unless they have real utility or long term entertainment value. In today's "throw away" happy "instant gratification" culture there just isn't a lot of that sort of thing around that isn't well within my reach without the aid of little green peices of paper. Point being, my version of the American dream doesn't involve obsessing about being rich. I wouldn't spit on the money if it was handed to me, or better yet, if I'd earned it, but I certainly don't sit and pine over what I neither want or need.

I wanted to be clear on that after my above gripe. I am actually more ticked about the manner in which they deliver regular lip service, and fail to do a single substantive thing to really support the troops. You know like maybe a raise that puts them far enough above the poverty line so these guys and gals can do their job without having to worry about whether the one car they have, on it's last legs, back in the states is still running, and if their wives/husbands have what they need to get by. Of course, that's expecting a lot in a country that doesn't even pay teachers squat. They make even less than military folks and they're degreed! Garbage men make more than teachers, police officers, firemen, and military personnel in this country. I have nothing against garbage men and I know sanitation is important. I am still left with the disturbing feeling that our priorities are bass ackwards.

By the way, I spoke to my Doc. He doesn't remember the sleep thing on the tape at all... :-( He dubiously agreed to let me take my stims at night though. Works pretty good! :-) I think my dose might be a tad high though. I am on 30 MG of adderall which from my understanding is a pretty whopping dose. I'll try cutting it to 20 or 25 and on down till I find a better dose too. I am probably pretty close to a good dose already though, because I can sleep on 30 MG. Feel pretty rested too. It was just fairly light sleep, and I'm concerned in the long term it might be too light to rest correctly.

Ran near six miles yesterday at lunch. Over six if you count cool down. After showering and cleaning up to go back to work my heart rate was aready down to 112 which is an amazingly fast drop for me. Even better my blood pressure pegged the machine at it's lowest on both systolic and diastolic. :-) Very happy with that. My mileage for the last two weeks is near 50 miles. Sounds like a lot until you think about marathon runners pegging 26 in under four hours... What a bunch of party poopers. Since the beginning of Enterprise's cruise I have put more than 300 miles on my poor shoes... Fortunately for them they have been mostly treadmill miles. I figured out that if I hadn't taken the two months off and had continued at the 8 miles a day I would have exceeded my 700 mile goal. Doesn't matter, I reset the counter in March. What's the point? It's like a sort of motivating tool. Gives me a number that sounds more impressive than it necessarily is. Feels good to think about and hear, and my kids go "HOLY COW!" Which is plenty motivating. :-)

Another late winter storm blowing in and another day I got my work out in before breakfast. I'm really happy with the visable aspects of my efforts. The one stack of 4' logs is retreating nicely and the stack of bucked up 18" stove lengths is building to impressive heights.

In the previous years my attention has been so scattered that this work has never been done systematically and never really shows off the larger picture of the job. Much like your 700 and 50 mile goals I seem to get great motivation from this type of evidence.

The stacks are hidden from view unless you take the time to walk behind the summer kitchen. My secret pay off will be later in the spring when the wife walks out to the garden and notices the wood pile. I'm hoping it's worthy of comment by that time.

The half dose on the slow release is looking a little short but the quick release Dex is very close to being right. My pharmacist tells me that the steady state with this stuff is reached within 5 half lives of 12-13 hours. So within three days any dosage changes should be showing their true colours. I am becoming convinced of a co-morbid relationship with depression or some other element I'm not familiar with.

I'm going to have to monitor my falling heart rate after working out.

Cheers! Ian.

One more day and what a glorious one to be outside. Stunning bright sun off the snow and warm enough to be out working in a t-shirt.. yum.. the air could not have been cleaner.

Well, anger is starting to outpace depression, which means I might get into the gym this afternoon after all. I need to. I skipped a day earlier in the week because of having to run all over the peninsula to get things done. Had planned to do it that evening, but had a near migraine experience, and a fight with the wife, and decided unconsciousness was, in fact, the better part of valor. So, I am sitting on 45.09 miles on the counter. Because I forgot the missed day in my calculations and added five point whatever miles that weren't really there... SIGH! Anyway, I'll make up for it tonight.

Heh, my therapist made note of my somewhat relentless running routine in session the other day too. Suggested I might be a little masochistic to do that and still be smoking. Heh, heh. I told her, I'm a mountain boy from Idaho and it was just like high altitude training. ;-)

She cut my sessions to once every two weeks instead of weekly. I think she intends it as a sort of confidence booster. A sort of pat on the back and acknowledgment that she thinks I am doing just fine. I told her that two weeks was fine as long as no one ran over me with a bus... She laughed and said no one would, but she did stop and check to make sure I didn't actually intend to hurl myself in front of one... I don't. I won't deny that I wouldn't feel terribly unlucky if it were to happen, but I won't make it happen...

She is the second person in the last month to suggest I train for a marathon though. I am seriously considering this now. For me, it would be a major accomplishment. I have no illusions about competing in any way shape or form. I am simply not built for it. Even in top physical condition, I have great equipment for maintaining a pace for a very long time, but I have very short legs. So, the pace in question wouldn't be terribly fast. I would be content to finish a marathon.

People have their paradigms all screwed up though. The marathon is hardly the ultimate endurance race. There are people's out there who would laugh at us for even seeing it as difficult. There is a tribe in South America who runs afoot every where they go. They even shunned horses when they were introduced by the spanish. It is not unusual for them to cover 75 miles on foot in a day. This is routine travel, not a major endurance race. One wonders what their concept of a major endurance race would be? Of course theirs is an entirely different culture. No mass transit or cars, or bikes. They are on foot their entire lives and run from the time they can walk on. It is said that Apache braves were known to cover up to 80 miles through the dessert on foot in a day. I just think it puts the whole marathon thing in perspective. I know I can do ten miles, and if I can do ten I can do twenty. Surely then with more training I can do twenty six?

Besides, after all that training and getting back in shape, I won't have any excuses for not playing intramural soccer in the Navy anymore will I? :-) My real reason for not doing it, is that I was quite good at 17 and I am afraid that at 34 I may not measure up anymore. Truth is I scrimmaged a little with my son-in-law who has several full ride sholar ships offered to him for his soccer prowess, and I held my own. He could have been going easy on me though. It would break my heart to stink at soccer now. I guess I could coach it.

Anyway, my weight came up by a pound or two but my waist size is still noticeably smaller. I'm thinking I put some muscle on the old legs. Might have been a result of that unscheduled break. :-)

Pretty hollow reward for such painful progress. I know what that feels like but I can say that I'm on the other side of most of it and it's a better place now.

I wish you peace on all fronts.

I trained up for a marathon in the spring of 1983 but never made the date.. motorcycles, beer, and a jazz club in Wisconsin were the culprits I believe. < g >

My old beater below now long gone.

Rushed a half hour in before dinner tonight. It wasn't pleasant to "squeeze" it into the day but I got it in anyway.

I ran to the city to confirm a trial of Welbutrin with a shrink. He supposedly specialises in adult ADHD and the like but I found him woefully behind the curve. It was disappointing.

Ian

She has a book. A book on adult ADD....

Also today I got a call at work from a woman who's ex-hubby has been refusing to enter his daughter into DEERS (this is the military dependent medical registry so she can get medical care). She is entitled to this by law, and there is an existing court order. Only he has been playing hide and seek with his spouse. Well, the regs say I can verify the command he is on. Can't do more, but I can do that much. I am also allowed to get her in touch with appropriate resources. She had already been in touch with them and they were giving her the run around. This is not strictly legal for them to do. They were playing the all boys club game and taking advantage of the fact that she doesn't know the rules. Well, I have little girls, and this ****ed me off. You see Ian, it's like this. Say she's lying, and it isn't for me to decide this, or for the jerks giving her the runaround, but for the sake of argument say she is. Nothing can or will get done to this guy or his pay, or anything else without a certified copy of the court order. You see my point? So, she has no reason to lie, and even if she thought she could get away with something she can't. Secondly, there are already persons and offices set up to verify this stuff and neither the people giving her crap, or me are those persons or offices. So, the fact that they flat out lied to her made me very angry. So, instead of sending her right back into the lion's den. I asked her if I could call her back in ten minutes. I called home. Yes the wife is ****ed, but as an OMBUDSMAN and an advocate she dealt with jerkwads like the one giving this poor woman the run around on a daily basis. She takes crap from no one, and unlike me, she doesn't have a chain of command, and she has had formal training in all the resources available to a woman in this lady's position. It helps that she has a legal backround too. Anyway it took a while to actually get a hold of her as she didn't want to talk to me. Mad as you may recall. Finally my son answered the phone, and I told him to ask his mother to come to the phone that I needed to speak to her and that this was not about "US". She did. I explained, and she told me to give the lady her number. I did so. About an hour later I get a call at work from the wife. She located the deadbeat hubby in question's command explained who she was and that she was acting on behalf of that individuals spouse. Got that command's OMMBUDMAN's number and gave it to the lady. Explained what to do and told her that if they couldn't give her the help she needed by three o'clock tomorrow afternoon to call her and she'd take care of it.

She will too. How that lady's call went from the command he was at, to the fleet and family support center, all the way out to York town fire department and then out to me at the chapel I will never know, but I am glad she called me, and I am glad I knew some one who really could help her.

These two events have somehow closed the rift between us somewhat. We are talking. I don't know Ian. I'm not a bad sort. I'm really not. I just seem very much out of place in this world.

I did a quick workout tonight. I normally like to have at least ten more minutes of cool down time than I got, but I still got most of five miles in and brought my total to over fifty and I haven't done Friday's run yet! That means I've averaged at least five miles every other day for the entirety of march, so far and it's only the 18th! I'm happy with this because there are days I have missed for various reasons and, of course, I don't generally run weekends. So, those fractions over the five mile mark are adding up and telling.

I have so much to do tomorrow it will probably have to be another evening run. It's all money related. My travel claim from the ship got lost, so I have to resubmit all the paper work. I don't think the loss was a coincidence. The acting CMC when it was submitted and who it was shipped to (Had I but known!) was the same jerk I filed several substantiated complaints against through the EO system for his conduct towards me when he found out I was a self referal for a psych eval regarding my anxiety issues and later my ADD. He harrassed me constantly about my fitness for duty when I had been signed off by the department head of the biggest psych clinic on the east coast as fit for full with the meds. He refused to let me carry a weapon inspite of the fact that this was covered and approved in the documentation specifically (at my request because I had heard them making noises about this and saw it coming a mile away). This is illegal and the only reason his butt didn't get fried for it was there was no concrete evidence it ever happened beyond my say so, and the odd fact that I was a full year delinquent on my weapons qualifications and never got into trouble... Weird eh? Anyway he was acting master chief of the command when my package went in, and it just up and disappeared.... HMMMM. Maybe that is just too paranoid. I don't know. I do know that I might have ADD, but stupid I am not, I have about a zillion copies of everything! I'm faxing out copies tomorrow morning. Then I have to run back over across the bay to Little Creek Amphib base to fix my pay because they still aren't paying me what they owe me in my normal pay and they are still taking pay out that they supposedly over paid me. Well I do owe them money they overpaid me, but they owe me more! I don't get their logic! Let's send Dan to the poor house, so we can apologize later. If that bitter little ham sandwhich eating bastidge behind the counter chews on me again I swear to god I am going to bite his damn head off and ask for his supervisor, who I will then ask why he's got a rabid shrew doing customer service?! Because I was under the impression that the object of good customer service was to be helpful and nice not resentful, evil tempered, unhelpful and generally spiteful! Hopefully this will get the desired result of a public flogging for the ham sandwich eating tyrant. Then I can have a peaceful rest of the day to contemplate a job well done... Wait, that was bitter wasn't it? Well, that guy really got to me. I was nice to him and everything to and he didn't even apologize. Oh, he better be nicer this time around or I am totally gonna ask to see his supervisor. No cussing, no shrew comments, just the quiet observation that his general attitude is outright hostile and after the second time in a row of dealing with it after the week I've had I'd appreciate it if he could get some appropriate training in customer service so it won't be an issue next time I see him. See, I can be nice! Nice-ish? Mean as hell in an angry but civil way? Well, at least I'm not calling him a rabid shrew in that version!

I like your wife.. < g > What a spunky woman! And a social conscience to boot! You two make a good team when you are "on".

Your story tonight about the low life ham sandwitch eater makes me think of the central differences between PU and me. She likes people. I generally don't.

Being a pessimist though I'm almost never disappointed in peoples behaviour.
Snoozing time for me.
Cheers! Ian.

Sorry Dan, I mistook who got the book. I thought your therapist got the book and somehow this was a good thing.

I was busy thinking about how clued out my doctor was yesterday.. especially about coaching.

Your day will be full and I'm sending warm thoughts your way.

I hope you can salvage your care for yourself. This is what I'm anxious to retain for myself as I've just nicely got my head around it.

I got out again today before breakfast for my half hour. There are wind warnings with wind speeds up around 80km/hour or 50mph.

Cheers! Ian. :cry:

Ian, the book is a good thing. It is good that my wife is making a good faith effort to learn more about ADD. She doesn't have to do this. She has chosen to do it for her own reasons, and that makes it that much more hope inspiring. :-) She's full of suprises, this lady! Woke me up with a boxer shorts load full of ice cubes one time! Or she'll hose me down with the garden hose when I pull in from work and get out of the car and just when I am in a position to retaliate she'll tell me I can't because she's a girl... :-| :-( Normally, I let her off the hook because this is when she has started thinking of how long it is going to take to reapply the makeup, dry off, blow dry the hair, etc... Of course, sometimes being a girl isn't even adequate defense for payback. :p

My mileage tracker is up to 55.19 miles as of today. YAY! Well, I was happy anyway. I got that pay issue fixed today, no ham sandwich eating troll in sight. I also got my travel claim in and managed to hand it in, in person being as Enterprise is inport now and Norfolk Naval Base is sort of on the way to Little Creek Amphib Base. So, I got to walk around on the old girl a bit. Saw some familiar faces and dropped off copies of my endorsed orders, check in sheets, reciepts, etc... Made more copies, of course. Then continued on my way to lovely, Ham sandwich eating Troll free, Little Creek Amphib Base to, also successfully, straighten out my pay issue. Although it may still not actually be in my paycheck until NEXT month. At least the ball is rolling. AMEN TO THAT!

So, the wife doesn't hate me anymore. At least for the time being. Providing I make a reasonable attempt to control my reactions and defensiveness I may manage to keep her happy, even if I forget something.... This could be too good to be true. Then again, no one here has ever seen me attempt to avoid being defensive. I'm not sure I have ever seen me do that....

My pay issues should be fixed shortly, and my darn travel money could be here any darn time at all! PHEW! I feel a little better. Still dirt poor, but like Tiny Tim, it's a Dickensesque kind of poor chocked full of nobility and stuff. ;-)

That's a great post to sleep on Dan.. for as tough a day as you had billing for, the results are pretty darned attractive.

I did gather that the the book and your wife were an optimistic pairing once I figured out it was her that got the book.. duh.

Breaking fifty miles in a week? oye! That's making me happy and I can't get close to that...ehhe

You were right about the muscle earlier. I'm getting significant gains in strength. I can tell on a couple of fronts and both are really making me happy. The first is that I'm physically able to move the wood around with much more ease. I'm able to toss pieces where a month ago I was walking them to the stack.

I don't have my diet under control and this combined with a less sleep than I should be getting will likely limit my progress or incur a break down of some kind. :mad:

But I know I can't be far off the mark because I'm less susceptible to fatigue. Tonight I took the time to drive an hour and a half to the city to see Ray Bonneville play. PU didn't want to go and I didn't find anyone else to go with but I went anyway. I am learning to do that more often and I love it. I like the feeling of being out on my own and it's great to be feeding some of the things I am a little starved for like live music. I can play and sing until the cows come home but it's not the same as a room full of folks and a pro doing the show up right. On the drive home I realised I really wasn't that tired so the night driving was easier than I expected coming home.. yeeee ha! Many times I'm so tired I worry about being a hazard on the road.

You covered a lot of ground today pal. Your gains are hard won but they sound like real gains.. I'll be sending good vibes your way for the sake of longevity in all things "forward".

Cheers! Ian.

Big day.. worked hard all day on not much sleep and did two stints of wood. On the positive side I got to see all three daughters go on to 4H provincial level public speaking from first placings at the regionals yesterday. Proud as punch Papa. :D
What a treat to be a part of.
Cheers! Ian.

Ian,

Outstanding news about the girls! Well spoken like their father, no doubt.

About the 55.19 miles. That's since March 1st, not just this week. I wish I was running over ten miles a day, but I'm just not at that level and never have been. Even on the ship going over ten was an exception provoked by extreme anger and trying to manage it. 7 to 8 miles a day was plenty for me then and I was dropping weight continuously because of it. You should have seen how much I was eating! I really thought I would have a tough time maintaining weight let alone gaining it when I got home, even easing off the running because of the adderall. My body got used to it though. Gained 19 pounds in all. Lost nine of it since I started back up running again. Actually I lost 14 of it, but five came back even though I actually lost a bit more off the waist. Leg muscle I think. Took the weekend off running.

Instead, I fixed the unexpected broken alternator belt on my car, it was new and the car ate it. I was a bit suprised. The guy I bought it from, a friend of mine, had just replaced it. Said it might need to be tightened up again in a little bit. I heard it squeak a bit on the way in to the gym, resolved to tighten it the next day when the light was good at home, and on the way home the battery light came on. I figured the belt had just slipped off. Nope. The car ate it. Tore it to pieces. So, I spent 11 bucks and got a little greasy Saturday replacing that. Mine is an easy car to work on, and this was an easy fix, except I have very few good tools, and I sheared off my socket set adapter on a frozen bolt. Which also banged the crap out of my knuckles. Anyway, I lived, the belt got changed, the rear brake light got replaced, and that took some doing because it being an old car the darn bolt holding the light panel in place had frozen in place and no amount of penetrating oil, elbow grease, or choice and colorful nautical terminology would budge it. Finally I just drilled the head off of it, and feeling much better for having avenged myself upon the thorn in my side I replaced the break light and moved on. Today was nice out, so I did yard work with the wife out back. I think she expected me to do a "quick and dirty" job rather than the meticulous careful work I did, so she ended up coming out and raking behind me to hurry things along. She wasn't criticising, only being helpful, and she compliment the job I did repeatedly, so I think she was pleasantly suprised with the time and attention I took. I forget things lots of times, but I always try to do things the right way. I don't always succeed if I don't know what I'm doing, but I know how to do yard work right.

Anyway, it's late. I'm off to finish my coffee, take my meds for the evening, have that last smoke and hit the sack. I have a sneaking suspicion I'll be spending time at the coast guard station tomorrow. NOT EXCITING. Oh well, there is always the gym at lunch to stretch my legs.

I'm such an inattentive sort! I guess it would make some difference to the calorie intake approaching ten mile per day. I'm grateful you can tolerate my lame attention to details like your mileage. I really don't have much perspective. What you are doing in 55 miles a month or 300 miles a month is so far beyond my level just now that they look somewhat the same to me.. sorry guy.. a lack of appreciation on my part isn't helping here!

I'm bone weary tonight. I did about 30 four footers today before lunch and then filled the porch up with split wood and that took another half or three quarters of an hour. I hope the adrenaline comes down and allows me to sleep. I may have over done it today. If I sleep I'll take a light workout tomorrow but if I don't I'll have to skip a day. I sneezed a few times today and although there was no sign of sore throat I'm not willing to risk getting run down. It's not like there isn't other things to do.

I think my wholesale account is cutting back on the work they take in for me. I guess it's just too much inconsistency over the years we have been working together. Excuses on my part are completely hollow at this stage and doing rather than talking about it is the only thing left. I worked a bit in the shop today to get my head around the upcoming week. I have two calls tomorrow that will bring a couple of posh clocks in. I have an older mechanical watch to do that will eat about three hours. I'm not sure where I'm going to fit that in tomorrow because there is a calendar mechanism on an older antique that isn't behaving and that one was supposed to be delivered tomorrow.

Lots to do but I'm feeling really optimistic. The workouts are levelling out much of the roller coaster. The meds are steady now at 10mg slow release in the morning followed by 2.5mg short release at about 4:30 pm. I really like this setup. Thanks for encouraging me to tweak the dose.

I'm still shaking my head at how little this psychiatrist knew about adhd last Thursday. If he's the best that city has to offer I'm not going to find much help here. One bright light though was running into a judge at the girls competition yesterday who was president of the Manitoba Schizophrenia foundation or some such name... I finally wrung out of him a name for a fellow at McMaster University in Montreal who might have an academic interest in coaching. I'm becoming a big fan of coaching. I get a lot of those same benefits here but one on one is good too... just not often enough for me.

Did you check that pulley for burrs? There had to be some reason that a brand new belt came unglued. Maybe a stone or just a bad belt. Sorry to hear you too get bloody knuckles working on cars. I have more than my fair share of good tools and I wish I could share. Tools are everything. If you have them the job is so painless and if you don't you have to pay.. with blood most of the time. yuk.

A break in the tension with your wife sounds like a good thing. Keep on keeping on.. I did dishes twice today and both times there was more than the rack could hold in one go. PU made me a wonderful dinner.. it's my bday tomorrow so tonight was the cake and candles along with an amazing meal. Today life is good.

Cheers! Ian.

Ian,

HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!!!!!!! I won't ask your age. I know you are older and wiser than me and that's enough. Besides, it ain't the age that counts it's the MILEAGE! Just remember old cars can be restored and I fully intend to cherry myself out... That sounds a bit odd... We aren't going to go there though. Heh.

No worries about the confusion Ian. You're talking to "Mr. Dazed and Confused" himself. It isn't lack of consideration on your part, it's just part of who and what we are. Yes, we have to learn to cope in the wide world, but I think we can dispense with the stress of that amongst ourselves, don't you?

I envy you getting to play with all those nifty contraptions. Old mechanical watch? Real craftmanship! To be able to construct a machine so small, by hand, no less, that keeps accurate time... It boggles the mind! Those old tinkerers knew a thing or three about physics to work the timing into a piece like that. I know quite a lot about how digital watches (I mean all crystal watches by the way, not just digital faced watches) ended up replacing mechanical ones. Makes for a very interesting documentary. Crystal vibrators, the same ones your computer uses for timing and clock pulses to run it's processes vibrate at extremely precise frequencies. They do this in response to an applied voltage. One of the main downfalls of crystal vibrators, and by the way all solid state devices, is they are temperature sensitive as hell. That mechanical watch may not be quite as accurate on the whole, but it is probably far more temperature stable. If you took two identical quartz watches, synchronized them, and stuck one in the oven at 200 degrees and left the other sitting comfortably at room temperature on the counter and left them that way for ten minutes.... When you returned, assuming it was still running at all, and this is a big assumption because after a certain threshold "thermal breakdown" occurs and the semiconductor's doped materials actually begin to chemically change (the word burn comes to mind) but assuming that internal temperature didn't immediately shoot into the red, the one in the oven would be substantially FAST when compared to the one on the counter. Because above about 80 degrees farenheit you start seeing "Thermal runaway" (Room temperature is optimal operating temperature for most electronics. When you see them supercooled this is usually simply overcompensation for the immense heat generated by extremely dense chip architecture. A standard PC chip puts out about the same amount of heat as a range top stove, just in a tiny sliver of space). Thermal runaway simply put is when threshold voltage required to bias a transistor to fire shifts lower. For logic, threshold voltage for a logic "1" is typically 3.5 to 5 voltsDC. A "0" is 0 to 3.49 volts DC. When thermal runaway begins occuring a transistor may fire at 3 volts. The warmer it gets the lower the required voltage, until the transistor is in a saturated "always on" and firing state. Crystal vibrators simply vibrate continuously faster the warmer they get. This goes on until "thermal breakdown" occurs. By then, of course, your computer, watch, cell phone, or what have you has long since ceased functioning because without reliable timing and logic digital devices simply cannot function.

And I was rambling again... Probably about stuff you are well aware of. You know Ian, you throw lots of compliments my way, but I learn just as much from you. More really.

I look up to you quite a bit. The Navy these days is running a program, a bit akin to coaching. Mentoring, they call it. One of the few good ideas they have borrowed from the corporate world. As a general rule I think the military borrowing corporate concepts stinks. For starters, most corporate management ideas are based on incentives that are REAL and TANGIBLE. The military cannot offer financial windfalls, the promotion system in the military does not even allow for this sort of thing to have more than a very indirect effect on that. So, they use job satisfaction as their incentive. Now I like to do a good job as much as the next guy, but maybe they missed the big lesson of communist Russia. What looks great on paper, and "in theory" often doesn't work in practice because of a little thing called human nature. People don't like change, they resist it. When the incentive to change is intangible and there are rewards that are easily attainable in the now for subverting that change, guess what? You got it! The idea doesn't work!!!!!!

Mentorship has a real chance though. They just have to get more professional. In the Marine Corps, I see this program going far. They have their own problem set, but professionalism isn't part of it. On the Navy end have our Senior people don't even know the rules. I know this from all too personal, very recent, and very unpleasant experience. While I did get the pleasure of spanking a few folks that outranked the crap out of me over it, it cost me two and a half years of hell before I got that pleasure. I am not sure I would want any of those guys to mentor anyone...

I bring it up because I kind of think of you as a mentor. You are very honest in your self assessment Ian. You learned a good many lessons the hard way, and it shows in the manner you talk about them. You don't preach to people. You share your experience, your pain, your less than proud moments, and what you did about them that made things better. That, my friend, is REAL wisdom.

You are also very different from most folks I know. Of course, most folks I know don't have ADD, so that is probably some of it. There is also the fact that you seem to have carved your own lifestyle out rather than try to fit in to the what the world had layed out. I admire that and like seeing it because, quite frankly, I have never fit in here and it is only in recent years I knew enough about why and enough about myself to address what I could do to find a place to truly be happy in life. A place where I contributed, functioned at the level I was meant to, didn't have to make excuses for not being able to function in ways that I have never been able to maintain, be happy with who I am, and provide for the well being of my family. It's funny, there actually is a place in society for folks like me. Oh, I will still have to deal with things I am no good at, but life isn't much fun without some challenge anyway. There's a big difference between being challenged and being burried. I am going to live my life to give society a much needed kick in the keister to loosen up a bit and be more flexible so folks like us don't have to be marginalized citizens, don't grow up damaged, and don't have to work so damn hard to interface with the rest of humanity. Europe seems to be on the ball with their education system, why can't we be like that?

I also envy you where you live. I miss Idaho so much!!!!! The main differences between Idaho and southern Canada are simple. There are more bears and wolves in southern Canada. The wolves in Idaho, including the non-re-introduced "local packs"
are mostly from Canada. Canadian Grizzlies are substantially bigger than the Idaho subspecies. Ours only get up to about 800 or 900 lbs because of the desert eco-system. Idaho due to it's location in, in between, and around a variety of different mountain ranges has all but the highest pacific storm systems blocked entirely out. we get most of our water in winter in the form of snow and technically the entire state is a dessert, although you wouldn't know it to look at the variety of different eco-systems there (lots of underground rivers, and a good supply of snow melt year round in the rivers). It's pretty unspoiled country. I miss the aspens... I miss the willows... I miss trout fishing. I miss hiking, and cross country skiing, and canoeing, float trips on inner tubes down the ashton river... I miss seeing the elk come down from Taylor Mountain in the winter time so close to my house you could see them from my front yard. I miss being able to look out my room window and see the Grand Tetons in Wyoming every morning, or walking down to the corner store to buy candy when I was a kid. I miss the stupid tree house we built in the enormous old tree in the meadow behind and between my friend Brian's house and mine. I fell out of that tree and separated my ribs... Scarred 'em up so bad they still reseparate sometimes when I do heavy lifting. Stupid tree house... I miss Jefferson County Lake.... We'd go out there in June before anyone else even showed up, when they had just let the river water back in (it was an artificial lake). That water was just above freezing with run off, even in June and we'd always talk trash about who would go in first and it always ended up being me. Heh, heh... I'd swim in that icy water while they sat on the beach and argued about who was going next. I'd stay in until I couldn't feel my fingers or toes then out into the sun for a bit to tell my friends it was very nice in the water and call 'em a bunch of pansies, then back into the water. I'd be near blue lipped by the time I'd had enough and sometimes they were still arguing! My friend Scott, Brian's brother, always made the swim though. He was practical like that. "Why bother coming to the lake if we aren't going to swim?" He'd say. Then he'd tell me I was crazy for enjoying it so much. It would take me a good two hours to feel warm again by the time I was done. It was worth it though. That water had to be no warmer than 50 degrees.

Yeah, I think you get the point. Sorry. Rambling this morning. Got my butt chewed by my chief this A.M. Over a task I got done...? Yep, sure did. You see, they were worried about me not getting MY paperwork handled properly and on time, even though, I am well aware of, and well versed, in exactly what my requirements are, have not missed any of my LIMDU appointments, meet all my requirements, and am fully capable of handling my own affairs. Never mind this is the third time in a month I have been through this wringer. Besides, I did exactly as instructed, I CAN'T control traffic flow through the bridge tunnels. I did make one call the Chief considered bad. I put my family's financial well heing ahead of his financial concerns, which cost me 15 minutes. Sorry chief, but feeding the kids comes first, and I'll more than happily explain that to the C.O. too. Anyway, the job got done, he was just upset because he thought that the three hour traffic delay made him look bad politically. I really don't care. I don't care for butt chewings either when I made a more than reasonable effort to do exactly what I said I was going to do, and explained all this on the recieving end when I arrived there. Why the hell do I care about the bad blood between them? Anyway, I didn't give chief this attitude. I had it, but I kept it to myself, which was a task in and of itself that I should be awarded a medal for. I told him that if I had access to a phone, I would have called ahead, let them know traffic was badly snarled, I was making a stop because I was stuck anyway, and I HAD TO HAVE THIS TAKEN CARE OF TODAY, whereas my LIMDU stuff while important can wait until May until they actually have to do ANYTHING with it (which they probably don't even realize I know), nor was there ever specific deadline given for this process, only that it occur before 1 MAY. Anyway, I couldn't do that. Traffic hadn't cleared when I completed my business, and a short hop took most of an additional hour. The short hop was about eight miles. So, let them gripe, they have to know traffic in their area is that bad, and if they don't then they are idiots.

Anyway, I would be more sympathetic and less upset if this was due to something I forgot. As it turns out though, this could have been done weeks ago, and would have too if anyone had told me Admin here had not taken care of it, which I was given the distinct impression they had.

Hmm... Forget that last bit of unhappiness... It's been dealt with. I am just angry about getting chewed on, for what amounts to nothing.

Gym fuel. Who needs red bull or any of that other energy crap? I've got good old fashioned young angry E-boy energy. ;-)

Hey guys I am back
I rode into work today. I was very winded after gong up hills but feel okay. I had a good vacation, but it feels good to be back doing productive things. This should be a good week to get a lot done, My wife will be out of town the second part of the week. I am looking forward to break and I think she is to. Good job on the workouts guys. A 44 heart beat is pretty good Ian! Hope you had a great B-day.
Jim

Well, got off work a little early today and hit the gym like I said I would. Felt better than I expected I would. Figured I was probably dehydrated... Guess I was wrong, because I ended up running eight and a quarter miles instead of my usual five or so. Felt good too, though I am a little more tired than usual.

I am thinking it is time to start strength training now, at least for my legs, to prevent the inevitable shin splints. Besides, it will add some speed and that 5K is right around the corner. Of course, if I do that I will have to at least do some basic upper body stuff to balance it out. I do the push ups, crunches, and situps already, because I have to as part of the whole Navy fitness routine, and believe it or not those go a long way all by themselves. Still, I'll add a thing here or there and try to come up with something that will stave off the shin splints, add some speed, and not be too terribly ambitious at the same time. Sustainability, is definitely more important to me right now than being in a hurry. I know where I'm going, and I'll get there soon enough. Maybe next week, if I'm feeling saucy, I'll try and squeeze a ten mile in. I'll do it again the week after, and the week after that I'll see about a fifteen. The second ten, and the fifteen are gonna have to be open road runs though. None of this indoor gym treadmill crap for that. If I can to a 15 miler, and I don't die or have major recovery issues, then I will seriously consider continuing training for a marathon. I'll have to talk to my Doc more about the training cycle. He's done a couple of 'em.
My monthly total for March, by the way, is up to 63.45 miles as of today. :-) Gotta love those days when you're feeling saucy. :-) I did push a little hard, I admit. It felt good though. I had to sit for a bit and drink up the lost water for a while in my car before I was ready to head home. Actually saw sparklies for a short bit, though I was not at all light headed. Not really that unusual for me. Blood pressure just dropped off when I finally sat back in my car. I even pushed myself during my normal cool down, so it's my own fault for not properly slowing things down before I sat still. Of course, Nothing really to complain about. Like I said no light headedness. Just some free fireworks. ;-) In a way it's a good sign. Normally hasn't happened to me on the adderall because the blood pressure has been up. I'm guessing this means it's coming back down.

"Part of who we are".. what a welcome thought to be among peers. Thanks for that.

It's misleading to lead you to believe that I manufacture from scratch because I don't. I do conservation, maintenance and repairs. Often I make parts but never a timekeeper of my own design. Not that there isn't one in the works.. but it's been in the works so to speak for many years. I have the machining skills now to actually do it. Lets get that wood out of the way first though and then there is the summer kitchen to finish and a wood shed to build. At least for this summer I can't see making any headway on the clock project.

At least now I feel like I might get through the projects at hand. I love the consistency of this commitment! I'm gaining confidence daily. I'm feeling stronger and less vulnerable to thoughts that this might must be a temporary reprieve. I'm more than a little excited to find myself still doing this with you all after a month!

I was never drawn in by the quartz watches. I did know about the time/temperature troubles. I've never had a quartz watch function up to spec but I've never really bought a good one either. Apparently there is something to be said for "aged" crystals but whether this gets around the flaws with temp variation is not apparent to me.

This is my favourite mechanical if the pockets were very deep.
http://www.omega.ch/omega/mu_cal_coaxial
http://www.iww.co.uk/iww62/page1_0b_text.htm

This is the best value for your money in a watch. I've had these come in for service after 20 years out on someones wrist daily and all it needed was an oil change. I've seen a few like that. I bought one from these people last year for my youngest ( more on him later ) brother and it was a clean transaction. Four days after it hit my credit card records it was in my hand. These are extraordinary value. I bought the SNX427K2METAL and it's a beauty.. if you like that kind of thing.

Work is seldom boring that's for sure.

I'm grateful you find me useful in learning a little here and there.. I'm an odd duck that way. I have been into so many different corners of enquiry that some people just shake their heads and walk away with the ever so popular "nutball!" look in their eyes.. eheh

I read your post this morning just before heading out on a day of pick up and delivery. I though about your kind comments all day. It was a wonderful thing to carry with me. Thanks. I do need to comment some though. Of course you know that all mentors are eventually revealed to have feet of clay right? ehhe All my success has come at the expense of my wife's deeply committed vision of compasion.

My wife and partner is a medal winning academic who quit a staring role as an up and comming student of genetics to teach public school. Now she's working as a councillor in two schools (French) helping put peoples lives back together and to help young ones miss many of the predictable pot holes along the way.

She is a gifted pedagogue and has been recognised for her hard work in this field by being asked to sit on various teams to help define the future of education.

My Achilles heal in appearing to be of some use on this board is that everything you see as "mine" is not really mine. It was gifted to me by my wife. I am not self sustaining for the most part. I was getting to have a strong positive impact before the crash of 2003 but up until then I wasn't capable carrying my weight financially or emotionally. PU has had to do most of the parenting because I'm too hot headed. And she's the one with the significant income. At best I add some spice to the mix but sometimes it's pretty bland.

We have been married nearly twenty years and with every fibre of my heart I want to work for this woman. I want to work toward giving back some of what has so freely been given to me... and so far I've been very far short of the mark.

I was home with the kids and worked when I could. When Manon (our last) went to school half time I doubled my income. When she went to school full time there was no change. I had fully expected to have lots of room to move ahead but I just did not have the time management or attention skills to move it ahead any more that I already had. I was confounded and a bit angry. Once I got the diagnosis and a very clear one at that, for ADHD I was relieved to know I'd finally figured out what the problem was.

This gets me back to an earlier post about "leaving". Maybe now you can see why me being in a position to leave would be so good for everyone concerned. I have never been strong enough to leave before. I'd have had to be institutionalised or maybe just land on the street if I lost my meal ticket here. Sure I have lots to offer but basically I'm just another sucker on the vine. At 45 years old today it's a bitter pill to swallow and I must be rid of it or die. If I don't develop some hope for stability I'm done.

The good news of course is that those things seem to be coming along very nicely.

I'm sure wondering about the elements of coaching though. Yes I have a truckload of coping skills. Daytimers, sticky notes, alarms, timers, you name it I've got it humping to keep me on track. But in the final analysis it's the camaraderie and public commitment that have had the strongest impact for me. Hellen my counsellor was basically functioning as a coach for me but neither one of us realised it. It was a very informal and relaxed relationship completely fluid to change if needed. Our mutual respect and love of books became at least a big a part of the successes as the textbook applications of organisation skills were for example.

I'm quite proud to have someone call me a mentor publicly. Thank-you. I do what I do because it's my **** that's in a sling. But if someone else is going to put their hat in the ring... the more the merrier! I am becoming quite excited by some of the possibilities I see here.

Most of the traits you listed that you admired are a direct result of attendance for 14 years in a twelve step program that I became willing to actually learn from.

My carved out tailored ADHD lifestyle is wholly owned and operated by my spouse. She makes it possible. She supports me and many of my crazy ideas. I had some new grey matter cut on marijuana today and although opposed she was clearly open to enquiry. We call her "Saint Pierrette" jokingly, but many others recognise her as a peach of a woman. She gives a lot to her work and her kids at school but where she really shines is at home culturing our kids and me closer to whole human beings. She has her faults too but she commands my deepest respect. Her sole goal in life is to leave the world a better place for having been here. I need a bigger hit of that one...

Idaho sounds pretty darned attractive. Probably not as wild as here but sounds nice anywho..

Re: butt chewing.
I got a nasty letter from a guy I've known and enjoyed over the past year on-line basically accusing me of being a false identify on-line. Pretending to be someone else. He just couldn't put it together in his linear brain that I'd be such a freak and not some imagined character made up to twist peoples relations on-line into chaos. I unloaded the full force of my sharp tongue in a concise pointed and referenced paper detailing how easy it is to "proof" my id on-line and introduced him to some of my friends. Many are accomplished artists in their own right. But like you Dan I was right hot under the collar when I read the note. He was snotty and mean spirited. Once I'd mailed my response off I realised I had energy for more so I went at it for another hour or so. Meds are great.. my focus was so tight!

Today I got the nicest detailed apology from him. I don't think I'll pursue the contact any farther because if he's having a tough time adapting to what he imagines my life to be like I can't fathom how he'd ever believe his eyes to the realities around here. Too bad.. I was sure he was hip to the trip.. but no.

Jim I'm sure glad to see you back here. You voice sounds so much lighter. Obviously the trip wasn't all bad by any stretch of the imagination. If you feel like telling us the story .... well.. I'd read it..ehh

Dan, I don't think I would be able to work for a "boss" now. I've had too many years of freedom to change now. But I would like to make my wifes life a living heaven!!! does that count?

I suppose I could do some pushups and crunches.. hmmm stretching would be a good thing too.

When I trained up for the Manitoba marathon in 1983 I think it was I didn't know how much weight I'd lost until I saw an image of myself catching a freebie while I was in the air behind my back. With my entire body in tension and just a pair of shorts on I was aghast at what a bad soup I'd make! Didn't know how to eat at all then.. now I'm better..

And on the food front.. PU gave me a copy of Larousse gastronomique for my birthday. I've wanted that beauty for many years. My Mum knit me some wild socks. Really really nice socks. The yarn was four strand 38% alpaca 50% wool and 12% nylon. Given that she's seen my feet many times for many lesser socks she got the size bang on.. sweet sweet comfort!

Sleep doods..

Cheers! Ian.

N 49 12' 30"
W 96 53' 45"

Only dead fish go with the flow

Well, population density backhome is pretty low, about 1.5 persons per square mile and I don't think they count the federal lands, which comprise about 67% of the state. It's got more wilderness area than any other part of the United States except Alaska. Still, I doubt very much it is as "wild" as it is out there. I do envy Canada that. I was always one for my mountains and rivers. The company of a family of otters enjoying fishing and play, even if it's at a respectable distance, is far more enjoyable to me than the company of many people.

Grizzly Adams I'm not, but I get along pretty well in the woods. I know what to do in emergencies, winter or spring. I know how to handle the native wildlife. I even remember a bit about what sorts of plants I can eat. Probably not enough for long term comfort, but enough to extend survival in a pinch. You really can't grow up in a town like mine and not learn these things. Of course, you being where you are at you probably have some idea of this already. Like I said Idaho isn't all that much different from Southern Canada.

My ignorance is showing. I had no idea Idaho was a sparsely populated as it is or that it was the least developed of all the lower 48. Now I want to make a trip out there.
Cheers! Ian.

Man you guys are getting deep on me. Sounds like you are both doing well in all areas. Dan how in the hell do you run 8 miles on a f treadmill. I would go nuts. Great job though. I would be happy to give you advice on marathons if you decide to do it. I have actually run 15 of the suckers. I have not done one in ten years so my training may be different than what they do now. I was actually quite decent in my younger days. I need to work on my upper body some more. My legs are great but I do need to build some strength upstairs. I did ride to work again today it felt better.
Ian, it sounds like you are doing well. I think there is a lot to be said for other help around the house besides income, but I do understand where you are comeing from. Glad I sound better. Things are okay in my relationship right now. One thing I have learned is that I am an okay dude and a good guy. I have learned that comes from within and not what others think
Jim

almost up to 5 miles too.
:)

Paul

Way to go Paul!

try to do 2.5 miles a night and 5 plus on weekend.
Paul :)

running seems to be my meds "replacement." :)
Paul
so far.
ps. see you doc or do your own homework what works for you. :)

I'll go with Paul on this one. I use both meds and running myself. My running is driven as much by old anger as anything else. Weird considering on the whole I don't come off as an angry person to most. More like a labrador than a pitbull, I'm afraid. Just a labrador with deep inner anger that is totally irrelevant in the present. So, the running helps let it out bit by bit.

I seem to have pulled something in my ankle yesterday afternoon. I am debating not running tonight.... I think what I will go ahead and do, is hit the gym this evening, spend some time in the sauna, stretch really well, and see about doing some gentle warm up and then maybe some strength work on the legs. I have been neglecting that of late, focussing so much on cardio and burning off the angry past. I'm suprised I haven't given myself shin splints pushing as hard as I have been.

Body composition has changed quite a bit. I am going to have to start doing some resistance training if I want more of that though. Anyway, after a little time on the weights, if my ankle feels okay I may do four or five miles.

As for the treadmill Jim, I can "zone out" safely on a treadmill. If I tried doing that on my normal running route, I'd be run down in about five minutes. Someone would get the "Deer in the headlights" look from me, and I'd be road pizza. I set the elevation on the treadmill to compensate though I'm not sure why I bother. I find running on pavement, turf, etc, easier than I find running on a treadmill. Sand I'm sure would be harder. I don't know why that is, but I do. I can usually knock a minute or so off my run times on solid ground.

You mentioned, training schedules for marathoning Jim? If they worked for you, by all means forward them. I might take one look at them and decide this whole marathon idea is silliness, but post 'em anyway.

Hi Paul.
As you can gather 5 miles is beyond me at this point but I must say that running was a treat when I was able to do it.

Just a bit of clarification first.

Jim my heart rate isn't down in the low forties. I have had it there but not since I was running and biking in the early eighties. It now has come down to 72 or some such when I'm active during the day and falls to as low as the high fifties at night reading in bed. This is huge progress for me.

With Dan's recipe for avoiding shin splints I might look to running next year if all goes to plan... there is hope for that right? ehhe.. hope but no precedent!!!! ouch.
Dan am I going to need a weight room to avoid the shin splints? I've got horrifically high arches and pronate like a sonofagun. I've made up orthotics in the past but never really got around lingering troubles with shin splints. The only thing I've done to address it really is ice and toe lifts, but all after the fact while trying to play catch up after the damage has started. I have too much weight yet to run at any rate.

Jim.. yes deep.. it's been a huge boost to have you two (and now Paul) to bounce things about with. The rambling arts as we know it.. ehh I'm rapidly coming to a place in my head and heart that is much more confident about my ability to avoid back sliding. I'm wary still but having this forum to dump my pains and pleasures into is a great help in avoiding the isolation I usually feel in taking on a daily commitment like this. The quality of the input and the risk you guys take in doing so is much appreciated.

Paul! How the hell are Ya? Just filling my oats a bit this fine day.. please pardon my irreverence. Welcome to the thread that never ends.. heh I'm not sure I remember meeting you before. I'm happy to see another face here that might continue to broaden the scope of my understanding. There isn't much I know for sure but one of those things I do know is that regular exercise is important to keeping me happy and healthy. Running indeed is an outstanding medication if you are capable of sustaining the routine. I've had trouble with that in the past.

I've never run on a tread mill but I've never run in such wild country as I am living in now either. I've always run in and around the city. I feel confident on horseback but on foot... well... a 300lb black bear up on her hind legs in the middle of the road is an awesome sight.. but a welcome one nearing the end of a run. I don't think I'd be crazy about startling a bull moose in the fall either.. I suppose that's what small bells tied to your waist are for.. hmmm

I'm just lazy.. running is very demanding. < g > It's been a month now that I've been tracking my progress and the wood is slowly being beaten into submission. Another week and the chain saw should be put away for good for a while and the splitting can begin again. It's a frightening pile I'm making though. The last time I took on a two year pile I had wound up working three twenty minute shifts through the day. After each meal I'd go and split for twenty minutes. I hope I can get back to feeling like that is appropriate before I'm done the chain saw work.

Cheers all.. Ian.

your quite welocme. :)

had lunch with a guy who ran the iron man triathalon in hawii,...i wish i could do that.
2.5 miles nights on treadmill
5 miles weekend outside.
hope to up it soon.
i pray. :)
Paul

Well I will give it a shot on the schedules. Your mileage may differ a lot. I was training back in the day when they believed the more you ran the better. I think you can get by on about 40-50 miles a week. I would start training seriouly about 3 month before the marathon starts. It sounds like you are already in shape so I will start out month one assuming you are
Month 1
Week1
Mon 5 miles (pick your pace)
Tues 7-8 miles
Weds 5 miles
Thurs 5 miles (try to do as much as you can at your target pace)
Frid 4 miles easy(rest day if you want)
Sat 13 miles
Sunday rest
Week 2
Mon 7 miles
Tues 8miles
Wed 5 miles Target pace
Thurs 4 miles easy or rest
Friday 6 miles
Sat 10 miles
Sun rest
Week 3
Mon 8 miles
Tues 10 miles
Weds 3 miles easy
thursday 5 miles fast or target pace
Fri 4miles easy or rest
Sat 15 miles
Sun rest
Week 4
Mon 8 miles
tues 10 miles
weds 3 miles
thursday 5 miles fast or at taget pace
friday rest
Sat 20 miles
sun rest
That is a months worth. You can probalby figure it out from here. if not let me know. You can also break down those target days and do one mile intervals. Rest enough in between so you can do the same pace. As you get better cut the rest time in between. You can also do shorter and faster intervals for your 5K and that will help get your speed up. I tried to alternate my long runs to 13 -15 miles one week and 20-22 miles the next. If you just want to finish I would work more on the endurance. You can adjust your miles to how you are feeling. The one year I was at my best I was running twice a day 3 times a week. I don't reccomend that. I was single and had no life. Hope this helps if you have questions let me know
Jim

nice input.
keep that in my mind <----add you know..
i forgot i had add.
classic thought of the day.
Paul :)

:D

Right now I have made the decision to go easy for this week. My ankle issue is due to impact strain. This is an issue caused from insufficient recovery time and maybe too much running compared to my calorie intake. At the level I am at now, to suddenly be getting sore means I have to change something to move forward.

Right now that something is going to be to give the muscles and connective tissue a little break from sudden impacts. A couple of days should do it. Definitely going to add some strength routines in for my legs though. look into doing something about my diet. I forget to eat... OOPSIE. :p That should nip it in the bud. Last time this happened I ended up adding a fair amount of muscle and reduced my run times substantially. I also got a lot more distance out of myself. So, this is just my body telling me to cool it and take stock. Some light cardio three times a week for thirty minutes to maintain will go with the strength training until mr. ankle feels better. Probably a week and I'll be running longer than a half an hour, but we'll see. Either way the weights gotta happen. Between the 5K which I have really been looking forward to, and the PRT, which is a mandatory part of military life, I can't afford to screw around.

Ian, calve raises are half the battle. leg extensions, hamstring curls, ilotibial stretching, as well as your normal stretches, toe points, flutter kicks, lunges, knee-bends, and all manner of other exercises strengthen everything from the lower back down through the front and back of the lower leg. The extra muscle helps prevent the ripping that makes you go ouchie. It also provides support for the ankles and arches.

As for that wildlife.... Carry a backpack with reynolds plastic wrap (this is great for sucking chest wounds should you be attacked by an animal like a bear. Yes I learned this in Idaho. Park rangers there carry the stuff around with them.), definitely wear the bells as bears in particular will usually beat feet if they know you're coming (startled bears aren't much fun.), and invest in a nice little can of pepper spray, especially if you've got mountain lions where you live. Mountain lions generally leave folk alone, but here in the states they have been protected for so long, they no longer fear humans. Seeing as how they learn what's good to eat from Mom, Dad, and trial and error you and me are potentially on the menu. A 130-140 lb cat might not seem intimidating to many folk who have dogs that big or bigger, but this is an animal that can carry three times it's body weight in it's mouth, leap 25 feet from a standing start, and cover near fifty feet leaping at a run. They are persistent, and playing dead only makes it easier for them to eat you. So, pepper spray, which is nasty to humans ought to be a good deterrent and a bit better of an option than shooting them. This is my own opinion mind you. I have seen no studies on pepper spray being used on attacking animals. Bears and mountain lions have much more sensitive noses and eyes than us though so it's got to be far more unpleasant for them than it is for us. If it works for Mr. skunk? Also an umbrella has been suggested too. Park rangers in Yellowstone have found that the sudden increase of apparent size opening an umbrella in an oncoming bears face gives them sometimes scares it off. Just some suggestions. Of course, the best suggestion is to run with someone slower than you. ;-)

Hey everyone,
I rode again today. It was raining and windy so I did not worry about speed. I am still dying on the hills. I do not stop. Though. I too find that with my Adderall that my resting heart beat is higher than before. It is going down some.
E-boy sorry to hear about your ankle. Sounds to me like you know what you are doing. Did not mean to sound like I am an expert I am not.
Ian it sounds like you are continueing to improve. Good job everyone.
Jim

keep riding, did 2.5 mile run b e f o r e work. try to do again tomorrow.
:)

good job Paul!! I will keep riding.

Must be something in the air.. Dad sent me detailed instructions on how to survive a heart attack if you are alone.. hehe

The cling wrap ideas for sucking wounds is extreme...ehh I'll have to make sure I copy my eldest daughter that info... she'll squirm uncontrollably..
< g >

Sorry to hear your ankle is giving you grief. Those semi hard tissues are slow to come on board! I took your comments as a harbinger and took stock of my behaviour working out today. Oops is right. I had dumped the timer because I knew basically what was taking me a half hour to do. I also realised that my capacity for work was growing exponentially. Today when I checked with the clock I was an 95 minute workout. Fortunately I checked this at half time so ended up breaking the task in half and did two stints instead of one.

Man.. what a dolt I am. I make the same mistakes over and over. Please let this go.. I'm not beating myself up.. I'm just grateful to have you guys around for the checks and balances. It does amaze me that even with such a conscious effort I am still over doing the whole thing. If it wasn't for this back board to bounce the details off of, I'm convinced I'd have sabotaged the commitment as I usually do with sickness or injury inside of six weeks. Distracted much? Oh man.. it would be laughable if it didn't hurt so much to catch the repeating pattern again.. Of course this isn't exactly the same because Dan has provided me with pause to check my progress.

I'm about a cord from finished the last of the bucking up process. I'd like to have it done of course but I'm feeling heavy. The past two days my legs have been heavy. My spirits are still up so I know I'm not in too bad a trouble yet.

So now I get to quit for a few days!!!! I know from playing guitar that if I take a few days off after this extended period of labour my body is going to rush into the system to build it up quickly in the absence of work. I'm looking forward to the buzz. If I've played guitar hard and consistently for an extended period followed by a three or four days off I'm remarkably stronger in both hands when I return. It will be fun to enjoy the process with the whole body involved. I hope I haven't gone too far already and end up catching a cold or something. My glands in my throat were a little tender this morning so I know I'm not right up to par.

This is a way too much fun.. heh

Thanks for the nod on the shin splints Dan. I swam one winter instead of running and found that remarkably easy on the body overall. Fatigue was my only enemy that winter. I have been missing the importance of muscle in preventing injury. You have driven this into my brain now. Thanks.. < g >

We have all the wildlife this part of the world has to offer. The 155 acres straddles the Roseau River which is a glorified creek most of the time. It's not got enough water shed left to qualify as a navigable waterway but it supports 12 species of fish apparently and what green belt remains is a veritable highway for wildlife. We have had wolverine steal our chickens and cougars have been spotted but not for me. I've seen the wolverine though and I'll pass on any intimate contact with that killing machine. The bonus is that all the predators are very wary of human contact. If we have a year without berries the bears are going to be down the chimney for the smell of food. I've been watching the population rise steadilly over the past ten years. We are due for a reality check and as is the way with nature it should be around just when we don't expect or need it. hehe...

I don't require impressing with the killing prowess of cats.. they are amazing. The pepper spray is a good idea.. thanks for all of the input. Much appreciated. I'm so grateful to meet a fellow rambler.. heheheh

Cheers! Ian.

Dead heavy today but no glands sending warnings.. a guitar day..heh A real crappy sleep.
Cheers! Ian.

me casa soo casa.
your chaos is our chaos
:)

Hey guys,
I rode again today. It is starting to feel good again in spurts. I had a better ride up the hills today. It was raining and wet again today. The ride really gave me energy today. I am looking forward to doing a long ride this weekend. Hopefully 30-40 miles. We will see. I plan to start doing crunchs and push ups when I get home tonight.

I would listen to your body guys. Nothing wrong with taking a day off or taking it easy. Enjoy the guitar today Ian. How is the ankle Dan? How are things on the home front? My wife is out of town until tomorrow so there will be no negative stuff going on.
She has been much nicer lately and her periods of anger I real short compared to the past. She even left me a note saying she loved me. I plan to get some roses for her tomorrow when she is back.
Paul how was the run today or are you waiting until after work?
Jim

Jim, did 2.5 for 45 min at 630am today. thursday.

felt good.

trying to shift to mornings, and look foward to saturday's 5 miles. :)

Good job Paul! I like am better just because if I wait until later I am usually to tired. One good thing about riding to work is I have to ride home so I do it twice a day. It is only 7 miles each way, but there are quite a few hills. It keeps me going.

great job! jim.

IthinkIcanIthinkIcan... heh it's tough for me to back off the throttle. Once in a goove I like to stay there. There is always work... < g >

Cheers! Ian.

Hey guys,

Good going Paul! Time and heart rate is more important than distance for cardio benefits and/or fat burning/weight loss depending on what you are aiming for. As for mood moderation and focus, same deal. I find between my meds and a good run to bolster them (usually at least 30 - 45 minutes worth, work permitting) I stay very much on task, am very focussed, and far less prone to experience "Executive" problems. If I am unable to run, some days even the meds aren't enough by themselves. Coping skills are all well and good but management level in the military (enlisted not officer) is a very ADD unfriendly place to be. So, on the days when coping, using my own "special" ways of doing things, and medication are simply not enough, and I can't run, I hit the coffee pot and smoke like a chimney!!!!! ARRRRRRRRRRGH!!!!!!!! Which, believe it or not, helps tremendously. Nowhere near as much as exercise, but one has to take what one can get. Of course, I NEED to quit smoking. Something I don't at all care to think about... It is, however, my next project.

Jim, I don't recall you ever claiming you were an "expert". Having spent so much of your life being so active though, I don't doubt you know more than I do about how to go about it right. No one here, that I know of, is an expert (As in professional) in exercise physiology Jim. We're just sharing experience. Yours are every bit as valuable as everyone else's.

Well, I haven't run in two days. Not due to lack of motivation. I want to, but the ankle is not cooperating. I think it is finally ready, with proper care, to run on today. Unfortunately, I have a million things to do today, so I will have to wait until this evening at best. My doc about fell out of his chair when I told him my mileage for the month though. :-) That alone was worth it. Heh, heh, heh.

I told him how well the meds were working taking them before bed, and he was really intrigued. Even though he's the one who furnished me with the tape by Dr. Dodson. I wonder if he's not a little ADD himself? Anyway, he asked me how much adderall I took and I told him the full 30MG dose, and that I went right to bed an hour later with no problems (very atypical for me), and woke up at my alarms first peep, refreshed, and also with no struggle whatsoever (also very atypical for me). This is exactly what Dr. Dodson said typically happens when you treat adult ADD 24/7 7 days a week. 75% of us have some form of sleep difficulty. Treating the ADD with a properly "tuned" dose of stimulant medications does not keep us awake and allows the brain to function properly when we are sleeping too, so we don't have problems going to sleep, staying asleep, or waking up. Anyway, it worked for me. Seeing as how that has been one of my single biggest issues of late, this is like a miracle. :-)

So, after our appointment my Doc was off to a meeting concerning ADD, of all things, and he told me he was going to make a point of discussing my results with the chair of the meeting. He said the guy would probably just accuse me of abusing the meds though... If I had thought about it at the time (stupid ADD) I would have reminded him that he could have also mentioned to the chair that I asked him to reduce my dosage. Not something your typical drug abuser asks for... Oh well, hind sight is 20/20 and all that.

Dan great to hear you are making headway with the sleep. I didn't sleep much at all the night before last which was a clear sign of stress to me. Last night was ok but I was wide awake well before I needed to be in the morning. I'll have another go at a reduced application of dex this week-end and see if I can find the balance point that encourages rest through the night.

The exercise helps a lot with the sleeping struggles, but I'm am not a good sleeper. I was so excited the first time you talked about meds 24/7 that I tried it and lost a night if you remember. Since that time I've cut the short release in half with much better results during the day.

I can split the caps on the slow release or split the tablets of the quick release. I'm curious as to which might be your choice to try at night. So anyone.. ? What's your guess? I'll talk to my pharmacist today and see what he thinks about my concerns and report back but your experience is valuable too so please comment if you have anything to offer on this.
Dan do you have a source for the transcript or the tape itself? I'd love to hear it.

If I look at the half lives of Dexedrine, it's about 13 hours for the long with a peak at about the eight hour mark. The short acting peaks about three hours but I can't remember the half life. I'm aiming to have it out of my system or at least not building up. Is this reasonable? If I took a 2.5mg late in the evening I would likely be able to achieve the same results, and still have most of the meds done by morning. I consulted with my doctor this week and she's wide open to adjusting the doseage times and amounts to get this right. She suggested that I'd be the best judge of what was working. The pharmaceutical details she's not so familiar with so I use my pharmacist for those questions.

I tried to get a decent photograph/image of myself yesterday. Hmmmm don't like the body image... I've only put on a couple of pounds since comming down from 190 last summer to 172 just now but I still look like a pear. One thing at a time though.. I set out to help my heart and that is much improved. Tomorrow I should see my heart rate drop. I love it now at night when reading in bed. My heart beat is so much more pronounced. I don't know why I find this so encouraging but it is. I saw my doctor this week too and she's over the moon with what I'm doing. yayaya.. I know "a woman doctor" ... you'd have to know her.. that and I live in a house full of women.

Jim I lived on the west coast for several years. The images of you climbing hills in the rain are vivid! I can feel the frame under me and the tires grip on the wet road, the rain on my face.. my pounding heart and heaving lungs. It takes me back.. I am right there with you.. and I'd like nothing better than to join you.

Cheers! Ian.

Hey guys!
Glad to here your ankle is starting to feel better Dan. Probably an extra day to rest it will help. You will not lose everything in 3 days. That is very interesting about your meds. I am sleeping well at night right now so I am going to keep where I am at.

Ian it sounds like you are doing well as usual on your program. My next step is to start eating better and doing more upper body stuff. I gained a few pounds over the winter.

I have had a great week of riding. Everyday this week. I will be up over 70 miles at the end of today. Last night was a real soaker. It was pouring. I came home basically a blob of water, but it felt good to be out there. I felt much stronger today and my wind is starting to come back. I would love to ride with ya someday Ian and to run with you Dan. I must say you are runing a good clip considering you smoke.

Thanks for the message Dan. You can see my feeling guilty that I am acting to big for my britchs still comes out. The other thing I forgot to mention in my big running days effort was measured more by time than heart rate. So you could probably do what I suggested monitoring your heart rate.
Paul how are you doing? Did you get your run into day.
Good job everyone!
Jim

A great indicator of where you are in your training is by monitoring your heart rate just as you wake, even before you roll over or move much. I've used this in the past and I have no idea where I learnt it but it's effective.
If I have watched this rate and am familiar with it, I can use it to indicate how much recovery or work needs to be applied. Now I know there are many other factors that I'm missing in this conversation but my primary concern and the thing I've never been able to avoid is OVER DOING IT!!!! ehe ouch.. that's so painful to admit. I have consistently hit the ditch instead of learning to get stronger. This is a frequent and common theme in my entire experience with life.

So.. if my heart rate is up say 4 or 5 beats per minute over what has been normal I know to take some time off or do a very light day. If my rate is down by that same amount I know I can get great gains by pushing beyond my limits that day as my body has adapted to the current workload.

I've stated all this as fact which of course is bologna. I have no source for this info and I'm lame at remembering, so please set me straight if and when needed. I'm learning as we go here.

Although I'm pumped to be five or six weeks into this round, it was a real slap in the face to see myself making the same mistakes again. I was so convinced that it would be different this time. I have kept records here on the forums and a commitment since the 22nd of February but I started about the middle of the month but kept no record of what I was doing.

Of course it is different this time, in that Dan's ankle woke me up. Hope somehow your ankle comes back stronger for the rest and care Dan.

Your note Jim was so high.. that's so good for me. I'm gaining strength in many ways.

Cheers! Ian.

Ian,
I think you are on to something with the heart rate. I have overdone it before in a bad way on my rides. I have pushed myself to the point I had to quit a 200 mile ride because I got heat exhaustion. I started to puke and my blood pressure droped to 90/40. I usually go by how my body feels. If I feel wiped I take it easy or do not do anything at all.

I do not record what I do. I know I did it so that is what counts for me. I would not get down on yourself because you are not maintaining records. The work you are doing is the most important and the record keeping is the whiped cream on the ice cream. Keep it up Ian
Jim

Thanks Jim.
I have to make notes on some things because as you can see I hardly notice when I'm hurting myself. I've always been like that so it's helping a lot to have some reflection here to go by.
Cheers! Ian.

Day three and I'm going to take tomorrow off as well. My back is twangy (please note the medical jargon) and I did not sleep well the first two nights. I woke up early again today but not so early as the day before. Weird. Not feeling the best but I'll try and do something good in the shop and see how I feel later. If I sleep really well tonight maybe I'll go back at it tomorrow, I'll wait and see.

Cheers! Ian.

i didnt do sat yet, run. probably get it in at 12 inside. it's hot outside this time. :)


keep you posted. :)
PAul

Ian,

Taking your heart rate when your first wake up like that is the best indicator of your true resting heart rate. Your assessment sounds pretty dead on to me. If it's running high when you first wake up, you may be dehydrated, or your body may otherwise be stressed. So, I'd say your method pretty well hits the mark. Had a Navy physical therapist tell me this stuff.

Ran just about six miles today, and worked in some weight training too. :-) Ankle is a teeny bit sore, but I can move it freely. I warmed it up carefully, stretched thoroughly and was careful to pay attention to how it felt as I ran. Probably going to be a little while yet before it's 100% again, but it's definitely on the mend.

Well, got to go hit the showers and go to work at Lowe's.

Thanks Dan I guess my memory isn't failing entirely..heh
Gottta love those double job lives.. keep your chin up bud.
Cheers! Ian.

Looks like the rain has let up some too... Tomorrow I'll be back at it.. hopefully.
Cheers! Ian.

WOW! Definitely feeling 77hour weeks... Ouch. Not really what I expected though. In fact, I didn't even realize I was putting in that many hours until I did the math. It probably wouldn't even be bad if it weren't timed with the ankle thing. Walking around for nine hours on concrete tends to **** off sore ankles. It's working out though. Healing slow, but sure. I just take my hour lunch and go sit in my car with the seat back and my leg propped up for an hour. Take 800mg of motrin, eat well, get plenty of rest, stretch, and on the days I feel up to it run/strength train. Normally, I would just not run at all... It's just that it really helps my anxiety, and a lot of that anger I have in the back round. My ankle is getting better, or I would have long since desisted. I am going easy on it. It's just hard to stop altogether because it leaves me feeling more than a bit antsy.

Anyway, after tonight I have a day off the second job. I think that is going to be a solid day of rest. Especially since I ended up running over the weekend.

So.. numb numb here finally figured out what was up with the longer workouts.

This hurts..ehh I had my timer set for repeat and was catching it on the second thirty minutes and just figuring I was being a weenie when I found more time remaining than I expected. Oh man.. some days it's not worth chewing through the leather straps..hehh

So from now on it's a chronograph and not a timer... can't hear it well with this work anywho..

Glad to hear you are on the mend Dan. Hang in there.

Cheers! Ian.

Glad your ankle is better. Hope your back perks up Ian. I did not ride at all this weekend. I worked hard in the yard yesterday and Sat I was helping my wife . I did ride today and again my wind is way better. I am starting to get into riding shape almost. Keep up the good work guys.

The chronograph works much better! I put my time in and whoa.. lordylordy my working pulse is looking good. I'm glad to find it dropping under load now too. Now if I could get a better handle on the food and sleep I'm sure I'd be seeing plenty more benefits too! hehe one thing at a time.. one thing at a time.

I've got flight times to get pretty close to you Jim. I'm headed for Victoria on the 8th and returning on the 11th of April. I looked at float plane fares but it looks like that's a bit rich for me. I looked at the ferry but that will eat too much time! grrr... I may have to make another trip where I have more time.

Brother David has decided he needs to see his older brother so he's flying me out for a few days of fishing and golf. The fishing should be good.. heh Golf? well.. I have a nice swing apparently but I do not like the pace.. I suppose I could get used to it but life is short and golf isn't ever going to climb the list of "todo" things before I die. Having little brother's who make pots of money is cool though... < g > So why is it that I live in poverty? Man.. food for thought.

Brilliant sun here.. worked today in a teeshirt and jeans with work gloves.. must be spring.. no mitts.. !!! yeah!!!

I am so pumped about taking my pulse after the work out. I took it immediately after finishing up hard and could feel it drop as I was taking it.. ehehehehh oh joy.. I may live to see my grand kids!

High as a kite. Ian.

Played with puters to long last night.. heavy again today.

I'm impressed I'm not sick or broken yet.

Do any of you have any experience with maximum heartrates? I've read that the "220" mark can be off by quite a bit, up to 18 or 20 percent I thought.

I also read that the only way to check for sure is to get your heart up to max then increase the workload. If no increase in heart rate is shown then you have indeed found your maximum.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting I do this without feeling like my heart can take it. I have put in my six weeks though and have seen some big gains as far as cardio fitness goes. I'd like to try this but would like some feedback first. No I don't have a death wish.. < g >

One mo-day.. Ian.

Ian,

This is definitely something to discuss with a doctor. I would have to say I am with you on max heart rate being somewhat variable though. I know I have exceeded what mine is supposed to be on several occasions. My big question has always been just how accurate was the machine doing the measuring? I have often found a manual count with a stopwatch gives me a higher rate than the sensors on the treadmill do, so when they show rates approaching or above my max how accurate are they? Nothing I have done recently, of course. Like to try it again soon. Been up as high as 208 BPM in the last 8 months. Can't remember what my max is as a thirty four year old male is...

Anyway Ian, I wouldn't recommend pushing that hard without going through your doctor first. They can actually hook you up to very sophistacated equipment and do it in the doctors office and monitor heart rate oxygen saturation of your blood, keep a running EKG, and the whole bit. I think they call it a cardiac stress test. Anyway, it gives them a butt ton of information about your general state of cardiovascular health. It's dangerous though and you have to sign a waiver to even have it done.

hey guys,
I know there is a test where you can figure out your max heart rate. My heart rate is usually up around 180-190 when I am riding hard. I am sure if you went on line you could find out the info. You could get the testing done at a doctor but I am sure you would have to pay. I did that a long time a go and had my heart up to 212 on a consistant basis. Do be careful though Ian. like Dan said maybe check with a Doc. You have told us how you have a tendancy to overwork. I could see you getting up to 240 and droping. I think just know when you start to feel it stop.
i have ridden everday this week. My speed and wind are starting to work together. Yesterday on the ride hom a guy who normally beats me up a big wheel was way behind by the time we got to the top. thats my braging for today. I am also riding faster speed consistantly.
Ian I am not going to be able to get up to Vicotria that week. I work and cannot take time off. Hopefully we can hook up at sometime. The boat may be cheaper, but it is still pretty pricey. If you can get close I may be able to figure a way to see you.

Dan how is the ankle? Man I think worrking 77 hours would be a work out in itself. Take care guys and talk to you soon.
Jim

I actually cheated today. I ended up having to go back at it for twenty minutes and finish tossing what I'd cut onto the stack. I'm still over estimating the time it takes.

I hear you both loud and clear as to the dangers of stressing the heart to that degree. I'll enquire at the sports medicine place in the city about a test.

Dan according to "220 minus your age" your max should be around 186 so 208 confirms that the 220- isn't that close for a rule of thumb.

I'd like to know so that I can better get to know what kind of percentages are appropriate. With my poor sleeping habits and my tendency to over eat I can't sustain as high a workload. Or at least that's what I think is happening to me. I'm tired with half hour workouts at about 75% or max which shouldn't be should it? I reiterate.. I don't know how to eat and sleep so is the tiredness really that surprising? I'm getting a bit miffed about not being able to commit more discipline to the bigger picture. I am constantly trying to remind myself that there is no reason to be upset at myself given that I'm not hurt and I'm not sick!

As usual it is great to have both your feedback on this.

Jim I'm green with envy thinking about the rush of improvement you experience. I can feel that stiff bike frame and hard tires all the way up that hill..


Looks like sugar and starches are going to have to be moderated. My wife has just begun to look at her blood sugar as it relates to what she eats and I took the test last night just for a lark. I was worse than she was. Oh well.. there goes the peanut butter and honey sandwich!

Cheers! Ian.

Well guys on the ride home yesterday reallity came crashing back down. I was spent. I still rode okay, but I could feel the push of the last couple days. I slowed it down some. Also because of the changeing weather conditions I ended up with head winds both ways. I took today off. I will start up again tomorrow. I also need to watch what I eat. I am bad about that. I probably need to cut back on my beer consumption too. I love to have a couple beers when I get home after work. I have become a big beer snob also. I love micro brews.
Dan, when is the 5k? hope all is well with you.

Ian, Remember we are not as young as we used to be so we do tire out a little easier and do not recover as quickly. It sounds like you are still doing well with the workouts.
Jim

gym, balance and exercise and consistency, my hardest friends. sounds good gym. btw waht is Green eggs &ham <---in your id here.

skppied run this morning for a light breakfast with a friend at 645am

i would love to keep gettin gup early. hope i can keep it this way..

paul

Paul just me trying to be funny. I figured since I moderate the relationship forums that men and women together are like green eggs at ham at times. Keep up the good work of getting up early. I did not ride today and I am not going to. I will tomorrow. I do beleive a day of rest is necessary to keep the body in tune. I once ran for a year only missing one day. I ran 265 days in row. I always ran at least 2 miles. My body was wiped and I ended up taking a couple of months off I was so burnt out. It was right after this that I started to get into cycleing. Keep up the good work and keep us posted.
Jim

Paul the Green Eggs and Ham is a Dr. Seuss reference. He has a book by that title. If you aren't familiar with Dr. Seuss start "The Lorax". eheh or Green Eggs and Ham.. I think I still have that on an LP.. lol Getting up early isn't an option.. I can't go to bed!.. If I could fix the latter I'm sure I would consider the former... < g >

Feeling fit and spry... < g > Got into a wrestling, slapping.. body slamming match with my 14 year old daughter last night in the kitchen.. omg it was loud and fun..hehh She loves to take me on and I love feeling like I'm not going to break! She got me in the leg though and I'm having second thoughts about all things "charlie horse". It's deep and today I can't sit back on my heels on the floor or sit cross legged.. but thems is the breaks when you rear a girl who knows something about throwing her weight around. She's 120 pounds and 5'1" or so.. stout and strong. She thinks nothing of a quick shinny up a tree too big to get her arms all the way around.

Life is good..

I put my time in today and managed to keep myself within the time limits and heart rates that I expect. I'm with you on that point of rest being an important part of the fitness equation. I think it only helps to take advantage of the new found strength.

Cheers! Ian.

Ian, Jim, Paul,

Still here if primarily for the purpose of "sharing the wealth" as it were. Things aren't the same as they were. Ian knows what I mean. Jim may as well, and he's welcome to ask if curious, it's no insult to most here (maybe even none) just not as sure of my ground as I once was. Not as sure what I am going to do about it as I was two days ago.

Moving on though... Got my first paycheck from Lowe's last night. It was a little one. It only covered the first two training days which was all of eleven hours of work. Still, it wasn't THAT LITTLE :-) Nice bonus, especially considering that the Navy seems to have lost my travel claim AGAIN!!!!!!!! I think that makes four times now. If I was that incompetent at my job I would hire myself out as a speed bump. I mean, I have ADD for crying out loud! I used to forget crap at work all the time! I was still productive though. I think the way one supervisor put it after the promotion was that he didn't doubt my motivation because he could see I was always busy but he noticed that as the workload spread out I tended to get tunnel vision and either focus on one thing to the point I lost the ability to prioritize, or shotgun it and get a little bit done on a lot of things but not finish any of them... Sound familiar to anyone? Heh, heh, heh... ;-) Boy, that promotion really let the cat out of the bag! Prior to putting on E-6 and getting into management you'd have thought I was the golden child or something and that if I broke wind at all it smelled of roses. After I put it on though I was like a packaged instant problem sailor. Just ADD sea water. ;-)

It was an environment shift. E-5 is management level, but it's very structured and very specialized. You are the god of your own little universe and the really big natural laws are already in place. You just have to do your paperwork, train your guys, and make sure the maintenance is being done in a safe manner, on time, and according to procedure. Parts that are needed are on order, repairs are made as soon as parts are available, manhours are documented, and trouble calls are handled quickly and properly. Sounds a lot more complicated than it is. It's pretty tailor made work for an ADDer. Big picture management. It helps to be a subject matter expert in the area you supervise, but it isn't a necessity. E-6 is a different ball game. Politics becomes a big part of life. I don't do politics beyond the basic honest level. Backstabbing, butt kissing, boot licking, and doing things in a bass ackwards manner to make someone else feel like they know what they are doing when they don't, is not at all my bag. I'm diplomatic about it most of the time... Well, some of the time. I'm not mean though, just matter of fact. You also get tasked with everything the chiefs don't want to do on top of your normal duties. This generally includes all the things the division officer didn't feel like doing and passed down to the chief. None of that is all that bad. It's getting pulled in eight or nine or ten equally important directions at one time that starts the process. I can actually pull this part off, but it gets the juices flowing in the bad way, if you know what I mean. Then you get the "Absolutely CRITICAL" tasking. So, you delegate everything you can, reschedule what you can't and focus everything on that critical task as only an ADDer can. Only they change the priorities on you when you aren't looking and you are so focussed you don't catch it the first fifty times they tell you... OOPS. See what I mean?

Anyway, my ankle is great! The weight training is really doing a number on my legs too! I'm going through the whole soreness thing all over again... SIGH! Especially the hamstrings. Hamstrings are a common injury point though and that's because most people neglect to work them at all. They don't get much work from running unless you really lengthen your stride out, and kick out hard on your step, which jogging generally doesn't accomplish. Biking may do a better job of that on the upswing of the pedal. Anyway, hamstring curls fit the bill nicely. My legs are getting stronger, and my run times are showing it. My three mile is comfortably passing the Marine Corps fitness test again for my age group. I am able to hold about a 6.5 mile an hour pace for a solid hour on a good day. I used to be able to do better, but I will get there. I am hoping to hold a 7 mile an hour pace for half an hour by the end of April.

That 5K is on the 24 of April Jim. I am looking forward to it.

My Son has taken a real interest in coming along to the gym with me. At first I thought he was just bored and wanted out of the house but he made a really big deal about how cool it was. I think I figured it out though... There are girls of the twenty something crowd in the gym every evening and they are usually wearing the skin tight outfits... My son is 14... Yeah, I think I got him figured out. ;-) HA HA HA! Just kidding, although I might well be right. Yeah, I noticed, who doesn't notice stuff like that. I don't pay it much attention. Back before my OCD was under control I would get obsessively guilty about noticing stuff like that and it would probably have kept me from going to the gym. These days? It's like art or something I guess. My wife will never believe this, but I really couldn't possibly improve on her.

Ian, Jim, Paul, and eboy,
i enjoy reading whatyou all have to say each day.
i appreciate your feedback amongst one another.
sorry i have limited time in between work to post.
some posts may get longer sooner than you expect them.
did 2.5 miles yesterday on t- mill.
cant wait to get outside.
i really enjoy runing on the beach.
not because its 5 miles away, but because the view is
so relaxing too.
Paul :)
ps. more later, cant tell ya when, but i promise. :)
congrats on your 1st paycheck eboy at hd.
gym, i love dr suess
i like disney too.

Hey everyone,
I did not ride into day. I had to take the car to the shop for a mileage tuneup. I got a loaner car which I have to drive and my wife could not car pool. I am hoping to ride after work today, but we will see about that. I am hoping to do a long ride this weekend. There is a huge bike sale this weekend and some new rims I have wanted are on sale. I am hoping to pick up a pair.

Dan, that is great your son is going to the gym. Nothing wrong with looking and if it gets him into a routine that is a good thing.
Let us know how the 5k goes. I am sure it will be fun.

Ian, glad you are feeling good. Sorry about the charlie horse, but it sounds like it was worth it.

Paul, how is the running going? Did you get your run in yesterday?
Take care guys!! I will PM you Dan.

Paul, how is the running going? Did you get your run in yesterday?
================================
sure did.
2.5 miles.
probably no big deal to you runners.
see if i can squeeze a longer run on weekend.
Paul :)

<-----traced a picture of a muscle dude when i was about 10 years old


thanks guys in including me in the conversation. :)
Paul

Oh, I ran 6.39 miles at lunch yesterday. Got a haircut too. I was starting too look like a sheepdog, which is not very military! Now I look like a sailor again. :-)

Last night at work, one of the other employees said "You must be military". I said "What makes you say that? The haircut?" She said, "Yeah, military or a state trooper with that haircut. So what are you, Army, marine corps?" I didn't even dignifiy that with an answer I just gave her that wrinkled nose look. You know the one, that same face you make when you realize that wet squishy stuff between your toes dog poop you have just stepped in. She laughed and asked me to make the face again after she suggested airforce and I did it again. So then she says, "You can't be Navy!" I'm like "What do you mean I can't be Navy?! Navy's the best of the bunch of them!" And she says, "But you look too good to be Navy! You're in shape boy!" I turned beet red and took a big gulp of my coffee to cover up the fact I had no smart alec comment to say to that.

That was a motivating comment. It was such a nice compliment to hear. I am afraid I don't view myself the way she apparently does. I am no hard body by any stretch of the imagination. There have been changes since I started changing my lifestyle though. Over the course of two and a half years they have added up. I haven't noticed them because they have been gradual, but I guess they show more to others. It was really nice to know there are fringe benefits to my personal improvement program. :-) You see, exercise in the long haul does more than just make you a more moderately tempered person.

Ian,

You keep mentioning the eating thing... Have you considered prepared snacks? Something healthy, of course. It is actually better for you to start with a good breakfast, and then eat five or six small meals throughout the day, than to eat the traditional three meals a day. It keeps your blood sugar more stable instead of it ebbing and spiking. Stable blood sugar ensures a steady metabolic rate which, in turn, ensures that you get the maximum benifit from the added muscle you've gained. Remember, that the majority of calories burned off in the course of an exercise program is burned off when you are not exercising. Over two thirds of your daily calorie burn is routine, at rest, or relatively at rest activity. If your blood sugar isn't maintained at a relatively steady level your overall calorie loss, even with the exercise can actually be lower than it was before you were exercising! Some people find the idea of Not eating enough, counter intuitive, but it really isn't. It's all about what you eat and when.

Suggestions would be to stay within any dietary restrictions you have for medical reasons for starters. Talk with a doctor about what you can do diet wise about problems in this area. Complex carbs, lots of water (water is never a bad thing, in my experience), protien for muscle, but keep red meat, animal fats, and frying to a minimum ( using it as an occasional treat I'd imagine is okay, I do. Probably more than occasionally too.), veggies for vitamins, and minerals, milk and cheese, or some such for the calcium. You get the idea. Vitamin supplements are okay. I'd stay away from the herbal crap on meds.

You have access to a dietician right? Talk to one about the snacking six times a day thing versus three meals a day. Explain your energy issue. Talk to your doctor about this too.

Paul,

2.5 miles is nothing to sneeze at. Besides, like I said, it's time and heart rate that are important. Sounds to me based on what you've said you are at about the same place I am. Five miles at a shot is what I normally do and you do that on the beach. I just got up to six, but that's new and a bit of a stretch at times the beach is harder to run on than a treadmill. I am guessing you probably run about a half hour on weekdays for that 2.5 right? I only run a touch faster than that now. I've been doing this a long while, but I smoke and I have short legs. :-)

No down talking here. You are consistent Paul, and you have been for a while now. Therefore you are doing spectacularly well for someone with ADD.

Having said that I herebye announce that I will shortly be having a cigarrette!

I am here at the chapel putting together the little handouts for Mass on Sunday... Me, E-boy, the fallen Catholic. E-boy, the Atheist. Talk about the blind leading the enlightened...! Or rather trying to be helpful to the more enlightened than himself, or at least those of a different belief system that he will try to be respectful towards though he does not any longer (though lately I have had leanings) believe in it.

Tired today but the beautiful weather and the fact that I'm so close to being done the noisy chain saw work is making it tough to quit. I did manage to keep my time and heart rate in place though.

I had a women say something suggestive to me yesterday too. Odd...that. It's fun to play though as long as I'm bringing the boost home to roost.. < g > I'm not much different in my body shape but my face has a lot more colour and my eyes are brighter and over all feel so much better for the effort. It must be paying off if others can see something healthy in me.

Dan, sadly I know most of what you are telling me about food. I will talk to Elizabeth (dietitian) and see what eating looks like when it's broken up into five or six rounds a day. Good idea. Thanks.

Paul the consistency is a big deal for me. I'm glad to see you so steady.
Dan we all have our paradoxes.. although yours seem to make me chuckle more than some others.. ehhh re: Catholic.


Cheers! Ian

It's official.. a shovel can induce exercise.. I put in 40 minutes at about 75% of estimated max today doing the wood and then couldn't quit. I came in for a bite to eat and some liquid and went at the gravel in front of the summer kitchen to help get the drainage working better there. One more thing crossed off the list of things my wife wants to see done.

I'm going to take a couple of days off now though. It seems appropriate to plug away at a civil pace then go really hard one day then rest to recoup my losses. I hope this builds me up stronger. I'm sure it will if I can get some rest. I have not been stretching but tonight I think I will. I used to stretch a lot and I know it's been good for me in the past.

Shovels are man killers. It's such beautiful weather to work hard. It's just above freezing with the blazing spring sun shine and little wind. Yum. What a glorious day to be outside!

Dan I spent my lunch with a map of Idaho. I wasn't familiar with the geography and wow does it look like a sweet bit of countryside. Lots of variation and little population to interfere. I can clearly see how you might long for it. Our geography is much less grand that Idaho's terrain but it's home.

Cheers! Ian.

Grand? Well, I have always thought so, though I sort of kept it to myself unless it was just me and dad or me and my friends and not even all of them. My mother and sister hated Idaho after the bustle of Northern California and the relative warmth too, I might add. :-) Some of my friends were convinced they were missing out on the world and resented the "backwater" they felt they were trapped in. I had never felt comfortable in crowds and even in Northern California when I was probably a bit too young for it too be terribly smart to do so, I would wander the hills and the oak groves well away from crowds, traffic, strip malls, and people. Back then, and probably even more so now, there were occasional cougar sightings up there, but I never saw anything, but skunks, snakes, racoons, and deer. Well, there were the occasional security guards come to roust me out of private, or government property as well. ;-) Many of my wanderings were in the backwoods of old Hamilton Airforce Base in Marin County. Heh, heh. Good thing about federal security guards. They drove toyotas at the time and those things couldn't follow a motivated ten year old boy, and on foot an overweight 60 year old is even more overmatched than the toyota. I figure they made a token effort to spook me and gave up as a ten year old ain't much of a national security risk. About the worst things in those hills back then were rabid animals and rattle snakes. Both hazards I was familiar with. Neither was one I ever encountered.

I saw more alone time in Idaho. I liked it that way. I like people. I really do. I probably like human beings more than most folks do. I just don't like crowds or the politics and mentality associated with them. I think a lot of human endeavors result in ugliness. Some architecture is graceful and blends with the environment. Some is a towering mark of our presence, and some grows up out of the ground like some kind of tumor. In the mountains I feel what I can only imagine is what religious and spiritual people feel in church. Only I don't attribute it to a soul. It just feels RIGHT. I wouldn't define myself as any kind of rugged individualist but in many ways I do feel like I would be perfectly content to live off the land. Not as a farmer, but as a hunter gatherer. Wandering from place to place season to season over a wide swath of land for a variety of different foods and resources. Just living that way. Moving along from prepared shelter to prepared shelter. If my dental care, and everything were up to snuff before I entered into such an existence and I didn't encounter a catastrophic injury there is no reason to expect I would not enjoy a very long and fulfulling life. I could even just do it occasionally for extended sabbaticals if I ever had the kind of cash to put my life on hold for a couple of seasons and get away with it.

I don't wish to separate myself from technology Ian. Technology is part of what makes us human. I just want to ditch the last six thousand years of head start I got from birth for a little while. :-)

Thank you for speaking so kindly of Idaho though. I hope they manage to preserve her through her population growth. It would break my heart to see her parcelled out and overdeveloped.

Wow.. I feel wonderful! I am very slightly muscle sore and certainly fatigued but I feel the best I've felt since starting this commitment.

I really pushed it yesterday and by last evening I was wondering if I had over done it to the point of threating a good nights sleep but no no no.. I slept like I rarely do.. that is to say I slept like a rock. I woke up comfortable as well which doesn't happen often. The Dexedrine makes regulating fluids difficult for me. I either go to bed with far too much water in my system or not enough. Either way I awake with a bloated bladder or am a way too hot and in need of big drink of water. Last night I nailed it just right and I know this will be a time I'll be gaining strength like crazy.

I don't know what's more exciting, being aware of the rush of health or not having some problem that would be making me stop doing what I'm doing. I can't thank you guys enough for showing up here to keep me on track. I should be done the chainsaw work on Tuesday. I'll take a picture then of me on the stack.. or pile.. eheh

I'm quite simply euphoric. The sun is shining and I've been very active today while in great humour. I don't expect it to always be like this but it's a reference that I'm going to hang onto. I remember running and having this happen but it was usually while I was on the road and temporary or shorter term at any rate.

Anxiety and stress are down. I am quite relaxed today. If I can get another good sleep tonight I will take a light work-out tomorrow of maybe twenty relaxed minutes as a warm up then try and weasel in some stretching.

Cheers! Ian.

My little brother has determined that I need to do some fishing with him. I'm sure I'll have to pay for it with a bit of golf too but I can't have everything I want all the time. heh I'm off to our beautiful west coast on Vancouver Island (Victoria) to luxuriate in some halibut and trout fishing.

I hope to take the opportunity to push his Euro spec M6 around some of the twisties too but we'll see how far he's willing to trust his big brother with his toys when I get there. He's had a few professional race driving lessons so I may be the one who's pushed.. hehe I hope so!

I'll be gone Wednesday night April 7th and returning late Monday the 12th. I'll be thinking of you all. I hope to open the lungs up with a jaunt up Mount Douglas at least once. I hope David (brother) doesn't have ambitions of doing anything higher than that. < g > I'm just a prairie boy now..

I'll eat all the seafood I can while I'm there in sympathy for those like myself get starved for such things midcontinent.

Cheers! Ian.

I didn't sleep as well as I could have so I'll take today off too. I can tell the recovery is faster now though. I really worked hard on Saturday and I'll be back at it tomorrow if the stars all align just right..
Cheers! Ian.

Hey guys,
I did not0 ride over the weekend. I would have liked to but I got plenty of exercise in the yard. We are catching up after not doing anything much last year. I am lining the edge of our flower beds with brick. So I have been edging our lawn by hand and then dig a very thing strip of dirt and puting the plastic edging in.; After that I put in the bricks and cover it up. I worked 4 hours yesterday and 7 hours on sunday. My upper body is sore, but that is from working hard. I did get the new wheels I wanted on Saturday and put them on the bike today. They felt great. I felt very strong riding in today. The days off were not to much time. I flelt like riding right past work. I will not ride tomorrow to work but hope to get 4 days in this week.

Paul and Dan keep up the good work. Ian have a great trip. If you somehow get close dial me up. also great job on feeling great. It is nice to know others feel the rush when you are working hard and in a groove.
Jim

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Clinical & Research News


Benefits of Exercise Reach Deep in the Brain
Joan Arehart-Treichel
Exercise has been shown to improve the mood of depressed persons, and now a new study suggests that it may also be capable of sharpening their minds—that is, of improving their executive functions.

Exercise can banish the dark clouds of depression, research has suggested. For instance, a study reported in a 1999 Archives of Internal Medicine found that participation in an exercise training program was as effective as an SSRI in improving mood in older adults diagnosed with major depression.

And now a German pilot study implies that exercise may also be capable of sharpening the minds of depressed individuals, that is, of improving their executive functions, at least to some extent. The study, which was conducted by Manfred Spitzer, M.D., Ph.D., chair of the psychiatric hospital at the University of Ulm in Germany, and colleagues, appeared in the September Journal of Clinical Psychiatry.

It was because aerobic endurance exercise had been shown to improve higher cognitive functions such as executive control in healthy elderly subjects that Spitzer and his colleagues decided to conduct a pilot study to see whether it might also enhance executive functions in persons with major depression.

The researchers selected 24 subjects with major depressive disorder as defined by DSM-IV and an average age of 42 years, and 10 healthy control subjects with an average age of 29 years. The subjects performed a half-hour of aerobic endurance exercise under two different conditions: One was at 40 percent of their predetermined individual exercise capacity, and the other was at 60 percent of their predetermined individual work capacity.

The researchers then measured each subject’s executive-control functions both before and after exercise using four standardized, computerized neuropsychological tasks: the Stroop task, the GoNogo task, the task-switch paradigm, and the flanker task. The Stroop task, for instance, showed words that were congruent with presented colors and words that were not congruent with presented colors; the subject was asked to press a response key marked with the color shown.

The control subjects did not perform any better on the four executive-function tasks after exercise than they had before, the investigators found. The depressed subjects, in contrast, performed significantly better on two of the four tasks after exercise than before. These were the Stroop and GoNogo tasks.

Thus, the study suggests that a single 30-minute aerobic endurance exercise can benefit, at least to some extent, depressed patients’ executive functions.

Spitzer and his colleagues would now like to confirm their results in a larger study sample and also with depressed subjects who are not on antidepressants, as these have been. "The problem of a drug-free control group is obvious, especially as we only have rather severely ill patients," Spitzer explained in an interview. "You cannot have [patients] off a drug. But such a study should be possible with patients with mild to moderate depression who opt for a psychotherapy intervention."

If Spitzer and his coworkers conduct another study in this area, they will try to see how long executive-function benefits from exercise last. "This is one of the most pressing questions," Spitzer said.

Spitzer and his colleagues conjectured that one way that exercise may improve depressed persons’ executive functions is by increasing the synthesis of serotonin in the brain. Endurance training, when carried out for at least half an hour, is known to increase the concentration of the amino acid tryptophan in the brain. Increased tryptophan might then lead to increased concentrations of serotonin, since tryptophan is a building block of serotonin, and the increased serotonin in turn might then not only exert an antidepressant effect, but also pep up executive functions that rely on serotonin-dependent brain structures.

If exercise does indeed benefit depressed persons’ executive functions via a boost in serotonin, it might explain why the control subjects in this study experienced no executive-function improvement from exercise—they were healthy and already had enough brain serotonin to conduct executive functions optimally.

Still another possible neurophysiological route by which exercise enhances depressed individuals’ executive functions, Spitzer speculated, is first by increasing serotonin levels in the brain and then by increasing neuronal growth in the hippocampus. Exercise, like antidepressants, has been found to trigger neuronal growth in the hippocampus, Spitzer pointed out to Psychiatric News.

The study, "Aerobic Endurance Exercise Improves Executive Functions in Depressed Patients," is posted on the Web at www.psychiatrist.com.

I'm getting more and more comfortable taking days off. It's so obviously the time where I get stronger. I really feel like I'm getting the hang of things here. I have a much better sense of how my body is doing. It's rudimentary still but I can see that with time it will come along well enough.

As usual Dan your comments are apropos. Thanks. Ian.

Too bad no one did a study of ADD and exercise. Anecdotal evidence supports this for ADD too though and many professionals have been pushing it for a long time.

Still running, and I threw some extra time off into the mix for recovery purposes. Working basically 77 hour weeks rotating to 66 hour weeks right now. So, I find taking a day or two between longer runs is almost a necessity until I adjust to the new routine a little better.

The upside is that the weight training is already paying off. It's probably a combination of the weights and the added recovery time. My run times and speeds have made some rather sudden and spectacular gains. I can run and hold substantially faster speeds now. I ran at a near lope for a good ten minutes yesterday before I decided that with thirty minutes of my hour left I didn't want to push my luck too far. I might have been able to maintain it, but it would have been a real effort beyond another two to five minutes. Read real effort as "ALL OUT". Keep in mind that I had averaged 7 miles an hour for the twenty minutes prior to kicking it up to near nine, and "ALL OUT" is in relation to whether I would have been able to complete the rest of the hour at anything resembling a normal pace afterwards. Heh :-). I did break the hell out of my three mile time though. 25 minutes, actually just shy of 25 but I'll round up. Considering my best before was 27 and change that's a pretty good gain. It's also a respectable time for a marine 6 years my junior. ;-)

As it turns out, body composition is still changing, just more slowly now than it was before. I'm down to 207 lbs. It's time to start doing a bit more work on upper body strength for PRT, just in case. Never had a problem with it before, but I've sort of rearranged the furniture, as it were and I don't want to find out at PRT time that my upper body strenght has decreased as a result of muscle being burned for fuel or any of that sort of thing.

PRT = PHYSICAL READINESS TEST. The Navy periodically (we call it the semi-annual fun run) puts us through our paces to ensure we continue to meet minimum physical fitness requirements.

Ian, this stuff is is science when people study it, but it's an art when you have to implement it.

"sudden and spectacular gains"

Ya that's what I'm after...heheh Art is tough stuff but very rewarding in this case..
Cheers! Ian.

Well, the suddeness was probably more the result of not allowing myself a full recovery than anything else. See, you're not the only one who needs to keep himself in check. I think given a chance to really recover and heal was the major cause of the big increase. I have been pushing a lot harder than I really realized.

I meant to mention, that my son has been wanting to continue going to the gym with me now. Well, either the lad has found a common interest with me at last, or he's discovered spandex and lycra. If he goes at least it's an opportunity to talk and share and get aquainted with the details of his life I have been missing out on.

dan, jim, big, ian and all,
thanks again for even more inspiring thoughts.
:)
happy easter/passover and whatever you celebrate this week or soon.

:)
Paul :)

Good job Dan. 2 minutes on 3 miles is a lot. My guess is if you quit smoking that time will drop from wherever you are at then. I also need to get some upperbody stuff going. This weekend was good. I am again going to try and add some crunchs in. Thanks for the article. I would guess that my exercise helped me through the years when I was undiagnosed. I always seemed to be able to think things through and come up with solutions to problems when I was running or riding. I always worked and thought better a couple hours after finishing.
Jim

I did not ride today as planned. I did have a great ride home. There is a long gradual hill on the way home and I was able to ride up it the best I had in a long time. It felt great. I also did some more edging work last night for about an hour. I am feeling it today. Hope all is well with you guys.
Jim

That's it for the chainsaw work. Now I just have get to the splitting. It doesn't look like much does it? Aside from the pile of split wood to the right the stove lengths comprise 5 cords or 640 cubic feet of firewood. I should easily have enough for a couple of years if I can get it split. This wood does not keep well if it's not split.

My legs need stretching so I'll look after that today then I'm going to take a break until I get back. David might have something heart pounding for me to do on the west coast but I'll try and stay focused on the seafood.

I guess my initial goals have been met in spades! I committed to six weeks and I've done all of that. I'm not sure how long or how much time I can take as the weather warms to keep at the splitting. As the ground thaws there is fencing that will be needing attention. Not much of that got done in the fall so it's a mess. It's a good thing horses are so trainable. In lots of places the wire is right down to the ground and she stays put so nicely! Horses do not like electric fences. Or at least this one does not.

Time for lunch, dishes, collect the eggs and hit the shop.
Cheers! Ian.

Ian,

It may not look like much, but I remember my Dad's wood heating fixation from my teen years very well. I spent many an afternoon filling three walls of the garage three layers thick with split wood, and several smaller stacks of kindling. I had to leave little openings for the freezer out there and the back door, it almost looked like a miniature log cabin except for the fiberglass garage door in the front. When I was done my dad couldn't even park the pinto in there. It didn't matter to him though. Just ran an extention cord out to the block heater on the engine and all was good. :-)

One year he got a buttload of cotton wood. YUCK! Knotty as all hell, burns dirty, hard to split, and I ended up having to scrub out the chimney too! I always thought he was pretty knowledgeable about that stuff, but the cotton wood thing caught him unawares. HMMM, feet of clay and all that I guess. 'Course that goes without saying anyway, the man drank himself to death.

You get my point though. I'm guessing your a woodstove man? You're too into machines to use something as inefficient as a fireplace. 80% of your hardwork lost right up the chimney. I can't see you allowing that. ;-)

You have that right about me and wood stove efficiency.. heh I have a small air tight stove that on many days when the sun is out a three stick fire in the morning gets me through until the kids are due home off the bus. I've never had to clean my chimney. Every fall I take down the flue and check.. and every fall I put it together thinking a little extra hot fire once in a while is cheap insurance. But I hope I never ever forget to watch for cottonwood. < g >

I don't enjoy the chain saw work but I love to split wood. Well.. not all wood.. I had a few logs of big elm that were down by the river and like your cotton wood experience it was remarkably bad wood to deal with. I only had the four big logs so I abandoned it but not before yanking the chain on my father in-law rather hard.

This elm didn't have a knot or branch hole to be seen. The first time I went to cut it up into stove lengths I thought my saw was goofy. I ruined a chain on it figuring the chain oil pump had given up the ghost. Once I got the saw all dialled in a again with a sharp chain and the pump checked the exact same thing happened and I still wasn't half way through the 20" log for the first cut.

I ended up bulling my way through and burning the chain beyond repair. The fun hadn't started yet though..hehe I set the piece up that I had cut and went to split it. I buried my wedge and my splitting axe (Spa t-Fix Ochsenkopf) which is fully two inches at the back end and was left standing there with my sledge in my hands wondering how I was going to retrieve my tools.. The grain split like hair, all in strands without binding to enough others to gain any direction. I've never seen wood like that and don't hope to again anytime soon.

I burned the stuff by sticking an end in the bonfire pit and slowly slid it in as the fire chewed away at the end.

The next batch I got from down by the river was all black ash and it was a crying shame to burn that stuff. The price for it just doesn't justify saving it for a mill though. I have a small chain saw mill if I need. I cut some runners for the s**t sleigh from some 12' railway ties. They worked out well. I can buy rough cut lumber here for pretty cheap. The last I checked I could buy a thousand board feet of rough cut oak for $750. White pine was $600 a thousand.

The chipboard mills have been eating up all the mature hardwood in the surrounding area over the last three years. I really like how they have logged it off. They picked and chose just the mature stock. The forest will recover as quickly as possible they way they have done it. I've only seen small time operators care for land like seems to be fashionable here. I was blown away.

Body is tired.. mind is so happy.. hope I sleep tonight. Jim's in my thoughts. Off to pick up the girls from choir.

Thanks Ian If I missed you welcome back!! If not have a wonderful time!! We are supposed to have wonderful weather after today. Catch lots of fish and enjoy the seafood. It looks like very hard work you have done. Hard to beleive that it has been 6 weeks we all have been helping each other to improve our fitness. The great thing is we all have improved.

I rode again today. Still a little sore from all my weekend yard work so I did not ride as hard today. I did do mini sprints. I set a speed I wanted to get up to and rode about 200 yards at that speed. I am really enjoying riding right now. I have set up my new computer and scanner so I am hoping to show you guys some pics of me and my bike. I am sure you can hardly wait.

Hope all is well with you Dan and Paul!!!
Jim

I try to workout regularly to stop my mind from racing and I feel absolutely at peace. But just like everything else, it comes and goes. SOOO...my vote is an average--once a week. Sometimes more, sometimes less. Makes me think there are voting options missing:

Sometimes I workout fanatically, sometimes I am not motivated.

and

My working out and regularity and intensity fluctuate like my general disposition...

jdsteelii that's just what was my pattern. I have a way easier time of it when I'm swapping my experiences both good and bad with someone else.

I'm sure it would help if I had someone close buy that would work consistantly with me but I haven't been able to arrange that so this board is doing the trick.

I keep track here and continue to learn about myself and others.. it seems to help steady the roller coaster some.

Works for me.. but now it's fishing time.. YYYYYEEEEEEEHHHHHHAAAAAA!

See you all in a few days.. I'll try and drop in and give you all a poke about how sweet the driving lessons are... < g > oh those machines!

Cheers! Ian.

Ian,

I actually have a friend that keeps me in line when it comes to working out...I'll never call to cancel and don't like it when he does.

Have fun fishing...and a quick question.

When you are fishing, does your mind continue to race along or does it stop?

John

JD,
Just want you to know were not a select group here in this thread we just kind of started responding to each other working out. You are more than welcome to join which you already have. Also anyone else out there just join in the posts we are not trying to be a clic here.
Jim

Good point Jim.. the more the merrier!

My state of mind now has changed quite a bit. I think that some of the things that help me to stay somewhat "quiet" inside are learnt skills. This may not be everyones opinion but it just mine.

I have a number of checks and balances to try and temper my inner activity. The most effective is working dang hard at work and at my work out. If I am feeling satisfied with my contributions to myself and my family I can be down right calm but any kind of anxiety about my performance and I ramp right up.
I live with that insecurity most of the time so my most common "check" is to deliberately walk slower than I want to. This helps keep me conscious of my pace when things are working well. Other times I just spin off into the distance and crash after a social faux pas or some other blunder.

I have been working extremely hard in anticipation of some time off this week. Time will tell if it was intense enough to allow me to relax a while.

I'm glad to hear you have a good partner that keeps those dates consistant.

Please join in when ever it moves you to do so. I'd love to have you around more often.

Cheers! twenty minutes to drive time.. ;^)

I appreciate the welcoming comments...very much. One of the issues I face every day is how my mind just races along. Not a good thing when I try to concentrate, like while working, but sometimes I can let it go wherever it wants and I find myself thinking about some fascinating things. My challenge is not only ADD, but depression as well. SOOO...it really sucks where my mind takes me when I am feeling down. That's usually when I have to work out. To get out of the funk my mind finds itself in.

John

Disclamer --- Grin I make this post in jest
___________________________________

I think all you people who buy exerscise equipment and go to a Gym to work out are silly

I get up every morning and go to work on a roofing crew and they pay me to execise till I drop each and every day

When I come home at night I eat supper ,have a shower check my email and the forums and go to bed

Im too tired to even think about being ADD anymore

and they pay me for this

The world of linerar thinkers is so strange

Imagine that they are so wrapped up in themselves they dont even know they are paying me to exercise and loose weight

Silly Linears

I'm a dedicated runner (race marthons, half-marathons, 10Ks etc regularly). And I swim & 'do the weight thing'.
Have found for years that it really helps me keep my sanity, which is sorely tested all the time due to my ADD.

Hey you aren't far from me! I'm over in Newport News myself! :-)

You run a lot more than me though. I am at a level now where I am just now able again to routinely run 8 and 10 mile distances for the first time since highschool/early twenties. I am not much of a swimmer, and my weight training routine is starting back up but still in it's early infancy. I do a lot of heavy lifting at work though so that last bit isn't always apparent. :-)

8-10 miles

you run that

I am envious

I couldn't even run that when I was young and didn't smoke

Hell I cant even walk that far

mainly becuase Id get bored , then distracted by the flowers growing by the side of the road , then Id lay in the sun and have a snooze , and when I wake up I will wonder what Im doing out in the country and how I got there

Keep on running guys and think of me as you run as I am jelous

HA HA HA HA HA! Now I am going to be driven to distraction by thoughts of what lying in yonder meadow taking a nap would feel like! Actually, I do get distracted at first, but after a very short period I hyperfocus. Only it's inwardly directed. It's one of the reasons I prefer organized runs outdoors or treadmills. Road work without adult supervision is an invitation to E-boy flavored road pizza. :-) I can sort of maintain and I have managed before, but after a near miss or two I am less than confident in my "auto pilot" to handle things. It's gotten me in trouble at work too walking unawares under a crane or two on the pier as well.

Anyway, you'all may not be hearing much from me for a while. Rest assured I will be getting lots of exercise. The level of anger and frustration I have right now demands nothing less. :-). The act of simple communication however makes my brain feel as thought it is going to explode so I need to cut this short. See you when I can. Hopefully on a better note.

E-boy,
Hope things are going okay. We will miss ya. Hope you will be back soon. Feel free to PM me anytime you want.

Gary watch out for those cow patties when you lie down :)

I am working a 3rd shift today to see how the crew I manage is doing. Of course since I am here everything is smooth.

I had another good ride this am into work, this afternoon I was fighting a head wind so I worked on spinning. I will do a 30 mile or so ride later today when I wake up.

Runner in my younger days I ran the same stuff you are doing. What kind of times are you doing. Just curious, you don't have to tell me. I was better the further the distance the better I did. I ran 15 marathons before I switched to biking. What is your next big race?
Jim