As many of you know i have a little girl whom is gonna be 8 in a few weeks and she has ADHD combined type and severe sleep insomnia.She is on sleeping medication and some nights she sleeps well and others its like she does not sleep even with her meds.
Lastnight I gave her,her sleep medications and a lavendar bubble bath at 9:00 come 10:00 she was like falling asleep on the couch so I told her its time to go get in her bed.She walked upstairs and what i thought was to go to bed.About 15 minutes later I heard a noise so I went to check she was reoganizing the hall closet(all the hygiene stuff and towels and such).I said to her "oh honey are'nt you sleepy'?She said no mommy Please let me clean this.Im like ok well i will let her do this then have her go to sleep cause she reallt wanted to clean this closet up,lol.She went downstairs and started cleaning the pantry(let me mind you Im already a clean freak so it was NOT dirty) but she wanted to redo it she said,then she went to the fridge and did that.I just thought it was kind of strange for her to do this.Usually when she is awake it is reading a book or watching tv or eating not cleaning every closet or the fridge.

Im sorry I just rambled on but I wanted to share this with you all.It was brought to my attention that maybe my little girl needs a second opinion because maybe she has autisim(high functioning)and was mis diagnosed.

Hi Lipz,

It couldn't hurt to get another opinion, right?

Have you considered just letting her sleep on the couch?
I know that was just one instance but one BIG problem about sleeping is that once your sleep pattern is messed up it takes a lot to get it back in sync.
So, anytime she falls asleep during what you would consider a regular sleep time period...let her sleep, wherever she is. If you're a neat freak you probably also think that sleeping should only be in a bed.
But you need to let go of what you think is right and try to find what works.
We've had to drive around with a child in a car seat to get them to fall asleep and then carry the car seat in the house with them sleeping in it and let them sleep there all night....just to fix a sleep pattern.

It can take anywhere from 7 to 21 days to correct a sleep pattern.
We had a 3 year stretch where our son, who is now 6, would go to bed at 8 pm and still be awake at 10 or 11.
We found two things that work really well for him. Rub his low back very slowly for a few minutes and he falls asleep every time. This might be unique to him. I don't know. The other thing we have done is put a CD player in his room and play one of his favorite songs on repeat. We tried the Ocean and Thunderstorm or other nature type CD's and that didn't work.

Also, I'm a firm believer that kids have allergic reactions to a lot of the chemicals and junk that are in everything we use these days. So, even though the lavender bubble bath might seem like a soothing thing you should look at what is in the bubble bath liquid. She could be allergic to perfumes or dyes or something else.
So, eliminate everything you can from her environment that might even remotely be an allergen and see what happens.

A couple of things I would recommend, calcium-magnesium is a natural relaxer and I give this to my son half an hour before bed as he also has problems with going to sleep, this does help ... have you looked into the supplement Melantonin - you can buy this in supplement form, it is a chemcial/hormone we produce that regulates are sleep-wake patterns, darkness stimulates the melantonin which brings on sleep... I would checkwith your doctor though that this will not counteract any of her current medication.
Another thing that works with my son, we have a fish tank at the bottom of his bed with a light, he finds it relaxing just to lie in bed and watch them with maybe a relaxing cd in the background.


Good Luck.

Hi Lipz......I thought this was interesting and maybe you would like to read it. It may help you. :)

~gourmet~


Melatonin Helps ADHD Insomnia
Natural Hormone Helps Kids With ADHD Go to Sleep Faster
By Staff Writer
WebMD Medical News Reviewed By Michael Smith, MD
on Tuesday, October 21, 2003



Oct. 21, 2003 -- Attention deficit hyperactivity disorder medications (ADHD) commonly cause insomnia. But the natural sleep hormone melatonin may actually help put children with ADHD to sleep faster.
Children with ADHD often have trouble sleeping this usually stems from stimulant medications --such as Ritalin and Adderall -- that they take for their condition.

Results of a new study testing melatonin's effects on ADHD insomnia were presented at the American Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry meeting this week.

Kids Fall Asleep Faster

Researcher Melissa Bomben, MSc and colleagues studied the effect of melatonin in nine children with ADHD -- seven boys and two girls from 7 to 13 years old. These children had severe ADHD that was interfering with their daily functioning. On average, it was taking these kids about 1½ hours to fall asleep at night.

In order to help fully evaluate the effects of melatonin on ADHD insomnia, the children were given either melatonin or placebo on different nights. Neither the researchers nor the study participants were aware if the children were taking the melatonin treatment or placebo.

Based on sleep logs completed by parents, study results showed that the children fell asleep significantly faster when taking melatonin -- more than 30 minutes faster. While taking melatonin, it took an average of 51 minutes to fall asleep, compared with 88 minutes while taking the placebo.

The greatest improvement in ADHD insomnia was seen in children who had the most severe cases of insomnia before the study. Therefore, the beneficial effect of melatonin may be lessened in children who have less trouble with insomnia.

The researchers continued to watch the children for an additional three months and found that the melatonin continued to improve ADHD insomnia.

Melatonin Safety

No significant side effects were seen during the study, and melatonin is generally very well tolerated, Bomben tells WebMD. Bomben is a project manager of the Mental Health Research Unit at the University of British Columbia in Vancouver.

The children were given melatonin at a dose of 6 milligrams per night, which some doctors may consider to be high, says Bomben.

"However, clinical practice at British Columbia's Children's Hospital has yielded a 20-year history of adequate doses for children in the 2.5 milligrams to 10 milligrams range. Doses in excess of 10 milligrams are not uncommon."

"Since melatonin is in an unusual category, being an unpatentable hormone, considered in the U.S. to be a 'nutritional supplement' that is unregulated by the FDA, and since there is evidence that some brands contain substances other than 'pharmaceutically pure' melatonin, evidence of safety and efficacy is of great importance to clinicians," Bomben says.

Importance of Sleep Hygiene

Parents were encouraged to establish consistent bed and waking times, but it was not required to continue in the trial. Children whose sleep hygiene was not consistent from day to day had less improvement with melatonin treatment. Sleep hygiene refers to the practices, habits, and environmental factors that are critically important for sound sleep.

In the current study, the researchers did not screen the children to see who was taking stimulant ADHD medications and which types. But the investigators are currently conducting a larger trial involving only children with ADHD who are taking stimulant medications and who have resulting ADHD insomnia. Results of this trial are expected next summer.

Strattera, the first nonstimulant ADHD medication, was approved in November of 2002, so none of the children in this study were taking this medication. Strattera does not appear to cause wakefulness, although sleeping problems have been reported with the drug. Strattera's manufacturer, Eli Lilly and Company, is a WebMD sponsor.

With reporting by Laurie Barclay, MD.

I am glad to read the info on melatonin, our dr recommended it. I just read the sleep chapter in the book The ADD Answer, it has a lot of good ideas in it. We have used the melatonin for 2 nights, and it seems to be helping so far but it is a bit too early to tell. Good luck, I know how frustrating it is when you can't get them to sleep.

Hi Lipz
Valerian root is another good sleep aide. I have had some problems with the melatonin, keeping them asleep. All of us in my house are "medicated" except my youngest 2.
I give it to them too. I have noticed they still have a tendency to get up in the middle of the night though. Also, to make it work, you do have to set the scene. it's not a like a prescripsion. So dim the lights, turn of the TV or put on the soothing cd tunes, highly recommended by most docs, like the rain, water, thunder storm , white noise things.
This might help . Just my 2 cents, Take what you want and leave the rest. Hope

I have always had trouble sleeping even as a child,,, one thing I have done as far back as I can remember is to create a story in my head and I usually fall asleep to it. Maybe you can have your daughter lie down and create a story in her mind to tell you the next day or to write about if she decides to keep that her private place. It ends up being kind of like a fantasy world of there very own. Through the forums and taking to others with ADD and ADHD,,, many of us have just always done this to fall asleep. I have no idea how else to fall asleep now,,,, it is really all I know. lol

Ask your doctor about Wilbarger Brushing. It's a technique used for sensory integration. Since we started to use it on my son he's gone from sleeping 4-5 hrs a night to 7-9. He can be at full tilt and about 15 minutes after I brush him the last time he's ready to go out. the proceedure has to be used frequently for the first few weeks and then you cut back until just 2-3 times a day is needed.

You will need a note from your doctor for school if you choose this option since it requires it to be done at school for about a month or so.

I used to tie her door shut to the hallway banister. I didn't really see this as unusal until until the babysitter made a face. lol

I wonder why Scuro...LOL
I have to admit there are nights i've been tempted... especially when it's two in the morning and I have to be up at 6.

What may appear normal to you is weird to others. You won't know that until you are doing something abnormal.

Too true, hence my signature...lol