I have read that adderall can be used for depression also. I have failed on Effexor, Paxil, Prozac, and now Wellbutrin. I am also undiagnosed add (I think Inattentive type, my daughter is and I show simular issues) I do not have pdoc coverage and cannot afford it.

I just need to let the WB get out of my system and then will go see the dr again to try something else.

Also, I am overweight and have no libido UNTIL I started WB then my appetite went down and my libido up. This is a major concern for me and I don't want to gain anymore weight or lose my "Love" :D again. And as far as I can see Adderall is the only one that can keep me intact with that.

Thanks

Robin

Hi Robin!
Well when I was in college I was diagnosed by a family practice doctor with depression/anxiety. I had meds all over the board... Prozac, Wellbutrin, Klonopin, Xanax, muscle relaxants. At one point another doctor saw me (my doctor was on vacation) and she actually wanted me to take ZYPREXA. (I never did, thank goodness)

Anyway, to the point now. Haha. I saw a psychiatrist for the first time shortly after that horrible experience with that particular doctor. I talked with him about my symptoms and what I was taking. He was very understanding and very helpful. He prescribed Adderall XR 20 mg in addition to the crap I was taking at the time (Prozac, Wellbutrin, xanax as needed). I asked him after the appointment "Well, what's my diagnosis??" He told me "major depression" at the time.

Point is- I've never been FORMALLY diagnosed with ADD or ADHD even though all signs point to ADD. I've dropped all my meds EXCEPT for Adderall XR and IR. I moved last year and had to find a new psychiatrist, but he has been wonderful and has helped me through my total shift from antidepressants to Adderall only. I have ADD tendencies but never *formally* took a test or was diagnosed by a specialist. My psychiatrist, though, recognizes that Adderall helps me in everyday life, especially school (I'm a graduate student) so it all works out.

Wow- can you tell I have ADD??? Just look at that unorganized post. geee!!

Anyway Robin, good luck to you. Let me know how you are doing and if you have any more questions just let me know.

I have periodic depressions. Though paxil helped me get out of my last episode, it made my ADD symptoms worse. Its my ADD symptoms that percipitate depression for me.

Now I am taking generic adderall and no anti-depressants. This is working well. Then again, I'm not depressed.

Amphetamine has mild antiD activity, but, IMO, its not going to help unless you really have ADHD and the drug mitigates some of the symptoms of ADHD for you.

A combo of an SSRI (for mood stabilzation) and adderall (or ritalin) for ADD can also be effective.


Good luck.

When I first started on Adderall a few months ago, I found it the most effective antidepressant I had ever tried, as well as an incredible appetite suppressant (I have a tendency to put on weight and will binge eat when I'm stressed).

Unfortunately, both the antidepressant and appetite suppressant effects have lessened with time. Last night, I was stressed beyond belief and ate a box of doughnuts - something I wouldn't have done when I first started Adderall. I am going to up my dosage of Adderall and see if I can bring back the halycon days when I first started with the drug.

Adderall is not currently prescribed for depression, nor would it be, as a Schedule 2 Controlled Substance. Though because of it's dopaminergic action it can cause euphoria in some patients, as well as when taken in very high doses, this euphoria should not be seen as an anti-depressant action, but rather simply an action of the drug. It's amphetamine, after all.

Adderall may relieve depression indirectly, if one is depressed because of symptoms of ADHD which are treated, but otherwise, it's not used as an antidepressant in mainstream medicine.

Adderall is not currently prescribed for depression, nor would it be, as a Schedule 2 Controlled Substance. I disagree....memebers on many depression forums report being prescribed Adderall for depression...it certainly is a know fact that Adderall is prescribe "off-label" for depression.

Futhermore, on the pharamcy insert that came with my prescription it states under Common Uses:

"...This medicine is a stimulant combination used to treat ADD/ADHD, narcolepsy, weight loss and depression."

Really? I stand corrected, then. I've never heard of it being used for depression, but it's possible...there is the dopaminergic effect I mentioned.

Off label uses aren't always reported on. It's just odd from my viewpoint to see how that would play with insurance, etc.

As a CII, it's definitely not a first line, but I can see how it would be doable. I'll have to look at a patient-insert next time I fill an Adderall script, I suppose.

(for the record, I'm a pharmacy technician, not a pharmacist. I know a good bit about psychopharmacology because I study it, but I'm no expert or doctor).

Thanks for this, and I suppose I stand corrected.

I have been taking Adderall for 4 or 5 years now and I believe it does help a ton with depression but I do understand that it is not normally prescribed as a depressant. With the right dosage prescribed for an individual on Adderall you tend to focus on the moment and not the problems. This is a powerful mind altering drug (class 2). It has great capabilities and proof of packing a double punch for people with focus and depression issues like myself. There's my two cents I hope I didnt stir anything up. Shawn

Adderall is most certainly prescribed for depression by knowledgeable doctors. I think it's not prescribed more widely for depression because of the general paranoia about stimulants and the hassle of triplicate prescriptions. Whether or not insurance companies will pay for Adderall for treatment of depression is a separate issue and has nothing to do with the drug's effectiveness.

I have read that adderall can be used for depression also. I have failed on Effexor, Paxil, Prozac, and now Wellbutrin. I am also undiagnosed add (I think Inattentive type, my daughter is and I show simular issues)......

You know, I think there is a fair bit of ADHD innattentive subtype getting a diagnosis of Depression. They look the same but they are not. It would thus make sense that some paitents with a diagnosis of Depression would respond well to stimulants.

More on innattentive subtype and the latest thoughts on it. A long and disjointed thread but some very good info.

A long and disjointed thread .....
Perhaps for the ADD type:) ...but the topic proposed by the thread starter (ltlangl2) regarding Adderall and depression has IMO remained intact and on course.

Adderall is most certainly prescribed for depression by knowledgeable doctors.
Bingo we have a winner. I would add knowledgeable doctors who are interested in the patients well being and willing to prescribe "off label". That is certainly true in my case. Really the only med the helps with me with depression. I've tried them all, SSRI's, SNRI's, WEllbut., MOA's, Tri's, etc.

Wow!!! Usually I don't stir up all of this in a post :) ! Sorry I haven't written back as I have a very ill little boy (He is 3 and his tonsils are so swollen that it looks like someone shoved a golf ball under is skin :eek: )

Anyway, I too have failed on many of the meds (they all make me sick)!!!

So I know that noone on this board will say it is ok to borrow (steal ;) ) meds but here is a question, well back ground and a question!

My doc was going to prescribe me adderall but wants to start me on cymbalta first. Because my son has been sick I haven't been able to go get my sample of cymbalta. My daughter is on 10 mg of Adderall xr how bad would it be to try a couple of hers to see if it works or not. If it works than I can go see the doctor if it doesn't than I will go get the cymbalta.

Is this a horrible thing to do or do ya think that it might be worth while to try. I won't be able to get the samples of cymbalta from the doc until probably Friday. My son can't go out yet (I am telling ya he is really sick! I am waiting for the antibiotics to kick in, he has been taking them since Monday afternoon).


Thanx for the input!

Robin

Works great for depression..... amphetamines sends dopamine right to the brain .. the question is can you handle how it feels when it wears off ... for some including myself the crash is hard to take , but it sure helps the depression and for those who are not depressed many if not most of them feel better that is why it is so abused .

You know, I think there is a fair bit of ADHD innattentive subtype getting a diagnosis of Depression. They look the same but they are not. It would thus make sense that some paitents with a diagnosis of Depression would respond well to stimulants.

More on innattentive subtype and the latest thoughts on it. A long and disjointed thread but some very good info.


Ooooops, I meant this long and disjointed thread. forgot to post... :o
http://www.addforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19889

I found that I started to get depression symptoms after starting the adderall.

It wore off in time but I had never had a problem with depression symptoms prior to adderall.

I don't know why it affected me that way.

Depletes dopamine ....

But does it really? I have read this "depleting" idea several times on this board but where is the proof that stimulants deplete dopamine or even change your levels? Better yet where does this dopamine go? As I understand neurotransmitters, they are not like gasoline, where you just put in more and more. They are more water which can be used over and over again. As I understand it, stimulants simply make the dopamine that is there, more useful.

Prove me wrong and I'll learn something. :)

Prescription amphetamines are known to induce the release of dopamine in a dose-dependent manner . Amphetamines deplete dopamine in the brain, so that when the euphoria wears off, the user experiences intense fatigue and mental depression. Amphetamines work by causing the release of norepinephrine.

Ok, when I joined this discussion group, dopamine depletion was my first question. Can you tell me where you got your information regarding dopamine depletion? When I think dopamine depletion, I think your brain doesn't make it anymore at all. I read dopamine depletion causes parkinsons disease. Anna

I don't like the sound of that. All I see is:
Adderall = dopamine depletion

My belief is that:
dopamine depletion = bad

Now all this is starting to make me think:
Adderall = bad



All this = not good

stress also depletes dopamine , lots of things .... it is just the price you pay for a drug artificially making you feel better . what goes up must come down right ?

Amphetamines don't directly deplete levels. They substitute levels by causing increased sensitivity and inreased release of dopamine while they are working. When this happens, the body becomes used to the dopamine levels it needs to produce when the drug is in action (markedly less). When the drug then wears off, the dopamine levels are lower because the brain is only producing those levels necessary while dopamine is increased by the drug. The dopamine levels will then eventually rise again, though this can take a long time.

I disagree....memebers on many depression forums report being prescribed Adderall for depression...it certainly is a know fact that Adderall is prescribe "off-label" for depression.

Futhermore, on the pharamcy insert that came with my prescription it states under Common Uses:

"...This medicine is a stimulant combination used to treat ADD/ADHD, narcolepsy, weight loss and depression."
This FDA warning letter (PDF) (http://www.fda.gov/cder/warn/nov2000/dd9153.pdf) , is instructing Shire sales reps to stop marketing that (for depression) in 1999, however Adderall was not approved until 2002 (http://www.fda.gov/cder/foi/nda/2002/11-522S030_Adderall.htm) at FDA. Then... FDA has deaths mentioned in 1999 (http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/InfoSheets/HCP/adderalHCP.htm) in a public health advisory (bottom), again on FDA's website.

No prescribing information on FDA's website (or the Adderall XR website (http://www.adhdhelp.net/)) has that for weight loss or depression, actually contraindicated for depression. Does that seem confusing, or was that previously approved for depression and weight loss?

Where I work, it isn't prescribed for anything but ADHD. I don't know about other places.

Prescription amphetamines are known to induce the release of dopamine in a dose-dependent manner . Amphetamines deplete dopamine in the brain, so that when the euphoria wears off, the user experiences intense fatigue and mental depression. Amphetamines work by causing the release of norepinephrine.


Not the way that I understand it. Prescribed stimulants don't turn on the "taps" nor is euphoria a good word to use when talking about therapeutic levels of stimulants. I doubt there is a body of evidence that suggests that there is "intense fatigue" and "mental depression" once the meds have worn out. Please show us some links to support your contentions. Especially the concept of Dopamine depletion.

What Prescribed stimulants do is make the neurotransmitter uptake work properly. This mechanism is a recycler of neurotransmitters which have been left in the synaptic gap. Without it, you wouldn't be able to repeatedly do any brain function. With ADHD people the NTU sucks up too many neurotransmitters as they are crossing the synaptic gap. For reasons not yet explained to me, the "no" messages are the ones that tend to get "lost" because the the neurotransmitter threshold has not been reached to pass the message along.

Stimulants simply make the NTU work more naturally.

Ok, I was a neuroscience major and I am currently a second year medical student so I am somewhat confident in the information I am giving you. What stimulants do, particulary amphetamines, is work thru a variety of mechanisms

1. block the reuptake of catecholamines (norepinephrine and dopamine). This lets them hang out in the synapse longer to do their thing and stimulate neurons.

2. Increase the release of catecholamines

3. Making the neuron your trying to excite, easier to excite (lowering the threshold)

The problem is there are several mechanisms in our brain that are in charge of clearing the synapse of neurotransmitters. The three main pathways are thru reuptake, monoamine oxidase (MAO), and simple diffusion. The reuptake pathway is able to recycle the NTs but the thru the MAO pathway and diffuesion pathway the monoamines are metabolized and essentially lost. When they are metabolized or diffuse out this means that you have to regenerate precursors (tyrosine) and this takes a long time so in essence you are losing dopamine.

This mechanism is dose dependent in which low doses tend to block only reuptake but higher doses tend to block both reuptake and MAO.

Depression is a clinical state described by DSM-IV lasting at least several weeks so I would doubt you would see any papers stating this, but there are hundreds of papers indicating residual depression in meth users and that could be applied analogously. Besides, anyone who has taken adderall knows that there is a comedown, you dont need a double-blind, placebo study to tell you that.

THough I am not a full-fledged MD, I would urge anyone thinking about self-medicating their depression with adderall to think twice. This could very well exacerbate and enhance your depressed state. SSRi's in combo with therapy have pretty decent track record and for some people work very well.

While I have no evidence to support this, the reasons I can see adderall working as an anti-depressant are because of its well-known euphoric effects. The half-life of amphetamines is very short so there will be a many peaks and troughs. SSRI's on the other hand have a halo effect that last 24/7 since they are thought to modulate the actual neural wiring.

ok im tired of thinking

JayMarc,
Do you know anything about dopamine depletion?

Anna

Jaymarc,

Welcome to the Forum and thanks for the feedback.

The track record for therapy + anti-depressants is a long and excellent one.

Personally, I see this train of thought as tangential; especially as it relates to ADHD.

Thanks again.
mctavish23 (Robert)

Im not sure what you are exactly referring to as dopamine depletion but using adderall or any other CNS stimulant will cause a transient decrease in your monoamines (dopamine and norepinephrine). Though your body is very good with at regenerating this fairly quickly. I think what you are referring to is cytotoxicity (neuron cell death) of dopaminergic neurons (neurons that make dopamine) that is well documented in Parkinsons, Huningtons, etc. This involveds the actual death of cells that is NOT involved in therapeutic use of amphetamines so you dont really have anything to worry about in terms of permanent damage. Amphetamines have a very long and safe track record in comparison to other psychotropic drugs out there.

Prescription amphetamines are known to induce the release of dopamine in a dose-dependent manner . Amphetamines deplete dopamine in the brain, so that when the euphoria wears off, the user experiences intense fatigue and mental depression. Amphetamines work by causing the release of norepinephrine. That's a funny statement, honestly:D. Intense fatigue and depression? Yeah maybe if you snorted 50mg of dextroamphetamine. Dopamine is depleted acutely, just as it is via environmental stimulation, but DA stores are constantly restoring themselves. The mental depression and fatigue are caused by desensitized receptors and a general adaptive change caused by increased stimulation. Most people don't feel like this AT ALL when they take amphetamines therapeutically, but many do feel worn down, irritable, and foggy. Rebound hyperactivity has been characterized for years with stimulants. In fact many people actually get MORE depressed while the drug is in the blood at therapeutic concentrations.

This FDA warning letter (PDF) (http://www.fda.gov/cder/warn/nov2000/dd9153.pdf) , is instructing Shire sales reps to stop marketing that (for depression) in 1999, however Adderall was not approved until 2002 (http://www.fda.gov/cder/foi/nda/2002/11-522S030_Adderall.htm) at FDA. Then... FDA has deaths mentioned in 1999 (http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/InfoSheets/HCP/adderalHCP.htm) in a public health advisory (bottom), again on FDA's website.

No prescribing information on FDA's website (or the Adderall XR website (http://www.adhdhelp.net/)) has that for weight loss or depression, actually contraindicated for depression. Does that seem confusing, or was that previously approved for depression and weight loss? This does not at all mean that Adderall is not efficacious for depression. It means that Adderall has not undergone studies for depression, so they have no right according to FDA policy, to market the drug and makes claims of efficacy for Adderall in depression. Fact is, that most studies of stimulants for depression have been negative. But stimulants have been used for years off-label for treatment-resistant depression, and for some people, they are all that will work. What the research really says is that stimulants are either ineffective or exacerbate depression in most cases, but for a significant minority, they work.

I don't remember what the original question was exactly, but if you have failed antidepressant trials in the past you may find some benefit from stimulants alone or in combination with other medications. If you have a particular constellation of symptoms that indicate cognitive impairment, anhedonia, apathy, etc., then you may look into it. On the other hand if your depression is more classical and is particularly severe, you're Dr. will rightfully augment with something more oriented towards stabilization like an atypical antipsychotic.

Here's my experience : I take Adderall and Lexapro--but the Lexapro is to raise serotonin primarily to treat my OCD.

The Adderall does help my depression, but I'm sure the Lexapro helps also.

Finally, I believe it's true I come down from Adderall more smoothly than I did from regular release Ritalin.

DBR