Oppositional Defiant Disorder Symptoms

A pattern of negativistic, hostile, and defiant behavior lasting at least 6 months, during which four (or more) of the following are present:

*often loses temper
*often argues with adults
*often actively defies or refuses to comply with adults' requests or rules
*often deliberately annoys people
*often blames others for his or her mistakes or misbehavior
*is often touchy or easily annoyed by others
*is often angry and resentful
*is often spiteful or vindictive

Note: Consider a criterion met only if the behavior occurs more frequently than is typically observed in individuals of comparable age and developmental level.

The disturbance in behavior causes clinically significant impairment in social, academic, or occupational functioning.

The behaviors do not occur exclusively during the course of a Psychotic or Mood Disorder (such as depression).

Criteria are not met for Conduct Disorder, and, if the individual is age 18 years or older, criteria are not met for Antisocial Personality Disorder.

Criteria summarized from:
American Psychiatric Association. (1994). Diagnostic and statistical manual of mental disorders, fourth edition. Washington, DC: American Psychiatric Association.

From Mental Help Net

I have a question for you Big.

Can adults have ODD? The symptoms describe both my mother and 21yr old brother to a tee, yet I can't find anything on the net relating ODD to adults. I am pretty sure my brother also has adhd.

Wow. I was DEFINITELY this as a child.

I think I have outgrown it now... but I am not positive. Perhaps I regress when fighting with my wife and son...?

Well folks, may I say that this simply sounds like the NATURAL reaction to being chronically frustrated and misattributed and situationally mistreated.

I think most people with ADHD, especially while not being given the "unique" treament they deserve and require, would qualify as this....

It seems to me that having any ther codition would be an indicatio tht this might be a "reaction" the another mis-deagnosis, rather than a condition of its own. (primary)

You may have a point, Wheel. I always felt as a child that I was being unjustly treated because I was misunderstood and the people in charge of me were not as intelligent as I was.

Originally posted by Paul S
You may have a point, Wheel. I always felt as a child that I was being unjustly treated because I was misunderstood and the people in charge of me were not as intelligent as I was.

Well, Paul, I'd guess you were right!

Originally posted by Bucky
I have a question for you Big.

Can adults have ODD? The symptoms describe both my mother and 21yr old brother to a tee, yet I can't find anything on the net relating ODD to adults. I am pretty sure my brother also has adhd.

Here's a web page with Frequently Asked Questions on ODD (http://www.docspeak.com/ODD/FAQS.htm#How%20is%20ODD%20diagnosed)

To highlight one...

What happens when ODD youngsters become adults?

They can take their problems with them, causing difficulty in their relationships, marriage and work. The divorce rate, employment difficulties and the abuse of alcohol or drugs is usually higher in this population of young adults.

An excellent article on ODD can be found here. (http://www.emedicine.com/PED/topic2791.htm)

According to Medline (http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/001537.htm), "In a significant proportion of cases, the adult condition of conduct disorder can be traced back to the presence of oppositional defiant disorder in childhood. "

Many anti-social behaviors can sound like ODD, but that doesnt mean that they actually HAVE ODD, or Conduct Disorder (http://www.aacap.org/publications/factsfam/conduct.htm). Only a medical professional can make that diagnosis.

Originally posted by Wheel1975
Well folks, may I say that this simply sounds like the NATURAL reaction to being chronically frustrated and misattributed and situationally mistreated.
I must say I do to some degree recognise the feeling of injustice and the "defiant" behaviour in myself and my mother, but from what I have read, the difference is that someone with ADD can often hurt people with words/actions because they act on impulse, but when the problem is explained to them or they realise they've hurt someone, then they genuinely regret their actions, and they are to some degree capable of learning from those mishaps.

You may still feel you were "justified" in your actions or wording of something, but you also are capable of regretting that what you said or did hurt someone. In case of ODD however, the element of regret or recognition of others' feelings isn't there, you feel like the other person "deserved" to get hurt.

Someone with ODD can often get a "kick" out of the defiance and often enjoys being hurtful to others, they do "bad" things BECAUSE they know what hurt they cause, NOT because they haven't considered the consequences of their actions (as with impulsive behaviour). There is an element of "I don't care about others getting hurt" in these actions (if not as far as "I want to kick them where it hurts).

I know the lines aren't as clear cut, but from the comparisons I've read about, there is a general difference in the intentions behind the behaviour, even if sometimes it's hard to tell the difference from the outside. (Especially if someone with ADD has trouble voicing their feelings, so apologising for upsetting someone can be difficult)

I believe for example that my ex may have ODD or be bipolar. I wanted to believe for so long that he regretted his behaviour (he only "regretted" it insofar as stopping me from leaving him was concerned), but the longer the more it became clear that he actually enjoyed hurting others, it made him feel strong and powerful and made him feel better about himself.

While I must say some of his blowups were down to low frustration/stress tolerance, there was always a certain air of intent and deliberate mischief about his actions - he actually PLANNED on how to hurt people, so there is no way any of what he did can be stamped off as "just plain impulsive" behaviour.

That willingness to hurt others for your own gain, in itself is definitely NOT part of ADD - we get frustrated easily, but that does not mean we are out to hurt others. Yes we blow more easily but we don't enjoy the hurt this causes others.


No matter what the reason, someone who beats other people up, destroys other peoples' property or deliberately says hurtful things to people, still has the choice to seek help for their problems.

It's whether or not you are willing to seek that help that distinguishes the "innocent" victim of mental disorder from the *****hole who deliberately continues their behaviour.

I'll take that, and I 'll raise you a nickle...

I'll take the description and deffinition as proposed.

Still, i have to wonder if the functional mechanism in ODD isn't more similar than different inside.

If an issue is left unresovled with me, I am as hot a week later as I was when i left it. Time, in and of itself, does not cool things.

I wonder if ODD folks are, really, prevented from ever gaining the "satisfaction" that allows others to "move on" from their "justified agner" or feelings that someone else "desevered" wht they got.

It wouldn't make any difference on the outside, or to how people should relate to them interpersonally, but it might explain WHERE inside the process was stopping, instead of progressing.

Originally posted by Wheel1975
If an issue is left unresovled with me, I am as hot a week later as I was when i left it. Time, in and of itself, does not cool things.

I wonder if ODD folks are, really, prevented from ever gaining the "satisfaction" that allows others to "move on" from their "justified agner" or feelings that someone else "desevered" wht they got.
That's a very interesting point there, I've never really looked at it from that angle! Personally, once I get stuck in something I can often argue a point to death and even when a thread (on the net) gets closed, I'll still protest and tell people I'm unhappy the discussion got ended so "abruptly". (Even though with hindsight, it's quite obvious the subject has been discussed to death and I had been repeating myself over and over again!)

However, once I take a step back (either out of my own choice because I tend to get bored of it eventually, or being forced to, if the discussion is shut) I am able to move on, and realise where I should have stopped (because I was repeating myself), and I definitely regret it if any of what I said in the course of the discussion/fight hurt someone else.

It does make sense though, that not being able to take that step backwards (even after a long time), not being able to move on (even if its just out of boredom) from these feelings, would make someone very negative indeed, and spiteful, forever holding a grudge against the world :(

The funny thing is that, in spite of the fact that in most arguments I passionately get involved in the only reason to "let go" for me is because I get bored with it and move on to something more interesting, the fact that I easily get frustrated and can be extremely stubborn when I believe to be in the right, I still am very quick to forgive & forget, don't tend to hold grudges, and overall I am very fearful of confrontation, and tend to be more of a (clumsy and a bit useless but still!) mediator than an instigator.

This is a garbage diagnosis. The willingness to hurt others for your own personal gain describes many business and personal situations. It is so amorphous that 30% of the population could be diagnosed with this disorder. They can show using a PET scan the hypoarousal of ADD. And their is sufficient data to believe that sociopaths have frontal lobe disfunction. But can they show the differances between how ODD and conduct disorder manifest themselves using a PET scan, EEG or MRI?

This is a garbage diagnosis. The willingness to hurt others for your own personal gain describes many business and personal situations. It is so amorphous that 30% of the population could be diagnosed with this disorder. They can show using a PET scan the hypoarousal of ADD. And their is sufficient data to believe that sociopaths have frontal lobe disfunction. But can they show the differances between how ODD and conduct disorder manifest themselves using a PET scan, EEG or MRI?

Yes I believe they can.

..and don't worry, it's not catchable.

Most people can read the DSM and find a "diagnosis" for everyone they know. The important thing to remember about diagnosing ODD is that it is classified as a "childhood disorder" and thus symptoms must be present during childhood. In order to properly diagnose this disorder, information is gathered relating to the child's behavior in various settings (ie, at home, school etc) and compared to behavior of "normal" children. The symptoms must also have been present for at least six months prior to diagnosis, and must cause significant impairment in the child's daily life.

Most people can read the DSM and find a "diagnosis" for everyone they know. The important thing to remember about diagnosing ODD is that it is classified as a "childhood disorder" and thus symptoms must be present during childhood. In order to properly diagnose this disorder, information is gathered relating to the child's behavior in various settings (ie, at home, school etc) and compared to behavior of "normal" children. The symptoms must also have been present for at least six months prior to diagnosis, and must cause significant impairment in the child's daily life.



Thank you, sss180b, for curbing the tendency, for most to 'run' with the DSM (whatever version) as being the 'almighty truth'.


Here's how I've *seen* it, folks..
Some individuals actually do invoke 'chances to change', if given, to react differently, as adults.

Nothing, and especially 'no one' is 'set in stone'.
Remember that.

must have odd then cos i meet all the above lol being your self is impornted i think ....dorm

So does these symptoms need to be in all settings (school, home, social)? What if they are just at home?

for a while now adn from what i gather it needs to pretty much be an all the time uncontrollable disorder, but i have noticed because ODD is not treated with meds, its treated with parental education mainly....they can behave better with certain ppl, usually a parent or 1 parent and not the other because the parent to take the disciplining seriously and doesnt given in usually gets more respect from teh child.

Actually this disorder should not be under conduct disorder, it should have it's own subject heading. Conduct disorder is more serious usually presents or children are labelled this when their ODD hasn't been managed parents, by schools and other authorative figures who fling up their hands in powerlessness and declare them "CD".

So, how about moving it out of here. My first words on this forum.

I have a stepson who is ODD and was diagnosed at age seven. We use the 1-2-3-Magic program and it has worked very well in this family. Before that, we used the Positive Discipline for Pre-Schoolers, which had great advice on time-outs and how to do them among other things.

I have children aged 31, 27, 24 and then I moved in with my stepson and his father and twin sister. That's when I decided he wasn't your average kid at age 31/2 years. So, I went out and put the positive discipline book and spent time teaching this kid who was in charge and what was acceptable behavior and that time-outs started when he was quiet etc.

He is now 12 and our biggest issues are the schools and their attitudes toward his IEP and what they are willing to incorporate into his daily classroom challenges. When they are good, he is good enough.

Yes, ODD can go from childhood to adulthood, and IS genetic. i know because i have ADHD, ODD, and IED. Both of my sons do also. As if just having one wasn't bad enough.

My son who is 11 is ADHD and ODD. We spent 3 yrs in counseling, this did a world of good for him. He had a sever impulse disorder when he was younger. It didn't matter what I said to him I was always wrong and he was right. If I told him to do something he would do just the opposite just to spite me. So I started using Love and Logic with him. You can do this or this. It worked wonders. Giving him the choice to do the right thing or the wrong and suffer the consequences put him in charge and stopped the fighting. Now I can take him with me anywhere and he is better behaved than his 9 yr-old sister. I can ask him to do anything to help and I rarely get arguments. Another thing I did is put his dad and I on the same page. My husband originally did not want him on meds and would often let him have his way. One day I said either you let me deal with this my way or you deal with him from now on and deal with the schools, and when he get kicked out of school you stay home with him and you teach him so that he can get a job and not have to fight all the time. His dad quickly got on board and we have done great. He is bringing home bs and cs in school. Is he perfect no but what kid is? With out the diagnosis from his Dr. I couldn't have gotten him the help he needed or made the schools listen to me. As a teacher that was very frustrating, knowing what to do to fix the problem but with out a Dr. saying "He has ODD" I couldn't get the schools to listen to me.