I posted something similar under someone else's thread - but here it is!

Concerta makes me want to smoke (Adderall made me chain smoke). It is an increased craving! BTW, I get hungry and sleepy on Concerta (on Adderall get hungrier, but not sleepy).

It has been a week today that I have been smokeless, but using nicotine lozenges instead. I never realized how addicted I was (only 3-5 cigs a day). What is interesting is how "taking" nicotine seems to help my ADD - it seems to enhance my Concerta. I realized I was medicating myself with cigarettes, but what I craved was (is) the nicotine. Scary - perhaps I should take very small doses of ritalin when I crave nicotine.

I know someone (highly probable ADD) who quit cigs six years ago, but still uses Nicorette (nicotine) gum.

My psychiatrist has never asked me if I smoke. I am planning to ask him to consider Wellbutrin (Zyban) instead of (or in addition to) the Lexapro I take.

Some doctors say coffee is "dirty" Ritalin- I wonder if nicotine is "dirty" Ritalin as well.

What do you guys/gals think?

nicotine is a stimulant when used in small doses. a fatal poison in large doses.

smoking a cigarette can do three things. the act of inhaling deeply can be a way to cope with anxiety. it suppresses the sympathetic nervous system thus resulting in relaxation. the nicotine in the cigarette however stimulates the sympathetic nervous system. taking a cigarette out of it's package, lighting it, holding it in the hand, doing this and that are displacement activities. instead of concentrating on the uncomfortable 'now', cigarettes provide a way of distracting the mind.

i think what goes on is multifactorial. people self medicate. life is uncomfortable and difficult so we develop ways of dealing with it. some ways are deadlier than others.

Nicotine is a Xanthine. It is a stimulant.

However, smoking doesn't treat ADHD.

Does Anything really treat Add

or does it just mellow out the emotional rollar coaster that we live on untill we can get our hands back on the controls

some drugs treat things and make them go away such as antibiotics for an infection

Smoking works to slow the roller coaster down just a little bit for a short period of time instead of taking a 10 mg pill that last for hours

we could banter back and forth for hours on this

Garry: In other words, some drugs cure, other drugs reduce/eliminate symptoms.

Since ADD is not curable, the question could be whether (non-smoked) nicotine "treats" (as in reduce/eliminate) the symptoms associated with ADD.

I have no doubt that there are more "targeted" drugs, e.g., amphetamine, methylphenidate, that can do a much better job.

But what if someone doesn't have access to Rx drugs and to physicians - would nicotine and caffeine assist in managing the symptoms, etc. of ADD? The answer is evident from the number of ADDers who use these and other drugs to self-medicate that "something" which is wrong with them.

One problem here is that these people are not medically supervised and thus might be hurting themselves. In addition, I am not aware of research on how to medically treat the symptoms of ADD with nicotine and caffeine - although I think it is possible (but not optimal).

SnappyCloud,
Congratulations on being smoke free. Wellbutrin helped me quit smoking cigarettes almost four months ago. Both my son and I found the nicotine patch hyped us up.

My diagnosing psychiatrist asked me if I still smoked cigarettes. I have forgotten most of the several hundred questions he asked me, but that one stuck.

A medical doctor who writes a syndicated newspaper column once stated that if one was still smoking cigarettes, one needed to see a psychiatrist. I did. :D

Not too long ago, Mike N.Y. posted a link to a study on how cigarette smoking exacerbates alcohol related brain damage.

It goes on to say that cigarette smoking can cause brain damage all by itself.

One of the things I look for in terms of trying to identify possible ADHD "risk factors" in kids, is evidence of whether or not the mother smoked during pregnancy.

Nicotine use during pregnancy impacts low birth weight.

It's listed in the literature as an "environmental toxin."

Thanks Imnaple,

Bad news for me: I love nicotine; I hope I just like it because of the adiction and not for the effects it has on my ADD. Why do I like it if I'm on Concerta? Again, hopefully just the addiction.

My second smoke-free week started today. Let me tell you that yesterday I got really bad cravings (if I had had cigs with me, I probably would've smoked "just one").

Today I got the lowest dose (7mg) of the patch (step 3- the last step) and put it on. My reasoning was that the 2mg lozenges (9x/day) were not that effective by themselves. I was only having 5 or 6 of them. What I plan to do is to use the patch and have 2-4 lozenges if needed. Hopefully the patch will stabilize me while the lozenges will be there just for the cravings. As you can see, this is a customized approach - not the one recommended by the nicotine dealers.

I will still consider asking my doc for Wellbutrin when I call him to ask him to mail me the monthly script for Concerta.

mactavish/robert,

Yes, I remember seeing that study.

I am currently interested in "smokelss nicotine." Nicotine is not a good stimulant compared to others, but some of the stigma about it is its association with (CO, tar, additives) the smoke. I am aware that nicotine might be more adictive than heroin.

Take care.

SnappyCloud, there have been cigarettes available in my house since I quit smoking; no strong desire for even a drag off someone else's. Wellbutrin rocks.

Imnapl,

Do you continue taking Wellbutrin?

I know someone who quit through Wellbutrin, but then discontinued the medication - he relapsed a few months later.

Nicotine increases seretonin in the brain treemendously. It is known to have a calming effect on people... This is probably why nicotine withdrawal symptomms include mania and insomnia...

ME :D


I posted something similar under someone else's thread - but here it is!

Concerta makes me want to smoke (Adderall made me chain smoke). It is an increased craving! BTW, I get hungry and sleepy on Concerta (on Adderall get hungrier, but not sleepy).

It has been a week today that I have been smokeless, but using nicotine lozenges instead. I never realized how addicted I was (only 3-5 cigs a day). What is interesting is how "taking" nicotine seems to help my ADD - it seems to enhance my Concerta. I realized I was medicating myself with cigarettes, but what I craved was (is) the nicotine. Scary - perhaps I should take very small doses of ritalin when I crave nicotine.

I know someone (highly probable ADD) who quit cigs six years ago, but still uses Nicorette (nicotine) gum.

My psychiatrist has never asked me if I smoke. I am planning to ask him to consider Wellbutrin (Zyban) instead of (or in addition to) the Lexapro I take.

Some doctors say coffee is "dirty" Ritalin- I wonder if nicotine is "dirty" Ritalin as well.

What do you guys/gals think?

Imnapl,

Do you continue taking Wellbutrin?

I know someone who quit through Wellbutrin, but then discontinued the medication - he relapsed a few months later. Good question, SnappyCloud. I haven't taken any Wellbutrin for three weeks and I think I'm going to be o.k.. Mind you, last week was the first time I've had an alcoholic beverage since I quit smoking and I really thought about it. It must have been fine because I had a second drink. :D I would not hesitate to go back on Wellbutrin if I felt I needed to and if I had to, I would stay on it permanently.

When I told my cousin that I quit smoking, she said, "Congratulations! Now you never need to worry about a cigarette again." She's right.

Physiology and Psychology of Smoking



Most smokers perceive the immediate effect of smoking as something positive; a stimulant that makes them seem to feel more alert, clearheaded and able to focus on work. However, the smoker’s perception is mostly an illusion. Take a look at what smoke does to the brain.

Within ten seconds of the first inhalation, nicotine, a potent alkaloid, passes into the bloodstream, transits the barrier that protects the brain from most impurities, and begins to act on brain cells. Nicotine molecules fit like keys into the “nicotinic” receptors on the surface of the brain’s neurons. In fact, nicotine fits the same “keyholes” as one of the brain’s most important neurotransmitters (signal chemicals), acetycholine, which results in a rush of stimulation and an increase in the flow of blood to the brain.

After ten puffs have flowed through the lungs, the smoker feels energized and clearheaded, but this is partly due to the fact that this was a period which ended a nicotine depravation, and another is about to happen. Within 30 minutes, the nicotine is reduced and the smoker feels the energy slipping away. A second cigarette is lit, and there is another surge of adrenaline, but now there is a feeling of one of the paradoxes of smoking, that at one dose it can stimulate, at another soothe. The muscles throughout your body starts to relax, and your pain threshold rises.

Another 30 minutes pass and the attention of the smoker increasingly drifts away from work and toward the nearby pack of cigarettes. Nicotine prompts brain cells to grow many more nicotinic receptors which allow the brain to function normally despite an unnatural amount of acetylcholine-like chemical acting on it, so the smoker feels normal when nicotine floods the neurons and abnormal when it doesn't. “You might say smokers live near the edge of a cliff,” says Jack Henningfield of the National Institute on Drug Abuse in Baltimore. “Most are never more than a few hours away from the start of nicotine withdrawal symptoms.”

The American Psychiatric Association classifies smoking withdrawal as a “nicotine-induced organic mental disorder,” and several studies have compared active smokers with ‘deprived’ smokers (those suffering nicotine withdrawal) on their ability to perform simple skill tests. These are often cited (and many were funded) by the tobacco industry as evidence that tobacco enhances alertness and performance. What they really show is that nicotine withdrawal causes dramatic mental dysfunction. Research revealed that a smoker might perform adequately at many jobs until the job gets complicated: a smoker could drive a car satisfactorily as long as everything was routine, but if a tire blew out at high speed he might not handle the job as well as a nonsmoker.
{“How Cigarettes Cloud the Brain,” Reader’s Digest, March 1995} In 1980, tobacco dependence was listed as a mental disorder in the official diagnostic reference for the American Psychiatric Association. In 1991, the Psychiatric Association reported that smokers have a higher lifetime frequency of substance abuse, severe depression and anxiety disorders involving aggression and antisocial behavior.

Full Article: http://www.jrussellshealth.com/smoking.html


1.Cigarette smoke contains carbon monoxide.Smoking one pack a day causes tissue hypoxia for 15-20 hours a day. Hypoxia is a reduced amount of oxygen.
In addition the peripheral vasoconstictive tendencies of nicotine may also cause a decrease in available oxygen.
http://www.orthosmoke.org/index.php/doc/Carbon%20Monoxide

Tissue hypoxia can cause acquired polycythemia.

http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic1863.htm

2. There is a link between smoking and depression.
http://www.apa.org/monitor/jun01/smokedepress.html
http://www.mentalhealth.com/mag1/p5m-dp04.html
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1998/02/980212072435.htm

3. Smoking may increase the risk of anxiety.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/1010221.stm
http://www.nida.nih.gov/NIDA_Notes/NNVol16N1/Smoking.html

Oh good.

Something else for us ADD'ers to feel a sense of failure over....

Oh good.

Something else for us ADD'ers to feel a sense of failure over.... Definitely not; unless I am misunderstanding something. Certain people are more inclined to smoke cigarettes and ADDers are some of them. My mother has never let a cigarette touch her lips (or inhaled :D) and didn't understand why we couldn't just quit. When the news reported a link to smoking and ADHD, she phoned me. She is also now a firm believer in the wonders of Wellbutrin for certain people.

A person's Belief System is what colors their world.

Nicotine being an environmental toxin and NOT good for ADHD......is a GOOD thing.:)

mctavish,

I apologize in advanced - it is late and my med has worn off - but I wasn't able to follow anything in your comment:

Who said good? (Mike/NY's article or MoodyBlonde's response?) The former refers to an illusion - not a result from a "belief system," but rather from a biochemical reaction. The latter was just being sarcastic.

What is good for ADD? psychoterapy? certain stimulants? antidepressants?

What is Good? what cures you? what decreases your symptoms? what helps you cope?

Is gasoline being an environmental toxin not a good thing for transporation of people and commodities?

I was referring to moody blonde's remarks about... "Something else for us ADDer's to feel a sense of failure over."

It's all in how you look at it.:)

mct,

Since I don't think I was hyperocusing at the time of the day I wrote my last post, I was probably OBSESSING - hence got carried away in overanalysis.

It was all in how I was looking at it!

I meant, the failure of not being able to quit smoking.....even though years of trying availed nothing.

And no, I can't take Wellbutrin.

I quit smoking after 9 attempts over 2 years. Tried everything, yes Wellbutrin works, and when I stopped the pill I did relapse so I just took it again and all back to normal. Found that making stupid rules like standing on one foot hopping while smoking outside worked best. Entertainment for my friends and good incentive not to smoke. The final blow came when I decided to just smoke a bunch of herb to cure the oral fix. Which I have to say is one of the most effective anti-cig techniques as I was too unmotivated to get up and smoke. Completely non-addictive and fun plus it really helps with the withdrawl symptoms especially the headaches and nausea. So in the absence of wellbutrin maybe it'll help.

Nicotine is one of those things that works wonders but isn't worth the side effects. The first problem is that nicotine causes your blood vessels to constrict, lowering body temperature and circulation. Since amps make your hands cold the combo probably wouldn't be pleasant. Also smoking while on any SNRI could cause a coma or death beacuse of the serotonin spike from the nicotine. Plus with circulation hindered, radiation of built up heat would not occur as efficiently and the body could overheat like MDMA which btw has the same effect on serotonin and norepinephrine as nicotine and an SNRI

I'd never heard that nicotine affects serotonin.
It's primary effect, from what I've read is on dopamine.

Nicotine does primarily act as a stimulant but consider what the body does because of the addiction. You release serotonin when pleased, nicotine makes you happy. The excess serotonin normally would be used by the brain and then taken back by the reuptake system. But if you have an SSRI at work the body could release MAO to remove excess serotonin, the MAO would attack the nicotine and cause problems.

THe other way was less verbose.

OK, I have been smokeless for four weeks today! I am still using nicotine replacement though. I still crave nicotine, but not necessarily cigarettes. I have reduced the amount of replacement nicotine compared to when I started, but find it peculiar that the replacement amount was higher than that I was using when smoking. This probably has to do with needing less smoked nicotine because of the quick direct effect on the brain.

I am particularly interested in theluckyone's above contribution about nicotine-ssri-serotonin-dopamine, since I cut in half (10mg to 5mg) my Lexapro (SSRI) a month ago. I am not sure of what he meant in his/hers last two postings here. I can tell you that my excessive sweating problem has improved a lot!

I am swithing back to ADDERALL XR (20mg bid) on Monday because eventhough I found Concerta better for decreasing anxiety (sometimes made me sleepy), my focusing ability was not as good as with Adderall. Furthermore, ability to focus decreased lately. I took up to 72mg bid.

I am happy to return to ADDERALL XR, but I am concerned because it makes me want to smoke more so than Concerta.

I would say "yes".

Covered it in various brain and pharm courses in univ.

Ritalin, nicotine, etc all stimulate the VTA-MFB-ACC brain "dopamine reward circuit".
(eg ventral tegmental area-->median forebrain bundle-->nucleus accumbens)

Most stimulants do. (except caffeine. it works by inhibition/blocking of Adenosine; a sleepy chemical.)

Emma