Firstly if i can easily type a long chunk of text like that in a fairly short amt, I cant possibly have ADD, can I?
I always throught I did. I mean the school reports year after year fit completely what wld be said to an ADD person. Horrendously disorganised, desk very messy, inattentive, dreamer, homework misplaced, most stationary or workbooks misplaced constantly, "doesnt" listen to instructions etc etc
But its starting not to add up. I have Asperger's, with ADD on the report although Im not sure if its considered a dx-- but I dont think I was completely honest during the testing-- i did worse on some because i was scared as I didnt know what they were looking for which obviously probably affected things somewhat!
I'm starting to think Im just a psuedo ADD-er. maybe its just an extention of a perfectly ordinary personality or character flaw.
Youd say so what? if you have i you have it, if you dont you dont... but itd make life so much easier and motivate me to do better if I know I have something... does that make any sense???

my so called ADD characteristics
used to switch/miscall numbers and letters often when reading (or read n for u)--- BUT this numbers (and some of the letters) thing almost decreased to zero in the past year
I can read the same book over and over for years and still find pages I have never seen before-- jump abt a lot, find it difficult to understand if i read it in order. Used to miss out sentences or parts of it but again this miraculously disappeared recently
lots of careless mistakes in maths
VERY disorganised
losing things all the time
inattentional blindess--- i can look *very carefully* for a title of a book vcd etc on a shelf and be unable to find it when its right under my nose BUT for some reason I dont see it at all. When asked by someone to find something I panic b/c I know i will miss it somehow. HOWEVER i find it easily to use the Dewey Dec system to look for books. DOESNT add up!
i need a lot of structire or i cant accomplish anything
Clumsy, always bumping into stuff
Very hard to organise factual essays. Mostly never came close to finishing essay tests although concise

WHAT doesnt ADD UP
-- Im a lefty and yet I use the proper tripod grip, my handwriting is aesthetically pleasing. Hard to read but looks good, not poorly formed I draw a lot too.
-- I transpose and turn stuff when reading but NOT when writing. In fact my writing since Sec school is almost error proof. I rarely have to proof read and I think Im a good proof reader. Perhaps my reading errors just my imagination?
-- I read aloud well, although I dont understand a thing Im reading when I read out loud but i suppose thats normal?
--- my coordination is okay I should think. i dont use the proper keyborading method but then who does? I type rather well.
-- I think I have a fairly good sense of rhythm
-- ADD and other differences usually= poor sense of time.
I have always been told I have a terrible sense of time but I realise now I actually have a pretty good one. If Im wondering about by myself trying to kill time when I look at my watch the time is almost what I estimated it to be.
Obviously if Im caught up with something I lose track, but other than that, I have a good sense of time passing I think and can usually remember when something happened (if not, im pretty good at stringing other memories to find out). Events from way back seem far more recent than recent events but i know chronologically they are not--> so i guess im a linear thinker? My long term memory is excellent.
So therefore I have no excuse for not being able to plan my time.
I always thought I was bad at maths (common teachers complaint) but i realise, at least until sec school, I was okay. its just that i was in one of the classes where more was expected therefore I was at the bottom in maths. I dont come across maths in my field of study being in uni, but i realise I can do simple computation quite well, and I can recall my times tables on the spot= clearly I dont have a prob!!! (though I am very slow in counting change)
FORGETFUL. this has been said al the time. really cannot remember where I put things, what Im suposed to do, multistep instructions. thoguh I take itnerest. BUT i easily can remember friend's names and birthdays, facts, appointments (granted i have so few events in social calender im bound to remember them), important numbers---> if I indeed had a poor working memory I wouldnt be able to recall all those!


Obviously as I said if I can write such a mammoth email.... it kinda cancels out my problem of structuring essays huh

I know its stupid to be so bothered by this... but... arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

P.S: I thought i'd add... I dont know exactly what I'm looking for or looking to achieve by posting this on this forum... guess I just had to let it out. Of course opinions from whatever angle are very welcome.

Howdy lurker: welcome to the forums.

A lot of your symptoms sound ADHD-like, but aren't a lot of Asperger's symptoms ADHD-like? I guess it can be hard to tease the two apart. But what is probably more important is just to get a handle on your issues -- the things that impair you -- and try to overcome them.

Hi Uminchu, I guess I'm not so much worried whether my symtpoms are coming from ADD or Asperger's, but whether I have a developmental disorder/neurological difference in the first place! i e if i really had problem X i wouldnt, shouldnt be able to do A, B, C. I have a sense of time, dont have handwriting issues and can remember stuff that people with any 'difference' should not be able to..

I know it is irrational and if i dont have a "problem" after all, I should be grateful but..

Firstly, if I can easily type a long chunk of text like that in a fairly short amt, I can't possibly have ADD, can I?
...
Obviously as I said if I can write such a mammoth e-mail.... it kinda cancels out my problem of structuring essays, huh?Y'know, all ADDers seem to complain of this awful contradiction. The thing is, what draws us in really draws us in, but what makes us bored really makes us bored.

I always thought I did. I mean the school reports year after year fit completely what would be said to an ADD person. Horrendously disorganised, desk very messy, inattentive, dreamer, homework misplaced, most stationery or workbooks misplaced constantly, doesn't listen to instructions, etc. etc.
But it's starting not to add up. I have Asperger's, with ADD on the report although I'm not sure if its considered a dx-- but I don't think I was completely honest during the testing-- I did worse on some because I was scared as I didn't know what they were looking for which obviously probably affected things somewhat!
I'm starting to think I'm just a pseudo ADD-er. maybe its just an extension of a perfectly ordinary personality or character flaw.
You'd say 'So what? If you have it you have it, if you don't you don't...' but it'd make life so much easier and motivate me to do better if I know I have something... does that make any sense??? Perfectly. I wouldn't like to prepare for a battle where I don't even know what I'm fighting against. I can certainly relate to the feeling that I -must- be a fake, not a genuine member of these people with such out-of-control thoughts! But soon enough I realize how incompatible I am with the steady workpace that so many people use&expect, and it becomes undeniable that I'm something different.
My so-called ADD characteristics


Used to switch/miscall numbers and letters often when reading (or read n for u)--- BUT this numbers (and some of the letters) thing almost decreased to zero in the past year.
I can read the same book over and over for years and still find pages I have never seen before-- jump about a lot, find it difficult to understand if I read it in order. Used to miss out sentences or parts of it but again this miraculously disappeared recently.
Lots of careless mistakes in math.
VERY disorganised.
Losing things all the time.
Inattentional blindess--- i can look very carefully for a title of a book vcd etc. on a shelf and be unable to find it when its right under my nose BUT for some reason I dont see it at all. When asked by someone to find something I panic b/c I know I will miss it somehow.
I need a lot of structure or I can't accomplish anything.
Clumsy, always bumping into stuff.
Very hard to organise factual essays. Mostly never came close to finishing essay tests although concise.
I can imagine it's not hard to get a diagnosis with that many symptoms. In fact, combining that with your school reports, and the assumption that you did value the education given in school, I'd say I'm definitely being quite convinced myself (but then, I haven't studied into Asperger's enough to know if it's just that). As the only one in my family diagnosed with the condition, I must say my tendency toward the same blindness can be found quite baffling, and my disorganization and occasional loss of needed items, quite annoying. And then there's the essays, and the structure... so much I can relate to here...:o

WHAT doesn't ADD UP
-- I'm a lefty and yet I use the proper tripod grip, my handwriting is aesthetically pleasing. Hard to read but looks good, not poorly formed I draw a lot too.
-- I transpose and turn stuff when reading but NOT when writing. In fact my writing since Sec school is almost error proof. I rarely have to proof read and I think Im a good proof reader. Perhaps my reading errors just my imagination?
-- I read aloud well, although I don't understand a thing I'm reading when I read out loud but i suppose thats normal?
--- My coordination is okay I should think. I don't use the proper keyboarding method but then who does? I type rather well.
-- I think I have a fairly good sense of rhythm.
-- ADD and other differences usually = poor sense of time.
I have always been told I have a terrible sense of time but I realise now I actually have a pretty good one. If I'm wondering about by myself trying to kill time when I look at my watch the time is almost what I estimated it to be.
Obviously if I'm caught up with something I lose track, but other than that, I have a good sense of time passing I think and can usually remember when something happened (if not, im pretty good at stringing other memories to find out). Events from way back seem far more recent than recent events but I know chronologically they are not--> so I guess I'm a linear thinker? My long term memory is excellent.
So therefore I have no excuse for not being able to plan my time. On the other hand, that's just past, hindsight, where you have a memory of what happened and how long it lasted. Although I often have a decent sense of how long something took, I often have a quite erroneous sense of how long something will take, or even should take. So even though I have the potential to keep track of time's passing, it's a whole other thing entirely to take that and project it into future events (which always seem to have something that makes this time seem much different from last time, whether or not it is so).



I know it's stupid to be so bothered by this... but... arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrI too have been awfully annoyed by myself for not making any sense. After all, how do I explain to anyone all the contradictory things that describe how I feel, and how I end up acting every day?

inattentional blindess--- i can look *very carefully* for a title of a book vcd etc on a shelf and be unable to find it when its right under my nose BUT for some reason I dont see it at all. When asked by someone to find something I panic b/c I know i will miss it somehow. HOWEVER i find it easily to use the Dewey Dec system to look for books. DOESNT add up!


The books on the shelf are aranged in order based on the system, so you can at least perform a "binary search" (you can tell if you are ahead or behind the book, so you can "divide and conquer") Finding the key here (the identifier) is more predictable than finding the key in the other instance (being the title, which could appear on any other book in the library). Makes perfect sense, actually. (At least, to me.)



-- Im a lefty and yet I use the proper tripod grip, my handwriting is aesthetically pleasing. Hard to read but looks good, not poorly formed I draw a lot too.

ADD does not imply poor handwriting or poor fine motor coordination, although it *does* often occur with ADD. My handwriting isn't bad either, but I am so painfully slow at it (and it is actaully painful for me too) that I really can't take notes effectively. Asperger's doesn't imply motor coordination issues either, but I've heard that up to 90% of Aspies are affected by this problem.


-- I transpose and turn stuff when reading but NOT when writing. In fact my writing since Sec school is almost error proof. I rarely have to proof read and I think Im a good proof reader. Perhaps my reading errors just my imagination?

Especially now, my writing is pretty good the first time around. I think that's more because I have been in the habit of checking everything as I go, multiple times (experience from computer programming). But then again, I use actual pen and paper for almost nothing. I do everything with computers (and often the associated support mechanism, like spell checking, etc). With me, it's mostly writing speed (the time it takes me to organize my thoughts).


-- I read aloud well, although I dont understand a thing Im reading when I read out loud but i suppose thats normal?

Does this mean that your reading comprehension is better during silent reading? How much better?


--- my coordination is okay I should think. i dont use the proper keyborading method but then who does? I type rather well.

Again, lack of existence of motor coordination issues is not evidence of lack of ADD.


-- I think I have a fairly good sense of rhythm

So do Aspies, at least when not forced to follow someone else's rhythm.


-- ADD and other differences usually= poor sense of time.
I have always been told I have a terrible sense of time but I realise now I actually have a pretty good one. If Im wondering about by myself trying to kill time when I look at my watch the time is almost what I estimated it to be.
Obviously if Im caught up with something I lose track, but other than that, I have a good sense of time passing I think and can usually remember when something happened (if not, im pretty good at stringing other memories to find out).

As Albino Fox said, do you have trouble with planning? If the way you perform the task is not organized (i.e. nonlinear), then that will cause issues in predicting how long something will take, in itself, unless you have measured from experience. Added to that, the unpredicability of the ADD mind (focusing on something irrelavent), we tend not to take the same amount of time to perform the same task each time (well, at least for me...)


Events from way back seem far more recent than recent events but i know chronologically they are not--> so i guess im a linear thinker? My long term memory is excellent.

ADD and Asperger's mostly have impacts working memory. And a great long-term memory is a characteristic of Asperger's... but I think it happens with ADD as well (the mechanism for access in this case is different).

Remember the baseline ADD symptoms and how/if they are affecting you, not neccesarily how they affect other people. There's a wide range of impairment that one could possibly have.

Hi guys, thanks a lot for your replies

The books on the shelf are aranged in order based on the system, so you can at least perform a "binary search" (you can tell if you are ahead or behind the book, so you can "divide and conquer") Finding the key here (the identifier) is more predictable than finding the key in the other instance (being the title, which could appear on any other book in the library). Makes perfect sense, actually. (At least, to me.)
yup... what i mean is that with the ADD error rate shouldnt i find it difficult to follow the long string of numbers? (my number switching as i said before has decreased dramatically recently)


ADD does not imply poor handwriting or poor fine motor coordination, although it *does* often occur with ADD. My handwriting isn't bad either, but I am so painfully slow at it (and it is actaully painful for me too) that I really can't take notes effectively. Asperger's doesn't imply motor coordination issues either, but I've heard that up to 90% of Aspies are affected by this problem.(i have to ask this qn-- what really defines poor handwriting, because i notice theres a good amt of subjectivity)
If most squarks are sparks, whats the chance that im either a non spark squark, or i am not a squark at all? thats my concern...


Especially now, my writing is pretty good the first time around. I think that's more because I have been in the habit of checking everything as I go, multiple times (experience from computer programming). But then again, I use actual pen and paper for almost nothing. I do everything with computers (and often the associated support mechanism, like spell checking, etc). With me, it's mostly writing speed (the time it takes me to organize my thoughts).thats the thing-- given the ADD prelidiction for careless mistakes, i check rarely and still rarely make careless mistakes in writing, from 13 onwards!! how possible is it to have a AS/ADD person who is able to do that? Yes my problem is mainly organising my thoughts. i have so much going on my head and rarely 5% makes it to paper, unless its a topic that is from the start so clearly structured/has a flow to it that it by itself guides me... dunno how to phrase it but i hope you get what i mean! its especially frustrating bcos i think: i have no difficulties carrying out the mechanical process of writing so i should not whinge.

Does this mean that your reading comprehension is better during silent reading? How much better?
Oh tons, better. my silent reading compre is very good whle i have virtually no reading comprehension when reading out loud. an easy thing like " meet today at 5 pm" when im reading out loud, i will understand it. Anything beyond that, if I am reading out loud I will not understand ANY of it. Im guessing this is very common to ADD and non ADD pple alike but anyway it does cause some problems, like in group discussions/tutorials yr called on to read a passage... and then immediately after that the leader/tutor asks... so what do you think abt that, what does that mean? Ill have to say uhhh give me a moment... and then ill have to read the entire thing silently... because i have almost no recollection or sense of whatever i just read aloud whatsoever.

As Albino Fox said, do you have trouble with planning? If the way you perform the task is not organized (i.e. nonlinear), then that will cause issues in predicting how long something will take, in itself, unless you have measured from experience. Added to that, the unpredicability of the ADD mind (focusing on something irrelavent), we tend not to take the same amount of time to perform the same task each time (well, at least for me...)
Yes i have heaps of trouble planning things that i am often overwhelmed. even with planning my time seems to go just like that and i feel like i have accomplished nothing. on a good day it will work, but very rarely.


ADD and Asperger's mostly have impacts working memory. And a great long-term memory is a characteristic of Asperger's... but I think it happens with ADD as well (the mechanism for access in this case is different).
I know i do have a bad working memory like remembering lists of things, take things like keys, bag out of house, even with a written list i will forget it/miss out, multistep instructions, very often forget what i wanted to say/what im saying in midsentence... i.e. "Today I went to the... (???)the....(?????) the...... park". thats one of e probs for writing essays--- i cant pin the ideas down...
BUT my question is if i have a bad working memory, how come i can remember things like names and telephone numbers and spellings? Although i use a non- rote way of retaining spellings ( but then again i dunno who the hell would use H-e-l-l-o etc as a method...), and once i see a pattern in a telephone number i remember it for life, but still... arent these suppose to be the very fundamental things affected by poor working memory?

As you said different pple are affected differently, but it bugs me to no end that if my memory is poor for example, there should be things i cannot do that i can do.

Sorry to be so repititive about it!

yup... what i mean is that with the ADD error rate shouldnt i find it difficult to follow the long string of numbers? (my number switching as i said before has decreased dramatically recently)


You might not do it perfectly the first time, but it is still quicker than just randomly looking for the book. Plus, one doesn't need to pay attention to the entire string all at once (one component at a time) to get to the desired book. But maybe I'm just good at breaking down the syntax of things like this.


thats the thing-- given the ADD prelidiction for careless mistakes, i check rarely and still rarely make careless mistakes in writing, from 13 onwards!! how possible is it to have a AS/ADD person who is able to do that? Yes my problem is mainly organising my thoughts. i have so much going on my head and rarely 5% makes it to paper, unless its a topic that is from the start so clearly structured/has a flow to it that it by itself guides me... dunno how to phrase it but i hope you get what i mean! its especially frustrating bcos i think: i have no difficulties carrying out the mechanical process of writing so i should not whinge.


No offense, but I'd assume you wrote these replies in a hurry (the quality of your reply doesn't go along with what you are saying)? I think the attention to detail (lack thereof) in ADD is related to the interest of the detail, because attention to the detail requires more effort for us (as we tend to be higher achieving in the tasks that we like to do). There are people on these forums that have excellent writing skills, in my opinion, in all aspects. Conveying the point (fundamental to communication), spelling, grammar, flow, etc.


BUT my question is if i have a bad working memory, how come i can remember things like names and telephone numbers and spellings? Although i use a non- rote way of retaining spellings ( but then again i dunno who the hell would use H-e-l-l-o etc as a method...), and once i see a pattern in a telephone number i remember it for life, but still... arent these suppose to be the very fundamental things affected by poor working memory?


My memory is very much based on connections as well. The phone number 512-4096 would be easier than 487-3021 for me to remember (512 is 2^9 and 4096 is 2^12). And yes, poor working memory does have an effect (if it can't be held in working memory, it can't be transferred to long-term memory), but if a connection to what is stored in long term memory can be made (512 = 2^9 is in my long-term memory), then I would think that there is less demand on keeping hold of arbitrary sequences. Names tend to be a lot more difficult in this respect.


As you said different pple are affected differently, but it bugs me to no end that if my memory is poor for example, there should be things i cannot do that i can do.


I'm not saying whether or not you have ADD, but I wouldn't be able to falsify the argument, based on the information given.

AUTISM & ADHD RELATED. Do some research on the biomedical treatment of autism.
Lots of medical doctors in this field believe there is a close relationship between
the two. Read Children with Starving Brains.
JB

I'm not saying whether or not you have ADD, but I wouldn't be able to falsify the argument, based on the information given.
i must sound really dumb, but, errr I'm not really sure by what you meant here. :o

i must sound really dumb, but, errr I'm not really sure by what you meant here. :o

Basically, I wouldn't say that you definately don't have ADD (as in, I don't think the possibility of you having ADD is totally rediculous).

Firstly if i can easily type a long chunk of text like that in a fairly short amt, I cant possibly have ADD, can I?

Obviously, this has been answered, but ADD is about the inability to control attention, not the inability to pay attention.

Regarding your list of confusions (symptoms verses contradictions), we each have different areas that are problematic.



used to switch/miscall numbers and letters often when reading (or read n for u)--- BUT this numbers (and some of the letters) thing almost decreased to zero in the past year

Symptoms can and do change. Perhaps you've developed a "work around" to cope with this. You may not even be aware of it because the brain itself can adapt.



inattentional blindess--- i can look *very carefully* for a title of a book vcd etc on a shelf and be unable to find it when its right under my nose BUT for some reason I dont see it at all. When asked by someone to find something I panic b/c I know i will miss it somehow. HOWEVER i find it easily to use the Dewey Dec system to look for books. DOESNT add up! I agree w/HF that this makes total sense.



WHAT doesnt ADD UP
-- Im a lefty and yet I use the proper tripod grip, my handwriting is aesthetically pleasing. Hard to read but looks good, not poorly formed I draw a lot too. I'm pretty coordinated and can write neatly with effort. Everyone's impairments are different. The lefty/grip thing isn't at all unusual and I'm actually trying to advance the research into a possible relationship between "hemispheric ambiguity" and ADHD. Just an example: I write and eat left-handed, yet I throw, bat, and "mouse" right-handed.



-- I transpose and turn stuff when reading but NOT when writing.


I transpose/reverse/replace stuff when writing or even typing, but not when reading....



FORGETFUL. this has been said al the time. really cannot remember where I put things, what Im suposed to do, multistep instructions. thoguh I take itnerest. BUT i easily can remember friend's names and birthdays, facts, appointments (granted i have so few events in social calender im bound to remember them), important numbers---> if I indeed had a poor working memory I wouldnt be able to recall all those!

Working memory and long-term memory are different mechanisms that act pretty independently. They use different parts of the brain. What you are describing is mostly long-term memory. Now, in order to use long-term information, it has to be brought into working memory. Many ADDers have trouble with dates and appointments and such because of difficulty doing this, but some do not.



Obviously as I said if I can write such a mammoth email.... it kinda cancels out my problem of structuring essays huh

Not at all. Emails are expressive and interactive. Essays are quite different.

AUTISM & ADHD RELATED. Do some research on the biomedical treatment of autism.
Lots of medical doctors in this field believe there is a close relationship between
the two. Read Children with Starving Brains.
JB
Autism and ADHD are not related with the exception that they are both "brain-based". When there is one problem in the brain, another is more likely.

I don't know what field you are referring to, but theories in book "Children with Starving Brains" is not support by research.

Working memory and long-term memory are different mechanisms that act pretty independently. They use different parts of the brain. What you are describing is mostly long-term memory. Now, in order to use long-term information, it has to be brought into working memory. Many ADDers have trouble with dates and appointments and such because of difficulty doing this, but some do not.
hmm... so it is possible to have some short term memory problems, and yet not have problems transferring long term information into working memory? (correct me if i misunderstood)

hmm... so it is possible to have some short term memory problems, and yet not have problems transferring long term information into working memory? (correct me if i misunderstood)
Not only possible, with ADHD it's common.

Example: my 8yo ADD son is a walking encyclopedia. He knows so much about so many different things, it's hard to believe he's only 8. He's recently qualified for gifted programs as "intellectual", so he also puts that knowledge to good use. BUT, until he started Adderall 2 weeks ago, he couldn't learn his phone number. In fact, he couldn't repeat 7 digits immediately after hearing them; I had to break it up into 2 sections. On his second day of Adderall, it took him ONE TIME of repeating it back to learn his phone number w/area code AND his address. It took a little more work to get his zip code down, but he was only on 5mg for the first 10 days.:)

In his case, facts about cavemen and how penguins raise their young are easily transferred into long-term memory by creating a "picture" or an analogy. But, rote memorization is nearly impossible for him.

It's for this reason that many of us go undiagnosed for a very long time, managing to get through school w/o trouble and so forth. Each person is impaired differently and, thank goodness, one of my son's is the inability to initiate tasks. This slows him down so much that he stands out. Otherwise, we may never have recognized a problem.

yeah i do think in some ways its easier to be more obviously 'impaired'-- that way its identifiable and you get the help you need.

But, rote memorization is nearly impossible for him.



Telephone number thing I soooo relate I lived here for over two years before I could remember what the last four numbers of our home phone were!!!!

Telephone number thing I soooo relate I lived here for over two years before I could remember what the last four numbers of our home phone were!!!!Geez... I'm obsessed. Maybe its an Aspie thing :D
I did a count of all the numbers of people the i remember over the years, including my own numbers (but excluding the Pizza hut delivery :) ). I counted up to 14 numbers in total. Many are very "patternish" numbers to me anyway, but no way someone with ADD/ASD can remember that! God, I feel more like a fraud than ever.

Geez... I'm obsessed. Maybe its an Aspie thing :D
I did a count of all the numbers of people the i remember over the years, including my own numbers (but excluding the Pizza hut delivery :) ). I counted up to 14 numbers in total. Many are very "patternish" numbers to me anyway, but no way someone with ADD/ASD can remember that! God, I feel more like a fraud than ever.

??? Didn't I just explain how this is consistent with AD/HD? First of all, 14 is NOT a very large number. Second, "patternish" numbers are exactly the kinds of things an AD/HD person could remember well. I'm actually very good with numbers, but only if I can break it into some pattern or set of chunks that hold meaning.

??? Didn't I just explain how this is consistent with AD/HD? Lurker, don't let this discourage you from asking questions. It's late, meds are wearing off, kids have been home from school . . . :D

Lurker, don't let this discourage you from asking questions. It's late, meds are wearing off, kids have been home from school . . . :D
I just realized my tone may have been less than friendly. I apologize -- totally unintended.

No worries barbyma-- i have a tendency to go on and on on the same point! :)

I think the thing to consider is that ADD and AS do occurr together very often. Many aspies end up misdiagnosed as having ADD only and are later discovered to have AS as well.

As far as having contradictory traits is concerned, that is characteristic of both ADD and AS and is not diagnostic for anything in the context of separating AS from ADD.

But if I saw autistic traits, high IQ, OCD and ADD in an individual, I know that I'd be considering the notion that it may be more sensible to use the label "Aspie" , instead of trying to define several discrete disorders at once. Occam's Razor states that the truth is simple, and one dx that fits all the symptoms is more sensible than several discrete disorders... In persons who are very high fuinctioning, it becomes hard to dx them as autistic since a compelling impairment is largely absent. It then gets easier to accept several discrete disorders insted of the simpler diagnosis in the autism spectrum...

One trait that might convince you is; Resistance to change. ADDers don't like environmental change, but aspies can be positively thrown into a major tailspin by environmental change.
The problem here is that some aspies might not be bothered at all... I think the big indicator is IF the individual were to have a very autistic response to the situation.

Let me ask you this; What would be the effect if I were to sneak into your appartment and rearrange all your furniture while you were gone ?

You would be understandably baffled and rightly upset that someone had violated your personal space. Now the question is; Would that upset be one that would cause you serious difficulty?

Myself, I don't know how I wouild react. I'd probably be upset over it for days, but would not stop functioning. I think that some people would be very nearly disabled by such an event.

At some point one is still left with the question of what is the real disorder ?

It is a good thing I am not a practitioner eh?? (laughing)

ME :D

But if I saw autistic traits, high IQ, OCD and ADD in an individual, I know that I'd be considering the notion that it may be more sensible to use the label "Aspie" , instead of trying to define several discrete disorders at once. Occam's Razor states that the truth is simple, and one dx that fits all the symptoms is more sensible than several discrete disorders... In persons who are very high fuinctioning, it becomes hard to dx them as autistic since a compelling impairment is largely absent. It then gets easier to accept several discrete disorders insted of the simpler diagnosis in the autism spectrum...
The benefit of recognizing discrete disorders (at least in this case, but maybe not others) is treatment.

While many psychologists would go for the Apsie diagnosis, they would miss out on possible treatments if they don't look any further.

Treatments for AS are limited to behavioral methods, while OCD and ADD are treatable with medications. Behavioral methods don't help ADDers in general, although they do improve symptoms for OCD.


One trait that might convince you is; Resistance to change. ADDers don't like environmental change, but aspies can be positively thrown into a major tailspin by environmental change.
Agreed about the AS reaction, but I've never heard this about ADDers and I'd be surprised to find out it's a common trait. In fact, many here have expressed the need to move or change jobs often. My need for environmental change actually forced me to change careers. I was tired of changing jobs every year or two, so I found a career that was constantly changing (academics).


The problem here is that some aspies might not be bothered at all... I think the big indicator is IF the individual were to have a very autistic response to the situation.
Some aspies aren't bothered by environmental change? Is that because they just don't notice, whereas autistics/aspies that do are rattled?


Let me ask you this; What would be the effect if I were to sneak into your appartment and rearrange all your furniture while you were gone ?

I can't wait to hear the response.

I'd love it, but I'm Bipolar & ADD. I wonder, though, if this can really differentiate between ADD & AS, given what you've said here. My guess would be that an adult with AS would freak. A child with any disorder might be upset (although I think that's also an individual thing. Both of my kids are really flexible, probably because we are fairly spontaneous).




It is a good thing I am not a practitioner eh?? (laughing)

ME :D

Actually, I think you'd be pretty good.

The benefit of recognizing discrete disorders (at least in this case, but maybe not others) is treatment.

While many psychologists would go for the Apsie diagnosis, they would miss out on possible treatments if they don't look any further.

Treatments for AS are limited to behavioral methods, while OCD and ADD are treatable with medications. Behavioral methods don't help ADDers in general, although they do improve symptoms for OCD.


Agreed about the AS reaction, but I've never heard this about ADDers and I'd be surprised to find out it's a common trait. In fact, many here have expressed the need to move or change jobs often. My need for environmental change actually forced me to change careers. I was tired of changing jobs every year or two, so I found a career that was constantly changing (academics).


I like changewhen I am in control. But if saomething unexpected pops up and changes my daily plans I can go into a tailspin rather fast. Myabe it is because I have OCD as well as ADD.


Some aspies aren't bothered by environmental change? Is that because they just don't notice, whereas autistics/aspies that do are rattled?

I can't wait to hear the response.


I'd like to hear from an aspie on this. I suspect there would be a range of responses from nonplussed to a complete meltdown, depending on the individual. But, I would expect the response to be an autistic response every time. I don't think that a person having an autism spectrum disorder automatically guarantees an obviously autistic personna. I think some are going to appear to be very "normal" but express some autistic tendencies in various situations. I think some aspies are not obviously autistic until you dig deper into who, what, and why.



I'd love it, but I'm Bipolar & ADD. I wonder, though, if this can really differentiate between ADD & AS, given what you've said here. My guess would be that an adult with AS would freak. A child with any disorder might be upset (although I think that's also an individual thing. Both of my kids are really flexible, probably because we are fairly spontaneous).


I would not like it if I came home and found my furniture were rearranged. My guess is that I would be positively miserable until I could get things back the way I liked it.


Actually, I think you'd be pretty good.
Thanks for the flowers. :)

Agreed about the AS reaction, but I've never heard this about ADDers and I'd be surprised to find out it's a common trait. In fact, many here have expressed the need to move or change jobs often. My need for environmental change actually forced me to change careers. I was tired of changing jobs every year or two, so I found a career that was constantly changing (academics). It is my understanding that the need to move or change jobs often is a symptom of untreated ADHD. I, too, prefer a job where someone else provides my needed structure and the basic structure of the job is constant (I like to know what's expected), but no two days are ever the same.

There are several posts on these forums from people with ADHD who are overwhelmed when someone arbitrarily makes big changes to their environment at work or home. I crave structure that I can't provide for myself.

It is my understanding that the need to move or change jobs often is a symptom of untreated ADHD. I, too, prefer a job where someone else provides my needed structure and the basic structure of the job is constant (I like to know what's expected), but no two days are ever the same.

There are several posts on these forums from people with ADHD who are overwhelmed when someone arbitrarily makes big changes to their environment at work or home. I crave structure that I can't provide for myself.

I imagine Speedo's on track with control being the issue. I don't like being out of control either, but I don't often feel that way when someone else makes changes. I usually take it as an opportunity to make some choices, so it's kind of putting me more in control.

OT here but i remember hearing that 2 standard deviations in the weschler test wld indicate a problem. my question: what= 2 standard deviatians?

A standard deviation is a "average" distance from the mean.

I can't think of how the Weschler test could tell you anything about ADD. It's an IQ test. 2 Standard Deviations from the mean puts someone in either above the 98th percentile or below the 2nd. I would say that someone in the bottom 2% of the population in IQ is most probably substantially developmentally delayed. The person in the top 2% is more likely a genius.

Neither of these is an indication of ADD. The reason for performing these tests is to look for inconsistencies and to rule out other problems (like learning disabilities).