Listen up buckwheates [Archive] - ADHD Forums - Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder Support and Information Resources Community

barbyma

02-11-06, 11:12 AM

I simply decided to stop beating myself up over what I suck at and focus on what I excel at.

Get it?

Bob,

I've gathered all this from your posts and realize you've been trying hard to express this exact thought. So I thought I'd point out that this sentence, IMO, expresses your attitude perfectly and clearly! Bronze it!:D

I wish I could follow suit. I certainly avoid some of the things that I suck at and don't particularly care, but my biggest problem is that my particular impairments are directly between me and the things I love. However, with my qualifying exams over (and the knowledge that I will NEVER EVER have to take such a test EVER again :D) I can do more of what you're doing -- outsource it!!! I plan to use every strategy I can think of to avoid those horrid tasks. What I can't avoid, Adderall helps me through.

Also, if I'd caught it earlier (like before I ran my prefrontal cortex into the ground studying), I might have been able to avoid the destruction of general cognitive functioning that I'm still recovering from.

At any rate, attitude is most certainly 95% of the equation in my book.

Nova

02-11-06, 11:19 AM

Thank you, Bob.
Well said.
Nova

Nova

02-11-06, 11:45 AM

Bob,

I've gathered all this from your posts and realize you've been trying hard to express this exact thought. So I thought I'd point out that this sentence, IMO, expresses your attitude perfectly and clearly! Bronze it!:D

I wish I could follow suit. I certainly avoid some of the things that I suck at and don't particularly care, but my biggest problem is that my particular impairments are directly between me and the things I love. However, with my qualifying exams over (and the knowledge that I will NEVER EVER have to take such a test EVER again :D) I can do more of what you're doing -- outsource it!!! I plan to use every strategy I can think of to avoid those horrid tasks. What I can't avoid, Adderall helps me through.

Also, if I'd caught it earlier (like before I ran my prefrontal cortex into the ground studying), I might have been able to avoid the destruction of general cognitive functioning that I'm still recovering from.

At any rate, attitude is most certainly 95% of the equation in my book.

Barb,
If it helps, I still have to do things that I'm terrified of doing, but I have to do them.
I don't go with the attitude of 'I'm going to fail' but I know that when I'm tired it exacerbates my fear of doing them, because there's more 'chatter' going on in my head, due to anxiety...I don't know if that makes any sense or not.
I read something the other day that said:

"You are what you believe".

I know that sounds vague, but to me, that means believing in yourself.
Knowing that you can do just about anything if you set your mind to it.

The other thing that might help, which might sound ridiculous, but actually work with me, when I'm anxious at first, is just thinking I'm in some 'play'.
This has worked for me for years..but I'm also ambidexterous- so it's easy to switch from being analytical- to creative, in minutes...to do what I 'have to do' in life.

That way I'm not so hyperfocused on the anxiety of the moment as much as doing what I need/want to do.

I don't think you would've gotten as far as you would've Barb had you not overcome many of your fears like you did.
Play around with some 'tricks' like some of us do to maybe overcome some more..and like some of us, accentuate the positive traits more than the negative ones.
All human beings have traits they consider negative traits anyways, whether they have ADD/HD or not.
The point is to grow in a positive way because you're all you have. (0:

Nova

barbyma

02-11-06, 11:55 AM

Here's a thought about denial:

Discussion & debate lead to knowledge.....

Denial leads to..... Aswan? No, that's upriver.... Ah -- Cairo! Alexadria! :D;)

2creative

02-11-06, 12:24 PM

Now I understand! :D This is where my really off the wall humor comes from- I've really enjoyed this thread. There are professional peers "out there" that I am sure really wonder about me- but alas- they are left smiling and I believe that is good for everyone.

I also am working on feeling more comfortable in my skin- accepting my limitations and it being o.k. That's hard since due to my emotional past the only way I feel safe is if I have 'everything' under control. Tell me that washes with ADD.:( Still alot of work to do...SOSdd

I do believe that attitude is a huge component of success as well as who we look to for our support.

Thanks for ya'll being you- and sharing you. :)

barbyma

02-11-06, 12:31 PM

Barb,
If it helps, I still have to do things that I'm terrified of doing, but I have to do them.
Nova,

I don't avoid tasks our of fear or anxiety. I avoid tasks because, like Bob, I see no point in expending great amounts of energy developing strategies and workarounds that get me babysteps toward my goal when I could simply outsource the task.

When I identified the problem and discovered there was a treatment that could bridge the gap between where I am and where I need to be on the tasks I cannot avoid or outsource, I immediately went for it.

These impairments aren't sources of anxiety, they are problems to solve. Obstacles arise in every journey; these just have a name attached to them. But I won't beat down every mountain to get to the shore. I'll beat down those that have no path around them or I'll buy a ticket on the Adderall gondola that takes me over them.

IMO, life is far too short to be spent trudging through the snow when a path is broken one foot to the right.

Nova

02-11-06, 12:46 PM

For me, I can't outsource, 'things' ..I have to do them myself..
At work that is. I'm not OCD- it's just the job I signed up for.

I, understand what you're talking about, though.

In regards to 'personal' outsourcing- I live in an apartment now. They do the lawn /apartment maintenance, so it's one headache I don't have to worry about. (0:
That's a 'kind' of outsourcing I don't mind at all...because I totally stunk at remembering to do the maintenance 'stuff' when I owned a house.

I don't know if everyone else would consider that as means of 'personal outsourcing'..even I don't think of it that way...I just know that it just gives me more free time to do the other things that I'm better at doing.

Nova

scuro

02-11-06, 01:20 PM

...My discovery is not a discovery but a change of attitude. I simply decided to stop beating myself up over what I suck at and focus on what I excel at....

Yes, Bob..that is the way it should be for all of us ADHDers. In fact, you can even use your weakness in a new way to turn it into an advantage. But Bob, you have identified your weakness and have come to grips with that. You have moved forward based on knowledge.

There are people who simply want to believe that ADHD is one huge + with no negatives. These folks seem to think that the world has it all wrong, that really it's societies problem for not recognizing how superior they are. HELLO, guess what the second "D" stands for in ADHD? Folks that "D" stands for disorder. This thinking that ADHD is all good, in my opinion is not based on any sort of evidence and is verging on a delusional thought process.

Nova

02-11-06, 01:50 PM

This thread was created to help people focus on the positive aspects of themselves.

There are a zillion threads that are on this forum that are about the negative aspects of having ADHD.

Why is it considered denial or delusional if some of us want to view ourselves in a positive manner?
Is it more healthy to view ourselves as broken, stuck, disordered or view ourselves in a negative light ? (0:

I'm not capable of understanding that negative line of thinking. I wouldn't have gotten this far ahead in life, and gotten over the hurdles that I've overcome, if I wasn't able to think in a positive manner.

Nova

Nova

Andi

02-11-06, 02:21 PM

I have to agree with Nova. It is better to embrace the positive than it is to dwell on the negatives all the time. There is no doubt that we have a "disorder" but do we have to be smacked in the face with it? Does it have to be considered denial when you discover coping mechs that enable you to deal with life? Day in and out we face the challenges of being who we are, no matter what the disorder/case may be. Instead of looking for the argument or the debate, sometimes it's nice to just sit back and be with people that understand and see you for more than JUST a disorder but for the positive aspects of who you are. I'm MORE than just ADHD...I have many labels that make me who I am and lately I've learned that it's better to embrace them and accept them and find the positive than it is to look at them as a proverbial anchor around my neck dragging me down. There are many positives and negatives...for this thread, let's look at the positives and save the negatives for some other time :)

Nova

02-11-06, 02:37 PM

Thank you so much, Andi.

Nova

scuro

02-11-06, 02:39 PM

This was the first line and only line of the of the first post; "Ain't nothing wrong with us. It is the rest of humanity that is nuts". In that context I was perfectly right to say what I said.

...and do we now have thread police who will determine who can contribute to which thread?

Andi

02-11-06, 02:59 PM

**Measured response or a spoon to stir?

There is no issue with an outside perspective and an opinion is a glorious thing but intent is what we need to look at. There was a great person once that said, "A more peaceful way to live is to decide consciously which battles are worth fighting and which are better left alone. . . . Is it really important . . . that you confront someone simply because . . . he or she has made a minor mistake? . . . Does a small scratch on your car really warrant a suit in small claims court? . . . These and thousands of other small things are what many people spend their lives fighting about. . . . If you don't want to 'sweat the small stuff,' it's critical that you choose your battles wisely."--Richard Carlson

**lol..this worked with the original unedited version to your post

Andrew

02-11-06, 03:03 PM

...and do we now have thread police who will determine who can contribute to which thread?

Just so long as you stay within the guidelines (This includes staying within the purpose and spirt of the thread topic), police will not be necessary. ;)

anamari

02-11-06, 03:15 PM

"Ain't nothing wrong with us. It is the rest of humanity that is nuts"

I agree.YEs we have a disorder.why? because we are not "normal".and what is"normal"? it is conforming to the social rules. who makes this rules? "the rest of humanity".why? because "they believe" this is the best way to be in order to live with each other ...but if they are wrong and we are right. if the best way to be is ours?....I mean there are some great accomplishments of the adder out there, and somehow their "adderiness" contributed to their succes....
ok, enough babbling here. have to feed the baby....

scuro

02-11-06, 03:31 PM

Andrew

02-11-06, 03:38 PM

“What’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.”

So let me get this straight because what is being suggested here sounds like a form of censorship. If I do not stay "within the purpose and spirit of the thread topic", and offer a counter opinion...I am "stirring the pot" and may be edited? Do you realize how many threads on this board have counter opinions?

I believe my comments to have been bang on and backed by current research in the field. On the other side we have a belief system that seems to need it's own ecosystem to survive. Perhaps you should have a private members section where this form of self affirmation can be continued without impedment.

There is nothing wrong with debating a stated position. BUT, when a stated purpose of a thread is, as an example, "To discuss the positive aspects of ADHD", then throwing in all the negative aspects would not be staying within the purpose of a thread. In fact, it would be considered "hijacking" a thread - taking a thread intended for one purpose, and trying to have it focus on something else. This is against forum guidelines. If a member is so hell bent on a particular topic, they are welcome to create a new thread.

Now...back to the thread topic at hand :)

scuro

02-11-06, 04:07 PM

Just wait a sec before we get back to regular programing. :)
----------------------------------------------------------

Here is the original title of the thread ->Listen up buckwheates
and here is the only sentence of the first post. -> Ain't nothing wrong with us. It is the rest of humanity that is nuts.

I am assuming that the stated intent of the thread is not about the positive aspects of ADHD, but rather that there are no negatives to ADHD and society have completly misunderstood those with the disorder. Correct me if I am wrong here and I have missed the double meaning.

The second point that I want to make, is, if there are factual errors in a thread, can one not speak the truth without straying from ADHD message board guidelines? Truth is more important then purpose. Do we have message boards to affirm our own beliefs or do we have them to hear what others have to say and share? It's high time that board policy got a review. There are other issues that have been on the backburner.

Andrew

02-11-06, 05:08 PM

If you'll read my post, I said "as an example..." and was not specifically talking about this particular thread. I am not going to debate or even discuss what the topic or meaning behind the topic of this thread is. You commented on censorship, and I wanted to set the record straight. You may not like the guidelines as they are written, but you've agreed to abide by them, as part of the membership agreement. You are not held to any standard that others are not. Everyone is treated equally here, and all are expected to follow the guidelines. Now...if you have further comment on policy or guidelines, I welcome a private message from you to discuss your views, but in the mean time, I insist that this thread be returned to its original topic. All other comments will be removed from this thread.

barbyma

02-11-06, 05:34 PM

who makes this rules? "the rest of humanity".why? because "they believe" this is the best way to be in order to live with each other ...but if they are wrong and we are right.
A place where a small minority rule over the greater population? Like royalty? Make all the decisions and allowing the common people no voice?

Cool. As long as you're one of the select few....

Tara

02-11-06, 05:41 PM

I think it's very challenging for some people to look beyond the pure medical model of AD/HD. By definition AD/HD is a disorder but when you get a group of people with ADD together you can see there is much more to ADD then just the disorder and weaknesses. Those of us with ADD do share positive traits and have similar strengths and talents.

There is nothing delusional about these observations. If anybody has ever attended a support group full of adults with ADD or been to a conference full of people with ADD they too probably have made the observations. It's probably something that hasn't and won't be measured by the medical and scientific communities but those of us who have seen it in action know it exists.

Nova

02-11-06, 06:12 PM

A section of one of the books I'm reading states that we can deconstruct various old created parts within our perceptions that are no longer of value (like helplessness/hopelessness etc.). The section also states that as we become identified with these self-created aspects, we conclude this is who we are, rather than this is how we choose to perceive ourselves.
The author calls this a Self-Lens that we create that defines us.

anamari

02-11-06, 06:14 PM

sorry for the misunderstanding. I did not have in mind a change of social order -after reading your post few images of ADDers with guns on the street passed thru my mind, but no-I do not think such a change is possible this way....
it is just a change of perspective. I believe that we are inclined to think that since they are a majority and that works for them now it is right, an absolute right.And because we are different it makes us wrong, an absolute wrong. If it were so social rules, customs would not change during time or from culture to culture....
Change the perspective and we are right, and they are wrong...

Now go a step behind, and see that nobody is right, or wrong....we're just different.But since they are the majority and they rule, well we have to live by their rules...so we have to adjust....

Cool. As long as you're one of the select few....
well, for now is cool if you are one of the "select" many.

I do not know if i make to much sense. Lia keeps interrupting me and my mind is not very clear right now....

Nova

02-11-06, 07:49 PM

When I was at the grocery store yesterday evening, there was another lady there with her son. He was sitting in the cart, happy as a clam, and laughing to his heart's content.

His laughter was so contagious, and I found myself starting to laugh with him. Then he took one of his shoes off, and threw it in my direction, which actually made me laugh harder.
She looked at me, and told me 'I'm so sorry..he does this stuff..he's only four..I'm trying to teach him..' But she was laughing too.

I was still laughing and I told her 'It doesn't bother me..he's a kid..and he's having fun..besides..I'm going to be here forever because I can't remember where a specific brand of waffles that I like are, that I'm looking for..I've been going up and down this aisle...so this is actually more fun than looking for the them anyways.'

She then said 'I do that all the time..I forget where the items are in this store..at least I didn't forget the list this time..ADD will do that to you...but I improvise, and have been buying groceries for so long, who needs a list, really ? You know ?
And if I forget some unimportant things...so what ?? It's not as if I'm going to die or something. The store will always be open tomorrow. If I decide their important enough to come back for them, that is.'

And she laughed so hard, as she tried to put her son's shoe back on, as he was trying to take the other shoe off and fling it across the aisle, once more...still laughing outloud. And I, was still laughing, while I was still looking for my waffles.

scuro

02-11-06, 08:01 PM

barbyma

02-11-06, 08:27 PM

well, for now is cool if you are one of the "select" many.

Well, I don't see myself as any more different than anyone else. Sure, I'm different; I'm unique; but isn't everyone, ADD or not?

For the record:

I'm bipolar. I'm ADD. I most certainly fall into the tails of the distributions of a great many measures of human behavior and physiological states.

I'm a pretty happy person. I don't live in "their" world. I live in the world. That world has others in it, and I bend over backwards to behave in a manner that makes them as comfortable as possible. Not because they "require it", but because I appreciate it when they do the same for me.

Of course, the majority of people don't think this way and have zero regard for the others they share the world with. They sit idly by while their children run rampant in public places. They refuse to allow others to merge into their lanes. They jaywalk, thinking their desire to get across the street without walking 40 feet to a crosswalk is more important than the safety of others. They chew with their mouths open, they cut in line, they eat food in line at a buffet, and shove their way into elevators before those on it have a chance to get out. I don't know if any of the people that do these things have ADD, bipolar disorder, or any other problem and I don't care.

My point? We ALL live in the world together. I won't claim to get back the respect that I try to give to others, but I choose to believe the world is just a little bit better because of my behavior.

I don't see the ADD as forced to conform any more than anyone else.

We can't even agree among ourselves how the world could be changed to accomodate us. Why should we think that every nonADDer in the world is comfortable with the status quo? Society dictates, right? Are we not a part of society? Do we not have voices and votes?

Bob1951

02-11-06, 10:14 PM

Scuro,

I just want you to know that I felt you posted a valid needed-to-be said balance to my hyperbole of "the rest of the world is nuts." Sometimes hyperbole can be misunderstood so my response was to clarify and for no other reason.

My wife and I just said goodbye to dinner guests. They have a four year old boy and the whole evening I was teaching him "bad things." Hand slapping, cheating at cards and spinning the lazy susan - the last really drives my wife bannanas. Here is this 54 year old geezer behaving WORSE than a 4 year old. But everyone was in tears laughing. I was just being my "normal" ADHD self, that's all.

You the man. Anyone with a full moon as an avartar is "good people" in my book. Two prescriptions ago the pharmacist told me it would be at least 15 minutes. I told her just make sure I get it before the next full moon. She didn't crack a smile. Fact is, I think she took me seriously. Now, I ask: Which of us is REALLY whacked?

your demented and pround of it friend,

Bob

william tell

02-11-06, 10:20 PM

Yea, I agree with that, I think leaving each situation a little better than you found it is good for the soul.
Greeting people you don't know, talking on elevators -I meet the strangest people this way. I'm different, but I'm lovable, and I seek friendship and try to help others see the beauty in the world :p

scuro

02-11-06, 11:44 PM

Bob...some how I knew you were not hardline. I came into this thread to give the balanced view because at the time, it was totally lacking. Remember, folks come in here all the time and some know squat about ADHD. If someone came on here and argued that ADHD people will never be nothing but worthless losers, I be extolling the virtues of ADHD to the high hills and I'd be just as persistent to have that point of view heard also. Neither extreme is true.

meadd823

02-12-06, 03:42 AM

I used to see the negative in every thing and in every one.....the negative especially the not so hot parts of me are always sooo obvious as if located in front of my nose..

Frankly I got tired of being the dark cloud in every one's silver lining....so I decided to do what I could to change my part of this.....

Every time I saw some thing negative about me, my situation even others I have trained my self to also see an equally positive trait along side my negative view.

I do try to remain mentally grounded by also seeing the neutral aspect which normal falls under the category stuff happens!!!! I mean if I drive forward while looking back I will eventually run into the car in front of me ----> simple as that!!!!

SB_UK

02-12-06, 09:20 AM

I have just read a thread with info by Tara, Nova and Carla ... there is surely a connection there ... ah*a*! ... mentioning "ADDA" ... there it is again ... :-)
[ My name ends with an 'a' too, so I'm guessing that I'll be eligible to be in this elite set too ...one day... :-) ]

And so I visited them, and saw that the President of this "the World's leading ADD not-for-profit organization" (note:statement copied from their site) ... defines his perspective on ADD as follows "... to communicate and model the positive attributes of AD/HD and to consistently reinforce the recognition that it is in our unique differences that AD/HDers will find their greatest strengths and abilities ..."

So that's the President of the largest mainstream ADD organization opening out with this kinda' statement of the positives ...

It kinda' makes you wonder why it's such an ordeal to launch a serious community discussion on the other side of ADD ... doesn't it? ... when the power players are singing from exactly our hymn sheet.

So CHADD was also mentioned in the thread (and for balance ... "the Nation's leading ADD not-for-profit organization" (note:statement copied from their site)), and I flew through their site too ... and strangely, felt that they held a subtly different position on ADD.

Of course, this is not a statement of one organization being more closely aligned to the truth ... however, it did appear to me, that CHADD adopt a more 'disorder-based' model for ADD, with CHADD, notably, arising as an organization concerned initially with kiddie ADD, whereas ADDA, seem to be more adult-centric, and seem, accordingly, to be adopting the 'difference' (or at least acknowledging the positives) take.

The most vehement members of the disorder camp, here, are more closely affiliated with kiddie ADD, and conversely, the most vehement supporters of the wonder [ :-) ] of ADD -- are adult ADDers with experiences borne more through adult ADD experiences.

Although all of the above, namely, the ADDA, CHADD, ADDforum (+) and (-) grouping observations represent really quite possibly over-simplified brush-stroke views, is it possible that polarized opinions are [ and which are quite frequently seen here - bubbling to the surface - in the "Flame series" :-) ], at least in some significant way arising through a temporal shift in the apparence of the expression of deletirious effects of ADD on the individual, exemplified and most exaggerated, on both extremes, by the apparence to a close observer to the ADDer of age 4 years (of the negative)<negative> and, in marked contrast to the individual ADDer's own experiential perspective of his or her condition, at age 40 years (of the other side ... the positive)?

:-)

My next sentence will be twice the size of that last one ... (evil) {g} [noting -- without even a net or single semi-colon to fall back on ...;... :-) ]

SB.</negative>

Nova

02-12-06, 09:45 AM

If your next 'sentence' is as well stated as your 'last one' I'm all ears, SB. (0:

The ADDA site is great.
Tara and Carla should be the ones who get the credit, since they're the ones who were asking about an ADD convention and put the link to the ADDA site.
I just noted that the ADDA site included many, many great positive articles about ADD on it.

Nova

scuro

02-12-06, 01:49 PM

Yes, I can see this as a perspective thing. With adults stressing the positive in their life because they realize their shortcomings and they want to move on. They simply want to function as best they can as they learn to work and socialize in society.

Those of us who are in the field have a different perspective. We see many young kids as they struggle in school which makes all of their weaknesses most apparent, at time when they are least able to handle such tribulation.

ADHD from my perspective is still a problem which has not been fully addressed by society. If kids get help, it's because the parents care a great deal about their kid...or because there are some enlightened teachers out there. Even so, It's far from ideal. The glass is half empty on my side of the table.

Please also remember that I only posted in this thread because the original sentiment was so extreme in it's viewpoint.

barbyma

02-12-06, 01:57 PM

Scuro's point is getting lost here in the battle between positive and negative.

I've often said here that if someone asked me if I could change it and not have bipolar disorder or ADD, I wouldn't have an answer.

Scuro's point is that the extreme view of ADD being nothing but a "gift", or that ADDers would function fine if allowed to create their own environment, does not balance out the extreme view that ADDers are cripples who can never function "normally".

One of the reasons it doesn't balance is that both views share a common misconception -- that ADDers can't function.

Seeing it as nothing but a gift is to deny there's a problem. If there's no problem, there's no solution.

Seeing it as crippling is to deny any possibility that one can improve.

There's a middle ground, and Scuro's point is that it shouldn't be denied, not that we should focus on the negative.

Bob1951

02-12-06, 07:02 PM

Barb,

I gotta tell you that if asked to trade in my ADHD brain for a normal, I'd say NO. This is the first time in my 54 years that I wouldn't GLADLY upgrade. And, it is certainly not to say, there isn't a serious downside to ADHD.

I know why it took so long to see what a blessing my unrelenting energy and ability to go around obstacles is. Society's norms. You gotta do things this way and that way. BULL DROPPINGS.

Bob

Uminchu

02-12-06, 07:41 PM

I gotta tell you that if asked to trade in my ADHD brain for a normal, I'd say NO. This is the first time in my 54 years that I wouldn't GLADLY upgrade. And, it is certainly not to say, there isn't a serious downside to ADHD.Maybe because that wouldn't be an upgrade -- it would be like migrating to a new system. And that is usually more trouble than it's worth. :)

Tara

02-12-06, 09:29 PM

I don't think there is a right or wrong here. It's not black or white. There are some people with ADD who can't fucntion or can't function very well and who are crippled by ADD. There are some people with ADD who thrive. Then there are many who fall in between the spectrum. We all come here with different perspectives because of our own experiences.

Bob1951

02-13-06, 08:08 AM

U,

I'm developing with VS 2003. I'm pretty sure I got 2005 in one of the unopened boxes that come every month with my sub. There is no way I'm upgrading until in-process work is done work. The sons-a-bees at Bill's shop changed the C++ runtime library somewhere between 6.0 and 2003. I didn't know it. Cost me a day to figure it out and now I'm going to burn for excessive profanity and murderous intent :D

Tara,

You are right.

Listen, I used to be a bad boy. Some argue nuttins changed. But I have stopped shooting speed. I take it orally now :D

Seriously, unbeknownst to me, I contracted the Hep C virus most likely back in my hippie days from a dirty needle - 68 to 72. That was in the 20th century, not 19th.

HCV is a very slow acting but hard to kill virus. That is how I survived for at least 30 years with it chewing up my liver. However, it is the leading cause of liver failure and not to be ignored if one wants their full allotment of days on the planet.

Interferon is used in the attempted "hit" on HCV. Interferon causes ADHD in nearly everyone except then it's called "brain fog." Well, you mix an already ADHD brain with interferon and you end up with an EXTREMELY ADHD brain.

I became useless. Had to sell my business. And, after everything was said and done, I was down 100K. Dang. I could handle those kind of loses when I was young but at 52 I decided to add depression on top of my EXTREMELY ADHD state. Bad decision.

The silver lining is the liver doctor ( they call em gastrogizzardendotolligests in real life) spotted that I might be ADHD and that all my little work-arounds crashed and burned in my exascerbated ADHD state. What I discovered was that even though I couldn't remember how to turn a computer on, I could fix my car, mow my lawn, start building a cabin my wife and I always wanted etc and so THAT is what I did. It really helped with the depression.

What if I was "normally" EXTREMELY ADHD? Well, I'd have to open an automobile repair shop, or a lawn service or a construction company because ADHD or not I am an entrepreneur.

The guys that started Jiffy Lube, Asplumb, and Bechtal might not have been ADHD. I don't know. But I do know focusing on what I do well works a heck of a lot better than fretting over what I can't do.

Bob

PS The interferon worked.

scuro

02-13-06, 11:19 PM

Well said Bob, you have great insight. I'm finding that folks with situational Depression really need to be doing stuff because, yes, doing stuff is better then fretting...much better.

Have you notice my negative signature before? ;) As Clint Eastwood said in the movies, "a man's got to know his limitations". Which was really the point that I was making from the start. No limitations no understanding.

Nova

02-13-06, 11:49 PM

All I know is that everytime I'm over my non-ADD friend's house and she brings out a manual to something that she just bought...I know it's going to be an interesting visit.
I keep telling her...'You don't need that..(she just bought a new microwave) you had a few before, they operate the same way..if it has a few more buttons..you'll figure it out..just press them and you'll see what happens..it's not like flying a plane, for gods sakes..'
And she'll tell me 'That's why we're different. What if something goes wrong? You just bought a new microwave, remember? What did you do wrong to yours to break it?'

I didn't do anything wrong to mine. The ridiculous thing was cheap and and it broke down. So I bought a good one. But I still didn't read the manual.
And she's prolly still doing that today on hers....still.... (0:
Whatever makes her feel better I guess.
And to all those who read the manuals..my hats off to you...not judging..
I was just talking about a conversation I had with a friend of mine, that's all.

You know what..for my job..I don't just wing things things, all the time.
If I get the zillionth email about so and so's upcoming birthday event, or the zillionth email about what the cafeteria has for lunch...then I'm skimming..
But I don't skim over the important stuff that has to do with my job.
Or my life for that matter.

Sometimes I think my friend thinks I should come with a manual.
I bet she'd read it too. From cover to cover.
And I'd still tell her 'you know how I work..you don't need to read that...'

Nova

Nova

02-14-06, 12:25 AM

Bob,
While I don't have HVC, I can't possible say that I understand what you're going through, but I can say that it takes one hades of a guy who is able to change his attitude, and fuel all of his energies into doing things he enjoys and laughing more than being depressed now.

I have Bipolar Disorder 2/Rapid Cycle (mostly depression and occuring more frequently)and Temporal Lobe Epilepsy (Brain seizures) with my ADHD..and I'm on Topamax for Bipo and TLE (one med for both) and I know if I didn't have my doc who was positive (he's ADD too, LOL) and able to help me with the right medication, (400 mgs. daily- most are on 100 mgs. daily) and if I wasn't able to focus on my spirituality, and try to surround myself with people who care about me, and think in positive ways....
If I couldn't do that...I literally wouldn't be...

Bob1951

02-14-06, 10:54 PM

Damn it Nova,

Had a bad day. Decided to whine. Read your post and feel like, damn it, they won't let me say it, but I feel for you and feel like a poop-head for whinning. You are incredibly smart and have the coolest avatar in the world. Don't forget that.

Scuro,

Man, that is my favorite: "a man has got to know his limitations." I say it all the time. You are a kindred spirit. Let's face it. Clint is a REAL man. A man's man.

You are "gooooooooooood people."

Bob

PS Nova, anyone who looks at a manual is an idiot :D

william tell

02-14-06, 11:10 PM

lol , just show me the pic on the side of the box and I can build it ,screw the manual , I don't think I ever have read one ,ever . Course there were one or two times in my life when it might have been benifical lol relationships , ahh I would'nt of read even if there was a manual for those

barbyma

02-14-06, 11:27 PM

PS Nova, anyone who looks at a manual is an idiot :D
I just realized that I always meant to comment on that and forgot....

I have never understood why we allow so much paper to be wasted......

:rolleyes:

Uminchu

02-14-06, 11:32 PM

I just realized that I always meant to comment on that and forgot....

I have never understood why we allow so much paper to be wasted......
As someone who has translated many manuals into English, and who is supposed to be translating one right now instead of posting this, I can answer this:

Product liability.

Manual production is nothing but a cost center -- it does not generate sales or other revenues. Companies would rather not produce manuals, but are legally required to do so. Hence their general poor quality.

By the way, nowadays a lot of manuals are only offered in PDF format, with a fee charged for a paper manual. So trees are getting saved. Progres... :)

scuro

02-14-06, 11:42 PM

Nova

02-15-06, 01:43 AM

I just realized that I always meant to comment on that and forgot....

I have never understood why we allow so much paper to be wasted......

:rolleyes:
No doubt, Barb !!!
Except my friend would beg to differ, of course, LOL !

Nova

Nova

02-15-06, 01:46 AM

As someone who has translated many manuals into English, and who is supposed to be translating one right now instead of posting this, I can answer this:

Product liability.

Manual production is nothing but a cost center -- it does not generate sales or other revenues. Companies would rather not produce manuals, but are legally required to do so. Hence their general poor quality.

By the way, nowadays a lot of manuals are only offered in PDF format, with a fee charged for a paper manual. So trees are getting saved. Progres... :)

And from one happy 'tree squeezer', thank gods for that, Uminchu ! (0:
I could use more fresh air than I could use manuals that I don't ever read.

Nova

Nova

02-15-06, 01:50 AM

Yeah Clint...or at least his movie persona, doing the right thing the wrong way. Stepping on toes...I can identify with character. Not that I am going to blow someone’s head off but more so that in the end the proof is in the pudding.

Yeah well, you and I both...the doing the right thing in the wrong way 'thang' most days...Scuro..
You and I both.

Nova

scuro

02-15-06, 06:56 PM

I got a soft spot in my heart for you Nova. :)

Bob1951

02-15-06, 07:13 PM

Boys and girls,

Got a serious question for ya'll. How can I go from happy to depressed in a matter of hours.

Last night I was so depressed I could have shot someone. Don't worry I will never shoot myself. I'm afraid it would be too painful. Called a dear friend this morning, a retired RN with a zillion years of experience helping depressed people. To cut to the chase, I allowed someone to take unfair advantage of me. Why? Because I want to prove to the world, which is a lie because I know no one gives a damn, I want to prove to myself I'm no loser by saying "yes" to the impossible. Which again is a lie because I know "a man has got to know his limitations."

Now, the question: My moods swing like the pendulum on a grandfather clock. BUT, and it is a big BUTT, there is always a catalyst. Someone says, does, or I think this or that and BAM off I go on a depressive tangent. Not to worry. It is like the weather. Soon to change.

Now, really the question: Do I have some form of mood disorder or am I just stupid?

Please help. I'm spiraling into an abyss. Had a huge fight with the Mrs. over nothing. I hate myself for hurting people I love.

Bob

barbyma

02-15-06, 10:13 PM

Now, really the question: Do I have some form of mood disorder or am I just stupid?
You're certainly NOT stupid!

If you are CERTAIN there's no trigger, a mood disorder isn't the most likely. But, you've got to consider the possibility that your "triggers" aren't really triggers, but how you are attributing your feelings.

Those of us with mood disorders, at least until we are FULLY aware of the problem, will attribute our moods to almost anything we can "think of". We can see lots of reasons for being depressed or euphoric, but that's just and attribution, not the underlying cause.

But, Bipolar is SO comorbid and SO many of the symptoms seem similar (although they are somewhat different in feeling). If you're at ALL concerned about this, please see get checked out. I like you a lot and I don't want to see this hurt you when it's treatable.

SB_UK

02-16-06, 03:14 AM

Bob dude,

For sure ... and you gotta' see that I have my bunny suit on now.

#1
So your mind is capable of great things ... but even though that is true ... there are things that it will not want to do#b, because it already knows how to do them, and we (our mind) (our mind which is our driver) is driven by an urge to make sense of all around us (reality), under the expectation that we will 'get the point of all of this' when we have a working internal model of rrreality describing that world out there - RRReality.

#2
However we weren't always like this - we have evolved from lower organisms (without a mind) and unsurprisingly - reproduction or continuation of these lower species was *for sure* the strongest hard-coded drive.
This drive has been called the 'primitive mating strategy' ... but let's just jiggle this idea a little and rephrase it as the 'motivation for competition'.

#3
And then along came the mind.
And everything changed.
For sure, the drive for the species to replicate continued to be strong, but the modern mating strategy became the dominant paradigm.
We don't fight another for the lady, we captivate one another's minds - the precursor to the rest.

#4
However the primitive strategy lurks and pokes its ugly head out from under the covers most often when you're least expecting it. It is the competitive streak that you define#b. Competition against the other where winner and loser is no longer appropriate, there's only competition of oneself against one's self.

#5
But what's even worse is that these feelings of #1b(not being consciously aware that one is not interested in a project, but being emotionally aware ie 'feeling bad') merged with #4b(driven by a motivation that is suspect without conscious awareness that this is so, but, again, being emotionally aware ie 'feeling bad') ... -- are all compounded by a heightened sense of morality#b (a compulsion to do the right thing) ... results in a clash between the conscious and unconscious parts of the mind/brain ... an unresolved conflict which results in the end-effect of anxiety, depression, anger ...

--So, to be clear, we are driven by our mind.

--Our mind has a more direct pipeline through to our emotional centres, than our 'rational' centres ... with 'rational' used here to indicate actual conscious awareness ... ability to express the problem in language.

--An inability to understand our feelings can only arise if there's a dysjunction between our conscious and subconscious minds.

--To unite these two drivers of our emotions, we must understand why they would part company.

--In this case, paragraph #5 ...maybe... describes 3 important and clashing models for determining your emotional state. Unresolved logical models within our mind ... our reality modelling engine ... our logical inferencing engine ... leads to a syntax error, where the error is caught and thrown to ... !!!!STANDARD OUT!!!!

-- -- -- > Well I guess we need to either a-debug or b-pipe the error to trash.
Both are possible ... the first (a) by frenetic coding and instantiation, and the second (b) by adequate documentation :-)

Sooooooooo ... and if I'm way off ... sorry dude! ...

That's about my nub of its rub.

I used to make my mantra ... 'but what's the point?' and maybe, especially after your rather shameless theft of my avatra :-) ... I can offer you my mantra, but always tempering the question's solution with the genuine needs of others (not those out to abuse -- you know the difference) and your genuine need to be able to offer a consistent view over all aspects of all reality, from the start of time ... that is, to become replete within a single internally consistent logical model unifying the conscious with the sunconscious.

But as ever --- your call dude, the above might just be the insane ramblings of a couple of harmless wingnuts ... :-)

SB.

By the way ... the appearance of depressive emotions from two different abstractions (layers of abstraction of the brain responsible for its functionality) ... maybe even more appropriately described from the 'brain' and 'mind' will be a topic that appears here soon :-)
The argument will be of convergent internal networks which map pure physiological homeostatic mechanisms (through brain) and subconscious (through mind) and conscious (through mind) processes onto the same central machinery which is responsible for the depressive emotional state.

But like I said dude ... wingnuts.

And just one final thing ... your observation about the cyclical nature of your depression; that fits within the "pure physiological homeostatic mechanisms (through brain)" and which was the subject of my most recent publication :-)
...(...check out circadian, infradian ... that kinda' idea)...if you like...

wingnuts.

Bob1951

02-16-06, 08:11 AM

Barb,

If I think you said what you said then you said it. That SB cat is rubbing off on me, sorry.

There is always a trigger. That's why I have always concluded my mood swings are not a disorder. But are my triggers attribution or cause? Don't know. You how we get gut feelings, all of us, even those that arn't as normal as ADHDers? I think our brains process information in nano, nano seconds. It can access our googolbyte hard drive, process the sum of our experiences and output, not a thought, but a feeling. "I got a bad feeling about this. Something just isn't right." Sure enough, we get bit in the butt. Then we go back and conscously analyze and more often than not the "feeling" was correct.

I got a feeling you are right. If you are right that means I'm even crazier than previous estimates. But this AM I'm ready to rumble. THE REST OF MANKIND IS NUTS. WE ARE NORMAL. Any takers? :D

SB,

You are so crazy. I love you, man. Let me tell you, I always got to go to root. Even on Andrew's web, I can't help but try to figure how to get to root. :D. It's either low or high voltage, a dit or a dah, a short or long puff, a short or long flash. Center finger up or down. George Boole really wasn't that smart. We've been doing it for eons. The zero, now that's genius. Boys and girls, let's add IV and XII. And they wonder why the empire fell.

Then us smarty-pants start with the layers of abstraction. And the dit and dah becomes DUH?

We experience thoughts and feeling differently but it's all the same chip. Ever see a blazing hot babe? How long does it take for your entire body to end up in your shoes? How the hades can I know what came first? Sometimes I end up in my shoes and no babe is in sight. Now what?

The life of an ADHDer: My wife flames me cause I'm three hours late and I didn't call. I told her I can't afford another ticket. She says, "you couldn't pull over." See how they try to confuse us with logic. She says, "your dinner is in the refrig. Microwave it." I look in the refrig and no dinner in sight. I see parts of a dinner. Fish in one bowl. Rice in another. Veggies (yuk). I'm carnivorous. Sauce. Yummy. But I can't figure out how to assemble the parts into a dinner. I go on the internet and start whinning to all my demented friends. Wife comes back from boob-tube hour later and says "arn't you going to eat?" I'm starving, I say, but I couldn't figure out how to assemble it. She gets mad at me. "You can figure out the computer but not microwave your dinner?" Then she did it for me. IT WORKED.

I really love her. I just can't figure out why she sticks with me. I'll try harder. Not easy, though, when you are as "normal" as me.

Off to see the wizard.

Bob

You're certainly NOT stupid!

If you are CERTAIN there's no trigger, a mood disorder isn't the most likely. But, you've got to consider the possibility that your "triggers" aren't really triggers, but how you are attributing your feelings.

Those of us with mood disorders, at least until we are FULLY aware of the problem, will attribute our moods to almost anything we can "think of". We can see lots of reasons for being depressed or euphoric, but that's just and attribution, not the underlying cause.

But, Bipolar is SO comorbid and SO many of the symptoms seem similar (although they are somewhat different in feeling). If you're at ALL concerned about this, please see get checked out. I like you a lot and I don't want to see this hurt you when it's treatable.

Bob1951

02-17-06, 02:41 AM

TimH come up with a good one. He said we need stall converters.

A stall converter is a type of torque converter. Did you know that there is no mechanical connection between your engine and your wheels if you drive an automatic. Your engine doesn't stall while you are waiting for a traffic light because your torque converter is slipping. The engine side turbine is spinning. The wheel side is not. It can do that because they are not connected. One drives the other through hydraulic fluid. The word "stall" in "stall converter" is confusing because the "stall" is when the engine turbine and the drive shaft turbine are spinning at the exact same rate. A stall converter locks up at a specified RPM. At speced RPM power goes from the engine directly to the wheels. No slippage.

I contend that my ADHD brain's stall converter stalls at 0 RPM. That is how I get myself in so much trouble. My mouth is directly connected to my brain. No slippage. No buffer. I think the thought and out it comes. Have you ever noticed that it is sometimes NOT in one's best interest to say what one is thinking?

I made a rather rude comment about ol George Boole not being that smart. Well, truth be known, the dude was a genius.

Check out what ol George came up with ...

1+1=1 Huh? Can't trick me, you say? The catch is when doing Boolean algebra 1+1=1. If ol George didn't figure that out, you and I wouldn't be talking - least not via computers. Let's write a little code in VB and replace the plus sign with Or ...

If (a = True Or b = True) Then (Do this thingy here)

Boole was no fool. Boolean algebra combines things, doesn't add them, and provides the basis for automating logic. Extremely cool. I always wondered why a detail-phobic (me) could find something as detail-centric as code so interesting. Don't know other than I do.

Using conditional blocks (above) and loops I or any other hack can emulate any reality in the universe - except one - emotion. It defies logic.

But, as you might have guessed and given my propensity for hyper-bowl, there are a few other realities I can't code. That's cause I got to thoroughly understand the reality to automate it and guess what? Not a whole lot of them-there realities I get. Dang, always a monkey wrench in the gears.

If we wanted to write an ADHD diagnostic program, where would we start?

Years ago I was struggling with an algorithm and a more experienced programmer told me something that forever altered my life. He said, "man, look for the pattern." Wow, gigawatt light bulbs went off in my head.

What's the pattern? That is what researchers are looking for. They study a group of ADHD people against a similar but not ADHD group of people and the majority of the ADHDer's have parents that are ADHD. Wonder if there is a genetic link? They do another study, same results, another study, same results. Guess whaaaat? There is a genetic link. Lunatism runs rampant in my father's side. Skipped him though. Guess what recessive gene got dominate in me?

In study after study they find restlessness, implusiveness, inattentiveness (I think that's where they got "attention deficit" from) and abnomal creativeness. Man, I see easier, better ways of doing things all the time. It translates out to why the heck would anyone expend so much energy to move a mountain when, hell, we can fly over it.

Let's do a little boolean algebra and "And" Scuro and me. George said that 1x1=1. That works out the same as that dumb algebra they tried to teach us in school. But conceptually it is way different.

I'll repeat my Or block so you can compare
If (a = True Or b = True) Then (Do this thingy here) - copied from above
If (a = True And b = True) Then (Do this thingy here)
See the difference?

The output from "Anding" Scuro and Bob follows:

ADHD like any other disorder causes pain. But it can be managed. Part of the management comes from recognizing that it actually enables us to do some things better and easier than people without the disorder especially creative stuff.

But I'm telling you, you can't BS your subconscious mind. Humans try to do it all the time. Suffer a devastating trauma. Pretend it didn't happen. And then spend zillions on shrinks and meds. It's got to be true or it don't work. Man, there ARE advantages to being ADHD. We need to see them and capitalize on them.

A few other tricks that have proved beneficial and have stood the test of time with me.

1. Schedule
2. Organization
3. My working memory don't work so write everything down
4. When I find myself getting bored, I MUST increase the baud rate. Baud is the number of incoming signals per second. It must go up or I'm doomed. First try to delegate. Can't do that, blast through it. If it is study, study faster and turn on the TV and blast a CD. If you have a second CD, turn that on too. Listening to a boring speaker? Start reading a book concurrently. etc.
5. Just say "yes" to drugs.

Oh, by the way, don't take foolish risks to up the baud. I got behind a driver doing the speed limit today. Of all the nerve. Metalled the peddle, tach flashed to 6K, smoked him good while blasting jazz. Didn't I tell you I was doing better. Wasn't Hendrix.

Do you think it is possible that I forgot to grow up?

Bob

PS Got go sleepy bye. Any of you other nuts do jazz. Jazz is so ADHD.

SB_UK

02-17-06, 04:19 AM

Boburo(-bella),
Ciao!

What's the unifying component to the basis of object-oriented languages, ADD, twisted jazz and the structure of fugues?
This is real important ...

Perhaps since the one that you didn't introduce, was the 'fugue' ... I might suggest you take a quick look around and about at its structure, particularly its beginning, middle and end, and perhaps if you like, you'd do me a favour and Bach like a dog.
If for no other reason than as a deterrent to cats :-)

Cheeky ... naughty ... naughty ... bad boy Bob!

Have you tried HF's signature on for size (eternally bored moderator) including a quote from Einstein on 'by the time you're ...'.

Few adopted truth-tinted views over reality pre-ADD ... the young, the crazy, the artistic, the dissenting and the hardened philosophical.
Why then wouldn't the ADDer appear as ...all of the above...
Each of these 5 states (and probably more if you give me a second to find them) ... will, and with prior request that I beg of you, that my presumption be forgiven ... be familiar to you.

They are to me.

I wonder why TimH use the stars as his avatar ... '''go on Bobbles, "says SB", avatar, avastar, 'ave any star, "SB jiggles his bag of stars and offers it to Bob", who delves his hand in, pulls one out, and there's just nothing sitting there in the palm of his hand when he looks ...'''
Dude-Bob -- will you get your own avatar -- Bob-dude! This one is taken :-)

'ave a tar? 'ave a star? 'ave a car? 'ave a bananar (half-eaten?)?

"It's easy if you try" ... Lennon ... "You might say I'm a dreamer"
Imagine ...
"but I'm not the only one" ..................................................

"peace"...dude!

SB.

Whoops ... nearly forgot ... the world of logic defined a new reality after Boole, when the new kids rocked up onto stage ... 'From Frege to Gödel' ... the general idea.

Bob1951

02-17-06, 05:30 AM

SB,

Man. I'm really screwed.

I understand you :D

I can't sleep.

You are in the future.

Of course, how could I miss it.

It's full moon. No wonder I had to shave 20x today/yersterday.

Hey, what's happening 6 hours from now? What are the stocks doing?

Bob

SB_UK

02-17-06, 05:47 AM

:-)

SB.

meadd823

02-18-06, 06:08 AM

Listen, I used to be a bad boy. Some argue nuttins changed. But I have stopped shooting speed. I take it orally now

Been there done that but not because I was a bad girl (well not in that way) I was actually treating a "disorder" medical science hadn't caught up to yet!!!

ADHD had to have come from my Dad's side because my mom's dad was some sort of freaking genius.....well until he died....

While we were poking about in some of the stuff he and Grandma left behind...cost too much to burry the garage with them.....any way while poking we found prescriptions of dezoxin....well me and my... :foot:

Have you ever noticed that it is sometimes NOT in one's best interest to say what one is thinking?

Wow grandpa took speed like I did before they discovered ADD!!!!

Yea dude just like that......if you have some undiscovered siblings you may look to Texas. because....you have traveled down some of the same paths and understand much to same languages ...even if they are both English!

In study after study they find restlessness, impulsiveness, inattentiveness (I think that's where they got "attention deficit" from) and abnormal creativeness. Man, I see easier, better ways of doing things all the time. It translates out to why the heck would anyone expend so much energy to move a mountain when, hell, we can fly over it.

And there are so may ways to fly and it sure beats burying your self under one...you know all those past things mistakes we do our best to learn from and add to the list of how not to do things.......

"I got a bad feeling about this. Something just isn't right." Sure enough, we get bit in the butt. Then we go back and consciously analyze and more often than not the "feeling" was correct.

(I hate it when this happens)

and move the mind on to the next thought actions......can't slow downnnnnn nnnnnnnnnnnnnnever say die except at the end of the day....... in exhaustion

ADHD like any other disorder causes pain. But it can be managed. Part of the management comes from recognizing that it actually enables us to do some things better and easier than people without the disorder especially creative stuff.

The secret is in my signature I got tired of typing it.......

blast a CD

I read and write better that way...fast upbeat music....ever notice that different threads and even people's post "go" with certain artist

right now it is Paul Parker.....earlier it was Metallica with a cool down of Santana in between.....

That SB cat is rubbing off on me, sorry.

He does that to me too!!!!!

I have began writing to others who "speak" differently and realized I must be reading too many SB post before bed or some thing..but hey I don't really mind.

My brain has a mind of it's own it picks up what it finds useful and scraps the rest......conserves “memory”

Using conditional blocks (above) and loops I or any other hack can emulate any reality in the universe - except one - emotion. It defies logic.

The fact I still exist in this space time continuum defies logic as well as several laws of probability!!!!

I got a feeling you are right. If you are right that means I'm even crazier than previous estimates. But this AM I'm ready to rumble. THE REST OF MANKIND IS NUTS. WE ARE NORMAL. Any takers?

Lets do it!!!!! I am board any way....... :D

barbyma

02-18-06, 12:26 PM

Bob, I really hate to burst this particular bubble, but nobody has found "increased creativeness" in ADDers.

It's correlated with Bipolar Disorder, but even the high cormibidity of BP with ADHD doesn't help. There's no correlation.

ADDers vary in the same ways that everyone else does -- wide range of IQs, wide range of creativity, wide range of psychic abilities..... :p

I made that last one up......

SB_UK

02-18-06, 01:24 PM

Bob, I really hate to burst this particular bubble ...
Then why do it?

SB.

scuro

02-18-06, 01:43 PM

Ignorance is bliss, SB?

SB_UK

02-18-06, 02:49 PM

scuro

02-18-06, 05:47 PM

Yup ... 'ignorance is bliss' ...

http://www.addforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=258853&postcount=13

Are you using the term in the same sense that I meant it?

Remember
... de Nial in de Nial ...
... drowning in irony, no ... ? ...
you should be.

SB.

Stew ard in the "garden of eden". Wouldn't you like to be the master chef? :)
Such pretty little ideas...it's beautiful sunshine.

SB_UK

02-18-06, 06:03 PM

? No; Why?
Misanthropomorphizing.
I surely hope you don't have such illusions.
They won't be realised.

SB.

barbyma

02-18-06, 06:11 PM

Then why do it?

SB.
Thank you for answering your own question.

SB_UK

02-18-06, 06:49 PM

Nope.
Thank you for allowing me in on your
raison d'être.
But, it isn't consistent.

SB.

Uminchu

02-18-06, 08:45 PM

Bob, I really hate to burst this particular bubble, but nobody has found "increased creativeness" in ADDers.

It's correlated with Bipolar Disorder, but even the high cormibidity of BP with ADHD doesn't help. There's no correlation.Actually .... If you look at that recent news article (http://www.addforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25627) posted by Nova, it says children of bipolar parents were 107% more creative; but children with ADHD were 91% more creative. It's hard to compare these two groups, since they measure different things (bipolar in parents vs. ADHD in self), but we can say that ADHDers are significantly more creative than the general pop.

Joyous56

02-18-06, 09:35 PM

What does '107% more creative' mean? It's like trying to quantify something that isn't quantifiable. And why 107%...not 105% or 110%....or 107.48%.

I'm not questioning the message, just the stats.

And just what does "listen up buckwheates?" mean?

Uminchu

02-18-06, 10:10 PM

What does '107% more creative' mean? It's like trying to quantify something that isn't quantifiable. And why 107%...not 105% or 110%....or 107.48%.It's simple. It means that ADHDers taste great, but are 91% less filling. :)

They basically showed the kids some geometric shapes. Other studies have shown that more creative people prefer more complex shapes, and dislike simple ones. So they measure creativity by how many simple shapes the kids reject.

Or something like that. :p

scuro

02-19-06, 12:46 AM

It's simple. It means that ADHDers taste great, but are 91% less filling. :)

They basically showed the kids some geometric shapes. Other studies have shown that more creative people prefer more complex shapes, and dislike simple ones. So they measure creativity by how many simple shapes the kids reject.

Or something like that. :p

Correlation does not equal causation

Uminchu

02-19-06, 12:58 AM

Correlation does not equal causationIf ADHD correlates with creativity, I think we can say that "ADHDers are creative." We just can't say "ADHD makes you creative." Pretty subtle distinciton, and I'm not too into subtlety, but I'll remember which statement is valid so the subtle types will be happy.

On the other hand, the correlation itself is a bit weak, right? We've got shape preferences correlating with creativity, and then ADHD correlating with shape preferences -- so we're two steps removed, so to speak.

meadd823

02-19-06, 02:34 AM

I really hate to burst this particular bubble, but nobody has found "increased creativeness" in ADDers.

another thing I have noticed here is that

"nobody" has looked for their "increased creativeness" that could be associated with being ADD..

Heck if we can't say we are creative due to our ADD, the fact that "increase" creativity has actually been LOOKED for by people NOT seeing disorders is aproxmaintly the same chances as this post has of being written by Queen Elizabeth!

In my reality I have found that people pretty much find what it is they are looking for....

If you are looking for a wrench in an ocean of hammers chances are you will find the wrench while simply cursing the hammers but never finding any of them!!!

Creativeness and disorder work much the same way..it is all in attitude

Then why do it?

Welcome to the never ending "conflict" a negative thing to such a cool place as this I know but to some people this is their reality..really !!!

If we are free to say we want to conquer the world or perhaps see the pluses of being ADD, the flip side would be this same freedom is granted to those who feel it necessary to rain on every parade possible.

I don't mind a little rain it is a necessary part of existence but I do not think I would be very happy if it rained every time I walked out side. I prefer a little variety in my weather conditions as well as my neurobiological ones!!!

Ignorance is bliss, SB?

Okay I would like to see some empirical evidence backing up the notion that SB's ignorance is bliss, it my prove to be kind of funny......

Which reminds me the river denial is most unusual; it is the only one in the world that runs both ways!!!!

barbyma

02-19-06, 05:45 AM

Actually .... If you look at that recent news article (http://www.addforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25627) posted by Nova, it says children of bipolar parents were 107% more creative; but children with ADHD were 91% more creative. It's hard to compare these two groups, since they measure different things (bipolar in parents vs. ADHD in self), but we can say that ADHDers are significantly more creative than the general pop. If you read the actual published article:

Simeonova DI, Chang KD, Strong C, Ketter, TA. (2005). Creativity in familial bipolar disorder. Journal of Psychiatric Research, 39(6), 623-31.

You'll find that once they adjusted for age, these numbers were not significant. Translation: there were no differences between disordered children and controls. This refers to the results of creativity tests given to the children of Bipolar Parents; there were both Bipolar and ADHD children.

In addition, the results that were significant (Bipolar Adults) were limited to a single subscale called "Dislike".

I often offer extra credit and one assignment I like to give is to have students find an article in the popular media (like the one linked) and compare it to the actual published research report it's referring to. The results can be pretty amazing.

So, sure, you can say ADDers are more creative. But that don't make it true.... And IMO, if there is a statistically significant correlation, it's not weak. If it provides reasonable prediction, you could certainly make the claim. Unfortunately, that's just not the case this time.

HighFunctioning

02-19-06, 11:06 AM

Just to keep everyone on the same page here, here is the entire abstract of that article (the one recently referred to by Umichnu and Barbyma):

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T8T-4FKY90V-1...... (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T8T-4FKY90V-1&_user=10&_handle=V-WA-A-W-AB-MsSAYVW-UUA-U-AAVWEVYVCE-AAVUCWEWCE-ZZYEUWZCC-AB-U&_fmt=summary&_coverDate=11%2F30%2F2005&_rdoc=10&_orig=browse&_srch=%23toc%235095%232005%23999609993%23606010!&_cdi=5095&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=04d4a5c76002664c26098c9fd4e6486f)

Creativity in familial bipolar disorder

Diana I. Simeonova, Kiki D. Chang, Connie Strong and Terence A. Ketter

Department of Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences, Division of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry, Stanford University School of Medicine, 401 Quarry Road, Stanford, CA 94305 5540, USA

Studies have demonstrated relationships between creativity and bipolar disorder (BD) in individuals, and suggested familial transmission of both creativity and BD. However, to date, there have been no studies specifically examining creativity in offspring of bipolar parents and clarifying mechanisms of intergenerational transmission of creativity. We compared creativity in bipolar parents and their offspring with BD and bipolar offspring with attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) with healthy control adults and their children. 40 adults with BD, 20 bipolar offspring with BD, 20 bipolar offspring with ADHD, and 18 healthy control parents and their healthy control children completed the Barron–Welsh Art Scale (BWAS), an objective measure of creativity. Adults with BD compared to controls scored significantly (120%) higher on the BWAS Dislike subscale, and non-significantly (32%) higher on the BWAS Total scale. Mean BWAS Dislike subscale scores were also significantly higher in offspring with BD (107% higher) and offspring with ADHD (91% higher) than in healthy control children. Compared to healthy control children, offspring with BD had 67% higher and offspring with ADHD had 40% higher BWAS Total scores, but these differences failed to reach statistical significance when adjusted for age. In the bipolar offspring with BD, BWAS Total scores were negatively correlated with duration of illness. The results of this study support an association between BD and creativity and contribute to a better understanding of possible mechanisms of transmission of creativity in families with genetic susceptibility for BD. This is the first study to show that children with and at high risk for BD have higher creativity than healthy control children. The finding in children and in adults was related to an enhanced ability to experience and express dislike of simple and symmetric images. This could reflect increased access to negative affect, which could yield both benefits with respect to providing affective energy for creative achievement, but also yield liabilities with respect to quality of interpersonal relationships or susceptibility to depression.

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

So, yes, there wasn't a significant correlation between the control and exp. groups for overall score, but there was for the Dislike subscale, though I wouldn't know what that subtest actually measures, so I can't draw any conclusions based on that. I would assume that they are comparing apples to apples here.... Just to keep everything here in context.

barbyma

02-19-06, 01:20 PM

So, yes, there wasn't a significant correlation between the control and exp. groups for overall score, but there was for the Dislike subscale,
Only for Adult Bipolars, not for children of bipolars who are either bipolars or ADDers.

Nova

02-19-06, 10:57 PM

Thank you! And I feel the same way about you!
I know you've made me laugh my derriere off with some of your replies on here on some topics, LOL !
And I give you so much credit for the articles you've posted on here pertaining to research development, because it does open the door to the many great discussions we've been involved in.

Thanks you!
I mean it.

Nova

Nova

02-19-06, 11:10 PM

I TOTALLY AGREE WITH BARB.

Please seek help. Mood disorders/depression are treatable and meds do work for either, but you have to seek help first.
If not for yourself, your wife..for all of us here who care about you.

Nova

Tara

02-19-06, 11:33 PM

If creativity really does equal "impulsivity going right" then it would only make sense that people with AD/HD are more creative.

Nova

02-20-06, 12:03 AM

Well I'm a 'Bipo' who's definitely creative. I've read the article too. (0:
When it comes to my creativity, I use it to help alleviate my 'stress/chaos'..in my case, I actually become more creative when I am encountering stress/chaos..I have a few friends who are most creative when they're undergoing the most intense/and or depression. Again these are only my thoughts, so please remember that.

In my opinion..when it comes to creativity..it might be so subjective..that what one considers to be creative in concept, another might not consider it so..When I've shown some of my poems to those who don't understand poetry..I've been 'hit' with 'they don't rhyme' as the first words...
Or 'That's what you're wearing..don't you think that's a little 'young looking for your age?' What does my creative age group wear ?
Is there a creative walker that I'm supposed to create next for when I reach a certain age even if I don't need it ? Just to blend better ?
I don't believe so.

I think my faded hip huggers, with the deliberately ripped up knees, and my beaded tank tops/color girly t-shirts will do just fine, as well as my ankle length skirts and the button down blouses, as well, as the mini skirts and the short tank tops...all of them-as long as I feel good wearing them.
If not, I'll decide what else to wear when the time comes then.
It's not about rebellion.

Once again:
It's about a creative positive mind that works differently.
Bipolar or ADHD.
Or in my case BOTH.

meadd823

02-20-06, 01:43 AM

What about the
Bob dude who has apparently gotten lost like so many do in these discussion where we all want to right...

Kind of like a bunch of doctors standing over the patient arguing about who's diagnosis is right and during this lengthily heated discussion the patient dies and quiet frankly it doesn't really matter any more now does it!!!!

Bob are these mood swing extreme or associated with circumstances like reading the thread you tried to start in humor?????

I did what I called quick journaling because I was having periods of extreme emotions not associated with trying to get a point across edge wise..

I simply marked a calendar with arrows up and down followed by a few words about how I was feeling. I would use a down arrow to indicate a down mood, the longer the tail of the arrow the more depressed I felt...I used - line for so so moods, and up arrows in the same manner I would the down ones....

I would jots down a word or two like head ache, joint aches, physical aggression x2 ect......a pattern emerge that I could actual show a doctor so he would have some thing to go one besides my vague memory.

I used the same calendar I did my "monthly cycles" on because keeping up with two calendars was out of the question...it was found that I was having brain swelling due to hormones fluctuations!!!

Perhaps you could enlist your wife’s help...saying you have frequent ups and downs doesn't really give the doc much to go on. If he has ever been apart of all this "idea exchanges" he may simply come to the conclusion you were perfectly normal!!!!! :rolleyes:

The main idea is keeping the main idea, the main idea.....and people's feelings would be a useful consideration in my opinion----no data needed here

Bob1951

02-20-06, 07:13 PM

Tammy and all,

Boys and girls,

The crazies have consumed me for the past three days.

Thank God I'm back with my normal compadries.

Wife gave me a good beating for poor language choice.

I called some cat's doc a *** hole. Got the Mrs. upset (she spies on me) and she started beating me.

Girl, I said, I see no vulgarity. Whatchu talking about?

W That *** Me: That's not vulgar. That's three little asterisks.

Beating is getting worse.

It's nerd talk, I say.

You know we call ! bang. You like that don't you. She smiles.

We call . dot. Heck, it is shorter than period.

And we call askterisk a pointer.

You see, it's code.

Nothing more than a triple pointer to the variable hole. You know, you can put things in a hole. Variables hole things, in this case a memory address.

Beating worsens in serverity. She don't believe me.

Honey, it's a metaphor.

Memory address is like a brain. Hole is like a cave. All I said is the dude's doc's brain lives in a dark, damp, smelly place.

She thinks it stinks and the beating esculates.

Honey, I have problems with the rule book.

W: Whatchu mean?

I can't combine a triple pointer with hole, right?

W: That's right.

But I can combine a triple pointer with inine, right?

W: That's right

I can call that cute animal that looks like a donkey a triple pointer, right?

But I can't the cat's doc a triple pointer?

The beating esculates.

So I repent cause THAT is always the fastest way out of punishment.

And that is another rule I can't remember.

Listen, the crazies have a rule book written by the DEVIL. And that is, my normal friends, 90% of all the problems we face.

Doesn't Andrew have a page where the crazies that have to put up with us normals can whine to one another.

Bob

PS God help me when she's reads this one. Damn, I'm screwed ! (bang) Cool.

Utter Nutter

02-20-06, 07:22 PM

Hey...I was just wondering, I am a singer/song writer/vocal coach and I find that my creaitive juices dry up like mad when I am on medication. I kinda like having ADHD for the most part. I am the life of the party, it only sucks when I have to be responsible (which unfortunately is now all the time). I feel like I loose a part of me that is fun and vibrant - anyone else feel this way?

Nova

02-20-06, 07:42 PM

There's tons of information on medication section on here, UN, if that helps you.

Nova

Bob1951

02-20-06, 07:47 PM

Tammy,

Yours was the last post I read before I was hogtied by the crazies.

Self-medication is root to many a drug abuser's addiction. I really didn't enjoy opiates, pills (except Dex), Mary Jane was OK, And Acid was cool if it went the right way.

But speed I couldn't quit. Signed myself into rehab. It should have been five minutes in and out the door. Dude, you got the dosage too high. And, you can get it cheaper at a pharmacy.

Fixed. Done.

Instead I battled for 30+ years with an unknown to me disorder only to find out I WAS RIGHT ALL ALONG.

Bob

Been there done that but not because I was a bad girl (well not in that way) I was actually treating a "disorder" medical science hadn't caught up to yet!!!

Nova

02-21-06, 01:56 AM

Toys R Us has some neato pocket games that you can take with you on the 'go'.
They help me, keep my mind occupied, when I find myself in places I don't want to be...like in waiting rooms... (0:

It beats shooting spit balls at people (which used to be a favorite of mine when I was young, which I don't advocate doing-especially at age 42)

Nova

KirkT

02-21-06, 11:45 AM

Ain't nothing wrong with us. It is the rest of humanity that is nuts.

The greatest discovery of my generation is that a human being can alter his life by altering his attitudes of mind.
William James (1842 - 1910)
Bob
But, what does it mean when you've altered your attitude to no longer alter it? By saying that everybody else is nuts, and that they must accept you for who you are, you are in essence saying that you will no longer alter your attitued to fit others, thereby negating that which you embrace.

Bob1951

02-21-06, 12:26 PM

Kirk,

I am capable of being rude, inconsiderate, opinionated and pretty vulgar. Those things must be altered cause they suck.

But I refuse to change who I am because I can't.

I tried it for years and it is a NO do.

Make any sense?

KirkT

02-21-06, 12:37 PM

Absolutly. For me, the hardest person for me to like is myself. So, instead of changing myself to be someone who is likeable, change my attitued to like me for who I am.

Bob1951

02-21-06, 01:08 PM

Kirk,

Man, you just saved me a bunch of typing. I say to myself I got to explain this great revelation I've had that Barbyma, and Nova, and Tammy, and a zillion other sane cases had 20 billion years ago and quit the hyperbole.

And you done it fer me.

You the man.

Bob

KirkT

02-21-06, 01:14 PM

Great!

Now tell me how to do it.:confused:

Bob1951

02-21-06, 01:48 PM

Kirk,

I certainly hope others chime in on this one. First, let me drop out of hyperdrive and get literal.

In my case it came from the confluence of several events in my life. Perhaps the most significant was the ADHD diagnosis, and, now it looks probable I suffer from some sort of mood disorder to boot. I do not fear it. The best thing for anyone with a disorder is to have the disorder diagnosed.

Psychologists have identified personality types. Each type has a distinct set of advantages and disadvantages. For example, the introvert won't do well in sales but may make the world's best research scientist. Incidentally, sales is the highest paid profession in the world. But the introvert will starve selling. Anything wrong with being an introvert? Sure am glad them cats is out there figuring out what is wrong with my brain, aren't you?

I have come to realize whether it is me less the ADHD or me because of the ADHD I possess some exceptional capabilities. For example, I spot the simplest most obvious solutions well before my peers. The funny thing is I'm not trying when the light blub goes off. That's gotta be ADHD. It's upside.

Focusing on the positive helps.

Speaking for myself, I suffered a lot of rejection in my formative years. That led to low self-esteem. Low esteem leads to wanting to be liked by everyone. Wanting to be liked by everyone is impossible unless we can morph from one personality to another on the fly. It can't be done. The attempt leads to unresolvable mental conflict which leads to shrinks and meds.

Much cheaper just to love me. I love me.

Bob

PS The mother of all paradoxes: You must love you neighbor AS YOURSELF.

Kokomo

02-21-06, 02:02 PM

Great last page of posts here! Spent most of my adult life "morphing" to be whatever anyone expected of me at any given time. Since my diagnosis, I am learning to simply appreciate the good in me and work on the bad. BTW, has anyone read a great "How To FIx ADD" book yet. I love these forums, but it's also a lot of shared experiences and consoling. I guess I would love someone to point me to the best source for the repair process. Don't get me wrong, just the sharing of experiences has been very therapeutic, but I'd love some practical hands-on cures as well! Cures is of course said tongue-and-cheek, but you hoopefully know what I mean.

Bob1951

02-21-06, 05:22 PM

I love these forums, but it's also a lot of shared experiences and consoling. I guess I would love someone to point me to the best source for the repair process.
Kokomo,

You mentioned journeling. Powerful. I did it for about a year. It taught me to stay conscious of how I am feeling. Well, about a hour ago I went depressed. Why? It is because I have a medical problem. My brain chemistry is off. So about an hour ago a regulator that should have opened didn't.

I can tell you my coping skills. They are all simple. For ADHD: write things down. Writing things down frees my working memory. The energy I use to expend trying to keep stuff in working memory is saved.

A rather rigid schedule and more than normal planning are also helpful. Anything that frees me from an on-the-spot decisions helps.

For studying, something a do a lot of, create distractions. Paradoxical indeed, but if I create distractions, I don't get distracted. Put me in a quite room and my mind is all over the place.

For whatever mood disorder I got: Depressed mode. I tell myself "don't worry about it, it will pass." And it does. For the "too optimistic" mode, "do not make any decisions without bouncing them off wife."

That is it. That is all of them. They all HELP, I promise.

However, drugs and each other is my BIG GUNS.

It will never change. Unless someone figures out a cure. There is no cure in sight.

Sooooooooooooo,

It's drugs and each other.

Bob

Kokomo

02-21-06, 05:34 PM

However, drugs and each other is my BIG GUNS.

It will never change. Unless someone figures out a cure. There is no cure in sight.

Sooooooooooooo,

It's drugs and each other.

Bob
I have never tried journaling, you must have me confused with someone else, but I think that's a great idea. I agree that the friendships here are already making a difference. I know the place must be creating dopamine cause I am here all day long.

I guess I should apologize to all for my 130 posts in four days, but this place is very very therapeutic for me. I thank you for reading my posts, and if, since there are so many you skip them, thanks for not letting them annoy you too much!

Nova

02-21-06, 06:36 PM

In my need for balance, pertaining to having Bipo/ADHD, the reason for posting and replying to positive articles on this forum helps me not to 'throw in the towel' as quickly and give into 'swings'/d-pression.

The one thing to keep in mind, in my opinion, is to try and remember that unless there is always balance- positive with the negative, light with the dark, good with the bad, something will 'give', or topple over. Again- just my 2 bucks.

So yeah...I forget things, am late to personal events and have to reschedule them many times, interrupt people when they're talking sometimes, I have divided attention, have mood swings, over react and get majorly depressed sometimes...BUT..and this is a huge BUT- I have creative ideas that can be implemented that are not zany/wacky/insane, I am highly intuitive, I am energetic and highly enthusiastic.

Here's what you really have to ask yourself...what do you have to gain by beating yourself up/putting yourself down ?
I don't mean go to the extreme opposite become so arrogant that no one can stand being around you...
but what've you got to lose by waking up tomorrow,
and before you get out of bed...saying 'I really like _______ about myself.'

Find one positive trait about yourself...
before you get out of bed tomorrow morning. (0:

Nova

Andi

02-21-06, 06:44 PM

lol...One of my best friends yells at me all the time. Whenever I say anything negative about myself she gets after me to say three positive things and if I won't, she will...gawd do I love that woman :)

Nova

02-21-06, 06:50 PM

I keep thinking about you, Andi !!
I want to create a T-shirt with your avatar! I just love it!
What's cute is that I'll think about you every time I wear it, you know that, don't you ?
I absolutely love that saying !

Nova

Bob1951

02-21-06, 10:20 PM

Andi,

You have the second coolest avatar in the world.

I was telling my wife how I cannot fail on a project I'm involved with. I can't take another failure, I say. She starts enumerating all my successes that I NEVER THINK ABOUT and MOST I FORGOT ABOUT.

What is it with us?

First thing I should do when I get out of bed in the AM is kick myself in the "triple asterisk" and tell myself how I am nothing but "quadruple asterisk."

Don't make sense, do it?

Bob

Nova

02-21-06, 11:22 PM

Nope.
That's why you should quit doing it.

Give up the asterisks habit, Bob (0:

(You da man, Baby!)
Nova

SB_UK

02-22-06, 01:10 AM

:-) A respect-filled respectful nod of respect, expressed as my inability to separate any of that post into quotes.
All or nothing.

*!. -> :-)

The secret to expressing one's self without fear of reproach lies in pointing through multiple levels of redirection at the heart of the matter.
Imagine a filter.
Relaxing with Java at 5am, I thank the smartinines for their vision of cleaning up my mess, of collecting my garbage when types float like broken parts of previously dynamically held structures. Except, the garbage collector hasn't seen the link.

"It's behind you" shout the children.

But Punch never gets to see the bad guy.
The bad guy side-steps, just that bit quicker, stays out of sight.

Imagine boot-up with a picture of a cuppa' ... but different behaviour on different computers.
The ideology of multi-platform laid bare :-)

So ... Bob ... jumping out that plane, check canopy, James Bond Style landing in the drag car ... he's off.

... all of this ... too slow, we need more speed ... faster baby faster baby ... we can see the Earth from our perch, and although planet Earth is blue and he told us that there was nothing we could do ...

... well, Zowie Bowie! Try harder or I'll kick yurfatinine.

The swings ... soon.
The roller coaster too.
The see-saw --- looks fun!!! ... feeling queasy?
The merry-go-round.

All to come ... all dereferenced by order of pointer.

Did I say?
I'm sure I did?
Welcome to my* world.

SB.

*our

meadd823

02-22-06, 07:09 AM

Like is 10% of what happens to us and 90% of how we deal with it!!!!

Bob dude are you and or wife doing the calendar thing ???? Oh I double as a PIA in this sort of stuff. The more accurate and conices the inform the better the docs can help you and the less visits it should take in doing so.......

Aint nothing wrong with being who we are.. can any one point to a human life form that doesn't come with strengths and weakness...... those things are a part of us all as a human race........ADD well is a specific set of traits that medical science has found a name for so they can have a common reference point when speaking and it so much shorter than thramatoidialdigbat......

Bob it seems to be in the water or some thing because they world is running in PMS hyper drive. It seems I will share what I "saw a while back" it may work for you and then again another may have an idea you find better. Never know This is why so many ideas are good things....

original thread (http://www.addforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=260734&postcount=5)

My partner has more ADD traits than I do but refuses discuss possibility never mind admit the reality of being diagnosis.

He is unable to function in the “NT’ world he can not work for any one else because of his ADD. He never heard of ADD until he met me, but had to provide for self long before we met.

He works for himself and does quiet well doing so in this case he has made his world fit his ADD traits.

Another Example..

I got sick of my life they way it was and decided to do some thing about it

I got tried of hating every thing, hating me hating my ADD….I wanted to make this dark cloud quit following me every where…..

Was looking for a why…………..

I noticed some people seemed more satisfied with their life and existence. One young man in particular was a patient I took care of who had lost both legs in a car accident. He used double prosthesis below the knees…he has such a wonderful attitude he radiated some thing I wanted to be a part of…I begin noticing what he had that I didn’t

My conclusion was attitude!!!!!!

I had a hard time changing my attitude until I looked into the why…and discovered my attitude was directly linked to my perspective.

Because I didn’t want to delude my self into thinking all was wonderful with the world while still wanted to see more than grey skies…..I came up with a plan.

Atoms…positive negative and neutral…every thing is made of these atoms so this lead me to believe that all situations in life contained atoms therefore should follow along the same “laws”.

I beginning looking at myself, my circumstances, and my ADD having positives, negatives and a neutral .

The negative was easy for me to see but I had to “train” myself to also see the neutral and the positive……

So I changed my inner world as a result my outer world soon followed suite!!!!!

I do believe in allowing medical science to help with any neurotransmitter quirks present...I am in favor of proper treatment however there is only so far medical science can go then dude it is your game so to speak......

I have read to the redundant that ADD hasn't been shown to increase creativity.....hey well I am some one who's brain has to sort separate every thing but the dirty laundry I am still not getting done I came to terms with this scientific point of view.......

ADD may not be shown in laboratory test to increase creativity then again I have never been a laboratory experiment...have you???? Any one else been a lab rat (LOL)

Now I understand they my not have thing one to do with each other in research labs and studies but the truth is they both occur in you, me, Nova, SB and several others here. In this way they are connected even if only because they exist in the same individual...no lab test or scientific research can take that away from you so chin up take care of medical stuff then begin learning how to be the best Bob you can be...

Do ya think this is long enough yet…….??????????? What is up withthis electrical stuff I mush have a magnet stuck up ...oops never mind can't write that here........ :o first at work now here...... :confused: