For YEARS I have been called the "ADD poster child" from my friends and family because of my lack of internal filter, poor social skills and hyperfocessing/obsessionisms. I took some online test and was off the scale for ADHD. I really feel like I can relate to most of the people here on the ADD Forums too.

SOOOO, I finally went to see a therapist and he thinks I have Asbergers. He told me to go home and "Google it" I had never heard of this before but after reading the symtoms it seems dead on for me. However it seems almost like ADHD too. I never really related to the "Distracted" part of ADD either but I feel like a social cripple plain and simple. It ALMOST seems like to different names for the same symtons. The "autism" relationship scared me a little too.

What is the difference and how closely related are they?

A lot over laps when it comes to social skills. One thing I have found in working with children and adults with both AD/HD and Aspergers is that the people with AD/HD when taught understand how and why to use social skills. It' just that they never picked up on them or don't use them do to impulsivity or other AD/HD related issues.

The people with Aspergers just don't seem to understand why the social skills should be used. For example if somebody's hair looks bad both the person with AD/HD may tell the person his or her looks bad.

The person with AD/HD may say that somebody's hair looks bad to that person. Later on if somebody brings it up that that wasn't the correct thing to say the AD/HD person gets why (even if they disagree with it). The person with Aspergers only sees that the person's hair looked bad and has a really hard time seeing the social reasons why it's not a good idea to tell the person this.

The person with Aspergers is more focused on the hair being ugly and doesn't see anything else. The person with AD/HD is focused on anything but the hair. With both AD/HD and Apergers the results are the same but it's the reasoning behind the action that differs.

ADHD is a disorder of attention. It is basically an inability to control attention. Asperger's syndrome is an autism spectrum disorder.

Autism in general is a disconnect between various parts of the brain such that a person has difficulty in a number of areas that impact everyday life. Nonverbal communication and social skills can be big problems when you have an autism spectrum disorder. The severity of it can vary from midly affected to profundly afflicted.

People who have Asperger's syndrome also sometimes have ADHD.

There is one author, Diane Kennnedy, who has a book that discusses a possible connection between autism and ADHD, but the idea is not widely accepted. http://www.adhdautismconnection.com/ Other than that, there is no evidence for a connection between autism and ADHD.

Me :D


For YEARS I have been called the "ADD poster child" from my friends and family because of my lack of internal filter, poor social skills and hyperfocessing/obsessionisms. I took some online test and was off the scale for ADHD. I really feel like I can relate to most of the people here on the ADD Forums too.

SOOOO, I finally went to see a therapist and he thinks I have Asbergers. He told me to go home and "Google it" I had never heard of this before but after reading the symtoms it seems dead on for me. However it seems almost like ADHD too. I never really related to the "Distracted" part of ADD either but I feel like a social cripple plain and simple. It ALMOST seems like to different names for the same symtons. The "autism" relationship scared me a little too.

What is the difference and how closely related are they?

ADHD = lack of inhibition (any sort of impulse control including such things as emotions or peserverance)

Asbergers = difficulty with language and social conventions (rules)


It gets a lot more complicated then that but that, as Speedo has eluded too, but that is the basic answer.

People who have Asperger's syndrome also sometimes have ADHD.


I think it maybe as high as 50% people who have an ASD also have ADHD.

A simple way to seperate them I find is people with ADHD tend to do
things for pleasure that most people can understand. Like any thrill seeking
things you can think of. A person with an ASD or asperger can get pleasure
out of things most people would not understand. Like subjects most would
find boring or useless.

I would not worry if you have one or the other or both. Its not like it going
to make much difference in your treatment options.

Oh myself I have inattentive ADD, dysgraphia, dyslexia, dyspraxia and likely
aspergers.

ADHD people tend to be disorganized, have difficulty following a routing.

Aspergers people tend to strictly follow a routing

ADHD people tend to be disorganized, have difficulty following a routing.

Aspergers people tend to strictly follow a routing
I have difficulty following a routine... or do you mean something different by "routing"?

I have difficulty following a routine... or do you mean something different by "routing"?
Ack! Typo on my part. I meant routine. I can't believe I did it twice! :)

Funny with my dyslexia I never notice a difference in routine or routing. They sound
enough alike and mean the same thing.

Also a lot of the social issues related to Aspergers are due to having somewhat of a tunnel vision and focusing only that that one thing. The social issues related to AD/HD are usually due to "not even knowing we are in a tunnel".

I have heard that Bill Gates has Apergers. If you ever see him interviewed his social akwardness comes through. It's mainly because he is talking about computers or a certain cause and doesn't really "get" the other stuff. Then you take somebody like Robbin Williams who is thought by many to have AD/HD. I saw him on a talk show last week and he kept interupting people because he was impulsive and just wanted to get his thoughts out.

I wonder if there are any studies out there showing if people with AD/HD and people with Aspergers respond differently to social skills training.

Thanks all, good stuff! As an IT guy, I am pretty good at Cisco routing ;-) but I suck at spelling :D

Aspergers and ADAD

Well in my view since I have been diagnosed with Apergers, most of the people here do not mention the good sides of Aspergers. they just mention that they do not care about there hair or whatever. Most of you need to realize that not everyone who has Aspergers is alike and not all: do not care about there personal hygene, some do care, and some dont care. I believe the difference is that in Aspergers have a tendency to go with 1-3 activitys (1 being the main) for most of the time, which usually ends up exceling and outperformining others who are normal(no differences) who are interested in that activity as well. I believe that Einstein was majorly in the aspergers syndrome. As well I am in the Aspergers side, and even exceled on the internet to the point of being extremely wealthy for a certain amount of time, until my nervous system overloaded.

So in my point of view Aspergers is all about having a odd (different type of activity which they will repeatly do till they reach/excel in that area)

ADAD: I'm not really sure about this, but based on what I read it's mainly based on depression, anxiety, all all the other types(which is related to Aspergers) We also need to be reminded that Aspergers in High Functional Autism most of the time (based on what I have read in resources)

ADHD people tend to be disorganized, have difficulty following a routing.

Aspergers people tend to strictly follow a routing
I'm too quick to answer (ADD trait) and sometimes see just one portion of a topic that has more than one aspect. Looking back on this, I realize that I have trouble learning a new routine, but certainly work best when I have a set routine. I got distracted at work yesterday and had to go back and catch several things that I skipped doing. I try changing things up occasionally just to keep me on my toes and keep from getting too stuck in one routine, and I can generally deal with doing that, maybe because I feel like I'm in control. When something disrupts the routine that is unexpected and quite out of my control, it really seems to be hard to finish the task at hand.


I have never been diagnosed, and at this point don't have the heath insurance to pay for visits with a therapist/psychologist/psychiatrist, but we do have my youngest granddaughter seeing a therapist once a week looking for a diagnosis and some kind of help for her. We went in thinking her symptoms seem like what we have read of Autism or Aspergers, but the first reaction he had was Bipolar. There is definately a neurological disorder involved, but working out what it might be and how to treat it seems very complicated.

One of the major issues, right behind the meltdowns which have been less frequent and shorter in duration lately, is that she is almost 6 and is not toilet trained. She doesn't seem to be aware of an urge to use the bathroom, doesn't seem to be aware when she has pottied or pooped, and has had perhaps half a dozen solid stools in her whole life. The MD we've been seeing says that's a "behavior issue", but I don't understand how - or why - a child would keep their stools from being firm. He did the blood test for Celiac's twice and says the numbers don't indicate that to be the problem.

Today we had to go and pick her up at school again and bring her home to give her a bath because she had a stool at school. The teacher in the Resource Room was so sure that she would be toilet trained by now, but at least twice a week she brings home wet or soiled pants and is wearing the spare clothes we sent in her bookbag.

Is that a common issue with Autistic or Ausperger's children?

I don't know how common it is to have bowel and bladder control problems with AS, but I know it happens a lot in autism.

I do know that some aspie kids have problems with toilet training. I also know that some don't.

Does the child make eye contact ? Are there stereotryped behaviors like rocking or flapping ?


here is some stuff I dug up for you on autism spectrum disorders...

autsm spectrum disorders have a triad of impairment.




Communication: language impairment across all modes of communication - speech, intonation, gesture, facial expression and other body language.
Socialisation: difficulties with social relationships, poor social timing, lack of social empathy, rejection of normal body contact, inappropriate eye contact.
Imagination: rigidity and inflexibility of thought processes, resistance to change, obsessional and ritualistic behaviour, lack of creative, imaginative play.
If you have impairment in only two of the three areas you might be diagnosed with PDD NOS....

The thing that ought to be convincing for you is if you spend most of the time trying to interpret what people are saying, stuggling with social situations and have a fundamental need for things to be predictable.

It varies so much from one individual to the next. Sometimes an aspie ends up initially diagnosed with adhd. It can be hard for doctors to spot the ones who are on the edge of the diagnostic threshold.

The thing to do is to talk about it with your family and with your doctor and go get diagnosed. In one sense it is just a label, but getting a proper diagnosis can be liberating and can point the way to finding ways of making improvements in your quality of life.

Me :D

I think I may be Asberger's as well, my social skills are comparable to a mop's, but I'm definatly inattentive ADD,

is there any tests that can be done (not oral or written, but scans, blood tests, anything concrete) to identify traces of autism. I remember teaching a kid with severe autism (teaching him skiing). he was in his own bubble, kinda knew there was something going on around him, but not quite all there, I spent most of the classes just running after him down the slope catching him, but I never got annoyed or angry with him, i just understood that his bubble is more important than the 50+ pedestrians hes skiing through. I think I'm rambling

Communication: language impairment across all modes of communication - speech, intonation, gesture, facial expression and other body language.
Socialisation: difficulties with social relationships, poor social timing, lack of social empathy, rejection of normal body contact, inappropriate eye contact.
Imagination: rigidity and inflexibility of thought processes, resistance to change, obsessional and ritualistic behaviour, lack of creative, imaginative play.
... I'm all three of thoes, g*d damn. although I'm sort of creative, but the ideas suck to normal people. but that could be my ADD side though, the creativity

lol Tell!!

As far as I know there is no diagnostic test for any facet of it. The triad of impairment is the benchmark that the doctors go by.


Me :D

I don't know how common it is to have bowel and bladder control problems with AS, but I know it happens a lot in autism.

I do know that some aspie kids have problems with toilet training. I also know that some don't.

Does the child make eye contact ? Are there stereotryped behaviors like rocking or flapping ?
Thanks for your response Speedo.:)

It's very unpredictable, which is one reason we're so frustrated. At times she is very social and will look us in the eye and talk to us on a very intelligent level, but at other times she hangs her head or hides behind furniture and/or uses "baby talk" when we ask her questions or try to engage her.

I'm the "rocker", haven't noticed her doing any rocking or flapping.


here is some stuff I dug up for you on autism spectrum disorders...

autsm spectrum disorders have a triad of impairment.

Communication: language impairment across all modes of communication - speech, intonation, gesture, facial expression and other body language.
Socialisation: difficulties with social relationships, poor social timing, lack of social empathy, rejection of normal body contact, inappropriate eye contact.
Imagination: rigidity and inflexibility of thought processes, resistance to change, obsessional and ritualistic behaviour, lack of creative, imaginative play.
If you have impairment in only two of the three areas you might be diagnosed with PDD NOS....
Communication = She didn't talk until she was 4 years old. Unless she was wanting something to eat or drink or a new video put in the machine she didn't seem too upset that we didn't understand her speech. Her mother often simply gave her whatever she was pointing at because the alternative was enduring yet another meltdown that would last for over an hour in most cases.

And as I already mentioned, she alternates between being very clear in her speech and using a "baby voice" and a stilted way of talking.

Socialization = Her teachers say she is doing well in her social interactions this year (kindergarten). But her teacher last year (Pre-K) said she would be getting along just fine and suddenly get upset if someone touched her or bumped her or if there was more than one demand on her attention at the same time. At which point she was told to go to her Naughty Spot for a few minutes. There are only a couple of older kids in our neighborhood who come and ask her big sister to play but don't usually want a little one tagging along, so we haven't seen her in social situations with her peers very often. She seems to get along fine at the park or at playland though.

As an infant and a toddler she didn't reject physical contact, and even now doesn't usually -unless- she is cranky or in the middle of a meltdown. And then she lashes out and has tried to hit her mom, and even her dad, once or twice. She regularly hits her big sister... which is not something I really blame her for as big sister can be very annoying. I am pretty sure she has ADHD or something similar.

Imagination = Has improved since she began school. Before that there was a lot of simply arranging and rearranging her Hot Wheels collection, mostly in silence. In the last year she has begun talking to herself, or to the toys, as she plays, and seems to be imagining or creating scenarios.

Although some things have improved in the last year or so, she is becoming more rigid and demanding about some things being done a certain way. For instance, she will get it into her head that she must use a certain cup to drink from and has a meltdown if we suggest she use the cup that she already has out.

She is still sleeping with Mommy, and not only does she insist on sleeping on the same side of the bed each night, she insists that her mommy be sitting next to the bed working at the computer. However, when it gets to be too much for Mommy, I will take her into my room and get her to lay down on my bed while I watch tv, and about half the time she will fall asleep there. On the weekend at her dad's house though, she sleeps on the bottom bunk in the girl's room with few problems.

The thing that ought to be convincing for you is if you spend most of the time trying to interpret what people are saying, stuggling with social situations and have a fundamental need for things to be predictable.

It varies so much from one individual to the next. Sometimes an aspie ends up initially diagnosed with adhd. It can be hard for doctors to spot the ones who are on the edge of the diagnostic threshold.

The thing to do is to talk about it with your family and with your doctor and go get diagnosed. In one sense it is just a label, but getting a proper diagnosis can be liberating and can point the way to finding ways of making improvements in your quality of life.

Me :D
Even when she's using her "baby voice" she is pretty much understandable. But social situations are as unpredictable as anything else with her. Taking the family out to dinner may be perfectly delightful, or it may be as bad as having a 2 year old throwing a tantrum - from which she cannot be distracted.

We've only been going to the therapist for 2 or 3 months. He first suspected Bipolar, but now is looking more closely at Autism/Asperger's, which is what we have been suspecting from our own research. He is trying to help us to help her, and is coordinating with the teacher in the Resource Room at school, but he doesn't want to start giving her meds until he feels more sure of what the meds would be treating.

We are ready to start begging for meds for her big sister though, she was difficult before we started the therapy and has been much worse since so much attention has been given to her little sister. She struggled a lot in school last year (3rd grade) but the teacher loved her attitude and refused to consider the possibility of a neurological diagnosis. And we're about brain-fried from dealing with the little one and therapy, we'd like to get a handle on one of them instead of trying to understand the issues with both of them all at once. How do single parents manage with more than one child who is 'special needs'? This is very hard with both mommy and gramma sharing the load, and with daddy taking them for the weekend every weekend. **sigh**

It's very unpredictable, which is one reason we're so frustrated. At times she is very social and will look us in the eye and talk to us on a very intelligent level, but at other times she hangs her head or hides behind furniture and/or uses "baby talk" when we ask her questions or try to engage her.
That sound exactly like my son (ADHD/Aspie). One way I heard Asperger's described (by an aspie) is that "I'm half normal, half autistic." SO part of the time they're running around acting their age, and then they turn into a kid that's half their age. I've even described Steven as hal 8 year old, half 4 year old. It's also the thing that makes it so hard to keep friends because kids have a hard time understanding why someone acts "normal", then acts like a "baby."

The other thing I've discovered is that alot of aspie kids act differently, even though they all have the same condition. When it comes to understanding facial expressions, Steven really gets it...in a controled situation, which was surprising to his therapist. It's the practical application that he's having such a hard time with.

That sound exactly like my son (ADHD/Aspie). One way I heard Asperger's described (by an aspie) is that "I'm half normal, half autistic." SO part of the time they're running around acting their age, and then they turn into a kid that's half their age. I've even described Steven as hal 8 year old, half 4 year old. It's also the thing that makes it so hard to keep friends because kids have a hard time understanding why someone acts "normal", then acts like a "baby."

The other thing I've discovered is that alot of aspie kids act differently, even though they all have the same condition. When it comes to understanding facial expressions, Steven really gets it...in a controled situation, which was surprising to his therapist. It's the practical application that he's having such a hard time with.
Thank you for sharing your experiences with your son. NoveMber is going to be 6 next month, so your Steven is a little ways ahead of her. What do you mean by having a hard time with "the practical application?" Does that mean he can interpret facial expressions with the people he's familiar with but has more trouble with people he doesn't know well?

One thing NoveMber does quite a bit, especially when talking to the therapist, is mixing something completely exterraneous in with the answer to whatever question he asks her. Instead of looking at him and focusing on that conversation, it's like she has a second conversation going on inside her head. He will ask something like, "What did you like best about school today?" and she will say, "Mrs. Miller talked about the words on the wall." And she will point to the colorful words that are hanging on the wall in the office there.



Has anyone read any books about dealing with Asperger's/Autism in children that they could recommend? I bid on a book about Bipolar children on ebay last week and didn't win the auction. Maybe that's the Universe telling me that it would be better to spend my money on a book about Autism? ;)

Don't see any way to edit the previous message, so I'll just add this here... I forgot about spinning being a STIM. NoveMber loves to spin. Standing in front of the tv and spinning around and around until just watching her makes us dizzy. But she never seems to get dizzy or tired of it.

Her big sister used to do that too (and also walked on her toes as a toddler) but seems to have outgrown those behaviors.

Thank you for sharing your experiences with your son. NoveMber is going to be 6 next month, so your Steven is a little ways ahead of her. What do you mean by having a hard time with "the practical application?" Does that mean he can interpret facial expressions with the people he's familiar with but has more trouble with people he doesn't know well?
You're Welcome. :) That's why we're all here.

When I say practical application, what I mean is sitting down and talking about things Steven gets it. Once he's in the situation, it's like he forgets what he knew. So I can sit in the living room, threapists office, etc and show him pics of faces and he understand the emotion, or I can give him a situation and he knows what face/emotion is involved. Once he's "out in the world" he doesn't seem to understand/pick up on people getting annoyed with him, wanted to be left alone, being upset, etc.

For books, I would reccomend The Complete Guide to Asperger's Syndrome by Tony Attwood (it kinda heavy reading at times, but very informative), and Can I tell you about Asperger Syndrome? A guide for friends and family by Jude Welton (it's more a book for kids to explain what Asperger's is). So far those are the only ones I have read.

You're Welcome. :) That's why we're all here.

When I say practical application, what I mean is sitting down and talking about things Steven gets it. Once he's in the situation, it's like he forgets what he knew. So I can sit in the living room, threapists office, etc and show him pics of faces and he understand the emotion, or I can give him a situation and he knows what face/emotion is involved. Once he's "out in the world" he doesn't seem to understand/pick up on people getting annoyed with him, wanted to be left alone, being upset, etc.

For books, I would reccomend The Complete Guide to Asperger's Syndrome by Tony Attwood (it kinda heavy reading at times, but very informative), and Can I tell you about Asperger Syndrome? A guide for friends and family by Jude Welton (it's more a book for kids to explain what Asperger's is). So far those are the only ones I have read.
The little one doesn't seem as "blind" to facial expressions and emotions as her big sister - who is one of those who interrupts constantly without checking to see if someone else was already talking or looks like they don't want to talk at the moment or looks angry/frustrated/distracted already.

Thank you for the book recommendations. Our little library doesn't have the one by Jude Welton but they do have the one by Tony Atwood, so that will go on my list to pick up when I take the current bunch back.

But I did check out some books that look like they will be helpful in getting a handle on understanding autism a little better, maybe help us figure out whether the little one actually has autism or not.

Thinking in Pictures by Temple Grandin - someone who actually has autism explains how autistics think differently

George and Sam by Charlotte Moore - a mother talks about her life with two autistic sons and one non-autistic son (interesting thought about how these kids have more difficulty getting born because they are differently wired from conception)

Rules by Cynthia Lord - Juvenile Fiction about a 12 year old sister's attempts to explain to her 8 year old autistic brother how to deal with life's little issues, and her friendship with a boy who is a paraplegic and cannot speak (this is for Big Sister to read but I think it's a great book - I got halfway through before she got home from school and am looking forward to reading the rest of it)