My whole life, I have been depressed, felt worthless and unloved. I am always anxious. I am 29yo now and I really think I may give up soon. I have tried every drug, I am only happy when I make myself manic with stimulants otherwise I suffer. I have pushed myself in all areas I lack, yet I still can't maintain a job, a friendship, a course of study. I still get walked over, screwed over, decived and abused. I cant remember anything, I can't connect with people. I always had hope for the future but now... I am looking ahead to a life a sadness, and loneliness, no matter how many people are around me, no matter what I achive. It is always going to be tainted.
Depression is meant to be a major comorbidity with ADHD but is it really?

I would like this post to stay here please mods, not tucked away with all the other depressives in a back sub forum, I want to know how others live their life...thanx

Depression is meant to be a major comorbidity with ADHD but is it really?Just like the rest of the population, people with ADHD can suffer with depression, but clinical depression is treatable and, for many people, not an ongoing condition.

If one is able to become happy when in a state of what we call "white mania" then it stands to reason that the person suffers from a form of bipolar disorder. There is an extremely high one-way cormidity bipolar-->ADHD. A person does not have to constantly cycle to be bipolar; it takes only one period of hypomania to qualify for the DX bipolar II. Stimulants are famous for inducing manic states in bipolar patients, even if they have previously never cycled to manic before.

I suggest you broach the subject of bipolar disorder with your doctor. It is quite common to be both bipolar and ADHD, just have a look around the boards to see how many of us here fit that criteria.

I am one of those people myself :) HTH and good luck.

I am 31. I do not believe you are bipolar to an extent to where you need to look into treatment for it. I am exactly the same way you are. Always anxious. If I am not doing something to either get organized or feel that I am accomplishing something and gaining progress - then I WILL get depressed.

Do you exersize? Because if you don't your going to get this way more often.

I got gym membership last week and I havent even gone to it once. I am having issues getting motivated to do it but I KNOW it will help me alot when I start going and I will. But I cannot even go to sleep at night happy if I feel I did not accomplish something to organize, and or reach a goal of some kind.

I am also looking ahead to a life of lonelyness and other such issues. We as add folk make it worse when this happense because we always expect more from ourselves than we should - and we always end up setting ourselves up to fail. I am sure you've heard this before in some way, shape or form.

I take it one day at a time stubbornly so that I can understand my ADD and know how to control it. I believe that once I make it to that point I can utilize it to work FOR me. I hope it does.

ADD people like you and me might be very very mildly bi-polar and so we are not rapid-cyclers. I used to be manic when was younger. I always have had lots of energy. This is why we are anxious all the time and feel lost. Hence this is why we need to exersize or find someting to do to keep that energy in use. Getting treated for bi-polar disorder will not do anything for you.

You and I both know that if we keep our energy projected and busy ALL the time we will be able to function and handle the next day that comes around. Most of all we will be much healther - I wish I could take my own advice!

I know what you mean by feeling that no matter what you are going to do things are going to suck royally. All i know is that if i keep myself busy and occupied and balance things out I can forget about it.
Being ADD we have so many ideas for projects and things we want to do that it overhelms us and this is the source of being tainted I believe.

Yes, I feel like crap most of the time. The only time I didn't is when I started on dexedrine and for the first couple of weeks felt some kind of high from it that suddenly faded as supposedly it started to treat my ADD symptoms. Someone mentioned going to the gym and I think that might be my remedy of last resort, because my doctor certainly isn't going to prescribe the amount of stims that would make me feel good all of the time.

Gosh, that must be awful.

I don't get that kind of depressed. I do feel depressed, and unable to handle my life, and tired. And that's kinda lousy.

What do you do? I mean, is your life rewarding to you? Is it a life you've chosen on purpose or something thrust upon you by circumstance?
If not, can you include things that meet that description? Can you maybe even chuck what life is and make it what you want? I mean, that's not easy to do if what you want is fame, money and power. But if you want, say, to live a life of adventure, maybe you can move to some adventure-compatible place and learn to be a whitewater rafting guide, or something.
I know depression isn't solved by that; but I also know that pills won't solve problems that require action. Just consider whether your problem really could be helped by some change of direction on your part. Sometimes negative emotions are telling us our lives are not right for us, and all the pills in the world won't fix that.

Hey, thanx for the replies. I am a psych nurse / nurse and a fitness instructor. The former was a career I chose that I thought would give me insight into myself. The reality is. Nursing is one of the worst jobs for an ADD'r. Lots of paperwork, lots of procedure, structre, hieracrchy. And never believe for a second nurses are wonderful people. They are abuseive thugs that constantly push each other down trying to climb to the top of the pecking order, all down under the guise of "effeciancy" or "best practice" You spend half your day dotting your eyes and crossing your T's just so nobody will have anything on you. I hate it so much, but of course, to the general moron publick nursing and nurses are "wonderfull" and its a super job and you make such a difference. Its all just so much crap.
I have tried for 6 years and 6 times to finish my fitness instructors course. I havn't got any passion left to motivate myself let alone anyone...unless of course I am high on dexies.
Mood stabalisers and neuroleptics are a chemical labotomy. No thanks. One day history will judge current psychietry severely for what its done to people.

Anyway, thats my moan. I have always felt depressed but never have I got so little pleasure out of life as I do now. In the past few years I just got burned so badly socially, mostly by women (even though I am gay). I am just so naive and a sucker, I get burnt and burnt and burnt and burnt again and I never learn.
I can't se it now, but tomorrow I may feel better, happy even, but it only last for a few hours then I am suicidal almost. Reactive. Everything effects me. Why am I saying all this to you guys anyway. Maybe I just feel better if I know someone else knows how I am feeling even if nothing can be done.
Take care

Nursing is one of the worst jobs for an ADD'r. Lots of paperwork, lots of procedure, structre, hieracrchy. And never believe for a second nurses are wonderful people. They are abuseive thugs that constantly push each other down trying to climb to the top of the pecking order, all down under the guise of "effeciancy" or "best practice" You spend half your day dotting your eyes and crossing your T's just so nobody will have anything on you. I hate it so much, but of course, to the general moron publick nursing and nurses are "wonderfull" and its a super job and you make such a difference

A part of me understand this is how you feel and I respect the right of all people to feel as they so desire.


However I am also a person with feelings of my own, I am nothing more than a fellow member here, and that portion of my being is truly insulted by this insinuation and generalization.

And never believe for a second nurses are wonderful people.

I am annoyed by your applying malice to all of us who are nurses. :mad:


I understand the dog eat dog mentality many in the profession do have and the need to c.y.a. due to law suites fears however as some one who has more than one profession I can assure you that this mentality is not isolated to the medical profession.

Please do bare in mind that you are not the only one here who is both ADD and a nurse. I am not the only other ADD nurse in this discussion. Apparently the other person is a kinder gentler soul, perhaps simply less opinionated.

Personally I would take a look at your own perception because it is how you choose to see life that determines your attitude about it. You can perceive all nurses as abusive if you want but in this choice you will have missed the hoards of us who are not that way at all. I agree the damn paper work sucks big time because it take away from the ability to spend time with patents. I periodically get out of the profession because it wears on my emotional stamina however I have been a nurse for 24 years and I do not blame the profession for my emotional strengths or weaknesses. I do what I need to do to maintain my own sense of well being without assigning blame.

One thing I learned in this life is you generally find that which you seek. If you seek the negative side of every thing that is exactly what you shall find.

For the Record- I am not trying to undermine the way you feel however as a nurse myself I felt my entire profession {including my self} was attacked by the generalizations made in your post. Giving you the benefit of a doubt perhaps that is the way nurses were where you worked but some of us do happen to be truly wonderful people who practice nursing for all the right reasons.
~peace out~

Bee -

I DO UNDERSTAND YOUR MISERY!!! I'm exhausted right now, but if you don't hear from me in the next 24 hrs, please pm me!! (I'd rather talk to you about my misery in private.)

Sue

Be insulted, I don't give a rats ***. Here, heres a rag covered with insult, breathe it in, suck it up. Part of what makes nursing so bad is that you can't say anything against the profession, you can't air these feelings you have without being jumped on by "professional" nurses like yourself. Plenty of people hate their jobs yet are damn good at it. I am a damn good nurse, but god help me if I say I hate my job...I mean calling, whatever it is. pfft.

I went to collage for 18 months, I have a diploma, I am accredited to administer morphine and do all kinds of highly technical tasks. I am "just an Enrolled nurse" or practical nurse, or whatever you call them where u are. It doesn't matter that I do almost exactly the same job, that my clinical skills are far in advance of some old biddy that trained in the hospital system 40 years ago, according to them all I am good for is wiping ***'s and I should be working in a nursing home because "Thats where EN's belong" and management, being of the same generation of the said Biddys, support them in this view. The unions are controlled by the hospitals and the government which is why our conditions have been staidaly bargined away over the years which is why you have to work all the crap shifts and have no social life to make a decent living. This is the recognition you get for nursing.

I work permanent night shifts through an agency and request specials (one on one nursing very sick patents) because of this institutionalised barstardry.

You know what, you are right about one thing though. When you focus on negitive things it brings you down All you see is just wanting to fight to protect your belief system that keeps you getting up in the morning and going to your ****ty job.

Hey Xbeejx, don't beat yourself up because you hate nursing. I've just recently changed from a career I did for 20 years, due to the same reasons you stated. I know how you feel.

You hate nursing fine by me I do not have a problem with your dislike the profession.

Blanket statements about every other nurse’s morals is inaccurate.

Making assumptions about an entire group of people's value based upon their profession is a stereotype.

It is much like making moral assumptions about some one based upon their sexual orientation, color of skin, ect. . . . .

Stigmas and stereotypes are very wrong no matter who they are applied to.

Now that you have treated me like crap for having a difference of opinion do you feel better about yourself?

You know what, you are right about one thing though. When you focus on negitive things it brings you down All you see is want to fight to protect your belief system that keeps you getting up in the morning and going to your ****ty job

Apparently you missed the part where I said I wasn't practicing nursing at this time.

So again your blanket assumptions proven to be inaccurate I do not have a ****ty job I would not stay at one I do not have to.

I have other professions I can make a living doing, and I do very well.

I do what I have to do to maintain my own sense of well being without assigning blame. . . I do not blame a profession I do not blame myself I simply accept I feel emotionally drained and need to get out of nursing . . . . . there is nothing wrong with that I have no need to make all nurses into villains . . . I have no need to stereotype it is illogical and inaccurate. . . . . I do not need to be a victim as it is unproductive.

I am not the one who feels like crap all the time. . . . . . . perhaps there is a reason for this.


I am guessing by you rather negative response you only want agreement because apparently you do not wish to change this. . .so do have fun. . . I will not be joining you because I think feeling like crap all the time would suck.

It is much like making moral assumptions about some one based upon their sexual orientation, color of skin, ect. . . . .


You know what, maybe its not nurses, maybe its just WOMEN!

You know what, maybe its not nurses, maybe its just WOMEN!

Or perhaps it's just Australian Nurses (or perhaps only the one's you've come in contact with)? But she does have a point... it's probably not wise (or nice) to make assumptions of this kind... even if in your locality such statements may be partially true. In general, simple absolute statements as applied to multi-variable situations such as this are often over-generalizations. :) (as well as a good way to start an argument... potentially causing a thread to be closed...)

Bee...

I am so sorry that your suffering from depression right now. Don't give up. Take care of yourself an hang in there...

As for me? Yes -- feeling like "crap" (most of the time) is a good way of putting it. Though I'm not clinically depressed... I do get frustrated when trying to find hope in things that feel out of control. Hope is a surivival mechanism. I wish I had something more helpful or professional to say.

With much sympathy...

~Ali

Men with ADD (http://www.addforums.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=59)

This is being nice. . . . . :D

xbeejx,
A couple of things come to mind.

I have been depressed all my life and my life is almost twice as long as yours, but I generally don't feel angry, as you do now. I read once that anger can replace sadness if you're not permitted to express the sadness. It's okay to cry. It's okay to wail. It's not going to make things better, but sometimes we just gotta sing the blues.


Secondly, I've never been a nurse, but I've heard that the positive thing about the job is that there are many different environments in which you can work. It sounds like you are in a hostile work environment right now. I know what it's like when you're constantly looking for another job, but maybe you should.
If not, maybe like me you'll have a miraculous breakthrough with co-workers and it will all change for the good. Interestingly, this happened after I cried in front of my boss when I was transitioning to new meds.

Well,i guess feeling like something( even it's a stinky comperacy) might be better than not feeling NOTHING AT ALL :( I started catching myself lately that things,simple everyday things that normally would get me happy,curious,upset and so on......lately,there's nothing,like no emotions.....it's scary and weird not to feel or care almost anything about :(.....so,hey,at least you're feeling something :) that's better than nothing. Get better:)

^^

Are you on SSRI's? I remember after being off citalopram for about 3 weeks I was walking down the street and I thought "man I feel so depressed" Suddenly I thought....I feel depressed!! I feel something!! And it gave me a joy that lasted a whole 2 days.


As for nursing, I had a terribbley disturbing shift on monday night where I had to look after a young man with ****zoaffective disorder and frontal lobe injury.

He was brought into the emergecy department by police having not threatened anybody or hurt anybody only preparing himself for people who he believed were coming to his house to kill him and his parents that night by putting a pitchfork out the front of his house and mothing alot of stuff about how he would fight them off.
His parents had called being more concerned for him than themselves.
He was brought into that emergency department and kept shackled, both arms both legs, and one restraint accross the chest. The nurse, senior to me who was looking after his medications was abusive and condasending and repeatedly used force against him when there was absolutlely no cause to. I was attacked by her and the in charge of the shift for objecting to his treatment and their subsequent treatment of me.
It was the very worst I have seen in the 7 years I have been nursing, (much of it in psych) and I have seen some dodgey ****.
That young man remained shakled to a bed for the whole 10 hour shift, medicated against his will for agitation primarily due to being shackled and cramped up because he couldn't moved, and because he was talked to like he was a piece of **** by this nurse who didn't hesitate to call in 4 burly security guards to further hold him down yet all the while him being more or less co-operative with me.
It was demeaning, invasive and degrading and I am in the process of writing a massive complaint about it.

I have seen nurses be violent, abusive but more than anything else I have seen so much neglect of patients, particually those who are in no position to complain.

Last night was the final straw, I was so disturbed by it that I am dropping everything to escape the profession and work a manual job at half the pay.
There are many many good nurses out there and even I will admit to not being as responsible as I should have due to time, my depression, stress or even my own irresponsibility which is part of the reason I want to leave. Mage, you live in a dream world. Nursing is a job that takes so much from you, phisically, spiritually, socially and financially (unless you work shifts your pay isn't that much above alot of ordinary jobs) and I'm sorry to say that gives back little in return and the fact that I come in here so depressed myself and all you can do is write monolog about how I shouldn't generalise nurses is a demonstration of nursing as a whole.

Thanks for your support everyone else. I wish I could say I was getting better or am better, I think I am getting somewhere very slowly but I am not sure where.
I won't post in this thread again

Later
B

B, what is your course of action in reporting inappropriate behaviour on your shift? What is the chain of command?

There is a shortage of nurses worldwide and wages are good in most places.

There is a shortage of nurses worldwide and wages are good in most places.

Maybe the pay is good in the countries we live in but not necessarily where xbeejx lives. He sure isn't describing practices that I have ever witnesses. Abusing patents not only can{and frequently does} lead to law suites but if verified can become criminal charges here in the US.

His description of events would constitute patent abuse here the US,{and to me as a person} even if one was an ER physic admit. Here it is considered a violation of a person's human rights to be shackled for 10 hours without being allowed to move freely about. . . to be medicated against their will requires an act of congress. I do not know about Australia sounds like it maybe very different there. Physic nursing sounds like a nightmare, I have known people to loose their medical license for less offenses than the gross violations xbeejx speaks of.

I do agree however that if there is a system of reporting abusive incidents that would be the right thing to do {a well desereved going away present :rolleyes: }




Nursing is a job that takes so much from you, physically, spiritually, socially and financially (unless you work shifts your pay isn't that much above alot of ordinary jobs) and I'm sorry to say that gives back little in return

I agree nursing is very demanding work and drains a person in ways few other jobs ever could.


I come in here so depressed myself and all you can do is write monolog about how I shouldn't generalise nurses is a demonstration of nursing as a whole

My statement had little to do with nursing as a practice and every thing to do with other members here on ADDF. Describing your work and even the statements made about how you are sick of putting up with the crap at your work;even your feelings of being stepped on or treated harshly by co-workers wasn't a problem. I happen to think that being able to voice this is what support is all about. This last post quoted above I agree with totally as a person, and I understand your reasons for hating your job.

For Clarafication:
My statement of offense earlier had nothing to do with my agreement or disagreement, it had nothing to do with the nursing profession it had every thing to do with respecting other nurses who happen members here. Being depressed isn't a reason to be inconsiderate of other people's feelings. Even in my post, the one that caused you to get so upset I tried to be respectful of your feelings while being honest about the possible damage your accusations toward all nurses could cause other members.


I am a nurse with ADD and I am here as are you therefor it is reasonable to assume that we are not the only ADD nurses here on ADDF nor are we the only ADD nurses in this discussion. There is nothing wrong with being angry and judging by your description of events you have every right {I never claimed other wise} I can see where having to put up with this sort of situation day in and day out plus working night shift would make you feel like crap all the time.

Hey things didn't even get this bad for me and I left the nursing profession and yes my present employment is an improvement. I have to work physically harder but I don't have all the mental BS to put up with. I feel at the present time it is a good exchange, I feel it is more healthful than working in a job I hate with supervisors that couldn't even manage their own excrement much less be remotely qualified to manage a unit.

I did however work with a few other nurses who were nice people but were simply caught up in the same garbage. I was lucky in that I had other options and I feel bad they felt they did not. It is perfectly fine to call feces feces I of that I have no qualms however it is not alright to do so at the expense of other members feelings on the basis of their profession. The generalization that all nurses{meaning all of them every where} were abusive was the problem. Other ADD nurses here maybe struggling with their own self esteem and functioning, they may feel like crap all the time themselves which is why they may have been drawn to this thread. The last thing they needed was to be labeled abusive based up on a generalization,that was my only contention.

My response wasn't a reflection of nurses in general or even of women it is a reflection of who I am as a person.

I tend to take up for people who are unable to take up for themselves kind of like what you did for that patent who was being treated poorly. I also happen to understand first hand what it is like to be treated like crap because you are willing to stand up for what is right, and yes it does suck.

Maybe I am more like you than you care for which is why I made you so angry. It wasn't my intention to cause anger only to defend others who did not feel like they could do so for themselves. I have been reading this thread sense it began but felt no need to interfere until an entire profession was assaulted. . . a profession I do not care for but continues to include a few people I do.

OKay now that we have each had our little say is there any way we can move this discussion along?

The topic being . . . .

Does any one else feel like crap ALL the time.


Should you feel the need to continue the discussion about generalizations it can be done via PM. It is not proper to continue to disrupt the discussion.

A quick reminder flaming is not allowed even in PM.


Thank you. . . . .

I cant always stay on topic its boring,I like the way the things change and evolve during a thread its like a conversation, I don't like being put in a box and being told to stay there. This is not meant to be offensive but I don't like being fenced in. Open to solutions to what it is that you find irritating about people going off topic. J.

Have you ever checked out the possibility of Borderline Personality Disorder? This goes beyond depression. Something worth checking into. I have ADHD and BPD so I do understand. You have some serious issues treat. Hating yourself where you feel worthless and always feeling like people mis treat you, trust issues etc..etc. I hope you seek therapy and get the help that you need.

I have found that the nursing field has more than its share of bullies. That is why I'll never work in a hospital ward. When I was a student there, it was hell. (Not quite a 'healing profession'.)

Part of the problem is really explained well with sociology's 'oppression theory'.


http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0FSL/is_6_78/ai_111895683

An oppressed group (female, nurses) tries to exert domination from within, upon subgroups of the weaker members (e.g. students, 'baccalaureate bashing', those with 'differences', males, visible minorities, etc).

Another example of oppression theory at work is the racist toothless, redneck KKK-er who wants to be 'one rung of the ladder' above the person of color. (Oppressing SOMEONE -- gives him some self-esteem -- no matter how pathetic his ill-gotten dominance.)

Female bullying is just way more sneaky and much less obvious than male-style bullying. (e.g. sabotage, witholding vital info, gossip, witholding assistance/care, ostracizing, duplicity, backstabbing & various other strategies of 'crazy-making')

Part of the problem is the 'bystander' phenomenon (e.g. Karpman's Triangle). People just watch maltreatment and bullying. Noone is brave enough to intervene. Everyone is afraid to take on the bullies. This acts as a maintainer.

My OWN solution is to avoid working in a place heavily staffed by RNs. I'd rather work more autonomously and on a Multi-Disciplinary team. (e.g. work in a community-based clinic).

Lets try this another way

All people who generalize are wrong. . . . .are we getting it yet?

There are cut throats and jerks in every profession and there are compassionate, good people in every profession possible exception would be paid assassins.

Now can any one of you ADDers connect it feeling like crap all the time?

An oppressed group tries to exert domination from within, upon subgroups of the weaker members.

I have seen this.
Why aren't the oppressed group pulled together
instead of ripped apart in an attempt to mimic?
I think that it's a morality-dependent 'call'.

I cant always stay on topic its boring,I like the way the things change and evolve during a thread its like a conversation, I don't like being put in a box and being told to stay there. This is not meant to be offensive but I don't like being fenced in. Open to solutions to what it is that you find irritating about people going off topic. J.


Well the request isn't about boxes it is about respect for the original person who posed a question. If I wanted to know about a subject. Lets say I wanted to know weather or not others with ADD could touch the tip of their nose with the end of their tongue I because I felt like I was alone and every one began talking about being able to touch their elbows to their knees I would feel ignored.

Conversations evolve this is true then there are rabbit trails. The generalization topic was more of a rabbit trail that seemed to have gotten out of hand. xbeejx did re-mention it therefore I shall leave the direction of this discussion up to him. This is his thread and I do wish to respect his needs and concerns.

Now can any one of you ADDers connect it feeling like crap all the time?All of the time? No. I feel like crap when I'm sick or injured and that isn't very often. If I was sick all of the time, I would try to get help.

'feel like crap' 'ALL'

For all of us - explaining how we feel is next to impossible (meaningfully),
to another
What's our plane of reference?
Calibrated on a series of events perhaps - your child's first birthday?
The first time you lost in a competitive sport?
One's first time away from home?

Maybe - but unlikely.

On these pages - the pain which is most often described is exerted through 'mental torture.'

Pain which is amplified by virtue of mind.

Why of any importance to this current discussion?

Perhaps the realisation that when one is feeling pain ('mental'ly induced pain - the pain of depression, anxiety) that paining others to alleviate one's own pain - perhaps is unwise
- actually won't work.

Above - the observation was made that a group being oppressed will attempt to oppress.
This is a legacy from the days when we were animals.
Enforcing a physical hierarchy.

Since mind - and logical hierarchy of storage of information - all physical hierarchies are 'off the menu' - only problem is that nobody has particularly enforced this point - the point that any physical hierarchy better be supported by a logical hierarchy - or it's doomed to failure ...

... otherwise expressed, that if somebody would like to instruct you in how better to go about your business - that they had better be in a position of *real* higher knowledge in that domain - treating the 'physical hierarchy' as a transition towards imparting their knowledge on an apprentics ...

... or otherwise put - that the physical hierarchy of our world - in the process of our realisation - is that of collaborative teaching the less experienced into a 'place' where - if we've done our job well ... that they will surpass us.

This, I think is the problem - which you and many of us are having.
It's nothing to do with a specific group 'nurses' and singling them out - is going to prove to be a form of 'mental torture' to others who are good urses.

There are good people everywhere.

I prefer to see the 'bad' as 'good' in the making
... a couple of pushes, gentle education

and one will see that any notion of one being better to another is deeply flawed - at least now - in our current state of evolution.

Perhaps this basic idea will help to illustrate that an 'all guns blazing' attack on these notional others will fail.
The notional others are just us guys in the process of switching.

One of the tell-tale signs though - carrying on the theme from 'Lost' - is that the lost - in desperate search for meaning - turn around and invent meaning.

Just as you stated - these meanings tend to be completion in an inflexible manner - systems, protocols - self-confounding mechanisms intended to set us free - which actually serve to maintain us in lower position - imprisoned by their flexibility. Paperwork and protocol pushers - who lose the point and pursue the protocol instead of its intended goal (in my field - the empiricists of scientific research who believe only in the method - and not the science which the method is meant to be leading them towards) -

- {pointless paper work, protocol followers} ... represents (just as you mention) - the sign of a 'culture' which will be difficult for us to handle.
We see it as pointless.
The problem though when we go about change by simply trying to 'attack' these people - actually through their systems ...

... change comes through the realization that the systems are pointless - within the minds of those people - and then the 'battle' is won - for all.
A happy ending (as it were).

Anyhow that was an -<- IMHO presentation -<-

:-)

sorry - in a rush on that last post (sunny here !)

1.good urses. ->- good nurses.
2.imprisoned by their flexibility ->- imprisoned by their INflexibility

Perhaps the realisation that when one is feeling pain ('mental'ly induced pain - the pain of depression, anxiety) that paining others to alleviate one's own pain - perhaps is unwise
- actually won't work.


No this doesn't work ; it merely isolates us and furthers our own suffering.

Above - the observation was made that a group being oppressed will attempt to oppress.
This is a legacy from the days when we were animals

I nice way of saying this, better than I would have done.



All of the time? No. I feel like crap when I'm sick or injured and that isn't very often. If I was sick all of the time, I would try to get help.


Most times I would agree however judging the incidence described in his post

Personally I think xbeejx needs to get out. . . out of where he is at.

You want to feel better xbeejax get the **** out and don't look back, don't look back even long enough to blame because you will only take the place with ya. . . as long as you place the blame of your emotions and actions upon another {them} you give that other person{the one who treat you like crap} the power to control you and your reactions. By accepting your emotions as your responsibility and your actions your choice for your own sanity you puts the power of your own direction and your own emotional well being back into your own hands. Who do you want controlling you emotions or happiness? Yourself or that witch at work who spoke to you like a dog and who back bites who ever she has to to get what she wants? This I know from my own experiences and you can take it to the bank of life and find it as truth. I didn't learn this by sitting on my *** in roses and bliss I am not getting these words from some distant sterile study pulled up on a computer screen. I walked out of that same hell . . . . .


Working some where where people treat you like crap and treats people they are supposed to be helping like animals well I can see where this would leave one feeling tired and angry. So working in a crap job, during crap hours for people who are crappy can and often does lead to the feeling of crap all the time.

There are good nurses and good facilities then there are hell holes. . . . an co-worker cannibals who eat their own young. . .. . this I never denied. I simply will not generalized because I know the truth.

Am I the only one here who realizes the original poster with whom I became offended the person who became so upset with me is himself a nurse. When he makes such generalizations toward all nurses he also speaks of himself. One needs to respect them selves before expecting others to give respect . If you sir are indeed an abusive nurse who is a back stabber as you have classified all nurses then nothing I say can change that. I do not think this i is case other wise you would not feel such strong emotions. . .

Those nurses who do eat the own young are people who are numb They do not care. . .in their own minds they do not have to . . . see . . . they blame all their bad behavior on others refusing to accept the responsibility for their own mistreatments of patents who come in for care or who trample down their peers like you and laugh in your face when you need help . . . see they simply justify their actions in the light of it being the another persons fault. . . . .normally the very person they are victimizing.


I left nursing shortly before my thread "ADD logic and Social dysfunction" I posed it in early Dec 2006. There in describes my latest exodus from the nursing profession. I was not a happy camper however I do realize that there are still good people who are nurses whom I had to leave behind.Many like xbeejx feeling stuck and angry. . . I have no doubt he is a goods nurse other wise this would not bother him. . .patents rights would not matter. . . . hate me all you wish xbeejx however I do not have to hate you back See I have been where you are and done all that hate and ugliness but not any more I walked out of hell . . .I left it behind . . I live there no more.
I do hope this is sinking in because it is the truth Weather you like it or me is irrelevant. I do not feel like crap all the time and despite your insults I am telling you the truth of how to escape I also know when you have enough pain you will. . . .until then your anger has served its purpose as have I. .. Do as you see fit the choice is yours.

May a rightful decision be yours xbeejx. . . . .peace out

You guys are scaring me! I just got excepted into nursing school (professional component) and I have already been worried enough! Most girls don't seem to like me for some reason maybe because I don't like gossip or people that talk bad about other people which sadly is what most people do these days. Now reading this thread I'm scared nurses are the worst at being mean. Please tell me I'm wrong! You guys make it sound like nursing is a horrible job!

I don't like gossip or people that talk bad about other people which sadly is what most people do these days.Another generalization?

Depression is the worst thing I have experience in my life so far... How did I get through it you may ask? I have been in therapy mostly on.

I have been on alot of meds but know I am down to Celexa and it really helped especially when the dr added Strattera to the combination.
I did some research and the 2 together work well, infact strattera helps the celexa work better.

Medication is not the only answer if fact is only part of the equation. One of the other things is I found that helping someone else helped me get out of my problems and make a good friend. Yes, Mary is a senior citezen, but I did alot for her and went tothe grocery store with here. It is a big help when you have something else to concentrate your energy on.

The other thing that has helped me take responsiblity for me is a puppy who is now 2 yrs old and a bundle of energy. I am compleltely responsible for her and have to think about her needs . I do get assistance from my sister now and then when she was sick, she took us to the vet. I paid half of the bill and she paid half. That is the only time. Penny , is the best medicine I have ever had.

I've been watching a small group of 'lost' individuals.

First comes the unified front - in which reality is lost as (it seems) - a set of 3 people are able to define local realities.

What follows in this strange world of red tape, paper work and commanding others to obey their rule - comes this incredible clinging to hierarchy.
One must not challenge their hierarchy - nor the systems they bring in.

A local false reality now exists.

Their insecurity becomes apparent - but only to us - not to them.
They continue to re-inforce one another - and with time - the triplet diverge further from reality.

They alienate themselves - and then the observation which you describe.

They validate themselves by invalidating others who do not keep to their protocols - regardless of whether the others need keep to their protocols.

Next - their own blindness to their own behaviour leads to the apparence - to one and all - of their false realities - their bad ways.

The three which I have in mind did exactly this - and the sad thing is that between 5 and 10 people have left because of them.
Original thinkers kicked out - because they're different.

Here're some more markers of this sort of grouping.
They find it difficult to understand subjectivity and objectivity.
Because when 'they' think it is better - it is better.

Willing to shout, scream, rant - be rude - all acceptable to their local reality.
The false reality breaks other components of their 'residual' reality - and they lose the capacity to see when they're behaving inappropriately (outside of their domain of 'expertise').

Particularly gifted in using words which mean nothing - they use the motto - 'we're politicians.'
Politicians are characterized here as vacuous individuals whose only interest is self-interest.
The guys who I am referring to are pursuing only self-interest.
The actual domain in which we work plays second fiddle to their own agenda.

In this case - pay, title, trips to other countries, chargeable computers - and 'working from home' days - approaching a half of their working period - when it isn't actually allowed.

So - yes - I have seen the oppressed become the oppressor just a little too easily, and then the validation of self by invalidation of others.

And all because they're blind to the big picture - the *actual* point of what they do.

This is a human thing though.
*Not* a nurse thing.
And any observations relating to nurses - probably reflect a reaction to their treatment by doctors.
Such hierarchy in a profession where - by rights - none should exist.

I've spent the majority of my career in Departments of Medicine at Oxford and Cambridge - and was often shocked at the 'militaristic' delivery of hierarchy in these Institutions.

-*-

The difference between the oppressed who turn into oppressor, as opposed to the oppressed who confront oppressor (though) - is of incredible importance to us here.

The difference resides within personal morality.

Personal morality is a function of mind, and ADDers have a mind of different structure to nonADDers - which engenders a difference in morality - which in turn makes ADDers more likely to confront oppressor [xbeejx observation] or to react badly to nastiness towards others [Danigus observation].
Although good - the effect on the ADDer can be to the ADDers detriment (as xbeejx describes) - it's not easy to go against the flow - it might be right - but being 'correct' hurts.

Therein lies an explanation of the contextual disorder which tails ADD.
Contextual disorder is the pain of ADDers having to live in a world of nonADDers.

It needn't be painful - in truth - the more ADD - the more one should avoid circumstances where inflexibility pervades.
We can't just do something without questioning its utility.

->-the pain of ADDers having to live in a world of nonADDers->-
...more specifically -here-
- xbeejx having to put up with systems which are pointless - to his mind
- or Danigus having to listen to backbiting.

If of any help - the generalizations which have been made (which shouldn't really be made) - are signs of a dawning in awareness of the poor way in which we treat one another - not in its worsening.
It's real tempting to see this dawning awareness as a sign of these problems becoming more prevalent - but *no* - ***really*** - not at all
- the first steps towards eradication of a problem - is identifying it.

I am absolutely convinced - after observing this behaviour for 11/2 years now (yes - as the bullied party) - that this is a particular characteristic of nonADD
*but* that there is hope - it's just a case of finding the magic key which breaks their 'system' of reality.

In my case - I needed to run rings around them - rings which they couldn't see - but which were apparent from the reactions of people dissimilar to them - and higher than these guys ... in their cherished hierarchical system of functioning.

As one climbs the true logical hierarchy of knowledge - physical hierarchy fades.
Humility of a real deep understanding that we're all either nothing or equivalent somethings.

I mean - someone being 'worth' more than someone else - nope ...
nope - that's silly.

Please fire away if there's anything here which seems unclear.
I really have been watching these 3 boys, 1 girl now - since June 05 ... and their set behaviour is remarkably predictable.

Particularly in their incapacity to use logic properly - especially when it's a delicate logical jump - into unchartered territory.

:-)

Nurses arent bad.
Nursing isn't bad.

These generalization don't mean anything.

The truth is more a function of two types of 'mind' - these two types are often call ADD and nonADD minds.

And yes - ADD is just that important - it's the sign of a change in our species.

Truly - man is evolving - and when I was taught exactly how to view the speciation event - sure enough - morality was the key to my understanding.

ADDF:: member Stabile describes ADDers as having 'enforced moral consistency' due to the different structure of mind which we possess.
Incidentally - this different structure also presents as the fundamental difference between ADDer and nonADDer.

Nearly 3000 posts chasing down the nature of this change - and I really do have to admit to being in awe at the remarkable array of end-effects which a simple :-) alteration ins tructure of mind can deliver.

:-)

This thread is killing me :-)

---corrections---
...1...
Nurses arent bad. ->- Nurses aren't bad.
...2...
these two types are often call ADD and nonADD minds.
->-
these two types are the ADD and nonADD minds.
...3...
morality was the key to my understanding.
->-
viewing the difference between ADDer and nonADDer from the perspective of 'morality' - was the key to my understanding.
...4...
alteration ins tructure of mind can deliver.
->-
alteration in structure of mind can deliver.

Penny , is the best medicine I have ever had.Auntchris, that is so sweet.

yep she is the medicine I can take anytime, even take a break and take some more... you guessed it she is my puppy dog. Dogs aare forgiving and give ten time back... the morning licks i get to wake up... I love doggie kisses.

Whoa! I guess my meds aren't really working because I am completely confused about this thread! I wasn't saying anything bad about anyone. I wasn't meaning to make any generalizations. I was kind of just trying to let the others who were making nursing seem horrible that maybe they should watch what they say. I obviously know every single hospital in the whole world isn't filled with horrible nurses explained in this thread. I was definitely not saying all people talk about people behind their back, I know thats not true. Sorry for any confusion, but I'm confused because I was being completely nice and innocent in my post but I feel like some of you didn't take it that way.

Please tell me if I took you the wrong way.......

By the way, I am still excited about nursing school. If I was dumb enough to believe their stereotype I would definitely have changed my mind.

I guess that the trick here is to take out the observations which have lead to some false conclusion - and to get them back on the right path.
I haven't seen any other attacks on the nursing community since I've been here, but have been a part of threads/PMs where the medical, military and bureaucratic establishments have been mentioned 'unfavourably'.
ADDers don't do well in inflexible environments. In environments where we're forced to perform activities which conflict with self. To think in a manner which is alien to us.

The problems come when we react inappropriately to our perception of the problem.

A proper reaction to the perceived problem may help to alleviate that problem.

Fighting in its most belligerent sense will accomplish nothing, particularly.

The goal is to pull the others through into 'your space' - not to re-inforce their position in 'their space.'
And the other (to repeat) piece of advice would be to *know* that you are not mad, broken, wrong - but at the same time - not to swagger under the knowledge that your are sane, correct - because that will only serve to maintain the status quo ... a status quo in which we are made to feel pain.

An appreciation of the mental torture which some exert upon others (often inadvertently) - is the appreciation which helps us to put an end to all of the unpleasantness.

We're not alone - and so should behave accordingly.

Would we like it if our neighbour sold his garden off as a sewage treatment centre?
Probably not - so perhaps we should try and avoid dumping on him :-)

You guys are scaring me! I just got excepted into nursing school (professional component) and I have already been worried enough! Most girls don't seem to like me for some reason maybe because I don't like gossip or people that talk bad about other people which sadly is what most people do these days. Now reading this thread I'm scared nurses are the worst at being mean. Please tell me I'm wrong! You guys make it sound like nursing is a horrible job!

Re-cap

There are good nurses and good facilities then there are hell holes. . . . an co-worker cannibals who eat their own young. . .. . this I never denied. I simply will not generalized because I know the truth.


Nurses arent bad.
Nursing isn't bad.

These generalization don't mean anything.

The truth is more a function of two types of 'mind' - these two types are often call ADD and nonADD minds.

Yes some nurse are not nice people while others are wonderful people. The behaviors are being described in context of the nursing profession because that is what xbeejx does for a living. He is being treated badly while working as a nurse. Had he been a CPA and been experiencing the same treatment then the thread would have been written in context of the profession of a CPA.

Also it is good to remember all countries are different, different countries have different medical systems. In this discussion alone are people from four different countries, UK, US, Canada, Australia . This falls in line with different employers have different atmospheres just as different type of nursing offered different challenges.

Which is what I meant by

All people who generalize are wrong. . . . .are we getting it yet
{ALL Irony intended naturally- :D }


There are cut throats in every profession. SB isn’t a nurse yet he puts up with the same crap.


The three which I have in mind did exactly this - and the sad thing is that between 5 and 10 people have left because of them.
Original thinkers kicked out - because they're different.

So yea where there is “social hierarchy" there is bound to be a mucho feces. . . . :soapbox:




Whoa! I guess my meds aren't really working because I am completely confused about this thread! I wasn't saying anything bad about anyone. I wasn't meaning to make any generalizations. I was kind of just trying to let the others who were making nursing seem horrible that maybe they should watch what they say

Apparently missing
I got ya covered (http://www.addforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=398701&postcount=8)

Judging by the response I believe my point was received. . . .not well received but I am not too picky really . . ..I don't have any preconceived notions about others. . . as long as they remain within the guidelines I do not have to and so I do not bother.






Please tell me if I took you the wrong way.......

My interpretation of events. . .



Post #27

Lets try this another way

All people who generalize are wrong. . . . .are we getting it yet?

There are cut throats and jerks in every profession and there are compassionate, good people in every profession possible exception would be paid assassins.

okay then we have

Post #34

Most girls don't seem to like me for some reason maybe because I don't like gossip or people that talk bad about other people which sadly is what most people do these days.

which resulted in

Post #35

Another generalization?

I have made this generalization point at nauseam. . . then I one line it out but in less than 10 post after my statement here comes your post with more . . .nope no ADD a round here. . . . we as a group are soo smooth – :p :p :p

I do not see Imnapl as mad only noting this particular event which is soo ADDF . . . . . :faint:


By the way, I am still excited about nursing school. If I was dumb enough to believe their stereotype I would definitely have changed my mind

Good to hear it . . . .

I think the worse thing you can do is let stereotyping and stigmas{especially if they aren't even your own} make up your mind for you. ;)