View Full Version : 1st day on Desoxyn after being on dextroamphetamine


phrenic
06-22-07, 12:37 AM
Today my psych wrote me a script for 5mg Desoxyn, 3x a day. It's my
first day and I'm pretty optimistic based on what I read about this med
and my past experience with stimulants.

I have tried Strattera, at a low dose it gave me insomia with no benefits for my ADHD.

Tried generic Ritalin, gave me euphoria the very first time and after
that all my other attempts with this med only made my heart pump real
fast, no benefits whatsoever. I was also taking it at a low dose since I am
sensitive to stimulants, equivalent to 5mg of dextroamphetamine.

Before today dextroampetamine at 10 - 15 mg a day worked really good
for my ADHD...I could focus well especially for work (I'm a computer
programmer), I think before I react...or over react rather! (helped with my
romantic relationship for sure!) and got me out of bed in the morning.

BUT the side effects drove me crazy...insomia was pretty bad and my
appetite was really at an all time low. Also gave me back and neck
pains and I would also feel mild shooting pain in my arms, like my veins would feel a little pinched. Very tolerable but worrysome (has anyone experienced this with stimulants?).

So anyway I heard about Desoxyn in this site and liked what people wrote about it: great help with focus plus less side effects than Dexadrine and Adderrall. ADHD has been really affecting my professional, financial and romantic life a lot more recently that I was willing to shell out extra $ for Desoxyn (my insurance needs prior authorization to cover this so I'll have to work on that as soon as I'm sure Desoxyn is for me).

I know I need to be on meds because my ADHD is severe but I would stop for weeks because I just couldn't take the side effects of dextroamphetamine on a regular basis.

Today my doc first suggested Adderall but I've read and heard time and time again that this med causes a lot of side effects. Knowing how sensitive I am to stimulants I asked my doc for Desoxyn. I knew the pharmacy downstairs carries it because I asked before meeting with my doc. Doc had to pull out a book since he'd never heard of this drug before (pretty common experience of other members of this forums with their docs, so I read). He also called the pharmacy downstairs and asked for more information from the main guy.

I heard him ask the pharmacist if Adderall was also available in stock so I was worried he would ask me to try Adderall before Desoxyn. I didn't want to spend more $ and waste more time if I needed to come back to tell him I reacted badly on Adderall that is known to give a lot side effects, knowing how sensitive I am to them, while another drug that reportedly gives the least side effects is available in stock.

For some reason after he hanged up the phone he said "All right I'll let you try Desoxyn"! :)

I took one dose and for dinner I actually had a full sized meal! Chicken and a lot of rice! So far so good. Although I don't get the really good focus and energy dextroamphetamine gives me, in fact I think I can fall asleep right now. But it's my first day and I like how well I'm tolerating it. Tomorrow I'll up the dose a little bit.

That pharmacist is great too in my doc's building, they once special ordered dextroamphetamine by Mallinkrodt for me since I figured it might be the Barr kind that gave me all the nasty SE's. Mallinkrodt was too mild for me though at 5mg while 10mg was too stimulating, pretty odd.

Bottomline, ask and you shall receive! (Sorry for you folks in Canada who are in search for Desoxyn though. Oh well, at least your health care is way better than the US'!)

lars
06-22-07, 02:22 PM
That pharmacist is great too in my doc's building, they once special ordered dextroamphetamine by Mallinkrodt for me since I figured it might be the Barr kind that gave me all the nasty SE's. Mallinkrodt was too mild for me though at 5mg while 10mg was too stimulating, pretty odd.
Hi phrenic, and welcome to the forums.

I can relate very well about what you said about 5mg of Mallinckrodt IR dex compared to the effects of the 10mg Mallinckrodt IR dex. I have found that two of the 5mg Mallinckrodt IR tablets to be much more effective for me than taking one of the 10mg Mallinckrodt IR tablets. I have found that the 5mg Mallinckrodt tablets are indistinguishable from the 5mg Dexedrine tablets.

I am happy that your Dr was willing to prescribe you Desoxyn. I can relate very well to the way described the effects of the Desoxyn. In fact, that is why I am currently not taking it. I need the extra stimulation that the dextroamphetamine provides me. I enjoyed the Desoxyn, but I really need the extra boost that the dex provides me for sitting through long lectures, or long labs.

Keep us posted on how the Desoxyn works out for you.

QueensU_girl
06-22-07, 02:28 PM
I know you think I'm being a smartarse, but try adding good hard cardio to help your focus. It truly does work. 10 mins of warmup and 25-30 mins/day.

phrenic
06-22-07, 03:27 PM
I am happy that your Dr was willing to prescribe you Desoxyn. I can relate very well to the way described the effects of the Desoxyn. In fact, that is why I am currently not taking it. I need the extra stimulation that the dextroamphetamine provides me. I enjoyed the Desoxyn, but I really need the extra boost that the dex provides me for sitting through long lectures, or long labs.

Keep us posted on how the Desoxyn works out for you.I agree, I love the boost dex gives. If not for the crazy side effects I would have stopped my search for the right meds and would gladly stick with dex.

It's Day #2 for me now on the Desoxyn and I actually had to up my dose which I've never done on the other meds I've tried. It makes me sooooo sleepy and sedated! 3 co-workers told me I look tired even though I had a good night's rest.

I love how I'm tolerating it though...I'm actually in the mood for lunch right now and I'm not drinking a thousand gallons of water every hour (on dex I do!). I can focus and I'm not bouncing all over the place like I usually am without meds but it does not give me the boost dex does. On the contrary I'm thinking of taking my dex left overs just to get some work done!

I just left my doc a message asking if I can up the dose. Since I'm tolerating Desoxyn so well I don't want to give up just yet.

phrenic
06-22-07, 03:31 PM
I know you think I'm being a smartarse, but try adding good hard cardio to help your focus. It truly does work. 10 mins of warmup and 25-30 mins/day.Maybe the fact that Desoxyn is well-tolerated by my "sensitive to stims" body but not giving me the energy I need for my work is a good thing because now I'll be forced to exercise regularly along with my med-use.

If only it wasn't so expensive!!!!!!!!!

Dextroamphetamine, as effective as it was for me, didn't push me to exercise because I already had all the energy I needed.

I'm buying a pedometer today. I am gonna start thinking of exercising the same way I think of meds...EVERYDAY with holidays on weekends! ;)

lars
06-22-07, 08:10 PM
It makes me sooooo sleepy and sedated! 3 co-workers told me I look tired even though I had a good night's rest. Yeah, I know what you mean.

You might want to consider talking to your Dr about another drug called Focalin. It's a single isomer of methylphenidate, in the same way that Dexedrine is a single isomer of amphetamine. I found Focalin to be quite similar to Desoxyn with regard to it's lack of negative side effects, and at the same time I found Focalin to be almost as stimulating as Dexedrine. The only down side was the fact that Focalin was just too expensive for me.

Last year I tried a combo of Focalin along with Desoxyn, and I also tried a combo of Focalin with Dexedrine. The hope was that since methylphenidate (or dexmethylphenidate in the case of Focalin) is considered to be more of a dopamine reuptake inhibitor, and since amphetamine (dextroamphetamine & methamphetamine in the case of Dexedrine & Desoxyn) is considered to be more of a dopamine agonist, that the two would work together synergistically to produce an equal or better result from less drug.

So, while one drug (dextroamphetamine or methamphetamine) had a tendency to activate dopamine, the other drug (dexmethylphenidate) had a tendency to delay the reuptake of dopamine thereby allowing the dopamine that had been activated to saturate the synaptic clefts that much longer than they normally would be saturated with dopamine.

The specific idea behind this was that by taking a smaller dose of amphetamine, along with a small dose of dexmethylphenidate, that I would be able to achieve a much smaller overall effective dose. It did just that. For example, my normal dose of Dexedrine is 20 mg per dose. However I discovered that by taking 10 mg of Dexedrine along with 5 mg of Focalin that the results were the same if not better than taking 20 mg of Dexedrine alone. The Dexedrine & Ritalin combination turned out to be effective too, however the side effects of the Ritalin made it something that I did not like.

The experiment with Desoxyn and Focalin was something that I only got to experiment with at a much smaller than normal dose due to the fact that I was unable to afford a full prescription of Desoxyn at the time, so my Dr had to write it for fewer pills than I would normally get prescribed at my request so I could afford to buy it. However, I found that it too worked out well for me like the Dexedrine/Focalin combo, however it was just too expensive for me.

PS I got this idea from another member here at the ADHD Forums. His member name was/is MasterRat, and I will always be grateful for him sharing this idea with me. It had worked for him, and it sounded like something that might work for me too. My Dr was intrigued by the idea, and told me that he had never tried it before. He was as pleased with the results as I was.

phrenic
06-22-07, 08:29 PM
You might want to consider talking to your Dr about another drug called Focalin. I spoke to my doc on the phone today and I said I love the tolerance my body has for Desoxyn but I miss the push of Dex.

He suggested Adderall again and I one more time feel sooo hesitant because I am very sensitive to stimulants I don't even drink green tea because I get so edgy on it (but I can drink coffee....isn't that odd!).

I will research Focalin before I meet with him so he knows how serious I am about finding the right med and dosage.

Thanks, Lars!

phrenic
07-15-07, 02:30 AM
Desoxyn was only sedating for me the very first time I took it. It behaved more like the stimulant it is afterwards although less potent than dextroamphetamine and Adderall.

It gives much less mental crash Adderall curses me with (my doc made me try Adderall after Desoxyn), if any, and much less of the physical side
effects from dextroamphetamine like the neverending thirst, insomnia, jitters and dizzyness.

I got 2 nosebleeds though about 8 days after taking Desoxyn which made me paranoid enough to go to ER. It also made my left hand slightly numb. The doc in ER said it could be the heat that caused my nosebleeds but it has been hotter the previous weeks and summers (I live in Los Angeles) and I haven't gotten nosebleeds from the heat since I was a kid! A CT Scan later showed I was not suffering bleeding in my brain like I feared.

I left the ER with a diagnosis from the doctor that it was probably the
meds that caused my nosebleed given the timing of events.

I agree that it was Desoxyn that gave me nosebleeds as they only came a about a week after I started the drug and has not returned since I've stopped. But keep in mind that I am extremely sensitive to stimulants...especially meth as I tried recreational use of crystal meth some 4-5 stupid years ago and I experienced these really really awful side effects while the friends I took it with would not (we had pretty much the same height, weight, age and gender - I was 21 then). I've probably taken crystal less than 10 times in my life. I don't like uppers. I was born with AD/HD, born with uppers in my brain as I would say.

I thought Desoxyn would be different for me since it's not street meth.
But I guess when it comes to meth I should just stay away even when it's taken at small dosages.

Other side effects from Desoxyn was this irritability feeling, not too pronounced but distinct enough for me to need a 5 mg diazepam (Valiums) sometimes to smoothen the edges.

The most I took of Desoxyn was 20 mg in one day. Usually 10 mg per dose. That's nothing for most people.

My doc had me try Adderall after Desoxyn and I loved it the first few 2-3 times but now it does nothing for me except give me a headache and makes me go through this bad crash.

I've been exercising most days for the last week and I have to say,
docs should be writing scripts for exercise and only giving AD/HD meds to people who exercise, if situation permits! I've never felt better. My AD/HD is still there but it's easier for me now to harness the positives of AD/HD and I am slowly feeling what no drug in the world can give consistently: MOTIVATION. Probably from the happy hormones physical exertion gives.

I'm not 100% anti-meds for AD/HD (I'm going back to dextroamphetamine and only taking it when I crucially need it) but I believe now after trying several meds (including Strattera) that other healthier options should be employed first or parallel with the meds. Docs can't stop stressing enough how important exercising is. An absolute must for our kind.

I am in a good place right now, med-free and exercise-hungry =)

Tomorrow I am going hiking!

katatak
08-01-07, 10:53 PM
To my knowledge, Desoxyn is not available in Canada! The only two stimulant medications are Dexedrine, Adderal, Methylphenidate, some extended release forms of methylphenidate. and Focalin.

Cheers,
Katatak

Jackinbox
08-07-07, 08:57 PM
What's the cost of Desoxyn and Focalin?

lars
08-07-07, 10:20 PM
What's the cost of Desoxyn and Focalin?Desoxyn is $2.00 or more per pill, and Focalin XR is around $5.00 per pill.

Sorry, but I'm not sure about the price of immediate release Focalin.

PS You can print off a coupon from the Focalin XR website for a one month free trial. ;)

ben72227
08-08-07, 12:30 PM
I spoke to my doc on the phone today and I said I love the tolerance my body has for Desoxyn but I miss the push of Dex.

He suggested Adderall again and I one more time feel sooo hesitant because I am very sensitive to stimulants I don't even drink green tea because I get so edgy on it (but I can drink coffee....isn't that odd!).

I will research Focalin before I meet with him so he knows how serious I am about finding the right med and dosage.

Thanks, Lars!
Desoxyn isn't a stimulant???:confused:

It's the lab form of methamphetamine (i.e. what junkies make in their basements) - I would think it would be one of the more powerful stimulants???:confused: Most doctors I've seen are the type that as soon as they look it up in their little book and see that Desoxyn = methamphetamine they completely freak out.:(

Jackinbox
08-08-07, 08:08 PM
Is the price of Focalin the same no matter the dosage of the pill? If it's the case, at least it put the cap on the price at 150$/month. In case of Desoxyn, the monthly cost can be somewhere 120$ and 720$...

lars
08-08-07, 10:13 PM
Is the price of Focalin the same no matter the dosage of the pill?
I just did a search at the Walgreens website, and here are their prices for Focalin:

2.5 mg tablet = $55.99 for 60 tablets

5 mg tablet = $116.99 for 100 tablets

10 mg tablet = $163.99 for 100 tablets

There is a generic available which is more affordable, but I have no idea how it compares to the brand name.

PS I only referenced Walgreens because it was easy to search for a price there. I would never recommend Walgreens pharmacy to anyone due to how much they price gouge on prescription drugs.

LightShifter
09-11-07, 02:02 AM
Lars,

Above on 8/7/07 you said there is a voucher for a free trial of Focalin available at their web-site? I can find it at Novartis at all. Did the trial end? I would like to try it if I can get a free trial.

lars
09-11-07, 11:09 AM
I just checked the Focalin XR website, and it looks like it might not be available anymore.

I would suggest that you give them a call on their toll free number and ask them if it's still available. You can find their number at the Focalin XR website.

netsavy006
09-11-07, 02:34 PM
I think this trial ended. If it's still available it could be found on Focalin XR's site:

http://focalinxr.com/

JadeEmperor
07-30-08, 01:26 AM
I saw a couple of issues and questions about the difference between Desoxyn and Dexedrine and Adderall. There's amphetamine (Dexedrine) and then if the nitrogen molecule (the one that makes it an amine) has a methyl group (a carbon w/ three hydrogens and a sticky spot) it's methyl-(or meth-)-amphetamine (Desoxyn). Each addition of a methyl group smooths out the stimulant effect such that methyl-methy-amphetamine has a notably sedative effect. I understand that it's standard practice to dose Desoxyn about 25% higher than Dexedrine for equivalency and still it's supposed to be less jumpy. Then there's the l-isomer and the d-isomer which are mirror images like a left and right hand glove (isomer is a nickname for any chemical that has that handedness). The d-isomer (the right hand glove) is more of a mind effect as it clicks into the central brain functions but the l-isomer doesn't fit there but does things to the bodies water management system and kidneys - it's used in decongestants and usually labeled phenyl-iso-propylamine (same thing as l-amphetamine but using the IUC nomenclature, whatever). Adderall has some of the mixed d- and l- forms and that's what gives it the stronger side effect than Dexedrine which is all the d- isomer. If you waded through that then this is my favorite thing that even a lot of pharmacists don't know - and it's totally an aside: amphetamine (1889) was named by shortening it's formal chemical name - alpha [A] methyl [M] phenyl [PH] ethyl [ET] amine [AMINE] with the standard abreviations. I'm currently not taking medication and kind of fidgeting with the keyboard here, but I hope it's useful info. Oh, yeah; most street has more smuuch left over from the synthesis than pharmacy and most times some pretty questionable cut which accounts for it's often nasty side effects.