Hi everyone, first time for me on here so here goes.

My 18 year old was on Ritalin etc for about 4 years from the age of 4 then we took him off it because no matter what we tried we/he couldn't stand the zombie state even though we were giving him the minimum dosage and told to put it up continually anyway, what it did to his body but I guess you would all know that so no need to explain. My 13 year old has never been drug medicated but had neurotherapy and naturopathic treatment like my 18 year old with really not much success. The 13 year old is currently on Synaptol which is an American drug free product, for the 1st month with fish oil it was great but now the school are complaining and a teacher is refusing to teach him and his concentration just isn't there. My son is really frustrated that he cant learn, I think he is a little slow at understanding but the Pschologist at school thinks he is ADD and that is masking his ability to learn, some things he picks up really fast but others not at all no matter who explains it to him, he cant grasp them. Can anyone help with any feedback on successful drug free products they have used and also successful drugs that dont have the usual Ritalin etc type problems and turn him in to a zombie. The issue of medication is mine as you can see but I just cant submit my child to a day of waking up to feeling sick, losing his hair, pale skin, unable to smile and acting generally like a robot so that he can fit in to what the school call a normal child. Even giving my son the first Synaptol tablet I teared up thinking I am changing his personality. I really feel like I am hurting him by giving him one of these drugs after the bad experiences we have had, at home he is no problem what so ever. Please help me because I think I have tried everything non drug wise and dont know what to do or how I can do it or what sort of effects these things will have on him.

If your son was zombie-like on Ritalin, then something was really wrong, but I think you've probably heard it all before. There is lots of information on the forums about natural versus pharmaceutical treatments. Bottom line? There is no proof that natural treatments work for ADHD, but from what you've written, I guess you already know that too. Trust yourself.

Hi Imnapl, thanks for replying, I was beginning to think I did something wrong and nobody was going to reply. I will take your advice and look at the forum, being new on here I am still finding my way around the site. It is a very difficult decision to make but I guess you know that, I am so confused I really cant trust myself, my heart says I cant give him the drugs, I cant change him because he is a really beautiful, loving and faithful child who would never hurt anyone (except his twin sister because he does have a moderate anger management problem when he doesn't win or gets angry) and he is over the top I guess but as you can see I am looking for reasons to agree with the school to medicate him. Are there any medications out there that dont have to be continually put up dosage, non zombie-like, but with the benefits being very subtle and without having to get him hooked up on anti-depressants because of the side effects of the drugs ? We have to make a decision and fast on this so I really need as much help and advice as anyone can give me.
Thank you very much for replying again.
Rainbow.

rainbow i would stick with the meds maby not ritalin but trust me im 17 and was on and off Concerta for about a year and then i switched to Adderal not more than 2 weeks ago and fetl zombie like and sedated on Concerta but on Adderal i feel great! i can focus i can do things i would never have been able to do before and a thousand times better... meds are different for everyone you just have to find the right kind of meds for your kids i got lucky and found the right one for me on the second attempt some people are even luckier and get it on thier first attempt but for a lot i know its a hard and time consuming process but trust me in the end it is worth it

just keep trying different meds until he responds that its working like he thinks it should

just gotta hang in there

i would also like to add that before i even tryed any meds i was much like you except i was the one with ADD see before high school i was always EXTREMELY against any kind of meds that may alter who i am and i fought them and my parents for years until i got to high school and high school combined with a break up with my g/f of over a year (very long time in high school) i just couldnt keep up with anything so i decided to try the meds and let me tell you i would not change a thing i can focus i have the energy i do things that i used to ok.. or sort of alrite now absalutly genious like its a fantastic feeling i would keep going with it until your son reports positive results a lot of people report they have the "zombie" effect but the reason they continue searching for a better drug is because once they had that focus or w/e its very hard to turn back to being 100% ADD it can be very frustrating but eventually you will find a medicine that will give your son everything he needs and wants with out the negative side effects it just takes time

i wonder if your son has an undiagnosed LD?

It is really important to get this tested for (or retested).

Undiagnosed LDs lead to a lot of really negative outcomes for kids, esp. as they become adults.

Why is your child's HAIR FALLING OUT?

That is not ADD/ADHD or an LD.

I have only heard of that with toxicities (like thallium or 'chemo') or alopecia (auto-immune diseases) or thyroid deficiency, endocrine disorders (issues like PCOS in females), or male pattern baldness (high DHT).

Sounds uncommon, whatever it is.

Talk to your Doctor?

If he cannot understand "verbal" explanations, he could have an Auditory Memory impairment (can't remember what was said) or Auditory Processing disorder (CAPD; problem is with deciphering what they hear; mis-heard words).

You can look up CAPD (central auditory processing disorder) on Wikipedia.

Rainbow, how did Ritalin change your son's personality?

Hey Revz, thanks so much for your reply, it means so much more knowing you are going through it, not being a sufferer myself I am on the outside so your advice is invaluable to me. It must be so hard to live with it yourselves and I do wonder if I am being totally selfish not wanting to change him, he is very easygoing but when the pressure is put on he explodes and then the tears and it is so sad to see that, he just keeps saying he is dumb and cant understand things. Incidentally have you heard of Synaptol or tried it, I read on the New York Times comment page of someone who had been on it and the effects only lasted for one month which is pretty much what we have experienced, it was great for the first month and being natural that made us very happy but 3 months down the track and we are almost back to where we were.
Thanks again for all your help and advice and I will keep you posted on his doctor's appointment on Tuesday, I am feeling better about the drug option but cant get out of my head that I am hurting him still and changing him with that first little tablet (have to get over myself really I think - somehow), have to keep thinking I am doing the best for my son. Have to read back the about of (I's) I have used in this and realise it is not about me maybe.
Hope everything continues to go super-great for you, you sound like a real genius like my 18 year old that has a huge IQ and a personality to match, he is not on treatment and really struggles too and is totally against drugs but then again with what he went through no wonder.

Hey QueensU girl, thanks for your reply, will look up that site. What you last wrote was exactly my son, for example last night I said to my 18 year old that my the computer shop was closed at 9.00pm, the 13 year old told his twin that my husband was due home at 9.00pm. He is having a WISK test on Monday and those results will be given to the doctor so the school are really moving on this, AT LAST, but I voiced what you wrote yesterday to the Psychologist about it being something else because he cant understand too many words at one time and he just cant comprehend (his words) and he said that is classic ADD. I know it is difficult to diagnose but surely we are a little more advanced in this day and age in diagnosis of ADD/ADHD/other learning disorders, everything seems to be left up to the parents to diagnose and then you find yourself second guessing yourself. Thanks again, Rainbow.

Hey Imapl, he was like a robot totally, within 20 minutes of giving him the tablet (Ritalin/Dex) it was like a veil coming down over his face very slowly and then wham, robot, no personality, seemed not his usual happy self, then when it wore off look out, we were supposed to dose him up again which was at lunchtime, gradually lunchtime was getting closer and closer time wise which was obviously the fact that I wouldn't put the dose up to allow it to last long enough, then when we took him off it he had a mini-nervous breakdown, I dont know if any of you have seen that but I sure hope you haven't. The day I went to the doctor and he ordered Prozac was one of the worst of my life, I did get it and gave him the one and only tablet and he went in to an absolute black depression, I really dont see how unless it is absolutely extreme (which both of mine arn't) you can recommend Prozac to a 7 year old, that was the turning point, from there we went natural and neurotherapy treament, I think the naturopaths worked at first because I was starving him and he had no energy, then back to normal, neurotherapy helped at first but it didn't last and cost thousands of dollars, another failed project. I think we have tried everything except the DORE program and that is at the back of my mind but after neurotherapy am concerned about spending so much money and having another failure and time is marching on school wise, my 13 year old has already lost so much information and is really struggling at school. Rainbow.

O.k. what dose did the doctor prescribe of the Ritalin and which type of Ritalin?

(in advance) im a horrible speller and rarly use periods and your amazing ability to do so in everyday typing on the internet is fantastic i can only generaly muster periods and correct puncuation for papers and official things :)

ok i believe ive read most of what you have said and i would just like to give my 2 cents on things

what you described... the thing about it working for a month then not again

this can be explained by a couple of things the first is called titrating and this means after the first intial dosage it will have to be gradually increased until the point where you will no longer need to keep uping it and you basicly stay the same and level out

the other explanation is simple... see when you first use the drug (one that works and does not zombifi you) you get sort of a high... its a mix of an actual high and amazement that you can focus.. its great its like seeing the world completely different for the first time.. things taste better.. tv shows are more compelling... the touch of another person feels greater.. its fantastic being able to focus on relitivly just one thing and there is really also sort of a chemical high because a lot of ADD meds are "uppers" and the thing is eventually, the chemical high, your body adjusts to and gets used to it and also the amazement of the new way of expierencing things goes away as you get used to it and some say that its not working anymore even thou it really is they are just not expierencing that shock and high of the first couple times they take it.

and now onto him turning into a robot that is defaintly what is known as turning into a "zombie" and talking from first hand expierence it sucks and i had to do it for a year before i changed meds. but you will have to brace your self for reality and your son may change slightly he may not seem to you as happy but truth be told he may just be not as hyper or jumpy and random but could still very well be just as happy if not more so

but this is just speaking from personal experience this process is different for just about everyone with a few common denominators and also assuming your son just has ADD and does not also have bi polar or LD or anything else

Also maby it really is just the meds because for some reason my doctor doesnt like Ritalin and ive never even asked for it she just makes it annoyingly clear how she feels about it... and i dont want to be ignorant and i certainly hope im not but just letting you know how my professional doctor feels about ritalin but then again all doctors seem to feel dif about ADD and ADD Meds

Revz, you are doing a great job and it's so nice to have a young person share their experiences; I wish more would. Just a word of caution so we don't scare off a concerned mother Rainbow. When you use words like "high" and "uppers", us more conservative folk think street drugs and that turns some people off and they miss the important information you are sharing.

When I took my first pill of Ritalin, I felt calm, like you do after a good workout.

Revz, keep up the good work.

Rainbow, I sent you a PM.

Revz, you are doing a great job and it's so nice to have a young person share their experiences; I wish more would. Just a word of caution so we don't scare off a concerned mother Rainbow. When you use words like "high" and "uppers", us more conservative folk think street drugs and that turns some people off and they miss the important information you are sharing.

When I took my first pill of Ritalin, I felt calm, like you do after a good workout.

Revz, keep up the good work.
lol sorry :( high was prob a bad word and i assumed uppers was ok because my doctor actually said to me "be carful thou one side effect can be insomnia... yeap these are def... uppers... you should work out more... so your tired by bed time... ect" :faint: :faint: but maby thats just because before i was on concerta which also has a calming effect to it not a "upper" effect and she wanted to get the point across i was trying something totally different i think she thinks i have ADHD but i believe i just have ADD in middle school i def would have said ADHD but maby the H is less noticable now that ive grown up a bit hmm?

thanks for the advice i will defaintly be more careful with my vocab
would hate to be the cause of someone not getting help

Rainbow, out of curiosity, what is the neurotherapy (neuropaths) your son went through?

Hi FrazzleD,

neurotherapy is about 4 wires hooked up to different parts of the brain just with gel, and they measure the activity in the brain and this is displayed on a TV screen via a game that is chosen for each particular patient, one son had the rocket game for example and the rocket was driven by concentration and attentiveness, it would keep going and along the way hit diamonds and emeralds etc. which would pick up extra points, if the concentration starting subsiding the rocket would slow down, this was the challenge of the game so the kids always want to win of course so they would switch on the concentratrion again to beat their previous scores. We did this 3 times a week for a year, it really did help the older one, the younger one it actually made him a bit more violent, they had to fiddle around alot with this therapy, a Psychologist is the one operating it and they would speak to them first. It was about A$80.00 5 years ago per session. Unfortunately it didn't stay with them and you really have to ask yourself exactly how far do you go with this financially and time wise. Overall I would say it wasn't worth it. Rainbow.
Hey Revz, thanks again for all your help too, you are amazing. Rainbow.

Thanks Rainbow! That sounds like the that S.M.A.R.T BrainGames, or similar.

And, I just thought of your username. The promise.