Hi, I am an adult of 30 years of age and just realized that I likely have ADHD.

I realized this after being told umpteen times by my wife that I've got something mentally wrong with me. She says it out of frustration of constantly seeing me start new projects and wonderful ideas, but never getting them done. I started pondering on this and took the test at: http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?type=doc&id=974&cn=3

To my bewilderment, I scored a 70 on this test. Frankly, I think I'm closer to moderate as I probably answered high on a couple of these items, but I realize that something is going on.

I had a very successful youth as my mother, I also just realized after reviewing that test with her, has ADHD as well. Due to her understanding simply through having parents herself who helped her to succeed she always kept me on task even if it was a matter of waking me up at 5:00 in the morning in order to do my school homework. It was always a struggle for me to focus on doing the work usually due to disinterest, except for certain subjects such as chemistry and science, poetry and arts in which I excelled.

I went on to college and continued to struggle, never realizing that I might have something like ADHD. It turned out that I could always learn better in the classroom by hearing the teacher and being directed and then after class I would utilize tutors and friends in order to focus more on the task at hand. I ended up doing well and was an honor student, but it was a struggle at times. I went on to earn a degree in computer science which proved most challenging, but I excelled as I always paid close attention to details and spent huge amounts of time on my assignments.

After graduation I could not find work in my field due to the .com and programming fallout so I went on to create my own successful computer consulting business in which we perform network administration and computer repair.

Notwithstanding this, I am seriously struggling right now with my goals. First, I struggle as a business as I go from task to task constantly not really ever finishing things completely. It is exacerbated in that I must switch tasks a lot in this type of work due to its very nature. Consequently, my business is not growing to its potential.

Along these lines, I am desperately trying to get back into my degree of computer science and have been trying to learn a new computer programming language and system for about two years. It seems that whenever I start, I get sidetracked either by my own volition or by work or family (I have a wife and several children). I am smart enough to learn and would be gifted with this, but I just can't seem to get the focus needed to master things properly.

I will not go to a professional for help with this as I do not have health insurance and cannot afford such an expense and the possibility of this being a preexisting condition for when I do have insurance. I desperately need input from folks who struggle similarly. If herbs or supplements help, please let me know. If certain music (I've found that trance music has helped me to focus more over the last few years) helps, please advise. Does anything else help? I would like to learn more about GABA as that seems to have some real potential to regulate things properly as well.

The bottom line for me at the moment is I must master this new programming language and whatever I do people tell me "read this book" or "read that book." I've tried and tried and have started and restarted time and time again. I have even tried to find a person to "hold my hand" or work with me so that I can have that additional assistance for focus, but there is no one available to do this (I've literally searched the world over for help).

Thanks for any feedback, direction, links or advice!

Don't feel so bad, I scored a 106!

My best advice to you is to go to your doctor and inquire about it. Take the results of any tests you took with you. He may dx you or may send you to a psychiartrist. The only real way of knowing is seeing a doctor. Sounds like you have good reason to see one.

:) Thanks for the note! However as I said in the first note, there's no way I will/can go to a doctor with my current health insurance situation... :\ I've got to figure out some assistance otherwise at the moment...

Sorry, I missed that. Check with your local county Mental Health agency. They cannot turn you away from services with or without insurance. They can set up a "sliding scale fee" or help you apply for medical assistance. With some mental health disorders, you are eligible for medical assistance even if you work. There are loopholes. Give them a call, you never know!

I was without health insurance awhile back, so I'll take you at your word that there's no way to consult a professional right now. If there is any way around that, though, any way at all...

There seem to be certain vitamins/minerals and nutrients that can be helpful-- my doctor just told me that the omegas, and DHA especially, are important for folks with ADD. There's info about this kind of thing under the Exercise & Nutrition section here. But for me, that only supplements the treatment from a doctor/psychiatrist, it can't replace it.

I found that music or background noise made a difference, but it's not like there's a universal ADD soundtrack. I think people vary and you just have to experiment, find your best M.O. by trial and error. (I listened to a lot of Stereolab. Also, I could sometimes focus better with uber-stale music that I'd heard ten million times before, songs I knew so well I could sing them verse for verse in my sleep. And I did way better in bustling, cacophonous spaces than in tomb-silent ones.)

And frequent movement. I was sitting in this cafe once and became transfixed by the spectacle of the man at the next table over: he'd spend 3-5 minutes hunched in intense concentration over his laptop, humming and mutttering to himself through clenched teeth. Then he'd leap up and pace back and forth for 5 minutes, then return to the laptop... and so on. When I remember to try his technique, I notice a difference. I'm sure it helps for anyone to keep the blood flowing; plus, if I allow myself to get up and walk around the room, I'm less likely to give up on the task and take off to go do something else.

But again, none of those things can take the place of treatment (I often need them on top of it). I think you should keep looking for loopholes, too. The sooner you can talk to a professional, the better.

Hi Sohowarrior

I know where you're coming from....I've real issues with work and have stated several ventures but got distracted and moved on. I've also worked as a programmer using several languages and been a sysadmin in an IT training company.

Basically I can't get my head round learning a new language from a book....but give me a project to do, a good manual with lots of code snippets and I'm off. I can't learn any other way than on the job.......scary but true.....I'm not that efficient on the first one....but give me a second and I'll be better than your average Joe.

I think the reason is that nearly all IT problems are the same and the same methods apply to breaking the project into smaller inter-related pieces.....coding them is but the final step in the chain.....and thats where a bit of that ADD hyperfocus and intuition comes in handy. so its not really about the coding its about how the system is structured to take advantage of the new languages strengths...thats the tough bit to get right on the first one.

Unless you're getting into something really esoteric like AI you should be OK.

kilt

Wow, you guys have hit a few things on the head for me. I have found that I already apply some of these techniques and I've already started high Omega 3/DHA a couple months ago. Very interesting.

@oedipa.maas: I've found trance, particularly Armin van Buuren to be very helpful to remain focussed as it gives my brain a lot of variety in sounds so that it remains focussed. I even have my babies falling asleep to it at night now; for some reason they seem to find it very soothing. Heh.

In thinking back, movement always saved me in deep programming issues during college. When I'd have a brain block I'd get up and just go outside for a minute or so to breath fresh air and then could come back and conquer. Interesting.

@kilt: yeah, on job/on demand seems to be the best tutor for me. Particularly I've found having someone with me helps tremendously to help to stay on task. Also, yes, I've found that I far exceed the average joe at tasks when I perform them.

Thanks again and any additional input would be much appreciated. By the way, does rhodiola or any other types of herbs (or minerals) seem to help? My grandfather was a very wise D.O. and always said that he believed that our bodies have all of the capacity they need in order to repair themselves and run properly, however we must give them the nutrients that they need in order to be healthy.

By the way, what do you all think about this: intelegen.com/nutrients/add.htm

Wow, you guys have hit a few things on the head for me. I have found that I already apply some of these techniques and I've already started high Omega 3/DHA a couple months ago. Very interesting.

@oedipa.maas: I've found trance, particularly Armin van Buuren to be very helpful to remain focussed as it gives my brain a lot of variety in sounds so that it remains focussed. I even have my babies falling asleep to it at night now; for some reason they seem to find it very soothing. Heh.

In thinking back, movement always saved me in deep programming issues during college. When I'd have a brain block I'd get up and just go outside for a minute or so to breath fresh air and then could come back and conquer. Interesting.

@kilt: yeah, on job/on demand seems to be the best tutor for me. Particularly I've found having someone with me helps tremendously to help to stay on task. Also, yes, I've found that I far exceed the average joe at tasks when I perform them.

Thanks again and any additional input would be much appreciated. By the way, does rhodiola or any other types of herbs (or minerals) seem to help? My grandfather was a very wise D.O. and always said that he believed that our bodies have all of the capacity they need in order to repair themselves and run properly, however we must give them the nutrients that they need in order to be healthy.

By the way, what do you all think about this: intelegen.com/nutrients/add.htmHey there,

Since everyone is saying it I might as well, I scored a 60. I have always known my ADD is not as bad as many others. I believe a 60 was in the "moderate" range.

With respect to your grandfather, I can appreciate his words as a DO student myself. However, the body cannot always repair itself and sometimes needs a boost from pharmaceuticals or natural things that have the same function as drugs.

I have no knowledge of natural herbs or anything so I won't suggest things, but supposedly fish oils can help as the types of fatty acids are somehow necessary for the production of dopamine. (I tried to find mechanisms of action but couldn't).

There is still much to be learned about ADHD and what it actually is. The question I have is, "Is the problem an issue of inadequate dopamine release or inadequate dopamine production? Or both?". I think it may be the prior, as ADHD people can really hyperfocus on things that are interesting and STIMULATING, which probably increases the rate of DA release in the cortices.

I'm basically pulling that out of a hat atm so take it with a grain of salt. If I ever have time I'd like to research it all some more.

I found this immediately after writing this post.

"Brain studies on individuals with ADHD suggest a defect in the dopamine receptor D4 (DRD4) receptor gene and overexpression of dopamine transporter-1 (DAT1). The DRD4 receptor uses DA and NE to modulate attention to and responses to one's environment. The DAT1 or dopamine transporter protein takes DA/NE into the presynaptic nerve terminal so it may not have sufficient interaction with the postsynaptic receptor."

Basically from this, DA receptors are dysfunctional somehow and may not be as sensitive to DA binding. DAT1 is basically a DA reuptake protein that removes DA from the synapse and back into the presynaptic nerve terminal. If I'm right and not mistaken, the key to future treatment would probably be a DRD4 allosteric activator and/or a SDRI (specific dopamine reuptake inhibitor) with an SNRI co-administered. Stimulants are basically a poor man's SDRI but who knows their actual efficacy.

Keep in mind, though, that a lot of researchers consider variation in the genetic alleles for DRD4 and DAT1 to be polymorphisms. Basically, this means a natural variation in the genetic makeup. This would explain why everyone can experience symptoms of ADHD to a degree, some more than others, but those who are at the extreme side of the continuum (those who express too much of the associated symptoms) are those diagnosed with ADHD. There are also diseases associated with the other side of the continuum (too much DA) such as schizophrenia.

Very interesting area of research....

@HooahMSII: Excellent material! Thanks so much for sharing that! I also very much like your last quote. I started off in medicine, but was not happy with the controlled environment (particularly by pharmaceuticals and insurance). DO is definitely the path to take, if you can be a good one. It seems too often any more that DOs are less holistic and more MDs.

Please do continue to keep us abreast of information, I would be particularly interested to understand the nutrients that a body would need in order to synthesize and/or utilize the proper levels. It is often so hard to start digging on google unless you have keyword anchors and you have certainly provided us with some of those in this post. Very very good info!

I certainly hope to see some more interaction amongst us in terms of researching this out and putting the variables in their proper location in the equation. There are answers and we must not sit on our laurels (or butts) letting others take their time in finding results.

It seems as though this is the information to which you were referring:

http://lansbury.bwh.harvard.edu/da_and_antagonists.htm
"Muglia, P., U. Jain, et al. (2002). "A transmission disequilibrium test of the Ser9/Gly dopamine D3 receptor gene polymorphism in adult attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder." Behav Brain Res 130(1-2): 91-5.
Convincing data support the hypothesis that genetic factors are involved in the etiology of attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD). Various lines of evidence have shown that the dopamine system plays a crucial role in the pathophysiology of ADHD. The dopamine D3 receptor gene (DRD3) represents a promising candidate to examine in ADHD. Animal studies have shown that DRD3 mRNA is highly expressed in the ventral striatum suggesting an involvement of this receptor in the control of motor behaviour. Manipulation of DRD3 in rodents has led to a mouse model with nonfunctional D3 receptors that displays hyperactive behaviour in various environmental conditions. Furthermore, administration of 7-OH-DPAT, a dopaminergic agonist that binds preferentially to D3 receptors exerts an inhibitory effect on locomotor activity while D3 antagonists induce hyperactivity. Among various polymorphisms described for DRD3, the BalI polymorphism is most interesting because it codes for an aminoacid substitution in the N-terminus of the receptor. The receptor products of the two alleles (Ser/Gly) exhibit differential affinity for dopamine. To determine if DRD3 Ser9/Gly is involved in the susceptibility to ADHD we genotyped 39 adults with ADHD and their respective parents (trios). Adult ADHD represents a promising phenotype for studying the genetic component of the disorder. In fact, a recent family study has shown that relatives of adult ADHD patients have a higher rate of ADHD compared to relatives of children with ADHD suggesting a stronger genetic component for the adult version. The results of genotyping in the 39 trios analyzed with the transmission disequilibrium test showed no excess of transmission for DRD3 MscI/BalI alleles (chi(2) = 0.360; df = 1; P = 0.54). This result, although from a relatively small sample, indicates that it is unlikely that DRD3 is playing a major role in the etiology of ADHD in our sample."

The question therefore seems to be, "what now?" What can be done with this knowledge? How do we solve the component parts to this? Or are there further component mysteries that must be solved?

It would seem nice if we could diminish or ameliorate it so that we could turn it on and off. In other words, I would not wish to remove the positive effects that it causes entirely, but I would like to diminish much of the time when productivity is needed, but allow my mind to flow and rush when I need the creative juices. It seems that I have a never ending flow of incredible ideas, but I can't get them implemented due to the same token.

That studies author, Umesh Jain is here in Toronto.

Yet another inconclusive gene study. :(

So much money is going into researching mental (neurological) illnesses genetic determinants.

Development is only 50% Nature (genetic), in the Nature/Nurture paradigm.

Seeking causes ("what to blame") is like arguing if Autism is Genetic or caused by Vaccines.

Honestly: at the end of the day, we have to come to the conclusion of "here we are [we have the symptoms or syndrome]".

You can't unchange or fix causation (it's developmental), so the question becomes "what can we do hereon in [to manage this thing]?"

The study also makes a flawed assumption: ADHD/ADD seems to run in familes, therefore it must be in the genes.

Many mental disorders that are NOT genetic run in families too.

It could be interpersonal/family-environmental (like personality disorders mostly are) or conditioning (like anxiety disorders mostly are; depression can be 'learned' [Seligman's Learned Helplessness paradigm]) or low IQ (other than the genetic disorders like Down Syndrome, the "socio-cultural" factor (child neglect; low verbal parents don't talk to their children/ignore etc) is the greatest cause there).

Interestingly enough my mother has the very similar indicators to myself. I would very much strongly reason that there is a strong genetic factor, at least in cases such as mine.

I really think we do need to look for a solution, not just "manage" this. I am certain that a solution is here within our grasp. We need to ask "how" questions and seek answers.

I learned long ago in engineering/computer science that too many of those in the engineering profession are quick to point out why something cannot be so, but while I was in a project manager position I learned that that mentality is very flawed: we must always seek out the "how" to do something in the face of seemingly insurmountable obstacles.

GABA worked well as a sleep aid for me, trouble was it was so effective I'd be tired into the next afternoon and not even coffee would help.

What helped memorywise for me was taking Phostphatidlyserine (sp?). I noticed within a few days my memory improved to where I didn't need to write things down as often I as once did. Unfortunately, my supply ran out and won't be back in stock so I've swtiched to Vinpocetine and noticed some good results remembering things as well.

In terms of books, ADD Success Stories by Thom Hartmann has a number of coping strategies/methods used by ADDers, some of which I've found helpful.

The book I've relied on the most is Healing ADD by Dr. Daniel Amen. Once I thought about his findings, I was able make some self-discoveries which really improved things for me.

Yet another inconclusive gene study. :(

So much money is going into researching mental (neurological) illnesses genetic determinants.

Development is only 50% Nature (genetic), in the Nature/Nurture paradigm.

Seeking causes ("what to blame") is like arguing if Autism is Genetic or caused by Vaccines.

Honestly: at the end of the day, we have to come to the conclusion of "here we are [we have the symptoms or syndrome]".

You can't unchange or fix causation (it's developmental), so the question becomes "what can we do hereon in [to manage this thing]?"


The whole point of the genetics research, and any research, is to pinpoint the cause of the disorder. Genes are the building blocks of proteins, and receptors/transmitters/etc are nothing but proteins.

Once they find out what goes wrong, they can tailor research to finding what fixes the problem.

An example of this is your thyroid. Thyroid hormone is very important and is synthesized as T4 and T3, mostly T4. T4 is an inactive hormone that binds to carrier proteins to extend its half life. The T4 enters peripheral tissues where it is converted to T3, and the T3 binds to nuclear receptors in the tissue to activate transcription of genetic elements that change the target proteins/tissues to do whatever it is they should be doing in the presence of T3.

The logic behind genetic research is the same thing. Yes, it's true that knowing what causes it isn't a direct fix since we can't go back in time and change things. However, knowing the cascade of dysfunctional (such as realizing a defective gene can code for an abudance of DAT1 transport proteins to clear too much DA from the synapse) genes can allow us to target therapies. In the future, we may even find a way to go in and "fix" the bad alleles, which will then start transcribing normal receptors and transport proteins.

Genetics is a relatively new field, just like psychiatry. I really believe the future of medicine is not symptomatic treatment but directly modification of the genetic material to correct the underlying cause of whatever has gone wrong.

The study also makes a flawed assumption: ADHD/ADD seems to run in familes, therefore it must be in the genes.

Many mental disorders that are NOT genetic run in families too.

It could be interpersonal/family-environmental (like personality disorders mostly are) or conditioning (like anxiety disorders mostly are; depression can be 'learned' [Seligman's Learned Helplessness paradigm]) or low IQ (other than the genetic disorders like Down Syndrome, the "socio-cultural" factor (child neglect; low verbal parents don't talk to their children/ignore etc) is the greatest cause there).The assumption that it is genetic is not based on the fact that it is seen in families, it is based on the fact that within families people with the condition expressed similar DNA that is different from normal people outside of the family. Were the DNA of the twins not the same, but they both expressed the condition, then the evidence for a genetic link went straight out of the window.

This is not to say there isn't an environmental cause as well. The research I have run across in my hours of being distracted (I cut down the meds since I've had a light week) suggest that genetics mainly predisposes people to ADHD, but it can be "brought out" by certain things in the environment or getting caught in certain behavioral patterns.

This begs the question, "Can behavioral conditioning result in genetic changes in the brain?". If you fall into ADHD-like behavior, such as obessively playing games and ignoring things you should be doing, does brain plasticity equate to a change in the genetic expression of the dopamine system to adapt to your chronic behavioral patterns? Can you change it back by modifying your behavior? No idea

he study also makes a flawed assumption: ADHD/ADD seems to run in families, therefore it must be in the genes.

Many mental disorders that are NOT genetic run in families too.

It could be interpersonal/family-environmental (like personality disorders mostly are) or conditioning (like anxiety disorders mostly are; depression can be 'learned' [Seligman's Learned Helplessness paradigm]) or low IQ (other than the genetic disorders like Down Syndrome, the "socio-cultural" factor (child neglect; low verbal parents don't talk to their children/ignore etc) is the greatest cause there).


Do Genes Influence the Onset of ADHD? (http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/546469_2)

Because disorders can run in families for environmental reasons such as shared exposure to toxins, cultural transmission, and social learning, we must turn to adoption and twin studies to figure out whether genes account for the familial transmission of ADHD. The logic of adoption studies is straightforward. If genes contribute significantly to ADHD risk, biological relatives of ADHD children should be at greater risk for ADHD than adoptive relatives of adopted ADHD children. Although few adoption studies have been published, each of these supports a strong role for genes in the familial transmission of ADHD

***End Quote


Genetics is a relatively new field, just like psychiatry. I really believe the future of medicine is not symptomatic treatment but directly modification of the genetic material to correct the underlying cause of whatever has gone wrong.

Impressed by the medical knowledge but this is a scary thought. Think they will be wise enough to go in a fix the gene responsible for greed and prejustice? To modify genetic material may be useful in cyctic fibrosis but to manipulate variations in temperament is a rather scary thought.

I half way agree with you but I can also see another point of view in that perhaps before we invest in these high faluntin purely medical approaches perhaps a look into the every day dysfunction of societies intolerance to neurodiversity would be a wise move as well . To manipulate genetic too much and one could very well end up eliminating the vary species one is seeking to improve. Just think bio-genetic weapons directed at specific sub-groups like those of a different race or ethnic persuasion. If we do not put forth effort in the advancement in the interactive/mindful/social department then genetic studies may indeed be playing with fire. Genetic variations are necessary not only for the survival of the species but also in the advancement of man-kind.

What would have happened if they had genetically fixed what was wrong with Bengermin Franklin, Albert Einstein or Thomas Edison?




This is not to say there isn't an environmental cause as well. The research I have run across in my hours of being distracted (I cut down the meds since I've had a light week) suggest that genetics mainly predisposes people to ADHD, but it can be "brought out" by certain things in the environment or getting caught in certain behavioral patterns.

I believe ADD is a genetic variation however I believe the expression of those traits is greatly influenced by environment. I can certainly see where my up-bringing has a lot to do with how I perceive myself thus influencing how I approached challenges presented as well as my own personal temperament

Oh yea almost forgot {nope no ADD here}

Our Favorite Neurotransmitters (http://www.mcmanweb.com/article-236.htm)

Although written for bi-polar I find the information to be in a straight forward easy to understand format.

Another interesting piece of info for the member who wrote the initial pot.

Treatment with Tyrosine, (http://stinet.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=getRecord&metadataPrefix=html&identifier=ADA199199)

I am sure the connection to the questions asked in initial post will be obvious.

Good luck

Guess I need to get checked out, I score over 70... And well on everyother ADD online test so far. Anyway, sounds like me here.

supps

gaba for sleep but can do the opposite and keep you up.

magnesium
zinc
dmea
piracetam
aniracetam
-racetams good!
lechithin
ginko
L tyrosine not sure but i take it
alcar cycled

rhodiola rose great for stress

buy bulk/save money!

This is not to say there isn't an environmental cause as well. The research I have run across in my hours of being distracted (I cut down the meds since I've had a light week) suggest that genetics mainly predisposes people to ADHD, but it can be "brought out" by certain things in the environment or getting caught in certain behavioral patterns.
hmn. My symptoms have been more noticeable to me since my mum died and had to deal with everything on my own and with my own apartment, which is when I started to look into whats going on. I now know that I've always had the symptoms of ADHD which my parents carefully managed with compromise, understanding and many of my frustrations could be off loaded and managed like a team. Which is now gone.

I always remember saying I felt humphrey (frustrated/angry), paying little attention to anything other than playing lego etc. My dad (divorced when I was 3) took me somewhere when I was about 7 ish, to which my mum and dad had a massive argument over and it all ended over some kind of treatment. I cant remember many details and have never been told what it was about or whether I was diagnosed. Previous to that I was born prematurely and have been told that I had seizures. I dont know how to confront my dad over it.

I can relate to most threads on this forum based on my whole life, together with school reports, private education with extra tuition and my impulsive behaviour. everything adds up. And my dad has similar symptoms still. I've expressed my symptoms in the "Diagnoses" forum. At the moment I'm trying to organize my frustrations better and taking "eye q", since taking a week off work as I burnt out. I will seek further help if that fails.

Hello

just a very simple advice : WRITE!

Write everything that you have work to do with it. Better be swimming under papers than running after the clock and the missed appointments.
If nothing else writing will help your mind to slow down .

The bottom line for me at the moment is I must master this new programming language and whatever I do people tell me "read this book" or "read that book." I've tried and tried and have started and restarted time and time again. I have even tried to find a person to "hold my hand" or work with me so that I can have that additional assistance for focus, but there is no one available to do this (I've literally searched the world over for help).I know exactly how you feel - I'm a web developer with ADD and I find it incredibly difficult to sit down and just learn a new programming language. The only way I'm ever able to do it is to force myself into a situation where I have to do it, or face immediate consequences. As a result, I often accept projects that require me to do things that I don't actually know how to do, and because my motivation stems from wanting to save face and avoid humiliation, I always find a way to learn what I need to know. It's a stressful way to learn things, but I have to admit that I get a sick little thrill from it.

Obviously, what works for me might not work for you, and I certainly wouldn't advise you to try it out in a potentially career-threatening situation. This is just how I've motivated myself pretty much my entire life. I've been on Adderall for two years now, and it certainly helps, but I still have to motivate myself the same way when I need to learn something new.

From some additional reading and comments here, it appears that the supplements/etc. that we need to really examine are:

GABA [Gamma-aminobutyric acid] (amount?)
L-Glutamine 500 mg to 3,000 mg (children, what would adults be?)
Taurine
Tyrosine - 200 to 500 mg (children, what would adults be?)
Glycine - 500 to 2,000 mg divided (children, what would adults be?)
Magnesium - 200 mg (that is for children, what would adults be?)
Calcium - 1000 mg to 1,500 mg
Huperzine - 50 mcg capsule

From above:
Zinc
DMEA
Piracetam
Aniracetam
Racetam
Lechithin
Ginko
Alcar cycled
Rhodiola rose great for stress

Can we figure out some amounts of these for adults and such and/or get some feedback on each or combinations so as to start making some more educated decisions on usage? For example, I don't find myself suffering from having an over abundance of energy much of the time, but I do experience a lot of other symptoms so I'd like to figure out which is used for what and their adult dosage, amounts, etc. that could encourage an appreciable difference.

@togamoos: interesting, thanks for sharing that. I unfortunately cannot place myself in quite the same situation due to having a large family (with several children) but thinking back, that has kind of been my story in "new things." Hmm.

Again, I cannot go to a professional for meds (although I may get some from Mexico since they are higher quality than Canadian... for various reasons), so I'd *really* like to try these supplement options in order to try to "take the edge" off or at least allow me to focus and put out the distractions for longer periods of time, or at least through the drudgery portions of learning as much of it does have me pretty captivated since I have such high interest in the result of creating my ideas and earning a living...

At any rate, this is super interaction. I appreciate all of the thoughts, comments, observations and information!

From above:
Zinc
DMEA .5g
Piracetam 1-2g
Aniracetam .8g
Racetam
Lechithin
Ginko 1g
Alcar cycled
Rhodiola rose great for stress

Can we figure out some amounts of these for adults and such and/or get some feedback on each or combinations so as to start making some more educated decisions on usage? ion!

All can be purchased in USA. You need to actually research, there is plenty on all of these all over the internet.
pubmed.org
or wiki it

Soho, one thing you might consider is booking an appointment with a homeopathic/holistic doc. I used to be highly suspicious of that stuff, thought it was a load of quackery... but, the practitioner I saw last month was really sharp, had an MD on top of other degrees and really seemed to know what she was talking about. It mostly wasn't covered by my insurance anyway, and since her purview sort of transcends traditional medical categories, she was able to put down a pretty vague diagnosis (could be helpful if you have "preexisting condition" concerns).

I mention this because it's been my experience that experimenting with supplements, even regular ol' vitamins, can be a shot in the dark-- some of the stuff I tried made things worse!-- and the costs add up quick. When I went in to see this doc, she was able to look at my individual body chemistry and assess why certain foods, supplements, brands of vitamins, etc., were having given effects. They can also test your thyroid, look for food allegeries, and other things that can affect stuff like energy and memory. Apparently there are even tests they can do on your neurotransmitter levels (I haven't taken those yet, so we'll see).

But anyway, if you're going to spend money on a load of supplements, you might spend some on a consultation like that, esp. since it could be more cost-effective in the end. (We don't appear to live in the same part of the country, otherwise I'd offer to recommend someone. :( ) And, er, I'd be really wary about the prescription meds from Mexico if I were you. I admit my knowledge here is limited, as I've never looked into it... though I have been to places in Mexico where there signs advertising prescription meds for sale, and they seemed kind of sketch to me, but... (*shrugs*) I assume you've done more research than me and it's legal so I'll leave it at that.

oh, p.s.:

- I take 500mg Mg, 1000 mg Ca, 25 mg Zinc per day

- try yerba mate tea. I've found I get more steady/sustained energy without the "edge" and jitters of my former (and, *sigh*, much-missed) espresso fix.

Hi soho

I have a pretty good diet, lots of fish oils, my wife cooks fresh every day, no ping food and I still have significant issues with ADHD behaviours. The presentation of the symptoms of ADHD is heavily influenced by environment however the underlying reason(s) may be hard wired.....it all depends on how the chold/adult copes with their cognitive processing power in the environment they find themselves in.

I know what you mean about putting yourself in situations where you have to do deliver something using a new skill set...I do it all the time, scares the hell out of me...but thats a big adrenaline burn...aka stimulation. Now I know why I am always always outside my comfort zone.

kilt

Knowing I have many ADD traits, and also many dyspraxic ones I took the test and scored 86-severe!! eeeek..but on a brighter point I DID stay on task long enough to finish the test!!!