After bad experience with stimulants (biphentin..see my previous post...continued muscle twitching which STILL not stopped, its been a month) the alternative would be a non-stimulant drug.

I have read all kinds of nasty things about Strattera on this website and some people who are ok with it. Seems like those who like it are in the minority.

The worst would be the suicidal thoughts. How do you know what will happen when you send your kid out the door in the morning, or say, to an overnight summer camp for a week or two? Its very scary. It seems like these thoughts can just happen out of the blue with no warning. And on top of that there is the sexual dysfunction in males (although he's only ten, what happens to boys entering puberty with this side effect of the drug? I worry about permanent damage. And the urinary retention and what not?)

I'm afraid to try even if there seem to be minimal side effects because the long term possibilites scare me. He is asking for help. He wants to try the next thing. It is heartbreaking and frustrating at times.

Although we have to make our own decisions, any comments would be appreciated!

After bad experience with stimulants (biphentin..see my previous post...continued muscle twitching which STILL not stopped, its been a month) the alternative would be a non-stimulant drug. I have been taking stimulant medication for this condition since 1992, and I feel very strongly (based on personal experience) that it's not a good idea to assume all stimulant drugs work the same based on a reaction to just one of them.

For example, my experience with methylphenidate was very similar to what your son experienced, except I also suffered an irregular heartbeat that lingered for awhile. It was by far the prescription stimulant with the most negative side effects for my muscles (including my heart), and my nerves.

None of the other stimulants had anywhere near the negative side effects like methylphenidate had for me.

The three prescription stimulants that had the smoothest side effects for me were Dexedrine, Desoxyn (not available in Canada), and Focalin.



I have read all kinds of nasty things about Strattera on this website and some people who are ok with it. Seems like those who like it are in the minority. Well, I have never taken Strattera, and I likely will not take it until it has been on the market for at least another 10 years or so. I am paranoid when it comes to new drugs due to the fact that my father was the 33rd person to die (in the US) in 2000 after taking the diabetic drug Rezulin which was pulled off the market in 2000 about 3 months prior to his death. It should have never been approved.



The worst would be the suicidal thoughts. How do you know what will happen when you send your kid out the door in the morning, or say, to an overnight summer camp for a week or two? Its very scary.It is very scary, and unfortunately until enough people have taken it for several years, we may never really know how dangerous, or safe it actually is.



It seems like these thoughts can just happen out of the blue with no warning. And on top of that there is the sexual dysfunction in males (although he's only ten, what happens to boys entering puberty with this side effect of the drug? I don't know, but the thought of it makes me cringe due to having experienced similar sexual dysfunction from antidepressant drugs which are chemically similar to Strattera, and God knows that I would have hated to of had to experience those side effects during puberty, that's for sure.


I worry about permanent damage. And the urinary retention and what not?) I'm afraid to try even if there seem to be minimal side effects because the long term possibilites scare me. He is asking for help. He wants to try the next thing. It is heartbreaking and frustrating at times.
Unfortunately, until a drug has been taken for an extended period of time (several years), and taken by lots of people, it's very difficuly if not impossible to draw any conclusion concerning long term safety. Especially the kind of long term safety that can be found among the amphetamine class of drugs which have been used to treat this condition longer than any other medication. I found the amphetamine based drugs to offer the fewest side effects too (excluding Adderall which I found to be a negative experience).

I suggest that you talk to your Dr about all the possibilities, and that you please consider that even though these stimulant drugs are similar, that we do not always respond to them in similar ways. I can tell you from my experience that this is the truth, and that I am so very grateful that I kept on trying "the next thing" because if I had not done that I would have never found the medication that finally allowed me to achieve the peace of mind that I depserately needed.

I failed out of high school due to being undiagnosed/unmedicated. At the age of 22 I was diagnosed, and the journey to find the right medication began for me. Sure, it was a bumpy road, but now, after finding the right medication, I am a full time college senior at the age of 37, and I have been on the Dean's list each of the last 4 years. My hope is to go further with my education, into either medical school, or dental school, or chiropractic, or perhaps even nurse practioner, or physicians assistant. Much will be determined by my MCAT scores obviously. Sorry to ramble on about this, but I wanted to make a point that I feel like I could have achieved so much more, at a much earlier age if I had only been prescribed right medication when I was younger, like your son.

I failed out of high school due to being undiagnosed/unmedicated. At the age of 22 I was diagnosed, and the journey to find the right medication began for me.

I dropped out of high school got a GED. I first took zoloft and thyroxine at 23 and started college then. :) One of the schools I applied to was EKU and my ACT test said I would have 60% chance of getting passing grades there.

I only experienced muscle twitching (in my eyelids ) from deprenyl and mega dose b-6. I hypothesise the b-6 had a dopaminergic mechanism.

Thank you Lars, I appreciate your detailed response.

Can you tell me how long your irregular heartbeat lingered?

As far as Strattera's track record is concerned, I had the chance to speak briefly to Dr. Leonard Sax who has recently written a book "Boys Adrift" (look him up, he's and MD and PhD psychologist when he did a presentation here in Toronto. He said Atomoxetine (spelling?) has been out for 25 years. Although I have not done the research on the drug myself, I would understand that it is just recently it has been approved for ADHD--last several years anyway. His opinion that he talks about in his book and on his website is that stimulants cause damage to the nucleus accumbens (spelling?) part of the brain that is responsible for motivation. I am currently trying to track down the original research that shows this. It would occur, I believe after many years of the drugs. However, I would ask if Strattera would have the same effect...no data in yet due to the short time its been used for adhd, probably.

The other part of this is that we still don't have a definitive diagnosis of adhd. We know there is a learning disability, have done hours of psycho ed testing with a psychologist to find that out.We also have definite executive function problems. He is not hyperactive though (ok maybe he's the inattentive type) but has a hard time with just doing his day to day stuff without conflict (esp. at home), argues constantly to get his way, etc. etc. and has a terrible time doing homework and school work. The four days he was on biphentin he did great with everything and he wants to feel that way again. He is a very intelligent boy.

We are considering private school for next year which would provide for a much smaller classroom and support with his LD, and attention to his organizational issues. However it is not a sure thing that we will do that as I'm afraid he will just reject the extra attention and feel as if he's under the microscope. Without any meds he may just become even more difficult in that small classroom. If you have any thoughts on that based on your life history, please share. thank you so much for your comments!

Thank you Lars, I appreciate your detailed response. You're very welcome, the pleasure is all mine. ;)




Can you tell me how long your irregular heartbeat lingered? It lasted for approximately two months after I stopped taking methylphenidate. It was not as severe when I took some of the extended release methylphenidate products, but I did notice it with those drugs too, albeit to a lesser extent.

That being said, the dextromethylphenidate never caused me to experience any of those negative side effects.





He said Atomoxetine (spelling?) has been out for 25 years. Although I have not done the research on the drug myself, I would understand that it is just recently it has been approved for ADHD--last several years anyway. Dr Sax certainlly is a very distinguished Dr, and I certainlly look forward to learning more about him, and his interesting theories. I am especially interested in reading more about his theories on same sex schools, and gender based behavioral differences that he appears to have done some very interesting research in. Sounds very interesting indeed.

On the subject of Atomoxetine, I have access to a private site online which allows me to access approximately 26 million articles, and after doing a search there I could not find anything that was published concerning Atomoxetine, or Tomoxetine (which was what it was originally called) that was published prior to the year 2000.

I am curious to find out what Dr. Sax means when he says that it's been out for 25 years. Does he mention anything about that in his books by any chance?






His opinion that he talks about in his book and on his website is that stimulants cause damage to the nucleus accumbens (spelling?) part of the brain that is responsible for motivation. That sounds very interesting too, and I would like to read more about his claim. I did a search on that too, and I could not find anything relating to therapeutic use, however there certainlly does seem to be a conection with people who abuse stimulants. However, the people who abuse stimulant drugs usually consume massive quantities of stimulants typically well over 400mg to 500mg per day, and perhaps much higher than that on occasion. People who take these drugs in a therapeutic manner rarely exceed 60mg per day, and that is if they are even prescribed a dose that high.






I am currently trying to track down the original research that shows this. It would occur, I believe after many years of the drugs. However, I would ask if Strattera would have the same effect...no data in yet due to the short time its been used for adhd, probably. Well, unfortunately there is not even any data (other than anecdotal evidence) to verify the safety of long term stimulant use either, however, based on my own experience, and from several people I know personally who have used them daily for years, I feel fairly confident in staying the course at this point. If I was to stop taking them now, I know that there is no way that I could finish school. :o







He is not hyperactive though (ok maybe he's the inattentive type) but has a hard time with just doing his day to day stuff without conflict (esp. at home) That sounds like me when I was his age. I am not hyperactive either. I am innatentive.







The four days he was on biphentin he did great with everything and he wants to feel that way again. I can understand how he feels about wanting to feel that way again. I hope he is able to find that feeling on a different path other than the methylphenidate.







He is a very intelligent boy. Once, again he sure sounds like me. :) I'm kidding about that, but I am sure he is very intelligent, and it's unfortunate that so many people out there (not you) so often assume that people like me (and your son I assume) are not as intelligent as the rest of the class due to our classroom performance (when not receiving the medical treatment that works best for us).







We are considering private school for next year which would provide for a much smaller classroom and support with his LD, and attention to his organizational issues. However it is not a sure thing that we will do that as I'm afraid he will just reject the extra attention and feel as if he's under the microscope. Without any meds he may just become even more difficult in that small classroom.
I hope that it all works out better than you could imagine it can, and I also hope that you will keep us posted on how things unfold on that end. Please know that there will be plenty of support here from the members of this site no matter which path you and your son's Dr choose for his treatment. ;)