For the past 2 weeks, my 15 yr old son has been asking me to see a doctor because he thinks he has ADD. He says he cannot complete a book without having complete silence or he looses his place in a book. (Reading has always been one of his strongest areas) We went to our family doctor who referred us to a psychologist who makes this type of diagnosis. I'm not quite sure what a diagnosis for ADD will benefit him with. The bottom line would be to learn coping skills to help him become successful in school.

Here's a short rundown on his school performance. He easily makes passing grades. Most of his teachers says since 4th grade, he is quite capable of doing much more than he produces. He has an IQ over 140. In fact he seems to fustrate most of his teachers with poor homework and classwork, then he makes a perfect score or near perfect on a test.

This is his first year in high school where he was aiming to make straight A's. He seems to be struggling with managing his deadlines, study habits, and projects. He does not care for organization, but he will do it if I let him back on the Xbox.

As an infant, he was hypersensitive to light and sound, loved his rocking swing instead of being held, and seems to misread a lot of visual cues from people.

Now I don't know if he is ADD, however, if he is what would meds do for him? If he doesn't need them .... what would a diagnosis with ADD help him with?

By the sounds of it, definitely worth seeing a psychologist to see if your son has ADD or not, as well as letting the psychologist suggest some tools to help with learning and focusing. Medication may be needed in the future (ex, when he is in college) so it's better to get officially diagnosed if he has it.

Seems like an unusual number of people on this forum have an IQ of 140 or greater. Only 1 in 261 people have an IQ of 140.

The only thing you can do is have a good psychologist test him and it sounds like that's what you're doing.

By the sounds of things he could have ADD. The reading thing doesn't mean much - I'm a very good reader and I've got ADD inattentive type. I'm now getting treatment and things have improved dramatically.

Try and get a book called 'Driven to Distraction' it explains things really well and you can get it on Amazon for pretty cheap.

Your son actually sounds a lot like me when I was that age. What the teachers have been saying is exactly what was written on all my reports. 'Chris is a capable student but fails to apply himself', 'Must learn better organization and to stay on task' 'intelligent but wasteful of his potential' etc. etc.

Intelligent people with ADD often get through the early years of school easily because we can rely on our quick thinking and general knowledge. Around when high school starts things change and you MUST study to do well..you can't rely on your general knowledge because you have to know exact things that you have to read up on.

How will a diagnosis make it easier for him?

It will help him realize his strengths and weaknesses and how to work with them. He might start to accept himself for who he is rather than who he 'should' be. It will explain lots of things he's dealt with throughout his life (but it won't make excuses for him) He can learn techniques and strategies that will make things much easier for him.

Treatment with stimulants can also be helpful. I'd suggest you read up on the different treatment options available - it's nowhere near as scary as it sounds. He won't be 'doped up' or anything like that. It's your choice though. If you don't feel comfortable with using medication that's fine, there's other things to try.

Exercise and eating a good diet can help.

I'll just recommend that book again as it's a good place to start. (Driven to Distraction by Dr. Edward M. Hallowell and Dr. John J. Ratey)

Good luck and welcome to the forums..if you have any other questions people here are more than happy to help you out.

Well to start with, he's exceptionally Gifted (evident by IQ alone).

Gifted children often have many of the signs and symptoms of ADHD: they don't concentrate in class, they get bored easily, they dislike authority (because they naturally need to ask why, which ****s off most of an authoritarian bent), etc.

Also, it's been suggested that co-morbidity of ADHD in Giftedness is 20%. That is 1 in 5 Gifted people have ADHD.

Obviously if he does have ADHD as well, things are doubly hard. Speaking from experience here. ;)

My suggestion would be to get him diagnosed. If the doctor says he has ADHD, accept his diagnosis for now, trial stimulant medication, and see whether this calms him down or 'speeds'/hypes him up. It's a fairly effective anecdotal way to determine the presence of ADHD, as common ADHD reactions to stimulant medications are: tiredness, sluggishness, calmness, massive increases in focus.

But in the end, medication is only part of it. Even in a normal person with ADHD, medication is only part of the solution, but in somebody who is also extremely Gifted as your some would appear to be, you need to be doubly careful to ensure he's getting the right treatment at school. Usually this means academic acceleration, but it's hard because schools only cater to the average student, not the top student. Further, being bright doesn't mean he'll enjoy or be interested in everything at school, so try and figure out what his interests are and work off those.

A lot of the symptoms you describe are characteristic of Giftedness, ADHD, autism, or a mix of the three. All have co-morbidity. So basically, when you visit the paeditrician, ask about autism/asperger's syndrome, ADHD, and giftedness.

Physical rocking, sensitivity to stimuli, obsession, dislike of environmental change are all common symptoms of Autism Spectrum Disorders, which is why I mention you should look into it. I wouldn't guarantee it is autism, however, since some of these symptoms also occur in Giftedness and ADHD (often due to asynchronous brain development).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gifted

ASD (Autistic Spectrum Disorder) seems a better fit than ADHD from the description you give, although the two can overlap in signs and symptoms. In fact, DSM-IV-TR states that if there is pre-existing ASD (e.g., Aspergers, PDD-NOS) the ADHD should _not_ be diagnosed, i.e. it's not "true" ADHD if the signs and symptoms are part of a complex of another classifiable disorder. However, many therapists seems happy to recognise co-existance of ADHD with ASD these days as a practical matter.

A developmental paediatrician or similar might be a good bet to get the issues untangled. BTW, many Asperger's kids have very high IQs. They also typically have trouble reading social cues. But there are other ASD categories that fit these criteria too.

My (inexpert) advice is to seek the expert advice of someone who is familiar with both ADHD and ASD.

We have dealt with ADHD for a lot of yrs and I know it effects more in my sons life then just school work. I would look for other things too. How does your son get along with other kids? Does he have a problem reading social cues? Is he prone to impulsive behaviours and/or severe mood swings? How is his focus at home when he is doing things around the house? Does he need constant reminders?
An evaluation won't hurt for sure but any evaluation will encompas more the just schooling.
ADHD effects every aspect of a persons life.
Let us know how he makes out.. my son is 15 as well :)

hi Justtess (http://www.addforums.com/forums/member.php?u=22614) welcome :)

as some others say as well, there are some cues that it might be a little apserger-like .. like the misreading cues, the rocking. I know I did not have that .. kids with (inattentive) ADD are quite often overly self-aware and aware of social cues.
Then again, it may be add .. or both .. best to have him evaluated by someone who knows about both.

hi Justtess (http://www.addforums.com/forums/member.php?u=22614) welcome :)

as some others say as well, there are some cues that it might be a little apserger-like .. like the misreading cues, the rocking. I know I did not have that .. kids with (inattentive) ADD are quite often overly self-aware and aware of social cues.
Then again, it may be add .. or both .. best to have him evaluated by someone who knows about both.

I dunno. I tend to find myself completely oblivious to social clues sometimes.

Like, I'll know exactly what's going on in a group - the power dynamics etc. It's like an intuitive understanding, yet most people seem to be unaware of it all. But when it comes to the basic stuff, I sometimes just miss it completely, or more often detect it but don't know how to respond. Caused me a fair amount of grief in primary and high school.

Yeah actually, I guess I pick up on social cues but often don't know how to respond.

Thanks for the replies!

I've signed up for a seminar at a private university today which is going to address Twice Exceptional Dilema gifted children. I'm not exactly sure if it will answer the questions as to "what's the best treatment", seems more of a run down on recent research discoveries. Anyone else have heard of this?

About my son missing social cues.... a good example would be his misunderstanding about how hard he hit someone, misjudging his peers visual cues of being very annoyed with his repeated jokes, not realizing someone was inviting him to be a friend.....

I have a course in behavioral psychology many many years ago in college so I remembered what to tell him when looking at other's verbal and visual messages. It has taken this long for him to utilize what I had told him. Maybe because I'm his mother, or he finally matured?

Anyway, I'm going in loops since ADD/Gifted/Asphergers all share many common signs.

I dunno. I tend to find myself completely oblivious to social clues sometimes.

Like, I'll know exactly what's going on in a group - the power dynamics etc. It's like an intuitive understanding, yet most people seem to be unaware of it all. But when it comes to the basic stuff, I sometimes just miss it completely, or more often detect it but don't know how to respond. Caused me a fair amount of grief in primary and high school.

Yeah actually, I guess I pick up on social cues but often don't know how to respond.

Oh, if you put it like that, that sounds more familiar. I meant more like sensing what someone wants by nonverbal communication .. or how they feel. I find myself extremely sensitive to that .. I can detect a mood from a mile distant, so to speak .. or if someone is hiding an emotion (say, if they feel bad but act like they're ok).

But reacting to it is another thing .. in 1 to 1 situations, when I get along with the person in question it is not too hard .. but, when I dont feel comfortable - then I can be really clueless / completely lost.
And in groups .. the power dynamics .. I sort of see what happens, but only the external 'result' - like when people exclude others, or are mean, or overly sycophantic. I cant fathom the motives of this group behaviour .. it feels so totally phony, dishonest and mean.

Anyway, I'm going in loops since ADD/Gifted/Asphergers all share many common signs.

They are not mutually exclusive.

And from a practical point of view, the success of the intervention is more important than the precise "label" applied.

I got a little too specific with my post :) We don't know if he has ADD and the only way you're going to find out is having some testing done with a GOOD psychologist that knows his/her stuff.

Let us know what the result is. The testing is worth doing even if it only rules out ADD.

Whether you cosult a pdoc or a psychologist, make sure he or she has expertise in ADHD and ruling out other conditions (or determining their comorbidity, & their secondary or primary nature). :cool:

Anyway, I'm going in loops since ADD/Gifted/Asphergers all share many common signs.

I guess the points to take from this thread are:

1) He's Gifted. That's going to interfere slightly with ANY diagnosis. It is also something to check out (that Twice Gifted program sounds worth it).
2) Nobody her knows what he has. But it could well be ADHD. First and foremost, get him checked out for ADHD.

BTW, those social cues you mentioned? They all described me at 15, and I don't have ASD.

Thank you for your thoughts.

I have been lurking around and reading other posts... basically wondering if the struggles and difficulties of someone with ADHD/ADD is what my son may be experiencing. To some degree, I've heard my son and his teachers complain about his lack of focus for many years now.

My next challenge is finding a professional who deals with gifted and other issues. Seems to get more difficult since he doesn't fit in the norm of the general pop. Maybe I'm making too much of a big deal and a regular ADD diagnostican can properly diagnose him. (Still like to think he's choosing to be difficult at school)

Anyway, I enjoy everyone sharing their experiences with ADD/ADHD and how it affects them.

Oh, if you put it like that, that sounds more familiar. I meant more like sensing what someone wants by nonverbal communication .. or how they feel. I find myself extremely sensitive to that .. I can detect a mood from a mile distant, so to speak .. or if someone is hiding an emotion (say, if they feel bad but act like they're ok).

Same. I think sometimes I'm too sensitive to it. Like, it personally matters to me what mood they are in, and if it isn't a good one, I'll wonder if I caused it, and I'll try and cheer them up.

I met with a psychologist today and I am very irritated. She thinks I need counseling for my divorce 10 years ago. Sheesh.... Why dig up old bones? I've moved on, yes it's sad and it hurts a bit but I handle it fine. She didn't even with my son. What a waste of time.

OK... regardless if my son is a child of divorce and his father is a stranger. We talk about time to time and he seems to have adjusted well... not dwelling on the past, or consuming his thoughts.

Can't a doctor make a diagnosis without the psychology? He hasn't said he was depressed nor has anyone at school said anything. He's doing what he has been doing all his school life,... except this time he's trying to study.

Grrrrrrrr...... ok just venting.

I wish I had answers for you...I've seen this happen before, with my own family. All I can say is, I hope things work out and that you find the answers you need. You may have to switch doctors. Whatever happens.. good luck!

Whew.... found another doctor who does neurotherapy with neurofeedback (?) has anyone here heard of such.

Seems most of the other doctors I've interviewed today... wants to know "how am I feeling"..... and I'm not the one I want tested. Maybe I'm approaching this wrong. .... It's been a long day.

Whew.... found another doctor who does neurotherapy with neurofeedback (?) has anyone here heard of such.

Seems most of the other doctors I've interviewed today... wants to know "how am I feeling"..... and I'm not the one I want tested. Maybe I'm approaching this wrong. .... It's been a long day.
Yes, I've heard about it .. and done a bit of research. There are a couple of synonyms .. neurofeedback, biofeedback, neurotherapy. I am not too enthusiastic about it seen what quackwatch (http://www.quackwatch.com/search/webglimpse.cgi?ID=1&query=neurofeedback) says about it, and most of all, CHADD (http://web.archive.org/web/19990208211649/http://chadd.org/fact7.htm)

EEG Biofeedback is the controversial therapy of the moment. Proponents of biofeedback believe that children with ADD can be trained to increase the type of brain-wave activity associated with sustained attention. Up to 20 electrodes are attached to the child's head. Levels of electrical activity in various parts of the brain are measured and entered into a computer. The computer provides a signal, such as a light or tone. This "feedback" is supposed to teach the child to increase certain kinds of brain-wave activity and decrease other types. Training usually involves 40-80 sessions, each lasting 40 minutes or more. This "treatment" costs $3,000 to $6,000.
The studies which suggest impressive results for EEG Biofeedback are seriously flawed. Sample sizes were small and appropriate control groups were not used to determine if any results are due to maturation or an "expectancy" effect.
CH.A.D.D. recommends that any parent considering the use of biofeedback proceed with extreme caution.

Neurotherapy -- also called neurofeedback and EEG neurofeedback -- is a form of behavior modification that uses electroencephalographic (EEG) biofeedback technology to increase voluntary control over the amplitude and pattern of various brain wave frequencies. Proponents claim that modifying brain wave patterns is effective against anxiety reactions, mood disorders, substance abuse, attention deficit disorders and various other mental and emotional problems. Research shows that brain wave activity can be altered through various forms of biofeedback. However, a comprehensive review has concluded that none of these claims is supported by well-designed studies [20,21].

Most people who go through biofeedback training use it to acquire relaxation skills that could also be learned without electronics.

In other cases, such as biofeedback for psychosomatic disorders, there is some limited evidence for efficacy, but scant evidence that this efficacy exceeds that of less expensive and less technologically sophisticated treatments (Druckman and Swets 1988). The benefits of biofeedback, for example, are not demonstrably greater than those of relaxation training (Silver and Blanchard 1978).

so my impression is that the jury's still out .. and meanwhile there's a fringe of (questionable) practicioners out there that are offering Neurofeedback and are not being cheap at it, too.

So I'd proceed with a LOT of caution.

Luthien --- you are brilliant!!

Thank you so much for the info. neurotherapy would be nice in a research atmosphere instead of a diagnosis/treatment for me.

I did more inquirey with CHADD and found a psychiatrist there who blogs his philosophy in my area. He seems to be quite on top of research and treatment. Thank you for your help... now i feel quite comfortable speaking to this doctor.

nah - not brilliant ... you should thank ppl like Carl Sagan or James Randi or mb John Baez or Richard Feynman .. they taught me to be skeptical :)

He's exactly like I used to be! I'm 18, in college, and now the homeworks are so many that I can't cope with everything I've to do everyday. I was diagnosed about 3 months ago, and now I comprehend a lot of things about myself. It'll help him in that he, if he has the disorder, will understand a lot of things that have happened to him, start learning coping skills immediately, and if you listen to him he'll feel he's being supported and not having to stand his parents in negation. Maybe he won't even need meds; yet, if he needs, he might be relieved. Just take him to the Dr. and listen to what they, both, the dr and your son, have to say.

Oh, BTW, I ended up having a bad case of ADHD combined type. After diagnosis and meds everything has become easier.