I have a bit of a problem and I wonder if I can share it and ask for your advice. I’m struggling to stay calm at the moment because I have a 14 year old grandson living with me and he is very upset right now and I don‘t want to make him any worse. He couldn’t sleep last night and went off to his room a few hours ago and fell asleep. I don’t have the heart to wake him just now.

Let me try to give you his story - the short version. My son and his wife were married about a year when they broke up, the boy was with his mum, he was 10 months old when he got hurt and he was taken from her, my son got custody, my son and the boy were on their own until the boy was eight, my son remarried and went on to have two more little boys close together, my grandson then 10 was becoming more and more unhappy and feeling pushed out, he was 11 when he asked if he could come live with me, I went for a residency order which no one objected to, the judge said the young man has voted with his feet!!

I got nothing from my son towards the boys keep and my grandson has only seen his dad about five times in three years. I never said a word to my son about the situation because I did not want to jeopardise the few visits he has with his son. But things are coming to a head and I am finding it more and more difficult not to bring my son to account for his behaviour towards his son. I do not understand it.

The latest problem is that the boy is going on a trip with his school, I sent for a passport for him and got a letter back saying he already has one in his name. I phoned my son and he said he would look for it and get back to me, he didn’t. I called him again and his wife tells me he is asleep and she refuses to wake him. I got quite annoyed and told her to wake him and have him call me or I would come over there myself and wake him.

I can deal with this in my own way but I am very conscious of how upset my grandson is and so I am holding back, getting ready to explode.

It’s not just the passport situation, it’s about my son’s attitude towards his son. The boy is very nice, absolutely no trouble whatsoever. I just don’t understand what is going on here. I find it impossible to talk to my son - a police officer.

My grandson suffers from bouts of depression and mild panic attack and doesn’t deal too well with stress. He has a ‘spell’ then he sleeps for a few hours and then he is okay for a while. I fixed for him to talk to someone last year, he went every week for six months and then refused to go again. Some days he will refuse to go to school. I don’t mean in a defiant way. He actually looks ill, very pale, and with swear on his forehead. It’s not so much that he refuses to go, he just can’t make himself go.

I have had meetings at the school and he has a special card that allows him to leave the classroom and go sit in the library if he isn’t feeling too good. I have made a few suggestions to him in an effort to help him, I asked if he would like to go and talk to someone again, he said no. I asked him if he would consider medication (it was just another option that came to mind), he said no. I don’t know what else to do. He is quite stuborn and quite strong willed, I cannot make him do anything. He will be 15 at the end of next month.

I would be very grateful for any help and suggestions you might have about what more I could do, or should be doing. Thanks.

Rose... is he in any kind of sports? Or clubs of any type? I know he doesn't want counseling, from what you just told us.

In my opinion, your son should be made accountable. But that's me. Let me think a while and see if I can figure some things out that may also help. I'd love to get some other opinions myself.. so anyone reading this.. please, if you think of anything, post it.

In the meantime,... hugs.

Bluerose, considering the age of your grandson, and how long things went on before he came to live with you, I would seek the advice of a good professional.

Mary,

No sports, no clubs. I have checked out the net and made loads of suggestions. Nothing takes his interest. I bought him a guitar and other things that I thought might at least give him something to do. He doesn't go out apart from school and an occasional visit to other family members. He's due to go away for a week and I am quite concerned because it'll be the first time he's been away. This is provided we get his passport sorted out.

I had my son call me back about that today and he asked to speak to my grandson but my grandson refused to speak to him. My son lives less than an hour away and my grandson hasn't seen him since boxing day! I have tried to be so reasonable and give him every opportunity to sort things out with his son if not with me.

It is very difficult to talk to my son. I know this is going to sound strange but he is a lot like my father and very moody. One word of conflict and he storms off. I just can't get through to him. And he looks at me like I am making too big a deal of this.

My grandson was doing very well but between the excitement of the trip and the passport hassle he is very low just now. It's breaking my heart.

:( aw Rose.. I wish I knew what would help.

Imnapl,

I think you might be right. He has been with me three year gone January. Before he came to stay with me I had been on my own since my divorce in 1991. When he came I was doing really well myself health wise and I knew I could help him, at least he wasn't a very young child, which might have been a different story. He was well able to do so much for himself. Over a period of time it came out that at home he had his own alarm clock, got himself up for school, got his own breakfast, walked to school, came home, went to his room, came down for tea and went back to his room. I was so sad when I heard all this, I had no idea. My son's new wife is ten years younger than him, just 18 when they married. She knew nothing about taking care of an eight year old. Then her own babies came and my grandson was pushed out more and more. Such a sad story and I have run out of ideas on how to help him.

Mary,

Don't worry. I think Imnapl might be right and it's time to seek some profesional help. He did talk to somone last year and has said that he doesn't want to go that route, but I might have to put my foot down. Not a week goes by without him having a 'very low point' which might only last half a day or so but it's hard to watch.

Mary,

Don't worry. I think Imnapl might be right and it's time to seek some profesional help. He did talk to somone last year and has said that he doesn't want to go that route, but I might have to put my foot down. Not a week goes by without him having a 'very low point' which might only last half a day or so but it's hard to watch.


might be a good idea. The sooner the better.

Yeah. I think so. I was upset and very tired when I posted the above. I'm sure it's not as bad as that but yes somethings needs to be done. I'm getting too old for this.

big hugs and I'm here if you need to talk

Thank you, I know you are. xx

I can deal with this in my own way but I am very conscious of how upset my grandson is and so I am holding back, getting ready to explode.Bluerose, this is why I think a good professional might be able to give you some advice on how to help your grandson and your son, hopefully without damaging either relationship. You are caught in the middle of a tough situation.

Thank you, I know you are. xx

You are welcome! xx

Imnapl,

Yes. Strange but true. Although I am the oldest family member left with younger siblings, we all have kids and grandkids, I do feel like 'pig in the middle' in this particular situation, and it’s a very strange feeling.

I’m going to let things settle down a bit and get back to sorting out this passport for the young guy. Once that’s sorted, depending on how he is over the next week or so, I might wait until after his trip to sit him down and have a serious chat about talking to someone professionally.

For some reason, known only to himself, my son has distanced himself from the whole family not just me. This has some family members (even my ex, his dad), out of concerned for me and my grandson, to become quite angry whenever the subject is brought up. So I tend not to look to them for advice.

Thanks for your kind and encouraging words. Like I said earlier, I was a bit upset and reached - and I was heard.

Bluerose,

Didn't I say that I wasn't qualified to give parenting advice because I don't have kids? :rolleyes: Yet, here I am... :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Ok, I'm not going to give parenting advice; I'm going to give you observations from my pre-law school days when I worked at a firm that represented children in abuse and neglect proceedings. I've also been a guardian ad litem for kids in foster care, and I went through many hours of training to prepare for that (so that's to make up for the utter dearth of parenting knowledge...) The end result will be to: 1) raise my glass to you many times with a hear hear for having taken him in; 2) underscore what Mary and Imnapl have said about professional help; and 3) perhaps suggest an approach to discussing the need for professional help with your grandson.

When you say that your grandson was hurt at about a year old and your son got custody, I read that your grandson was physically injured, possibly by abuse or neglect. If that's the case, then he suffered mightily as a young baby. Assuming, too, that your son did not have a major personality shift since the time when he was raising the boy on his own, then your grandson likely experienced a bit of emotional neglect, perhaps, before coming to you. The latter is actually in some ways worse than physical abuse or neglect in the effect that it can have on a child. Children who experience emotional neglect can become incapable of asking for help from anyone else. Physically abused kids (you, me, others) can actually at least have a sense that they matter to their parents, even if the way that they know that isn't terribly functional. So getting him professional help is probably pretty critical, because you've got a lot on your hands, there.

We had a lot of families on our firm's caseload when I was doing the child abuse and neglect work, and I developed this "sense" from reading those families' files, and then also from direct work with one family of four kids for whom I was a guardian ad litem, but I'm no psychologist and I could be totally off base here. But I think that kids do best when they're allowed to see other adults "disapproving" of their parents' bad behavior. This doesn't mean that he needs to see you explode at your son/his father. It just means that I think that it's ok to say to a kid, "I'm disappointed in your father for X, Y, and Z, because I think that those things hurt your feelings, but honey, understand that your father does them because he's not particularly good at: 1, 2, 3 and it has nothing to do with you. That's about him, not you." I guess I see that as the segue to seeking professional help; you let him know that you're not, in any sense suggesting that he's "wrong" or "mentally ill" for feeling the way that he does, but that the ways that his father have failed to parent him so far (which have nothing to do with your grandson and everything to do with these unfortunate things with his father, who is still worthy of love and blah blah blah) are hard things for a kid to bear, and a therapist can offer ways of understanding those things, and cataloging them, and accepting them that will help him (your grandson) to feel better. Just my two cents.

I almost wonder if books on co-parenting for divorced couples might be helpful to you.

Ah, Bluerose. I'm so sorry for you and your family (all of them). Your son will one day likely suffer mightily with this guilt, don't you think? So sad.

It reminds me of a 12 y.o. boy on our caseload. He was in foster care and his father (who had done well up to that point) had fallen off the wagon and become drunk. His father had a criminal history of attempted homicide when drunk, and the foster mother (who knew the family) was petrified of the father for that reason. When the father showed up at the foster home, this 12 y.o. boy walked out, faced down his father and said (with the boy's three baby sisters peering out in terror from an upstairs window), "You need to leave right now or I will call the police. And I never want to see you again if you've been drinking." Twelve. Twelve and a bigger man than many men I've known before and since. Yes, that was hard for him. Yes, it complicates his relationships with others to this day, I am sure. Yes, he grew up way too fast. But he at least he had the self-esteem to draw that boundary. I couldn't help myself when I learned that story from the foster mom. It made me cry. I told him that I was very proud of him, and he smiled shyly.

You go, Bluerose. You're probably saving your grandson's life, you know.

Sandy

Sandy,

Lol! I've raised a few glasses to myself too, Sandy. And to the young guy for how he is dealing with it all. He's no slouch, he's trying really hard. And apart from threatening to hide my hearts medication when I'm 'older' and he's looking after me, he is awesome!

Needless to say the whole story is quite complicated. And yes I believe he was emotionally neglected. I think the young one's refusal to take his dad's call the other day is his way of beginning to stand up to him or to stand up for himself. I have told him that it's okay for him to be angry with his dad and that I am angry with him too just now. It is sad but, as a family, we have come through sadder. This is a very sad situation and there is no cure, the only way to cope with this is to learn to deal with it. And maybe that's something I can help my grandson with. My son will just have to sort out his own problems.

A very worthy two cents. Thank you.

Well, you go, Grrrrrrrrllll, that's all I have to say! You're a gem.

It was not a grandmother who saved me (although my father's mother might have if she could have), but a group of teachers. They say that it only takes one, so I'm glad that your grandson has you.

Again, Bluerose, kudos to you.

Sandy

http://i26.tinypic.com/2zp2tu9.jpg http://i29.tinypic.com/mav79u.jpg

This is my grandson.

The first one is of him when he first came to stay with me.
And the second one was taken at my brother's wedding last summer.

The pictures say a lot, don't they?

hugs BR ..xxx I have read page one, and so far haven't seen if he has contact with his bio mother. As much as I know she hurt him (possibly) and he has no contact, has anyone looked into the fact he may be wondering why he's not there, or why SHE doesn't want him (in his eyes anyway?)

As logical as we are, his bond to his mother, although he hasn't lived with her etc, is very very strong, and he may have issues with that, that he may not want to or be able to talk about..

Tracy,

He met his mum for the first time just before Christmas and learned that he has another three brothers. Spent part of Christmas with his mum's new family. Everything went well. But in January when he was due to go for a visit he decided he didn't want to go, when I asked him why he said he didn't know her, he said they are strangers to me. It seems they had a talk and she asked him to forgive her and he did. That's just another mile stone, it had to happen sooner or later. Now it's time for him to take the time to get his head around it all. If only his dad would just do the same, I believe it would go a long way to help the boy heal.

hugs xx It's hard....

Sandy - From your past legal experience, don't you think Bluerose should seek legal advice and go after her son for some financial support?

Mole, I have no idea: 1) I'm not a family lawyer; 2) such law varies from state to state in the US; and 3) Bluerose is in Scotland.

In the US, if the boy was a ward of the state, many states would still pay Bluerose for fostering him, which is what I'd call what she's doing. They'd also pay for therapy, etc., and then the state would actually go after the parents for financial support. But I have NO IDEA how the UK handles it. Sorry, Bluerose. Not much use to you there. It's something that would have to be answered by someone allowed to practice where you are, at a minimum.

Sandy

Thanks Sandy. Obviously more complicated than I thought.

In the US, if the boy was a ward of the state, many states would still pay Bluerose for fostering him, which is what I'd call what she's doing. They'd also pay for therapy, etc.,This is the case in B.C. too. I'm not sure what the rest of Canada does.

Sandy,

I moved from Scotland to just outside London in 1970. Laws are different in Scotland and England. But I don’t want to go that route. I live quite simply and we manage okay. The only time financial support or lack of comes to my mind is when I have trouble getting my son’s co-operation. Like just now, and the thing that started all this a few days ago, I sent for a passport for my grandson because he is going on a school trip next month. A few days ago I got a letter saying that the boy already had a passport. I called my son to ask about it and we had some words and he hung up on me. I finally filled in the form saying that the passport had been misplaced and sent it off. Now we are just keeping our fingers crossed that he gets a new passport - soon. I don’t ask him for anything and I don’t want to. I’m just too angry with him. Not for the circumstances that brought my grandson to live with me, but for his lack of effort to keep in touch with his son.