This is a commonly used "herb" in Thailand, and has recently acquired a popular reputation among online purchasers in other countries. I've read that it's used a lot by opiate addicts for withdrawal/recovery but it has other uses as well. (look for citations via Google if you don't believe me.)

It is unscheduled in the United States (last time I checked anyway.) So I'm wondering has anyone ever tried this, for any purpose? From user reports (erowid.org), it has stimulating effects at lower dosages and more of an opiate-like effect at higher doses.

What did you think of it?

It has the same action as other opiates but with a large amount of chemical induced nausea from the witches brew of alkaloids it contains.

Sorry to bump this back up, but I'm sure someone here knows something about this subject... but perhaps have not bothered to reply yet...?

Sorry to bump this back up, but I'm sure someone here knows something about this subject... but perhaps have not bothered to reply yet...?

My analysis of it is spot on. If your a masochist and love negative side effects than I recommend kratom. Its not a substance suitable for treating any condition. If you want a legitimate opiate with an antidepressant action look into tramadol . I've heard at least one person on the autism spectrum who did not respond to stimulants find tramadol a useful drug for his problems. Some doctors are under the false impression tramadol has significant abuse potential
though.

I find it hard to believe that the many Kratom addicts in Thailand (where recreational usage is now considered illegal) would use this stuff if there were so many negative effects. I could be wrong, I may not have enough insight into this subject, but just my guess.

People tend not to become addicted something if it makes them feel horrible.

I wish I could contribute to this discussion, but when I tried to order it from on online herbal shop, it never showed up. Not a scam or anything - they never took money out of my account, but I had ordered some kratom and some other herb and it was like they never got the order at all.

I probably should have called and found out what happenend but that would have required too much effort, you know, follow-through and initiative and all that. :rolleyes:

I have taken kratom a few times at doses beyond those for stimulant purposes so I can't comment on that, but I can say something about higher, recreational doses.

I've made kratom tea a couple times and another time just swallowed several grams of resin. The tea was much more effective, although it tasted incredibly foul and the only way I could drink it was to mix it with a large amount of honey. I did experience some nausea for about an hour but no vomiting, but as anyone who's ever taken any serious opiates knows, if the drug is good you won't care even if you do vomit. I would describe the high as similar to opiates although with more heady effects and not quite the same extent of euphoria. A lot of the same kinds of side effects are there, like nausea, itching, sweating, etc., and the high feeling is definitely similar, just not as long lasting or blissful as something like morphine or oxys.

However be warned that although kratom is legal this in no way means it's weak or safe to use frequently. Kratom addiction is a serious problem in Thailand and the only reason the drug isn't criminalized in the US is because of its obscurity.

I can't comment on therapeutic use of kratom but it is much stronger than something like Tramadol as far as analgesia and euphoria go. If anyone does try kratom you should be very careful about the dosage as the difference between a recreational dose and an overdose is not that large. Although I've never heard of anyone lethally overdosing on kratom (though it can probably happen), you can expect hours of intense vomiting, agitation, and disphoria if you dose too high.

I wish I could contribute to this discussion, but when I tried to order it from on online herbal shop, it never showed up. Not a scam or anything - they never took money out of my account, but I had ordered some kratom and some other herb and it was like they never got the order at all.

I probably should have called and found out what happenend but that would have required too much effort, you know, follow-through and initiative and all that. :rolleyes:

Please keep us posted if/when you do get the product.

I got some of the dried leaf material once from an online vendor and very clumsily prepared it (put the stuff in a coffeemaker, basically) and I hated the effects, but I later learned that at that time, there was a lot of "fake Kratom" on the market (it was basically a similar plant with some psychoactive effects, but not Kratom.) I'm not sure if I got the fake stuff, but whatever it was, it made me feel spaced out and depressive.

I have taken kratom a few times at doses beyond those for stimulant purposes so I can't comment on that, but I can say something about higher, recreational doses.

I've made kratom tea a couple times and another time just swallowed several grams of resin. The tea was much more effective, although it tasted incredibly foul and the only way I could drink it was to mix it with a large amount of honey. I did experience some nausea for about an hour but no vomiting, but as anyone who's ever taken any serious opiates knows, if the drug is good you won't care even if you do vomit. I would describe the high as similar to opiates although with more heady effects and not quite the same extent of euphoria. A lot of the same kinds of side effects are there, like nausea, itching, sweating, etc., and the high feeling is definitely similar, just not as long lasting or blissful as something like morphine or oxys.

However be warned that although kratom is legal this in no way means it's weak or safe to use frequently. Kratom addiction is a serious problem in Thailand and the only reason the drug isn't criminalized in the US is because of its obscurity.

I can't comment on therapeutic use of kratom but it is much stronger than something like Tramadol as far as analgesia and euphoria go. If anyone does try kratom you should be very careful about the dosage as the difference between a recreational dose and an overdose is not that large. Although I've never heard of anyone lethally overdosing on kratom (though it can probably happen), you can expect hours of intense vomiting, agitation, and disphoria if you dose too high.

That's why it's best to start with a smaller dosage and gauge the effects.

I wonder if I should even bother with Kratom at all... I'm an addictive personality and if I use something that works nicely once, I KNOW I'm going to use it again (and again, and again), and I have no discipline about using only on certain days of the week. Maybe this drug-seeking behavior I've gotten into, this constant craving, means it is time to start medicating my ADD.

I'm a former addict and every day I wish I could use my choice substances again, every day I feel bored and understimulated, could this somehow be related to ADD...

What do you guys think about all this? Would it be smart for me to even try a high quality Kratom... the advantage is it might keep me away from craving other things such as alcohol (I was addicted to that too and it's been a long road to stay off it.) The disadvantage is that daily usage, for most things anyway, has become something of a norm for me. It's part of a whole set of rituals and routines.

I have taken Kratom on and off for the past 2 years. I usually take the 15x powder and it is similar (actually better IMO) than taking an opiate. The downside is my thought process; it is legal and therefore can not be too addicting . . . wrong! I have spend well over $12,000 on this substance and it helped immensly with my ADHD (combined) symptoms - but the cost far out weights the benefits.

I have taken Kratom on and off for the past 2 years. I usually take the 15x powder and it is similar (actually better IMO) than taking an opiate. The downside is my thought process; it is legal and therefore can not be too addicting . . . wrong! I have spend well over $12,000 on this substance and it helped immensly with my ADHD (combined) symptoms - but the cost far out weights the benefits.

I can't imagine it would be too wise to use this stuff before venturing into a public environment (like school or work)... but is that what you used it for?

I say so because the effects can be unpredictable, it can go from stimulant to relaxant in a matter of hours, from what I read.

For me, I took it for coming off of opiates after my surgery and then I continued to take it for the energy it gave me. It actually helped me focus on my work - I am a graphic/website designer and my creativity was flowing with this stuff. You build up a tolerance to it real quick and then need more to get the same effects (as with anything).

This is a commonly used "herb" in Thailand, and has recently acquired a popular reputation among online purchasers in other countries. I've read that it's used a lot by opiate addicts for withdrawal/recovery but it has other uses as well. (look for citations via Google if you don't believe me.)

It is unscheduled in the United States (last time I checked anyway.) So I'm wondering has anyone ever tried this, for any purpose? From user reports (erowid.org), it has stimulating effects at lower dosages and more of an opiate-like effect at higher doses.

What did you think of it?

I've taken Kratom. If you get the right dosage, it's just like eating a 10mg Hydrocodone. There are certain variates. The three main ones are Thai, Bali, and Indonesian. The Thai is more of a speedy type herb, the others are like opiates. The Bali is the cheapest, but you have to eat/drink more to feel the effects. I would roll with some UEI (Ultra Enhanced Indo), that stuff is the best. It's kind of expensive, but doesn't take much to feel the effects.

Then you can start getting into tincures, but that's not really necessary. I'd just get the UEI.

KratomCafe.com - reliable source!

Despite its sort of legendary status amongst most online drug communities. My cat claims that it seemed like a very expensive weak opiate that takes far to much to get you to that nodding euphoria that all good junkies shoot for. My cat while experienced with all sorts of opiates aside from street versions says he prefers more natural means of experiencing opiates over pharmaceuticals and kratom broke his little heart as it didnt really pan out to be that great.

Despite its sort of legendary status amongst most online drug communities. My cat claims that it seemed like a very expensive weak opiate that takes far to much to get you to that nodding euphoria that all good junkies shoot for. My cat while experienced with all sorts of opiates aside from street versions says he prefers more natural means of experiencing opiates over pharmaceuticals and kratom broke his little heart as it didnt really pan out to be that great.

What kind did your little cat eat? Or shall I say, burn? ;)

"meow meow mow mow meow"

I belive that means super indo from a certain bouncing bear. Im not sure what bears have to do with it but ill take his word.

http://www.wholesaleshamanicherbs.com/images/180px-7-hydroxymitragynine.gif

^^^7-hydroxymitragynine is supposedly a potent and selective mu-agonist found in kratom, but not in large amounts. It could be isolated with relative ease.

The stimulation that people get from kratom is probably due soley to the alpha-2 antagonism, which most people can agree is not particularly pleasant (yohimbine!)

7-HO-Mitragynine, however, is not an alpha-2 antagonist, and is highly potent. On a mg to mg basis, it is likely as potent as oxycodone...

"meow meow mow mow meow"

I belive that means super indo from a certain bouncing bear. Im not sure what bears have to do with it but ill take his word.

Interesting. I had a cat that would eat 10mg Hydrocodones like they were skittles all day long and that stuff still got his rocks off - MEOW!!


:):D;):o:eek::cool::p

My cat usually enjoys pod tea once in a great while and if you're familiar with it you know how potent it is.

I've taken Kratom. If you get the right dosage, it's just like eating a 10mg Hydrocodone. There are certain variates. The three main ones are Thai, Bali, and Indonesian. The Thai is more of a speedy type herb, the others are like opiates. The Bali is the cheapest, but you have to eat/drink more to feel the effects. I would roll with some UEI (Ultra Enhanced Indo), that stuff is the best. It's kind of expensive, but doesn't take much to feel the effects.

Then you can start getting into tincures, but that's not really necessary. I'd just get the UEI.

KratomCafe.com - reliable source!

I forgot to mention the different types - UEI, one of the best - no doubt. I surely spent my fair share with many of the vendors. For beginners that are interested and not sure which one to try; I would start with flaglercafe, she offers a variety pack for a pretty decent price, plus throws in extras. Darn forums, now I am thinking about Kratom - loved it a little too much. :D :rolleyes: One more thing, you can Google "kratom for ADHD" the results are pretty interesting.

My cat usually enjoys pod tea once in a great while and if you're familiar with it you know how potent it is.

Hmmm, have never tried that but have read a lot about it. Being ADHD; my cat, dog, horse, pig, chicken (heck the whole farm) would be too into this. :D

My cat usually enjoys pod tea once in a great while and if you're familiar with it you know how potent it is.

Ah, but it's better not to tempt an addictive personality (like me) with opiates.

A watered-down "opiate effect" would be just right for me. Pod tea might be a bit "too good" ...

I must ask though, what is the "stimulant" effect of the Thai kratom like? Is it a bit too edgy and/or anxious, or more of a pleasant stimulation?