As I visited my father's grave last week (he passed of a heart attack at a young age) the thought of the harm I may be doing to my body by using Adderall daily has been haunting me. I am in my mid-40's and want to live to see my daughter graduate from college, get married, etc.. I feel that if I don't take steps now the grim reaper will appear sooner then I'd want.

I've been doing a lot of research and no matter how I frame it my using amphetimine at 60mgs is neurotoxic(as AMP depletes DT and NT, vs just the reuptake). On the other hand, while WB is not free of side-effects (it is a modified form of Tenuate, an AMP-like drug), at least it does only the reuptake and is easier on the heart.

Therefore, I've decided to taper off of Adderall and keep my script for only when needed. I do need a med for my ADD (else, I can't function), however, I'll only use the 450mgs of Wellbutrin as my daily must take med (I also have to layoff the NoDoz and sudfed, as I've been popping them both like tictacs lately).

If I could take Strattera I would, but the tiredness was too much to bear and this fostered a nasty NoDoz and Sudfed habit to counteract. However, WB is another option and at least it does not make me tired (I hate being tired or feeling sleepy because of a med).

Has anyone else felt the same way about reducing a pureplay Stim, going with WB as the primary ADD med?

Thanks for letting me vent:)

I was just telling another member about my Wellbutrin experiences via private message.

I can only speak for my personal experience and for what my Dr has told me. I've taken it 3 different times. 1st time for about 4 months. The 2nd for about 3 months and the last time for about 8 months. I think Wellbutrin is wonderful for depression and helped my ADD as well since I was untreated up until recently. At any time after 6 months on the RX, many people develop anger, aggression and extreme irritability. For me, slowly happened and caught me unaware since I'd never heard of this possibility and I'm far from an angry, aggressive person. After getting so angry I thought my head would pop one day... I started weaning off.

I guess if you know to be on the lookout for this, then it's not such a big deal.... I simply didn't know until it happened. THEN my Dr. said, "oh yeah, that happens a lot on Wellbutrin". Yay. I don't know if it matters but the last time on it was the only time I was taking the generic. HTH.

I had an anger episode while on wellbutrin. I hope to recognize and diffuse it if another
manifests itself. I am going from 1 WB SR a day to 2 WB SR/day today. .

Thanks for the tip, guys. I've been on Wellbutrin for about a month now. Upped my dose to 450mg today... so I'll make sure to monitor myself. I do not have the body for being angry. I'll get my *** kicked. :(

I've found that I still need my daily dose of Adderall and the Wellbutrin - after being on both seperately - I believe it the synergistic effect of taking the two together - that works for me and makes me feel normal and balanced (I have LD and the ADHD). I need the Adderall to get motivated first thing, along with three NoDoz and a 12 hour sudafed, but then the WB which I take an hour later sustains it. I describe it as - the AMP does it's intiual release of DT and then WB locks it in (DT reuptake). If I take the WB at 8:00am, I am good up until 6:00pm when I take 30mgs of AMP iR (and of course 2-3 cups of coffee and another 12 hour sudafed). I'd rather do without the Addy, but I've resigned to the fact of needing it. And viseversa, the Addy without having the WB leaves me semi-focused but scatterd. It's almost as if the two alieviate the side effects of each other (i.e., no euphoria - yea!!, which is something I don't want - NOT worth chasing) and strengthens the benfits of each other (i.e., the Addy lasts much longer and there is NO CRASH). Not sure why this is the case accept that the two molecules are so close in structure (Tenuate which WB is derived from, is similar to AMP but from the Khat plant instead vs. MaHung which ephedra - precurser to AMP/Adderall is extracted from) to each other and that WB is long lasting. The combo is working well - so hopefully I can get off the celexa I take at night. I wish I didn't have to take anything however, but I need to function.

Regards.

PS- I was reading a med journal and the advice was the WB should only be given as an AD after an SSRi fails as the drop off rate is high due to "over stimulation". I wonder if Glaxo will reinvigrate the WB ADHD studies (which rated its effectiveness on-par with Ritian), and get approval of using WB for ADHD, instead of off lablel. In my opinion, it is equal in effectiveness to Adderall - but it so happens that I and many others just need both meds (like a magnet needs steel:)).

Hi! Wellbutrin is an odd drug! Over the past 4 or so years I have used it several times- and have had all sorts of effects, both good and bad and rather toxic. Even at a smaller than usual dose of 150mg It never wiped out my ADHD. But did an OK job on the depression that comes along with my ADHD. And has some lovely aphrodisiac effects too:)
But irritability, bad temper, back,(flank-kidney) pain, weird sensations, a rotton egg smelling urine, and more, made me quit taking it.
I am now on Dex with no neg side effects and will be on it as long as it works:)

WB is a good add in ADHD med, when Dex/Addy aren't cutting it soley, but you do'nt want to add in additional Dex/Addy late in the afternoon/evening. Also, the XL is really an all day med - vs Addrall XR which may wear off in 8 hours. However, if I didn't have slow-brain in the AM (therefore need the harder stim booster), it would be my prefered med, and I feel it is a good standalone ADHD med for longevity and durability. I was on Straterra for a year (100mg daily) and hands down - WB was more helpful with my ADHD, I began to get organized without even realizing it on the WB. Also, Staterra made me very very very tired and lethargic, yet raised my BP and gave me sleepless nights - I was a zombie.

On the other hand, WB was easier on my BP/Heart - boosted the NE, just like Straterra, but also kicked in the DT benefit Straterra didn't cover, and I never felt tired (why they give it to CF and Narcalepsy patients).

It is an odd med nonetheless, direved from an amphetimine-like drug, but marketed as an AD; it takes time to build in your system but you can feel it wearoff much like a pureplay stim (unlike Sraterra which just lasts like an SSRI). It can overstimulate some but also quiet the mind's chatter. It only blocks 35% of DT reuptake - but the chemical interplay makes it more effective then a med that would block off signifigantly greater amounts of dopamine. It blocks nicotine/drug cravings - just like Adderall does for cocaine, but is less abusable because it is long lasting and tolerence needs to build. On the otherhand many report the withdraw effects (extreme tiredness and iritability), are enough to warrrant staying on the drug (sounds much like Adderall withdraw). Finally, just like the parent drug Tenuate and Adderall, WB diminishes appetite and raises the overall metabloism rate - hence an off label diet drug. It is the only DNRI that is not a scheduled II drug.

I've had the jaw-clenching thing since starting and I've been on it for about a month or so now, just upped it to 450mg/day and I'm noticing anger as well.

It's nothing uncontrollable, but like I'll see a guy cut in line and just want to smash his face. That only lasts for a split second until I catch myself. I don't see myself ever acting out on it, it's just a weird feeling.

Im going through the same situation right now. I've been through strattera, ritalin, concerta, and more recently the adderall i've been taking for over 6 months, but I feel that the adderall doesn't cut it and although it helps me focus to do homework, I don't have any organization in my life -- I'm a mess.
I started wellbutrin about 3 weeks ago to see if it would help, because I felt that the adderall was clouding my mind and causing me to not function without it. I noticed right on the first day of wellbutrin xl that the adderall still in my system lasted so much longer.
In my experience so far, I find wellbutrin to be a great add on to adderall, but by itself it doesn't quite cut it. However, at 300-450mgs it does significantly reduce the need for it, like instead of taking my regular 40mgs per day, I would feel about the same by taking only 15mgs. So it seems that wellbutrin is a good choice for someone that wants to tamper off adderall or any other stimulate, like nicotine. :)

I'm just wondering, does wellbutrin take a while to build up like strattera? I've been taking it for 3 weeks at 300mgs and although it has helped with getting up in the moring and the effectiveness of adderall, I didn't notice any improvement with the mess in my life. I was hoping it would help me organize my life and time a little better. How long did it take for you guys until you noticed any improvement with organization?

after months on wellbutrin, I usually find myself calm yet overly confident... Yet I have noticed the overly confident feeling of it too lately, I'll start doing something that I don't like and start really talking it up , and start really laying into people. the arrogance doesn't fit well in the work field... I've noticed the anger too lately, normally I have a pretty normal temperment but I can lose it easily. Lately after like 3 months I've just started laying into people and getting so mad that I feel I could lose it any minute...Kinda cool actually but not worth it.

Samm-

I've found that the best thing for my ability to clean up my life and mess was as simple as taking a breather in life and stop thinking about what I can't do and how I feel in the moment.... Sometimes when you have adhd people can start just bossing you and you'll listen because you have no ability to process on your own.... Its confidence, blow off all your things to do list on a day and take time for yourself, not just working out but time to just relax for an hour or so and not concern yourself with this and that and everybody's elses slant or depiction on life and how it should be or how it should not be....Life is subjective , your the boss... Personally, I've found that just by relaxing and saying it's all good that I've found my stims to work better , and you rely on them less. Next thing I knew I was finishing touch up painting on my house and training my dog and not worried about catching up with the Jones's ..... Yet, 3 weeks is early , I'd give it 12 weeks-

Yeah, doc said to give it 6 weeks or so to fully kick in. And I have to agree, because since upping my dosage every day has been "different" and I think overall I'm improving.

By the way, anybody have trouble sleeping on Wellbutrin? I've upped my dosage to 450mg and I find myself waking up a lot at night. It's possible that's just stress related, though, because I have so much work to do this week (like grad school applications). But I don't usually let those things bother me, so I find it kind of weird that it would stop me from getting a normal night's sleep.

war-

I'd say it's the welly , you will just have to give your body time and this side should reside

That's cool, I'll sleep it off this weekend. ;)

after months on wellbutrin, I usually find myself calm yet overly confident... Yet I have noticed the overly confident feeling of it too lately, I'll start doing something that I don't like and start really talking it up , and start really laying into people. the arrogance doesn't fit well in the work field... I've noticed the anger too lately, normally I have a pretty normal temperment but I can lose it easily. Lately after like 3 months I've just started laying into people and getting so mad that I feel I could lose it any minute...Kinda cool actually but not worth it.


That's how I got to be as well... pretty much. I started to get really angry over little things. Since I'm not an angry person it really caught be off guard. I do wish I could figure out a way around that.. like taking a month or 2 off the RX every 5 or 6 months.. I dunno. This was the most effective RX I've ever been on, I would really like to take it and have it stay as it is for the 1st few months.

Also, to answer the OP, it did effect my sleep in the beginning. Then there's the CRAZZZZY dreams. wow. :D

I can't say it totally improved attention though. the only thing I ever noticed was the next day prior to redosing I'd feel great. I'd say that has something to do with the improved amount of dopamine and the receptors in your body. Then at redosing it slowed me down a bit, and I felt a good bit below of my normal functioning abilities... I don't know, it does help and it must be the depression that it kicked away and that is what I'm attributing the good normal feeling too, but after awhile I'd feel much better taking off the med for a few weeks.... If I've learned anything it's that my adhd meds do work and that mostly I was slightly depressed "environmentally " that is , but thats common in adhd people since we rely so much on our environment stimulus... I have to say I have laid off the wellbutrin for the past few days and I feel unbelievable... If I were getting too angry , honestly I'd start taking the welly every other day- All I can say now is that it's good to feel back and in control of my life...Thanks wellbutrin, job well done

so you felt better when you stopped wellbutrin? then take it now and then if you get irritated every other day?
just wanted to clarify in my mind what you meant
TIA

Wellbutrin is effective when the dosage, time taken are consistent for a durative period. If there is a stop/start, stop/start and alteration of the perscribed theraputic dose - the med will fail to provide full benefit, and it will magnify side-effects. Wellbutrin is a CNS stimulant - but it takes time to build in the system - making it last longer and less abusable. Perhaps this could have been contributing to the side effects. (My first cousin is a Dr. of Pharm, and I've bounced enough questions off of her to understand the aforementioned.)

I use the med soley for ADHD purposes, and in my case, Adderall has been the more productive AD.

When I was taking 72mgs of Concerta I found it to be ineffective, but as soon as I added my starting dose of Wellbutrin 150mgs SR - I found myself getting organized, using my PalmT3 which now I use all the time, and regularlly cleaning. It just happened with the combo. When I was on Concerta/Adderall without the WB, I was lazy let me clothes pile and only semi-focused. There is no magic though YOU must put some skin in the game (and as I learned taking "The Forum" way back in 1989) and be willing to be unreasonable with yourself and sometimes "do what you do not want to do". I also have LD, but I pushed myself to graduate from two colleges with good GPA's and landed good jobs (which - unfortanately, I recently lost my most recent one as a VP due to the Wallstreet/IT market crash:().

One final comment, run google searches - there are numerious, consective studies that verify WB as being as effective as Ritilan for ADHD. This just goes to show that each of us is unique and as such require a differnt mix/combo or type of med to treat the symptoms of ADHD.

Sorry for the sermon.:)

All the Best!

Wellbutrin is effective when the dosage, time taken are consistent for a durative period. If there is a stop/start, stop/start and alteration of the perscribed theraputic dose - the med will fail to provide full benefit, and it will magnify side-effects. Wellbutrin is a CNS stimulant - but it takes time to build in the system - making it last longer and less abusable. Perhaps this could have been contributing to the side effects. (My first cousin is a Dr. of Pharm, and I've bounced enough questions off of her to understand the aforementioned.)




I'm guessing that you are speaking to the OP and not me? I agree with you that you can't possibly have the desired effect without consistent dosing. Given the mood change I'd encounter if I were a few hours late on a dose I can't imagine the consequences of skipping them altogether. Again, I really wish I could still take Wellbutrin.. I plan on talking with my new Dr about how I might can work around the side effects I dealt with after 7 (wonderfully productive) months on the RX. My appt seems sooooo far away. :S

How long have you taken it? Have you never had any problems with anger or irritability (beyond a usual, reasonable emotion) due to the Wellbutrin? It would be encouraging to know that you've been able to take it long term without these issues.

recruitdir-

thanks for the data, actually I find your post interesting and helpful. I cannot say that the wellbutrin has organized me as you described that it has organized you in the past in combination with your stimulant ( of course I had been using the wb xl in combo with concerta) . Recently, although I had been consistent day in and day out I found that I would start feeling okay at times but most of the time I found myself a bit mentally very mechanical and was having alot of processing and short term memory issues which is not like me. Thus, I started not taking it , "it's been about 3 days off wellbutrin and I have since switched to focalin xr and have been doing and understanding things much better. I was having so many processing problems while taking the wellbutrin...ie I feel as though I kept taking things the wrong way which normally I never do... Maybe I wasn't taking enough as I was on the 150xl. Either way I am only taking the focalin xr now and finally got work done on my house and felt normal and had no memory issues as I was having on the wellbutrin xl. I feel as though it was helping but I cannot have any additional processing issues as adhd presents that when the meds wear off.... The wellbutrin was negatively effecting my attention and ability to understand.

Godessenahiway & Hollywood,

I appreciate your responses. I've taken the WB for the better part of one year and I've found many of the side-effects disappate and the theraputic benefit increases in time. Have not had memory issues with WB and the memory issues I had from Addrerall disappeared with WB. The biggest benefit for my ADHD/LD is the longterm duration of the med (XL version), and therefore, unlike just Adderall - I take it in the AM and still have the effect at night. Adderall XR, Concerta, et al just wore off in too quickly however, in combo with the WB, appear to last much longer.

However, each of us have unique needs - therefore, what works for me - may not work for you and vice versa.

All the very best.

recruit-

what was your dosage that you were taking of the wellbutrin xl? I think if I give it more time that may be the key. I found myself emotional to a point on the wellbutrin at times, which is not my style

Hollywood,

I take 1 300XL in the AM and 1 150SR at Noon for a 450mg total. I didn't get pronounced ADHD treatment benefit until 300mgs.

I appreciate your responses. I've taken the WB for the better part of one year and I've found many of the side-effects disappate and the theraputic benefit increases in time.


Thanks so much for the info. It's VERY good to hear this and I will keep it in mind at my appt. :)

Hollywood,

I take 1 300XL in the AM and 1 150SR at Noon for a 450mg total. I didn't get pronounced ADHD treatment benefit until 300mgs.

do you tolerate the 300xl once a day better than 150 SR 2x day ?
or have you always been on the xl ?
TIA:)

Yay! I'm back on Bupropion (aka Wellbutrin). I hope that knowing what now know and with a great Psychiatrist keeping tabs on how this works, I'll have great results.

Most likely at some point I'll need to add something else. For now it's an experiment to see what happens so I've stopped my Straterra (wasn't working for me anyways).

Hey goddessonahiway, hope the Wellbutrin works for you!

Here's my unnecessarily long take on taking WB for longterm therapy.

I've had a couple years of experience on Wellbutrin, mainly for depression. For me the side effects (dry mouth, nausea, fast heart rate/slight anxiety, little to no appetite) went away after a couple of weeks. It helps to not research the side effects (especially the seizure info) tooooo extensively because that too causes anxiety. I've gone through periods of thinking that everything sucks, my brain's not working the way I want it to, so maybe WB's just not right for me... and so I've tried WB with other meds, or just new meds without any WB, or even no meds at all. Each time, the only real conclusion I've reached with my doctors is that WB works for me. It's not the end all be all, especially since I've now been diagnosed with ADD (AHHHH!!!! WHAT?!?!?! Ohhh that explains a lot), but I guess I am one example of someone who has been able to live at least a little better by consistently taking WB.

I have taken both SR and XL versions, maxing out at 300mg (I'm a small chick... 5'0" and 105 lbs), I have had periods of being instructed to take it once in the morning, or twice a day split into morning and afternoon. I did experience some mood swings last year and was put on Lamictal (even though I'm not bi-polar) which didn't work. So there definitely are some aspects of WB that either heighten my negatives or cause them, but I say...it's worth it because it brings the positives to light. It's better than not being on it. Because then it's a free for all in my brain. And those times when I think it's not working? Those times are when I take for granted all the good things it does for me, like control over my emotions/less impulsiveness, the ability to motivate myself (which I must mention is different from feeling enthusiastic about life simply by popping a pill), less fogginess, ability to want to seek happiness, and all that other cheesy stuff which usually results in increased productivity and a better quality of life in general. It's just easy to overlook those things because it's subtle and you come to accept them as part of your real life. Which is how, I think, a successful medication should work.

I was most recently put on Strattera without Wellbutrin since they're not to be taken together, but since it was hell for me, my doctor wants me back on the WB so that I'm at "baseline", which means that we will address my ADD-specific med needs only in conjunction with the WB. It definitely does help with my ADD because the times when I haven't been on it, not only am I depressed but I basically can't get a thing done. But we want to try adding on something that'll work together so that more of the not so great pieces in my brain can stand a chance at getting better...if that makes any sense.

So that's just my experience on it. Everyone's brains/bodies are different, yadda yadda. Like some people just love Strattera, the thought of it makes me want to vom. :)

after a few months off , I'm starting to actually think that angry people get more work done and do and think more. I did more doing when I was a bit upset than I do daydreaming which is what I do even when I can focus with stims. I think the stim + wellbutrin combination is a good one , heck right now I'd like to be a little angry ... Anything to put a fire under me might help

Hey goddessonahiway, hope the Wellbutrin works for you!



Hi! Parts of your story sound a lot like mine. I've given up on WB 3 times, tried other things and always come back to it. The Strattera was pretty awful for me. If you wouldn't mind PM'ing me about the experience you had with taking the WB in conjunction with Lamictal, I'd appreciate it. If I start having the mood swings again, my P-Dr is prolly going to try something like that along with it. For some reason that's scary to me. BTW, I'm also a small chick at 5'0" ~ 115 # and I'm on 300mg a day of the SR. I took 150mg for 5 days then went up to my full dose.

Thanks for replying and sharing. :)

I think I discontinue alot because many times I start to read to far into these forums and then I come to the conclusion that we are on drugs and I don't want to view things that way. The facts are without stimulants I don't understand other people and cannot for a second pay attention. I'll just sit there and rethink the same concept over and over until finally I understand what was initially said , sadly thats usually after half an hour has gone by.