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jlsachs

01-20-09, 01:39 PM

Hi everyone,

I've been lurking around the forums for the last couple weeks. It's nice to see such a tight, helpful online community geared to ADD. Makes me feel like I've got you guys to turn to, since so much of what I've read here I can relate to. That's not something I get a whole lot. So I'd like to begin with a Thank You to all the members of this forums for being there for each other and sharing your experiences. It makes the world a whole lot smaller. :)

Last Tuesday (1/13/09) I had my first appointment with a psychiatrist. I've known I have ADD for some years now, but I never got diagnosed. I always figured I could make myself who I wanted or needed to be if I manipulated myself psychologically and tried hard enough. After three years of a mediocre college career that should have been straight A's, given my very successful high school career, I finally accepted that I won't be able to do everything I want in my life if I didn’t get this resolved. The psychiatrist prescribed me 10 mg generic Adderall IR, and told me take one in the morning and one at lunch. She also said I could take them as needed if I rather not have a daily regimen. After the research I've done on these forums I understand it takes time to get adjusted to them and I need to play around with the dosage a bit, but I'm hoping maybe you guys can share some insight based on my following reflections on the last day and half, given your experience and knowledge. There are just so many conditions to take into consideration with figuring on the regimen that I’m feeling a bit lost in terms of which direction to go. Here is my reaction to yesterday and today:<o></o>
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Day 1 (1/19/08):<o></o>
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Took 1 10mg at 11:30am. Felt slightly euphoric and very energized on the come up. I felt very focused for about 3 hours. It felt like my thoughts which usually take the foreground had moved into the background. It was a surprising and nice change. I smoked a couple cigarettes during the main duration but I didn’t really feel the need to, and I didn’t feel any effect from them. Usually cigarettes wake my brain up a little so I can focus a little (self-medication I suppose). Around 4pm I started feeling a little agitated and I started craving cigs almost non-stop, yet they had no effect on me. I was also starting to feel like I wanted to relax but I couldn’t. Although the focus was gone I still felt hyper and excessively talkative. Felt hyper/edgy till I fell asleep around 11pm. Meditating a bit of the energy out helped my body relax a little but my nerves still felt on edge. I definitely did not sleep well, waking up almost every hour or so, until I finally gave up and got up around 6am.<o></o>
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Day 2 (1/20/08):<o></o>
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Took 1 10 mg around 7:30am. Felt focused, and able to do things without thinking about it. Like the previous day. However this time, my mind felt sluggish, like it was in a fog. The edginess/hyperness from the previous day went away as soon as it kicked in. Instead, I felt calm, almost dreamlike. After reading on the ADHD forum for a couple hours I decided to try upping the dosage a little to see if the fog would lift with a slightly higher dose. I took 5mg (half a pill) around 8:30am. My focus improved slightly, but the mental sluggishness was still there. I’m not sure at this point (writing this around 9:39am) whether I need to go up or down dosage wise or if the fog will just go away with time/adjustment. This would be nice if the fog wasn’t there, although I must admit I do miss my thought pattern…being able to fill time thinking and making interesting connections. I feel like that is what has given me so much wisdom over the years and I’m sacrificing it in order to think linearly and be connected to the here and now. I’m finding harder to entertain myself because I’m used to experiencing so much more in a moment, seeing everything. Seeing everything lets me plan and navigate my way through life, gaining insight along the way. It makes life fascinating. Almost like life is a puzzle of pieces. It’s a little boring to shut all that down when it been my way of functioning for so long. My mind feels under-simulated/empty. I also feel kind of emotionless. I’m hoping once I figure out the fog thing, I’ll have more control over what I focus on. I want to be able to think laterally again as well as appreciate the linear effect of the Adderall. Because honestly I’m not trying to dumb myself down here, and I feel like this is making me shallower. If I can’t have both, it seems like I’ll have to make this sacrifice for school, but this will not be a long-term solution. Maybe there isn’t one. <o></o>
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10:32am: Spent the last hour typing this out, doing research on Adderall and writing an post (this one) on the forums. I just felt a sudden change in mental state (like over a couple seconds)..like the fog lifted a little bit. Things just got a little clearer and I feel a tiny bit more energized opposed to sluggish. I feel like I’m a little more myself, but I still don’t really feel like I can think normally. Maybe the one thing happening at a time is throwing me off. I guess I’m used being able to have a bunch of connecting thoughts lines and being able to conceptualize along that line. I don’t know, I just don’t feel like my thoughts vivid where I can retain, connect, conceptualize, and so on. I don’t know if that statement makes sense. It’s like the here and now is getting in the way of my depth of thought. I feel like I have one thought line; like right now, it’s what I trying to explain here, but I can’t reach the same depth of thought that I usually do. I’m just typing what I’m thinking, without seeing that bigger picture. I’m going to stop trying to explain this because I’m not sure I can pinpoint it with words. I need to figure out if this change in sluggishness means I need to go down on my dosage, maybe its wearing off a little or if it is reaching its peak. <o></o>
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11:14am: just felt a sudden drop in energy, focus remains but now my head feels hazy and blurry. I think I’m actually a little dizzy.<o></o>
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11:18am: Dizziness is gone, and I feel sluggish again but not foggy. I guess the slight clarity earlier was the peak? Then does that mean I get 40 minutes of a tiny bit less fog, and the rest of the time I’ll be foggy? I think I’m starting to come down.<o></o>
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I’ll continue to update. I think I need a little guidance here though, hopefully you guys can clarify some of this stuff for me. All I want is to stay me but be able to focus. I don’t want to feel drugged up just to focus. I truly appreciate the time you have taken to read this; I know it wasn’t all that interesting.

Thanks a lot guys :)
Jen<o></o>

ndnbutterfly

01-20-09, 01:46 PM

Hi and welcome to the forums!

kwalk

01-20-09, 02:32 PM

hey I just wanted to say that from my experience, there's always going to be a little fog. Like you said you don't want to be drugged up to focus. Focus on focusing the way your natural personality prefers. Working out REALLY helps with the fog in terms of snapping out of the mental state, especially from right afterwards.

teenie

01-20-09, 08:36 PM

welcome! i also take adderall IR and I take 20mg in am and then another 20 around lunchtime if I need it. The 20 mg in the morning is perfect for me because it starts working usually within 15 mins or so and most days lasts 4-6 hours. I have found that if I have not slept well thenight before the adderall makes me feel at about 50% of how it normally works. I wonder if that's why day 2 was the way that it was for you. I highly recommend getting a good nights sleep (even if it means skipping a day) and then trying again.

Also, for me when I started taking it I just felt a lot calmer. I am ADD innactive so not H but things quieted down for me and I was able to just focus on the tasks I was working on.

Keeping your log will be a great tool for you to use.

demitriden

01-21-09, 12:12 AM

hey there i just joiend this form too.

i read your post -- thats very interesting with the varying effects, i'm sort of on the same boat as you.

the first 3 days i only took a measly 2.5mg and it was amazing. my cognitive capability those 3 days was superb, all my life i've had to take my time to read things and reread things to understand it. but with the drug i did everything with ease, i studied all day so i always knew when the drug kicked in because 1-2hr after dosage while reading my book i would just notice my focus sharpening exponentially. anyway, my problem was that after the third day it stopped working. i tried upping gradually 5 to 10 to 15, and still it hasn't been able to work. i'm taking a week or 2 off of it to get all of rest, rejuvenate, and detoxify.. hopefully it'll work again. now i just feel like my normal zombie-self....

demitriden

01-21-09, 12:13 AM

you should continue a log. it'll help you a lot to find a regiment thatll work for you.

jlsachs

01-21-09, 04:04 PM

Thank you for your replies guys :) I'm definitely going to continue keeping a log at least until I get a handle on how this stuff affects me. I'm going add an update in a minute. I'm still trying to figure out exactly what effect I should be looking for. I've been researching the forums yesterday and today I know now I shouldn't be looking for an euphoric effect or for motivation. So if I'm getting those effects do that mean the dose is too high? Or I shouldn't pay attention to that part because I'll get adjusted to it? So then should I just pick a dose and stick with it till my body gets used to it? My doc prescribed me 10mg pills; should I just take the whole pill and give myself a chance to get used to that? I'm also a bit confused about what level of focus I'm trying to achieve here. Am I looking for that "in life" focused feeling (opposed to in mind) or is that a side effect that will dissipate with time as well? I hope it isn't because I feel almost like a normal person must when like that. It makes me feel grounded in reality. I took 5mg around 10 this morning. As you'll see the log I'm about to post that's what I did yesterday and the main effect wore off after about two hours. Today at effect starting wearing off after a hour and I felt anxious and I didn't get that "in life" feeling. I still felt like my add self (thought wise) just calmer, with my thoughts not going so fast. They still dominated over sensory experience however. I haven't taken anything since that because I'm confused as to what I should be satisfied with in terms of effect. I'm hoping you guys can help me out here. I don't want make the mistake of of looking for an effect that will fade as I get adjusted. Then I'll be back at square one. I'd really appreciate any insight you guys have. Thanks :)

jlsachs

01-21-09, 04:47 PM

Log:

Day 2 (continued from first post):

At the end of my first post it was 11:18am and I was coming down from 15mg. I felt foggy/mentally sluggish on that dose. After posting I decided I'd try a low dose.

<link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5Cjsachs%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5Cmso htmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><link rel="themeData" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5Cjsachs%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5Cmso htmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_themedata.thmx"><link rel="colorSchemeMapping" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5Cjsachs%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5Cmso htmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_colorschememapping.xml"><style>  </style> 11:30-11:45am: Took 5mg (half a pill). It’s now 12:34: I’m feeling pretty good (in terms of normalcy) for the first since trying these. Maybe a lose dose is better than a high one. I can focus, but I’m not foggy or sluggish. Things have perceptional corners again, they are clear. I feel like myself after smoking 3 cigs in row, haha. Connected/grounded but myself. When this starts to wear off I’m going to try another 5mg dose. I curious to see if lower doses wear off faster. Tomorrow I’ll start my day with 5mg.<o></o>
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2:06pm: Been starting to feel a slight waning effect of the med for the last half hour. Now I’m starting to feel agitated and my head feels a little tired as though its just lost the energy it had. I’m coming down. I think when I start coming down I start hyperfocusing. I’ve been sitting in front of the computer a lot.<o></o>
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2:31: Smoked a cig a minute ago to see how much I was coming down vs. cig withdraw. I felt a like more alert after smoking but still couldn’t focus. Just took another 5mg.<o></o>
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2:51: Feel much more alert and focus, but not clear like earlier. I’m going give it another 10min, then go smoke a cig and see if that makes kick in or something.<o></o>
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3:02: Starting to feel clarity again, I think I was being impatient. Its amazing how low a dosage is effective for me, I find it hard to believe after reading the amounts everyone else taking on the forums. I don’t like how it wears off after 2 hours though. That’s a lot doses to take each day. One thing to keep in mind though is I’m taking these all on empty stomach. If I start eating normally 7.5mg or 10mg might turn out to be more appropriate. <o></o>
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jlsachs

01-21-09, 04:55 PM

Ok I'm having some trouble posting the rest of my log. It says there is 45000 character limit on posts, but my first post was way longer than that and its only letting me post a couple paragraphs at most. I was going to just put it in a few separate posts after seeing that, but the amount of text its letting through is lessening with each subsequent post (although it continues to say 45000). Any tips?
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demitriden

01-21-09, 05:53 PM

no idea on the post thing but I started adderall/dexedrine last week too.

I started with a conservative dose of 2.5mg and it did a world of wonders for me. i felt like handicap was lifted off of me. 2.5mg would last me the whole day, enough for me to study all day efficiently (though I am quite self-motivated and only need it to concentrate). after the 3rd day however, the drug stop working. i've been increasing my dosage from 5 to 7.5 to 10 to 15 a day and still nothing. i'm going to take a week or 2 off to see how it goes. but yea, people kept telling me that 2.5mg was only a "placebo" and I was imaging things (which I assure them I was not, but still they don't believe me -- my main message to you is if 5mg is working for you just keep with it and don't deviate until it stops working..

jlsachs

01-21-09, 07:16 PM

Ok guys! I figured it out. Somehow Microsoft Word makes the text much complex and come up as more characters than it is. I copied into notepad, then over to here. Just saying...just instead one of you ever has that issue. :)

The first portion below is a repeat of the second log post I made (3rd post I made), I figure it's easier to read if its not all broken up. So the below log is begins at the end of my original post.

Log:

Day 2 (continued from first post):

At the end of my first post it was 11:18am and I was coming down from 15mg. I felt foggy/mentally sluggish on that dose. After posting I decided I'd try a low dose.

11:30-11:45am: Took 5mg (half a pill). It’s now 12:34: I’m feeling pretty good (in terms of normalcy) for the first since trying these. Maybe a lose dose is better than a high one. I can focus, but I’m not foggy or sluggish. Things have perceptional corners again, they are clear. I feel like myself after smoking 3 cigs in row, haha. Connected/grounded but myself. When this starts to wear off I’m going to try another 5mg dose. I curious to see if lower doses wear off faster. Tomorrow I’ll start my day with 5mg.

2:06pm: Been starting to feel a slight waning effect of the med for the last half hour. Now I’m starting to feel agitated and my head feels a little tired as though its just lost the energy it had. I’m coming down. I think when I start coming down I start hyperfocusing. I’ve been sitting in front of the computer a lot.

2:31: Smoked a cig a minute ago to see how much I was coming down vs. cig withdraw. I felt a like more alert after smoking but still couldn’t focus. Just took another 5mg.

2:51: Feel much more alert and focus, but not clear like earlier. I’m going give it another 10min, then go smoke a cig and see if that makes kick in or something.

3:02: Starting to feel clarity again, I think I was being impatient. Its amazing how low a dosage is effective for me, I find it hard to believe after reading the amounts everyone else taking on the forums. I don’t like how it wears off after 2 hours though. That’s a lot doses to take each day. One thing to keep in mind though is I’m taking these all on empty stomach. If I start eating normally 7.5mg or 10mg might turn out to be more appropriate.

4:49pm: Just ate a bowl of spaghetti and watched the new house episode. While I didn’t really feel distracted while watching it, I wasn’t able to retain and analyze plot/character connections the way I usually do. I watched it and I saw everything that happened but it was like my mind didn’t have the chance to do that. I’ve always been a very quick thinker; able to see the whole picture and draw conclusions about something in a split second. Now its like my mind is set up so that that’s not a part of my moment to moment experience. I thought the adderall would still allow me to have that since that’s a lot who I am, but I’d be able to zoom in and out and focus on command.

5:34pm: Coming down again. It’s seems like with each come down the change in ability to focus is more drastic. My mind feels still, so even when the concentration part wears off the racing/jumping thoughts don’t come back. It might be since my brain has been in this setup all day, when it loses the energy to move around (come down) it just gets stuck where its at.

Around 10pm I started feeling like myself again, I was still experiencing slight comedown effects (tired but wide awake, a slight headache, chills). From 5:34 to 10pm I experience a not so pleasant comedown. Once I decided not to take another dose, I started getting cig cravings. It seems like my brain gets the same satisfaction from smoking as from the adderall, on a much lower level of course. Smoking seems to be my body’s way to trying to keep from coming down. It might help make the comedown a little less drastic. After smoking two cigs and still craving another one, I decided to try to ignore how I was feeling. I was feeling quite agitated and it felt like my body knew the solution was to take another. When I didn’t I started getting chills and generally just didn’t feel good. For the rest of the night (till I went to sleep around 3am) I felt burnt out from the adderall, but basically myself.

Day 3 (1/21/09) Today:

I woke up 6am this morning and wasn’t able to go back to sleep. So I only got 3 hours of sleep. I felt kind of hyper and alive this morning. I spent about a hour thinking about the last couple days when I woke up. I’m starting to realize the perceptual place the adderall-induced mindset (i was refering to that "in-life"/grounded feeling where your thoughts not only slow down but they take back seat.) holds in relation to how I normally think and to living in general. My thoughts normally if not put in check by life’s responsibilities will run free, all take up the majority of my perceptual experience. I think years of this has naturally caused me to identify with my intellect over the rest of my perceptual experience. When I experience a given instant that is concrete, its just a matter of time (and very little at that) before a thought pops up to replace that present (time). Thus, the last memory I have (which obviously is also a thought/mind-based) is of some sensory experience. So, with a mind allowed to run free, the majority of my experience is mental. Plus, my thoughts always have an insight/opinion/question on that last memory if that memory was interesting enough to contemplate. Same thing applies even if that last memory was a thought. So I can think about what I’m thinking. It’s cool in the sense that on an intellectual level I’m extraordinarily aware of all the angles. But the problem is life becomes about trying to find things interesting to keep my mind entertained, and the actual experience becomes secondary since it’s not given the time of day to be allowed to be experienced. It makes life tiring as well to think your way through everything. I love my ability to think the way I do but I also understand that in order to have a truly functional and full-felt life I have to put it in check. I need to find a balance where I can still entertain my mind like that in given moments without it becoming dominant. Right now, I’m still trying to figure out what that balance is, but this is something I realized about two and half years ago and worked on on my own through extensive self-examination, meditation, and Buddhists teachings on the importance on living in the present. But as hard as I tried I could achieve but not maintain this balance. That’s around the time I came to realize that there was a ceiling on how much I could grow as a person, because there was something else going on (the add). While achieving that balance certainly made me grow and see life more fully, I knew I’d have to figure out how to maintain it. And now here I am.

9:53am-Took 5mg. I ate half a donut about 2 hours ago.

10:09am-Over the last twenty minutes I’ve gradually felt an increase in calmness and focus. I’m coming up.

10:46am: spent the last hour writing that paragraph above. I feel somewhat focused, but I’ve been feeling a bit anxious over the last 20 minutes. The effects don’t feel strong as yesterday. That could either be because I ate 2 hours before I took it, maybe yesterday was stronger because I started the morning with 10mg, then 5mg a hour later. I’m going go smoke cig and decide whether to take a little more or wait till this wears off. I do feel anxious though.

11:16am: Smoked cig, but craving another after. That seems to be further confirmation that this dosage (or at least the effective level right now) is too low. I don’t feel like I’m at my best level of focus anyway. Going to wait till this wears off to add more.

This dosage feels like I just smoked 4 cigs. I feel like I usually do (off adderall), things are just a bit more clear/calmer. I don’t feel the groundedness that I have been yesterday and the day before. My mind is still dominating, its just not all over the place. Not sure if that’s adderall balances (as in it was just an initial effect/adjustment) or it’s just the dosage. I suppose time will tell as I become adjusted to it and figure out the dosage. I might try 7.5mg but if its just an initial effect that should go away in a couple days even with increased dose.

11:25am: I pretty much feel like myself with a touch focus but its not helping me direct my attention to different types of perceptual experiences (thus keep my mind in check and keep me in the present).

2:20 pm: Haven’t taken anymore adderall since the 5mg this morning. I have headache. I’ve been sitting at this computer for a while now. I’m definitely not able to concentrate right. It’s like it takes more mental effort than I have to focus. But I’m hyperfocusing on computer stuff. My mind feels kind of stuck. I’m confused as to what effect I’m looking for. Whether I’m looking for that that "in-life"/grounded feeling where your thoughts not only slow down but they take back seat and you can focus, or if I’m looking to be a calmer/slowed down version of my add self . In other words, should my focus be coming directly from the medication, leaving all that thinking behind or should it come from my usual way of using my thoughts to organize/direct what I’m paying attention to, except they’ve been slowed down and given some energy to accomplish this?

Thanks for reading. I'm still trying to figure out the issues I raised in my second post. Any feedback/insight would be greatly appreciated :)

Lalita

02-09-09, 03:30 PM

hi sorry i know this is off topic, but i am having an appointment tommorrow with a psychiatrist and was wondering what your psychiatrist did to test you for add? did she test you in anyway or just listen to what you had to say?

s_mitchell

02-15-09, 01:16 PM

Hi jlsachs,
I have also had ADD for years, I figured it out some time in university, but have never been formally diagnosed. My mom was a special ed. teacher and she knew but kept an eye on me herself so she never felt the need to have me formally assessed. I was the shy, quiet kid and since I didn't bother anyone no one saw the need to put me on medication.

I had pretty good marks in high school but found it really difficult to focus in university. I guess that's why/how I figured it out.

Now I feel that the ADD, sometimes, affects my job.

I am also new to the forums, just discovered them actually, and really appreciate the advice on every topic.

Thanks for the log and please continue to let me (us) know how the medication is working for you.