I am a person that has raised his two kids basically stay at home dad for 7 years on and off.one girl 7 now and a boy 5 now.I have been away from the wife for 1 year and still married to her now.anyway we had our differences about the way the kids should be brought up.It felt like it was her way or the highway as for the rules of me being there.the biggest one was drinking in the house being that I was a extreme alcoholic and she wouldnt tolerate me drinking in the house.even though I slowed it down to once a month at a hotel away from the kids and her.I guess most women hate men because the man drinks in the house around the kids, to me I got to the point that she wasnt going to tell me what I could and couldnt do.

I started drinking when I was 16 or 17 and lost a brother at the age of 22 in 1992.thats when It started to get worse for me I had a younger brother that was gonna help his older brother me.well we had plans to move in together and he was gonna help me out with my drinking.he was in the marine corp. he had 6 months left in the marines.but he never made it, he was killed in a car accident before he was discharged.so thats where it began I swore on my brothers grave I would never love anyone again,to be friends with anybody,or to trust any one again.well I have buts its been very few one being my wife-I think because she changed with the kids and the some of the comments said to me about me in general that she would never trust a man again because of her familys divorce situation.and her #1 priority was the kids-I felt expendable.

Despite the fact that I am a full blown alcoholic,been in numorous accounts with the law for the past twenty years,been in and out of jails,detoxes and prison.

thats a basic wrap up of my life other than the fact that I was diagnosed with a.d.h.d during all this tried to get help with it during our marriage my a.d.h.d. frustrations with seeing docters who didnt know how to help me and my impatients with them I easily went back to drinking too much to handle for me.

I am not even sure it has anything to do with my adhd but all my life I have found it best to not to care for people anymore like I used too. after 35 years of state of confusion of untreated adhd since 14.diagnosed at 4 years old.

So I have seen a docter about my adhd and he has me on methylphenidate for a month, boy it helped alot I could concentrate finally not having 10,000 thing going on in my head at a time.but it was giving me extreme headaches towards the end of the 3 weeks.now on concerta 1st day so far so good not having the highs and lows anymore and headaches.

Anyway just thought I would share this but I know its not normal for someone not to love their kids-I have read other places that people are fighting to get to see their kids.problem is I just dont attach myself to anyone to get that death feeling again from the result of 1992.maybe I have always been that way desensitized to people and caring for people anymore.guess its that I dont care anymore adhd trait.

not looking for sympanthy just any reasons why this might be like this for me?

Hi there outlawtigeron...

I also suffer from being emotionally detached from my family. On the one hand I love them, on the other hand the "love" I feel for them doesn't seem to even remotely compare to the evidence of the love they feel for me, if you see what I mean... they always want to snuggle, be close, talk, spend time, buy me things, make me things, tell me "I love you"... when most of the time, all I want is to be left alone.

I don't know exactly what caused this or how to solve it.

One insight I do have is that my family growing up was always in crisis... I have a huge family and I just learned to detach from them and keep them at arms length emotionally... I can't stand being forced to care about someone when they are going through something too intense for me to deal with.

The drawback I guess is it sometimes becomes difficult to care about people when you actually WANT to.

Cheers... hope you find something useful in this or other replies...

Paul

I know what you mean,at least I am not the only one that feels like this maybe it is the adhd,I think it has something to do with the adhd,anyway it has been like this most of my life I dont like to listen to others problems, even though I do but soon after thinking great thats over with and go on with my business.I would rather not have any friends at all and deal with there situations.I have enough of my own.

Emotional detachment should be my middle name as I could do without my whole family on most days. For me it is out of sight out of mind. Sounds bad, but it is true.

while on one hand I am very caring, loving and attached, theres another part of me that is very detached. It drives men bonkers, I have been told I am not clingy enough or at all.

Yet, with my child I feel great love and responsibility.

Growing up I had this need for aloneness so much that my great fantasy was to live completely self sufficient alone in the mountains or forest. Yet, I had this strong urge to be a mother since a very young child. It was like an experience I knew I would have to have. It really threw a wrench in my fantasy, so I decided I would have to take a man to my anotomous paradise. I drew many picures depicting me alone in vast wildernesses and planned my survival. Then as I grew up being a musician I realized I had to have people in order to share/work musically.
Anyway, I understand on one hand and don't on the other.

I am wondering... is it hard to take good care of your children, if it isn't a labor of love? That I could not imagine?
Do you feel as much responsibility?
Is the responsibility enough?
Wouldn't it be more of a chore only?

An ex boyfriend told me that if he got reasonably hurt and it would lesson his quality of life, he would rather just leave this world as he has no reason to stick around, even though he has three kids that he primarily raises. I was a bit shocked, he didn't feel that deeper attachment. I am looking forward to bringing up the subject to him tomorrow. I felt strongly that he was very ADD when we went out. He never delved into it though.

Thanks if you read my ramblings and Double thanks if anyone can shed some light on the questions.
Janine

Originally posted by janine
while on one hand I am very caring, loving and attached, theres another part of me that is very detached. It drives men bonkers, I have been told I am not clingy enough or at all.

Yet, with my child I feel great love and responsibility.

As for my kids the responsibility when I was there it had to be done to take care of them.but if the kids were in any kind of danger I think I would protect them,as for giving them love I never hugged them,kissed them,or even said I loved them, if I did say I LOVE YOU.I didnt mean it.only reason I said I love you, was cause she asked me too,it didnt feel right for me to do it.

Growing up I had this need for aloneness so much that my great fantasy was to live completely self sufficient alone in the mountains or forest. Yet, I had this strong urge to be a mother since a very young child. It was like an experience I knew I would have to have. It really threw a wrench in my fantasy, so I decided I would have to take a man to my anotomous paradise. I drew many picures depicting me alone in vast wildernesses and planned my survival. Then as I grew up being a musician I realized I had to have people in order to share/work musically.
Anyway, I understand on one hand and don't on the other.

For me a relationship is a beautiful thing to have. To have someone to be with and share my life with if they are the right person.I would be happy to be everybodys friend and trust them,problem is the way society is you cannot do that.so for me I decided not to trust anyone anymore,sure I am opening up here with my feelings letting my soul open up to the world to see me-but inside I dont care what people think anymore their dead to me, at least the ones who want to bring pain on someone else or try to bring me down -cause to me they do not exist.the only ones that exist to me are people that really care and even then you have to watch out for them too.

I am wondering... is it hard to take good care of your children, if it isn't a labor of love? That I could not imagine?
Do you feel as much responsibility?
Is the responsibility enough?
Wouldn't it be more of a chore only?

For my two kids the labor of love? it wasnt love it was a fear of going to jail if they werent taken care of.if I get frustrated with something I give up on it.since I didnt get attached to those kids its easy for me to walk away from them. I feel better they are not in my life anymore.All I know is that my life was hell being with them and I have no remorse being away from them now.

An ex boyfriend told me that if he got reasonably hurt and it would lesson his quality of life, he would rather just leave this world as he has no reason to stick around, even though he has three kids that he primarily raises. I was a bit shocked, he didn't feel that deeper attachment. I am looking forward to bringing up the subject to him tomorrow. I felt strongly that he was very ADD when we went out. He never delved into it though.

no comment on this one.

Thanks if you read my ramblings and Double thanks if anyone can shed some light on the questions.
Janine

Originally posted by janine
while on one hand I am very caring, loving and attached, theres another part of me that is very detached. It drives men bonkers, I have been told I am not clingy enough or at all.

Yet, with my child I feel great love and responsibility.

Same here janine... Unlike you I never wanted to be a mother, I never wanted to be married and I did that twice.... :uhh:

I had a longing to have a child at the age of 25.... Family and friends told me it wasn't right for me to be with child and not be married sooooooooooo. :cry: Today I feel I was wrong about this I could have had the children I longed for and not have to marry....

For me most of my detatchment comes from trauma and its my reaction to trauma. Some of it is my add etc. After all I don't take care of the relationships I have then I move on to new ones or I am left etc. or we have some falling out over how I failed to word something correctly etc.

My children Ive alwaysbeen very attatched and close to, but I had them in my sobriety and clean time, I also find myself closing off part of myself to my son since a recent a huge hurt that he and I both suffered. Its , I think, an attatchment reaction, you know?Why get close or stay close if youre going to have so much pain? I think thats how my suvconcious is working.

man ron-------------you pulled out a major yet not talked about issue---thanks so much

wow thanks for the insight. That is pretty heavy, it must be so hard parenting when you can't love them. Definetly not fair to them I would think.
My mother never wanted kids, And it kept happening. She is more of an intellectual, not a mushy type at all. Which doesn't make her the type of grandmother I want for my son!

I never understood my early maternal instinct. I even used to dream about a little boy I would give birth to since I was a little kid. And he came along in my 30's. I can't help but feel It would have been easier to raise him alone, than dealing with his father. But I also feel he deserves a Dad.

I never liked dolls or playing house, why would having a child be so important? I think it teaches me a lot, thats all I can figure unless it was because he was just meant to be.

I know how you feel fastalkingmom.
I always wnted to do it alone.

I guess it depends on what you all mean by "detached" "love" "responsibility" etc. I never wanted to be a mom, never did any babysitting, felt very uncomfortable around young children, and just coudn't get girls/women who were really into kids, both before and after they had them. Nevertheless, I ended up having two late, the first pretty much by accident after I got back together with my now ex (who had quit drinking for good at that point after years of drinking very heavily every day and occasionally going thru rehab programs, only made it for good after we separated). Looking back on it, I'm quite sure he has ADD, too (though he's not interested in finding out -- which is fine for him). Anyway, I think he'd say he loves his kids but he's always been detached, especially from his daughter who is alien to someone who grew up in a family with several generations of only male children. So, it's partly because I feel like I'm all they've got that I can depend on and partly because of some sort of physical bond I've felt with them since before they were born, that I'd say I'm deeply attached to them and, when things are really bad, only keep going on because of them.

But, if I were the dad it might be very different. If I weren't the mom in this particular situation, my ADDness might make me look and act more detached -- I've just gotta do various things for them and make the commitment because no one else will. As it is, I need lots of alone time, invariably am distracted and appear totally detached, especially now that they are older and can care for themselves most of the time. I don't think about it much, don't intentionally cover it up, but it is somewhat disguised by the fact that I work long hours (I work from home via computer) and spends lots of time online. We're pretty close, and they know to come to my study to talk to me, and I do go out and do some things with them, drive them places, attend their sport practices and games and all that, but compared to some other moms, I really seem to be in the clouds, amd late taking them places and picking them up, never make it to PTA meetings (and know not to volunteer to do something because it invariably requires extra efforts at scheduling and organization which I cannot do and try to keep up with just the needs of my own household). And every once in awhile my husband (the step-dad) accuses me of not caring about them, the house, etc.

I guess what I'm trying to get at is this: maybe some of you who feel very detached are not all that different than the rest of us. It could also be that you really can't allow yourself to love others in any kind of deep sense for various psychological reasons, but don't just assume that is the case because you aren't wired for intensive warm fuzzy stuff or focused attention. You still may really love your kids but are afraid of acknowledging it to yourself or them because you feel like you can't somehow be a "real" parent because of your problems with ADD and other things. My daughter and her dad finally have become quite close simply because she unconditionally loves him (unfortunately that's not the case with my son, but he's working through it). So, maybe you just have to go with what you can handle and good things may come of it.

Epiphany---you made me cry, that is so it, so on the nose, so perfect, thank you for voicing what i could not

This sounds so much like my father... Twists my insides up reading it....

I don't have to take the distant past personally anymore. Perhaps you can find what looking back on the past I so fervently wished my father had. The bottom of that block. Of that numbness, of the empty spot where the feelings used to be. Find it, feel around for the edges and pry the damn lid off.

My father feared feelings. feared them for different reasons sir, but feared them same as you do. To protect himself everyone else had to suffer. You can't hide from the pain in life sir. Lonliness is no less painful than loss. Different, but not lesser.

I would have liked to have known what my father was like beyond the few brief flashes of character and feeling I was treated to over the course of my life. The rest of the time he was tightly controlled and hiding, or drunk. Now he's dead. Three years gone Drank himself to death in six short months most of which I was deployed. 9/11 happened while we were on our way back we turned around got our orders and proceded to extract some payback. It was then that I got the message that my father was ill. Of course, he'd been ill for six long months and no one, not my mom, not my sister, and not my grandmother would break the silence and write me. Jesus, all he did was lay in that goddamned bed and drink, and they let him. He got out of bed to get more booze and use the facilities. If I'd been home, he'd have had to figure out a way to get more booze. Drinking yourself to death in front of your nine year old granddaughter is unacceptable by any standard. However, it isn't my house is it.... I could have talked to the man though. Talked some sense to him? Six months is a long time! By the time they told me, he had finally agreed to let my sister take him to the hospital. Not because he'd changed his mind about dying (I fully believe it was a concious suicide attempt on his part) but because he couldn't walk anymore and he at least had the decency to not want them to have to clean the bed after him.... By this time he was too far gone to do much for. They gave him six months with no liklihood of becoming strong enough for a liver transplant. I even volunteered a peice of mine, not that he deserved it. But... He deserved it at least as much as I did... Children I was told do not make good donors to parents for liver transplants becuase there is very little chance of a good tissue match. Where as a sibling of the parent has a high probability. Like I said he wasn't a candidate so it was moot. Within 12 hours the ship recieved another message telling them if I wanted a chance to talk to the man they needed to send me home now as he was now given a month at the outside and could go any time from a G.I. bleed. Arrangement were made to have me out on the first morning cargo flight. Nine A.M.

I recieved a third message at seven thirty Am. My father had had a G.I. bleed in his sleep and died the previous night. So, he never did get to pry that lid off.

I don't think you are broken sir. I think rather than feel your pain and move through it you are denying it and denying any other opportunity for pain to occur. The last thing your brother, who wanted to help you ever would have wanted was for you to just quit living. That wasn't my place to say, but it was true and I think you probably know that. I say this from the perspective of a grown man, who wonders what the father he grew up with COULD HAVE BEEN LIKE? Maybe you can answer that question for me. I think you might want to or you wouldn't be here. Anyway, you have my best wishes, and I apologize for any harshness that may have come through. Bad memories.

Originally posted by E-boy
This sounds so much like my father... Twists my insides up reading it....

I don't have to take the distant past personally anymore. Perhaps you can find what looking back on the past I so fervently wished my father had. The bottom of that block. Of that numbness, of the empty spot where the feelings used to be. Find it, feel around for the edges and pry the damn lid off.

My father feared feelings. feared them for different reasons sir, but feared them same as you do. To protect himself everyone else had to suffer. You can't hide from the pain in life sir. Lonliness is no less painful than loss. Different, but not lesser.

I would have liked to have known what my father was like beyond the few brief flashes of character and feeling I was treated to over the course of my life. The rest of the time he was tightly controlled and hiding, or drunk. Now he's dead. Three years gone Drank himself to death in six short months most of which I was deployed. 9/11 happened while we were on our way back we turned around got our orders and proceded to extract some payback. It was then that I got the message that my father was ill. Of course, he'd been ill for six long months and no one, not my mom, not my sister, and not my grandmother would break the silence and write me. Jesus, all he did was lay in that goddamned bed and drink, and they let him. He got out of bed to get more booze and use the facilities. If I'd been home, he'd have had to figure out a way to get more booze. Drinking yourself to death in front of your nine year old granddaughter is unacceptable by any standard. However, it isn't my house is it.... I could have talked to the man though. Talked some sense to him? Six months is a long time! By the time they told me, he had finally agreed to let my sister take him to the hospital. Not because he'd changed his mind about dying (I fully believe it was a concious suicide attempt on his part) but because he couldn't walk anymore and he at least had the decency to not want them to have to clean the bed after him.... By this time he was too far gone to do much for. They gave him six months with no liklihood of becoming strong enough for a liver transplant. I even volunteered a peice of mine, not that he deserved it. But... He deserved it at least as much as I did... Children I was told do not make good donors to parents for liver transplants becuase there is very little chance of a good tissue match. Where as a sibling of the parent has a high probability. Like I said he wasn't a candidate so it was moot. Within 12 hours the ship recieved another message telling them if I wanted a chance to talk to the man they needed to send me home now as he was now given a month at the outside and could go any time from a G.I. bleed. Arrangement were made to have me out on the first morning cargo flight. Nine A.M.

I recieved a third message at seven thirty Am. My father had had a G.I. bleed in his sleep and died the previous night. So, he never did get to pry that lid off.

I don't think you are broken sir. I think rather than feel your pain and move through it you are denying it and denying any other opportunity for pain to occur. The last thing your brother, who wanted to help you ever would have wanted was for you to just quit living. That wasn't my place to say, but it was true and I think you probably know that. I say this from the perspective of a grown man, who wonders what the father he grew up with COULD HAVE BEEN LIKE? Maybe you can answer that question for me. I think you might want to or you wouldn't be here. Anyway, you have my best wishes, and I apologize for any harshness that may have come through. Bad memories.

e-boy:the reason I started this thread is to try and understand why I feel this way and get peoples help with their opinions with their experiances. to help me and if I can help others with their pain.if possible?

As for my drinking my plan was to die in the process and not give a damn for anyone or anything in life.when you are a alcoholic you only have one thing on your mind and nothing will stop you to get that next drink.that was my life for 17 years.all I know there is insanity involved with drinking after a long period of time.you think of dying see no hope in life for yourself and your better off.I was too scared to take my own life so I figured to take myself out slowly with alcohol.

I prayed to GOD for death cursed at GOD. asking him WHY am I still here?even attempted suicide with knife slashings upon myself.today I have visable markings of the the knife slashes on my body.

I have been sober now since 4/30/03.but I got to the point that after getting sick repeatedly and putting my body threw a hell of drinking day in and day out.my body started talking to me saying its time to stop cause my hangovers were getting worse and when I did detox from stopping, it was non stop puking for days that is putting your body threw hell no sleeping for a week-insomnia sets in.guilt that is so thick you feel insane wanting to die.begging for mercy for the physical pain to go away but it dont thats your body trying to release the alcohol out of your body.

Also when you drink you adapt to live a life that is a solitude life cause society says that alcoholism isnt acceptable and most people try endlessly to get you help with your drinking,but you find ways to get away from people. become more secluded away from everyone to live for the booze.you make a mistake where you get into trouble so you adapt to not to get into that situation again and this process repeats over and over.to where it is perfected to live the way you want too and the lifestyle you want to live.but the problem is society is always there to intercept you when you make another mistake to correct your alcoholism. A never ending process for a alcoholic.and if it involves loved ones that try to intercept the alcoholic they are they are the ones that get hurt because they are trying to help that person.like I said the alcoholic dont care who they hurt as long as they can get the alcohol.

So as for your father-I can relate to what he was doing to himself its unfortanate he gave up.I know one thing the alcohol made him something he wasnt. it just made his inner fears multiplied even worse than they were for him to handle.all I can say for your father what he might have been like? that is a good question seeing that I am a father myself.I have a son and a daughter.what you are explaining to me is someone who loves their father and I am a father who is saying that I can disown my own children and not love them.

I have been enlightened by my girlfriend now that its wise I should be in my kids lives. otherwise they will hate me later on in life.I honestly can say I think of them from time to time.Is that love?I myself am trying to figure out what love means anymore since I have avoided it most of my life.thats why I am here my children are with me in my mind. I am trying to make sense of all this? should I be in their lives or not I find it easier not to be right now.

I am honestly a person that never grew up inside yeah I am 35 years old but inside I am a kid myself,I dont think I will ever grow up to be a man-but thats just me. and I have to live with any decision I make and whatever I choose maybe choosing to be in their lives? or not? I dont know? I will have no remorse if I choose not to be in their lives,but wonder what would happen if I was?

My brother would want me to live I think,its unfortunate hes not here but its been 12 years now.I am still trying to figure what my purpose is here on earth. time will tell looking for the answer to that question for myself?hope this helps you out.peace

I think, as someone with 20 years clean, that what Im seeing is potential for major growth and spiritual releif. Im so very glad you joined, it keeps my head where it needs to be--on growth

I was unable to feel anyones love for me till my late twenties. Yet I felt a deep love for the universe and it's inhabitants.
That seems like the opposite of Ron. Yet I was protecting myself in a similar way from pain. I honestly never felt love comming at me, until I saw an energy worker (like rebirthing). I didn't even realise that you really could feel other peoples love
until that day, it hit me like a physical force when I encountered the usual road party near my place, everone started waving and holding a beer up for me. I had to drive right on cause I never felt anything like it and was bawling saying "oh my god they love me, I can feel their love" It hit me like a physical force!!

Anyway I would suggest energy work, healing. It's unbelievable!
My father wasn't emotionally available, my mother wasn't a toucher. I closed down. Plus there was other abuse.

Everything we stuff and don't work through contributes our hearts to close.

Everytime we ignore our experiences that offer growth potential
we are telling ourselves that we are not important to ourselves.
Because we are invalidating ourselves, our experiences.

The lady that worked on me was unbelievable she told me abouth heath conditions and other stuff know one knew about, even me. She said that I was amazing cause I put out love to everyone yet I never felt anyones love back cause I had a blocked heart from so much trauma. I never knew what I was missing till that day, and I cried knowiing it was the truth. I hadn't told her anything about me except my first name. She did the work in a tent in someones back yard. I meant to see her more but couldn't afford it, eventhough she was very reasonable. That day when I got home was the first time I could say to anyone. "I feel your love" It upset my husband in the past that I couldn't say that and could only say "I know you love me". I don't lie about my feelings. And couldn't understand why people spoke of feeling someones love for them.

I strongly advise energy work. If you call a holistic type of health/practitioner they can probably direct you in the right direction.

Hope my rambling doesn't offend anyone.
j9

I hope I'm not imposing, but I think that if you recognize that you have to live with the decisions and choices you make in life, that makes you a man, not a boy. No adult ever makes only good or right decisions, its only important that you stay true to yourself. You are showing that you are a man, because you are taking responsibility for your actions and being honest about your thoughts.

And yes, it is worth you staying alive. Even if you believe in an afterlife, this life on this planet is short and the only one you get. I've spent much time wondering why I'm here, but does it really matter why? You are here, and there will always be good and bad in life, and believe it or not, even the simplest smallest good things are worth being here for. Even times when just feeling the sun on your face is the only good thing happening to you. Because not being here anymore doesn't just mean an end to pain, it means an end to everything, good as well. And I've found from experience that very bad things are painful to go through, yes, but you can learn from them to eventually become a happier person. These bad experiences are tools in the continual process of self-discovery.

Regarding your children, I too think its possible that you are keeping yourself from feeling anything for them, but perhaps you truly do not feel love for them. That is part of your journey in this life, to find that out.

a lot of this thread seems to be about self-absorption. really, that's what most of these addictions are... there's no room in your life for attachment, because you're caught up in family drama, or alcohol or drugs, or blaming other people's misfortunes for your own behavior. My two cents are that the reason some people feel detached from their children, in particular, is because they have a deep attachment only to themselves and their needs, and don't have the emotional maturity to break free of that vicious cycle. Alcohol keeps you from dealing with issues of emotional maturity, and keeps the focus on you.

Of course, this is just my uninformed opinion, and I've been wrong before. To me, this sort of thing just screams "I need therapy, not a web site." And the whole adage about "you can't love other people until you love yourself" really seems to apply here.

I have also always felt distant from my family.
Out of site, out of mind was a good analogy for my family as a child.
I barely know my 5 siblings and only see them once every few years. (3 live within 15 miles of me)
I only see my Mother on holidays that my wife invites her out.
I have always been this way.
I have no close friends, and the ones I used to have, I let go because of the out of site, out of mind thing.
I almost lost my Wife because of my lack of attentions/concern for her.

I am working on the wife part. (hyperfocusing, actually)
But I still have issues with the kids.

I Love them and care about them, but do not want them sitting on me or bugging me. I do not like that I am this way, but I seem very consistent.

I have also questioned if the family would be better off without me. (or would even notice me not there.)

I hope you get past this. Please share what you are trying.

Steveb, do you hold them and stuff anyway? Do you get warm cuddly feelings if you do make the moves to hold them or play with them? Or just feel detached in the kid cuddle area?
This is very interesting as I want to cuddle my son quite often.

I think that I am always feeling behind the eight ball.
There is always something unfinished.
I think I do not allow myself to take a break.
So, I am always in the middle of something.

I have enjoyed just sitting with the kids, watching one of their shows with them, or playing a game with them; I am just rarely in that mode.
So I will get annoyed by them.

I suppose it is like a savings account, they say pay yourself first, before you spend the rest.
I should put the kids and my wife on the list of unfinished projects.
I mean I should plan that time with them, and worry about the other things when appropriate, not all of the time.