Along with ADHD-I, I struggle with depression. In particular, one thing I constantly struggle with is the idea of Perfection vs. Adventure. Sometimes I get very "perfectionistic" about things and want to get them just right, but that's just because I'm tuned into an idea and I can see the high-level connections of how things work and how they should go together and I get really hooked on a picture in my mind of how the situation should be. Basically, in some situations I can see the way things go together for optimum success - at least in my mind. So sometimes I get really turned on for an idea and work towards it like crazy, and either it's successful or I do nothing because it's so big and hard and requires so much effort that I just can't even work up the energy to start.

But on a reality level, it's the sense of adventure that motivates me. The process of building up towards perfection is what is fun - not achieving it. Once I achieve it, I'm bored with it and I want to move on. Case in point: a year or two ago I got into road biking (those bicycles with the skinny tires). I bought a used bike and fixed it up. I got really excited about the idea of participating in road races, not to win, but just to compete in them and have fun and get healthy. But after I got set up with my bike kit, got everything working smoothly, did a bunch of training - I completely lost motivation. I had more or less achieved the vision in my mind, and that was that. Next, please.

Does anyone else deal with problems like this? It's really hard to define and I know I'm not explaining it properly, but maybe some additional discussion can flesh it out. I have trouble with motivation for, like, everything because of this - it's almost as if the thing I am pursuing becomes boring once I've achieved it, and no longer needs to be done.

I have a really hard time getting back into things because of this - I still go on bike rides, but I have to force myself to go - thinking about it is almost depressing, I just don't care - but once I'm out on my bike, I'm having fun and I really enjoy it and I'm like why did I try to talk myself out of this? My thoughts create this huge motivational barrier which is really a lie, because I DO enjoy doing it, but I just can't switch off my brain from "I've accomplished the vision in my mind and that's that" to "this is still fun and I should do it on a regular basis".

It's especially depressing because some days I have bad days and *everything* feels like that - why bother doing anything at all? Anything and everything is accomplishable, so why do anything? I know it's a ridiculous way of thinking, but the non-emotional response internally is just about impossible to get past - it's like having an anchor stuck on top of you! You know it's there and it's ridiculous, but it's ridiculously hard to get past. I'm having a bad day today because I got back from a business trip really late (1:00am) and although I slept in until 8:30am, I know that I don't handle staying up late well and it just cranks up the depression. Which complicates everything else in my life.

Stupid ADHD.

I love the title but am on a weird one so cannot read this as of now...
But have left this here so to remember to come back-thank you 4 the 4ort:)

I have just read the first line and want to write this-

Practice makes perfect-perfection makes boredom........but;)

So, it seems like the key is reformatting my thinking patterns to change how I think about things I've already accomplished or that I'm good at. I think I interpret things in terms of re-runs, instead of new instances. I hate watching re-runs of TV shows that I've seen recently because I already know what's in them and I get soooooooo bored! In my mind, re-doing something I've already accomplished or am "perfect" at is a re-run, instead of a new experience. When I'm actually doing it again, it IS a new and fun experience and I enjoy it. When I think about it, however, I just can't seem to get past the idea that it IS a boring re-run and BOY do I not want to do it again! So I need to find a trick for dealing with this mentally so that I don't de-motivate myself for doing things that I enjoy in future instances...

I love the title but am on a weird one so cannot read this as of now...
But have left this here so to remember to come back-thank you 4 the 4ort:)

I have just read the first line and want to write this-

Practice makes perfect-perfection makes boredom........but;)

Hah, there's the formula:

ADHD = Hyperfocus
Hyperfocus = LOTS of focused practice (on something you're passionate about, usually)
Practice = Perfect
Perfect = Boredom (mentally, but not in action)
Mental Boredom = Kills motivation to take physical action and DO the task

So I guess what I'm really looking for is a way to feel the motivation. I don't want to live the rest of my life not looking forward to do what I enjoy doing, but I don't know how to motivate myself internally to feel good about it. Right now, I have to force myself to do things I have become good at and enjoy, such as going on a long bike ride. I enjoy it once I do it. The missing link is in feeling the motivation - I used to look forward to doing it and then would enjoy doing it, but now I don't look forward to doing it, force myself to do it anyway, and then enjoy it. Super lame! I want to look forward to it again! I know this is a normal-person reaction to things they've gotten good at, but as we all know, ADHD amplifies all those nearly invisible psychological events and makes them waaaaaaaaay more complicated than they need to be.

Fooey.

Is perfectionism a symptom of ADHD? I always thought my perfectionism came from being ACOA. I don't know that I can reply to the motivation and achievement question. I'm trying to think of examples in my life. The most current one that your post reminded me of was my recent interest in track driving. Only, I haven't even gotten so far as to get my car prepared for it--I'd need a rollbar at the very least, plus a helmet, and I just don't have the money for it now. I went to a car event recently, and someone told me I had some potential, and suggested I join a regional association and take their high performance driver education. This was at the end of May and I was excited for about two weeks, and even joined the association--it was "only" $40. I really enjoy doing the track events, but don't follow through with it, or do it often enough. I've actually done something like that three times in the last ten years, and the second time, I lost some confidence. So, it wasn't money at that point that was stopping me. But, I did wonder how long I'd stick with it if I got involved.

I,ve noticed the number three today in threads....i think maybe three times and it is a crowd in our heads we get it-eg;do not say it three times co i'll explode in your face?

Really enjoyed the last three posts :);)

Is perfectionism a symptom of ADHD? I always thought my perfectionism came from being ACOA. I don't know that I can reply to the motivation and achievement question. I'm trying to think of examples in my life. The most current one that your post reminded me of was my recent interest in track driving. Only, I haven't even gotten so far as to get my car prepared for it--I'd need a rollbar at the very least, plus a helmet, and I just don't have the money for it now. I went to a car event recently, and someone told me I had some potential, and suggested I join a regional association and take their high performance driver education. This was at the end of May and I was excited for about two weeks, and even joined the association--it was "only" $40. I really enjoy doing the track events, but don't follow through with it, or do it often enough. I've actually done something like that three times in the last ten years, and the second time, I lost some confidence. So, it wasn't money at that point that was stopping me. But, I did wonder how long I'd stick with it if I got involved.

I don't think it's Perfectionism in the traditional sense. People who are really perfectionists really have problems in life :D I'm much more selective than that, haha. I think it's just hyperfocus getting the better of me. It all goes back to that core problem of motivation...

Hah, there's the formula:

ADHD = Hyperfocus
Hyperfocus = LOTS of focused practice (on something you're passionate about, usually)
Practice = Perfect
Perfect = Boredom (mentally, but not in action)
Mental Boredom = Kills motivation to take physical action and DO the task

So I guess what I'm really looking for is a way to feel the motivation. I don't want to live the rest of my life not looking forward to do what I enjoy doing, but I don't know how to motivate myself internally to feel good about it. Right now, I have to force myself to do things I have become good at and enjoy, such as going on a long bike ride. I enjoy it once I do it. The missing link is in feeling the motivation - I used to look forward to doing it and then would enjoy doing it, but now I don't look forward to doing it, force myself to do it anyway, and then enjoy it. Super lame! I want to look forward to it again! I know this is a normal-person reaction to things they've gotten good at, but as we all know, ADHD amplifies all those nearly invisible psychological events and makes them waaaaaaaaay more complicated than they need to be.

Fooey.

Perfect formular!

But:)got bored on your 3rd or 4th post?;)

Well, I've had two thoughts so far:

1. This is just classic depression. I keep forgetting about that :D

2. Looking at it from a different lens - paying attention to Perfection allows me to pursue my Adventures, in a sense. I hate going to bed early and doing many of the other things that I know help me feel better and deal with my ADHD better, but I know that if I'm "perfect" at them, it opens up my ability to pursue my Adventures because I feel good and can focus better (this is a bit different than my first intepretation, but the same principle applies).

Ho-hum.

Well, I've had two thoughts so far:

1. This is just classic depression. I keep forgetting about that :D

2. Looking at it from a different lens - paying attention to Perfection allows me to pursue my Adventures, in a sense. I hate going to bed early and doing many of the other things that I know help me feel better and deal with my ADHD better, but I know that if I'm "perfect" at them, it opens up my ability to pursue my Adventures because I feel good and can focus better (this is a bit different than my first intepretation, but the same principle applies).

Ho-hum.
And it starts again-like this alot......

Two more posts and you'll be bored:D

I think this may be my third or 4orth;)

And it starts again-like this alot......

Two more posts and you'll be bored:D

I think this may be my third or 4orth;)

Sorry, I'm confused...what do you mean?

Sorry, I'm confused...what do you mean?
I dont know i got bored on my third post(no offence at all-have enjoyed this to the max)

When you can have a re-read of all the posts in your thread;)

Adventure = a challenge of some kind. . .a problem to figure out. It could be different for everyone, just based on what your own interests are.

Perfection = completeness. No holes to fill in, nothing to fix or improve upon.

That doesn't mean something perfect doesn't need to be maintained. . .which is why I know I personally suck when it comes to jobs that require me to follow a set routine of tasks. It gets so painfully boring. Even though I'm "doing something," it's the same thing day after day after day.

Adventure = a challenge of some kind. . .a problem to figure out. It could be different for everyone, just based on what your own interests are.

Perfection = completeness. No holes to fill in, nothing to fix or improve upon.

That doesn't mean something perfect doesn't need to be maintained. . .which is why I know I personally suck when it comes to jobs that require me to follow a set routine of tasks. It gets so painfully boring. Even though I'm "doing something," it's the same thing day after day after day.

Yeah, exactly! I even have to force myself to take a shower and shave every morning...I hate the reptition lol - I did it yesterday, why do I have to do it again today!! :D

Tell about it;)

Saying that I need to go to the toilet:eek:

I went yesterday-but somethings need repeating LOL:D

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I have the feeling all this is not really about perfectionism at all. It seems like, to Schroeder, completing a task means putting a tick next to it and moving on. It's a great attitude if you deal with a list of projects to complete per day or month or year, but repetition is a natural element in everything we do. We brush teeth twice or more a day, we take a shower once or twice a day, we go to bed every night, and we probably go ride a bike a few times a week, if we do that at all. The issue with boredom or motivation deficiency is purely psychological, I guess, and I see two approaches that might help here:

a) try to find a new perspective from which to view that activity each time you do it again and again and again, e.g. could you try and focus on a different element each time you ride your bike? find a new path? try a different speed?

b) treat your experience of riding a bike as a means to a larger end, e.g. muscles, weight, distance, socializing, competition, heart rate, or whatever else you choose.

I am a "perfect" example of a perfectionist, and I can tell you that you don't seem to show any symptoms of perfectionism at all. For an example, completing things alone is already something that perfectionists have a big issue with. I simply believe that you need to work on breaking the bad habit of viewing repetition as necessarily something boring--the TV would be an exception because it is a mind-killer no matter what--and maybe start looking for potential within repetition. How about that? :)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I have the feeling all this is not really about perfectionism at all. It seems like, to Schroeder, completing a task means putting a tick next to it and moving on. It's a great attitude if you deal with a list of projects to complete per day or month or year, but repetition is a natural element in everything we do. We brush teeth twice or more a day, we take a shower once or twice a day, we go to bed every night, and we probably go ride a bike a few times a week, if we do that at all. The issue with boredom or motivation deficiency is purely psychological, I guess, and I see two approaches that might help here:

a) try to find a new perspective from which to view that activity each time you do it again and again and again, e.g. could you try and focus on a different element each time you ride your bike? find a new path? try a different speed?

b) treat your experience of riding a bike as a means to a larger end, e.g. muscles, weight, distance, socializing, competition, heart rate, or whatever else you choose.

I am a "perfect" example of a perfectionist, and I can tell you that you don't seem to show any symptoms of perfectionism at all. For an example, completing things alone is already something that perfectionists have a big issue with. I simply believe that you need to work on breaking the bad habit of viewing repetition as necessarily something boring--the TV would be an exception because it is a mind-killer no matter what--and maybe start looking for potential within repetition. How about that? :)

No-we are past perfection we are bored of it.........nice colour are you bored of the old colour or is this the perfect colour?

Schroeder,

I'm very similar even down to struggling to get on my bike but then loving it when I do. I am perfectionist in a hyper-focus way too. But I think this motivational issue is more down to two issues firstly a fear of boredom - Brushing teeth etc fits into this category a repetitive, mundane, annoying task. Then secondly and the bigger issue is ADD people's problem with time sense.

People with ADD generally struggle with imagining, planning and placing a VALUE on future tasks. We are neurologically unable to imagine the reward we will feel on the bike with the wind in our hair etc. So in the moment when we make a choice of what to do, the task that is immediate and in front of us wins out everytime over a task that needs some effort to initiate, especially if we cannot "see" how much fun it will be.

Problem is I have never heard of any viable solution to this issue as meds don't see to help, nor do lists, mediatation, incentives whatever. The best time I cycled was when I cycled to work each day. Then it was automatic, no thought or choice involed. Then it was easy and fun!

Inthemoment

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I have the feeling all this is not really about perfectionism at all. It seems like, to Schroeder, completing a task means putting a tick next to it and moving on. It's a great attitude if you deal with a list of projects to complete per day or month or year, but repetition is a natural element in everything we do. We brush teeth twice or more a day, we take a shower once or twice a day, we go to bed every night, and we probably go ride a bike a few times a week, if we do that at all. The issue with boredom or motivation deficiency is purely psychological, I guess, and I see two approaches that might help here:

a) try to find a new perspective from which to view that activity each time you do it again and again and again, e.g. could you try and focus on a different element each time you ride your bike? find a new path? try a different speed?

b) treat your experience of riding a bike as a means to a larger end, e.g. muscles, weight, distance, socializing, competition, heart rate, or whatever else you choose.

I am a "perfect" example of a perfectionist, and I can tell you that you don't seem to show any symptoms of perfectionism at all. For an example, completing things alone is already something that perfectionists have a big issue with. I simply believe that you need to work on breaking the bad habit of viewing repetition as necessarily something boring--the TV would be an exception because it is a mind-killer no matter what--and maybe start looking for potential within repetition. How about that? :)

Yah, it's definitely not full-blown perfectionism, and given my ADHD-I, at the most basic level it's basically just a problem with motivation. It's the idea of perfection - the idea that it's already finished, it's perfect, it needs nothing more. That's really hard to get past from a motivational level, mentally.

I love the Internet because it's always new - either new stuff has been posted, or there are undiscovered sections that are new to *me*, which keeps it interesting. Although I even get bored of the Internet sometimes :D

Schroeder,

I'm very similar even down to struggling to get on my bike but then loving it when I do. I am perfectionist in a hyper-focus way too. But I think this motivational issue is more down to two issues firstly a fear of boredom - Brushing teeth etc fits into this category a repetitive, mundane, annoying task. Then secondly and the bigger issue is ADD people's problem with time sense.

People with ADD generally struggle with imagining, planning and placing a VALUE on future tasks. We are neurologically unable to imagine the reward we will feel on the bike with the wind in our hair etc. So in the moment when we make a choice of what to do, the task that is immediate and in front of us wins out everytime over a task that needs some effort to initiate, especially if we cannot "see" how much fun it will be.

Problem is I have never heard of any viable solution to this issue as meds don't see to help, nor do lists, mediatation, incentives whatever. The best time I cycled was when I cycled to work each day. Then it was automatic, no thought or choice involed. Then it was easy and fun!

Inthemoment

Hmm, that's a good insight. I am terrible with estimating how long things will take me, a classic symptom of ADD. I've gotten much better with applying tricks that suck me into tasks I *need* to do (so I accomplish my responsibilities better), but I still struggle a TON with feeling motivation to do tasks I *want* to do.

Is there a return policy on this condition? :)

I think one of the more frustrating aspects of ADHD (for me, anyway) is the inconsistency of it.

For example, the idea of having to maintain something that does not need any improvement can be extremely boring. I had a job that consisted of filing insurance policies and applications. The "system" and procedures had been in place in the office for nearly thirty years, and it was the same thing every day.

There were times when my need for some variety kicked in, so I might start filing in a different area on a given day. I guess I just needed a change of scenery, but my supervisor would see it as being some kind of act of major rebellion against her authority (even though the work always got done), and she grilled me about why I did what I did. How to explain that I just needed to do things a little differently to keep them interesting?:confused:

And yet, some days my supervisor would interrupt my filing work with another project that needed to be done ASAP, and it would kind of kill my momentum. So, even though I NEEDED a break from routine just to give myself some sense of "adventure/change," when it was forced upon me unexpectedly by a supervisor who explained the new project very quickly and then disappeared without giving me time to write down or absorb the new set of instructions, it completely threw me off and I'd have to go find her to ask her to repeat or clarify something. At that point, she then berated me for not listening to her, and therefore being disrespectful.:sigh:

It was that inconsistency of balance between maintaining a set "system" without going out of my mind from boredom. . .while being able to adjust to a new challenge/adventure that I did not expect. . .that made me think there might be something seriously wrong with me. My co-workers never seemed to have the problem that I did. That's what led to me seeking professional mental help and eventually getting diagnosed with ADD-I last year.:)

I think one of the more frustrating aspects of ADHD (for me, anyway) is the inconsistency of it.

For example, the idea of having to maintain something that does not need any improvement can be extremely boring. I had a job that consisted of filing insurance policies and applications. The "system" and procedures had been in place in the office for nearly thirty years, and it was the same thing every day.

There were times when my need for some variety kicked in, so I might start filing in a different area on a given day. I guess I just needed a change of scenery, but my supervisor would see it as being some kind of act of major rebellion against her authority (even though the work always got done), and she grilled me about why I did what I did. How to explain that I just needed to do things a little differently to keep them interesting?:confused:

And yet, some days my supervisor would interrupt my filing work with another project that needed to be done ASAP, and it would kind of kill my momentum. So, even though I NEEDED a break from routine just to give myself some sense of "adventure/change," when it was forced upon me unexpectedly by a supervisor who explained the new project very quickly and then disappeared without giving me time to write down or absorb the new set of instructions, it completely threw me off and I'd have to go find her to ask her to repeat or clarify something. At that point, she then berated me for not listening to her, and therefore being disrespectful.:sigh:

It was that inconsistency of balance between maintaining a set "system" without going out of my mind from boredom. . .while being able to adjust to a new challenge/adventure that I did not expect. . .that made me think there might be something seriously wrong with me. My co-workers never seemed to have the problem that I did. That's what led to me seeking professional mental help and eventually getting diagnosed with ADD-I last year.:)

Your boss sounds typical - in all my years in different jobs, if there's one thing I've learned it's that people are terrible at communicating, lol. My coping trick is to do exactly what you said - write it down. Not only does it give me a chance to clarify my task, but it also forces the supervisor to think about what they want me to do and communicate it with me. Most of the time, they have a picture in their head of what they want done, explain it quickly to you, and then don't understand why they're not getting the results they want...lol. I just explain to people that this is how I operate - if I don't write it down, it doesn't get done, period.

I totally understand what you're saying about maintaining a set system vs. not going insane with boredom...I have such a hard time with that! I'm not a control freak, but I just can't handle not doing things my way - it completely KILLS my motivation! I can handle reptetitive things, if it's something that I'm personally hyperfocused on...for example, one of my phases was fish tanks - I think I cared more about maintaining the system than I did the fish! lol. I was always very careful to feed them as needed, cycle the lights, clean out the tank, change the filter, ensure that I had supplies, etc. But ask me to do laundry and I'll leave it in there for days :D

I've already discovered the key for forcing myself to get things done - I simply flesh out the details into a crispy task, then force myself to "try", i.e. put myself in the situation of what I want to be doing, and do it for 5 minutes, and then my hyperfocus kicks in and I cruise right along. So this way I don't really have to do a whole big giant task, I just have to sit myself down where I'm supposed to and focus soley on that clearly-defined task for a few minutes, by which time I get sucked in. So that's great for getting things done, but there's still that core motivational problem that kind of sucks the fun out of life for things I want to do, and even for things that I need to do and get satisfaction from :p

People with ADD generally struggle with imagining, planning and placing a VALUE on future tasks. We are neurologically unable to imagine the reward we will feel on the bike with the wind in our hair etc. So in the moment when we make a choice of what to do, the task that is immediate and in front of us wins out everytime over a task that needs some effort to initiate, especially if we cannot "see" how much fun it will be.

The more I think about this, the more I'm realizing this is a big piece of the puzzle - it's true, I CAN'T imagine the reward of the activity a lot of the time! When I force myself to do it, I enjoy it, but I have to fight myself every step of the way until I plunk myself on that seat and start moving. Yeah, even if you sit there on the seat not moving, you're still fighting it! Haha. It's like being a robot whose feelings are only activated upon activity! :p

Your boss sounds typical - in all my years in different jobs, if there's one thing I've learned it's that people are terrible at communicating, lol. My coping trick is to do exactly what you said - write it down. Not only does it give me a chance to clarify my task, but it also forces the supervisor to think about what they want me to do and communicate it with me. Most of the time, they have a picture in their head of what they want done, explain it quickly to you, and then don't understand why they're not getting the results they want...lol. I just explain to people that this is how I operate - if I don't write it down, it doesn't get done, period.



Exactly!

When I finally got diagnosed with ADD-I and requested (through the corporate HR office) that my supervisor allow me the chance to write down instructions for new projects, she took it to extremes and began requiring me to write down a full plan for everything I planned to do each day and when I planned to do it, and then make "amendments" to it if she came to me with additional projects.

I also had to meet with her at the beginning and end of each day to discuss my plan with her, ask questions, and to explain my reasons for anything I might not have finished. She would take notes on everything I did, especially if I "failed" to complete all of my planned projects for the day, even if she'd hit me with an extra project in the middle of the day that absolutely HAD to be done, and put me behind my originally-planned schedule. It was so humiliating and defeating, I was actually kind of relieved when I lost my job there. . .

Exactly!

When I finally got diagnosed with ADD-I and requested (through the corporate HR office) that my supervisor allow me the chance to write down instructions for new projects, she took it to extremes and began requiring me to write down a full plan for everything I planned to do each day and when I planned to do it, and then make "amendments" to it if she came to me with additional projects.

I also had to meet with her at the beginning and end of each day to discuss my plan with her, ask questions, and to explain my reasons for anything I might not have finished. She would take notes on everything I did, especially if I "failed" to complete all of my planned projects for the day, even if she'd hit me with an extra project in the middle of the day that absolutely HAD to be done, and put me behind my originally-planned schedule. It was so humiliating and defeating, I was actually kind of relieved when I lost my job there. . .

Holy cow, I was gonna say, you need to quit that job ASAP! :eek: She's insane!!

Holy cow, I was gonna say, you need to quit that job ASAP! :eek: She's insane!!

To say that she created a "hostile work environment" would be an understatement. . .

Basically, she did all that just so that she could go back and tell HR that I "just wasn't working out" as an employee because my performance was not improving despite her efforts to "accommodate" me.

Exactly!

When I finally got diagnosed with ADD-I and requested (through the corporate HR office) that my supervisor allow me the chance to write down instructions for new projects, she took it to extremes and began requiring me to write down a full plan for everything I planned to do each day and when I planned to do it, and then make "amendments" to it if she came to me with additional projects.

I also had to meet with her at the beginning and end of each day to discuss my plan with her, ask questions, and to explain my reasons for anything I might not have finished. She would take notes on everything I did, especially if I "failed" to complete all of my planned projects for the day, even if she'd hit me with an extra project in the middle of the day that absolutely HAD to be done, and put me behind my originally-planned schedule. It was so humiliating and defeating, I was actually kind of relieved when I lost my job there. . .

So she was taking the glory for your work?right!.....

I was always better at my job than the wan+ers i was working for-gets me angry thinking back-and will not fall into that spiralling trap again(i hope)

Along with ADHD-I, I struggle with depression. In particular, one thing I constantly struggle with is the idea of Perfection vs. Adventure. Sometimes I get very "perfectionistic" about things and want to get them just right, but that's just because I'm tuned into an idea and I can see the high-level connections of how things work and how they should go together and I get really hooked on a picture in my mind of how the situation should be. Basically, in some situations I can see the way things go together for optimum success - at least in my mind. So sometimes I get really turned on for an idea and work towards it like crazy, and either it's successful or I do nothing because it's so big and hard and requires so much effort that I just can't even work up the energy to start.

But on a reality level, it's the sense of adventure that motivates me. The process of building up towards perfection is what is fun - not achieving it. Once I achieve it, I'm bored with it and I want to move on. Case in point: a year or two ago I got into road biking (those bicycles with the skinny tires). I bought a used bike and fixed it up. I got really excited about the idea of participating in road races, not to win, but just to compete in them and have fun and get healthy. But after I got set up with my bike kit, got everything working smoothly, did a bunch of training - I completely lost motivation. I had more or less achieved the vision in my mind, and that was that. Next, please.

Does anyone else deal with problems like this? It's really hard to define and I know I'm not explaining it properly, but maybe some additional discussion can flesh it out. I have trouble with motivation for, like, everything because of this - it's almost as if the thing I am pursuing becomes boring once I've achieved it, and no longer needs to be done.

I have a really hard time getting back into things because of this - I still go on bike rides, but I have to force myself to go - thinking about it is almost depressing, I just don't care - but once I'm out on my bike, I'm having fun and I really enjoy it and I'm like why did I try to talk myself out of this? My thoughts create this huge motivational barrier which is really a lie, because I DO enjoy doing it, but I just can't switch off my brain from "I've accomplished the vision in my mind and that's that" to "this is still fun and I should do it on a regular basis".

It's especially depressing because some days I have bad days and *everything* feels like that - why bother doing anything at all? Anything and everything is accomplishable, so why do anything? I know it's a ridiculous way of thinking, but the non-emotional response internally is just about impossible to get past - it's like having an anchor stuck on top of you! You know it's there and it's ridiculous, but it's ridiculously hard to get past. I'm having a bad day today because I got back from a business trip really late (1:00am) and although I slept in until 8:30am, I know that I don't handle staying up late well and it just cranks up the depression. Which complicates everything else in my life.

Stupid ADHD.

Though not an inattentive, I can identify with about everything you said. I've battled it forever, particularly in business. If I had a nickel for every business I've started, but a website together for, marketed a little bit, and then quit because I hit the wall of complete and utter disinterest, I'd be much richer than blowing money on idea after idea and quitting all the time to pursue something else.

I think it boils down to a few things. For instance, ADD is a constant search for stimulation for your brain. Once you've been there, done that, it just doesn't have the same stimulation as something brand new and shiney.

A cognitive distortion (look them up on wikipedia if interested) often associated with ADDers and also perfectionism, is all or nothing thinking. I'm either really interested in something, or not interested whatsoever. Like you on the bike, if someone pushed me back into something I could find joy in it, but getting past that wall is near impossible by myself.

I think I also battle depression, though I've never seen anyone for it. I know my dad, and my mom as well, both do. I've actually got something I'm going to post on that, but that's for another thread that I need to start.

Good thread.:D

Though not an inattentive, I can identify with about everything you said. I've battled it forever, particularly in business. If I had a nickel for every business I've started, but a website together for, marketed a little bit, and then quit because I hit the wall of complete and utter disinterest, I'd be much richer than blowing money on idea after idea and quitting all the time to pursue something else.

I think it boils down to a few things. For instance, ADD is a constant search for stimulation for your brain. Once you've been there, done that, it just doesn't have the same stimulation as something brand new and shiney.

A cognitive distortion (look them up on wikipedia if interested) often associated with ADDers and also perfectionism, is all or nothing thinking. I'm either really interested in something, or not interested whatsoever. Like you on the bike, if someone pushed me back into something I could find joy in it, but getting past that wall is near impossible by myself.

I think I also battle depression, though I've never seen anyone for it. I know my dad, and my mom as well, both do. I've actually got something I'm going to post on that, but that's for another thread that I need to start.

Good thread.:D

Ah, depression is an easy fix :D It's the ADHD-I I'm still struggling with!

If you want to cope with depression, all you have to do is understand the fundamentals and implement a few changes. From living with depression for the past 6 years, I've found it boils down to three primary causes:

1. Incorrect thinking
2. Not managing health
3. Underlying health condition

Everyone I have ever met has had at least one of these in relation to depression, if not two or all three. The fixes are simple:

1. Incorrect thinking: Buy and work through the 10 Days to Self-Esteem workbook (http://www.amazon.com/Ten-Days-Self-Esteem-David-Burns/dp/0688094554/) by David Burns. It's an amazingly insightful workbook that guides you through changing your cognitive distortions. If you enjoy it and want to understand more of the "why" behind it, then also pick up The Feeling Good Handbook (http://www.amazon.com/Feeling-Good-Handbook-David-Burns/dp/0452281326/), also by David Burns - it explains more background info on the 10 Days workbook. If the cause of your depression is emotionally-related, such as Post Traumatic Stress Disorder or some kind of abuse or something, then you need to take this further and see a therapist. Also if you're voilating your personal moral standards and are living in denial, this can cause depression and need to be fixed as well. But if you're just a normal person who has depression for some stupid reason that you can't make sense of, this book is the key to fixing your brain! :)

2. Not managing health: Perhaps the number one cause of depression is sleep deprivation. You can only control 3 things in your health life: sleep, diet, and exercise. To make a long story short - go to bed early, eat healthy, and exercise daily. I had a strong belief that what I put in my body on a daily basis and what time I went to bed did NOT have ANY correlation to my depression, BOY was I wrong! If you have depression, you HAVE to go to bed early if you want to be able to manage it! There are tricks to force yourself to do that, but that's another post.

3. Underlying health condition: This is usually either (1) a food allergy, or (2) some kind of disease. For me, I discovered a few years ago that I had a dairy allergy, and more recently, ADHD-I. A good friend of mine had been privately struggling with depression for over a year and was finally diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis. Others have had Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Cancer, ADHD, and so on - the common reaction to having an unknown health condition is to screw you up emotionally and cause depression.

So as far as practical application goes, it's very simple:

1. Use the 10 Days to Self-Esteem workbook (...for 10 days)
2. Go to bed EARLY
3. Eat super healthy
4. Exercise daily (doctors say 30 minutes, so there you go)
5. Determine if you have an underlying health condition

So here are the questions to ask yourself if you are still dealing with depression:

1. Did I use the 10 Days workbook all the way through yet?
2. Have I been going to bed early for a few days consistently?
3. Am I eating super healthy or putting crap into my body?
4. Did I exercise today?
5. Have I figured out if I have an underlying health condition? If I have one, have I begun treatment for it?

And of course, we all know how wonderful ADHD makes actually DOING things, so it can be a massive struggle to simply put those simple principles into place. The great thing is, the information is all there - it's not that we don't know how to eat healthy (homemade ham sandwich vs. Burger King, for example) or go to bed early, it's that we lack the motivation to do this, and subsequently the focus and the energy to make it happen. I had such a struggle believing that first, taking care of my body had anything to do with my depression (it did, TOTALLY), and second, that changing my thinking patterns would even help at all (again it did, TOTALLY).

The thing to keep in mind is, it doesn't go away. If you have a chemical imbalance for whatever reason, you're going to have your off days no matter what. It's just how the system works - the better you manage it, the better you'll be able to cope, but you'll still have bad days - and you can cope with those too. But I live a productive, happy life despite having severe clinical depression. Once you seperate it from yourself and treat it as you would, say, missing a leg and having to walk around on crutches everywhere, then you're absolutely fine.

How did this one-line smart-aleck reply turn into a huge post, haha...anyway, thanks to ADHD, I have a hard time keeping all this in mind in relation to actually living life. I get frustrated that I can't enjoy looking forward to "routine activities" which are also fun, like riding around on my road bike. A clearer understanding of what I'm dealing with always helps me deal with it though! :)

Ok. I'm sold. I just went to Amazon to get 10 Days to Self-Esteem. Then I saw the "eligible for free shipping on orders over $25", and I already had What does Everybody Else Know That I Don't? in my cart...so I looked at my saved list to make up the $25, and ended up with Delivered from Distraction, and ADD & Romance. But... didn't want to wait the 5-9 business days, so I went ahead and paid the $7 for standard shipping. :rolleyes: :p It IS payday.

Hopefully, I'll get them Friday. :D Now, if I can just sit, read, and absorb.

thanks!!!

Ok. I'm sold. I just went to Amazon to get 10 Days to Self-Esteem. Then I saw the "eligible for free shipping on orders over $25", and I already had What does Everybody Else Know That I Don't? in my cart...so I looked at my saved list to make up the $25, and ended up with Delivered from Distraction, and ADD & Romance. But... didn't want to wait the 5-9 business days, so I went ahead and paid the $7 for standard shipping. :rolleyes: :p It IS payday.

Hopefully, I'll get them Friday. :D Now, if I can just sit, read, and absorb.

thanks!!!

Hah, awesome! Best way to do the 10 Days workbook is first thing in the morning. Wake up, do it. Otherwise it will (most likely) never happen. Remember that it's a 10-day workbook, so you have to (1) do it every day and not try to cram it all in one day, and (2) you have to DO it every day, so set a time that you're going to do it (or skip the time and just do it when you first wake up!).

Hah, awesome! Best way to do the 10 Days workbook is first thing in the morning. Wake up, do it. Otherwise it will (most likely) never happen.

Er...I barely have enough time to get a shower, get dressed, brush my teeth, and rush out the door. There ain't no way anything else is getting done... :D Of course, I haven't gotten the book yet. If it's something simple and doesn't require writing, it might get done. :D

To be perfectly honest, this morning, I actually got up the first time my alarm went off (I usually set it for 5:05, then reset it to 5;45 or so) I was ready let's see, about 30 minutes earlier than normal, and I CANNOT sit around and wait, so I left the house and got to work 30 minutes earlier than normal (which was an hour early). :p

I can always do it first thing when I get to work-- I arrive 30 minutes earlier than I'm supposed to anyway-- that way I'm the first one in the building, and don't have to say hi to anyone on the way in. :p

No-we are past perfection we are bored of it.........nice colour are you bored of the old colour or is this the perfect colour?

you got me here: perfect (or rather favorite) color. the perfectionist in me ;)

I really wish this thread had continued. I enjoyed reading comments from others who struggle with the same issues I have.
The ideas about how to deal with overcoming motivation for ADHD-ers is valuable. I would have liked to see more comments on the variety of head games that ADHD-ers play to overcome the motivation problem.

Imagining that I will lose my job if I am found incompitent or "discovered" has always been a stressful, yet effective, motivator. Social shaming seems to work pretty well also. Being a hero by completing this task is another tactic. (I use that one alot.)

I really wish this thread had continued. I enjoyed reading comments from others who struggle with the same issues I have.
The ideas about how to deal with overcoming motivation for ADHD-ers is valuable. I would have liked to see more comments on the variety of head games that ADHD-ers play to overcome the motivation problem.

Imagining that I will lose my job if I am found incompitent or "discovered" has always been a stressful, yet effective, motivator. Social shaming seems to work pretty well also. Being a hero by completing this task is another tactic. (I use that one alot.)

Yeah, that's just a general ADHD problem - no sense of deadlines whatsoever. Deadlines don't become real until the last-minute panic kicks in, then it amps our brains into over-drive. Terrible :D

Yeah, that's just a general ADHD problem - no sense of deadlines whatsoever. Deadlines don't become real until the last-minute panic kicks in, then it amps our brains into over-drive. Terrible :D

That scenerio sounds very familiar to me. . .it basically describes my entire college career. I actually did very well on the projects that I waited to do until the last minute. . .go figure. . .