When I first was diagnosed with ADD and first got medications that worked, it was in conjunction with also getting treated for sleep apnea, and with the combined effect, I felt great, I felt renewed, but I also felt chronologically displaced. I felt, strangely enough, like a fascinated curious teenager in an adult chronologically displaced body, at first. It was a wonderful and very painful experience, knowing what it was like to be a teenager with a mind, and knowing my teenager years ended 20 years earlier. I had to accept my feelings, like being a teenager again, and go from there. In some ways, I am still that teenager, who has developed a few years since then, now a young adult, who happens to be in his 40's raising children, not in his early twenties making career choices and discovering himself. I am both, in both places at once, chronologically displaced, living 2 lives.

Very well-said. I can relate very well! I feel much younger than my years. I'm soul-searching and figuring out things I probably should have learned 20 years ago. Simultaneously, I'm raising two high-maintenance children. I'll have to come back to this topic after I find out why the second one is screaming at the top of his lungs....

I'm back. (You don't want to know.)

This is a very interesting topic. Much of my frustration in my 20s was due to getting stuck in the "choosing a career and getting a life" stage. Not knowing about the ADD, I couldn't figure out why I was having so much difficulty making choices and following through on them.

I've gone through many, many life changes in the past few years. I'm now married, raising two young children. I still don't think I look or act my age, but am sometimes self-conscious because most of the other moms I meet are younger. I do feel chronologically displaced, as if I'm tackling two life stages at once. But that's not a new feeling for me. What's new is the awareness that helps me deal with it all.

I'm glad to know (relieved) that someone else has experienced this. It is an odd feeling, that is hard to describe to anyone. Like a time warp. It was most strong when I was first diagnosed and treated. At that point, I felt like I was in a new and seperate reality, in a new body I did not recognize, married to someone I did not know, and of all things, I had two children walking around! Talk about my shock. I felt like a teenager in highschool who had been transposed into an adult life, and didn't know how the hell I got here. I doubt anyone has had a similar experience, but logic tells me I could not be the only human to have experienced it. No, it was not a psychotic break, as strange as it sounds. Or was it? If it was, no doctor picked up on it, and I was under the care of doctors, and told them what I was experiencing, including my psychiatrist. Since then, I have progressively been closing the gap, between teenager seeking awareness and adult raising a family. The schizm is not as great as it was, and is closing steadily, but it still exists.

I also feel stuck in an earlier age. I had the same problems in my 20s trying to decide what i wanted to be when I grew up. This continued through my 30s and 40s. I will turn 50 in a week, and I still don't know. I know a lot of things I can't do, because of the ADD, or the fact that that door is now closed to an old fart like me, but I don't know what I CAN do. And yes, I look a lot younger than I feel (except for the graying hair). Must be that ADD is the secret to youthfulness!!

Stranger, go to the new poll on age and youthful appearance...

:)

Jon

I could never put what you have siad into words as the years went by but I have bbeen many of the choices.

I am now:

I was living 2 very seperate age realities; pursuing 2 age-related growth stages at the same time, the gap has closed significantly

in this stage as I have been able to put a name to the demon but now realise Im to old to choose a carear that I want to do for the rest of my life.

Not that I couldn't now but more that I wouldn't want to be stuck in the same place for ever.

A month in the future seems like forever from now

A month in the past was a lifetime ago

I have lived many diferent lifetimes in the span of 50 years and really feel sorry for people who spend forever in the same job day in and day out.

Gary

Funny thing is I could never put into words what I felt either :) but then the words to describe it finally arrived. I'm not sure the definition is very precise, nor am I sure we are all talking about the same experience. However, I am sure we are all talking about a similar experience. If anyone, you or others, would put more detail into the description of this experience of being in two times at once, what is the psychological impact, does it feel real, like reality, or does it feel vaguely uncomfortable, and did it appear one day like lightening or was it always there like an old shadow friend? Did it grow with intensity with aging or subside. When was it most intense? Does anyone have any extremely vivid memory of what it felt like at its most intense time?

Calling all chronologically displaced person to tell the details of its worst moments. These kind of answers would help me tremendously, to narrow down the phenomenon of "chronological displacement" into a clear definition. I might be able to help someone have an "AHA! YES THATS WHAT I AM FEELING" experience, where they know finally they are not nuts afterall and not alone. Your stories could help.

Jon

ok i will think about this and get back to you on it

Thank you Gary.

I can't vote, but I would say the gap has closed a little. #2 choice.

I am feeling now in my twenties but with a 40 year old wisdom.
And I even often remember my age, which is sometimes a shocker.

I often feel reborn, as I make little but profound discoveries daily it seems. Very cool.

Maybe ths is off topic, but I at first thought this thresd might be about people who felt they were born in the wrong century.
I have a lot of reinactor fiends who relate more to a specific historical time period.

Sooo with that subject in mind I wanted to mention, that I feel misplaced often as I feel a kindred to a feeling of a past life. And often feel I am living a dual existance. Kind of like I am growing away from it. As I intergrate with the human race in new ways in this lifetime, and now I play out intead of hideaway in fear that someone wil hear my soul through my music.I was a hermit in this life, yet a healer. Medicine man, lived in europe somewhere, closet musician. I am quite sure it was a man. When I was very little I felt funny about being a girl, and wasn't entirely sure I should have been one. In my pre teens I started to realise for sure I was meant to be a female.
I guess that should be another thread!

Thank you Jelly Bean

I've been thinking about this for some time, and wondering how others (like us) would be experiencing it.

I voted #2, although my first impulse was to vote #3. I had an immediate second thought that maybe I hadn't yet experienced enough change to have "caught up". You really have to be at the end of your life to sum up what all happened.

But the change I've experienced in the last couple of years (post-Ritalin) can't possible be considered "minor". It seemed that before, life was a fogbank I was always walking into, or out of which things would lurch unexpectedly. I was always living in the present (childlike), and was always surprised about how things turned out, good or bad.

Now, after two worthless meds (and recently a worthless fourth taken as a "holiday"), I'm on MPH (generic Ritalin), and the results are fascinating. I "calmed down" (I had stopped expecting that cliche response after two meds that made my irritation and reactivity worse), and then I noticed why: I could see through that fogbank (or further into it than before), and see the end of a work project in my mind instead of having no idea how long it would take or whether it would "blow up" on me unexpectedly.

I read recently that an imaging study chronicled brain development in children right into early adulthood, and the part that develops last is -- surprise -- the frontal lobe. I would guess that AD/HD brains get "stuck" in that stage.

Most interesting was the description of the development process, which involved cutting back extra connections (!). Maybe this "fog" I'm talking about is the whirlwhind of stimulation (inner as well as outer) that makes me feel like Dorothy in the tornado all the time. My brain never cut back on all the garbage and gave me a leg-up on how to do "adult" things like prioritize and distance myself from other things and people that really had nothing to do with me.

Now that makes me think how a teenager must feel, to be able to think and having an adult body to use, but unable to keep their emotions and thoughts on an even keel......


Ken

Your welcome John. (ooops)
very interesting Ken!
I may be slooowww, (Kind of a brain fog I don't want to wait to clear) what do you think is the cause of an adder getting stuck in the frontal lobe stage? Does chemical imbalance make it hard for us to go beyond????

When I was a teen, I knew things and tried things and accomplished things and wanted things that would traditionally be expected of people five-ten years older than myself. The contradiction then was that I could not let someone know of my whereabouts, call if I was to be late, turn in my homework or have a comfortable conversation with other girls my age. I'd place those behaviors at a developmental level of someone five-ten years younger than myself. It is not easy to face that type of reality about oneself when one is a big hormone-y mess.

In my early twenties, I had a husband, a child, then two children, then three children. When others my age were working on developing themselves professionally and personally, I was working on developing toddlers and a marriage. That could potentially have been difficult, but luckily it was exactly what I wanted at the time. I still felt like a teen, though. I had plenty of energy (still do) and flying by the seat of my pants is a pretty great feeling. I can remember catching myself from time to time thinking "Wow, this is a huge responsibility. How will I, the girl who gets zeros on homework, manage to not screw it up?" I did not get stuck there in those thoughts, thankfully, because I had to act and I could not afford to think. Oh yeah, I usually got high grades on tests. You should never think deeply about the physics of motion and balance when you are learning to ride a bike.

I still feel in my twenties, although I am in my thirties. I have recently learned that of all the parents of children in my oldest daughter's grade, my husband and I are the only gen-Xers. The rest are classified as baby boomers. This was a result of a poll taken in conjunction with their social studies unit. I should be saving for my retirement and kids' braces and college, but I want to spend my money on a bike and some improv classes. I won't get them, I am too responsible; but I probably won't be contributing to the retirement/college funds either, I am not that responsible. That is where I am now.

I hope this is what you are looking for Jon.

Thank you Jellbean, Ken and FlakeyGirl. Great descriptions.

Please have a moment to reflect and have patience with me on this. I want each of you to reach in deeper, to look beyond the impartial observer within each of you, and to come out with something a little more adventurous. I want you to explore inwardly, without the impartial overservation, and see what leaps out at you. Then write it.

What is it to be chronologically displaced? How do you know you are chronologically displaced? Remember, use the irrational side of yourself to answer these questions. If typing a guttoral sound works, use it, if painting an image with words works, use it, if describing an emotion felt in a different more commonly known situation can provide an analogy to your feelings, do it. Combine all the possibilities and see what comes out.

I am in that boat two. I feel like an adult more than in the past. I think that the meds and behavior changes have brought me closer to addulthood.

I felt like I was a teenager my whole adult life. I still feel I am a lot younger than my age. I do not think I started acting even close to mature until I was at leat 36. There will always be a part of me that is at a different age level. I like that part of me and do not want to change the positive aspects of it.
Jim

JellyBean ---

Maybe "stuck" isn't the right term, but maybe also it rang a bell with you. I didn't think of it as a fog or in any terms of something unusual (or "abnormal") until I started familiarizing myself with AD/HD symptoms and stories. I had just thought I was someone who was always too busy to keep track of time....

The fog metaphor is also personal, and maybe a shrink could make something of it. It's an image I've had since before high school -- of a sunny day with birds in the trees, but looming over the horizon is a wall of dark clouds. I have only recently recognized it as a common scene from my childhood, as I lived within 3 miles of the Pacific, and fogbanks would roll in all the time. Still, it stuck with me for some reason..... I'd like to think my subconscious (or whatnot) was trying to tell me something about my AD/HD symptoms.

Who knows????????? %P

Ken

I don't think I have ever felt displaced...I'm 31 and to most people probably don't act my age. The point I'm trying to make is that I'm me and that is all I know how to be...It doesn't feel out of place to play silly games with my kids or crack jokes with my friends. I only feel out of place when I'm trying to fit in with the norm I've given up on that...life is too short to spend half my time stressing the small stuff.

I could relate to Flakey's response. When I was a kid, through college, I acted more mature for my age, as I went through adulthood, I felt more like a grade schooler. A bout of depression around my recent 40th birthday has made me feel more adult. I'd rather feel like a kid again, I still can't act like an adult but I would like to be able to cope like an adult and feel like a kid. It was never shocking to me to feel another age, I always felt different and accepted that I was unusual.

Originally posted by paulbf
I would like to be able to cope like an adult and feel like a kid.

That is one of the most beautiful, succinct statements, about becoming an adult and being an adult. What a perfect sentiment, it just captures the ADD personality for me in so many ways. I love feeling like a kid, being like a kid, when appropriate to let myself loose and be so, but I also want to be respected, be in charge, be an adult. there are parts of being a kid that are not so great, like not being in charge, and I don't like that part.

I think ultimately for anyone, not just people with ADD, the best of both is your statement, to feel like a kid and cope like an adult. Afterall, childhood allows us to be fanciful, and there is no reason to give up the wonderful fancifulness of our personalities. If all adults had to give that up, there would be no comedians, no entertainers, no jugglers, no clowns, no doll makers. Those who have given that part up, they have a different challenge, they may wish they could get back in touch wit their childishness and be fun again.

So balance is important in devloping oneself, and not blocking out one healthy part of our personality in order to develop another part. One does not have to lose the child in order to gain the adult; doing so would entail swapping one sinking ship for another sinking ship. Growing up makes more sense than that! To have both worlds is the goal.

I will share with you that for me, the dichotomy was real, vivid, and horribly painful. I was extremely depressed for about 6 months as I realized had I been diagnosed earlier I would have been an MD and many other things would have been different. I started having dreams for the first time in ages, when I was diagnosed in 1996. My diagnosis was especially impactful, because I discovered and received treatment for 2 conditions at one time, sleep apnea and ADD. My sleep apnea was severe, and it was reducing the oxygen in my system, in my brain, literally giving me a fog that followed me all day. When this was finally lifted off me, and then ADD medication was added, it was like the world had just moved over for me; it was like I entered a new dimension, walked through a portal, and the world was different. And when I looked at myself, I was different. I did not recognize myself. This was REAL. I knew who I was in name, but who I was in the more dynamic sense was just beginning to become apparent. I was on the verge of an explosion, my personality was bursting, my curiousity was just bubbling over, I mean I was curious about everything, even the damn toilet - I would watch the urine combine and think of the scientific laws that must be being demonstrated. I was curious about everything. I could not read enough books, I was voracious in my appetite to discover the world. And I was living in two different worlds. The one I had created was no longer me, and the one I was now in, was a me I had not met before. The difference was painful. Over time I have grown and reconsiled the two parts of me. I have also experienced a painful awareness that I am not up to speed with my peers. Finally, I have forgotten about much of that and am focusing on me, am I happy, not "them", but even that was a maturational step that I could not have taken pre-diagnosis. I am still chronologically displaced, but I am finding my way in the world, and I am repairing my growth process, and I am satisfied that I am developing into who I will ulimately become. That is a statement I could not have made a few years ago, so progress is made.

Jon

I'm thinking more & more that I'm not ADD but I went through some rough times as a kid & that made me old at a young age because I didn't get much chance to be a kid. Then it interfered with my proceeding to mature while part of me was at an advanced level at the same time. As an adult, I retained a certain amount of childish innocence that I still needed to get out of my system... and I won't be giving that up now, I think. What I did get from the middle-aged depression is a smack in the face from reality and I hope I can come to terms with that.

paulbf

what bis that thing beside you in your avatar

it looks like a cross between a cat and a racoon

It's a cat. He is big but not that big (only 18 pounds). I just faked our faces onto the forest background. I switch the picture to his full size face for a while.

omg your cat is bigger then my six month old son lol Luckily he looks like a keeper.

hmmm... a chronologically displaced feline?

ok Jon.

I am ****ed that I am gaining sense enough to know better.

I feel like a 10 yr old boy in a 16yr olds body with a sexdrive of an animal

I still feel like the 11 year old ADHD kids I work with, and tend to act like them from time to time, just in a much more adult manner as it were...

That said, I don't complain. "Be ye as little children..." Ok no problem. :)

KMiller I love your philosophy!! I'm wondering how you work with ADHD kids? Both my children along with myself are ADHD and my son is 11 this year so naturally I'm curious. And I'm really sorry I tried re-wording it a 100 times and it still comes out sounding like your some kind of pedophile and it's not meant that way at all.

I talked about chronological displacement today with my therapist. I explained that prior to being diagnosed in 1996 with sleep apnea i was sleeping my life away, living in a fog when i wasnt asleep. When i got a CPAP for the sleep apnea, all the light bulbs lit up, and the fog dissappeared completely. Well, there was a mild fog left, called ADD, but in relative comparison to the Sleep Apnea fog, the ADD fog was mild. Isnt that hard to believe!

Well, with the light bulbs going on, I went into a state of being a 10th grader emotionally, right where i apparently left off my developmental track. It was a horrendous experience and wonderful at the same time, to be 36 yrs old, and be thinking like a teenager, was awkward to say the least. You seee, in my former life, i had learned to act like an adult, i was a financial planner, i wore expensive suits and ties, and dealt with a lot of money and serious financial planning issues of investment, insurance, estate planning, etc. So to all of a sudden feel like a child, a teenager, was really rocking my world. I didnt know what the hell was going on. All this undeveloped teenager stuff was surpressed and waiting to come out but couldnt come out until the fog of the sleep was lifted. then the developmental emotions came rushing in like a steam train!

I was in two worlds, running a financial planning practice and feeling like a kid. I opted to go back to college, and that made me even more like a kid. I was with 18 yr olds in classes! Holy smokes! And they were more mature than me!

That was 1996.

In 2001, I met my mentor. She was a psychodramatist. She invited me to her classes and she made it possible for me to start developing at a speed needed to catch up.

Today it is 2004, and i feel i am about 20 something. Probably 27-30... and in real life i am 45. My career, however, the change needed to become a therapist, requires more education, so that makes me feel early to mid 20s because of the lack of completion in my career choices. Otherwise, I have matured a lot in 3 years. More than i ever did in my life. In fact, 3 years ago is like another lifetime. That is how much changed took place.

I start psychodrama again in 2 weeks. My 4th year will begin.

In the meantime, i have discovered that until i correct some somatic issues, such as getting to bed and waking up on a schedule, and being on time, i will be having trouble all my life with my goals. I therefore am going to try some novel approaches to both problems. I'll report back here on what i try and how its going.

Anyhow, I believe chronological displacement is a real phenomenon and this poll has bolstered that idea.

Personal accounts are requested! Type away!

Jonathan

Healthwiz --

There's too much here to go after with a detailed quote. I'll just have to rely on my short-term memory ( :eek: ).

1) having a sleep disorder is definitely a bigger issue for an adult with AD/HD than the AD/HD itself, given you've had most of your adult life to work out coping strategies. I'm jealous you found something in your life that made AD/HD seem relatively minor ( :D ).

2) .... finding 18-year olds who act more "mature" than you feel? What a shock. My own belief is that "maturity" is just another social skill (or skill set) that becomes internalized, like bicycle riding. It's not really conscious or intellectualized -- except for AD/HDs, who play catch-up all their lives and seem to have to curtail themselves and "fake it" in group situations (with non-ADDs). At least I have to.... But that's a common bit of self-flagellation that ADDs (yes I am also speaking for myself) tend to do -- "I'm so #@($#$#*(*@ immature!"

3) The mentor relationship is one good thing about your psychodrama therapy (as far as I can tell, who's never actually attended your group, so take with salt....). At least that sounds like the kernel of value in the whole "coaching" approach. Every highly successful person with ADD I've known (and a lot I know about) had a mentor of some kind.

Keep on truckin'....

Ken

thanks vinceptor

i wish my add or sleep issues, whichever is predominent, would go away!!!
I would like to succeed at something in my life.
I run my own little business, but that is not enough.
I need to feel better than I feel.

I guess I'm not too happy today. I appreciate your uplifting notes, and think its funny now, that I said the 18 yr olds were more mature. In reality, i had more life experience and had more maturity in that way. So maybe i was self flagulating. On the other hand, there must have been something there, or i wouldnt have mentioned it. I must have felt immature at the time.

Today, as i said, its been 3 years since i started psychodrama, and i feel a lifetime more mature. But i am still stumbling on basic blocks, like waking, sleeping, controlling my energy level to be awake throughout the day, being productive, being on time.

I'm not sure what i am so unhappy about, not depressed, just unhappy, and i am tired of it. I hope htis year in psychodrama i can face off with my unhappiness, and see what i can do about it. The prior 3 years have been about letting go of anger and resentment and shame and ugly memories. I've done a lot of that, and now it is time to look at my life, and see what i can do to improve it, to improve the way i feel about my life. I guess the prior work had to be done first.

I also agree, the value of a mentor has been invaluable.

Take care and again, thanks for posting! Post again!

Jonathan

No problem, Jonathan

Ken

Not sure if i count since im only 19, but i've always lived more mature then my age and being friends with people older then me, but at the same time, i hide inside my head the fact that i really feel younger then 19... again since im only 19 i could just be crazy :P

-Bright Shadow

Not sure if i count since im only 19, but i've always lived more mature then my age and being friends with people older then me, but at the same time, i hide inside my head the fact that i really feel younger then 19... again since im only 19 i could just be crazy :P

-Bright Shadow

I hopeyou don't mind a few questions, which might help unravel your reasons for enjoying older friendships.

Having older friends in itself may be healthy if they are compatible with you, and if they are not exposing you to negative influences; ie, if they are a positive force in your life, possibly even taking mentoring roles with you. If you are soley attracted to older people, it may be a sign that you are unable to relate well to the emotional experiences of people in your age group, and that may be something you want to confront and learn about in your own growth.

How do you view the emotional states of people in your age group? Are you able to be friends with people your own age? Do you understand people your own age? Can you relate to them? Have you gone through similar growth stages, rebellion stages, aspiration stages, as people your age?

You can ask yourself these questions without posting your answers. If you wish, you can post your answers.

I'll share with you my experience.

When I was younger, including as a young adult like you, I related to older people better. People older than myself often mentored me in a form of friendship. I really needed that older friendship. It provided some security for me. I didn't have much of a relationship with my parents or older brothers. I didn't have anyone older than me to go to, except the older friends I made. They were good for me. However, when I look back with all the knowledge I have now, I realize I was having trouble in my own development and looking for guidance. I was not in the same developmental stages as my peer group, I didn't like the way kids my age acted. To older people I was a likeable person and they didnt mind putting some effort into helping me.

Good Luck

Jonathan

Well I think im in a similar situation. Some of my older friends have been good and give me good memories that i can look back at though some were bad influences. I have a group of friends still from highschool and we meet during vacations to have Lan parties and such. I just don't have many friends my age, but many who are older. even my best friend is 2 years older then me. My only brother is younger then me, and i hate my dad for too many reasons to state here! (But i'll share one opinion he has that makes me mad every time i think about it. he doesn't belive in ADHD. even though its such a big factor in my life and effects me in different ways all the time)

-Bright Shadow

(But i'll share one opinion he has that makes me mad every time i think about it. he doesn't belive in ADHD. even though its such a big factor in my life and effects me in different ways all the time)

-Bright Shadow

Hi Bright!

Lets look at this problem of a father not accepting the ADD diagnosis. Is it just a repeat of the many other things this father did not accept, the lack of recognition from the same father on so many other occassions? Do you think to yourself, "Finally, something scientific, rational, that this father can bite into and see the light about me, his son, that I have ADD and I am a good kid! Damni* why won't he bite? Why can't he didn't see the light? Why can't he see that I am a good person.....he still doesn't approve of me....."

I know all those lines because I have thought them all myself in my own situation. Some fathers cant feel they love their children and condone them when their behaviors don't match the parents belief of their ability. Unfortunately, a child with ADD rarely meets his full ability, and therefore rarely gets his parent's unconditional approval. Its sad for all of us, because so many of us have gone through this, in a more extreme amount than many of our peers have had to experience. It has hampered our emotional growth and our confidence. Many of us, I imagine, can relate to this all too common problem for the ADD child/adult/.

On the other hand, there are also other factors in the way parents operate. It may not be entirely about ADD. Some parents are shut off emotionally and can't be supportive of any person suffering any illness, expecially if it bears upon the psychological.

Sometimes people cannot acknowledge labels because it would put a serious dent in their own world order. In other words, if your personality attributes aren't personality attributes, then what about their own personality attributes tnhat they could never actually figure out or accept about themselves? Are they having an undiagnosed illness too? Will they have to see a psychologist? Those thoughts might run through their mind at least at a lower unconscious awareness.

Another reason some people won't cave to the ADD illness paradigm, is they may feel they are the last remaining bastion for a loved one, standing between an unproven but popular paradigm and "good ole common sense". If that person does not see how the ADD illness paradigm will help you, then he may be resistent to jump on the bandwagon. In other words, love and fear, may both be operating at the same time, to prevent a loved one from accepting the paradigm you are wishing to accept for yourself. It is a parents job, to leave you an out, a channel of escape, and the fact that your parent does not buy into the paradigm whole heartedly gives you an out someday, if you feel you need it. You may not need it, but in their thoughts, that time is when you will appreciate their being the last hold out. In the meantime, they may feel it is a parents obligation to be unpopular with their child, if they think it's important enough. Some parents have learned to be more flexible and not put the whole relationship at risk over belief systems; others never learned how to be more flexible and still feel like a responsible parent. These same parents may not have learned how to express themselves well emotionally, and they may not have learned how to explore their own issues. They are going to be difficult to get to accept your illness paradigm, because they don't have an adequate paradigm to cover their own needs.

Now, those are just possibilities, not actual reasons for your circumstance. It's intended as an exercise to maybe open the tiny possibility that its not necessarily out of a lack of love that a person is annoying you with pessimism about your latest belief system. It may be their own lack of power, not yours.

Now, you said you really hate your father, for too many reasons, so this just becomes one more issue of lack of acceptance on the stack of many. That is rough, I've been there. It will take time and compassion and being able to trade shoes with him, to be able to overcome differences like those. It may sound implausible or impossible, but in my case it was until I traded places with my father, truly, emotionally and spiritually, (for a few moments) that I began to understand he was giving me all he could or was able to give me, that he loved me in the capacity he was able to considering all his emotional blockages. I realized his emotional blocks were not going to change and were not under his control to change. They were a part of him, and due to his character and the way he was raised, and his hurts in his life, not likely to change. Until then, until that moment when I finally traded places with him and understood, it angered me endlessly that my father was unable to meet my needs. After that moment, he met my needs much easier, because with my new understanding, my needs changed, became more appopriate for his ability and more likely to be met by my father, and were easier to meet.

I feel for you right now. As I felt for myself. But I can tell you, that even with the most hostile of parents, some equilibram can be reached, with some effort, but that effoft is mostly on your part. One of the most valubale lessons I learned was that everything a parent does is a lesson, whether they realize it or not, we learn to "NOT" do what they did, and that is a lesson in itself, and if they were not our parents, we may not have gotten that lesson. It makes the unpleasant lessons a lot easier to digest in restrospect, and makes it possible to learn from everything our parents do, from the good and the bad and the ugly, not just from the positive.

My father has since died. I let him die in peace. I was at peace with him. He was at peace with me. It was a gift to be at peace with him, and worth the painful moments of enlightenment to acheive it. At another time in my life, I would have never believed we would have reached peace.

Sincerely,

Hope that helps

Jonathan

Nice words Jonathan

I wish my parents were still alive so I could talk to them about what I have discovered in my quest for answers.

But they are not , but my son is and at least I can share with him what I am learning from all of you.

Nice words Jonathan

I wish my parents were still alive so I could talk to them about what I have discovered in my quest for answers.

But they are not , but my son is and at least I can share with him what I am learning from all of you.

Hi Gary,

Good to hear from you!!

You can still have that long wanted conversation with your parents. You only need to remember how to role play each of them, momentarily, long enough to change chairs, and give the answers you think they would give, allowing yourself to be spontaneous, to change body postures, to change vocal styles, and to change mindsets. You can have that conversation, and conclude the pieces of work you want to do with them, and establish a peacefullness. I think you, and anyone else who tries, would be amazed at how much can be accomplished.

In psychodramas, the "other" people are not present, such as mom's dad's siblings, lovers, teachers, etc. But we know their body language, their voice style, their mental style enough to act their role, and then something takes over.....its called psychodrama, it takes over, and magical experiences start to happen. It helped me prepare by healling in this way first. Then when my chance came to heal with my father, everything went much better than I thought it would. However, many psychodramas are done with people who are deceased, and yet, the participants get a great deal of discovery and growth from the experience, as well as a sense of final closure.

As for your son, your children, I can relate. Isn't it great we get to take our mistakes, our hard knocks, our bad relationships with our parents, and turn around and give our children something good in their parental relationships. Its a blessing in disguise, we learned to NOT do what our parents did, and it made us better parents.

Take care

Jonathan

...

In psychodramas, the "other" people are not present, such as mom's dad's siblings, lovers, teachers, etc. But we know their body language, their voice style, their mental style enough to act their role, and then something takes over.....its called psychodrama, it takes over, and magical experiences start to happen.

...
Jonathan

From my own experiences with P-drama I learned (to some degree) how to recognize when I (and others in the group) were putting on their "daddy" (or "mommy", or even "granma" or "auntie" or...) hats and acting out a script written by their parents or other role models. It's now second nature and enhances my reading of social cues...

I don't know about "magic"; if you only understand that most people learn by example, and family members have priveleged access to the young minds growing up among them, it seems quite natural....

Ken

From my own experiences with P-drama I learned (to some degree) how to recognize when I (and others in the group) were putting on their "daddy" (or "mommy", or even "granma" or "auntie" or...) hats and acting out a script written by their parents or other role models. It's now second nature and enhances my reading of social cues...

I don't know about "magic"; if you only understand that most people learn by example, and family members have priveleged access to the young minds growing up among them, it seems quite natural....

Ken

Your the first person here I know of who has commented on experiences in psychodrama. Thanks for comments on your experience! Comment more!

Magic always has an explaination,

thank you Ken :)

Well, for all my skeptical crust, I'm still an unregenerate Tolkien addict, and can't play cynic all the time.

Besides, what is science but a window into unimaginable worlds -- as scientist JBS Haldane once said (more or less), "the truth is not only stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we CAN imagine".

Ken

I have alway thought I was the only one who felt this way. As I became older I have felt this way. I have felt more and more disconnected from my family and my peers in general.

I know when I am a postion, for instance when I was doing child care in the homes, I felt very capable of what I had to do. The child were alway my first priority. I dont think it is have the position of power...just that this is what i am need to do to take of these children...I am responsible for.

Then there is the me...when I am around my sister or other people younger or older or in the relatively same age group if they have gotten further in their life I feel inferior and as if I am a failure and loser. I want to be able to feel connected to people and my family but now I dont and dont know how to deal with it. You are not alone. auntchris:rolleyes: