View Full Version : Reasonable Rates for ADD Coaching ?


Tara
08-16-04, 12:50 PM
There has been a lot of talk through out the online community about rates for ADD Coaching being too high for the typical person with ADD to afford. I'm curious as to what people think reasonable rates are.

paulbf
08-16-04, 01:14 PM
How about three 20-minute sessions a week at $25/hr ($100/month).

Psychiatrists with 8-year doctoral degrees make $150/hr & self employed plumbers make $50/hr or more but that's difficult dirty work. Hallowell's book talks about using nearly untrained retired folks at more like $15/hr 'cause maybe sometimes it doesn't need to be real sophisticated, just a helping ear and a little common sense.

How much training is involved and what does it take to make a living? It's not quite like a shrink who can schedule seven one-hour sessions at $100/hr (or more). That works out to $182,000/yr. At $25/hr it'd be $45,000/yr but I realize that'd be hectic to take 28 separate 15-minute calls a day. Probably even a really busy coach could only manage half that much billable time so in an expensive area they might need $50/hr to make a decent living. $25/hr might be fine in a less expensive part of the country. Maybe a retired person takes four 15-minute calls per day at $15/hr & could make $15,600/yr that way.

Three 20-minute sessions a week at $15/hr ($45/month) would be nice <grin>.

Garry
08-16-04, 04:32 PM
I like this thread and am going to think a bit before I respond.

Garry
08-16-04, 04:56 PM
Three 20-minute sessions a week at $15/hr ($45/month) would be nice <grin>.3 x 20 = 60 mins a week

4 weeks to a month = 4 x 15 = 60 / month

unless your talking about a monthly rate Paulbf

which would make sence , say $50 a month for 3 - 20 min sessions per week
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Now if this is considered a medical benifit or treatment then it should be Tax Deductable " for the ADDer

as

we do have to remeber

that that $15 per hour that the coach is making , has made that person self employed and that "Coach" as we will call him/her is now elligable for all the "Tax Breaks" that any other "Self Employed " individual is entilted to.

If they have a car that is used for personal use and business use becomes a "Tax Break"

The fuel and repairs on that car and the insurance

Not to mention 25 % of there home as it is there office and there telephone

there internet connection and the new computer they have to buy to run there business ,

oh yes and of corase the lunch they had when they were meeting the client in a public place for the first time.

And there are many more which I wont go into at the moment,

Becuase I would like to discuss the "AVERAGE" Adder who really needs the coach who is usually "unemployed or underemployed" making minimum wage where $ 50 a month could make the difference as to whether or not that ADDer and his family eats bolgna or ham for a Sunday meal.

These Tax rules I have spoke of above are related to the "Canadian Tax System", so I may be out in left field regarding an "American Tax system",

I DONT kNOW

waywardclam
08-16-04, 10:37 PM
I actually DO think that ADD coaches deserve to be paid well for their services. Please don't think I discount or devalue your expertise, or the effort you put into your work, Tara.

What I think is that there should be more social programs in place to take the burden of these costs off of the user.

gingagirl
08-17-04, 12:02 AM
How about $100/month for 3 sessions, 45-minutes per session? I don't think it's reasonable to have 20 minute sessions 3 times per week. I think that's too much of a burden for the coach. Also, I don't really think much can be accomplished in a 20-minute talk (rather, I should say I cannot accomplish much in 20 minutes time ...sometimes it takes me that long just to get my mind in gear)



What I think is that there should be more social programs in place to take the burden of these costs off of the user.
This makes more sense to me. Seems like people's frustration is that they cannot afford coaching, not that they feel the ADD coach is being paid an unreasonable rate. Maybe we (the ADDers of the world) should set up fundraising programs specifically for those who need coaching but can't afford it.

There is a website (http://www.imom.org (http://www.imom.org/)) that raises funds to pay for veterinary expenses of animals whose owners otherwise couldn't afford treatment ...people can make a one-time donation to a specific animal, or sponsor specific animals on a monthly basis, or make a donation to a general fund that goes to whatever animal is most in need. There are some animals that need on-going care (diabetic pets, chronic renal failure kitties), which would be similiar to the on-going nature of coaching. Owners are required to post about their pet's progress ...it would be kind of weird to do that with coaching, but maybe the person receiving funds could send a personal "thank you" to people sponsoring them.

****Hope no one took offense with that example -- I'm an animal nut, so I tend to relate everthing in life to animals. People that know me have learned to consider it a compliment if I compare something in their life to an animal (I actually inadvertantly named my new dog after my best friend :p)

Another idea is to do a more formal type of peer coaching. Seems like the peer coaching forum is not used too much here. It might work better if two people would "pair up" and do the peer coaching via private email or over the phone.

paulbf
08-17-04, 01:05 AM
...3 sessions, 45-minutes per session... I don't think it's reasonable to have 20 minute sessions{

The schedule suggested by a coach I was seeing (and others) was once a week (I think only 15 minutes) so unless I'm confused again, three 20-min sessions is more than usual.


Another idea is to do a more formal type of peer coaching. Seems like the peer coaching forum is not used too much here. It might work better if two people would "pair up" and do the peer coaching via private email or over the phone.


Ha that's a good idea!

Garry
08-17-04, 07:38 PM
I actually DO think that ADD coaches deserve to be paid well for their services. Please don't think I discount or devalue your expertise, or the effort you put into your work, Tara.

What I think is that there should be more social programs in place to take the burden of these costs off of the user.
I agree with Clam on this one as we in Canada have a very good medical sytem where a session with a coach would be a lot cheaper for the medical system than a vist to a shrink.

RmCL
09-10-04, 07:42 PM
Psychiatrists with 8-year doctoral degrees make $150/hr & self employed plumbers make $50/hr or more but that's difficult dirty work. <grin>.
Well, then ... I think I am going back to school. I am in the wrong underpaid business.

We (cake decorators) get complaints if we charge $500 for a wedding cake that took well over 40 hours to produce. People are willing to pay $5.00 for a nice desert in a restrurant but not willing to pay $5.00 a slice on their guest for a wedding. I live in Alabama so it may be different in your areas.

We get less than minimum wage (about 1.00 an hour) when you put all the time and equiptment into what I do.

daisyo75
09-10-04, 09:53 PM
This is a difficult question since the going rate would be quite different depending on location. Here in the NYC metro area I would expect to pay somewhere between $50-$75 for any kind of professional service. In areas where the average income and cost of living is lower I would expect the fees to be less.

I would think that the fees that an ADD coach charges would be comparable to fees charged by professional organizers and virtual assistants.

AtWitsEnd
08-30-05, 03:09 PM
I am new to the ADD coaching but the two I spoke with both quoted me prices per month in the $350-450 range and that was for once a week email or telephone. That seemed rather excessive to me.

Andrew
08-30-05, 03:10 PM
You might want to check with the coaches at addconsults.com, however, the rates you quote are not necessarily unheard of.

Check here: http://www.addconsults.com/coaches/index.php3

Imnapl
08-30-05, 03:46 PM
I am new to the ADD coaching but the two I spoke with both quoted me prices per month in the $350-450 range and that was for once a week email or telephone. That seemed rather excessive to me.
Did these coaches have really special qualifications?

scuro
08-30-05, 03:51 PM
Ya know when we talk of ADHD we are talking impairment at some point in your life or possibly for a good deal of your life. Will e-mails or 3 twenty minute sessions a week cut it? For someone without support at home, the answer is...I don't think so. Barkley jokingly said that an EA's function was to be the surrogate executive functioning part of ADHD student.

Up here in Canada EA's make roughly a little under $30,000 US a year...give or take several grand depending on location, experience, and qualifications. How much help should an ADHD person get? Really it should come down to need and the coaches should be willing to help with anything like an EA does. They should get paid like an EA also. The services should be more of getting things done because that is the nature of disability. Things like bills, taxes, forms, applications, help with night school, coaching for dealing with certain situations, setting proper goals, and even organizing your house. This shouldn't be straight talk therapy.

Tara
08-30-05, 04:10 PM
ADD Coaching is not "talk therapy" well trained ADD Coaches do help clients come up strategies and individual programs to live more productive lives. Well trained ADD Coach are also able too pick up on the clients' prefered and strongests learning modalities and implement that into the programs and the sessions. While the majority of ADD Coachihg is done over the telephone other modalities are supplemented into the telephone sessions.


Ya know when we talk of ADHD we are talking impairment at some point in your life or possibly for a good deal of your life. Will e-mails or 3 twenty minute sessions a week cut it? For someone without support at home, the answer is...I don't think so. Barkley jokingly said that an EA's function was to be the surrogate executive functioning part of ADHD student.

Up here in Canada EA's make roughly a little under $30,000 US a year...give or take several grand depending on location, experience, and qualifications. How much help should an ADHD person get? Really it should come down to need and the coaches should be willing to help with anything like an EA does. They should get paid like an EA also. The services should be more of getting things done because that is the nature of disability. Things like bills, taxes, forms, applications, help with night school, coaching for dealing with certain situations, setting proper goals, and even organizing your house. This shouldn't be straight talk therapy.

Tara
08-30-05, 04:19 PM
I am new to the ADD coaching but the two I spoke with both quoted me prices per month in the $350-450 range and that was for once a week email or telephone. That seemed rather excessive to me.
Many ADD Coachies do takes clients one for reduced rated and offer coaching scholarships. Most of those who do this do not tell clients this up front. People who have trouble paying for these rates need to ask the coaches if they offer scholarships or accept clients for reduced rates.

I also suggest that people group together and write to organizations like ADDA (http://www.add.org) and ADD Resources (http://www.addresources.org/) letting them know that a typical adult with ADD can not afford these rates.

AtWitsEnd
08-31-05, 07:56 AM
I'm wondering if my insurance company will pay for all or part of ADD coaching. So far they've been great and pay for everything except minor copays with both psychiatrist and psychologist.

Anyone have insurance picking up coaching fees?

Tara
08-31-05, 12:01 PM
The only possible way that they might cover ADD Coaching is if it's done by a psychologist or social worker and it's billed as a regular type of session. But, other than that ADD Coaching is not covered by insurance.


I'm wondering if my insurance company will pay for all or part of ADD coaching. So far they've been great and pay for everything except minor copays with both psychiatrist and psychologist.

Anyone have insurance picking up coaching fees?

Hudson85255
06-11-06, 05:37 PM
Yes, this one is really tough.
You'd think at least there would be student rates. Maybe there are and I just don't know.
BUt I plain gave up on the idea. The person who was recommended would charge 400 a month plus a 300 dollar upfront onetimeonly, which, she said, some clients spread out over three months.
So right away I would be looking at 1500 dollars (ie she assumes I would need ongoing stuff).
Well bottom line is I just can't afford it and am going to have to try to suck it up, as I have for the last several years. Getting pretty tired of it, alright.
I agree with the person who said it ought to be put onto some form of insurance like other medical services - if the coach is medically certified (whatever that would entail).
Otherwise it's impossible (at least for me).
Rats.
Hudson in Canada

Tara
06-11-06, 08:07 PM
Many ADD Coaches are begining to offer group coaching which is a lot more afforable. For some people with ADD it's actually more benefical than one on one coaching.

QueensU_girl
06-17-06, 08:12 PM
Re: #2

Nope.

Psychiatrists do not have Doctoral degrees (e.g. a PhD). They are an MD.

They also have way more than 8 years of training.
eg
-4 yrs bachelors degree (usually a BSc)
-4 yrs Medical School (an MD; or MB, if British)
-5 years of Post Graduate specialty (eg psychiatry)
-possible 2-3 years of Sub-Specialty training (say, in forensics)

That is way more than 8 years!

You are confusing a Psychologist (PhD) and a Psychiatrist (MD + FRCP).

Psychiatrist are MDs with an extra five years of Post Graduate training ("PGY-5"). The MD lets them write Prescriptions and figure out if a Physical Illness is causing a Mental Illness.

(They really are one and the same. The brain and body are all connected and affect one another continually. For some reason, Society, in it's ignorance of neuroscience and physiology has created this False Dichotomy. Cartesian Dualism is bunk.) <G>

QueensU_girl
06-17-06, 08:13 PM
re: Hudson

Are you not eligible for the BSWD (Ontario) to pay for coaching?

Scattered
06-17-06, 09:52 PM
When I was at the ADDA Conference, the coaches I talked to seemed to be charging between $50 and $100+ an hour talked once a week. That is not that different from what you'd pay for a counselor or even psychologist. I thought the whole point was to be able to talk to this person several times a week at least to keep on track. If they're only going to be talking to you a by phone or e-mail and doing it once a week and charging those kinds or rates -- well -- I'm not sure how helpful or affordable that is for most ADDers. If you can see a Masters or Doctoral level trained mental health professional with expertise in ADD face to face once a week or talk to/e-mail a certified coach (coaching certification varies a good bit depending on which program one joins since it's such a new field) and the cost (especially after insurance pays) is about the same -- I don't see the value.

I guess in my mind coaching should be two or three times a week at least with a total monthly outlay of $100 - $200 maximum. And I'm guessing the lower figure is more in line with what most of us could afford to pay.

I also really like the idea of group coaching. Groups are a great source of support and good ideas to boot, plus it keeps the costs more reasonable. I think although on-line groups could work, face to face groups would be especially nice, with some on line contact during the week.

Now if you're talking about coaching a high powered business professional, that's a different thing than coaching a disorganized ADD mom with ADD kids. One could afford to pay a lot more.

Correct me if my thinking on this is off on this.

Scattered

Crazy~Feet
06-17-06, 09:55 PM
Seems right on to me Scattered! :D

auntchris
06-17-06, 11:45 PM
Many ADD Coachies do takes clients one for reduced rated and offer coaching scholarships. Most of those who do this do not tell clients this up front. People who have trouble paying for these rates need to ask the coaches if they offer scholarships or accept clients for reduced rates.

I also suggest that people group together and write to organizations like ADDA (http://www.add.org) and ADD Resources (http://www.addresources.org/) letting them know that a typical adult with ADD can not afford these rates.
Tara , I think alot of what a person can afford will be diffeent since some of the people who have ADHD, work , are in college and others cant work and are on subsidized government funding so a sliding scale might be agood suggestion.

I know i cant afford it and it would help. Any ways I am not trying to get free medical but I cant afford anything and I dont think that the health care in the US really thinks about how to make healthcare affordable for all of us no matter what are income. :foot::soapbox:

Tara
06-18-06, 07:58 PM
When I was at the ADDA Conference, the coaches I talked to seemed to be charging between $50 and $100+ an hour talked once a week. That is not that different from what you'd pay for a counselor or even psychologist. I thought the whole point was to be able to talk to this person several times a week at least to keep on track. If they're only going to be talking to you a by phone or e-mail and doing it once a week and charging those kinds or rates -- well -- I'm not sure how helpful or affordable that is for most ADDers. If you can see a Masters or Doctoral level trained mental health professional with expertise in ADD face to face once a week or talk to/e-mail a certified coach (coaching certification varies a good bit depending on which program one joins since it's such a new field) and the cost (especially after insurance pays) is about the same -- I don't see the value.

I guess in my mind coaching should be two or three times a week at least with a total monthly outlay of $100 - $200 maximum. And I'm guessing the lower figure is more in line with what most of us could afford to pay.

I also really like the idea of group coaching. Groups are a great source of support and good ideas to boot, plus it keeps the costs more reasonable. I think although on-line groups could work, face to face groups would be especially nice, with some on line contact during the week.

Now if you're talking about coaching a high powered business professional, that's a different thing than coaching a disorganized ADD mom with ADD kids. One could afford to pay a lot more.

Correct me if my thinking on this is off on this.

Scattered

I think one of the biggest issues with ADD Coaching is that it's based on a "Life Coaching" model. Many people with ADD are not only looking for but also need "Life Skills Coaching". There is a huge disconnect when a typical person with ADD goes and tries to find an ADD Coach. The person with ADD is looking for a "Life Skills Coach" but gets really frustrated and discouraged when they speak to ADD Coaches who are "Life Coaches" and are charging rates of Life Coaches.

There a very few ADD Life Skills Coaches out there and very few ADD Life Skills Coaching Programs out there. I have been offering a Life Skills Programs that helps people with ADD learn how to get organized through one of my web sites. The last 3 times it was offered we actually ran out of spots because there has been such a huge interest in the program.

I mentioned to several other ADD Coaches at the ADDA Conference that there is a huge need for Life Skills Coaching Programs for people with ADD. A couple of coaches seemed to get what I was saying but I didn't get the idea that most of the coaches did. I also told them how successful the program offered through my site has been.

I don't think Counseling and Coaching can really be compared. Maybe if the mental health counselor has extensive knowledge of ADD and has extensive training in Cognitive Behavioral Therapy and Reality Therapy then there could possibly be a way to compare the two. I have a feeling that there are very few mental health counselors with such a background though.

Life Coaching is a lot more than just talking on the phone once a week. There is a lot that takes place in between sessions. But, I agree that quite a good portion of people with ADD do need more than that.

scuro
06-18-06, 08:11 PM
Coaching has gotta be tough. The national dropout rate for ADHDers in schools with Special Ed programs is a whopping 34 %. Even though there are people there to help, they fail. I've tried my best here and have to admit, it's not always easy to get these kids through. I can see that getting a job, holding a job, and just making life work would be just as hard, if not harder.

Sometimes talking works but as Goldstein and others have mentioned, often you have to make change at the point of performance. You can't always talk or e-mail someone through doing things. For example doing their income tax, you have to be there and do it with them. Some ADHDers have a very low frustration level and think nothing of future consequences until it's too late and it's really taken a chunk out of their ***.

A good ADHD coach working full time should be making at least as much as an Educational assistant, or child and youth worker. They should also get gas money, a pension, and health benefits.

Scattered
06-19-06, 03:53 AM
I don't think Counseling and Coaching can really be compared. Maybe if the mental health counselor has extensive knowledge of ADD and has extensive training in Cognitive Behavioral Therapy and Reality Therapy then there could possibly be a way to compare the two. I have a feeling that there are very few mental health counselors with such a background though.I attended Sari Solden's workshop at the ADDA Conference. She is the author of Women with Attention Deficit Disorder and Journeys through ADDulthood. She actually thinks counselor can be good coaches and that in her practice she often begins with counseling, moves on to more of a consultant and later coach role with her clients. I think most counselors do have coursework in CBT and RT. Counselors don't just look at emotions, they help clients look at their life and identify what is and isn't working and find concrete steps to take to begin making changes. Plus if a counselor has an interest in ADD, I would expect they'd go on to get continuing education training in that area of ADD and related conditions and the appropriate therapies, especially since 30 hours every two years is the minimum requirement to maintain licensure. Hallowell also discusses in Driven to Distraction that the counselor can also function as a coach.

I think it is easy to get territorial at times. I know in my masters level counseling program we learned that psychologist mainly give tests and the implication was that they probably weren't as focused on the counseling process as we were. Well I'm currently seeing a psychologist and he is the best counselor I've ever worked with by far. So much for stereotypes. It is important to find the right person who has been trained in this area and has a good fit with a particular client. He also coaches me on very specific areas of my life that need addressing (schedules, career plans, parenting, etc.).

I'm not in any way trying to discouraged the use of an ADD coach -- I think it is a needed and valuable asset. I just know that when I was considering hiring one, there was no way I could have afforded it at the rates that are frequently seen and there are plenty of ADDers in that boat, I'm afraid.

I'm glad to hear that you have program that is doing well and thriving, Tara.:)

Scattered

QueensU_girl
06-24-06, 07:59 PM
re: #27

Yeah, i remember a statistic of something like 4% of 5% of us will complete Post-Secondary.

That is so sad.

I am so glad that I discovered Dragon Naturally Speaking (which can accommodate my 120 WPM) -- to enable me to get the written work done, or I never would have completed University.

Tara
06-24-06, 08:50 PM
I'm not trying to get territorial at all. I have just come in contact with far too many people looking for help from counselors for AD/HD and can't find help. There are far too many counselors who do not have a basic understanding of Adult AD/HD. Some of us have been lucky enough to find the right match but the majority of people I come in contact with both online and offline can't find proffesionals who have a clue about Adult AD/HD.

I'm not saying a counselor can't function or make good or great ADD Coach. Finding one who actually understands adult AD/HD is a huge challenge for the thousands and thousands of people I have been in contact with over the past decade.

I am one of the lucky people out there who finally found a therapist who understands AD/HD. However the process of finding one was more frustrating for me than trying to buy a car. I walked into the office with the same attitude as I did when I bought my last car.

I do agree that a typical person with Adult AD/HD has trouble affording ADD coaching. Like I have said before more people need to speak up about this issue an contact organizations like CHADD (http://www.chadd.org), ADDA (http://www.add.org), and ADD Resources (http://www.addresources.org/). These organizations are here to help people affected by AD/HD and they need to know how people feel about the ADD Coaching field.



I attended Sari Solden's workshop at the ADDA Conference. She is the author of Women with Attention Deficit Disorder and Journeys through ADDulthood. She actually thinks counselor can be good coaches and that in her practice she often begins with counseling, moves on to more of a consultant and later coach role with her clients. I think most counselors do have coursework in CBT and RT. Counselors don't just look at emotions, they help clients look at their life and identify what is and isn't working and find concrete steps to take to begin making changes. Plus if a counselor has an interest in ADD, I would expect they'd go on to get continuing education training in that area of ADD and related conditions and the appropriate therapies, especially since 30 hours every two years is the minimum requirement to maintain licensure. Hallowell also discusses in Driven to Distraction that the counselor can also function as a coach.

I think it is easy to get territorial at times. I know in my masters level counseling program we learned that psychologist mainly give tests and the implication was that they probably weren't as focused on the counseling process as we were. Well I'm currently seeing a psychologist and he is the best counselor I've ever worked with by far. So much for stereotypes. It is important to find the right person who has been trained in this area and has a good fit with a particular client. He also coaches me on very specific areas of my life that need addressing (schedules, career plans, parenting, etc.).

I'm not in any way trying to discouraged the use of an ADD coach -- I think it is a needed and valuable asset. I just know that when I was considering hiring one, there was no way I could have afforded it at the rates that are frequently seen and there are plenty of ADDers in that boat, I'm afraid.

I'm glad to hear that you have program that is doing well and thriving, Tara.:)

Scattered

QueensU_girl
06-26-06, 04:04 PM
I'd agree with the statement that ADD/ADHD is misunderstood.

FAR, FAR too many people think that you just take away the Hyperactivity or "behavioural" issues, and an ADDer is made "Normal".

They have NO concept of Executive Dysfunctions (frontal lobe) or the Auditory Memory or Working Memory impairments involved. (And there is so much more, even.)

Ofcourse, Public People like Dr. Phil, only make this worse, by having their "experts" get on the air and perpetuate various ADD myths.

I used to think Dr. Phil was OK, but after I saw his ADD shows, I realized that the Emperor Had No Clothes.

Scattered
06-26-06, 04:10 PM
I'd agree with the statement that ADD/ADHD is misunderstood.

FAR, FAR too many people think that you just take away the Hyperactivity or "behavioural" issues, and an ADDer is made "Normal".Agree -- it is very misunderstood -- don't we just wish that were so!;) I also agree with you Tara that a generic counselor wouldn't be as valuable as an ADD trained coach for those types of issues. I was referring to the idea that a counselor who had a specific interest and training in working with ADD could also function in the role of ADD coach. The fact is nobody can know everything about all the conditions there are out there and it is important to have specific areas of expertise to be the most effective.

Scattered

healthwiz
07-09-06, 04:10 PM
ADD Coaches, in my opinion, charge way too much. A psychologist, with a doctoral degree, gets reimbursed from insurance, about $80 for an hour of therapy. They also maintain an office overhead, a phone attendant, an emergency call service, and they maintain required CEU credit hours and expenses for keeping their licensure updated, and they are bound by licensure laws and boards. Furthermore, they have the $100K expense of getting the graduate school education, and a year of low paid internship, before being able to be licensed, and they had to pay for and pass the liocensure exams, which are very difficult and failure is certainly a possibility, which means they must also pay for an expensive course to prepare them for the exams. They also have to submit to insurance for payment, and wait months to get paid, and that is if they are accepted into the insurance company lists, which many are not. By the time their $80/hr is reduced by overhead of maintaining an office and assistance (outside their home), the average therapist is netting $40,000 in CA. Bear in mind, a therapist cannot do 40 hours a week of therapy, or they will burn out, and they will also be paying a lot of money for their own therapy. Therapists also have to be diagnostically trained, so they can adapt their treatment modalities based upon scientific data on treatment success per disorder. This is a lot of training for $40k per year. The top top tier therapists may earn from $60kto 90K, and we are talking the top 20%, and then above that you are talking a few percent making over $90k.

Relative to a highly trained therapist with high overhead, a coach can have zero college, go through 12 months of training for credentials over the phone or internet, does not have to go through state licensing or any licensing, does not have to have an office or a support staff, is bound by zero legal requirements, and thus has an extremely low cost of education, low time frame for getting started, can even get started immediately while training, can name their price to match whatever income they want, gets paid upfront, and with low overhead nets most of what they charge. all they need is an internet connection, a computer, email, and phone.

So lets see, less education, 1 day versus 4 undergrad years and 5 graduate years and 1 intern year (1 day versus 10 years training), should they charge more than a psychologist? LEts see, less overhead, $150/month in internet and phone and cell phone, versus high overhead, thousands per month in overhead for secretary service, answering service, medical filing, CEU credits, office space, phone, fax, mail, etc.....

So lets see, training, can start on day 1 and see how it goes, versus barred from practicing for 9 years until fully trained and licenced.

Oddly enough, the ADD coach gets paid more. They charge $120/hour easily. $400/ mo to $500/mo is probably the average coaching fee, regardless of ADD or not ADD. Many therapists are leaving therapy and becoming coaches, thus avoiding a lot of the headaches of submitting to insurance, getting lower overhead, and getting higher pay. Imagine that!

There is little explanation for this phenomenon, but i think eventually, as the market pressures bear down on coaches, as there becomes a glut of coaches looking for high paid careers, the rates will drop. for now, it seems the rates are still holding or going up. that can only last so long, and then supply and demand take over.

My suggestion to all of you who say the rates are damn high, become an ADD Coach. You know ADD better than anyone, and with a day or a year of training, you too can coach and charge these fees, and live a better life.

ITs a free world, why not?

:)

Jonathan

sammyanne1
08-17-06, 02:25 AM
I'd settle for a good virtual assistant. Someone to email me a daily task list every morning. With reminders about when bills are due. And someone to balance my checkbook. That and a weekly housekeeper is going to cost about the same thing and that would be more practical and useful.:o

healthwiz
08-17-06, 03:36 AM
I'd settle for a good virtual assistant. Someone to email me a daily task list every morning. With reminders about when bills are due. And someone to balance my checkbook. That and a weekly housekeeper is going to cost about the same thing and that would be more practical and useful.:o

good comment Sammy Anne. I agree!

Coaching $$$ could be wellspent on a housekeeper and organizer. I found that one appointment per week would cost $120. Multiply that x 4 and you have $500 a month. Alternative ways to spend $500 a month for an ADDer to have an easier life? Hmmmm.... get a housekeeper every other week (about $80 each time), you still have $340. Hire a professional organizer at $65/hr, for 2 hours of professional organization in your home once per month ( alot can get organized in two hours with a professional and they teach you methods so you can continue). You still have $210. Go to Guru.com and find a virtual assistant to be your reminder pal for 1 hour per day of wages at $10/hr M-F. You still have $10 left over. Take the final $10 and take yourself to the movies, bring your own popcorn, and you have enough left to buy a Coke. Enjoy the movies, the clean house, the new sense of organization, and the daily boost from your virtual assistant! With all the time saved, and the new sense of freedom, you can now have time to think of and implement other ways to improve your life!!

I recently hired a coach for one hour, as a test, and after that hour, realized it was going to be very expensive to go that route. Instead, I hired a housekeeper to come in and do the royal cleaning on the house for $168, and The next day I hired an organizer for 2 (3 hr) sessions, 5 days apart. I spent $390 on the organizer, and the benefits are long lasting. The benefits of the clean house and the new sense of organization are invaluable to calming the ADD mind. Yes, I'd like a coach, and maybe I will get one, but in the short run, I plan on twice a month house cleaning at $80 each time, and once a month follow up on organizing the house until I feel the organizing is finished. That is $355/month to improve my environment.

On the coaching side, I abandoned that idea for the time being, as my insurance covers psychological. I did an internet search for my area for therapists and psychologists who specialize in ADD. I dont remember where i located the search, but I started with google and quickly found a site that would allow me to search. Three names came up. I found only one with a doctorate, who worked primarily in cognative behavioral therapy modes. I prefer doctoral level training in therapists. However, there are a lot of MA level therapists that are top notch. My insurance covers this type of treatment. Its not coaching, but it still leads to looking at things differently, which is in essence what coaching is suppose to yield as well. Since it is a covered medical expense, I have the other money left over to hire the housecleaner, the organizer, etc.

I will probably hire the organizer to return every month or two to continue the process, but it was unbelievable how much an organizer could help me purge from my home, and help my children learn to do the same. In the first 3 hour session, we identified needs, then identified areas that were the highest priorities in the house. As it turned out, paper work was my highest priority. So we learned how to sort paperwork and spent about 2 hours doing that, making it much easier to throw away, file, shred, read, or take action on papers. It was amazing, we cleared about a 2 foot tall pile of papers off my dining room table, which had been like an avalanche, and we did this in 2 hours. I had to keep doing more after she left, but I got an incredible head start. The next 3 hour session, i devoted 1 hour to each child, in their bedroom, to purge their toys, their clothes, etc, and then one final hour to my bathroom closet, which is huge and had old sheets, tons of expired medicines, and on and on, and that closet got organized in that hour.

Anyway, i have gone on and on for too long. Its my birthday today......so I have a right to yap a little!!

:)

Jon

Scattered
08-17-06, 01:15 PM
Happy birthday, Jon! :)

Thanks for your defense of trained psychologists! I quite agree -- a Clinical Psychologist, especially one who specializes in ADHD can be an invaluable asset! Even Licensed Professional Counselors, Clinical Social Workers, and Marriage and Family Therapists have at least four years of college, 2 - 3 years of a masters program and then at least two years of post graduate supervision and 30+ CEU's due every two years. No mental health professional can specialize in every area, so it's valuable whether you see a psychologist, social worker, counselor or Marriage and Family Therapist to be sure they are have additional training and experience in working with ADHD issues.
Oddly enough, the ADD coach gets paid more. They charge $120/hour easily. $400/ mo to $500/mo is probably the average coaching fee, regardless of ADD or not ADD. Many therapists are leaving therapy and becoming coaches, thus avoiding a lot of the headaches of submitting to insurance, getting lower overhead, and getting higher pay. Imagine that! When they do try to make the switch they're likely to be told by the ADD Coaches already in the field that they're not qualified to do ADD Coaching without an ADD Coaching certificate.:rolleyes:

1. So back to the original question -- what would you as an ADDer be willing/able to pay a coach?

2. New question -- would you be interested in group coaching -- it could be offered at much less expense and one would have the support of fellow group members, an educational feature as well as braining storming and sharing of ideas among group members (although perhaps less one on one calling).

Scattered

Tara
08-17-06, 04:41 PM
We aren't just talking about ADD Coaches here when it comes to charging $100 plus per hour. It's the Life Coaching industry that is charging these and higher rates. There are some very successful life coaches out there too. There is a market out there for general life coaches because they do something different than people in other helping professions.

I don't think ADD Coaching is really based on a Life Coaching model but it has come to be based on it when it comes to charges. I really think that those affected by ADD really need to speak out about what they need from ADD Coaching services. ADD Forums is a great start but it's not enough.

The Institute for the Advancement of AD/HD Coaching (http://www.adhdcoachinstitute.org/)is currently developing the criteria for credentialing AD/HD Coaches. Now is the the time for those affected by AD/HD to speak up.

healthwiz
08-18-06, 01:43 AM
What would I be willing to pay an add coach

>Originally Posted by Scattered
>Happy birthday, Jon!

>Thanks for your defense of trained psychologists! I quite agree -- a Clinical >Psychologist, especially one who specializes in ADHD can be an invaluable >asset!

(Are you a clinical psychologist?)

>When they do try to make the switch they're likely to be told by the ADD >Coaches already in the field that they're not qualified to do ADD Coaching >without an ADD Coaching certificate.

(I roll the eyes with you - sheesh - but the modality of coaching is quite different from therapy, especially strict therapy where there is no "advice" given)

>1. So back to the original question -- what would you as an ADDer be >willing/able to pay a coach?

I'm not sure. I obviously am willing to pay something, but $120/hr was over my limit. Technically, coaching requires little overhead, little in CEU's, minimal expense in training, minimal time in training, no office, no secretary, no insurance claims, no waiting for reimbursements, no arguments over the phone with insurance companies to get approval for sessions or to get paid for those that are complete, no fancy coded paperwork that has to be perfect to get paid, no state and national regulated licensing boards to answer to, etc. That is what therapists must do. Furthermore, coaches can gain from their coaching relationships, both socially and financially. There is nothing to prohibit a coach from entering into business arrangements with clients, or from recieving gifts of significant value from clients. Therapists are prohibited from receiving any of the above, and from having social relationships with clients, and can lose their licensing for any infractions. Thus, the therapist can only make money one way, in session, and primarily from insurance reimbursement, and they pay significant overhead.

Therapists get about $80/session from insurance. If a therapist sees 20 hours a week of patients, that is a full load, which is $6400 gross revenue per month, minus the typical overhead expenses a coach does not have: share of office rent ($500), shared secretary support ($1000), monthly budget for professional meeting wardrobe ($250), mo CEU budget ($25), mo answer service $($50), mo student loans payment ($300), approsimately. This leaves $4275/mo after overhead expenses, so a therapist working 80 sessions per month earns pre-tax net of $53/hr, and they are significantly more educated and more regulated than a coach. Thus, by my logic of fair wages, I think a coach who does not have those overhead expenses (because sessions are on the phone, by internet, or in restaurants) they should receive no more than the net income of a therapist, $50/per session, and those that have less education than the 6+ years of college should be paid less per hour. Why should i pay a high school grad who has a coaching certificate an equal wage as is earned by a highly educated therapist, let alone more than one? That is my logic.

Thus, my answer is $50/hr tops, even for coaches with PhDs, because they will not have to call around to insurance companies to get paid, and thus they are actually making more per hour than the therapist, with a lot less headache, and without a billing department!


Now, the coach who thinks this unfair, has to remember, they can do more than 20 sessions per week because they don't have to file any insurance forms, or manage an office staff. Say they could do 50% more sessions, sand earn 50% more income, so they can still make more net money than a therapist, even if they are limited to charging the same amount as a therapist nets ($50/session). If a therapist makes net pre-tax $50K on 20 hours per week of sessions, a coach can make net pre-tax $75K on 30 hours per week of sessions, still working about the same amount of total hours as a therapist because they wont have the same amount of office staff management and billing management to perform. I can't see how a coach can complain about those financial numbers.


>2. New question -- would you be interested in group coaching -- it could be >offered at much less expense and one would have the support of fellow >group members, an educational feature as well as braining storming and >sharing of ideas among group members (although perhaps less one on one >calling).

Would I be willing to pay for group coaching? YES! Its a great idea, and it would be less expensive, and offer the opportunity to develop a tight knit group for interraction, brainstorming, support, and friendship. Very good idea. Take that ball and run with it!

>Scattered

I know i was long winded again, and i have no idea if so many words are worth the read. You have my uttmost respect and gratitude if you read all of it!

Jon

healthwiz
08-18-06, 02:13 AM
Tara

All very good pts and info - thank you.

Jon

We aren't just talking about ADD Coaches here when it comes to charging $100 plus per hour. It's the Life Coaching industry that is charging these and higher rates. There are some very successful life coaches out there too. There is a market out there for general life coaches because they do something different than people in other helping professions.

I don't think ADD Coaching is really based on a Life Coaching model but it has come to be based on it when it comes to charges. I really think that those affected by ADD really need to speak out about what they need from ADD Coaching services. ADD Forums is a great start but it's not enough.

The Institute for the Advancement of AD/HD Coaching (http://www.adhdcoachinstitute.org/)is currently developing the criteria for credentialing AD/HD Coaches. Now is the the time for those affected by AD/HD to speak up.

Scattered
08-24-06, 02:56 AM
Read it all Jon -- worth the read!:)

No I'm not a clinical psychologist.

I agree with you that $50 is about what I could come up with and what seems appropriate at the maximum end of the payment scale.

I think there is a lot to be gained by coaching groups -- financially do-able, shared experiences and support, etc, etc.

Scattered

ClarityWhere
08-24-06, 01:47 PM
You have my uttmost respect and gratitude if you read all of it!

Jon

Well, didn't get it on the first try, but came back and - thank you!


I'm looking around for a coach ... aside from the costs, so far my impression is that a certain chemistry has to be there. I'm a bit afraid that a licensed psychologist would be somewhat likely to be trapped in the healthy expert / unwell patient mindset.

How do you go about finding a match?

Scattered
08-24-06, 06:31 PM
As far as finding a coach goes, Patricia Quinn and Kathleen Nadeau's book When Mom's and Kids Have ADD lists these resources:

www.addconsults.com (http://www.addconsults.com/)
www.americoach.org (http://www.americoach.org/)
www.addcoaching.com (http://www.addcoaching.com/)
www.nancyratey.com (http://www.nancyratey.com/)
www.add.org (http://www.add.org/)
www.addresources.org (http://www.addresources.org)

This address in Tara's signature
http://www.myaddblog.com/

healthwiz
08-28-06, 02:08 AM
If group coaching starts, let me know. I'd be interested in seeing how that works.

As for picking chemistry, I think it is first checking if they have the skills you are looking for, and second, do they seem to have an understanding of you, based on an initial consultation, which could be over the phone or in person. In person might yield a better idea, but I find I can learn a lot by a phone call too. Most intial consults with coaches tend to be over the phone and seem to be at no charge - its an opportunity for them to bring on a new client, as much as an opportunity for you to find a new coach. With therapists, the initial phone consult (if you can get one) might be free, but the initial office appt wont be free, in general. It doesnt hurt to talk to two or three professionals and choose which one meets your needs better. If you have insurance, that is a factor too, in choosing someone on your list.

Hope that helps...

Jon

Tara
08-28-06, 02:37 AM
The are plenty of ADD Coaches who do Group Coaching. Two people I can think of of the Top of my head are Sarah Wright (http://www.swcc.biz/) and Scott Lewis (http://www.addgroupcoaching.com/).

healthwiz
08-28-06, 04:00 AM
Thank you Tara

Jon

wildfire1672169
08-30-06, 12:35 PM
I have recently started looking for an ADD coach and I've spoken to one. She quoted me a price of $280 a month. This included three one hour consultations to determine what my goals are, where my problems were, and to help develop a plan to get there. Then she would help develop the plan. After that, it was a 1/2 hour telephone call once per week to talk about my accomplishments and such. I pay $288 a month for my truck. I would love to have a coach but since I am a full time graduate student that doesn't work outside the home, I think that is a bit excessive. Money is tight and I just don't see where we can afford that. I met with a professional organizer that is going to help me get the house more effciently set up and develop some schedules but she's only charging $300 for eight hours worth of work. Where's the discrepancy? I checked on a couple of coaching training programs to see if education might be the answer and found out that you don't have to have any sort of higher education to get into these programs. You can go in with only a high school diploma. The cost of the school averages around $5000. So it's not as if you are trying to recoup costs for a Master's degree or a Ph.D. I just don't get it. Reasonable to me would mean around a hundred a month. If you figure an eight hour work day; assume ten 1/2 hour telephone calls, with three hours for planning or administrative duties, or even two one hour consultations and six telephone calls with three hours for planning. If you add that up, at $25.00 per half hour, that totals $400 per day, $2000 per week, or $8000 per month! I realize that a client base is hard to build up and that there are advertising costs and overhead and all that, but the coach I talked to worked from her home. With some of the nationwide long-distance calling programs that are out there, telephone costs wouldn't be a problem, or you could even use a cell phone! The other issue I have a problem with, is that while health insurance will pay for physical therapy, walkers, and other aids for some disabilities, coaching for ADD is not covered by insurance, and often therapy for ADD is not covered either. Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now. But I agree that peer coaching is a possible alternative, but you'd almost have to find someone that was not ADD to help you,k or they might get so overwhelmed they forget!

healthwiz
08-30-06, 12:55 PM
I like your reasoning and agree with you completely. I think coaching is becoming the easy get rich quick scheme, and is there any objective evidence that a person recoups their coaching fees in higher income, higher acheivement, higher productivity, etc? Has that data been compared for efficacy to other methods of increasing income or productivity? I think it can be snake oil in the wrong hands, and there is no way to know, unless you try....and trying is expensive. On the other hand, I dont want to make it seeem that people should not hire coaches, as that is not my message. My message is that coaches should base their fees more reasonably, especially considering education. However, the market and demand determines rates. There will eventually be plenty of coaches available for your recommended $100/month rate, as the void for reasonably priced coaches fills in. I do believe if someone has a higher education, they can justify higher rates, but I'm still not sure the rates I have been hearing, such as your $280/mo for 4 calls, ie 2 hours of coaching, ie $140/hr, are worth it.

On your figures, 10 half hour calls a day, 3 hours planning, or some variation on that, is not a bad plan. That is $250/day in revenue, 1250/wk and 62500/yr with 2 weeks vacation. for many people, talking on the phone for 5 hours a day would be difficult. for others, it would be easy, so you ahve to tbe the right personality. And be organized yourself in order to make all those calls. I guess you put it in the ADD person's court to call ON TIME, so you dont have to worry about your own ADD preventing you from being on time, and just always have your cell phone with you , and be ready to listen and talk and assess and recommend, for 30 minutes, at any time of day, between the hours of x and y, whatever hours you set. Its not a bad life. However, marketing, marketing, marketing, and reaching 50 clients who want the monthly plan might be a difficult challenge. But for someone with ADD, coaching might be the perfect occupation. Maybe i will open up such a shop, part time, who knows!!


Jon

wildfire1672169
08-30-06, 01:06 PM
There are probably a lot of things about the process that I don't know, this was just my uninformed opinion of things. So If I've misspoken, please forgive me. I am just a bit frustrated right now becaue I want to get with a coach, and try to finally get my life together (at age 40,it took me long enough!) and now I'm finding that I can't afford it. I would love to see coaching covered by insurance. So many other things are. I mean, insurance will pay for viagra, why not coaching? I agree that in some instances, Viagra is recommended, as ED can be debilitating both physically and psychologically, but having ADD can also be physically and psychologically bebilitating. In the end, I think it comes down to misconceptions about ADD and politics. Too many people think that ADD is a crutch, an excuse, whatever. They don't realize that it is a real condition and that it does affect a lot of people.

I was not diagnosed until I was 36 and have been struggling with this now for years, mostly without therapy or help of any sort. Mainly due to lack of health insurance. I have insurance now and am getting even more frustrated about what is and isn't covered.

Tara
08-30-06, 03:11 PM
Have those of you complaining about the cost of AD/HD Coaching actually contacted the national AD/HD Organizations and let them know how you feel?

wildfire1672169
08-31-06, 10:40 AM
Yes, I did. I was basically told that they had little control over how much a coach charges, that they could qualify their recommendations but couldn't control the costs. I guess my biggest issue is that coaching is not covered by health insurance. Physical therapy, home health nurses for the wheelchair bound, vocational rehabilitation services, wheelchairs, scooters, lift chairs, plastic surgery in some cases, and home health care (either live in or per visit) for the seriously or chronically ill and the physically challenged are all covered so why not coaching? The previous services are intended to help the individual either recover or have a good quality of life and standard of care so, maybe I'm not seeing something, but I think coaching should be also. After all, we are mentally challenged, not in the areas of intelligence (we're not stupid or mentally retarded), but in the areas of executive cognitive functions. Anyone else have any ideas?

Tara
09-27-06, 04:57 PM
I thought this this blog post may interest some of you:
http://www.experiencingaddvantages.com/2006/08/what_to_do_when.html

buffalopc7
11-11-06, 11:47 PM
Wow, I hadn't read this thread until now, in the midst of deciding whether to go get certified as an ADD/ADHD coach. I'm a psychotherapist (masters level) and also an adult with ADHD and I agree that the latter characteristic is likely a benefit for my present and future clients who have ADD/ADHD. At this point, unfortunately, all too often we are not given a choice to go to a professional who has lived the life that we, as people with ADD/ADHD have. For myself, if I were to seek help, I would certainly prefer the therapeutic relationship be with someone who understands ADD/ADHD from my perspective.

healthwiz
11-12-06, 02:16 AM
I think your counseling experience will help, along with your ADD. However, I don't think the ADD is going to help unless you have a model you follow for overcoming ADD. Otherwise, you can only be an empathetic therapist, and well, then you are practising therapy, not ADD coaching. Even then, I have serious reservations how much assistance an understanding ear is, compared with constructive cognitive behavioral, or self-discovery exercises. In the case of ADD, all the emotional, psychological, self-discovery issues are there probably in good portion, and thus it is a good measure to deal with them. However, it is the cognitive behavioral changes that will make a concrete difference in the lives of those with ADD. Eventually, everyone with ADD needs concrete change, or they will become victim to the same frustrations as before, waiting for success in their achievements, that can only wait so long before natural consequences take over, such as depression. Bakc to my first point, you will need a concrete model to follow if you want to help people with ADD. That is my opinion. And I also think people need therapists who plan out how they are going to help the ADD community. So go for it.

Jon

Wow, I hadn't read this thread until now, in the midst of deciding whether to go get certified as an ADD/ADHD coach. I'm a psychotherapist (masters level) and also an adult with ADHD and I agree that the latter characteristic is likely a benefit for my present and future clients who have ADD/ADHD. At this point, unfortunately, all too often we are not given a choice to go to a professional who has lived the life that we, as people with ADD/ADHD have. For myself, if I were to seek help, I would certainly prefer the therapeutic relationship be with someone who understands ADD/ADHD from my perspective.

meadd823
11-12-06, 09:54 AM
I think cost should be determined upon the type of contact. In person contacts being the most expensive while internet should be the least. Also the price should be determined upon the amount of help the person seeks services is going to require along with the amount of experience the coach them selves has.

I too found coaching out of my price range however I have not checked prices out in a while, perhaps they are more reasonable now.

buffalopc7
11-12-06, 11:40 AM
And I do work with concrete models (multimodal usually) and will do so if I become a certified ADHD coach. I understand your concerns that having a coach/therapist who has the same disorder may not be a significant advantage. After all, the individual who would go for help would be going to address their problems, not mine. That was not my intent, however. In following the guidelines of my profession, my interjection of my own diagnoses, etc. are at my descretion, but to continually refer to them and utilize them in treatment is in direct conflict with the purpose of therapy. To do so would constitute a situation of countertransference at the very least. In other words, that would be using the client to work through MY issues and ignore theirs. I should clarify; what I meant was that I felt that the coach/therapist/etc. who has ADD/ADHD would (ideally) have the understanding of the client with ADD/ADHD, in terms of realizing the unique combination of characteristics that make us who we are. Realizing that the client may have a higher potential for procrastination or may not have enough insight to begin the core work would be an advantage to the professional who has themselves, been in a similar situation. That awareness would also provide foresight to the professional and may be an advantage in predicting potential behaviors that the ADD/ADHD client may resort to that may stall their progress. In addition, I believe the enthusiasm, the energy of a professional with ADD/ADHD is a great source of motivation for a client. There is something to be said for having a source of optimism in the face of fear. Great points, thank you for sharing!



I think your counseling experience will help, along with your ADD. However, I don't think the ADD is going to help unless you have a model you follow for overcoming ADD. Otherwise, you can only be an empathetic therapist, and well, then you are practising therapy, not ADD coaching. Even then, I have serious reservations how much assistance an understanding ear is, compared with constructive cognitive behavioral, or self-discovery exercises. In the case of ADD, all the emotional, psychological, self-discovery issues are there probably in good portion, and thus it is a good measure to deal with them. However, it is the cognitive behavioral changes that will make a concrete difference in the lives of those with ADD. Eventually, everyone with ADD needs concrete change, or they will become victim to the same frustrations as before, waiting for success in their achievements, that can only wait so long before natural consequences take over, such as depression. Bakc to my first point, you will need a concrete model to follow if you want to help people with ADD. That is my opinion. And I also think people need therapists who plan out how they are going to help the ADD community. So go for it.

Jon

odd duck
05-13-07, 01:51 PM
My 2 cents worth.

What is peace of mind worth?

What is the sense of accomplishment worth?

What is teaching your kids a skill that actually works for them worth?

I read all of the posts here and I think that some are missing the point of what you are gaining verses what are the costs.

I am speaking in general in the following, I always keep in mind that there are exceptions.

We are all to some extent trying to be able to function successfully in a so called normal world when all of our lives we have been told or made to feel less than. So, when we hire out the organizing, the book keeping, the house cleaning, etc., we get things done but we don't always learn how to do them in a way that works for us.

Most of our lives we have been called lazy, stupid, disrespectful, bad, etc. Whether we are willing to admit it or not most of us have spent our lives trying to prove to somebody we are not all those things they think we are. I believe it comes from growing up in an enviorment that did not take in account our learning style, so we missed out on a lot of lessons that had we understood them would have made our lives so much easier I think.

I myself, do not care how much education someone has to pay for or not or what their overhead is. I care whether or not they have what I need. Can they help me? If they are able to help me learn what I missed so that I feel like I can function well in this so called normal world, to me that would be invaulable.

If I could have avoided half the pain and suffering that having ADD caused while I was growing up or to help my children avoid the same I would find a way to pay them anything they asked (almost of course). I can not put a price on that. So instead of complaining about the amount of money it costs, ask yourself what those services are worth to you or your kids?

My opinion on what would be ideal and afforable for most would be $200.00 to $250.00 for 4 hour long sessions a month, up to 30 e-mails for updates of progress and the atta-boys we all need to keep going, 4 to 5 5 to 10 minute phone calls for some quick problem solving sessions, and a monthly review to see if more coaching is needed. :soapbox: (getting down now)

Well I am sorry for rambling on so long but I just wanted to share my 2-cents worth, I welcome any comments or questions.

Thanks for listening, Keith (the little odd duck)

healthwiz
05-14-07, 02:59 PM
Back to worth of coaching. I see this as market and demand. If the demand is high enough to keep a coach busy at $100/hr, well, then more people should become coaches. However, my suspicion is that it is hard for a coach to keep a full book of clients at $100/hr - I could be wrong!!

Another point, all services have a value, otherwise we would not buy the service. However, I would not pay a carpenter $100/hr even though his work is invaluable in making my life easier. I CAN find a carpenter for $10, $15, $20, or $25 per hour.... depending on skills and how much demand they have in their work schedule.

Finally, coaching may be a temporary fix - a very temporary fix. I highly doubt we are where we are because we need "a pat on the back" and encouragement - that might be a secondary symptom resulting from low achievement, leaving us with challenged self esteem. However, the primary cause remains - ie learning disability. The learning disability does not go away, and a coach may not know what style works with an LD - not all ADD is just ADD - in fact it is all different - and when you consider all the LDs, all the emotional mental health issues, such as depression, bi-polar II, etc., the number of variations becomes infinite. There is no science to determining which variation one has, as the skills are not holistic, they are segregated between psychology, psychiatry, educational testing, personality testing, career compatibility testing, vision testing, etc. Show me a coach who has all of those skills and I'll pay them because I will know it is more than chance that a solid diagnosis comes from it.

However, even with diagnosis, effective treatment is not assured.

So why are we paying $100/hr? I will tell you why....for most people...it is.....for something we all already know we need...we are paying for HOPE! Thus, people with "ADD" are being raked over the coals to try to get HOPE! That is expensive hope....

Of course, religious institutions do the same.... they get 10% of your earnings, for hope.

Hope is a great commodity.

But when the coach leaves, and the money runs out, what is left...... do you still have an LD, or a mental health issue, or a vision issue, or an occupational issue?

And are you going to have to search for HOPE in a new place, at a new cost? How much is a fair price to pay for HOPE?

Do skills and success rates have anything to do with the price of HOPE?

At least with a psychologist, I can rationalize that whether they succeed with me or not, they at least went to school for 9 years and deserve to get paid a professional fee..... and I know they used statistically proven treatments.....and statistically proven diagnostics.....and they carry liability insurance....and they can be brought before review boards....and they can have their license yanked or reprimanded or disciplined....

Does a coach who costs as much as a psychologist come with all that? I have trouble rationalizing the fee if it doesn't work - then I just feel like a "mark"..... and I pay to feel like a mark....

Give me a break!

That is just my opinion!

Jon


A coach representing that a few sessions will enhance coping skills is throwing darts and hoping some stick.

Tara
05-14-07, 03:56 PM
I don't agree with the hope thing. If people don't see results they stop paying!

healthwiz
05-15-07, 05:36 AM
I don't agree with the hope thing. If people don't see results they stop paying!

Hi Tara

Ok, they pay, they don't see results, they quit. Thats an easy parameter to define, and a clean way to measure those coaching clients who see results versus those who do not see results. Without arguing the validity of this argument, lets take it a step further and see where it takes us.

We have two groups of coaching clients, "Those who see results" and "Those who do not see results". If we define those who see results as those who stay and pay, what percentage of clients stay and pay less than 3 months, 6 months, 1 year, 2 years, 5 years? From a pool of 100 new clients, how many stay and pay, and how long do they stay and pay? Have your "stay and pay" success ratios improved from your first year of practice as a coach, versus your 3rd year of practice a a coach? Are your clients staying longer, paying longer? What does this say about hiring a first year coach? What does this say about overall success ratios?

Now to argue the validity of the measurement. Retention ratios are a good indicator, but of what? While I can agree that clients who leave after a month received insufficient results, it is unlikely that those who invest in a coaching contract would give up after just one month. The coach would probably establish that as an unrealistic expectation upfront, and establish a longer time frame for the coaching contract. If not, the coach is a poor saales person, communicator or business person. I think that people who hire a coach have a certain sense of desperation, need and hope involved to give up before a few months. I cannot agree that those who stay longer than a month received results. I think if someone stays longer than 6 months, that is a better gauge that there may be some results, but it is still a poor gauge. The length of stay may not have as much to do with results as with other major factors: depth of pockets, social skills and attractiveness of coach, attractiveness or hippness of coaching philosophy or paradigm, length of time it takes to prove paradigm is not a success for client, willingness of client to have failure with one paradigm and yet still try a new paradigm new direction with the same coach, the suggested and/or mandated length of the coaching contract, ambiguity of success measurements, whether clients know what results they are seeking and whether they can measure those results, availability of alternative options in the market, in what length of time the clients are expecting to see results, whether clients are lonely and need social contact and thus will overlook lack of coaching results. I know a highly successful coach who admits some clients just need companionship and are willing to pay a fee for that conversation. Sometimes retention is more about intangibles such as fear of change, and lack of options to change, such as in the cell phone market where we typically stay with the same carrier a long time because change is a hassle, not because the carrie is so great - they are all so-so in the USA as compared to in Japan. In the case of coaching, retention for at least the first few months may be more a reflection of the clients fear of "failure yet again" than it is a reflection of the effectiveness of coaching.

Thus, is it really valid to say, "Those who don't see results stop paying," and ina few short words imply that the definition of those who see results is "those who see results stay and pay?" Certainly, client retention is an important measurement, but to whom? It is an extremely important measurement to the coach, whose revenue is directly correlated to and is a dependent variable of retention. Retention means higher and more consistent income to the coach, but does not have as direct or as high a correlation to client success. Is the retention measurement an indicator of client success or a measurement of coach success? Is it a fallicy to say they are one and the same?

The correlation between retention and success for clients probably exists based on common sense, but I don't think it is a direct correlation, not as strong as "you pay" or "you dont pay", it is not black and white, and it is probably leaning towards a correlation with statistical significance, rather than a direct correlation. There must be more industry wide independent data for client success ratios with AD/ADHD coaches. Even based on retention, what is the average length of retention of an ADD/ADHD client?

healthwiz
05-15-07, 06:11 AM
Yes, I did. I was basically told that they had little control over how much a coach charges, that they could qualify their recommendations but couldn't control the costs. I guess my biggest issue is that coaching is not covered by health insurance. Physical therapy, home health nurses for the wheelchair bound, vocational rehabilitation services, wheelchairs, scooters, lift chairs, plastic surgery in some cases, and home health care (either live in or per visit) for the seriously or chronically ill and the physically challenged are all covered so why not coaching? The previous services are intended to help the individual either recover or have a good quality of life and standard of care so, maybe I'm not seeing something, but I think coaching should be also. After all, we are mentally challenged, not in the areas of intelligence (we're not stupid or mentally retarded), but in the areas of executive cognitive functions. Anyone else have any ideas?

I think when one goes into coaching, they become part of a fraternity so to speak, they go to one of the major coaching schools, and I am going to guess they learn what the average or expected rates are in coaching. It is probably safe to assume there is an unwritten rule not to charge less than the going rates, or risk being looked down upon by your peers, having less prestige, etc.

Also, since coaching is in the "personal advice" catagory, and society has been trained over the past half century to pay for advice from psyhcologists and psychiatrists, this left an opening for a new field of advice: Coaching. The public has been well trained as to the cost of advice, so coaching naturally piggy backed on the going rates for psychological help, but did a few things: 1) decreased eductional requirements to 6 months, 2) decreased tuition 3) decreased regulation 4) eliminated insurance companies as the middle man 5) removed the stigma and put a positive spin on getting advice 6) reduced overhead - no need for an office - just a phone and an internet and a car 7) reduced professional liability 8) improved sales to packages of groups of appointments and long term contracts 9) required monthly prepayment on packages of appointments 10) eliminated 90% billing issues 11) eliminated collections 12) eliminated waiting on payments from 3rd parties 13) eliminated necessity of secretary 14) eliminated state mandated licensing and CEU hours 15) eliminated severely disfunctional mentally ill clients (which are the hardest clients for most psychogists).

However, Coaching kept the relative payment level, actually increased it by charging $100 per hour which is more than psychologists get reimbursed from insurance. The cost control must have some artificial inflation, so it might be that the industry coaches itself to never lower prices, always increase marketing - the same advice coaches give to businesses, why wouldn't they give it to each other?

Tara
05-15-07, 12:40 PM
I don't see much a difference in measuring the effectiveness of seeing a psychologist or a mental health counselor. I think people are more apt to stay longer there because most are only paying a relatively small co-pay. People expect more from coaching because they are, for the most part paying out of pocket. I think people expect more from coaches too just because of that fact.

We are a very new profession need to prove ourselves more than others in the "helping profession". As for the education level of coaches the majority of coaches who are members on the ICF actually have at least a master's degree. So while there are no actual educational requirements we aren't a group of high school drop outs.

I give my clients a lot more credit then you seem to be giving people with ADD who choose to hire a coach. I think choose is a very important word. Most people seek out an ADD Coach on their own.

There are some people who will never understand the value of coaching and never hire a coach no mater what the cost is. I am a person who will never pay $100 to get my hair cut yet many people pay even more for a hair cut. We are all different and we all have choices.

healthwiz
05-15-07, 01:50 PM
I don't see much a difference in measuring the effectiveness of seeing a psychologist or a mental health counselor. I think people are more apt to stay longer there because most are only paying a relatively small co-pay. People expect more from coaching because they are, for the most part paying out of pocket. I think people expect more from coaches too just because of that fact.

We are a very new profession need to prove ourselves more than others in the "helping profession". As for the education level of coaches the majority of coaches who are members on the ICF actually have at least a master's degree. So while there are no actual educational requirements we aren't a group of high school drop outs.

I give my clients a lot more credit then you seem to be giving people with ADD who choose to hire a coach. I think choose is a very important word. Most people seek out an ADD Coach on their own.

There are some people who will never understand the value of coaching and never hire a coach no mater what the cost is. I am a person who will never pay $100 to get my hair cut yet many people pay even more for a hair cut. We are all different and we all have choices.

Agreed! It is a choice and I am not critical of that choice. I think coaches are great, in that at least it is a choice. I do think it is overpriced, but that is an opinion and everyone has one. I'm glad to hear most coaches have a masters degree, that is good to know. It still remains that for the masses of ADD population, a system of support is necessary which costs a lot less than a coach. One day the void will be filled!

isisdave
08-07-07, 08:14 PM
If you think that your ADD coach is only worth $50 an hour, then that's what you should pay. But I think many posters here have a very incomplete or fanciful view of what it means (1) to be self-employed; and (2) to be an expert at something.

First, let me mention that new engineering graduates this year are getting $58,000 to start. One 4-year BS, zero experience in engineering and very little in life. The usual estimate of overhead (vacation, sick time, retirement, life and disability insurance health care, etc.) is at least 35%, so that's $78k/yr or about $40/hr. The employee has no operational overhead -- rent, utilities, business insurance -- and is generally assured of being paid reliable every month.

Any old plumber that comes to your house or office gets $100/hr . Heck, a hair stylist gets that much many places.

But I'm really jealous of the drywall repair guy who just patched my ceiling in 45 minutes for $300.

These guys command more because they are professionals. They do jobs I can't do because of their training, and experience. I am willing to pay the drywaller because I would end up with a terrible mess and yelling at the dog. I COULD do the plumbing, but it would take four hours and three trips to the Home Depot. My time is worth more.

And they require a higher hourly rate because they have overhead. They have trucks and tools and parts or materials they have to buy and carry around (because YOU aren't going to want to pay for them to bop down to the hardware store). They have to service the truck and pay for insurance.

And finally they have to charge more because they don't work 40 billable hours a week. A lucky plumber might be able to get 8 hours a day, but generally to do so he'll work a 12-hour stint, because the next job is not at your neighbor's house. Sometimes the customer stiffs him. Sometiimes the client forgets the appointment, or doesn't get home by the correct time. Do you think he gets paid for those trips? Does someone pay him anyway when he gets the flu?

And so it is with most professionals. Others have cited the overhead of mental health professionals vs. those of coaches, and I submit that a coach with no training and little experience can do the job cheaper, but I generally find You Get What You Pay For. Most coaches have an education and experience that is appropriate to coaching.

Some other considerations: short sessions means higher overhead. It's much more efficient to have three one-hour sessions than nine 20-minute ones. Every session requires fetching and storing the file, writing notes, etc., and I would imagine most coaches think about upcoming appointments and what research is needed to advance the client at his next call or visit.

Finally, remember that having a coach isn't something you are going to do forever. If three to six months doesn't make you at least effective enough to run your life yourself, then you don't need a coach, you need a personal assistant or organizer on a long term basis. So think of the coach as training or education, an investment in your future. Don't keep paying one if you're not getting what you want, but if you think you're worth $1000 for three months' coaching, then the coach is probably worth it too.

[I'm not a coach. I'm a freelance computer jock with thirty years experience. If you want to hire me for a year, I'll work for $50 an hour or so, but if you want one hour, it's $125 for the reasons laid out above.]

healthwiz
08-12-07, 03:28 AM
Dave

I love your comments about the costs of doing business. I own a business and doing business does cost money, or time, as does being idle - lost earnings. All of the above is true. I pay insurance, vehicle, materials, supplies, repairs, secretary, phone service, internet, designers, advertising, travel, etc, etc, etc. Nevertheless, every occupation has its rates. A MacDonalds burger flipper does not get much more than $10/hour, janitors make x$, etc. If we use psychologists and social workers as the nearest comparitive sampling of rates for helping people self help themselves, and there are many similarities, then we arrive at the conclusion that the psychologist has more education (PhD) and (MSW) or (MS), and has more experience counseling people in a broader variety of areas than a coach. There are exceptions to the amount of education coaches have, ie, they may also have phD and MS, etc, but there are no exceptions to the psychologists' education credentials, and no exceptions to the regulations that they must abide by, or lose their license.

Since you used a plumber in your example, would you prefer a plumber bound by some regulations about how he does your work, or would you prefer one without any binding regulations, no authorities to overlook his morals, ethics, techniques, materials used, etc? At the cost your paying for the plumber, I bet you want one who is regulated, and your probably willing to pay more for that plumber versus the other one, the handyman.

Thus, the same goes for counselors and self help gurus, which is where the coach falls. Bottom line, coaches are not regulated, their backgrounds are varied, nothing consistent, and franklyu - coaches do not try to establish 3 month clients. They try to establish annual clients, and they hope to renew those annual clients. In psychology, this is known as making professional patients. I don't know what it is called in coaching, other than great business.

I'm sorry, but the price of a coach depends on credentials, what they bring to the table, can they make my business earn more money, can they make my life happier, or are they just giving me a buunch of that a boy pats on the back. You know a lot of people are paying for pats on the back, with no real benefits, and a lot of coaches know this to be true, and they don't terminate good paying clients just because the client is only getting a positive attitude momentarily. When someone quits the coach, it is unlikely they are taking with them long term benefits if all they were getting was positive reinforcement.

Anyhow, as you can see, I rail against coaches, because their main market is people with ADD who can't afford them. ADD clients are least likely to have serious change take place long term unless they are willing to keep the coach relationship going long term. If a client poses more resistance than the coach knows how to deal with, the client is not going to get anywhere for the money.

Maybe I have a personal issue with coaches, because I have tried them and had little luck with them. I do believe there is a place for coaching, but I'm not so sure that their place is in the $100/hr place, unless they really have some strong backgrounds. Now there are coaches here who spend a lot of time at conferences, spend a lot of time communicating with ADD specialists, and spend a lot of time reading on the latest ways to assist people with ADD. They really work at what they are doing. I think if they are fully booked at $100/ hr, all the power to them, as any business owner would raise rates to meet demand. However, there should be plenty of coaches available at lower rates because their books are not as full, and they should be $25/hr, $35/hr, $50/hr, etc, depending on experience, education, and the amount of work they put into it. The idea that every coach is worth $100/hr is not something I buy.

Ahhh well, this is an old argument, and internally, I am still not certain how I feel about coaches!!

All arguments and points of view on this are legitimate, there isn't any right answer, it is all opinion and view. We all have our biases.

Take care, and when someone finds an objective way to do this, let me know!

Jon



If you think that your ADD coach is only worth $50 an hour, then that's what you should pay. But I think many posters here have a very incomplete or fanciful view of what it means (1) to be self-employed; and (2) to be an expert at something.

First, let me mention that new engineering graduates this year are getting $58,000 to start. One 4-year BS, zero experience in engineering and very little in life. The usual estimate of overhead (vacation, sick time, retirement, life and disability insurance health care, etc.) is at least 35%, so that's $78k/yr or about $40/hr. The employee has no operational overhead -- rent, utilities, business insurance -- and is generally assured of being paid reliable every month.

Any old plumber that comes to your house or office gets $100/hr . Heck, a hair stylist gets that much many places.

But I'm really jealous of the drywall repair guy who just patched my ceiling in 45 minutes for $300.

These guys command more because they are professionals. They do jobs I can't do because of their training, and experience. I am willing to pay the drywaller because I would end up with a terrible mess and yelling at the dog. I COULD do the plumbing, but it would take four hours and three trips to the Home Depot. My time is worth more.

And they require a higher hourly rate because they have overhead. They have trucks and tools and parts or materials they have to buy and carry around (because YOU aren't going to want to pay for them to bop down to the hardware store). They have to service the truck and pay for insurance.

And finally they have to charge more because they don't work 40 billable hours a week. A lucky plumber might be able to get 8 hours a day, but generally to do so he'll work a 12-hour stint, because the next job is not at your neighbor's house. Sometimes the customer stiffs him. Sometiimes the client forgets the appointment, or doesn't get home by the correct time. Do you think he gets paid for those trips? Does someone pay him anyway when he gets the flu?

And so it is with most professionals. Others have cited the overhead of mental health professionals vs. those of coaches, and I submit that a coach with no training and little experience can do the job cheaper, but I generally find You Get What You Pay For. Most coaches have an education and experience that is appropriate to coaching.

Some other considerations: short sessions means higher overhead. It's much more efficient to have three one-hour sessions than nine 20-minute ones. Every session requires fetching and storing the file, writing notes, etc., and I would imagine most coaches think about upcoming appointments and what research is needed to advance the client at his next call or visit.

Finally, remember that having a coach isn't something you are going to do forever. If three to six months doesn't make you at least effective enough to run your life yourself, then you don't need a coach, you need a personal assistant or organizer on a long term basis. So think of the coach as training or education, an investment in your future. Don't keep paying one if you're not getting what you want, but if you think you're worth $1000 for three months' coaching, then the coach is probably worth it too.

[I'm not a coach. I'm a freelance computer jock with thirty years experience. If you want to hire me for a year, I'll work for $50 an hour or so, but if you want one hour, it's $125 for the reasons laid out above.]

erratica_1
05-22-08, 06:53 PM
Those are quite practical ideas. Thanks :)

txlegalpro
11-17-08, 01:46 AM
We aren't just talking about ADD Coaches here when it comes to charging $100 plus per hour. It's the Life Coaching industry that is charging these and higher rates. There are some very successful life coaches out there too. There is a market out there for general life coaches because they do something different than people in other helping professions.

I don't think ADD Coaching is really based on a Life Coaching model but it has come to be based on it when it comes to charges. I really think that those affected by ADD really need to speak out about what they need from ADD Coaching services. ADD Forums is a great start but it's not enough.

The Institute for the Advancement of AD/HD Coaching (http://www.adhdcoachinstitute.org/)is currently developing the criteria for credentialing AD/HD Coaches. Now is the the time for those affected by AD/HD to speak up.

I must say when I followed your link to the Institute, and looked at the lilnks to their certification process, I was shocked to see that it appears the Institute grandfathered in certification of all working AD/HD Coaches who were willing to pay the membership fee of $100/year up and until February, 2008. Yet they still have not come up with a certificaion process for new coaches. So, essentially, they gave certification to anyone who had done any ADD coaching at all, with no other testing or educational requirements, and they are not even offering any type of program for new coaches to be certified? Let me know if I am wrong, but this appears very fishy indeed.

I found this thread because I was truly considering becoming a coach so I could help others not suffer for 50 years as I have before finally getting the help they need, but after doing some limited research on it, I am becoming more and more concerned about the ethics of this field. I know there are good ADD coaches out there, but if this is their way of self-certification and survival - to block any newcomers to the field - the system is in dire need of an overhaul and has huge ethical problems.

txlegalpro
11-17-08, 02:04 AM
Also, I must say this is one of those times when I feel blessed to have suffered through alcoholism and addiction, and reinforces my acceptance and forgiveness of those in the psychiatric and medical field who misdiagnosed, placated, and drugged me up with crap that worsened my condition for years. When I was finally diagnosed, I was fortunate enough to be sober and to have an amazing AA sponsor who had experienced much the same things I had, and not only coached me in life skills but continues to do so, and actually physically helped me organize my home and life in the beginning when I was first put on medication. The only thing she asked is that I do the same for others whom I now sponsor. Who knew we had it so good?

Tara
11-18-08, 12:27 AM
They didn't just certify anybody who had been an ADD Coach. There were several requirements and the number of hours and clients were only part of the requirements. There was a process!

I do agree that the coaching both ADHD Coaching and Life Coaching are missing a beginning level of certification. I think that people should be assessed before "practicing" ADHD Coaching. Both ICF credentialing and ADHD Coaching credentialing require people to have coaching hours 1st. This has never made any sense to me what so ever!

They are not blocking new comers but are still in the process of developing the certification process. Most professions needed to grandfather in people who had been working in the field for some time before developing a standard credentialing process.


I must say when I followed your link to the Institute, and looked at the lilnks to their certification process, I was shocked to see that it appears the Institute grandfathered in certification of all working AD/HD Coaches who were willing to pay the membership fee of $100/year up and until February, 2008. Yet they still have not come up with a certificaion process for new coaches. So, essentially, they gave certification to anyone who had done any ADD coaching at all, with no other testing or educational requirements, and they are not even offering any type of program for new coaches to be certified? Let me know if I am wrong, but this appears very fishy indeed.

I found this thread because I was truly considering becoming a coach so I could help others not suffer for 50 years as I have before finally getting the help they need, but after doing some limited research on it, I am becoming more and more concerned about the ethics of this field. I know there are good ADD coaches out there, but if this is their way of self-certification and survival - to block any newcomers to the field - the system is in dire need of an overhaul and has huge ethical problems.

Galadriel724
02-13-09, 05:58 PM
I just started coaching 2 weeks ago.... I had to deal with the high price because I was having so much trouble balancing my regular daily tasks vs relaxing- time not running around in a frenzied manner trying to do what non ADDers do naturally. I was busting my butt from the time I woke up to the time I went to sleep and I never finished my lists. I felt too guilty to relax.
I have very bad disorganization issues and my apt was getting out of control. No matter how hard I worked, it just wasn't helping. As a child I was abused by a parent who expected perfection, and I'm not used to "good enough". I panic when I see a mess, so I ignore them. I finally ended up so exhausted that I missed 2 days of work just sleeping. Time for assistance, I think.
My coach is certified and a member of most pertinent associations. She trained under Nancy Ratey (who is well known in coaching circles- and costs $1200 a month!). My coach is also a personal organizer for ppl w/o ADD. But, the best? She HAS ADD. She GETS IT! Unfortunately she also charges $600 a month with a minimum 3 month committment.
She works for it though. We talked for 1hr 15 min before deciding to work together. She came over to my apt to meet me and see what she was dealing with (3 hrs), looked at all my existing systems and went over what hadn't helped, and what specifically did work. We came up with a game plan for the week, and will talk for 45 min, 3 times per week. She is coming over in 2 weeks to physically help me clean, shop for inexpensive organizing stuff (cabinets from Target, etc.), and then put the stuff to use in a way that I can keep up. I can e-mail her any time if I get stuck.
This was something I had to do, and the cheaper coaches only did phone work, plus could not accommodate my schedule. I'm not going to be coached forever, the point is to teach me to do the stuff on my own. I just wish I had one in middle school!

spaghettibrains
02-14-09, 05:50 PM
I had hired a coach only 10 days prior to getting myself fired. It would have come to about $280 a month. I was originally expecting to pay $400-$500 a month. If I would have found someone only a month prior I could have avoided the nightmare that resulted after my termination.

So "how much" is relevant to each individual's situation. Everyone is unique and has their own unique needs. If paying someone $400-$500 would have helped me maintain some semblance of organization it definitely would have been "worth" it.

As for the suggestion of "$100" coaches would you do it for that amount?

Think of how demanding it could actually be for the person doing the coaching. They have to remember the minutiae of another adults life and then put that into some type of organizational perspective. Then they have to follow up. And then follow up.

If hiring someone helps get your life "on track" rather than getting derailed then thats not something you want to be cheap about.

qhcowgirl
02-14-09, 08:51 PM
I talked to a coach. She charges $300/mo for 4 sessions, 1 hr each if I remember right. That's for phone conversations -- you never actually meet in person. I understand why coaches need to charge enough to make a living, it's just completely unaffordable for people like me... *shrugs*

Music lessons or horseback riding lessons, unless you're taking from world champions or the best of the best in the area, tend to be $30-$45/hr. I guess I expect coaching rates to be similar.

Tara
02-14-09, 10:28 PM
Some ADHD Coaches offer group coaching which is a lot more affordable. There are ADD Group Coaching programs out there with fees of $25 -$100 per month.

Number 1
12-27-09, 10:42 PM
I have been coaching for over 18 years and my rate is at 80.00 an hour and when I started it was 30.00 an hour. When you have a good coach they are worth every penny in the long run. The hours that I can put in behind the scene working on individual plans are not billed. Sometimes when it is merited I never even send a bill.
Every individual or family I work with is unique and requires a system that will work with them and is flexible to allow for changes that occur. According to my clients over the years the services and support I have given are priceless.
I don't accept to work with anyone who contacts me since I don't want take your money if I can't really help you. It takes a lot of energy and patience to be a good coach and it not always easy working with people with ADD. I know, I have ADD and at times in the past I wasn't the easiest person to work with.

Some of the most important factors that I have found is that I have to connect with my client and have a fantastic sense of humor. You also have to have patience since change does not come easy. You are also dealing with at times clients with anxiety, depression, addictions, low self esteem and the list goes on. You have to know when your client needs more professional help so you can help them help themselves.

You have to be willing to do what it takes to get what you want. It is a lot of hard work but worth every moment in the end.

musicman64
01-07-10, 08:13 PM
My experience was 375 a month. 3 sessions or so a month. An hour for sure sometimes a bit longer. My coach was very experienced and was able to direct me in ways that I had not previously thought of. I was so inspired that I am now becoming a coach. However, I was unable to continue with him due to cost. As I am opening my own door I struggle with the pricing issue all of the time. One has to consider his value for the exchange of time and information.

Yaaziel
03-15-10, 01:05 AM
That's mighty steep, for something not covered by insurance. Not saying it's not worth it, but it's outside my ability to pay.

mindmadness
02-04-11, 06:50 PM
I'm a financial organization coach and I charge $600 for eight 60 minute sessions (including one free session, so actually 9 sessions). The idea behind what I do is to work with anyone on setting up a spending plan and money management system using technology. Because my specialty is a little different, I hadn't formally included shorter sessions. I think it depends on the person I'm coaching. One person I'm coaching with ADHD maxes out at 30 minutes. So we do twice a week instead. I can handle an hour because I love this stuff...

Also, the idea of coaching (and this may be different for ADHD coaching) is that you set goals to actions and anticipate roadblocks to work around them in small chunks. Each session you review what you wanted to achieve, discuss what worked and what didn't and then set the goals for what will be done during the time between sessions. Coaching is not counseling...a behavioral change needs to occur, in other words actions...not talking only. Limiting beliefs are discovered and removed.

I've been considering ADHD coaching. My whole money plan is made for me...and I believe I have ADHD but was never diagnosed formally.

Ravenstar
02-24-12, 10:21 PM
I think one of the main issues is that many people with ADD are under-employed due to the executive function disorder. This causes severe financial constraints...on top of the financial messes some of us have gotten ourselves into... looking into something that seems like it may really help, then not being able to afford it is ..well... depressing.

Some of us struggle just to afford the medication..some can't even afford to see a doctor (so sad) but as stated in many of the threads here meds will only get one so far.

I don't care what the research says, every ADDer I have ever met was highly intelligent, resourceful and creative. I believe that with the right combination of treatment (meds, therapy, coaching) most would be doing MUCH better financially. We have a lot to contribute.. if we can find/learn ways to do it.

Maybe the coaching community could take a look at some sort of sliding scale adapted to the progress someone with ADD makes. Like at first there would be sort of basic coaching focusing on basic organizational skills then move to financial responsibility/organization, troubleshooting credit issues, etc.. then move on to occupational or education issues.. as the ADDer progresses and is more stable then fees increase with focus on more detailed and self-actualizing goals.

Just some ideas

I've been self-employed and am a professional... and usually I don't change my base fees for no reason other than the "can you give me a deal' thing - BUT if I see someone whom I really want to work with and they have a constrained budget I try to accommodate them... I find adjusting the services to fit their budget and help them to accept that there are limits.. and still give them top notch quality service works out well. (I get great word of mouth referrals that way also)

Ravenstar
02-24-12, 10:28 PM
Oh!

I forgot:giggle:

I also do pro-bono work for charitable causes.. for every 8-10 regular clients I do one job for someone who needs it, for free.

Maybe the idea of scholarships for people who are very low income would be helpful.. group coaches could implement that pretty easily.

Lalalalinds
03-27-13, 11:25 PM
I just started coaching 2 weeks ago.... I had to deal with the high price because I was having so much trouble balancing my regular daily tasks vs relaxing- time not running around in a frenzied manner trying to do what non ADDers do naturally. I was busting my butt from the time I woke up to the time I went to sleep and I never finished my lists. I felt too guilty to relax.
I have very bad disorganization issues and my apt was getting out of control. No matter how hard I worked, it just wasn't helping. As a child I was abused by a parent who expected perfection, and I'm not used to "good enough". I panic when I see a mess, so I ignore them. I finally ended up so exhausted that I missed 2 days of work just sleeping. Time for assistance, I think.


I was seriously spooked by how similar your situation seems to compare to mine. My doctor recently suggested that I meet with a coach. Unfortunately, my poor organization has also led to having financial problems as well lately. As much as getting a coach seems like an important choice for me right now, I'm extremely overwhelmed by my daily routine, I wish I could afford it. I wish you the best though, it sounds like you're on te right track!