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Drogheda98 02-25-19 02:29 PM

figuring out self abandonment and my true self
a while ago on the boards I said "*this* is me"

I was wrong, *this* is the vicious cycle. it's very difficult to explain, however, say, if I said something like "this is, this is my, this is...whatever"

"this" is the entrenchment and the defense mechanism, kind of a portal through which the qualities of my mother spews forth.

cause in object relations theory, "this" is the first "object", my mother. eerytime I use "this" instead of "I" I hurt my own ego, or myself and become more like her. and that stops today.

so... I want to relate a scenerio that just happened in my life cause, no idea why, it was a transformation experience (or a good first step).

I have blue cross blue shield as my insurance provider and I'm going to the docs tomorrow, however the *card* was old(just replaying it in my mind now and noticing these things myself) . I said to my mom "this is an old blue/cross/shield card, you(mom) can have this back"

I then called bluecross/blue shield to order in my card, instead of saying on the phone "ya this is drogheda(well my name) I said " ya I'm (my name)"

and it's weird, I feel more present just from the exchange that I described above. now it's time to start telling her (I would say talk with however, bounderies, in the past all I wanted was a conversation with her, and I don't think that's going to happen, try as I might, I've never been able to talk with her about anything) that the way she commands me, like a dog, is just no good. with my relativly immature super ego, it's time I started taking charge of my life, doing what my therapist told me (to go through them) and really figure out these emotions that I have been denied so long.

I'll ask my dad and mom sometimes "how are you feeling", thats the pain and that's really me asking myself, I never get reciprocated by them. how am I feeling (well the super ego statment in my head, the cart before the rider so to speak). I've tried to repair the relationship with them over and over, it just doesn't work and I don't want to be a slave to them anylonger.

I guess what I'm saying is, it's I start taking charge of my life and to honestly self reflect for myself(it's odd saying talking to my own superego in my head, figuring out what "you's I don't agree with and then forgiving myself"

Little Missy 02-25-19 04:37 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
The bottom line is, you can be whomever you want to be if you have a good job and don't live with your parents first.

tudorose 02-25-19 06:48 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
Even when you move out the effects of narcissistic abuse carry on. There is a tremendous amount of work to be done. As you have mentioned you are smart so this reasoning process to see things for what they are will be easier as it was for my husband. For those more driven by emotion it's hard. You have to move away and get some distance physically. Get out into nature it helps. Don't rush trying to regain a sense of self it will happen once you are free

Drogheda98 02-25-19 10:16 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
thank you tudorose, however I'm trying not to even say that(smart) anymore to get more grounded. the more I research enmeshment the more I just want to heal. empathy is more of the key, or my own empathy towards the people that hurt me and forging myself and them.

I know some behaviors that I honestly enjoy doing, I think I'll track on my phone when I start to feel an emotion, what does it for me., tracking body emotions is, kind of new.

and just doing the process, either outloud or in my head over and over.

I remember(trying to *unpack* and process some memories*), I remember a time in my past when I was sitting on the kitchen floor, and my mom was just yelling at me for no reason. I would be sitting their, on the kitchen floor, not wanting to upset her, cause man, she was like, a powderkeg. at the same time, soaking it all in. the shouting at me matches were never over anything. sometimes those fights were litterly because she thought I named something wrong. "what a supid name, now your gonna get yelled at for an hour"

I could never get a word in. she just, yelled so much and then would always tell me what to do.. I remember asking my sister "what kind of mother does that to their children"

I love her but I am not her

heh, I feel a bit better getting that out. I guess whenever I have any of those memories just coming to the surface I need to wright these thoughts down to *unpack* some mental weight. and then, what I can learn from the memory going forward.

tudorose 02-27-19 05:00 AM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
Journaling helps. Screaming and crying helps too.

Drogheda98 02-28-19 02:25 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
heh, ya, yesterday was a blast.:umm1: I journaled some body emotions and and its wierd, by asking myself why a part of my body was tense I could remember certain memories, then wrote those memories down. good thing I get clono refill today cause heh, unpacking some of these memories is.... ya.

I feel way better right though, even with very little sleep

Drogheda98 02-28-19 11:14 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
alright, I was spot on.

the video here,, Richard nails it, all the way to when I did the slightly nutso thing to reach down into the past in wrighting to pull up the 2 year old (the acceptance thread I think).

I even remember feeling the split in session, that wasn't a good time at all.

so turdoise, can I ask you, should I wright down the *recordings(this stuff)* knowing what they are now to get the recordings out of my head?

tudorose 03-01-19 05:52 AM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self

Originally Posted by Drogheda98 (Post 2015429)

so turdoise, can I ask you, should I wright down the *recordings(this stuff)* knowing what they are now to get the recordings out of my head?

Yeah pretty much. I tried to watch the video but I only made it through 5 mins. It's such slow process I've been at it for so long. My husband has narcissistic parents too and he started his journey after me and already has been able to make sense of it and move on with life. I think intelligence has a lot to do with speed of recovery. And I'm not saying that coz of stuff you said earlier I'm saying that coz we openly discuss how he's been able to see it for what it is but I'm still drowning. He took the pragmatic approach of it is what it is and that he changed how he saw them (with no value) and somehow managed to rise above it. Me on the other hand being the opposite to him and ridiculously emotional takes 2 steps forward and 1 step back and sometimes 3 steps back.

I tend to rage at the world and feel so low and just hate people. I don't have much more to add coz I'm in a really bad place this week

Drogheda98 03-01-19 11:22 AM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self

I'm starting to think that the defense mechanism is more on the neurotic side. my sister I know has bpd, I believe my brother has more narcissistic while my defense is more neurotic. and that fits the golden child, ghost child and scapegoat narrative (first child my bro, second myself and sis, and third my sister), and I just did a quick search on google and I think I'm right

I tend to blame myself way more (don't beat yourself up is a catchphrasesI have to remind myself of) cause I don't want to hurt others at all even if a judgment is merreted, so the judgment is often internalized (so I have to catch myself doing that so someone elses worry doesn't become my own) and then, heh, parent myself (you are ok self, it's not you it's them, I think I have moved through them enough that them = other people and things(university), like in my mind I say "go through them, I'll get a job through the university)

I just looked up a bunch of neurotic people talking(well, for the past while) and I get it and see myself doing similar.

like, you know this guy and he is pretty cool and all but when he does stuff he is prey fragile sometimes, I mean, he is like more ingrained in whats going but you know, this dude is like way more open to experience and wants to go ahead with his life but stumbles a bit at times, I don't know why(ya I do). when I say this and then "you" it's more of a mirror to myself but, not all the time), and I don't know if the mirror is more directed at me (if I absorbed part of the "object which would be more of the waining of the oedepus complex" and I just looked up "The Oedipus complex is considered to be the nucleus of neurosis" and.. ehh that's horribly embarrassing to admit, but thats what the forums for, healing) or her , mother". the problem is ADHD and object loss, if I don't have an object per say, or anyone with adhd, we are screwed. I tried going a months or without saying *this* and I started to almost become a bit pshychotic(pshychosis) which is the one foot in chaos one foot in order of the neurotic/creative person or self. so currently I tend to use "this" in reference to real objects in the outside world objects(guitar, camera, phone etc...) and try to be particular objective and with the workings of the objects.... and I'm wondering now ( brother.... guitar (I picked up the guitar from my brother) camera ( I picked up the camera, somewhat of a phobia actually from childhood) from my mother) and sister..... lol I even have 5 lenses and their are 5 people in my family so, that would be the family cluster I'm thinking like I'm thinking cause I didn't talk to them much growing up or they just didn't really see me(my dad did, with his faults he is the one that actually shows me unconditional love which fits the model in the video, even though I disagree (tears)with my bio father on most everything he provides and is always their even though I don't think he understands a lot of the personal stuff, he is still there for me. even though he nitpicks on small **** and sometimes drives me up the wall, he is there. this is why being smart isn't important in terms of relationships and letting go of defenses like my therapist said is essential, cause if I were to judge my bio father on his smartness, I would of missed that.

anyway, in therapy I think myself and the therapist are on the transference (or I'm doing that right now, in anycase) cause right now I really am starting to see the defense mechanism for what it is, and I feel better just righting all of this., unpacking all the inner stuff in a somewhat linear fashion to conceptualize and later on compartmentalize (been a while sense I have done this)to the memories so they aren't just fragmented in my head, feel the emotion (like I'm doing right now, and it's really positive) and then, ehh, name the memory. it sounds odd but it works really well

man that's a tactic that my therapist and I did a long time ago and I haven't done sense. I think thats the reason why you(tur) said to journal

Drogheda98 03-01-19 09:36 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
I think I'm understanding more.

so, I'm just going to imagine that their is another person in the thread who isn't me. just a hypothetical.

other person: hey, how are you doing (talking directly to me, taking them at face value)

I'm doing ok, how are you. a reciprocal behavior. by asking the other person "how are you" I would not be talking to myself but the other person, I would not be talking to myself(heh, uhh, ya just a hypothetical) because I said "I'm doing ok"

the other person might say "I'm doing good" however, then the other person might say "you are a puts"

then I would internally ask myself "am I puts?" what have I shown to be *putsy*

so I would say "excuse me, what are you talking about"?

the other person might say " you heard me, you puts, puts puts puts!!!"

that would be a form of projection on the other parties terms. the other person would be trying to project the putsyness:) of the other person onto me.

in the example I would say "I'm sorry but I disagree with what you are saying, look at your own behavior to see who is really being the puts"

the conversation would continue for a few minutes

the other person would say "man I can't believe what you are doing, why are you being such a puts" projection

I would say " listen, you need to leave, you are disturbing myself and these other people, we are having a nice time, you need to go". in the example I would not be self reflecting because I know who I am(well more) and that I wasn't behaving as a puts in the example.

Drogheda98 03-01-19 10:12 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
heh, now I'm going to leave and do some behaviors :)

Little Missy 03-01-19 10:22 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
do you mean putz?

tudorose 03-01-19 10:41 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
What is a putz?

I'm Australian so that's not an identifiable word in our version of English.

Secondly if putz is a put down. Why?

I'm confused.

If you want to see your situation as an outsider with pragmatism then there are places where you can do that without having to talk to yourself. If you're interested Pm me and I can send you a link

namazu 03-01-19 10:47 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
Point of information:
Putz is a word that was adopted into English from Yiddish.
Literally, it's a part of the male anatomy.
Coloquially, it's an idiot/jerk/fool/tool.

Drogheda, it sounds like (in part) you're working out how to establish a stable sense of identity that doesn't depend solely on other people's views of you / what they project onto you. Is that accurate, or am I way off?

Drogheda98 03-01-19 11:08 PM

Re: figuring out self abandonment and my true self
ya Namuza I also just like writing and if I want to wright that book I've always wanted to wright heh, gota understand how to wright in a projective(uhh, ya) way that isn't.

but ya, critically thinking (I love thought experiments so the writing above is just that), knowing myself so I know what are my core components so I don't project onto others parts of myself (which the therapist of mine said I did a LOT). and how projection(both of myself and of others) litterly has drained me of vitality and I'm starting to understand how to get that vitality back. (by understanding myself and doing the behaviors that do it for me so to speak).

I mean it's weird (in my case) how I have litterly projected parts of my psyche out of my psyche, so the example above was just me figuring out projection so that doesn't happen anymore. and know when to judge (above, if I'm not a putz then the other person is for example, and the critical thinking part is just asking myself (am I a putz what have I done thats puzzy, if I'm not puzzy then the other person is and I don't want to absorb the others projection)

so your on the mark namuza. and now knowing more about myself I'm less self helpless cause if I want a good relationship with myself (to be confident in myself) then I know I have to engage in those behaviors that do do it for me (and I think that's just not from my pov, I think that's the human condition for pretty much everyone).

so I'm thinking now, if I want to wright I have to have a psyche that is up to the task, and if I want to talk to others without projecting and without absorbing.... ya, I'm starting to figure out boundaries.

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