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Old 10-09-17, 11:21 PM
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Re: Amphetamine and Pain: pain reception dysfunction and psychopathology

Originally Posted by wonderboy View Post
An area of personal scientific interest and inquiry for me is the correlation of possible dysregulation of pain receptors… How we perceive pain, both emotionally and physically, and its correlation, or possible correlation, to psychological disorders, such as major depressive disorder, anxiety disorders, schizophrenia, and ADHD.

It seems to me that most scientific inquiry still studies the antiquated
"Tried and True" serotonin system, along with norepinephrine, and some basic inquiry into dopamine
We need to get completely away from all the neurotransmitter based models- because the brain just doen't work like that.

I was at a very promising conference on the weekend in the area of functional neurology and the specific area of pain came up.

One area that really surprised me is that nociception (pain perception) is suppressed by proprioception and vibration sensation.

Essentially 2 parts of the anterior cingulate gyrus modulate each other.
I believe (and this is if my notes are correct - the slide show pdf is still coming)that the 2 relevant target areas are area 32 in the pregenual ant cingulate gyrus- and area 25 in the ant cingulate gyrus).

I think it works that extra vestibular sensation can be used to reset the balance between the two areas. This is work that needs to be done by somebody experienced in the area, as the setup is quite complex, and easy to stuff up.

Here is a paper that supports it:
Attenuation of Experimental Pain by Vibro-Tactile Stimulation in Patients with Chronic Local or Widespread Musculoskeletal Pain. Available from: [accessed Oct 10 2017].

Unlabelled: Patients with chronic pain syndromes, like fibromyalgia (FM) complain of widespread pain and tenderness, as well as non-refreshing sleep, cognitive dysfunction, and negative mood. Several lines of evidence implicate abnormalities of central pain processing as contributors for chronic pain, including dysfunctional descending pain inhibition. One form of endogenous pain inhibition, diffuse noxious inhibitory controls (DNIC), has been found to be abnormal in some chronic pain patients and evidence exists for deficient spatial summation of pain, specifically in FM. Similar findings have been reported in patients with localized musculoskeletal pain (LMP) disorders, like neck and back pain. Whereas DNIC reduces pain through activation of nociceptive afferents, vibro-tactile pain inhibition involves innocuous A-beta fiber. To assess whether patients with localized or widespread chronic pain disorders have dysfunctional A-beta related pain inhibition we enrolled 28 normal pain-free controls (NC), 29 FM patients, and 19 subjects with neck or back pain. All received 10s sensitivity-adjusted noxious heat stimuli to the forearms as test stimuli. To assess endogenous analgesic mechanisms of study subjects, vibro-tactile conditioning stimuli were simultaneously applied with test stimuli either homotopically or heterotopically. Additionally, the effect of distraction on experimental pain was assessed. Homotopic vibro-tactile stimulation resulted in 40% heat pain reductions in all subject groups. Distraction did not seem to affect experimental pain ratings. Conclusions: Vibro-tactile stimulation effectively recruited analgesic mechanisms not only in NC but also in patients with chronic musculoskeletal pain, including FM. Distraction did not seem to contribute to this analgesic effect.

Now I have seen this demonstrated, and had it demonstrated on me, and it works dramatically well.

But you see we are moving well away from clumsy neurotransmitter based models to something much more sophisticated.

Whenever you see a crowd all rushing in the same direction on any one issue, run in the opposite direction.

There is neither fun nor profit to be had in polishing the brass knobs on a bandwagon.
Nicholas Nasseem Taleb.

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