ADD or PTSD?

[starrykitten]

I think this might be covered in one of the private forums, but hopefully it's ok to post here.

I'm sure I've been experiencing some PTSD symptoms lately from recent trauma, but sometimes i have trouble distinguishing them from my ADD symptoms. There are some things that seem clearly PTSD, like not wanting to go to sleep. (I don't consciously feel afraid, but I don't want to sleep.) As for the other symptoms, I have no idea what condition they belong to.

Does anybody have any insight?

[T-Rex65]

Irregular sleep patterns are pretty common among ADHD folks.

Also, some symptoms may belong to both conditions. It may not be an "either/or" kind of thing, but sometimes an "and".

[starrykitten]

Originally Posted by T-Rex65

Irregular sleep patterns are pretty common among ADHD folks.

Also, some symptoms may belong to both conditions. It may not be an "either/or" kind of thing, but sometimes an "and".

True. I do have chronic insomnia, so it's not that unusual for me not to sleep. But I had been sleeping fine with the help of Seroquel, and now I don't even want to sleep.

I think you're right that they can exacerbate each other.

[Fuzzy12]

Most conditions have an overlap. Many PTSD symptoms can look like ADHD and vice versa. In addition, of course, there is the possibility that you have both. You'd have to look at all symptoms and what lies behind them not just the sleeping issue

One of the things that would distinguish ADHD and PTSD is the onset of your symptoms. ADHD symptoms are supposed to be present from early childhood onwards, whereas PTSD symptoms would occur after the traumatic event.

I wonder the same by the way. Most of my problems started after a difficult time in my life. I've had ADHD like symptoms before that as well but were the severe enough to warrant an ADHD diagnosis? Did possible ADHD make my reaction or resilience to traumatic events worse? I don't know. Have you seen a professional? From my experience, they tend to treat ADHD as a last resort after ruling out any other disorder that might cause your symptoms.

[Plognark]

I have both, and there is a lot of overlap.

I don't know that teasing out the distinction whether a symptom is caused by one condition or the other is really helpful. I think the brain chemistry from ADHD can interact with the changes trauma causes in all sorts of different ways.

It'll probably take some trial and error; find out what your triggers are, figure out if there have been any major changes after the trauma that may have made your brain shift. Diet, medication changes, etc.

[Eisi]

In Germany many psychiatrists in the field of adults don`t believe that ADHD exits in adults (they think of it as a childhood disease).

So you have to got a lot of luck to be diagnosed in the first place as an adult with ADHD.

But even if you`re suffering from PTBS-Symptoms (and you got Adhd) it´s most likely that your PTBS isn`t diagnosed either.

Because german professionals mostly believe to diagnose PTBS you got to have one major event (refered to as trauma) which you couldn`t cope with and therefore developed PTBS.

But with ADHD we found out it`s much more common that the symptoms of the PTBS you`re suffering from are dued to a series of minor traumatas that accumulated over the decades not being diagnosed and treated with ADHD and not dued to one single event.

In Germany we start to think of ADHD combined with symptoms of PTBS as "dissociation". One of our major physicans in the field of adult ADHD does believe, that "dissociation" is commonly connected with late diagnosed ADHD. So that the question of this thread wheter it`s ADHD or PTBS seldom arises, because the syndroms are connected very often.

"Dissociation" could effect the impact of stimulants, too. Whereas stimulants treat the symptoms of ADHD they could worsen the symptoms of "dissociation" (much more thinking with stimulants and not calming down with thinking/more spacing out than less.).

But that´s basically still the opinion of one single psychiatrist not the common ground of science in Germany (basically there is no common ground when it comes to adult Adhd).

[Electra2]

I have both but even though the PTSD has changed through the years I still don`t sleep at night.
I sometimes use Melatonin.I dont like sleeping pills and try to avoid if possible.
But it can be hard to relax..I used to sleep better when I had a boyfriend :P

[lostdog65]

I, too, have both. It took a trip through the DSM-IV and a counselor/therapist to help distinguish between the two. Many times I have had to stop and query, "ADD? PTSD?" to figure out my response. Sometimes the action is the same. Sometimes different.

First, find a good therapist who can help diagnose the PTSD. If it is PTSD, find a therapist who can do EMDR, Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing. It did wonders for me. It is documented well and has proven effective even for those in the military who saw a hell of a lot more trauma than I did.


Eric

[yellowflowers]

Hi

This is a big worry for me are the moment. I'm scared to post on here about it all, but maybe ppl can relate mere than I think. I've started ritalin and so scared about it. I know I should be grateful, I keep not taking it. I'm worried that, well I guess I just fear this, struggling to accept an addh diagnosis fits for me. That I need to take a med to make my brain function? forever? And I know its contradictory - because I've been on antidepressants for more than at decade - and when will they stop.

Okay see I'm noticing I'm off topic I can tell the ritalin is working for me, and maybe it doesnt matter why? But I worry that its PTSD I have - and I can't draw a distinction on the 'when did it start thing' because I've always been like this. But then its always been pretty tough at home. In fact, I suspect, well I don't know, that it may have been even tougher back when I was very small, just from figuring out some family situations, that even as a baby I was probably in a pretty difficult envirornment. So I can't really say its not ptsd. Maybe it doesn't matter. But then I run off down that avenue again of if its ptsd maybe I can fix it - like 'recover' and not need meds for ever.

I realise its a pretty huge debate, the nature versus nuture, the chicken and the egg etc.


X :

[Electra2]

Originally Posted by yellowflowers

Hi

This is a big worry for me are the moment. I'm scared to post on here about it all, but maybe ppl can relate mere than I think. I've started ritalin and so scared about it. I know I should be grateful, I keep not taking it. I'm worried that, well I guess I just fear this, struggling to accept an addh diagnosis fits for me. That I need to take a med to make my brain function? forever? And I know its contradictory - because I've been on antidepressants for more than at decade - and when will they stop.

Okay see I'm noticing I'm off topic I can tell the ritalin is working for me, and maybe it doesnt matter why? But I worry that its PTSD I have - and I can't draw a distinction on the 'when did it start thing' because I've always been like this. But then its always been pretty tough at home. In fact, I suspect, well I don't know, that it may have been even tougher back when I was very small, just from figuring out some family situations, that even as a baby I was probably in a pretty difficult envirornment. So I can't really say its not ptsd. Maybe it doesn't matter. But then I run off down that avenue again of if its ptsd maybe I can fix it - like 'recover' and not need meds for ever.

I realise its a pretty huge debate, the nature versus nuture, the chicken and the egg etc.


X :

Hm,with ADHD you may notice a difference if you forget a lot of stuff,keep daydreaming even though you didnt meen to,get to late for appointments and forget stuff in conversations that the normal people remember.With PTSD its more like you feel anxious,cant sleep,feel as tho something terrible is about to happen next minute and you have to be prepaired all the time,you might also loose weight because of stress and anxiousness and such...but offcourse,its difficult to sleep with ADHD too,and with PSTD you can be so stressed it makes you forget stuff...

[lostdog65]

For me it's where I "feel" PTSD vs. where I "feel" ADHD.

PTSD is pit of the stomach.
ADHD is flushed face.

It's how I can distinguish which is being triggered and how to deal with it.

Eric

[Slo-mo a-go-go]

awww, sorry to hear of your trauma and resulting PTSD, starrykitty

i hope this helps although i had PTSD 10yrs bf getting dx'd ADHD-I.

maybe due to the type of trauma that caused my ptsd but i felt that all my symptoms were amplified, at the time I understood my attention issues to be caused by depression.

my ptsd felt like a dial someone turned up, before i had a little anxiety, after i literally would freeze in fear, everyday. is it possible that could be happening to you also?

my best to you and all others, it does get better, so so much better - for me, just when i feel like my ptsd was my new normal....
{{{{{{hugs and teddybears}}}}}}

[yellowflowers]

Originally Posted by Electra2

Hm,with ADHD you may notice a difference if you forget a lot of stuff,keep daydreaming even though you didnt meen to,get to late for appointments and forget stuff in conversations that the normal people remember.With PTSD its more like you feel anxious,cant sleep,feel as tho something terrible is about to happen next minute and you have to be prepaired all the time,you might also loose weight because of stress and anxiousness and such...but offcourse,its difficult to sleep with ADHD too,and with PSTD you can be so stressed it makes you forget stuff...

Thanks Electra

Yeh I don't know, I guess I'm just struggling to accept/understand whats 'wrong' with me.

The adhd fits uncomfortably well but probably only parts of PTSD. I have the 'hypervigilance' (around people) but this might not be as PTSD sufferers really experience it, could be an adhd thing... I really need to inform myself on PTSD more but I avoid it because... I guess don't want to upset myself... hell, avoidance is my strategy for everything, adhd had been banging around my head for a long time before I actually said anything to anyone but I just ...didn't want to believe it? I don;t know why I resist.

Even though I know I;ve had some pretty bad times, I really fear labelling them as 'trauma'. I hate that word. I realise its not rational. I've been for therapy (for eating disorder) and any suggestion that seemed to hint at ptsd I bawked at. I still managed to slowly go through some stuff though, and did begin to get a better understanding that my was not to blame for everything bad that happened.

I've heard there may be a connection between ptsd and adhd - in that people with adhd could be predisposed to it. But I also wonder about the actually physical effects of trauma on a infant/babies/small child's brain.... and what they were born with/ had a predisposition to versus what the environment created/ brought out. You know?

Xxx

[Barliman]

There can be significant overlap, and some psychiatrists believe that the "attention difference" mind is more prone to PTSD, or that PTSD may be nearly exclusively a condition of the "attention difference" mind.

This is the private blog of a retired Australian Psychiatrist, but I think it has some gems in it:
http://ptsd.net/

Andrew

[Eisi]

The problem with PTSD higly connected with ADHD is not the traumata, but the dissociation which leads to a mental state where often stimulants don`t work correctly.

The the quessing starts: Is it PTSD, is it Borderline, ist it Asperger and so on.

This starts because of the ADHD medication therapy didn`t work out.