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  #16  
Old 07-12-06, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1kid2dogs
This reflex is also known as the Moro reflex, and is usually developed in the infancy. Occasionally, it can be retained or left immature into adulthood. It is one of the cluster of baby reflexes. In the reading and research I've done on the STNR reflex, which is also a baby reflex, I have not found much on how to correct this. I would bet there is some kind of neurological therapy that can be done to help this, with getting in the right direction with searching for information. It's mighty uncomfortable!
There is a decent body of evidence to say that these reflexes, often known as primitive reflexes, are connected to and possibly cause ADHD and dyslexia.

An example of one these reflexes is the grasp reflex. This is what triggers a babies hand to grasp a object placed into its palm. Imagine if you kept this reflex and tried to write with a pen. The sensation of the pen will cause the hand to grasp the pen rather than gripping it normally. Such a handicap is going to make writing neatly very difficult.

There are several treatment programmes that are based on removing primitive reflexes.

INPP have been researching this area for 30 years and wrote the book on the subject.

Stopping ADHD is a book by O'Dell and Cook, based on their experiences running a clinic for ADHD sufferers.

The Infinity Walk. A book but I've not read it.

You can find more about this on my website (see my sig). I would post the direct links but the moderators have warned me that I'm not allowed to do that.

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Old 07-12-06, 02:37 PM
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Chris, does "The Infinity Walk" go into therpies for these reflexes? Or do you know of other places that mention them? My son and I are currently doing the Bender Program, in the book you mentioned "Stopping ADHD" for the STNR.

I have been on your site numerous times, and it is very informative! Thank you very much for the time and energy you put into it!
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Old 07-13-06, 04:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1kid2dogs
Chris, does "The Infinity Walk" go into therpies for these reflexes? Or do you know of other places that mention them? My son and I are currently doing the Bender Program, in the book you mentioned "Stopping ADHD" for the STNR.
Checking there website, the Infinitiy Walk doesn't specifically target primitive reflexes. However I believe that it will help with the neck based reflexes.

How are you getting on with the Bender Program? I really liked the book but I was concerned that the exercises were a bit complicated to learn from the book.

Thanks for the kind words about Myomancy.
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Old 07-13-06, 05:28 AM
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Yup, I have a wicked bad startle reflex. People have been commenting on it my entire life. For several years now (since I learned what it was), I've been explaining exaggerated startle, because people always seem to think they can spook me out of it somehow.

It's a neurological soft sign (NSS), by the way.
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Old 07-13-06, 06:24 AM
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Quote:
Yup, I have a wicked bad startle reflex.
Thanks for getting us back on topic Bean!



Quote:
I've "attacked" more people than I care to count.
Although I have never attacked any one I have been known to spin around with my fist raised.

I am especially prone to pro-active action if this ”sneaking up on me” is done when I am outside after dark, action potential increases with unfamiliar surroundings. Approaching without me being aware is a rarity I have sensitive hearing. To walk up behind me in a way that sounds like sneaking then attempt to make any sort of physical contact with out first speaking (in an attempt to startle) has landed more than one person on the ground.

I am odd if I am walking in a dark area I am not familiar with and I hear “two footed” steps approaching I do not necessarily act like I have heard the approach . . .but I do. Weird as I am people usually do not startle me more than once.



Quote:
Ditto, but add odd smells to the list too.
I do the sound thing but Gary can smell. His nose is soo sensitive I think he can smell the neighbors flatus. Makes him really good at taking out the trash before it gets too full.




Quote:
There is a decent body of evidence to say that these reflexes, often known as primitive reflexes, are connected to and possibly cause ADHD and dyslexia.

The cerebellum is the area of the brain that controls coordination and balance. It also plays a role in memory, another problem area for dyslexics

I am sorry to disagree here but I have dyslexia I have neither problems with coordination nor long memory(which is execellent-btw). As a matter of fact, many dyslexics depend on their long term memory to cover up for the struggle reading.

I do not know haw many posters here have dyslexia besides me (this discussion would need it's own thread) however I do believe almost every one here has ADD!

I think I agree more with SB's explanation for us ADDers being easily startled, it seems to fit my experience and knowledge better.
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  #21  
Old 07-13-06, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1kid2dogs
This reflex is also known as the Moro reflex, and is usually developed in the infancy. Occasionally, it can be retained or left immature into adulthood.
The startle reflex discussed here is not actually the "Moro reflex". The Moro reflex is present at birth, not developed after, and diappears at about 4 months of age unless there is a severe delay of normal brain development.

The term doesn't refer to being startled; it refers to the specific behavior a newborn child engages in when they are startled (throwing arms and legs wide, etc.).

For ADHDers, the reason we startle more easily than "normals" (and, believe me, OP, you're not alone!!!) is we maintain a level of alertness that is slightly greater than normal.

Alertness is a form/state of attention.
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Old 07-13-06, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Crazy~Feet
Ditto, but add odd smells to the list too. Sometimes nobody smells these things but me and my DD, but trust me...they reek and distract us to no end! Curse you, Mystery Stench!
AT LAST! I KNEW I wasn't alone in this!

When a neurologist does an examination, one of the first things they do is test smell sense.

I occasionally have "supernose" - my term for that enhanced sense of smell one gets with certain hormone levels (like during pregnancy).

I occasionally can't smell what others can.

But, the most interesting thing is the occasional strong and strange smell that comes from nowhere and nobody else smells!
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Old 07-13-06, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tregenza
There is a decent body of evidence to say that these reflexes, often known as primitive reflexes, are connected to and possibly cause ADHD and dyslexia.
Please provide citations.

Several members, include myself, have done reviews of the literature on this subject and have found absolutely nothing that supports these statements or the effectiveness of these so-called treatment programs.


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You can find more about this on my website (see my sig). I would post the direct links but the moderators have warned me that I'm not allowed to do that.
Hmmmm.... there's a direct link in your signature, isn't there?

There are some good reasons for this restriction. One is that it is difficult to understand one's motives when there's an obvious dollar to be made.
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Old 07-13-06, 04:44 PM
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I do have those reflexes sometimes... but usually I just have regular reflexes, like when I caught someone's book in midair before hitting the ground.

Instead of good hearing, my ADD gave me impecable eyesight... I can actually read in the dark
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Old 07-13-06, 05:54 PM
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better than peeing your pants
Too true !! Now THAT would be embarassing!
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Old 07-14-06, 12:48 AM
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Here is some more information on the moro reflex, that when believed to be retained, is speculated to cause us to react the way we do! Me included. :-) I hate thunder, it's embarrasing. This interests me a lot.

http://www.dyslexiamovement.com.au/reflexesadvanced.htm


"This is the alert reflex and causes the release of adrenaline in the body. The arms can move and there may be a sharp intake of breath. Function: This reflex warns the baby of a change in its environment. The change may be in sound, e.g. a loud noise, or sight, e.g. a bright light. Also a change in position such as dropping the baby will stimulate this reflex. The baby does not filter these stimuli and so the Moro reflex is automatically activated. Interference:
The retained Moro Reflex is another very disruptive influence on the life of the child and, unless addressed, will continue to disrupt the adult’s life. It has more social consequences. Because the child is unable to filter the various stimuli in its daily life, it is on alert far too often. Therefore its sense of security is underdeveloped. The child may be clingy and shy. Sometimes the feeling of insecurity creates a more aggressive reaction, the need for self-defense is irrationally overused. The child will over react to small changes, perhaps a substitute teacher or change of plans- situations that should be easily coped with. A child may hate loud noises or be easily distracted. The reason for the reaction is the inability to rationally deal with the unexpected. The Moro reflex over rides the rational thought processes. The panic mode is activated before the reason can be absorbed. Student’s ability to concentrate is obviously affected. Consequently, sequencing and memory skills are poor.

When the Moro reflex is activated, the body produces adrenaline. If this continues to be produced unnecessarily the presence of this hormone in the body can inhibit the immune system, leaving the person more vulnerable than others to sickness."

This site has more information on all of the primitive reflexes and what it can mean in the learning environment when believed to be retained.

Here is a trial that was conducted on a program instituted to help children with retained reflexes. For what it's worth, it's interesting food for thought anyways.
http://www.dyslexiamovement.com.au/Lancet/Lancet.htm
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Old 07-14-06, 05:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barbyma
Please provide citations.
Several members, include myself, have done reviews of the literature on this subject and have found absolutely nothing that supports these statements or the effectiveness of these so-called treatment programs.

Hmmmm.... there's a direct link in your signature, isn't there?

There are some good reasons for this restriction. One is that it is difficult to understand one's motives when there's an obvious dollar to be made.
I would be very interested in reading those reviews. Is there a thread you can point me at?

The moderators said its OK to have a link in Sig but not to link to specific articles and I understand and respect the restriction. Though it makes it hard to point out evidence that supports my point of view.

My motives is to spread information so that people can make informed choices. I appreciate that the same could be said for spammers but spammers don't normally hang around to discuss the issues.
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Old 07-14-06, 03:08 PM
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I don't have them organized and on stickies like some of the members do, so I'd just do a search.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tregenza
The moderators said its OK to have a link in Sig but not to link to specific articles and I understand and respect the restriction. Though it makes it hard to point out evidence that supports my point of view.
Well, links to articles should be all you need. For those of us that conduct research, failing to cite a peer-reviewed source would result in not getting published, so it's the appropriate source IMO.


Quote:
My motives is to spread information so that people can make informed choices. I appreciate that the same could be said for spammers but spammers don't normally hang around to discuss the issues.
Spoken by an obvious newbie!

We actually get a lot of "trolls" in here that join, post on or start a bunch of threads endorsing this treatment or that treatment, then defend their statements for several days before finally abandoning the forum.

Hang around; you'll see them! They tend to pop up in groups of 2-3.
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Old 07-14-06, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barbyma
Hang around; you'll see them! They tend to pop up in groups of 2-3.
Heh...they tend to get spotted quickly by people like me old moderator habits die hard.

I do not care much for SPAM in a can or otherwise.

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Old 07-15-06, 12:21 AM
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Originally Posted by meadd823
I am sorry to disagree here but I have dyslexia I have neither problems with coordination nor long memory(which is excellent-btw). As a matter of fact, many dyslexics depend on their long term memory to cover up for the struggle reading.
I agree in some respects meadd!

I have dyslexia and have never had a problem with coordination or long term memory.

However, a friend of mine who has ADD is a klutz. He drops and breaks stuff all the time, and seems to regularly injure himself too.

As for long term memory, I would say that my ADD not my Dyslexia effects my short term memory more than my long term memory.

For example, when someone calls and leaves a telephone number on my answering machine. I can't just listen to the number on the answering machine and immediately recall the number. I have to write the number down or I'll immediately forget the number.

And since things have to get into short term memory before it can make it into long term memory, I guess I would have to concede that long term memory would/could be effected by this short term memory issue that I have.

However, once I have gotten it into my long term memory, I would challenge anyone to a long term memory match. In fact, my long term memory regularly amazes my instructors and fellow classmates. It often amazes me too! But if you ask me how I can remember these facts, I honestly have no idea how I can remember them. Heck, I can even recall stuff clear back to when I was only two years old, which my mother confirms are true, and it amazes her that I can remember that far back.

But tell me your telephone number, or even if I am reading the number out of a telephone book, I can't remember the number 2 seconds after reading it (Or hearing it). It drives me nuts that I have such a problem with my short term memory. I don't know, maybe it's because the numbers are just to insignificant to remember or something.

As for the startle thing. I don't startle easily. In fact, I don't even jump during a scary movie or thunderstorms. But lately I have noticed that at work (I work the night shift alone) whenever the security guard walks into my department and I am busy doing paper work, the security guard startles me every time! I think he thinks it's funny by the way that he chuckles about it! Which makes me think that he does it on purpose sometimes. Perhaps a punch in the nose the next time he does it will solve the problem! LOL JK....

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