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Old 04-15-17, 05:57 PM
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What's the deal with procrastination?

I'm a huge procrastinator, and one of my procrastination methods involves studying procrastination itself. It gets me wondering why I procrastinate, and what happens when I do.

I've realized that when I am hit with a thought of "There's something I could do", I react opposite to how I should. The ideal response to a "possible action" thought is to start doing the thing right then and there. Instead, I go from the initial idea of the task, and I immediately start running through reasons why I shouldn't do that. I feel like at that crucial point, my mind self-hijacks and attempts to stop me from doing that thing.

I pretty much end up convincing myself that it's okay to wait. Why do I let my mind do this? Is there a way to stop the opponent in my mind?

I don't want it to sound like there are actually two different people in my mind, but sometimes it does feel like there is actively an opposing force in my mind influencing me to do things like procrastination (it is very convincing).

I have only recently been taking ADHD medication, which does help a lot with focus problems. However my procrastination is still present, becoming more advanced with the medication, as I'm actually able to completely focus on whatever I choose to procrastinate with.

Any tips on fighting this? Personal experiences with procrastination?
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Old 04-15-17, 06:28 PM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

I'm new to ADD, recently diagnosed and I'm having similar problems with procrastination. Even when I'm ready to start a project or the procrastination starts to cease I still procrastinate and I don't know why. My only reason is that I'm so used to procrastinating and when I don't have that feeling of procrastination I get scared and become fearful that I will actually accomplish something. I'm trying to take things in smaller pieces. So if I'm not procrastinating but my mind still disallows me to work or study I start by accomplishing something small. For example if I want to read a book I might only read one page, then ten minutes later read another page. Then after awhile the feeling of not procrastinating will become normal and will become a habit.
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Old 04-15-17, 08:42 PM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

In my opinion, the deal with procrastination is that there is no deal with procrastination. I think it's somewhat different for each person, though often with a number of features in common.

Because of that, I believe there's no single way to combat procrastination, but that each person must develop and use their own unique patchwork of many strategies to get what they need.

In terms of ancient computer games, you need the sword AND the poison AND the spear AND the key AND the magic potion, and if one is missing, you'll still procrastinate.
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Old 04-15-17, 11:24 PM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

Unfortunately, it seems most of our lives our spent doing things we dislike to one extent or another. My strategy is to make a list that I follow the best I can. Sometimes it's easier than others, but "brute force"/just doing it without thinking too much about it is the best action sometimes. Lists may not be your thing though. Find what's best for you.
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Old 04-16-17, 11:33 AM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

Quote:
Originally Posted by unwitting View Post
I'm a huge procrastinator, and one of my procrastination methods involves studying procrastination itself. It gets me wondering why I procrastinate, and what happens when I do.

I've realized that when I am hit with a thought of "There's something I could do", I react opposite to how I should. The ideal response to a "possible action" thought is to start doing the thing right then and there. Instead, I go from the initial idea of the task, and I immediately start running through reasons why I shouldn't do that. I feel like at that crucial point, my mind self-hijacks and attempts to stop me from doing that thing.

I pretty much end up convincing myself that it's okay to wait. Why do I let my mind do this? Is there a way to stop the opponent in my mind?

I don't want it to sound like there are actually two different people in my mind, but sometimes it does feel like there is actively an opposing force in my mind influencing me to do things like procrastination (it is very convincing).

I have only recently been taking ADHD medication, which does help a lot with focus problems. However my procrastination is still present, becoming more advanced with the medication, as I'm actually able to completely focus on whatever I choose to procrastinate with.

Any tips on fighting this? Personal experiences with procrastination?
For me it is absolutely about personal experience.

My life history is nothing but a sequence of things begun and never finished. I get to a stage in anything where i just can't see how to take the next step. My clutter is all about things begun that got stuck.

So, when something new comes up - all those old messages come back "No, please, do not start something else you'll never finish".

WMM
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Old 04-16-17, 11:48 AM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

I've been a procrastinator since College and I wanted to change that when I started my work. Sometimes, it's still hard to fight the urge to set aside the things I needed to do but it's a matter of overcoming that perhaps and knowing that you'll have plenty more of time ahead once you've done it earlier.
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Old 04-16-17, 12:27 PM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

I wish I had found Joseph Campbell 40 years ago. He called himself a mythologist. A myth is not a fictitious story - a myth is a USEFUL story. He claims that all religions are myths - not because they're not accurate portrayals of things, but because their usefulness over-rides whether they're factually-based or not. We use stories to educate all the time - the elementary school reading books are all fiction and we use them to teach reading. Most of the old fairy tales teach a lesson - you know the made-up story of the tortoise and the hare, which teaches the value of patience and persistence? In many religions, the deity uses fiction all the time, and it's called a parable.

What Campbell did over his lifetime was absorb the stories, legends, beliefs, cultural values and so on, of as many cultures as he could find, and then he sought the similarities - he felt the similarities would tell us a lot about the essential core of being human. Of course, he also read the works of other men who came before him and did similar work.

What makes Campbell accessible is that he was a prolific writer and lecturer, so a lot of his work is easy to get - and he's fairly recent, so there are no problems understanding a translation from an old language or even the vagaries of old English.

Finding your purpose:

Here's the point, though - one theme that comes up over and over in all belief systems - whether derived scientifically by a philosopher, or evolved over generations in a non-scientific belief system - is that a human's #1 goal is to find yourself or find a calling or, as Campbell put it, Find your Bliss. My own opinion is that few of us have just one calling, but there will be things that we are drawn to - more than one thing...and our life's pursuit should involve those as much as possible.

This is such a strongly held belief that thousands of philosophic/moral/religions quotes discourage NOT doing this...for instance:

What happens if you don't find your purpose and follow it:

Dante (Italian poet circa 1300) wrote one of the greatest works in the entire world of literature "The Divine Comedy". It is an imaginative view of the afterlife and how it looks depending on how the person lived.

In this masterpiece, he speaks of The Wasteland. The Wasteland is the boring, colorless place that people go if they spent their entire lives obeying rules created by others. Waste, in this case, is a waste of a human life. If all one does is obey rules created by others, then one has made no contribution to humanity.

Why do so many fail to find their purposes:

An over-arching theme of all world religions is that every person experiences a number of deaths and resurrections through life. Each major life change is a death and resurrection. This may sound overly dramatic, but it has been pointed out by many philosophers that the greatest problems in society are caused by people who transition from one life stage to another without really embracing how dramatic that change was. People who have their first child and still try to live the happy child-free life often neglect the children to the point where the kids grow up to not trust others. When a child is born, your child-free self dies and you are resurrect as a parent - with a completely new set of responsibilities and you must sever ties with most of what you were before. People who get married and do NOT, in some ritualistic manner, cause their former single self to die, will not resurrect into a married person - and they are the ones who end up being unfaithful spouses.

The most dramatic personal death and resurrection, however, is transitioning from a child to an adult.

The human is a child for 20% of its life - more than any other animal, by a long shot. Because we walk upright, the human birth canal is relatively small, so our babies are born far more immature than any other animal. Thus, an entire community is required to raise a child - otherwise the parents who would spend 100% of their time on child and end up disconnected from community would suffer too much. To make this work, the entire childhood is spent learning rules, and thou shalts, and the highest objective is to obey all those rules.

Having obeyed the rules until the age of consent, at which time you can now be legally prosecuted for transgressions, violations of agreements, and such, your child self dies and you are resurrected as an adult. Your highest obligation now is to evaluate every single thou shalt that you learned and determine, for your own self, which ones are proper for you to pursue making a significant contribution on your own merits.

The high crime rates in the USA are 90% perpetrated by people under 25 years old - people of adult age who failed to make the transition properly.

And that's also the main reason why many don't seek and find their purpose - they go into adulthood continuing to believe that all is good as long as they follow the rules.


What happens when you find your purpose:


All writers on the topic point out that you rarely simply find your purpose and *bing* it's done. Rather, you find some passion early on and make sure to have plenty in your life. As time goes on, that passion may kindle a spark in another one, which you then attempt to bring more of. The new passion may be a sideways step from the first, or a higher level built on the first or something completely different. The point is to make sure to spend time on it, and pursuing it, and not just on obligations. To be sure, any commitments you made, you still must carry out. The passion for your purpose, in theory, motivates you to get your obligations completed quickly - and also tells you that those obligations are not your life's work, so don't be perfectionist about them.

Follow your bliss and don't be afraid, and doors will open where you didn't know they were going to be."

"If you follow your bliss you put yourself on a kind of track that has been there all the while, waiting for you, and the life that you ought to be living is the one you are now living. When you can see that, you begin to meet people who are in your field of bliss, and they offer a million helping hands to ease your path." (I have personally observed this exact effect working in my favor)

"

Work is love made visible.
And if you cannot work with love but only with distaste, it is better that you should leave your work and sit at the gate of the temple and take alms of those who work with joy.
For if you bake bread with indifference, you bake a bitter bread that feeds but half man's hunger.
And if you grudge the crushing of the grapes, your grudge distils a poison in the wine.
And if you sing though as angels, and love not the singing, you muffle man's ears to the voices of the day and the voices of the night."

The drudgery of everyday life:
Quote:
Originally Posted by aur462 View Post
Unfortunately, it seems most of our lives our spent doing things we dislike to one extent or another.
I used to agree 100%. But - now that I'm able to spend my time mostly pursuing things that are closer to my passions than before...it's different.

I have not found my bliss, but over the years, I've learned some things. First, I absolutely can not do things just for money - although my preferred lifestyle requires above average income, I can't just take a job because of the money - I will fail to focus, and get fired. For me, I have a strong need to make a difference - my presence on this planet must have improved things, somehow, for more than one someone. I'm no altruist trying to solve world hunger, but if I write a piece of music that makes people flock to the dance floor when it comes on the radio, then I've succeeded. Or, if I write a collection of opinion pieces on how successful people with ADHD have done it - that's a successful improvement.

Presently, I do sound engineering for one local band. This is not an end goal, but it feels like a step. We have been voted as one of the top 3 bands in the area, and repeatedly when entertainment reviewers cover one of our shows, they say "technically, the quality of the sound was above that of any pro touring act I've seen in years, and this really helps to admire the talents of the musicians." My work makes thousands of dancers happy, makes the musicians much more energetic to play, knowing the fans can hear them better - this to me is an improvement that is worthwhile. As I said, I won't be setting any goals for curing world hunger any time soon!

By the way, if you read books on how successful people do it, you'll find that those whose passions are not somehow strongly connected toward making a difference for others, usually find those passions short-lived. I found this to be true for me at one point, too.

So - how did I and how do I handle drudgery? Before I realized the value of following my interests, I did a terrible job of determining which activities I should really get good at. I swear I could do five layers of perfection in dish-washing. Now, knowing that washing the dishes is simply part of "life support", I get it done quickly, knowing that simply letting them dry is 99% of the disinfection process. Maintaining the yard? Since I decided that saving money at all costs is NOT a worthy goal but freeing up time for my music pursuits is - I spent money on a riding mower. I can now get the entire place mowed in 45 minutes, not 6 hours.

I had also enjoyed making nice meals. I still do, but it's not really a passionate type of enjoyment, more like relaxing. So now, I cook much more simply, as it saves time...unless I'm throwing a house party which I do a few times a year.

My mom was fastidious about house-cleaning, I guess that was her passion. I 'inherited' that, and cleaned frequently and fastidiously. About2 20 years ago, somehow the light turned on. Only a few hours after dusting, there's visible dust on all the horizontal surfaces. If that's the case, and I clean weekly, then on average, there's 3 days of dust. There's no real point cleaning it ALL since I'll have achieved a state that's very temporary. So now, I dust far less often and more quickly, and maybe once a year I actually do it carefully enough to get everything. Probably saved 100 hours a year.

Everything I do is now informed by this - if the thing I'm working on is not in the path toward building a music-based business, then I first ask "is this even needed?" with a STRONG desire to say "no". Then, if it's needed, but not for my business, I ask myself if there's a way to get it done more quickly - am I being too much of a perfectionist? In many cases, if it's something I've never done before - and don't have any need to become good at it - I'll hire it done. Nobody does anything quickly/well the first time, so if you're never going to do it again for say, 5 years - it's hardly worth attempting to get good at it. Thus, I hire out painting the house. Doing that task has nothing to do with my business, and I would gain no useful benefit in getting good at it.


All this focus on where I want to be, with respect to my contributions to humanity have made lots of decisions easier...and made even formerly boring tasks not so boring, since I know with certainty where they fit in my life.


That's not to say I've overcome procrastination and clutter - I'm still struggling with those, but again, I sense them fitting into the overall picture better than they used to.


This was long, but I hope usefully so.


WMM
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Old 04-16-17, 02:46 PM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

unwitting

Quote:
Why do I let my mind do this? Is there a way to stop the opponent in my mind?

I don't want it to sound like there are actually two different people in my mind, but sometimes it does feel like there is actively an opposing force in my mind influencing me to do things like procrastination (it is very convincing).
Any tips on fighting this? Personal experiences with procrastination?
Unwitting, if I could get the number of people in my head down to just two, I'd be forever grateful.
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Old 04-17-17, 03:50 PM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

Quote:
Originally Posted by aur462 View Post
Unfortunately, it seems most of our lives our spent doing things we dislike to one extent or another. My strategy is to make a list that I follow the best I can. Sometimes it's easier than others, but "brute force"/just doing it without thinking too much about it is the best action sometimes. Lists may not be your thing though. Find what's best for you.
It's the "just doing it" part that I am having problems with. I can write a list just fine about what I should be doing. When the time comes to make a mental decision to either "do it now" or "procrastinate", I have a hard time intercepting that thought process and choose the former. Instead I feel like the decision was made for me and not by me. Sounds strange to say that but it really is a sort of competition between two sides. And the "good" (non-procrastination) side very often loses. So I guess I'm looking for how to get this side to win more times than not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WheresMyMind View Post
For me it is absolutely about personal experience.

My life history is nothing but a sequence of things begun and never finished. I get to a stage in anything where i just can't see how to take the next step. My clutter is all about things begun that got stuck.

So, when something new comes up - all those old messages come back "No, please, do not start something else you'll never finish".

WMM
You can't see how to take the next step, or don't want to? Usually procrastination comes because you know what you need to do, but aren't doing it. Otherwise it's not really considered procrastinating, is it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonlight View Post
I've been a procrastinator since College and I wanted to change that when I started my work. Sometimes, it's still hard to fight the urge to set aside the things I needed to do but it's a matter of overcoming that perhaps and knowing that you'll have plenty more of time ahead once you've done it earlier.
What strategies can you provide that would help overcome the urge to procrastinate? It's such a comforting feeling for me. I love procrastinating, and that's likely a big part of the problem, and why it's so difficult to stop. How hard is it for you generally to stop a given moment of procrastination?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Letching Gray View Post
Unwitting, if I could get the number of people in my head down to just two, I'd be forever grateful.
Actual people in your head, or just opposing forces? I'm speaking metaphorically when I say people, but there are certainly debates going on in my mind between different sides. Which side is more convincing? Why? How am I able to debate myself like this? How can I influence this debate so that I may end up choosing to act, instead of procrastinate?
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Old 04-17-17, 05:28 PM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

READ THIS: http://cyllyathoughts.blogspot.com/2...stination.html

I know the EXACT problem you're talking about, and that page has everything I've been able to find about it.

There's not much actual help there, unfortunately. A lot of people on this forum have described this, and I consider it an unofficial ADHD symptom, but there's not much research or professional literature about it.

Procrastination can be caused by anything that makes you dislike doing a task, so this is not the one and only cause. However, it's this massive invisible wall that's still around after you get past all the other obstacles.

Quote:
Originally Posted by unwitting View Post
I pretty much end up convincing myself that it's okay to wait. Why do I let my mind do this? Is there a way to stop the opponent in my mind?

I don't want it to sound like there are actually two different people in my mind, but sometimes it does feel like there is actively an opposing force in my mind influencing me to do things like procrastination (it is very convincing).
I completely sympathize. It's this weird nonsensical but frequently overwhelming urge to not do things, contrary to our own interests. Some people describe it as "feeling paralyzed."

Sometimes it's referred to as "lack of motivation," but I hate calling it that. That makes it sound like a much different problem than what it is.

It's subtle, yet horrible and demoralizing.

It's pretty much my biggest obstacle. I have other issues, but this is problem #1.
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Old 04-17-17, 05:46 PM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

Quote:
Actual people in your head, or just opposing forces? I'm speaking metaphorically when I say people, but there are certainly debates going on in my mind between different sides. Which side is more convincing? Why? How am I able to debate myself like this? How can I influence this debate so that I may end up choosing to act, instead of procrastinate?
I know. Figures of speech. I was goofing. I'm more than familiar with what you're saying. It is amazing how crazy I can get. Reading what you wrote inspired me to get off my behind and get to work.
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Old 04-17-17, 06:47 PM
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Re: What's the deal with procrastination?

One of the best working definitions of ADHD I've ever heard is :

"ADHD is DOING what you know and NOT KNOWING what to do."

It's also defined as both a "Performance Disorder," and a "Time Management" Disorder.

The latter refers to ADHD impairing the ability to "anticipate the future."

Consequently, people with ADHD will almost always believe they have more time to

complete a task than they really do.

Put another way, "They (ADHD individuals) won't be ready for the future, until it gets

there."

Hope that helps some.

tc

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