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Old 10-21-20, 09:11 AM
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Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

I am not saying this applies to everyone or even that you have to believe me.

My mother and brother work in ICU in NJ near me. There has been talk of a second wave coming, or being here already and I wanted to share info I found out about this morning. I talked to them both this morning and they both shared with me what they see going on and the opinions of doctors that they work with.
NJ's cases are rising as well as the transmission rate but what seems to be the real issue as it was last time is the lethality and hospitalization rate. At the end of July the two hospitals they work at had zero covid patients. This is after overflowing hospitals during the peak. In the last three days both their hospitals had 12 admissions including 4 intubations and 2 on ventilators. The nurses and doctors talk to each other and the doctors are scared. They are scared it will be worse this time around. At a hospital north of me by 1 hour they had 30 patients admitted to ICU in the last 3 days. There were 28 intubations. Granted these hospitals are closer to NYC but still, NJ is not that big of a state.These hospitals are also not huge. The doctors have been getting briefs by other officials and they are starting to prepare for admissions. They will be in a better place because they have been stockpiling equipment and PPE but they expect this time around to end up being worse.

According to them its because people are so soured at what the first lockdowns did to the economy combined with cases and hospitalizations falling over the summer and ******** who refuse to comply, and people that violate guidelines and have "covid" fatigue. Whereas before it was new and there were a lot of unknowns; now people think its so mild and look at health policies as violations of their rights. There are no consequences enforced. The politicalization of covid and poor examples set by officials cause people to think its all under control.

Let me tell you that there are no sound treatments for covid no matter what you hear. No long term studies. They are still studying antivirals, and the like but its largely a matter of hypothesis and best guesses when it comes to treating the very sick. They know a little more now than last time but covid still seems nearly invincible.

They have better plans now but you can only plan so much, you cant plan for overwhelmed hospitals. If there isn't enough room, there isn't enough room.

They both want me to get a 3m respirator and face shield because I am the one who goes to the store and takes people places. My mom has N95 masks that she wants my husband and kids to wear. I do not F-ing care if I look stupid. I would rather be wrong and safe than sick. I know cases are up across the country but its the hospitals to pay attention to, to see how the healthcare system is holding up. And it has been proven in some places that its not just the 65 and over crowd that are most at risk. NJ's cases percentage wise have struck the 30-40 year old age range more than older adults. There are schools shutting down because of outbreaks in the "supposed" immune kids".

And The flu is coming. There already was an anti-vaxx sentiment about the flu vaccine but covid has made it 10 times worse due to misinformation. A favorite stat that was thrown around was how the flu was worse and more deadly than covid. Well, use that stat and add in covid and think about what will happen.
I don't know if anyone will think I have "insider" info but it is more than just speculation. I am not being an alarmist and this may not apply to your area or your state. I live in the biggest tri-state area in the country and if NYC or Con. or PA has spikes and deaths than you expect NJ to follow suit.

The biggest reason the doctors they work with say cases are getting like this is the cool weather and inside gatherings with no one wearing masks or distancing. Just because you are related doesn't mean you should not wear a mask. If people are not immediate members of your household it is recommended to wear a mask indoors and stay socially distanced. My brother has already decided he will have to miss the holidays with us if things continue this way. He doesn't want to risk it. He had been working 90 hours a week April-June and was having 1 patient die a day from covid. Young healthy people. There is too much to learn about this virus and how it mutates and why certain groups get sicker than others. When you get information please fact check it with an independent source. Double check you are reading the science and not opinions. You can disagree with me or tell me to F off but I assure you this is not something I read, this is not my guess, this is from people I know that work in critical care. I just wanted to share my perspective.
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Old 10-21-20, 02:13 PM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

I agree that the second wave has already started.

I was so angry when I saw the president bragging about the treatment he got
and promising that every American could get the same treatment.

No, they can't and they won't. That's privilege talking and no understanding of
what it's like for the other 99% of us.

I asked my PCP last week about getting the flu shot as usual. She advised
against getting it this soon.
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Old 10-22-20, 07:14 AM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

If this is a new wave now (not sure just yet), it would be our third for us. Our first wave in the spring was the welcome to the world of pandemic wave, the mildest, although certainly didn't seem mild to us. Our idiot governor wanted to open up oh-so-early, to get brownie points from his boss. So before we were stabilized, he started to open up FAST! I knew we weren't ready. The numbers started to edge up almost immediately. In July, we were pretty much out of control, scared out of our wits. That was the second wave...they said it wasn't, but I believe it was. We hit numbers that were twice what we'd seen in the first wave and everybody was afraid, although not all admitting that. That's when the trailers showed up to hold the bodies outside the hospitals. Being high-risk, we had never stopped isolating at home. I'm a doctor's mother, kept reading up on the huge mess we were in. After we finally forced the governor to take it seriously...THEN we managed to get strict rules in place, at least in the cities, and started to get the masks, distancing and etc. as seriously as we could in a hellhole state like ours. The hospitals were scary places then. We lost way too many! It worked...the numbers eventually came down and down to somewhat safer numbers. Now we are, unfortunately, opening back up somewhat again. It's gone up a little...don't know how much it'll be now. Right now, I'm just so sick and tired of being sick and tired. We haven't had the virus, but feel very victimized nonetheless. I'm 74, but feel way older this year. I don't want a vaccine until we get something as safe and effective as possible, so I'm waiting until next year, even if vaccines come out earlier than that. Flu shot probably early November, since that's when I see my PC. Voting is tough here...I'll be taking my ballot straight to the election office myself. Hoping for the best.
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Old 10-22-20, 01:53 PM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

Hi, I get the fear and the need to get out information and I'm going to leave this note instead of killing the Covid thread conversation because some of your statements are political, which is against our guidelines. Please keep your conversation on topic for Covid, the disease, the science and the preparation, tips, and perspectives of nurses and doctors, etc. and leave out the frustration of politics, political members, etc. Thanks.
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Old 11-12-20, 07:59 PM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

I’m so tired of everything right now. Because I work in a school, and the powers that be have been making moves to bring students back in person, I’ve been following the metrics fairly closely for our county. We just hit a number for cases per 100,000 that rivals our summer peak, but looking at the shape of the curve this time, we’re still rising.

My sister is due any day now. I don’t think we’re even going to drive the 45 miles south to do Thanksgiving with my folks...it’s just too risky. And I live in a state that is doing comparatively well...
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Old 11-13-20, 12:19 AM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

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Originally Posted by TygerSan View Post
Iím so tired of everything right now. Because I work in a school, and the powers that be have been making moves to bring students back in person, Iíve been following the metrics fairly closely for our county. We just hit a number for cases per 100,000 that rivals our summer peak, but looking at the shape of the curve this time, weíre still rising.

My sister is due any day now. I donít think weíre even going to drive the 45 miles south to do Thanksgiving with my folks...itís just too risky. And I live in a state that is doing comparatively well...
The covid thing is so crazy. The school thing is really crazy. *hugs*

My daughter wants to do our usual drive to her bestie's for TurkeyDay,
and I understand that because her daddy has cancer and may not be
with us next Thanksgiving. But I'm on the fence about going.
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Old 11-13-20, 07:47 AM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

I'm in Western Australia. We never got a first wave. All overseas travellers are being quarantined upon arrival. Our state closed the borders and it was challenged in court and we won. State borders to most states are opening at midnight which is good news as there has been a considered approach. I really do hope you can all stay safe.
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Old 11-14-20, 05:34 AM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

Thought I'd update: There are two small to medium hospitals in my brother and mother's network. One we will call H and one T based on their cities in NJ. The T hospital has a trauma unit while the H hospital is more for surgeries, especially elective ones. Both have ICU/ critical care units that they work in. They both work out of H hospital at least until covid. By mid August there were no more covid patients really, maybe a few long haul ones and it became policy that from now on until things got bad again covid patients were automatically shipped to T hospital even if they came in the the ER at H. Things went back to normal, or the new normal.

In mid Sept a few covid cases came in and went to T hospital. The adminstration, in anticipation of a possible second wave in the late fall/winter said they decided that when the census reached roughly 68 they would have to start putting patients into H hospital as well. T hospital has about 150 beds (Icu/ccu max of 22), H has about 175(Icu/CCU max of 16-18). Still the hope was that people would just follow the F-ing guidelines so it wouldnt be like the spring.

The second week of October there were 6 covid patients at T hospital. By the third week there were 11. By 11/1 there were 16. By 11/7 there were 22. By 11/11 there were 40. yesterday morning there was 60 and I will find out today what the count last night was.

Yesterday my brother got pulled to the covid unit at T hospital. Goodbye visiting with my brother(we kept it masked and outside, but still). He now will not crash at my mother's house when he works long hours. He will isolate from his partner IF he actually goes home. When people still appreciated nurses and frontline workers in the Spring hotels across the state let workers stay in nearby hotels for free. My brother asked his boss about this, and his boss said she heard "the hotels were offering a bargain rate of 69$ a night now" and asked how long he stayed in one the last time. He said 60, she thought he meant 16 but he repeated 60. Do the math on that one to figure out his out of pocket expenses. He got a brief "covid" bonus for two months the last time of an additional 3.75$ an hour. There are no plans as of yet for anything this time but he is expected to take extra shifts and overtime.

Working extra time in ICU is exhausting. You are dealing with near death patients who require every need met and heavy monitoring. It is supposed to be a 1:2 at most 1:3 ratio and if your charge nurse its supposed to be no patients for the charge nurse. Already the cenus is up to a 1:4 and he was also charge.

This all might seem like no big deal but in my small county even though we are heavily populated it just a small area for this to be going on already. NJ has 71 or 72 hospitals with a lot of them large. Basic math can tell you where we are at already. Just sharing.
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Old 11-14-20, 12:37 PM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

I was curious Sarah, has your brother or mother noticed a lower death rate or less severe complications in patients since the addition of Remdesivir, Dexamethasone, Convalescent plasma, Tocilizumab and Monoclonal antibodies (MABs) treatments have become available?

I don’t think MABs are readily available. I think you have to be the president or a participant in early phase studies to receive Monoclonal antibodies currently.

Just curious to know if your Bro and mom have mentioned the virus seeming less severe this go-around with more treatment options.
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Old 11-14-20, 02:34 PM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

Thereís been a lot of articles saying vaccines are coming very soon. Fauci is saying everyone in US would likely have access by April.

Someone in the US government said some higher risk group would get access in December even though Iím not sure how reliable that source is.

The infection numbers in my state are higher than theyíve ever been right now. Our governor has just called for a new partial lockdown.

My friends dad is in the hospital and expected to die from covid. Sad way to die. They canít even visit him and he doesnít have a smart phone so itís only telephone calls.

https://www.businessinsider.com/fauc...erable-2020-11
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Old 11-15-20, 05:55 PM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

Well, we've been back in lockdown here since October 30...everyone got careless...

It's less awful , because the grocery stores are all just stocked normally , everyone's used to wearing masks, etc and sports already have very strict covid protocols so stuff wasn't cancelled. and they didn't close parks so it's not all roped off by the apartment. you must have a signed form saying you're out for groceries, work supplies, dr appointment, exercise, etc. but they aren't checking in this area (so far).

Things got political over what's considered "essential goods." so to be fair to small businesses, you can't buy clothing or books in stores like target (although i guess socks and underwear and basic baby clothes are ok).

the other day I could have theoretically bought a frying pan ; but not a deco spoon rack for the kitchen. it was just very strange.
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Old 11-16-20, 09:15 AM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

Covid-19 will forever stay with us and vaccines can only make us immune for a given time. With the long term effects, this virus is giving to patients that recovered from this. I can't imagine people going back to normal as not wearing a mask and face shield. I believe these activities/protocols will stay for good and I don't have any problems with it. Japan has been doing it for years so why can't other countries.
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Old 11-16-20, 08:19 PM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

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I can't imagine people going back to normal as not wearing a mask and face shield.
I wish the people in my area would take it more serious. Normal should be mask and or face shield given the severity of the pandemic but it’s not here.

I work for a wholesaler and I’m the only one of our staff including the owner, that wears a mask. Roughly 80% of our customers we deal with on a daily basis don’t wear masks.

Publix grocery store has a mask requirement but publicly said they wouldn’t enforce it. The people around here seem to believe the virus isn’t as serious, dangerous or prevalent as portrayed in the media. Social distancing and avoiding gatherings seems to have been pushed by the wayside and forgotten.

I was invited to a Florida vs Georgia football game party recently. I definitely declined and slightly scolded them for having it. 3 people have since come down with COVID from the party.
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Old 11-16-20, 08:31 PM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

There is an absolutely devastating thread on Twitter wherein John J. Lowe (@Prof_Lowe) solicited stories from healthcare workers involved in caring for COVID patients. Won't link it here due to guidelines, but you can look it up with the original tweet text:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof_Lowe
We keep using data to communicate COVID risk, trends and to ask people to take precautions. As the US peaks, perhaps it is time to share our personal experiences. So to my fellow COVID warriors, what experiences left an imprint on you?
Just gut-wrenching, the stories people have shared. So many will bear emotional scars from this, in addition to the direct loss of life and lingering physical effects.
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Old 11-17-20, 08:54 AM
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Re: Covid information according to my ICU RN brother and mother

Quote:
Originally Posted by namazu View Post
There is an absolutely devastating thread on Twitter wherein John J. Lowe (@Prof_Lowe) solicited stories from healthcare workers involved in caring for COVID patients. Won't link it here due to guidelines, but you can look it up with the original tweet text:

Just gut-wrenching, the stories people have shared. So many will bear emotional scars from this, in addition to the direct loss of life and lingering physical effects.
I just can't wrap my head around folks whose attitude is "if I get it, I get it, and it was meant to be." They have no *idea* what it is like to die from respiratory failure. No idea what they're going to go through themselves, and what trauma they will be putting their loved ones through, as they die alone in the ICU.

It's a fate I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy, and yet folks are still clamoring for their rights to be absolute selfish *******s, as if their behavior doesn't affect anyone else around them.
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