Wellbutrin / Stimulant Comparison

[Sc@tterBr@in_UK]

I am wondering if there may be a connection between which stimulant works for a person, and which antidepressant-that-is-also-used-for-ADHD works for them.

Theoretically, people for whom ampthetamines like Dex and Adderall work should respond better to Strattera (because both work more heavily on the Norepinephrine), and people who respond better to Methylphenidate should respond better to Wellbutrin as well (as both work primarily on Dopamine and work more similarly, i.e. on the re-uptake of Dopamine).

So the question is to people who have tried both stimulants and Wellbutrin:
BARRING any physical side effects (that may be related to other individual problems and metabolisms), and just from the point of view of helping your ADHD symptoms: Which ones worked and which ones didn't?

[Stranger]

I've never tried stimulants (well, once I snitched an adderal from my kids) but wellbutrin helps only very slightly, and strattera not at all.

[douglasbrooker]

In 2001 I was put on Zoloft, then a combo of Wellbutrin and Zoloft, then after about six months of that I went on Wellbutrin alone. I was on it over a year, at a dosage of 300 mg a day. I noticed the effect of Zoloft more than the Wellbutrin, which was weird, kind of like living inside an emotional pillow where none of your symptoms of ineptitude and sketchy behavior were lifted, but you were suddenly more okay with what an idiot you were. I have to say that coffee had a more noticeable effect on me than Wellbutrin. I gave it a year and was on the high end of the dose range, but it was literally like taking nothing at all. When I lived in Mexico I took a diet pill that used to be sold as Tennuate, but the generic name is dithylpropion, and it's related to to Wellbutrin, which is buproprion. That had a more stimulating effect, and worked instantly, like amphetamine, but was sort of lame and you felt jittery and it gave me cotton mouth. Wellbutrin is basically worthless, to me. I have even experimented with phentermine, another diet pill, which actually works almost as well as Ritalin for focusing, but has a rather "flat" emotional contour about it. I found it made me a little anti-social. For me the stimulants are the best. I have had problems with the euphoria associated with them, especially Dexedrine. But I find that none of them are a problem if I stick more to the time release formulations and am less likely to revert to the old party ways of the 60s, when taking a "handful of bennies" was sort of vogue.

[paulbf]

I think I'm sensitive to norepenephrine. Wellbutrin got me speeded up, loss of appetite, increased sex drive & sleeping poorly. THose effects wore off in time except the insomnia. Effexor also messed with my sleep and it has a bit of norepenephrine action.

I could not tell the difference between ritalin & adderall. They both got me speedy but I was able to sleep fine. I didn't have any improvement with my hyperfocus/overfocus distractability from any of them. I'm trying some dopamine only meds from overseas (ameneptine & amisulpride) and they feel good without the tenseness (well maybe just a little bit). I don't know yet for sure if they help really with anything ADD related but they actually feel good. I think I'm more motivated, relaxed and less of the hunting around for something stimulating, more able to relax & enjoy what I've got, not always so difficult & unsettled.

[douglasbrooker]

The drugs that focus on norepinephrine always seem to have generally undesirable sideeffects. The drugs that focus on dopamine and serotonin seem to work better. This is just my opinion based on personal experience, which is considerable, and reading posts in websites like this. Dexedrine is interesting because it acts on all three, but it has a "pleasure" factor that can make it addictive for some people. Take 30 or 40 mg of that stuff, and it's basically a cocaine buzz. Ditto for Desoxyn.

[paulbf]

The thing is I've tried cocaine (& speed) a few times years ago and I didn't think it was that great. If I want to get high, I'll drink or smoke, I don't want a prescription to ritalin to get high & low doses don't seem to help my ADD symptoms. Maybe combined with Prozac or something? I wish this stuff worked on me. I actually tried combining my leftover wellbutrin with this dopamine stuff & it felt like ritalin. At least this stuff is pleasant. I tried a larger dose & it's not something I'd really want to abuse that way.

[douglasbrooker]

Yeah, it's weird how one guy's obsession is another guy's yawn. I do have a moderately addictive personality. I've quit drinking. That ancient crap was the thing I could control least. Basically an isolating go to bed drunk pattern. No binges or black outs. But it bordered on obsessive, or maybe ritualistic is more accurate.

[attention]

Hi Ya Doug,

I'v taken Ritalin 60-70mgs daily. How does Dex compare?
You have tried Desoxyn how does that help your symptoms-side -effects?, what dose?


Cheers Paul

[douglasbrooker]

Desoxyn and Dexedrine are pretty similar. They are more potent. If you're doing 60 to 70 mg of Ritalin, I would say 40 mg of Dexedrine would probably be equivalent. It really all depends. I'm taking Methylin now, which is a very good generic of Ritalin. Some people like Dex better for subtle, intangible reasons. Like they feel more social or "smoother", whereas Ritalin is more of a tasking, anti-social feel. I think it depends on so many psycho-social factors all you can do test it yourself, see what you think.

Dex and the more pure amphetamines tend to definitely feel a little too euphoric than Ritalin, so I sorta go with the one that works without getting me too "happy."

Good luck with your own experiments. Whatever works is what works, and don't be afraid to sample the cornucopeia, because that's where the best discoveries are made.

[blueyemass1979]

Originally Posted by douglasbrooker

I have even experimented with phentermine, another diet pill, which actually works almost as well as Ritalin for focusing, but has a rather "flat" emotional contour about it. I found it made me a little anti-social.

Are you saying phentermine actually helped your ADHD symptoms? How did it compare with Adderall or Dexedrine?

[douglasbrooker]

I would say this: if you have addictive tendencies with amphetamine, you might ask a doctor to give you phentermine. It gave me the same focus at about 30 mg in time release caps. Bear in mind all these medications came out as "diet" pills. Now they're all for ADD or ADHD. Phentermine is a very close chemical cousin to all them. It has less influence on dopamine and more on norepinephrine. It's probably better than Strattera, and one third the cost.

I think it should be included in the current bunch. Plus it's not a controlled substance. It's a Schedule III so you can get refills. Talk to a doctor. I've used it and believe me, it works.

[blueyemass1979]

Thanks for the quick reply...

Did you lose weight on it? I'm kinda thin (perfectly healthy weight, but thin-looking) so there might be some reluctance because of that. How can you even get them to prescribe this to you if you're not overweight?

[blueyemass1979]

Almost forgot to ask...how many mg were you taking?

[douglasbrooker]

Well, weight loss is going to happen no matter what. The typical dose is 30 mg as a time release capsule.

[aforceforgood]

I think I may be the only ADDer taking stims (ritalin) and wellbutrin and still gaining weight. Sigh.

I thought that phentermine was basically not being used anymore since it caused heart problems and irritability?

I definitely don't need more irritability...