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General Medication Discussion This section is to be used for general medication discussion and other medications not broken out in their own respective forums.

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  #1  
Old 02-14-12, 08:15 PM
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Stimulants vs. Antidepressants for inattentiveness

I'm not hyper at all. In fact, quite the opposite. I wouldn't say I'm majorly depressed, because i don't feel overwhelming sadness all the time. I also wouldn't say I'm overly anxious either to the point where i can't function. My biggest problem is putting my thoughts and ideas into action. I'll think about doing something, think about it some more, and then end up not wanting to do it. It's like a part of my brain isn't awake enough to feel like engaging in anything. Even if I do eventually start doing something I'll tire easily and give up. This does tend to cause depressive and anxious feelings which is why I'm confused about my problems.

I've been diagnosed with ADD and i'm prescribed a stimulant, Vyvanse 50mg. This stuff wears off after 4-5 hours and i crash hard in the afternoon. I've also tried Adderall XR15mg + 5mgIR booster but these didn't do much. With the stimulants i feel like i'm dependent on the "buzz" these things give me. As soon as they wear off i crash and feel like crap. I feel like they are correcting a chemical imbalance i may have but I just don't feel like they're a long term solution. Maybe i just haven't found the right med combination/dosage.

Is it normal for inattentive types to benefit more from something like wellbutrin or a tricyclic antidepressant?? After taking stimulants I can see how they could be good for a hyperactive/impulsive person but for someone like me they don't seem like a stable long-term solution. Your thoughts/experiences??
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Old 02-14-12, 09:55 PM
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Re: Stimulants vs. Antidepressants for inattentiveness

Wellbuin does help alot with stimulants. It kind of kills the artistic slant and calming effect of stimulants though .
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Old 02-14-12, 09:59 PM
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Re: Stimulants vs. Antidepressants for inattentiveness

Well, I'm not hyper and there are many others here who aren't hyper either. However, many of us still benefit from adderall or another stim to help deal with the other symptoms you described.

I don't have much experience with vyvance but with the adderall, you were taking a fairly low dose which may be why it didn't seem to work for you. You might want to ask your doc if he could prescribe you different amounts to see if that works any better. You might also try something like strattera or even provigil.

In my experience, anti-depressants don't do much if anything for ADD, although some have had good results with wellbutrin. Wellbutrin alone does nothing for me. I take mine with adderall and get a much better effect.
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Old 02-14-12, 10:24 PM
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Re: Stimulants vs. Antidepressants for inattentiveness

Possum to clarify you say that you take wellbutrin with adderall right? How much wellbutrin? Have you tried provigil with adderall ? What do you find works better added to adderall and why?
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Old 02-14-12, 11:08 PM
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Re: Stimulants vs. Antidepressants for inattentiveness

I'll put a plug in for Wellbutrin.

Maybe it'll work for you. Like Possum I take Wellbutrin with a stimulant. Er in my case I take two stimulants. I am a very quiet, reserved, inattentive person. While other people I knew in this partial hospitalization program told me Wellbutrin made them feel wired like being on "too much caffeine" (can't say I know how that feels), I did not really notice much of a change myself. I think it's been helpful for my depression...
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Old 02-14-12, 11:41 PM
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Re: Stimulants vs. Antidepressants for inattentiveness

Quote:
Originally Posted by hollywood View Post
Possum to clarify you say that you take wellbutrin with adderall right? How much wellbutrin? Have you tried provigil with adderall ? What do you find works better added to adderall and why?
I take 300mg XL wellbutrin per day along with 60 mg adderall in two divided doses. In addition, I take clonezapam prn for sleep. I haven't taken provigil with adderall. I tried provigil by itself and found it unhelpful. I can't remember the dosage now, but it was pretty low. A higher dose might have had more effect. I don't know.

Adderall does seem to jump start the wellbutrin for me. These two together and pemoline (when it was still available) are the only meds that ever helped with my depression symptoms. I have suffered from severe depression all my life and no anti-depressant other than the wellbutrin/adderall combo has helped. At one point before I was diagnosed ADHD, my p doc was ready to send me in for electro shock treatment because I am so unresponsive to conventional anti-depressants. I think I am atypical that way, so take my experience for whatever its worth.
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Old 02-15-12, 12:27 AM
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Re: Stimulants vs. Antidepressants for inattentiveness

Thanks. I am not so much a depressed person as my situation gets to me. Wellbutrin helps me alot, at times I feel it interferes with my stimulants quality of affect . Nuvigil seems pretty helpful with my stimulant it's very calming . May keep all 3 in rotation
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Old 05-01-12, 01:17 PM
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Re: Stimulants vs. Antidepressants for inattentiveness

I like the title of this thread. ADD isn't the only attention related disorder...

Quote:
Originally Posted by KTGATOR View Post
My biggest problem is putting my thoughts and ideas into action. I'll think about doing something, think about it some more, and then end up not wanting to do it. It's like a part of my brain isn't awake enough to feel like engaging in anything. Even if I do eventually start doing something I'll tire easily and give up.
This reminds me of when Russell Barkley talks about the missile with no fuel.



And as far as the Wellbutrin vs Tricyclics, etc stuff goes, check this out (more here):

Helen Phillips
The pleasure seekers
New Scientist, 11 October 2003
"At first glance, the "reward centre" idea seems hard to fault. The self-stimulation experiments, beginning with rats in the 1950s and followed by the human experiments in the 1960s, seemed perfectly clear. Modern brain-imaging studies have confirmed that the centre works overtime whenever you're enjoying something, whether it's sex or chocolate, drugs or music. And chemical analysis shows that, whatever your pleasure, dopamine fuels the circuit. "Dopamine was the pleasure transmitter," says Berridge. "The evidence seemed so strong. If you shut down dopamine signalling by giving a drug that blocks dopamine receptors, you dilute the reward value of everything." So why did he and others begin to question the status quo?

Berridge reckons that his doubts began to creep in around the late 1980s, with a few surprise results. He'd found that he could watch rats' facial expressions to judge their reactions to certain tastes. Believe it or not, rats actually look pleased when given sweet things to taste, and produce the rat equivalent of a disgusted look in response to bitterness. The assumption was that these expressions were of pleasure or displeasure, mediated by the reward centre. The surprise came when Berridge blocked the dopamine signal with drugs. In theory, with dopamine knocked out there was now no way for the rats to sense the reward value of the sweetness, so he was expecting not to see any "pleased" expressions. But the rats seemed just as expressive as ever.
Putting it down to experimental error, Berridge tried a more foolproof test. He used rats in which dopamine-producing cells had been wiped out with a neurotoxin. It was already known that these animals simply stopped eating. "They would voluntarily starve to death if the experimenter didn't intervene and feed them," says Berridge. Researchers had always thought that the rats' lack of dopamine meant they didn't like food. But when Berridge force-fed them with sweet and bitter liquids, their facial reactions were normal. "They still showed the proper positive face to sugar and the proper negative face to quinine," he says. "It looked like their reaction to pleasure was normal even though their dopamine was gone."
What was going on? The experiments prompted Berridge to look back at Heath's brain electrode results. He was struck this time by what feelings the subjects reported. They all said they felt good, and always pleaded for more when the controls were taken away. But was it pleasure? The reports mentioned feelings of alertness, warmth and goodwill, arousal, a desire to masturbate, or to drink even though they weren't thirsty. It sounded more like desire than pleasure. This fitted perfectly with Berridge's rats. Even with no activity in the reward area, they seemed to "like" the taste of sweet food. They just didn't "want" it. Could the dopamine system be a desire circuit that mediates our feelings of wanting something, rather than a pleasure centre that supplies our feelings of liking?
Although it was Berridge who drew attention to the distinction between wanting and liking, he is by no means the only researcher to realise that "pleasure" is not quite the right term to attach to activity in the dopamine system. If people are given drugs that block or stimulate dopamine release, it doesn't alter how much they report liking certain tastes. What that suggests is that the dopamine system itself doesn't produce feelings of pleasure, says Panksepp. "The dopamine system is about motivation and seeking. It gives a generalised desire or urge, an eagerness to engage with the world."
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Old 05-01-12, 03:00 PM
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Re: Stimulants vs. Antidepressants for inattentiveness

ummm mmm... Umm yeah definitely , well I'm debating which ssri would be the easiest with sides and willl not zap the ever living life out of me. So I know they all work well for what they are supposed to , so now its a matter of choosing one. Celexa, prozac or cymbalt. I think I did have some anxious feelings with prozac, it may or may not have gone away but I felt a bit ****** on it although I kind of enjoy being angry so thats cool. I think celexa will be the way to go, the question is will it render me a useless deadbeat and take my body by storm, stomp on me with it's zombie effect, trample me with demotivation, fatigue me like I'm feeling somewhere between the gates of hell or will it be okay...Hmm... guess I'm deciding.
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