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  #91  
Old 02-06-18, 10:57 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

If there is an error in my arithmetic in the bottom part of the last post, please point it out to me. (I think it checks out.)

Otherwise, I'll resume agreeing to disagree.


Ultimately, the prevalence of SCT/CDD will vary, depending on how the condition is defined and assessed -- and there's not (yet) any one standard definition. And we were doing a lot of rounding. So those calculations are all pretty academic, anyway.


Do you have other questions about so-called SCT?
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  #92  
Old 02-06-18, 11:41 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mildadhd View Post

Ratio 1:2:1

Twice as likely to have ADHD symptoms and SCT symptoms, than ADHD symptoms (without SCT symptoms), or, SCT symptoms (without ADHD symptoms).
= (3(6)3)

Reduce

= (1(2)1)

Circle on the left = 3

Circle on the right = 3


Ratio 1:2:1

Twice as likely to have ADHD symptoms and SCT symptoms, than ADHD symptoms (without SCT symptoms), or, SCT symptoms (without ADHD symptoms).





M
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  #93  
Old 02-06-18, 11:45 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mildadhd View Post

Circle on the left = 3

Circle on the right = 3
When you count the number in the circle, you need to count the number in the whole circle, just like they do in the video -- not just the ones outside the overlap.

For the left-hand circle, that includes the people on the far left (3) AND the people in the overlapping area (6).

For the right-hand circle, that includes the people on the far-right (3) AND the people in the overlapping area (6).

In your scenario, the total in the circle on the left = 3+6 = 9 and the total in the circle on the right = 3+6 = 9.

Then, all of the people in the overlapping area are in the numerator when you ask "what fraction of the people with ADHD also have SCT?":
6/9 = 2/3
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  #94  
Old 02-06-18, 11:50 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by namazu View Post
When you count the number in the circle, you need to count the number in the whole circle, just like they do in the video -- not just the ones outside the overlap.

For the left-hand circle, that includes the people on the far left (3) AND the people in the overlapping area (6).

For the right-hand circle, that includes the people on the far-right (3) AND the people in the overlapping area (6).

In your scenario, the total in the circle on the left = 3+6 = 9 and the total in the circle on the right = 3+6 = 9.

Then, all of the people in the overlapping area are in the numerator when you ask "what fraction of the people with ADHD also have SCT?":
6/9 = 2/3
Reduce

= (1(2)1)

Circle on the left = 3

Circle on the right = 3


Ratio 1:2:1

Twice as likely to have ADHD symptoms and SCT symptoms, than ADHD symptoms (without SCT symptoms), or, SCT symptoms (without ADHD symptoms).





M
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  #95  
Old 02-06-18, 11:51 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Even if you reduce:

Your ratio of ADHD+SCT to all ADHD is still 2:3 (not 1:2, like it's supposed to be) and your ratio of SCT+ADHD to all SCT is 2:3 (not 1:2, like it's supposed to be), so it's still incorrect.



I'll take your response to mean that you didn't find any errors in my calculation above.
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  #96  
Old 02-06-18, 11:54 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mildadhd View Post
According to Dr. Barkley, half the people who have ADHD have SCT, and, half the people who have SCT have ADHD.

If all people diagnosed with ADHD-Combined and ADHD-Predominantly Hyperactive/Impulsive have must have a certain number of hyperactive symptoms to meet the diagnostic criteria, and people who have SCT do not have any hyperactive symptoms.

Does that mean only people who have ADHD-Predominately Inattentive could possibly have so called SCT?

(I have more questions, but I will start with this question)







M
According to Dr. Barkley, half the people who have ADHD have SCT, and, half the people who have SCT have ADHD.

They are the same damn people.

The ADHD people have SCT ... and the SCT people have ADHD.

So they people who have both ADHD and SCT ... or both SCT and ADHD.


The same damn people.
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  #97  
Old 02-07-18, 12:05 AM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mildadhd View Post
Group#1...............Group #2

ADHD...................SCT
ADHD...................SCT
ADHD...................SCT
ADHD/SCT.............SCT/ADHD
ADHD/SCT.............SCT/ADHD
ADHD/SCT.............SCT/ADHD
= (1(2)1)

Circle on the left = 3

Circle on the right = 3

=3:3

Reduce

=1:1





M
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  #98  
Old 02-07-18, 12:08 AM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

EDIT: Agreeing to disagree.
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  #99  
Old 02-08-18, 12:27 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

I'm willing to give this one last shot at explaining my reasoning.

In Namazu's video in post #87 ... there are two circles that overlap.

There are 3 red dots in the left crescent, 2 red dots in the center overlap
area, and 4 red dots in the right crescent area ... making 9 dots total.

If you were to pull those circles apart, eliminating that overlap, the two red
dots in the overlap area would not and could not end up in both circles.

Either one dot would end up in each circle, or two dots would go into one of
the circles and no dots would go into the other circle.

The total number of dots in the illustration is 9. Pulling the circles apart doesn't
make 2 more dots appear.


I have to admit I've flipped and flopped back and forth on which answer is
correct ... but each time I come back to the fact that there are only a set
number of people in the overlap area who share the same symptoms or
disorder and it cannot be correct to count them twice.
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  #100  
Old 02-08-18, 12:46 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunacie View Post
I'm willing to give this one last shot at explaining my reasoning.

In Namazu's video in post #87 ... there are two circles that overlap.

There are 3 red dots in the left crescent, 2 red dots in the center overlap
area, and 4 red dots in the right crescent area ... making 9 dots total.

If you were to pull those circles apart, eliminating that overlap, the two red
dots in the overlap area would not and could not end up in both circles.

Either one dot would end up in each circle, or two dots would go into one of
the circles and no dots would go into the other circle.

The total number of dots in the illustration is 9. Pulling the circles apart doesn't
make 2 more dots appear.


I have to admit I've flipped and flopped back and forth on which answer is
correct ... but each time I come back to the fact that there are only a set
number of people in the overlap area who share the same symptoms or
disorder and it cannot be correct to count them twice.
There is 6 different people in group#1 and 6 different people in group#2.

12 dots total. (not 9 dots)

I have not been able to confirm if the research involving group#1 is even from the same research, as the research involving group#2?


M
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  #101  
Old 02-08-18, 12:53 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mildadhd View Post
There is 6 different people in group#1 and 6 different people in group#2.

12 dots total. (not 9 dots)


M
The 3 people in the overlap area are NOT different people.

There are 3 people who have both disorders.

There are 6 people who only have one of the disorders.

There are 9 people total.
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  #102  
Old 02-08-18, 12:57 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunacie View Post
The 3 people in the overlap area are NOT different people.

There are 3 people who have both disorders.

There are 6 people who only have one of the disorders.

There are 9 people total.
The overlapping symptoms are within each group.

Group#1

6 people have ADHD symptoms, 3 of those 6 people also have SCT/ADD symptoms.

Group#2

6 people have SCT/ADD symptoms, 3 of those 6 people also have ADHD symptoms.


12 people total.




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  #103  
Old 02-08-18, 01:04 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mildadhd View Post
The overlapping symptoms are within each group.

Group#1

6 people have ADHD symptoms, 3 of those 6 people also have SCT/ADD symptoms.

Group#2

6 people have SCT/ADD symptoms, 3 of those 6 people also have ADHD.


12 people total.


M
3 people have ADHD symptoms.

3 people have SCT symptoms.

3 people have both sets of symptoms, they could go in either of the first two
groups. Or they could be a separate group.

9 people total.
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  #104  
Old 02-08-18, 01:13 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunacie View Post
3 people have ADHD symptoms.

3 people have SCT symptoms.

3 people have both sets of symptoms, they could go in either of the first two
groups. Or they could be a separate group.

9 people total.


3 adults have SCT/ADD symptoms (without ADHD symptoms)

6 adults have SCT/ADD symptoms and ADHD symptoms

3 adults have ADHD symptoms (without SCT/ADD symptoms)

Total of 12 people



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  #105  
Old 02-08-18, 01:30 PM
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Re: Questions about so called SCT?

6% of adult population have SCT/ADD symptoms

6% of adult population have ADHD symptoms

12% total


How are you getting 9% total?



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Last edited by mildadhd; 02-08-18 at 01:49 PM..
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